we are not talking about the fact that they are really going to fight with us, we are talking about the fact that they are entering a new phase of militarization, i would compare the situation with the fifties of the last century, when the west gave the go-ahead for the remilitarization of western germany, which had just went through a cycle of denazification, demilitarization, and so on, and was still considered and quite rightly, so to speak, the culprit for what the german nation did under the leadership of hitler, nevertheless, it was remilitarized because it came cold war, then they said that the russians would not stop at eastern europe, they would go further, they would capture all of western europe to the english channel, to the shores of the atlantic, so we need to arm ourselves, so i now see an analogy with this situation, that is, talk about in my opinion, they are not intended to prepare for the fact that russia will not stop.

increasing military spending, sending large american military contingents to europe, and so on. so, well, they proceed from what, that 40 years of the cold war the world held on in this way, no matter how, at the very least, a direct collision with russia did not happen, but in the end the soviet union fell as a result of this collision, but this confrontation, there was an economic confrontation, political confrontation, military crises, in my opinion the bet is being made .

in the same fifties, it was called not containment, but discarding, liberation, liberation strategy, within the framework of this strategy, significantly more ambitious, dare i say, aggressive, we see a whole series of american actions when, for example, such a person whom you knew well, like the american ambassador who was in moscow, mr. burns. who, from my point of view, was not just a very experienced, reasonable diplomat, but i perceived him as a worthy person, now they are covering up ukrainian terrorist acts, clearly no one told zelensky, and you put an end to this immediately, such rubbish, not that one , you won’t get anything from us, so i have a feeling that, in general, from the western point of view, this is a very...

idea that it’s possible to get russia in this way shove, in this way you can strike at it, even not the most serious blows, and assume that at the same time you will remain safe, because you declared that you are not a party to the conflict, it

seems to me that this is another expression : old mustache policy, when you don’t see, even refuse in your own eyes. to see what you are really doing and how it can end for you, i , of course, don’t want it to end badly for them, because firstly, i don’t wish this on anyone, and secondly, this was would be a very risky strategy, but i don’t know what you think, but it seems to me that it is very important that the collective west understands with what kind of fire they are playing with, your last word, well, somehow... president putin had this the statement that the west is aware of the possible consequences of a direct conflict with russia, but they, they claim that they are not going to a direct conflict, yes, yes, that’s exactly why they claim that they are going to direct conflict, because they don’t want to bear the burden

of these long-term consequences, that’s why they say: ukrainian soldiers are dying for our goals, so let’s help them continue to die for our goals, but they themselves are not participating in this. well, of course, you know, in politics you never say never, there could be a breakdown into a direct clash, but of course, i would like to proceed from the fact that even with the decline in the intellectual and professional level of the current leadership in the west, they are still not suicides, i would really like to hope for this, and i know some of those people who are now in leadership and united states, and european.

clearly demonstrate to the west that russian patience is not only endless, but that it is very close to the end, and that they should think about how they need to become faster and more reliable. it was a great game, we'll see you on air next week.

hello, i'm still dmitry bak, i still host a literary podcast called let them not talk, let them read. there are so many debates now about the classics, whether they are relevant or whether they are forever outdated, of course, there are very different writers, but dostoevsky, fyodor mikhailovich dostoevsky. among russian and world classics , it occupies a very special place, so i think , let’s see what my guests think, today our guest is the director, people’s artist of russia, vladimir ivanovich khotyanenko, hello, vladimir ivanovich, thank you for coming, we have a theater actor , lenkom mark

zakharova, anton shagin, and we’ll talk about dostoevsky for a reason, this year marks the 150th anniversary. publication of a separate edition of roman bes, and taking advantage of this occasion, we will talk about the novel besa, about dostoevsky, about creativity, and most importantly, about today. partly the reason for this is the architectural institute, which i graduated from at one time, because in our architectural institute of that period, these groups, rock groups, and mozart, and wagner, and high literature, all got along quite happily. , whatever, here it is...

and i suddenly recalled the impression, i re-read, first of all, everything, so i remembered, naturally, constantly, or rather i remembered, i thought, on the side in this internal controversy, but nabokov didn’t convince you, you seem to now think that he, no, nabokov, i think that he is completely wrong, absolutely, that is, he is in his own way, that well, for this you need to know nabokov, him, that’s him there was another little thing, nabokov highlighted it to me, you know, sometimes it’s very important to highlight it with some unusual light, and through the enemy, through the opponent, yes, it’s interesting.

what i had in common with nabokov, i also studied the etymology of butterflies, yes, this is news, that is, the architect and i too, i am an entomologist, i have urticaria, i had urticaria, such mutations, fantastic, and i ran, i could run 5 km in the middle of nowhere, and most importantly, violating all the principles of these entomologists, i caught with my hands, and i endowed this manner of mine with strogin, that’s how fate is, that ’s it, that’s from these details,

you can’t get enough of them, well, is it really possible to get enough, i also tell students that there are volumes with notes for novels, for teenagers, for example, this is no less interesting. in st. petersburg, in the bukinist, i found dostoevsky’s notebooks, which he was preparing for the novel idiot, pre-revolutionary edition, became interested, found it somewhere at the very bottom, moreover, the uncut book was not yet

cut, unread, i arrived with rapture under the light bulb at home, which means i started. read and was shocked by how much these notebooks - well, this can be said to be a separate work, only in the eighth notebook he writes the word “prince” in dostoevsky’s calligraphic handwriting at the beginning of the page, from this word everything begins to take shape for him, and this mechanism begins to twist everything for him, because those traits that gannyu had, he throws on myshkin, myshkin has the traits that he had, he transfers them to rogozhin, this mechanism that... he himself starts from a single word, this is an incredibly charming read, my interlocutors are amazing, you feel how advanced they are in this matter , but anton, i wanted to ask you a little about something else, but you feel more organic, in what images, within what characters, you play both modern people and naturally

classical characters of russian literature, what is easier, what is more organic, what is more productive maybe nothing is easier. and here, more interestingly, i can say, well, for me the main criterion, perhaps, is creativity, yes, so to speak, the volume of this or that character who would not just live his life, yes, but would be in dialogue with her, in a collision , then it turns out it’s polyphony, then it turns out interesting and interesting to perform, of course. observe, with regard to historical or modern, the main thing here is that there is a core, this flaming vertical, in which you want to dissolve, immerse, and then already unfasten from yourself, because so that this does not migrate to other roles, when you begin to encounter dostoevsky, and i

played him in the theater, in the cinema, when you begin to encounter his text, he... he sits down on you and you can, as a performer , completely dissolve in a tongue-tied repetition of such a brilliant meturgenian disharmony, an amazing text precisely because of its disharmony, which , however, the thought is extremely strong and dostoevsky is not lost; what makes dostoevsky strong is this block of meanings and us. although although he wrote for money, as it were, yes, that is, his well, not not his main idea was for money, yes, but he always desperately needed money

, so he could afford it, well, says tolstoy, turgeniy, they have money, but i need to finish it, why? because he could sit on these rails, as it were, and describe nature for 20 pages, but he doesn’t have that, he’s into the grain, he breaks through to the meanings, although of course it’s difficult to read, i’m vladimir ivanovich, sorry, anton, i’m enjoying the conversation so much so that i just want to stop and give you the floor to speak with each other, but it’s very important for me to ask you everything that was in my head, that’s when you read the novel demons? and did you know what was connected with it in soviet times, you did, or it was just somehow behind the scenes, and behind the scenes, the fact is that i once read it in the school curriculum, that’s how the plot is, i i read it as a plot, no , well, it wasn’t in the school curriculum, no, i mean, when i was at school, i read it anyway, i already read the demon, but according to which edition, this is a grotto - in the agrarian peter the great

academy, now it is the temeryazev agricultural academy, yes, where the student ivanov, whose prototype it was, was killed. but i’m telling you, i was such an inquisitive, intelligent reader, i just read too much, ruined my eyesight, lost my dream of becoming an astronaut, so i understand , but this is all just a statement , yes, dostoevsky is a great writer from perov’s painting , this is how it is, this is how it is, yes, but - i really felt, of course, this of course, when i started making the film postoevsky, that’s all, that’s where everything was real, when i re-read everything, when i i asked myself the question: i’ll listen to the gru... sense of humor, hello, what a sense of humor he has, they even accused him of imitating gogol, this sense of humor is wonderful, but it’s wonderful with such practice,

a wonderful statement, he says, if it weren’t for katorga these 4 years, which he especially paid attention to, if it weren’t for the boat, i wouldn’t exist, says mikhailovich, if he only had one notebook and the gospels with notes for the building. beautiful, well look, i’ll just remind you that in soviet times there was such an anecdote that if they erected a monument to dostoevsky, then they would have to write to fyodor mikhailovich from grateful demons, because since the roman about demons in the revolution, it is against the revolution, then no matter how strange it is to imagine now, but in soviet times demons were not published , they were published once and withdrawn too, so i was finding fault with you, and which pre-revolutionary publications are, this is an important story, and the novel was based on absolutely. hot events, because in november 1869, near this grotto that we saw, a group of revolutionaries , terrorists, conspirators, whatever, killed their

like-minded person, a very modern theme , a sect, yes, which you can enter, you can no longer leave, his name was ivan ivanovich ivanov, well, such an intricate surname, so they killed him, sergei nichaev they were led, there was a process, that’s just not enlightened.

5 days was already approved for verkhovensky, but what is interesting here is my inner, how to say, message, why it was important for me

to play verkhovensky myself, i suppose so that he would not germinate in me and would not remain, to me it was necessary to perform it, play it and unfasten it so that he didn’t know about it, but when they tried it out, they talked about it. it was, no, we talked a lot about this, in fact, we talked a lot about it, how much to let in , how much to let in, how important it is, how important it is to hear, because these are completely different people, after all, kirillov is such a monomaniac, he has the idea that suicide is the only free act, he lives only by this, and verkhovensky of his freedom, in fact, and verkhovensky is so complex, still not probable, who wants to command, hence the surname, probably his father, by the way, wants to rule. i suddenly thought, and the elder stepan trofimovich, stepan trofimovich is, as it were, in the shadows here, but the trigger is in the very

verkhovensky pyotr stepanovich, it seems to me that he manifests himself with this trigger, because this dislike of the dispute with his father gives rise to in himself, this is the number of demons that he already looks at, how interesting this is and how new this is anton, that is... humanly speaking, he is focused on his figure, and his figure is absolutely empty, this is a liberal of the forties, who is still obsessed with the fact that the government is looking for him, watching him, looking for him, he is like an oppositionist, in fact, he is an absolutely unsuccessful person who is not even capable of loving his son, treating him atepanovich cultivates all this and spreads it to the country, already to the people, trying to subjugate them...

as a performer you simply dissolve, because when you start teaching him, and then you start playing him, i’ll say a strange thing now, but to my physiological even, but the insides change places at this moment, uh-huh, and the soul turns inside out , and all your sins hang there, and they wave their legs like ukrainians worry about the heat in the houses of the kherson region, supposedly in the kherson region people are not given a cylinder and gas without a russian

passport.

solo presenter, and in this fragment of our conversation i would like to read the texts of captain libyatkin, without any choice, yes , this is the first aberiud, captain lebiatkin, sense of humor, this is a wonderful comic character, of course, but still funny, he must necessarily, he tells varvara petrovna stovrogina that he has a fable, he says: on krylov’s tower, no, no, not krylov’s, my own fable, that’s what he reads, there lived a cockroach in the world, a cockroach from childhood, and then fell into a glass full of fly-eating, lord, what is this , varvara petrovna exclaimed , a cockroach took the place, the flies began to murmur, our glass was very full, they shouted to jupiter, but while they were screaming, nikifor, a noble old man, came up, well, here i am not finished yet,

met. "oh my god, what is this, this is absolutely, this is not a krylov fable with a moral, with clearly defined good and evil, in the end, but this is simply a cult of the disgusting, disgusting, then afanasy afanachfet, an absolute russian poet, even to the point of boredom sometimes, because he writes about the most important thing, well, that the evening sounds are crowding like moths.

in the summer i fluttered through the forests, to tell you that i woke up, i, damn you, am all awake, under the branches, there is a forest there, as if under the rods, every bird asks for thirst, tell you what i will drink, i don’t know, i will drink, well, i don’t know what i’ll sing, but just the song is ripening, but here this twist is terrible, monstrous, artistic.

exists, but how do you even interpret the name, that’s why demons and not devils, for example, well, because this is a herd of pigs, this is one of the best scenes of his manifestation, yes, there is this wonderful monologue and he coped with it with this wonderful

historical monologue, we had to shorten it, it’s there, yes, but there we were struggling with the words, we rehearsed this monologue very carefully, because the words were too on the surface, something was needed. that’s all, they don’t have love, this is the correct formulation in principle, this is the correct scary thing, well, how is it not the worst thing when there is no absence, i later found

udostoevsky’s notes, this doll from which you are a butterfly, that is, i am a confirmation, here i am i brought a butterfly, it’s not in the novel at all, i actually brought in a whole line when i realized that dostoevsky forgot about it when he arrived. and this is also just a figurative system, and there are some thorns there, he says, this is nature, because this is also in words, this simplification, because the words are given to us in the gospel; everything is written, thou shalt not kill. don’t steal , that’s it, but we don’t do that, why is it important that you directly transferred this episode from the gospel and lived it additionally, yes, there, too , christ heals a demoniac and they relocate the pigs, who themselves ask to want the pigs,

that is, he has them they ask permission, this is very important, so the demons are trembling, i would like , anton, to return to your thesis, with which i of course agree, but the main love. this is true, but look, a person who does not know love, he simply turns to stone dies, but here’s a different story, in my opinion, these people don’t just petrify, they die, they want to command other people, they want to subjugate other people, they want to make other people unhappy, so stovrogin brings a child to death, this is the central idea of ​​dostoevsky, little slug child, take the kharamazovs, brings a girl to death, at the moment when he knows that she... commits suicide, he looks at the little red spider, stylized, this person not only does not know love, he kills, we filmed it all, and literally, yes, yes, this, this is a monstrous story, here i say

, we did not constantly fight, but tried to solve this translation from literature into the language of cinema, yes, the equivalent is very difficult, it is very difficult, so i give the student this example of the difference. you need to look for an adequate one, after all, dostoevsky has the most unwritten character, as if it were a spacesuit that anyone can turn on

, fyodor mikhailovich himself actually helped me in the demons , filming the demons. dostoevsky, that’s where he writes: one does not completely fit into the other. and what does he recommend? there is some secret of art, according to which the epic form will never find a match in the dramatic. i even believe that for different forms of art there are corresponding orders of poetic thoughts, so that one thought can never be expressed in another, not in the corresponding form. another thing is if you remake it as much as possible, change the novel, keeping only one episode from it for processing into a drama, or taking the original... idea, completely change the text, that is, it will be a new text, yes

, this is wonderful, this is freedom, dostoevsky thus does with his work approximately the same thing as the composition of rogin, but he leaves it free, we can now also look, after all, he was perceived as literature, yes, except for this interlocutor , no one thought he was a handsome guy, after all, he was recorded as handsome, recorded as handsome. shows him the text that he wants

to make public, well, sometimes in church the priest says that if it’s hard for you, write, but stavrokin writes a terrible story about a matryosha, this monstrous one, and so what - he says after this, and to the quiet one he says, you are my brother, well, christ the mother of god is sinless , so what, god will forgive, god will forgive, just repent, and how to do this - it is necessary that he be unforgiven, it was he, like everyone else , who staged the novel in the year seventy-three,

that is, the novel continued to be published in such a censored form, in my opinion this is a very strong move, if we had known from the very beginning that stavrogin is a person who he just marries the disabled gorbunya, well , gaganova has a skid, he spoils all the girls, he just wants to get the lord to not forgive him here, it would be easier, it seems to me, this is the caspian sea, we will play a dagestan... wedding, this we have a wedding suit imitation circassian mountain tuxedo, a thin and delicate organza that will cover the bride, shuana and ahmed are avars, we will have a wedding according to the customs of one of the most ancient settlements of dagestan, an aul, czech, and here will be our photo zone made of carpet, dagestan carpet, only instead of a wall we will have mountains, we already need to prepare, a grip without sausages as it happens,

there is a special czech lizginka, there is a step, a step, let’s imagine our hands like this, once, it’s so fun, we need to prepare a wedding, our premiere, let’s play a wedding, on sunday on the first, vodka veda, a product of the stellar group, yes, but in the novel there is a mass, a whole panorama

of public, i’m not even talking about names, but what kind of people, look, maybe it’s not even about names, no , not names, but why do you need to ask a simple simple question, but why is it nichaevskaya history that pushed him to this topic, because there it took shape in the history of nichaevskaya , it took shape, so these elements are present in all of us and maybe there were some other familiar ones, but... that’s how it took shape in ideology, ideologeme, that’s just yes, it was then that a subject appeared that can be. well, yes, since dostoevsky, in my opinion, is an absolutely russian writer, even too russian, if i may say so, then i believe that he describes the unconditional enemies of russia, the russian world, the russian people, but russians, but russians, yes, those who are inside, inside, who are capable,

because russia cannot be defeated from the outside, but that’s not scary, it’s the internal thing that’s scary.

very different things, so that i, what is even more terrible to do, but to do anything, you can still be forgiven, since there is an all-merciful principle in the world, fyodor mikhailovich, in fact, drew out this concept of man, the complexity of man to the bottom, this one already had a cooker

scooping it from the bottom, the karamazov brothers were already just already rattling, dostoevsky has exhausted himself, he has told everything about what a person is? here, but the question is different, i want to remember anyway, because in fact , the point is that it is about love, this is the love that the apostle paul, the letter to the corinthians, of course, if you allow, i will add, of course, of course, love, but i would also put

a dash here, for russia, anton, as we say it, somehow you immediately understand from this, somehow, although you are right, i am not saying that you are wrong. will mark, well, not even the end, but will end the conversation, which, of course, so curious that i think that we will meet here more than once, and today, of course, we realized that fyodor mikhailovich dostoevsky, like 150 years ago, like 200 years later, in the future, will be relevant and important, because

they argue about him, they talk about him, i am very grateful to my interlocutors today, the director, people's artist of russia vladimir ivanovich khotyanenko, thank you, vladimir ivanovich, see you, thank you, they gave a reason, very grateful, of course, to anton shagin, actor of the linkom theater, mark zakharova, thank you big, well, to you, our respected interlocutors, i, dmitry bak, host of a literary podcast, let them not talk, let them read, i say the same wonderful phrase, important for me, read with pleasure.

then, as a particular matter, maybe touch on the topic of dirty german money for the revolution, because there is also a lot of talk here, myth, reality in general, well , there are a huge number of myths about lenin, both such leafy myths of the soviet era, and negative myths that were created even during his lifetime, which were picked up after the collapse the soviet union, and what’s interesting is that those people who praised lenin before the ninety- first year began to throw mud at him after. so the task of clearing lenin of myths is huge, too, but we need to

do this in order to break through to objective knowledge about this by far the largest figure in the history of the 20th century. hello, this is a historical podcast russia-west on the swing of history. pyotr romanov and sergey soloviev are with you. today we will deal with the biography of the leader of the russian revolution, vladimir ilvich alenin. with historical point. regarding this figure, sometimes they compare him with peter the great, well, to a certain extent , you can probably talk about it that way, but in the end, peter the great built petersburg on bones. lenin made a revolution, and then they began to build socialism and he lit the ilitch light bulb from

the funeral pyre of the peasants, but nevertheless, brilliant st. petersburg still stands, and the light bulb, in general, did not burn out completely, so perhaps this parallel in general acceptable, perhaps, especially since petrine reforms are called a revolution from above, lenin was the leader of the revolution from below, but still the funeral pyre of the peasantry. from my point of view, this is a later period, this is the period of stalinist repressions, already collectivization, may heaven forgive me, i allow myself to compare lenin with the apostle paul. there were a lot of apostles, but paul alone; in fact, paulicanism created christianity. here, there were a lot of marxist theorists, well, the most influential and popular in russia was plekhanov, in western europe, say, kautsky, yes. but how it is said that there were few practitioners , organizers of the uprising, well, paul said, not hellene, not

jews, but lenin also brought marxism to the mongolian steppes and to africa, so yes, for some time it was a teacher of such a planetary scale, no doubt. in fact, you are right, western european marxists, not marx himself, but his followers, quite dogmatic, like kautsk. to a lesser extent, plekhanov was distinguished by dogmatism, but nevertheless they believed that all countries would come to socialism in more or less the same way in the same way, lenin just revised this point of view, saying that there may be more than one path to socialism, and that the methods by which one can achieve power can be different, it was lenin who owned the model that largely determined the face of the social struggle in the 20th century century, a model of a new type of party, which lenin wrote in the book what to do. taking it from his beloved chernyshevsky, which we will talk about today, uh, which came out in 902, where...