accepts her son from a previous marriage, and the expert in today's episode, a famous psychologist, family psychologist, ekaterina sivanova, who knows this situation, both as a specialist and as a woman. hello, hello, well anastasia, tell us your story. the story is, yes, that i had a previous marriage behind me, in this marriage i had a son, yes, but it turned out that we divorced my husband and accordingly. but anyway, we are all women, we want a relationship, but i started a relationship with a man, we are with him we met, to be honest, on a dating site, yes, everything was basically good, beautiful, romantic, but at some stage problems began in the relationship, they started due to the fact that i have a child from the past marriage, and he immediately knew what you had, yes, yes, yes, that is, i even wrote it in the profile on the website.

because i believe that you shouldn’t start a relationship with some kind of silence, yes, but this is definitely something that you should be ashamed of, conflicts began, well, yes, misunderstandings began, and it also turned out that we have, he also has an ex-wife, there is a child from a previous marriage, yes, only a girl, but the girl, she lives - with his ex-wife, respectively, yes, and you said, that the conflicts started somehow in connection with your child, but can you tell me? if we take the very, very beginning of the relationship, we went to the apothecary garden, listened to a wonderful music concert, went, then went to a restaurant, and ate , we came home, and put the child to bed, of course it was already late in the evening, and then we went there to communicate further together, at some point the child ran into our room, yes, he ran, in fact his temperature rose, he came running to complain that he felt bad, at that... moment, instead of there

being support, he collapsed into some second little child who takes his mother away from him, why, why did he run into us, so unceremoniously, the child died, how old was the child then and the child was 7 years old then, oh, he’s very small, he’s still small was, yes, that is, he really probably i don’t think, it didn’t even occur to him that he needed to knock or something, why did he run in, and it was like... yes, how many years have passed since that episode? has 4 years already passed? 4 years, this story, it didn’t resolve, well, that is, well, okay , it happens, maybe there, something somehow masculine flared up in him, but it didn’t resolve, and he didn’t, he also took it and generally left, that is, he took the car and drove home, and that is , it remained not some episode, some kind of excess, but you see that it became system, well, yes, that’s what the child is, he’s like my... perception that he’s like

a second child who takes away his mother, not a woman, that’s your child, yours and he even tells me that the man himself , your priority is the child, so we went to the cinema, you ran around buying food for this child there and so on, instead of watching a movie there, i say, at that moment i was really trying to ensure your comfort, so that the child would be busy, yes, not ran around the cinema hall there and didn’t make any noise at all, so he said, no, it’s necessary it was... it was just strictly for him to tell him that now we are there at the cinema and you won’t run anywhere, you had to put him in his place, you don’t put him in his place, i don’t know , it’s like here and you live together now, no , we don’t live together, we have a so-called , as it’s fashionable to say now, guest marriage, and you haven’t thought about having children together, we have a child together, we have a child together, yes, yes, it turned out that we have a child together, that is, i am a mother of two children, my first child me from a previous marriage, and we also have a child together, who is now 3 years old.

yes, and he lives with you, he lives with me, yes, and dad comes, dad comes, this is the youngest child, it evokes the same feelings in him, no, no, he loves his own, if his child broke in somewhere there is a lesson in it, then here they are, yes, your guys, my mothers, cool boys, and that is, if the younger one does something like that, then there is no reaction, it’s a little son, a basket, the younger one even has a screensaver on his phone, then there is not even...

well, that is, you are now talking about the fact that there is a family, me and my two sons, yeah, and there is a man, but it’s understandable. we saw the picture , but it’s not her who says that, it’s her husband, no, i understand, this is her husband, that’s not her husband, that’s her man, the father of her child, ours, no, no, no, no, no, anastasia says that i want harmony in this ecosystem, and i translate from russian into russian, that is , now you have you and two sons and a man, because uh... judging by what anastasia says, a man, it's like he's with side is standing, if you and i draw , well, i’m sitting here, now they’re drawing all sorts of pictures, yes, that is, here you need to see that the family is, in fact, a family, here, the nuclear family is anastasia and two boys, well, that is ,

you want this man to fit harmoniously into your family. as i see this story, i can tell you, of course, it means that we have a completely charming woman who got married and gave birth to a son, she certainly gave birth to a son in love, but then something went wrong, and the marriage broke up, and this charming woman

remained a wonderful son, this is a family, after a divorce she formed a family, mother, son, there are two of them... what good news, it’s just that you and your ex-husband are great, that you have retained these roles, mom and dad, and accordingly, there is this story, then the woman, not the mother of her son, but the woman. we are now getting our bearings in the roles , yes, a man appears, a boy who is from his first marriage, he knows that he has a mother and a father, and somehow you probably told him that you were getting a divorce, somehow there was some - conversation when we were getting divorced, to him

i was 3 years old, and that, well, somehow it wasn’t like that, i can’t say that there was some kind of conversation, that is, he saw that my dad and i had conflicts, and in these conflicts he always seemed to protect me . my mother, yeah, and accordingly, such a conversation, that is , the conversation took place later, when he started asking some questions there, why did you and dad divorce and so on, yes, that it happens that people are together, yes, and then they get divorced, misunderstandings arise, which means that my key slogan, yeah, in life, that in the moment we are doing the only thing that we are capable of here now, but since we want... our audience to receive new knowledge, among other things, i will say that at the age of 3 you should talk to your child about divorce, yes, because you, look at how you report that i had conflicts with my husband and my son

protected me, that is, he can protect me for 3 years, but know the truth about what happened and that mom and dad will never be together again, it’s like he can’t. therefore, but in any case some conversation took place in in the end, yes, for him it is an acceptance that these men and women will never be together again, it seems to me, no, point one, yes, we write it down, this is something that later, after our charming conversation, you can attribute to a psychologist in therapy, yes, that is, what needs to be done, how to talk to the child, so that he has the fact of acceptance. well, okay, it's already passed, yes, i just have a question, it seems to me that children always hope that their parents will reconcile, because i have a friend my age, her parents divorced when she was at a more or less conscious age, she was told all this in the moment, all this was explained, and she is more than 30 years old, she still thinks, suddenly, of course,

this is a traumatic situation, a psychologist is sitting in front of you, whose parents divorced, they are no longer alive, and i still hope that they will make peace, i will finally have mom and dad together at the table. listen, we are all living people, and this is always a very big trauma. why am i asking a question about divorce now? because in our description history sounds like a theme. the man does not accept his son from his first marriage, but the son, as i understand it, is not delighted, but why should he be delighted? they brought her, she’s taking away her mother , she’s also killed her brother, who is also taking away his mother, this is a podcast of the psyche, and we continue to analyze the story of our heroine anastasia, a man who does not accept her child from... a previous marriage, but you need to talk to the child when in such situation, that this man, this

uncle came to the family, so that for you, not in the sense of being a dad, but besides the dad there is other, probably roles, functions, some values, yes, but i can’t tell him that maxim should be your dad, yes, for example, i tell him this, he won’t have a dad, because the child has a dad, he is alive, he is healthy, he works great. as a surgeon saves people’s lives, yes, that is , i can’t say anything bad about dad, that is, here i don’t understand how this is correct either, but a child, a child, any child, he deserves to know the truth, you understand, because that children at the level of empathy, feelings, whatever you want to call it, they know the truth and they expect from adults with words through their mouths that... they told him this truth, they can get sick for this, rebel and do whatever they want,

but just tell me the truth, tell me that i am a person who is so valuable to you that you trust me to know the truth , so i’m going to try to formulate things like this, but here we have a problem with an asterisk, we have a man who, first of all, didn’t come into a family, a guest marriage is not a family. let's not lie to you, yes, and secondly, he broadcasts in every possible way to the boy, ours, to whom no one tells the truth, along the way, and he broadcasts rejection to him, and if his dad, we assume, yes, we can’t dive so deeply now, if his dad , the receiving father is in contact in an emotional way... the receiving father, who, well, loves this is all, then when he encounters rejection from

an adult, he does not understand at all what is happening, he does not have such experience, yeah, and he will naturally look on mom, mom is trying to play both here and there at the same time roles, and mistresses, excuse me, and mothers, and there’s also the youngest son as a dancer, right? and then what does this child begin to do when he does not have an adult who begins to protect him, he should attack him, in theory, he should do something to kick him out, well, because his life is in emotional insecurity and about the man we are talking about today is very important, here’s what to understand, i don’t know what kind of life experience he has, we’re actually just talking about you here, right? but his attitude towards to a child from his beloved’s previous marriage

, we want women to believe this, says that well, firstly, he apparently has something in his history, why does he have such a reaction to the child, this is only his projection, this has nothing to do with your son at all, but there are my friends, there is such a thing in family systems as family hierarchy, and the whole point is that... your son first appeared in your life, only then this wonderful man appeared, and before until this man admits this fact, that this little beautiful boy is higher than him in the hierarchy, this hierarchy is not about what i said, you go, but this is about recognition, about recognition, about respect for what you had a life before him. there was love, and this child was born in love, oh, he doesn’t really want to admit it, but

this place says that you are dragging, you are dragging your past behind you, so sometimes we talk to him too, we are not silent , we don’t swear, we are adults, like civilized people, yes, we are trying to discuss all this, as you say in words through the mouth, he says, yes, you’re dragging your past with you, or everything was fine there, if only you were there...

well, the internet, yes, there are a lot of wonderful lectures, including many famous psychologists there, yes, that is, yes who say that a woman cannot separate a child from herself, this is her part of the body, there is an arm, a leg, a tail, and so on, yes, and there they call on a woman to abandon her child, this is tantamount to saying, well, cut off your hand to be with me, but this, well, that is , pay me so that i - consider you with your woman, make a sacrifice, make a sacrifice, it’s the same with us. the topic of making sacrifices, by the way, was also with the second child , well, this is the one we have in common, but tell me, it’s so unique, tell me, this is important, the second child, i’m ready to tell you, yes, as if in principle this is the same it happens in life, this is life, yes, yeah, it’s clear that at the age of 30 you meet, not only

to read poetry to each other, well, at some point we flew to barcelona for the weekend, we flew together, and arrived in three. that is unplanned pregnancy, yes , yes, and so unplanned that - we learned that there are such, yes, physiological moments that we learned not in the cycle in which it happened, even later, that is, there are already some things to think about when we came to the doctor, they left us less than a week, and so, accordingly, this was also the moment when we arrived, he didn’t come with me to the office, i have tears in the river like a river in my office, the doctor tells me: well, i’m fine i won’t do anything to you, leave the office, goodbye, as if we were going, wait, you we’ve already come to have an abortion, yes , that is, the decision has already been made, the decision was made , in my doctor’s office the tears just start pouring in, i’m silent, my tears are still flowing like a hail, well, as if such a woman’s wife was

quite adequate, yes , she just left the office, and how he took it, so he... he started telling me about the biblical parable about abraham, yes, how he took his son to the mountain, when he raised this sword over his head, yes, that the lord told him that yes, i believe that you are devoted to me, yes, then there is a parable that actually speaks not about human relationships, yes, but about sacrifice actually to god, that is, for your man, when he cited himself as an example, drew parallels, yes, it was determined that... he is the king god, the king god, the creator from above , yes, and you, then, let’s bring me a sacrifice in the form of this child, who is still in the mother’s womb, well, they left the child, they left the child, then he says, i’m so glad that you left him, so glad, that is , after all, he was happy, but the sacrifice still wants from you, no, so there

, someone, well, look, my friends, he can want everything... anything, now it’s important to understand what nastya wants, taking into account what we’ve already said, that you may have seen something new, perhaps some sensations, new feelings arise, you know, in a month there is some kind of feeling, maybe even, well, i don’t want to admit it, that it is precisely the futility of the relationship, because it will happen if you admit, they will end, and what will happen then, well... that’s it, i don’t seem to want to yet, that is, i definitely understand that i i want to maintain a relationship with this man, i want to maintain it, but in principle , i’ve known this man for almost 5 years already, yes, i ’ve been around for this time, you can already guess , yes, what reactions a person can give you to certain moments, now you

were talking about recognizing, for example, that the child was at first recognizing my past, well, 5 years yes... that it’s always about him, your focus is on you, what’s happening to you? i’m offended, but what’s offended? why is that? well, that is, you, excuse me, have an expectation from this man that he he will break the spell and say: son, dear, what a blessing that you came into my life. together with your mother, no, look, nastya , can i translate, as he says, from russian into russian, yes, it seems to me, if i understood correctly, that we are now marking time, this stuck episode, so we have 5 years, listen, yes , let's see what real ways the situation can develop, and what will happen in a year,

in two, in five, let's try to reason, because all we hear now is ponies running in circles , nastenka, let’s mentally imagine ourselves in a year, and not a fantasy like... how i want to feel, just try to see the picture, how you can feel, i don’t understand, i understand how you can plan, how you can fantasize, and how to feel, for example, for example, summer, i’m walking through the park, next to me someone, well , the little one will definitely go, so the younger one, that is, you are walking through the park together, yes, the older child rarely began to go somewhere with us, but where is he probably walking now with his noisy teenagers, great, where is your man? breathe, nastya, breathe, he didn’t go, how do you feel when you walk through

the park in the summer with such a wonderful baby by the hand, you know that the eldest son has already grown up, he can walk on his own, mostly freely, there is a feeling of freedom inside, yes, where are you heading? and we are walking, well, if in the park, for some reason i imagine this path that goes in the botanical garden along the kamenka river, you know, there’s a garden there, we walk, we walk, yes, i like to sit there, i’m also there i like to sit look at fontancola from afar, from these steps, uh-huh, wonderful, that’s wonderful , the picture is simply mesmerizing, an absolutely happy woman, please tell me, we have already returned to reality, where is the place for this man, he exists, you didn’t tell me, that i haven’t seen him for six months and

forgot his name, he is in your life, but he is not part of your family. this is a psychic podcast, and we continue to analyze the story of our heroine anastasia, a man who does not accept her child from a previous marriage. i i just want to add one point, we tried to live together, yeah, and the man works as an it specialist, works for a large foreign company, and accordingly he, well, we left for him and lived there with him for some period of time, i left first, i ’m just with at some point i’ll go i won’t go, i won’t go i won’t go, literally in 3 days i pack my things and fly away with two boys, with two boys we fly away, but because... i just felt for my eldest child i felt so uncomfortable about it all, he asked me every day, when we went home, when we went home, although he studied at a private school, he was not offended, but the child was

so uncomfortable that i say, we just got ready to leave in 3 days, and returned to moscow, and returned to moscow, yes, and the most interesting thing , he also packed his things , a week later, he told the employer, if you don’t like that i work from russia, you can have me there, that is, he followed you, followed you into the country, but at the same time you don’t live together, we don’t live together, fantastic. well, listen, how is this the fantasy that is our usual life, but how do you look at the option in which there is a family, you and your sons, the youngest son has a sunday dad, well , that’s what we have now, and what’s wrong, during the week i don’t have time to meet with him, now and what’s wrong, that is, it turns out that the eldest son has his own dad, with whom they communicate , that’s right, yes, well...

so wait, what do i want to do, i should do it, it ’s somehow a very interesting story, you understand what's the matter nastya, you have a request for a family, yes you have a request for a family, but you chose a man who this? there is no question, but bingo, and it’s very painful to admit, in fact, and this is a very big and long conversation, we didn’t touch on your previous family experience, but why do you choose such men for yourself, well, this is just an open question, can i say, that is, i can ask both of you, and how you feel, as you see, ekaterina, that is, in this situation. in general, it’s not about the child, of course, no, that is, it’s not about your eldest son, in fact, it’s just an excuse, you know what the whole point is, nastya - she is now

said with... the moment she takes this rejection personally, she perceives it as her own rejection, and this is a story about the fact that we all parents react to what happens to our children in the first split second from our inner child, from that state when i was 11 years old, that is, when my teenage daughter was 13, and she was terribly arguing with her father, which in principle is normal, i did not dare

to defend her. faster at the speed of light, they made up in a second, and i was discouraged, then it was just me and my psychologist told me, it dawned on me that i was not running to protect my daughter, but i was running to protect myself at the age of 13, who, well , was under severe pressure, let’s call it that, you know, when you come with a request about your son, because you hurt. i understand that when a man and i also talk about these topics, i also tell him in plain text what i perceive, this is how you don’t accept me, so you tell me that i should put him somewhere, and i and what about a man? yes, it turns out i don’t accept you, what should i do? wait, what do you mean i'm not here, what? so it’s solved, that’s it, well then we can give him contacts of good psychologists and let

him go and work. by what part of his woman he rejects, no, when he says that it is decided, what does he mean, can he mean that there is a child to be resettled, for example, with his father, and i say that, as it were, here he is he says, my past lives separately from me, well, wait, you accept your man’s child from your first marriage, you know, here’s another point, that i see her very rarely, yes, i accept her, but what do i i’ll do it, she’s already there, sweet, good girl, beautiful... it’s like, we go there together, we walk, i give her gifts there, how can i accept her? yes, i don’t wake up with her, i ’m there, no, wait, but you don’t tell your man, what are our plans today, we’re going somewhere, the man says: my daughter is coming with me, i’m not going anywhere with your daughter i’ll go and work with her yourself, and i’m only there with my sons, you understand, you do

what you do, what... concerns and is your basic settings, yes, your core values , you have an expectation that this person will do the same, but you and ah, we are all different, and what you do does not mean that he will do the same, and this means not because he doesn’t even want to, but because a, he doesn’t know how, b, he has a lot of pain somewhere , forgive me for the diagnoses, he’s not ashamed of it, so this is a... that is, you are looking for something, what do you want where it doesn’t exist, well, listen, well, no, well, it’s clear, but the square won’t become round, but relatively speaking, it depends on what i want, well, yes, therefore, your attitude towards your son has somehow transformed into this situation over these 5 years, honestly, no, not towards your son, i had moments with my son before that when he annoyed me, but they started more precisely at the moment of divorce, when i start, you begin to see your ex-husband, and

it’s right for you... it starts, damn it, well, why is that, and the older he gets, the more he becomes like dad, who should he be like, and what are we going to do with that half, with what the father of this child put in you, well, yes, just admit that he put it there, and be proud that your son has such a father, we’re not talking about a man, my dear, but about the child’s father, mind you, our whole conversation today is about family roles, i don’t i know, friends, i understand that you are now having a dialogue between a psychologist and a client, but i, with my, so to speak, worldly, other-sided bell-bell, i want to say that in my opinion , it is generally immoral, immoral and immoral, infantile, i allow myself evaluative judgment, in principle, puts a woman before a choice, i’m a man or your child. but

it’s just so unnatural for me, it’s so anomalous, maybe, i’m sorry, the old formation of conservative views, well guys, well, i would just doubt it after that. dictated, but not out of the blue, this man behaves like this, i under no circumstances, as a psychologist, should be neutral, yes, and in no case do i want to make any guesses, but somewhere there is something he can’t

understand why he puts a woman before a choice, or well, god bless him again with this man, god bless him, it’s something you, there is something that does not give you - the opportunity to call a spade a spade and see the obvious, this man may remain in your life, but he will never be the one who will give you warmth, family, that’s all, and i i still don’t believe in never, nastya, but i don’t believe in never, but i believe that you will find some solutions to this complex problem with an asterisk, what do you think, what from this conversation? maybe you have already been able to feel, i would like to find a solution, of course, well, what will i feel, that i need in many moments just take it and admit to yourself that round is round, square is square and it will never be the other way around,

that’s why thank you very much for the opportunity to communicate with your wonderful expert, thank you very much for your experience, for your advice, and maybe when anastasia recognizes this square? family psychologist ekaterina sivanova helped anastasia, i hope, take the first steps towards solving this olympiad problem. psych podcast. ekaterina, throughout our entire conversation you’ve been drawing something on your on a piece of paper. can you even show us this? in fact, these magic icons are a research method called a genogram, i, as a family psychologist, i work with family systems, when i listen to a client, i picture to myself who is who, who

has to, that there is a civil marriage here, well between anastasia and a man, that there was a marriage, there was a child, and this gives me such a picture, that is , you know, this is what 3d turns out to be when you look in detail. then you describe all this with the client, you begin to see patterns, including in family scenarios, in behavioral strategies, well, in general, this is very interesting, this is the method that i use with absolutely all clients, that is, it is the visualization of relationships, family relationships, which may not be obvious to the client, yes , of course, we showed it today, how cool, well, then we will invite you to draw more diagrams like this, thank you. hello, this is the podcast schrödinger's cat,

and i am its host, grigory tarasevich, editor-in-chief of the popular science magazine cat schrödinger, and my co-host, the real barry the cat. our podcast is about popular science , about how easy it is to understand complex things , about how to see complexity in very simple everyday things, and today we have a wonderful guest, maria kalinina, doctor of chemical sciences, professor ran, leading researcher at the institute of physical chemistry and electrochemistry named after frumkin, hello, gregory, yes, completely, absolutely right, and today we will talk on the one hand about very complex chemistry. and about very simple things, for example, about soup, let’s try them tie it together, let's try , let's start with soup, well, all of you have at least eaten soup, and sometimes cooked soup, you cook soups, of course, yes, but what kind of

soup do you like to cook? well, i’m probably like everyone else, like most housewives in our country, first of all i cook borscht, cabbage soup, solyanka, and occasionally pickle, well, where does it start? borscht, borscht begins with broth, that’s right, but what is broth from the point of view of colloidal chemistry? broth from a point, let’s still think it’s worth giving a definition of what it is colloidal chemistry, colloidal chemistry from...

with the outside world, to somehow react with it, in fact, this is approximately the same thing that any housewife does, in general, soup is the path of any person to chemistry, on the other hand , the path of chemistry to the heart any person, the housewife prepares a colloid-chemical system in order to extract from... voluminous things from a voluminous carrot, voluminous beets, a large piece of meat, to extract that very taste, beneficial nutrients due to grinding or other techniques that the housewife uses in the kitchen, quite chemical, by the way. now, if we start with broth, what is it? this is a solution of protein molecules in water, as well as parts of protein molecules, but we know that meat contains collagen, i think everyone has heard this word, because this word... there is protein in water, we

must heat the meat, slowly we must heat it up to about 50 degrees, so that the collagen doesn’t immediately curl up, collagen is such a spiral-shaped molecule, and if you heat it up very quickly, it will shrink all at once and won’t go into solution, that is, wait, an important question that worries me with... no way, because if you throw meat into boiling water, this is exactly what will happen, this is about the same thing that will happen with a steak, you throw it in a frying pan, that's it, collagen it curdles quickly and no longer releases nutrients out, so well, a properly cooked steak is juicy inside, the same thing will happen to a piece of meat if you throw it in boiling water. then, in order to still get the broth, you will have to cook it for many hours, so that after all. to overcome this initial mistake, you need to put the meat

in cold water and slowly heat it up, let the collagen swell, and then somewhere around 60-65° the collagen molecules will begin to break down and release into the solution this same amino acid, the famous glutamine, which is in meat contains, to which our tongue reacts as if it were the same famous taste of mother, that is, this is the fifth taste that we can feel. and the more glutamic acid there is in the broth, the tastier it will be, this is obvious well, wait, you have to bring it to a boil , but the broth can actually be prepared without boiling, the problem is that you won’t be able to handle the vegetables later, if you don’t heat the soup further, then look, you said, you used the word solution, but as i understand it, in chemistry there is the concept of a true colloidal solution, a broth is not a true solution, a broth is not a true soluble solution. because the particles it contains are larger than

single molecules, that is, in fact, these are particles already larger than 2-3 nanometers of the standard size the size, well, as a rule, of an ordinary molecule, what does this mean in physical terms? this means, well, any listener can take , see for himself, try to distinguish colloidal solutions from true ones in his kitchen or in his cosmetic cabinet, so if he takes - say, well, some kind of perfume, a solution of aromatic substances in alcohol, shines there with a laser pointer, then the size of the spot at the entrance and exit will be the same through a transparent container, but if he shines it into a transparent glass with broth poured in, then it will see that the spot from the laser pointer will begin to increase at the exit, why is this happening, because the particles are large enough to scatter the light, not enough for us to see them, but for the laser pointer it is already...