hello, hello, alexandra, tell me what’s wrong with you, i buy everything, a good start, so, i buy everything, everything i can, everything i can’t, in any situation, bad, i’m going to buy new underwear, good, i’m going for a new bracelet, bored, i open some marketplace, sad, i buy cosmetics, a pimple has popped out, i buy 115 cream, i have a feeling that soon all things will be simple. will evict me from the house, that is, they need a separate house in order for us to exist together, this bothers you or is already bothering yours loved ones, that's where the problem starts? this has always bothered my loved ones, i’ve always been like this, that is, if my mother and i buy , say, one down jacket in childhood, or they buy someone one down jacket, then i need three, i need it to be like mine, like masha’s , like katya, like my sister, and also like olga.

dmitrievny is some kind of conditional, so i need everything, the problem is that i need everything, well, it’s great that your parents had such an opportunity, and what’s wrong, well, it’s cool, but i probably would like it instead of the fifteenth cream to buy at least a second apartment, that is , to feel, that is, you begin to understand that this is unreasonable, i understand that this is unreasonable, and i feel like an absolutely fool when i start buying the same identical things in a circle. that is, 15 gray jeans, conditionally, there are three identical skirts, the point is not that i simply don’t have these things, i have a basic wardrobe as such, it’s put together, i’m starting to take philip kirkorov’s concert clothes, which i will never wear , it will forever remain hanging there with a label, well, maybe i’ll try it on twice more, look at myself in the mirror , and go buy something new that i ’ll never wear either. uh-huh, that is, i

’m satisfying some of my needs for a purchase, that’s all, i’m not getting any better or worse, a new thing just appears that doesn’t bring me any pleasure, what are you doing? i ’m doing smm now, before that i was married, i didn’t work by education, i’m a lawyer, yeah, when we were married, we also bought everything, yes, at what age did it start, you say, from childhood. always been like this, yes well, that is, it was during the period of toys, during the period there, when i lived with my parents, when i lived alone, when i later lived there with my husband, it was always there and my husband already told me, as much as possible, has there ever been such a short period, perhaps, when you didn’t buy anything, no, never at all, not even once a day like this, okay, you go somewhere on vacation, it happens, travel? now less often, but it was, well

, let’s say you went somewhere on vacation, do you buy there too? yes, i'm buying a suitcase to bring what i am and what you are there are you buying? well, let’s say, i used to bring some cheeses from abroad , wine, olives, even food, cosmetics, i really love all kinds of cosmetics, things, clothes, shoes, to me, in principle, well, it doesn’t really matter, but when do you have you ever been to some countries or places where you definitely don’t need everything that... is sold there, well, for example, in cairo, no, i haven’t, haven’t been, yes, yeah, well, it’s just not interesting what you brought from cairo, and how do you generally feel when that thing that you so desperately wanted becomes yours, momentary joy, from the fact that i have it, look, you have it after that, but there is no joy from possession, so having received it, you get some kind of joy, uh-huh, let's see... the last thing you bought

today, yesterday, a bag, yesterday, today, yesterday, yesterday, yes, we were sitting at home, bought a bag or went to the store, bought a bag, and i saw it, somewhere on the internet, yeah, yeah, i saw it, i realized that i needed one, i waited for it for 2 weeks, that is, it’s not just like that, i went and bought it, it was not available, i was waiting for it, i went and bought it, yesterday you went and bought it, yeah, today with it. did you go with her today? okay, tell me, at that moment when you saw her, what thoughts, feelings, emotions arose? i liked it, i thought that i needed it, that it would fit, that it was roomy, that i could carry a laptop in it, since all my other bags were very small, that i hadn’t bought myself a single large bag before, but i don’t know why, before that i went with little ones, but now i needed a big one, understandably, that is, there was such a rationalization that everything will fit in this bag, a laptop, bricks, and so on, right? do you have a laptop there now? no,

of course, it’s clear that no, tell me, this is rationalization, but what emotion arose when you saw it? but i liked it, it was beautiful, it seemed to me that it was comfortable. you liked her, i like you too, but that doesn’t mean that you and i will go home to me from here, no, you see, and i like you, but somehow i’m worried, and you might not, well, i’m not yet not for sale yet, but let's see, you liked the bag, but besides the fact that you liked it, there is also some kind of emotion there, which, you know, it might look like some kind of hole that needs to be closed, this bag will definitely close this hole. it seems as if i really thought that this was because, well, sort of, that i have a desire, it’s wrong to say, like everyone else, to be the best , probably, that’s when i, well , that is, buy everything, everything that i can, i feel

like i’m better than i really am, maybe, maybe this is it, well, that is , it turns out that without this bag i’m somehow not the same, not better than everyone else.” well , it’s like everyone has it and i need it too, well wait, obviously not everyone has this bag, not everyone, either some friend who you saw there has it, i don’t know, some... some actress you saw it with, or in an advertisement for some girl you saw it with, well, yes, and but the absence of this bag makes you what, i don’t know, makes me without a bag, here you are without a bag , what a sasha, not fashionable, probably not stylish, that is... you seem to be lagging behind, yes, yeah, probably good, in this backwardness, what kind of feeling, what kind of emotions? sadness, unhappiness is possible, that is, it seems to me that if i buy something, maybe it will make me happy, of course, but now i’m more

interested in this feeling of unhappiness, yeah, what does it consist of, i don’t know, it’s difficult for me to say about this, because i am... basically, a person who has everything, i have a wonderful family, i have wonderful parents, i am an only child, that is they loved me very much, they were waiting for me, they always waited for me, there, even if we look at my childhood photographs, i can show you after the program, there we are sitting in the kindergarten, all the children are like me, socks with frills, which means glasses on a chain, grandmother i attached a bow, my grandmother immediately sewed some kind of jacket with flowers, and i have always been such a favorite as...

children are like children, and i’m there in little darlings and bows, yeah, tell me about your parental family, how you grew up, anyway, a little more detail, my parents’ family, i grew up, i don’t remember my dad well, because my dad passed away, i was in in fifth grade, at that time my parents were already divorced, well, that is, we talked, my mother is such a very calm person, she never instilled in me there, well, i just , including i faced different situations in life, i was there i see how my friends behave in relation to their husbands, exes, yes, and communication with children, i didn’t have that, i was raised by my mother, father, grandmother, grandfather, i studied at a music school and went to dances, knitting to the house of creativity, well , that is, i had such a normal, cool, rich childhood life,

tell us about your parents’ marriage, oh, it ’s hard to say, my dad is an anesthesiologist, yeah, mom... i’m a financier by education, in my opinion, well, something connected with the financial and accounting field, when i was young, she worked part-time at a clinic, uh-huh, molopoly, she met her dad there, uh-huh, so they got married, you were born, 10 years later, 10 years later they lived without children, without children, yes, uh-huh, then you were born, how many did they give birth to we lived together after that, oh, i don’t remember, to be honest, but i was very, i was very young, yes. how did you spend your childhood, how much time did you spend with your dad and how much with your mom, like this? well, i spent time with my dad, of course less, most often on weekends, because my school and academic life was busy, that is, even, probably, my mother tried to implement some

things that she may not have had, because that as a child i was never denied anything, when i asked, that is, at my school i studied from eight, say, until three or four. i don't remember, i just came and she said: mommy, i want, my mother told me, please, there to dad, i came and said, daddy, i want, he said, go, and dad, when they divorced, he created his own family, no, he didn’t, that is, you remained the only child for your dad, yes, yes, but at the same time, when you came to your dad for the weekend, how did he show love for you, how, how did you feel, why, by what criteria did you evaluate it? i remember very poorly. dad, because i was very little, i remember that moment when he was gone, uh-huh, and i even remember how

they told me about it, and how painful and incomprehensible it was for me, but i remember dad in segments, how he took me from kindergarten there, how we had pizza with him in a restaurant, well, that is in this format, i don’t remember spending time together as such, can i ask why they divorced, yes you can, it was, it was... such a rather difficult time, my dad worked in a hospital, worked in gynecology, dentistry, then there were questions, well, how would everyone relax in the nineties, god forbid, well or not very much, my mother was not happy with such a life, and my mother wanted security to a greater extent for both me and herself, well, considering i’m from a gangster city, yeah, from vladivostok, that’s how he is... you’re watching the podcast triggers with

you, its host tatyana krasnovskaya and sergey nasebyan we are talking with sasha, who is our guest today and we are talking about the problems of chapagalism. now where is mom in vladivostok? uh-huh, how is your relationship with your mother? excellent, wonderful, well, that’s how the hourly difference is 5 hours, with we communicate with our mother through messengers, we communicate with my mother. by video call, by phone, by texting, yeah, did you have a close relationship with your mother, in what way was it close, such a warm relationship, where you relate to each other, where you trust each other, not so much as a teenager, now yes, in childhood , as a child, i really don’t remember my mother well, because my mother worked a lot, i remember how my mother took me to school and how my mother picked me up from school, well, that is, somehow.

in your very childhood there was some kind of your own, interesting, rich life, what you lived mother? my mother lived by work, that is, although everyone always teased me that i was a beloved child, much loved, my grandparents took care of me, i have a wonderful family, i have sisters and cousins ​​there, we all had a great time, had a great time, but i too, i don’t remember my dad well, and i don’t remember my mother well, so the fact of the matter is that you... talk about your life, that in essence, when you talk about it, you talk about how all

these negative experiences were leveled out by those the most shopping, gifts and pampering that they showed towards you, probably, and moreover, well, if you try to change it a little, yes, add tragedy, drama to your story, then mom and dad divorced, as if yes, they could communicate normally and mom never against... you against your father, but this does not mean at all that you did not suffer from this, that they do not live together, of course, but at the same time, as if all the main holes were closed by the fact that there was everything about you, yes, so that you seemed to have nothing to complain about, but there was no feeling that you were needed, of course, today, out of habit, you continue to cover up all your negative feelings with purchases, but if you just look at the basis of what you are buying 117 cream, as you say, right? the same, then, in fact , in a few seconds, there minutes, maybe before, you will see that the level of anxiety was

so high that you urgently need something to cover this anxiety, but because in such circumstances, in which you talk, there is vladivostok, and the nineties, a gangster city, and there are all these complexity and ups and downs, they certainly caused a high degree of anxiety for you as an individual, you need to cover yourself with something, and you know how good it is. that at least you’re not drinking vodka, it’s good that you’re shopping, but since you begin to understand that this is inadequate, then , of course, you need to look at it from the point of view of the fact of what emotions you are hiding. i ’ll assume, i’ll leave it like this for now, and we ’ll move on, that these are precisely those same feelings of anxiety and loneliness that arise inside you, yes, perhaps, that’s why everything these purchases don’t bring you pleasure, because it’s the same thing that happened in your childhood, they bought you a lot, you had a daily routine, a schedule, knitting, sewing,

a photo club, all this, but you needed, you needed this this warm contact, and closeness, warmth. it seemed like it wasn’t enough, do you know how to create warm , close relationships, as you think you can? i can, in fact, i also have this kind of fixation, a family dinner, a family outing somewhere, to the theater, to the cinema, have always been important to me. let’s say my husband, a man of unknown status today, told me that, well, let’s lie there in the evening, i say what?

well, what difference does it make even if you kick him out? no, i’m not kicking him out, i left him, well , because i can’t live with such a low-emotional person, he’s ready to cover some basic needs for me, but conditionally, well, he tells me, why are you complaining? you have everything, you have a house, you have everything there, what else do you need, but i

need it to be cool, fun, interesting, emotionally, that is, i want something. that i want to buy something that can’t be bought, yeah, that’s probably it, yeah, something that’s not for sale in the first place, yeah, that’s happiness, flight, yes, that is, not that, well, yes, i have a husband, yes , okay, yes, he’s doing something there, he goes to work, he’s great, that’s when he goes to work, or left, no matter how you felt, it’s so good, to be honest, especially the last five months, so, i i was so happy. sometimes i didn’t even want him to come, that’s how it was, well, you stayed one, what did you feel at that moment, you were going there to meet with friends, girlfriends, not always, i spent a lot of time at home, we lived outside the city, i liked to walk, i liked to hear birds singing, i planted some things there hydrangeas, he always said, i had two beds

there, unfortunate three by three squares, i was thinking, damn, plant onions there, what are we... we’ll buy onions, so i really wanted to create something, and i still want to, i went to sew, i’m taking photographs there now, i’m trying, i i want to see exactly the result of my efforts, my business, now you are doing it, now i am doing it, yeah, yeah, and you know, i feel so happy now, despite the fact that i continue to buy, well, look, it’s a strange feeling, that it’s still as if this happiness doesn’t close your inner pain in some kind of... inner hole that closes precisely when you consume, yes, but now i did an experiment for myself, i left, went to a friend, left with two suitcases, in one tablet, in second, that means things, so now i still reassure myself that i buy what i need, because everything else is kind of there, i don’t want to go back to it yet, i don’t plan to, not yet, well, for

today, i just understand , that i am more comfortable alone, well, here i am... i feel much better alone than as if nothing is pressing me, so what has been pressing me lately? it seemed to me that he seemed, not that he didn’t seem to hear me, so he often asked the question, what are you missing, but i seemed to have enough of everything, i didn’t have enough time, attention, i missed jokes, i missed walking together, i missed watching a movie together, i missed. time together, and i don’t have enough, well, strawberries, let’s buy you some in the evening, if you want strawberries, eat strawberries, but i like these strawberries, i wanted to be close, yeah, but you’re sitting at home? he says: let me buy you some strawberries, at this moment, of course, you want him to just be there nearby, yes, and he’s not nearby, it just so happens, then what you felt

was nothing, i mean such emptiness , emptiness, yes, and this is one of the, if before that we had a difficult relationship for a year already, if before that i understood that we were still going there, that this is it, let’s try it like this, let’s do it here, then now, lately, i ’ve directly felt emptiness, i understand what i have in principle. you don’t need anything, let’s see, did you turn to specialists for the first time with this question or did you go to see them a year ago, that i also cover up my emotions, the need there with shopping, but after talking with a psychologist i went out, called my friend and said, listen, let's go, there's a new collection, we need to go in, let's go, just take a walk, yeah, well, you can do that today after talking with us, but now there's still a feeling that... you seem to be more ready with figure this out? yes, i ’m tired, really, i want to, so i understand that even well, it was also very

significant for me, i was in thailand, it was many years ago, i was vacationing on one of the islands, and there were three islands in one of them has an airport, the other two, you can get there by poromchiki, it’s like a panga on kotau, yes, yes, kotau, i was in kotau, vacationed there, probably for three years in a row. i mean, i have these two, and can you imagine , it’s forty-degree heat with these two suitcases , i can’t close anything anymore, i bought some aloe vera for myself in some store, there were some gifts, and i bought gifts for everyone who didn’t need it , they didn’t ask me much, which means i, since i stayed there for 3 years in the same hotel, they already knew me there, there was such a beautiful thai woman there and i bothered her. some things from my suitcase, because it simply did not close, that is, there were two suitcases that had to be stepped on in order to close it, and i have a next flight from

the island in the other direction, i understand that i need something buy more in singapore, i understand that i simply won’t deliver things there, i started giving them to her, and i understand what she feels about this, when probably this didn’t happen, she...

if you refuse to buy , well, this is how it happened, and you no longer buy what will begin to change in your life, no matter how yours will change, there will be more money , there will be more money, i think yes, not more, in large quantities, i can, here with professional activities too, well, such a small nuance, i worked there before as an assistant, oh, before that i worked as an assistant in a large holding, then i became the executive director of a modeling agency, after that something went, went, went, i moved to moscow, and here, while i was still in an uncertain status with my man, i graduated,

graduated from higher education professional education, because there was a transfer from one place to another, i lost 2 years, i didn’t work for these 2 years, and it was extremely difficult for me without work, because before that my life consisted of wonderful... traveling, it was great for me , it’s interesting to communicate, meet new people, i really regret that during this time i lost my professional skills, for example, such as knowledge of the english language, before this allowed me to communicate with anyone, anywhere, at any time, now i understand there recently entering some kind of restaurant, when i hear a conversation in english, that i understand almost half of it...

the satisfaction you get from the professionalism of your activities, this is wonderful, in relationships, what can change, in relationships with with this man or with any other, i probably think that we need the next one, the next one, that is, relatively speaking. well, if we assume that your relationship, here you are dating a man, yes, how are you afraid or how worried are you, worry about the fact that he will find out that you are a shopaholic, that’s how you hide this part, but i don’t hide this part in any way, but well , you have a problem, conditionally, you admitted it, thank god, here i am the last one, probably months, well, four months for sure, i

’m talking about this frankly, yes... not yet, not yet, yeah, i’m actually still in that status, those feelings, that i don’t seem to want a relationship right now, i want to go on a date, i want to get attention, have a great time, but build a family now, which i dreamed about very much, i also admit honestly, i’m not ready, i’m not ready, no, why am i tired. during the period of our

previous relationship, we weren’t that long, you stayed there for 4 years, well, there was so much going on that i think it was, well, our relationship was complicated, we have a big age difference, and it was hard, like it would be hard to get used to each other, plus he still has two marriages behind him, one official, one not so official, this is communication with children, which is very difficult to build, and it was not easy for me, plus... he also has his own internal conflicts at work, which are quite serious, which in general added to the fact that his attention from you flowed into the activity, into work, into problems, i continued to buy, yeah, well then it becomes even more it is more obvious that your chapagalism is just an attempt, you see, when a person is thirsty, he drinks salt water, cannot get drunk, an attempt to be loved, you need

an attempt to receive. exactly that same love, or in the case of chapagalism, replace it, you know, if you, for example, were telling us that your problem is that you demand gifts, that would be different, that’s what you are talking about shepagalism, then your task is precisely to be able to buy this or that thing there, to simply have the opportunity, i remember a number of years ago, i went into some store, there was an expensive bag shop there , and i thought, what kind of bag costs there, like 30,000 rubles. i think what a beautiful bag, 30,000 rubles. it can’t be, then i think, i’ll take a closer look, maybe not 30,000 rubles, maybe 300, but i looked closer, it cost 3 million, yeah, and i put this bag in such a way and walked away from it so backwards, why am i saying this, to the fact that i clearly could not buy this bag under any circumstances, well, except on credit, and this is an unpleasant feeling when you have the opportunity to buy, then it

seems to elevate you and... humiliated by the fact that a person does not pay you the amount of attention that you want, does not give you the quality of attention that you want, of course you want to cover it up with needs, things, etc. with which you buy, and not the things themselves you need, this is exactly the ability or opportunity, power, to take him, buy all this, yes, this is, as it were, what you are looking for, and i would, well, how can i say, if i were you, i would look... and also into that very relationship with mom and dad there in childhood, where their attention was still lacking, it is obvious that the problem of this chapagalism takes its legs from there, you know, this work requires - in my opinion, or rather this problem requires quite a long work, and group work is best, but i now i’ll give you some, well, instructions, or something, yes, what needs to be done, i never offer quit smoking, drinking or stop buying,

for example, like that, it’s pointless to do that, you need to go the other way around in the opposite direction, in my opinion, that is, essentially, uh, you need to do two very simple things: first, you can absolutely safely buy from. .. everything that costs less than 500 rubles. i don’t know that it won’t matter, it’s just necessary, no, i understand your reaction, i understand your reaction, products, no, i understand your reaction, but believe me, the whole of russia is watching us now, i just don’t need it, i i know you at all you don’t need anything, that’s the point, you don’t need anything, you already understood that too, i’m giving you a direct instruction, your task is everyone. buy something that costs less than 500 rubles. it could be anything, go down to the metro, there are absolutely a lot of things sold in the passages, absolutely unnecessary, i went down, you know how much it costs there, not 500 rubles. no, if you try, you will find something, at the end there are shops, everything is 349 or something

like that, no, i understand everything, if you don’t want 500 rubles, let it be 1. rubles, but your task find buy something, just buy some kind of nonsense every day, but it should not be food that you eat. and it shouldn’t be food that you put in the refrigerator, it should be something completely material, that is, well, i really don’t know either, laces, for example, so you go buy them, take them, remember my vote , buy them, by the way, i need to, i lost the white one somewhere, so, accordingly, your task is to buy something every day, buy something, so be sure to do it once a day 500 rub. the second thing i’ll suggest you do, i don’t know whether you’ll do it or not, at some point you’re sitting at home and out of boredom you’re scrolling through some marketplace, probably, yes, yeah, often i’m in a taxi when- something like that, and not a question, suddenly your eyes stop on something that you think you need right now, you

need it right now, before you click on the buy button, pay, you first do the following: you yourself hug tightly, and tell yourself several times that you feel very you love very much that you have the best on earth in general and that no one exists on this earth except you, so you say this to yourself several times, after that, if you want to do it, then you buy it, but i have it the feeling, especially judging by your reaction, that this will be more than enough, thank you very much, you know, a previous psychologist told me about a technique , i think it was called 21 days or something like that, that if you like a thing, you. .. you take pictures, and if in a month you i haven’t changed my mind about buying it, then you go buy it, i tried it, it didn’t suit me much, well, that’s why i suggest you do two things, i’ll try, just buy something

completely unnecessary on a daily basis, you can throw it away immediately if you want, maybe you will put some unnecessary things in a box, but the second one , yes, but the second task is more important, i really hope, than you are leaving, sasha, it was important to hear, probably, that i love myself? it's also that i probably don't need someone who will take care of me to love that i’m no longer a 3-year-old girl who needs to go for a cotton candy walk with her dad in the park with her mom, choose shoes, self-love can be shown not only by shopping, i hope this will be useful to you, thank you, thank you for your openness, really , thank you, well, you watched the triggers podcast on the first channel with you and its hosts tatyana krasnovskaya. we talked with alexandra about what the roots of chapagalism are, and that often the desire to buy things just covers up our unbearable pain and loneliness. what if suddenly

dear tv viewers, if you want to sort out your problem or solve some issue here in the studio with us, you can fill out a form to participate in our program, which you will find on the website 1tv.ru. you can watch all episodes of the triggers podcast on the website of the first channel 1tv.ru. hi all. this is a free program podcast. i'm maxim tronkov. and our guest is a man who, with his career-ending performance, raised the anniversary one to his feet.