"she's there, the children need oxygen, she climbed through the window, let me out and so on, yes, she's an ordinary child, irochka there, well, that's it, ira, you did something wrong there, i won't buy you a new school bag because of this, okay, mommies, no, once again a school bag, then it's not valuable, and what is valuable to her, damn, i don't even know anymore, you know, she has a phone, yes, i took it, but she's calm, well, okay, and alya is also calm, how much did you take?" "how much did you take from alya, alya lost her phone for a year and a half, ira, well, at most, well, about the size of she hasn't had it in her phone for a year, well, that's significant, and i can, well, not let them watch tv, that is, and what do they do when they don't watch tv, they don't have a phone, she can occupy herself with playing with dolls there, ki is very valuable, by the way, for modern children, modern children are less and less able to do it themselves.

and does he wash the floor in the kitchen? yes, maybe he can wash after the cat, yes, good, super, so, and, in fact, yes, we look at what he does, good, he walks, he pays the electricity bills, no, let him, make it his responsibility, let him he pays for electricity, he will be able to do it, no, he won’t be able to, you know, how do we determine what people can do and what they can’t, one of the ways, yeah. is to assign them something and see if they can do it or not, no, well, i saw the results of their studies, okay, you saw the results of their studies, but you didn’t see the results of their cleaning, so draw your own conclusion: they can study, but they can’t clean, for what reason, and they don’t clean, that means, that means they can’t study now in those, in those conditions in which they live, external, some internal ones. there are certain

limitations, for example, lack of motivation, okay, then for what reason do they do homework at the mother-in-law's, but not at home, this is a very cool question, if you worry , instead of learning how to build interaction with your children, you will have the opportunity to build this interaction better than now, but in principle, if you have two assistants and they already have this, you can spit already. and stop demanding of yourself that you be such, that is, an ideal mother, who succeeds in everything, including building 100% relationships with all the children, and maybe, well, take what you have, well, we have good relationships with the children, they love me, and i love them very much, well, like, wait, i tell them, i didn’t give birth to you to become your slave, believe, wait, let’s do it this way, while we have the opportunity to get advice from mikhail. recipes, let’s try

to objectify those situations, to designate them, when it seems to you that you are in slavery, yes, here i heard that they don’t wash the floor, yes, yes they do nothing, it's not true, it can't be that they brush their teeth, well yes, thank god, and they wash the floor, they go to the toilet, they flush after themselves, periodically, judging, judging, judging by the way vera thought, once again, they do something, every time you say that they don't do anything. nothing at all, you are again deceiving yourself, you feel bitter about it, unpleasant, well i feel unpleasant, yes, but not because they don't do anything, that's a lie, but because you decided that they don't do anything, but they do, and a jar of yogurt she will throw it out after ten reminders, and the little son will wash after the cat, that is , your children do, they just don’t do as much as you want, let’s just try to think about someone... as

an intermediate result, yes, what would you like your children to do, so that you could let go a little of this idea of ​​orsk, i really want, here is the idea of ​​slavery, so that they would take up their studies. so cleaning doesn’t bother you so much, because about about about slavery, here i see, if only with cleaning, but what does slavery have to do with studying, then what are you for them study, yes, as we all study together, that is, you write some essays for them , do some projects for them, thank god no, i hire, look, i have a tutor with them four times a week, and the vosyns, because even the tutor has started doing their homework for them. accordingly, listen, a lousy tutor, i tell you, you see, one of us, here is victoria vladimirovna, a very good tutor, she even refused us for this reason, because she realized that ira was doing her homework at her expense, and she comes blank sheet and gets bad grades because of it, she

said, i won't do that for then you need to invest in finding a tutor who is a professional and a teacher, we don't need a trainer who did it once, did it twice, or i'll do it for you, right? this is exactly what grandmothers and parents who desperately write their children's copybooks deal with, you need a tutor who would motivate them, you know, who would create in them an intention, a desire, a drive, an anticipation of pleasure, you know, we are both simple and say, people who are engaged in another profession, we may not be able to do this, here is a teacher you need to find, it seems to me either a psychologist or a psychologist.

just don't jump on the twos , maybe some correction was needed again, so now she is studying again, well now the whole summer has come, it is understood, do you see some result? well, until this first lesson is good, and why do you think that you are in slavery? i see how you tell, i see that you are not a slave of this lamp, yes, of

your children, and why are you such a manager? you you know, you need to find a tutor, organize lessons, ask your grandmother for help, ask your neighbor for help, is this slavery. here, here, here, here it goes, yes, so, now you are not talking about their behavior, but about your feelings, yes, i do not feel yes for you, what is it, what will you feel when you receive a return, i will relax, that's it, so, you are under stress, and you call this stress slavery, yeah, here, here is the key story, now the important question, most people, yeah, think that they experience stress because of the environment in which they live, that is , most people accept the position of an emotional victim of circumstances, well , like, these are the circumstances, so i am forced to experience stress because of these circumstances, i was born into such a family, i

was born into those children, they behave incorrectly, all that, but it is important to understand that a lot of scientific experiments have been conducted, a huge number, which prove that in the same...

well, if you start to look more realistically at this situation of your relationship with children, yes, children can be like that, and i can be like that...

no, but i want them to see their lives themselves, not me, who they are still little to, no, the thing is, you see, when, for example, i was little, i knew that mom and dad were working, they would come home at 5 o'clock, mind you, in the afternoon, and they don't have a dad, they have a mom who has done everything for them their whole life, and you immediately demand from them that they just like that and... line up, and you have this requirement every day, this requirement has always been there, even when

there was a husband, that a study, they should know themselves, that they need to come home from school, and that they need to do their homework, they should know that on the street they throw a piece of paper in the trash, and at home near the tv, you understand, well, it's elementary, i don't clean up these pieces of paper, with them , they collect them themselves in the end, but what bothers you, if they collect them, what bothers me is that they can't do it right away, right away, well, that means they can't yet, what 's wrong with that, tell me, well, a person, you understand, should live, you drew yourself something, how it should be, well, let's leave them in the dirt, well, let them not study, as my one could say, let him not study, they are removing something, no, look, you are being thrown from one extreme to another, either everything is just the way i want. or we will leave it alone, no, take the middle ground, let's start from the beginning, when i

was a child, they didn't check my homework, yes, but now i went to a club myself, of course, i finished 11 grades myself, i entered college, i finished, i finished, i entered the institute myself, your children are like that, no, no, yes, it surprises me when a child comes and discusses, you just said five times, i myself, myself, by yourself, by yourself, that's also a lie, not by yourself,

your parents helped you, what, well, with something, you somehow interacted with the fact that they were not there until five, they helped you with this, because if they had babysat you until five o'clock, then you would be what you are, strong, you would not have grown up, each, each influence of a parent on a child or something. that it is very, very frequent, and you many, here in our short conversation, unfortunately,

short, raised problems that i want to think about and discuss, that and i will add that in the definition of the word intelligence or in brackets mind, there is such a line: the ability to adapt to changing circumstances, it is very difficult, especially when a person has made himself a strong-willed person, not completely himself, it is not easy, but ... nevertheless, i see before me a very caring person, a person very passionate in a good sense, a person devoted to his family, from what i heard from you, i saw that you have come a long way. in the evolution of your family relationships and even that you were able to make a team not only with your mother, but also with your former mother-in-law, this is a huge achievement, this is very cool, that is, you are rowing, in my opinion, in the right direction, the fact that you ask questions and worry, this is normal, we, people, we are so arranged to worry , to look for a way out, and i sincerely wish you to find

that harmony in relations with your children, when no one will be in slavery to anyone, everyone will be a little more happy. with what they have, well, and maybe put the brakes on those things that seem to us not quite perfect. this was a podcast psyche, in which we talked with our heroine vera, who came to us with a request that she is in slavery to her four children. and we honestly tried to find a way out of this slavery, but came to a conclusion, probably unexpected. thank you, dear friends, for coming to us, i remind you once again, yes, that they ask for help. those who want to become stronger, welcome, we invite you to our podcast, hello, i am dmitry bak, we have another

episode of the literary podcast, let them not talk, let them read, today we have absolutely unique. guest, you all know him well, at the same time, i am sure that you do not know him completely, he is a young, passionate, strong, active, risky person, he is a person who knows russian poetry of all times, he is a famous poet, scientist, he is a professor, he is a lauriate of many awards, he is a tv journalist, this is igor leonidovich volgin. hello, igor. hello, dima. let's be informal, as we are in life, i am very glad to see you. and since i have already promised our interlocutors that they will recognize volgin and not recognize him. let's let's start right from the point where they, perhaps, do not know you completely. i 'll read some line now. well, for example, belaya akhmadulina. and igor will try

to continue. it's me, my outfit is purple. i am arrogant. young fat, but i have already accustomed my lips to the dying smile of poets. igor volgin, a participant in the witness of all those phenomena, events that we are accustomed to call the khrushchev thaw, or simply the thaw, this is the period that is, as is commonly believed, between the fifty-sixth year, the twentieth congress of the party and 68 or the seventies, this is the era of debuts, the era of beginnings, well yes. this is the era of the sixties, of course, although my generation we were called undergrowth, we are because the generation of the sixties is the thirty -second, thirty-third year of birth, yes, we were 10 years younger, of course, but this is a wonderful era, this is not only a literary debut, this is a historical debut, a change in worldview, if there had not been this era, there would have been no literary debuts, there would not have been, there would have been yavtushenko, but another yavtushenko, of course,

would have been perhaps in voznesensk, although i am in this i doubt it, but it would have been a different galaxy of poets, i... for example, i remember the first meeting with yavtushenko, he had an evening on bolshaya okemanka, where, by the way, there was the literary museum at that time , an architectural museum, that's when i saw him for the first time and we came to, but no, that was a little later, yes, but we weren't acquainted yet, we came to this museum, there was a huge crowd standing there, they opened the windows, tushenko came out in something so extravagant, i remember how amazing it was, i heard this rhyme for the first time, yevtushenko's new one, which updated dictionary, updated poetics. it was a rhyme of the middle of a word not the ends of words. i poked him painfully in the side, he did not understand why, i say, here is a new rhyme, dictionary update, any examples? well, well i will give an example, maybe from another, let's say, it is pankratov, his students, pankratov and kharabarov, winter was so young, so cheerful and miserable, it seemed to me

like a simulated milk can, yes, but they took it from yatushenka. he fed that he was making a career, and meanwhile he was ruining it, well, that is, and so long live the career, when a career is like shakespeare's, pasteur's, homer's and tolstoy's, the lion's pause, i promised, i promised, here's igor. evenings on

mayakovsky square, when people gathered on saturdays, a crowd, everyone could read, only then was the chichulin monument erected, and right under the opening of the monument somewhere at the end , apparently, and the renaming of the square, yes , the renaming of the square, and we gathered there, moreover, there was such a... spontaneous reading, but there were also poetry days, the same ivtushenko spoke there, it was already official, but we gathered there, i remember there antakolsky read skifov, there were people from mayakovsky's team of 1929, amazingly, mayakovsky's brigade, which organized his last exhibition, let us recall, the last exhibition was called 20 years of work, it was open literally a few weeks before mayakovsky's suicide in 1930, in early april, in 1929 all this was alive, yes. and it was alive in the late fifties, it was, it was a gate park in moscow, a gate park like that, they not only read poetry there, there were conversations there, like for the first time i this is the moment when politicians heard and

so on, it was absolutely free, then it was all closed down, but it was about a year or even more, i remember bukovsky there we argued with him on that square, there i didn’t know what he would become - that he would be a future politician, there were many, many people there, this was also such an amazing phenomenon, i have never gone to a single personal date... in my life i have never gone with such excitement as to mayakovsky square, there was my debut before the debut, that is, as if there was already recognition, this is bon mot, this is bon mot from the volga, although the first i had a publication in the spring of fifty-nine, i was a schoolboy in the newspaper moskovsky komsomolets, the first poem was a fairly early debut, so it's an anniversary, we have an anniversary program today, because volgin's poetic debut in print was 65 years ago, no, well, if you take such a serious debut, of course, i went with the propaganda team of the philological faculty, although i was on...

so there was this selection in the literary my debut, okay, but it comes out in the fall, they come out in a newspaper like this, like, this is already what year, the second year, i studied at the history faculty and an interesting year, it's a stunning year,

because look, this is my okay, okay, one day of ivan denisovich, the eleventh issue in november in the new world, yes in the new world, my first selection is in october, by the way, it's also interesting, there was like october, the new world, two, let's remember that these are two magazines, one is conditionally progressive.

we expected not only a poetic takeoff, because i know that there are photographs of volgin with gagarin, for example, and where was it taken at a meeting, at the fourth meeting of young writers, by the way, this is

done, he spoke. this is a new reality, it would seem, on the one hand this, on the other hand such a reaction, all this, well, in general, in the sixtieth year i brought books, as always, and i will even tell you a terrible thing, not traditional, that usually, of course, you remember that in the middle of each of our podcasts there is an author's column, and the host there either reads a poem, comments, or shows an old book, and today i give it to the guest, because i have igor volgin as a guest, who reads himself, but about this

later, and... now i'll just pick up some books, well, here's yavtushenko's book promise, for example, here's yavtushenko's book tenderness, it's very important that i have a foreign book, duckling, this is also important, remember what happened a little earlier with dr. zhivvaga, when a book was sent abroad , what a tragedy, yes, we remember, the nobel prize, here's andrei voznesensky's book, my love diary, also published abroad, here's a selection of, well, erotic poems, but most of them are published, that is, barriers no, but i remember when my first book of poems was coming out, they called it excitement, i was wildly indignant, because it was called night cities, in the young guard it came out in sixty-fifth year, i see, when it comes out excitement is written on no, they just took night cities, what excitement, well, i 'll tell you one more thing, here we were talking about

roles, that is literature, the second year. "i'm 20 years old, it comes out in january of sixty-three , not 20 years old, not 20 years old, yes, by the way, yes, the first issue of a new newspaper comes out, literature and life, literature, literary russia, which replaced the friendly sharsh with golubkina in the first issue, it was a hussar band, it was written about me, i beg your pardon, there is glory and oil in the cup, look , poet, don't get drunk, i'm 20 years old, i'll get drunk, but igor volgin still hasn't gotten drunk, that 's nice, well, he got drunk, of course, well, not glory , of course, this is a unique, unique historical phenomenon, a unique literary phenomenon, it hasn't been repeated in the last 65 years, here's a little book , a parable, mandestam's book is the same small, voznesensky, print runs take, take, my first book, the first book was 10,000 copies, the second book 20,000 copies, now everything is instant, here

is a gigantic print run, i think also some kind of. we recognize the artists, we recognize the editor, viktor fagelson many books, my editor too, yes, for sure the print run is also large, now the print run even of prose books, even of novels, well 2.0 is good, yes 3.00 a lot of magazines, when i opened each issue of the new world, we read, after all we signed up for a queue for...

tomorrow on channel one, i saw you on tv, who do we have on tv in our house, even though we can't fly with you, we'll go to kosiapeya, in kassiape there are nebulae, a bubble nebula and soul and heart nebulae, and you say women don't have a soul and heart, here you go,

we have everything. how sweet, does she like being kissed? i don't know, but i like it when i kiss her. and can you help me, oh my, better than anyone, the premiere is on saturday on channel one, so here's a podcast, let them not talk, let them read, we're talking with the poet igor volgin, after all, igor, you!

brodsky, these orphans, akhmatova's limbs. they came to okhmatova, by the way, feeling some, some continuity, no one was published, no one, no, no, no, no one, it was a different poetics in many ways and a different subject matter, of course, well, i first heard of obroskom, by the way, from ivtoshenko, i remember, we were sitting in the wto, that is, everything is not so simple, not so simple, he sat down with us yavtushenko and said: and you know, they arrested there or the trial is going on now in st. petersburg, the wonderful, brodsky, yes, and brodsky, whom then... he accused him of treating him badly there, so he says: we must, we must, we must free him, we must write a letter, and seryozha chudakov sat down, an amazing figure, seryozha chudakov, to whom brodsky dedicated the death of a friend, although he was still alive, everyone thought that he had died, well, he died, so

yes, he is, well, he is an absolute marginal, but with genius inclinations, and then he read me a christmas romance, i first heard poetry quite late, brodsky's poetry, all this somehow merged, we...

after all, enthusiasm or skepticism, they didn’t go, because well, they didn’t believe that it would last long, no, they wanted all these, i think, not everyone thinks so, no, no, they wanted, well, why did porodsky want to be published, of course, of course, by the way, he debuted that, yes, the second year, in the magazine kostyor, i think there were some of his poems in kostyor, yes, such half-childish, half-childish, yes, of course, they all wanted to be published, but i still have one book in my hands, this is the book of arseny. my beloved, who was born in 1907, and the debut was in sixty-second, sixty-second year, the same book before the snow, the same year when solzhenitsyn, when brodsky, the book before the snow 55 years, well, he was a translator, constant translations of poetry

, how my head hurts, but he always wrote poetry all his life, yes, but it was such a late debut, he performed at my studio too, but he was already famous then, i would like to say a few more words about vladimir sokolov .