of israel's total c, just because it has disrupted all aspects of life with no fuel for cars, buses and trucks. palestinians have been forced to find another way to move around, but how much the vault has the story? the it looks like a scene from the past. but this is kind of going to seem southern because like 2023 of 2 weeks of he does. he is 80 bombardments and the just want blockades. almost 10 units are returning to the old, where your calls have disappeared. some of the roads replaced by donkey costs deal with the bus, the leaving the house to go to the hospital because i have diabetes in high blood pressure here on my medical records. there are no cars, no fuel, no flower there is nothing to eat or drink. we want to live late enough. enough is enough. 7 costs on just the most common form of transport. they

also provide a source of income to those of last the farms and businesses on this, but to feed the families. the other one, the most of my pocket, the station and shouts out the names of the stock. so don't key count serves like and that's what i need to provide for my children. i have no other choice. what can i do at least this way? i can pay for a formula in the nappies and in this other expenses, not for you, but the thing is there is no fuel, no gas, no. so the power there is absolutely nothing. what can we do? we have to survive. these are the blockade of goals or dates, spock nearly 2 decades and with the code for it has to suffice what is what i described as a complete seat of the teddy to preventing being pulled up. even the most basic items, the big carries offer on out of fuel and smoke the shelves

in the grocery store and to produce thomas have lost the office. schools have become temporary shelter for hundreds of thousands of displaced families. the list of all you say is non stop bump up and it just goes up from north to south east, so you can life one day to the next is 51. so how much of this that's it for me 0 then yea. then use continues here on alpha 0 off to the bottom line will have much more coverage of israel's war on gaza at the top of the hour. and a reminder, of course, you can keep up to date with all the news on our website. thanks for watching. stay to the the

challenge is with the high on steve clements and i have a question. this is real having in game for the war in gaza. let's get to the bottom line. the israel has been pounding guys up for more than a month. ever since the hamas surprise attack of october 7th, resulting and more than $1400.00 is released killed, and another $200.00 taken hostage at this point. more than 10000 palestinians had been killed by his really forces about half of them children. today the narrow strip has been split into, and most of its 2300000 civilians have been displaced by the non stop is really showing. the humanitarian situation on the ground is become dire. food, water,

medicine, and fuel shortages are reaching catastrophic levels and the united nation said more of its aid workers had been killed in gaza. then in any period in the history of the united nations, all of which brings to mind the famous quote of general david betray us from 20 years ago when us forces were invading a rock. he said, tell me how this ends the death and destruction continue, but what's the end game for israel today we're talking to congressman seth molten, a democrat representing massachusetts and a veteran of the marine corps who served in iraq war proximal. and thank you so much for joining us with you, sir. it's more terms in iraq. you know, what war feels like and sees. you saw your friends die, you saw civilians die and you saw enemy combatants die. i'm just interested, given your experience of that. what frame should we be considering as we look today at the crisis between israel and homos and gaza? well, 1st of all, all, let's just acknowledge was absolutely horrific. where should be avoided at all

costs and the worst part of war is when innocent people die. and is, and people always die in war and we saw innocence, seville civilians, and israel massacred barbaric lee by him off. and now we're seeing innocent civilians in gaza killed every day and it's really air strikes. this is a horrible tragedy. i think the important context to look at this war though, is it, this is not a force on force for like russia versus ukraine, or the united states versus germany in world war 2. this is a real counter insurgency where the fight is not just to defeat her boss, for israel. the fight is also to wind over the population, so that her mom with their hearts in mind you do have to when there are, how is it? how is that going from your, you know, early watch of a month into this war? i don't think it's going very well to be candidate. and, and look, i look at this from the perspective of, i want israel to defeat him off. i want israel and palestinians to live. i want israel and palestine to have peace. i want is really citizens,

if palestinians village citizens that have to worry that they're gonna get killed in their sleep. but to get there, i do think you have to defeat terrace. but you can't recruit more terrace in the process, and the number one way to recruit terrace of the cause is to kill in essence of where you wrote a very powerful and interesting piece of the lights. i haven't read out there about warren conflict relevant to these really guys a crisis in cnn dot com. i highly recommend that people take a look at that article, but in it you talk about mcchrystal snap. tell us about that. so general stanley mcchrystal, famous counter and surgeon of american general and afghanistan, he talked about how there's is what he calls insurgent math. and he estimates the equation to be for every one civilian that you kill, you recruit about 10 terrace. so in other words, if we one city calling unless spoken at one innocent person of whom thousands have

now been killed, we know it will get this over half of the 10000 are children. so innocent right there. but tell us how many insurgents are associated to this is a problem. so, so israel has a math problem and it's measured in human lives this day go in and they say we're going to take out this one. how mos terrace. but in the process they killed just one civilian. well, by general mac crystals math, you've just recruited 9 new or sorry, 10 new mos terrace. so the cause that means you recruited 10, you killed one year plus 9. that's not moving in the right direction. if you want to actually take out this terrorist organization as you kind of look at your experience of there and it's something that i, i think you had knowledge is very, very different that the density of buildings of people um, wildly different than a place that like stacked up with people like london today, it's like going through and trying to find, you know, the bad folks amongst

a lot of good folks. and how do you process that and, and i, and i want to acknowledge i was very taken with your comment that you called in a bombing rate on a school you flattened the school. so it was a difficult decision to make. but here's the context that was so different than then, garza, we knew that there were no civilians in, in that neighborhood to the best of our knowledge. all the civilians had evacuated . that's because we in many ways conditioned the battlefield. we made sure that civilians had a way to get out. we went into this building where americans had already taken several casualties. and then my raise my platoon took casualties as well. and i was faced with this decision. do i continue fighting up the stairs where they're rolling grenades down to the us? or do i pull the marines out and drop a bomb on the building to take care of the fred, the insurgents. but also rec of school, a school that we would have to rebuild. if we wanted to win back popular support.

and i made a decision, i said this is not worth more marines lives. so i dropped the bomb. but then the tough work started to get after we finish the fighting and knowledge of in 2004, we spent months and months rebuilding the city rebuilding the city so that we could rebuild trust with the rocky people. who by the way, much like the pelting, if they didn't want to be living under terrorist, but they weren't sure they could trust americans. we had to earn that trust you. you also cite general madison. something he said, which i found really interesting. he said, i want the military to be looked at as the enemy's worst enemy, but as to people's, as there, there would be no better friend. that's right. and i found a very interesting to hear those because we're not talking in those terms right now . we're quite in range were caught in a motion, but even president bite and acknowledge that rage, the blindness of rage can be a bad place to start. so i, i'm just interested in how you see through that and how do you orient

a military to be no worse enemy and no better friend? well, this was our 1st marine division motto, but it wasn't our motto when we went into a rock and we went into a rock, we didn't understand the consequences of, of killing civilians. we tried to avoid it because the right thing to do. but we were just trying to defeat the rocky army. it took us years to appreciate to realize that we were in a counter insurgency campaign, where it was just as important to win over the civilian population as it was to defeat the enemy. so general matters, introduce that motto to tell every single marine that you had to prove every single day that your enemies would fight no greater phone. but at the same time, if you put your trust in us, if you put your trust in united states marine corps, you won't find a better friend. that was really important to this whole concept of waiting over the civilian population. and what struck me is that we would spend often much more time focused on the know better friend part that on the know were sending me any we

might spend days rebuilding infrastructure a working with a rocky politicians. and then they, we might spend a couple hours at night going on it and are ready to take out a few tears when i later worked for general patricia as it was the, it was the same thing. he would agonize over restoring power to parts a valley. that in fact, he sent my small team of marines once on admission into enemy held territory. a place where americans didn't want to go for the sole purpose, not of taking out harris, but of fixing a power line because he knew was so important to win over the support of the, of the civilian population by showing you could deliver services. and i just went back and i sort of did a search of news headlines of military during your rock war during afghanistan. and i found one with this as a someone you probably know who is the, the former head of us central command, frank mckenzie, who set a capital drone strike that killed 10 civilians, which they thought was part of terrorist infrastructure. was a tragic mistake,

killed him, were killed and came out on television, admitted the mistake publicly of the article for that. it may be too early in this war to see that. but how much does confession apology, recognition of those mistakes publicly fit into the hearts and mine strategy is a good question to you. i think it matters a lot. and again, i'm not saying that we always got it right. the message i'm trying to send to to the israel is who have every right to defend their country. every right to defend their civilian population. every right to take out terrace, just as we did after $911.00. the message of trying to send is learned from our mistakes because in the early days of iraq and afghanistan you would never hear the us apologize for civilian casualties. but as we came to appreciate how important it was to show the civilian population that you can trust us, you can work with us. we're a better alternative to the terrorist. as we came to appreciate that we were much

more candid and open and honest and transparent and part of that is being willing to make mistakes. yeah. yeah. so publicly you're out there on this, but you said in this time of conflict, we need to begin thinking about in games you need to envision other things. you need to think about hearts and minds. i'm just interested in how this is playing with your constituents and also this town. you know, how are you getting criticized with this or you being applauded for your while? he 1st of all, i always get criticize desperate because no matter what you say, you're going to criticize. but no, i think in many ways people realize that that what, what i'm trying to do here is, is not just sort of find the middle ground, but, but really stand on moral principle. these, there are strong moral reasons why we don't need to see innocent lives offended or ended in this conflict. but there are real military reasons as well. so you can be the start you a supporter of israel, and i am a staunch supporter of israel. it, these rarely state of israel, fundamental right, even responsibility to defend its citizens. while also saying if i want israel to

win this war, they've got to be more careful. they've got to minimize civilian casualties because that's what we learned in iraq and afghanistan. now, the president and his team that president biden has called for a pause a ceasefire. you've called for humanitarian court, or is you've called for various dimensions to try to give, you know, people who are innocent, an opportunity to escape this hell that they're in right now. how do you think that's going? well look, there's a little bit of a battle over words here. a lot of people i get a lot of calls in the office saying why won't you support us these fire? i mean, 1st of all, israel's not going to agree to a cease fire. and if you do that very clear, it may have very clear. but you know, the to the secretary general view and his call for a cease fire. lots of others and cough as he's fire the air of world that was normalizing in, in large part with his realty. the abraham, of course, is also called for a ceasefire. we have said, we understand israel's not in the conference. he's far look also a lot of arab leaders really want him off taken out. and that's something that that

may not resonate with the arch street, but it is a reality. and this complicated part of part of the world, the middle east. but, but here here's the reality, israel's not going to agree to cease fire. and on top of that cease fire really would empowers to moss, a lot of boss allow them time to reconstitute. so what we, what we need fundamentally is not a ceasefire or a humanitarian pause. both terms that suggest we're going to take a break from the fighting, but then we're going to go right back at it the way we've been doing it. now what we need is a civilian evacuation, that's fundamentally what we need. and that's another less than that we learned in iraq and afghanistan. but the less than the civilians in, in palestine have learned is once they evacuate, they don't get back in. so that's one of the big concerns if you've talked to palestinians on the other side of the equation, those that have gone into jordan, now there's in times of crisis. they can't get back into land se one's had. so what do we do with that fear and, and is there some negotiation, some deal that get civilian evacuation but doesn't result in them not being able to

get back into guys a um into their home? no, it's a great question um and what we, what we did in pollution for example, the 2nd time range went into felicia. they had evacuated about 90 percent of the civilians. so only 10 percent of the civilians in that entire city were left. when the marines went into includes you went in the almost everybody there was tied into that to the, to the that's right. they made the decision to stay and fight. and so the marines took them out. part of that part of the way we weren't able to facilitate that stability and evacuation is by promising the civilians the residents that they could go go back that they would be able to return. so you have to have this plan, you have to be able to lay out your engage danielle, who to talk to your is really friends and folks that you've talked to in the us government's that. that's a very key part. because right now what's happening is the idea and other folks just say, hey, move south, move down. and yet as people have move south, particularly refugee camps, they continue to get bomb in places where they were told to go. because of

a commander being somewhere, allegedly, or others. and so the broadside is, how do you, how do you get some element of trust that where they're being sent to go is something that's not gonna end up getting them killed. so i've called for not a ceasefire. but a civilian evacuation, i've also called for not a humanitarian pause and just the us, a temporary association, but a humanitarian search. i where you don't just bring in the minimum amount of a to southern gaza, you bring in the maximum amount to show the people that if you evacuate, if you move out of the north into the south, you'll not just get a small bit of aid. you'll get a lot, in other words it's really worth it for you to make this journey to lee from aust behind a certain senators like senator chris murphy, the senator, chris van, holland. it'd be going to move and said, we need to have some oversight of how the weapons that, that the united states has now provided to israel are being used on the white house

has rejected that thus far and said, we don't want to impose any limits on those, do you think there should be some limit? who should, i mean, i think the world looks at the united states as a defender of this really security and security needs. but should there be constraints on what is real can do with our partnership? see if you know everything i've been calling for and this debate in, in, in our conversation today preserves innocent life. it fundamentally helps in this, in palestinians. it also helps is real when it helps israel to feed. i'm off and i think that what the present has been trying to do here is stand staunchly by our ally, our most important ally in the middle east. that that is, we will allow them to defend their, their territory, but helps them do so. in a way that, that is not only morally successful, but militarily successful as well. and i do think that the present is looking for ways to exert more influence over the israel is to,

to learn those lessons. the same lessons that i'm, that i'm describing that we learned in iraq and afghanistan, one of those, probably the most paramount being. you have to explain the engage. you have to have a political solution to something that is fundamentally a political problem. you're not, you're not just going to solve this by military means. that means being able to explain to the palestinians what their future is. also means by the way, then yeah, who's got to be able to explain to his troops what they're fighting for. because i think his soldiers know that if they just go into the gaza and leave it a smoldering mess, the end of the day, they're going to be right back where they started. well, that's a forever war. so are we looking at the ingredients today over forever? one right now on the ground, we have the ingredients of a forever war. and that's not a recipe that any of us want. and so i think that for is real success. also the recipe where a, a, a dad and mother can not go out and justify and think about why their child was

killed babbling. and that if you have a forever without it, you know, we don't want any. it's a 5 year old palestinian kids dying in this conflict. we also don't want in this, in 5 year old israel is dying in the same conflict 20 years from now. when they're still fighting. i'm just interested with you have such insight. what is this do in terms of trauma for the as really nation, but also for a guidance and palestinians who have for decades been locked in advice. i mean, see, i know so many amazing americans, some of the greatest americans i've never, ever met in my life who fought heroically in iraq and afghanistan and are still haunted by. they made it home, but they're tremendously hobbled by post traumatic stress. and that's going to be a reality for jewish citizens of israel. it's going to be a reality for muslim citizens of palestine. and it is going to be

a horrific reality for everyone who's caught up in this conflict. and it's one of the reasons why at the end of the day, we all have to be aligned for peace. i had a guy in the show recently who said, hey, present vitamin got 20 trucks of humanitarian relief. and at the beginning of this, he says, a low level state department staff, or can be countered on to get 20 trucks. is the president united states who got 20 trucks of relief, which is pathetic. i mean, i mean, part of the question is, is, is joe biden being made to look pathetically weak when it comes to interactions with israel? no, i don't think so. i mean, is real, is gone through the greatest national tragedy in its history and present bite and made them significantly, delay their ground to solve, to try to influence them on how they carry it out. i think this could be a lot worse if not for present and by biden's involvement today. what do you think the geo political dimensions of this are stuff?

when we talked last, we talked about the ukraine war in russia and the failure of determinants. you worry about asia, the signals that some of the sent around the world and their concerns now that china is testing the dashboard of america is attention span across things is the world. sensing america is distracted sort of off off. it's a game that it can't handle this many of hot conflicts around the world as i think we're showing the world right now that we can the we can handle this number of conflicts. but, but there are real risks there. real risk there real risk that the conflict in gaza expands dramatically into a regional war in the middle east. they're real risks that the message that seizing pain takes women from looking at ukraine is the americans are going to stick with their democratic allies at prudent might eventually win this war. and that means i can get away with starting a war in the pacific over taiwan. so there are real risks and,

and for everyone who's quick to criticize the united states and different things that we do in different parts of the world. it's also important to understand that the united states is pretty much holding this altogether. what preventing a regional war in the middle east. with our presence, we're preventing vladimir putin from rolling over ukraine and rolling right into into a european war with nato. and every single day, we're sending a message to seizing ping and china do not invade democratic taiwan. don't start world war 3 in the pacific. let me ask you about prime minister netanyahu. if you were to have a conversation with him about what an in game would look like, and he's come out and said that every aspect of guys and security is now going to be in israel's hands a i don't want to just critique feminist brittany netanyahu. i want to understand what's the pathway to getting to something where both sides can see hope during a time of rates. really on both sides can begin looking at something that looks like a sensible and can because somebody's got to begin doing that. well,

would you counsel him to do in this moment? i would say mr. prime minister, i understand how furious you are. i understand how angry your people are. but the right thing to do for every is really kid, the right thing to do for every palestinian kid is to find a new solution of political land game that both sides can believe that both sides were both sides, can find peace. and that means you've got to convince palestinian innocent civilians and is rarely used as well. that there is a better way. i think that's a 2 state solution, but it's a re invigorated to 2 state solution. it's a new commitment from a prime minister who has been fundamentally opposed to a 2 state solution for a long time to actually make it happen. united states is no longer looked at by many palestinians that also airbus is a fair broker and that i've been watching turkey and, and a present air to one. and his strong support both of him us,

but of the pallets and the inside of the question. the turkeys and nato ally of the united states. is there an opportunity there? you could actually, we shuffle the traditional players. they've been trying to negotiate a deal and, and try and look at turkeys better impulses as, as a defender of if interest on the palestinian side and the united states on these really side. or do we still need to maintain? i would, i would call a fiction that we can be fair to be fair to both so well look, i think a lot of people rightly assess, i mean, how can you just advocate for a 2 state solution when this hasn't worked for decades? so i think one of the things that changed in the middle east is you now have arab states, places like saudi arabia, the gulf states that actually wants to have dialogue with israel. i mean, israel has been pre, so in peace with his arab neighbors. let's turn that into action. let's turn these agreements into real differences on the ground. i think that if israel finds a way with our help to get arab states involved in a 2 state solution,

ultimately ensuring its success that's before believable for everybody. congressman seth molten massachusetts. thank you so much for joining us today and sharing your candid views. thank. thank you, steve. so what's the bottom line grievances, dr. rage and rage drives killing and the demon ization of the other. the latest about a range between his realities and palestinians was triggered by her ma surprise attack on his really military and civilian targets. but history just didn't start on october 7th. and just as for palestinians has been simmering for many decades and combined with deep polarization within israel, there were many factors that led to this explosive situation. now, wages gushing and my guess today, a former soldier with experience says that leaders need to be leaders. they need to see through the rage, they need to find ways to articulate this for their citizens and in game a reasonable, even if painful equilibrium that gives both society is a chance to reset. it's almost impossible to talk about a peaceful future now,

but it's a vital part of leadership. that's something that palestinians is really americans, everybody desperately needs. and that's the bottom line. the, it does have been some fold. we covered every single one of these, waiting on god. why would is real vent crossing is really deputy foreign minister. he thinks that the rules of the game has changed. i'm on israel stops, is that it will certainly look at the lease of more of these captives. what you might have to events, are you telling view is faulty a un experts on bias in wrong? well, you have to do is look at the you. and while you're looking up i'm, i am hearing something as soon to be able to write. the bar has to stay close to

the story without a 0 water is life. but in palace, scott, it's an instrument of bulky patience. with is a way of controlling the majority of palestinian water resources and destroying hundreds of sanitation structures. simians are being deprived of a universal human rights. people in power investigates with an isaac water in palestine on a jersey to the depths analysis of the days headlines. all these blue cross blue is root has of items. so the thing is we built a license to kill inside story on out to 0. israel is still refusing to allow international journals into jobs to cover the carnage they're all that they can report on 1st hand is the, is really saw palestinian reporters of risking everything to get the story f 15

members and 5 killed and, and asked for sharing what's happening, we don't cover the news, we cover the way the news is the listening post. what out of their existence, it's load ship as a principal present? as a correspondence with any breaks in the store, we want to hear from those people who was normally not get that voices heard on the international news channels. one moment i'll be very proud. all was when we covered the fullness quick of 2015 at the terrible met shoulders. that's the story that needed to be told from the hall of the affected area to be then to tell the people story. it was very important at the time. during the facts, how are we defending is real heavy, more dead children asking questions and wanted to have your voice heard? what is your message understand? a little part of the beach was transformed into a minute,

reporting every now and then we can hear cluster bombs, exploding out his ears, teens on the ground when you close to the hall to the story. the so i'm fairly back to boy, you're watching the news our life from don't have without continuing coverage of his rascal on guy. so coming up in the next 60 minutes, 13 palestinians are killed. and then these really striking con units in southern, gaza, the tax, the continue even is thousands that order to move south for the safety and northern guys. several hospitals are under caesar lodges, south she is out of.