an old bottles is escalating a new claim. there will be more p t s. d. there will be flashbacks. many civilians will find it difficult to understand. and one of the biggest mental health crises in living memory mindset to reach the therapist helping ukraine soldiers and their families. what is the desired outcome for the patients that come for the store to make a person want to live? come with me. how relevant isn't on the line, the 2nd largest organizational, this kind of to the united nations needs and uganda, and what problems cannot solve in a while, mod, by escalating tension. this is inside store the kind of there and welcome to the program. i'm this tells you, hey,

it's an organization created almost 70 years ago during the cold war era of by lot truism, far removed from the walls. we see now as an on the line movement method, uganda, and denounced. israel is war on garza and quote, for an immediate cease, fine, and also quote, for the eradication of poverty and the implementation of sustainable development. but how big a role can it's a $120.00 members, including developing powers like india, south africa, and indonesia play on the global stage. and how much influence do they have in creation? i'm a multilateral system. we'll get through all guests and just a moment, but 1st this report from pulling the normal line to movement group from the principles of the band dung. confidence. in 1955, many of the applicant invasion states taking part in indonesia were nearly independent. then having more than 50 percent of the world's population, the conference paid the way for the creation of the non aligned movement at the height of the cold war. the movement was viewed as a way for countries to show the neutrality and the biological confrontation between

nato countries grouped around the united states and the warsaw pact, nations of the soviet union. a, c, n a. m. a, to focus attention on the developing world. instead, to create an alternative multilateral model of the globe, looking to promote disarmament, the colonization, an opposition to racism most prominently apartheid in south africa. following the breakup of the soviet union and the emergence of what the n a m has viewed as a unilateral wilks dominated by the united states. the movement has redefined itself in opposition towards it. sees as western identity to try to function itself an ongoing, relevant role of the normal lines movement has grown to include a $120.00 members states the camden presidency, our re mis stephanie has taken over as leader for 3 years. some, let's say the changes, the faces or convincing member states to take

a unified position on major global excuse, while at the same time, balancing that own interest and priorities. but the movement retains a desire to offer an alternative vision to the current global political older. people going out to see you inside story the well we have a global panel to speak about this global movement and the uganda in capital. can paula, we have nicholas thing. grandma, he's economist for the daily monica national newspaper in the interviewing capital . chicata and the by uni is a form editor that you cause a post and also in component without some it's been taking place. fema out cuz he directs that of united nations office for south south cooperation. a very warm welcome to you. well thank you for being on inside story with us today and nicholas also with you as you are. oh so that and can paula. so let me ask you, in the face of 2 ongoing was right now and, and ukraine and gaza,

where great powers are involved as well as what something called a 2nd cold war between the u. s. and, and china. what does it mean right now? so the country is there and can paula, what does it mean to be non aligned in the face of these 2 wars? it's a very great test for. ready what we mean and what to have and what we defined as known alignment. because if the global issues and the depth pause that are going to speak of the know that we as the countries in the no, no land movement or the congress include us self. the most that we can do to show off i am really t is what is it that we can do in this sort of situation. whereas they convinced that take place, especially in bringing

a bottle of these powers to suit for peace. not telling you that we have supplies, most of the countries in the movement and the global. so is that the last 2 very dependent countries on, despite to the fact that we speak about noon alignment, we speak about independence. we speak about as the present. what we've done to sees pro ourselves most of the things that we do, we simply follow the link and we can only make comments that the district of not bind. ready not having a, you know, impact freezes. now we know the war, he not being does south africa has come out very, very clearly. we discussed of the genocide. you know, these are very big story there. one because south africa is one of the countries

that we would call, and the big one of them is show the african continent and in the south. yep. members of the briggs and all of that so they can speak. now the rest of us, what can we do apart from the comments? there's nothing that we can do. nicholas, i'm going to the last comment. so we saw from the composite declaration that came out often the summit, a very clear political statement. like impala declaration includes denouncing israel's actions and gaza, calling for an immediate cease, fine. and the, let me bring you in here. i've been wondering around this idea of between being not aligned and being neutral does making a political statement against israel then potentially align you against a great power like the united states, a sedan system. i think that the fact that the sunroof income tyler came up with the spacing and denouncing s o l. a.

aggression in, in does a slightly expected. um, is this something that i think goes back to the history of the normal life things when even going further back to the, the bundle of sunny off asia, africa, countries in 1955. where do you know the principles laid down includes solver and t and independence? and i'm thinking now there's one country that remains under under corporation. and that is part of the time. and i think of every sunday of the movement english, i definitely assisted on having a statement with a got to be the creation of the independent state them and by this time. so that is, uh uh, is, is it was widely expected. but when it comes to us talking about neutrality, no, not a life. and there's nothing about that. probably the, but it's actually about taking actually far been in finding solutions to the problems. but we, the, we,

the aligning with one or the other power. now we seem to make yourself a new quote more particularly between china ended. i'd states, certainly in the, in the pacific region, we are feeling it by strong. and then i think the countries be expected to align with one or the other. and we're trying to expanding his power to africa and beyond that typically true. but and look, and you said this seemed up contestation between the 2 big powers even growing, expanding the 2 years ago, the china and russia signed this, lead me to stop the pharmacy. meaning that if one of them is being attack, i think they would cope with have the other. so basically we are now entering to a new quote, multiplication. and this is i've seen when did not allow me in a small voice, it's very important. and a lot of expectation be placed in the compiler, somebody to come up with something to address this issue. and you, i want to talk

a little bit more about what's been happening in the asia pacific region in just a moment that you mentioned something there about solving problems. and then on the line with me being a moral voice, do you, might you work for united nations? and one of the, the biggest criticisms around the u. n. when it comes to the war and gaza has been about the lack of ability. the un security council, i know, obviously you're not involved with the security council that i'm asking about the un structure, the infrastructure of the un as a whole. that there has been a complete inability to reach any kind of agreement. obviously they're a veto powers of the security council. you've been at the summit, the income paula dema. and i'm wondering about that. the conversations that have been taking place. how much of what's in managed this strong political statement we seen on garza how much of that has been in response to accounts a point somewhat to the inaction that we've seen at the u. n. the recent ones to, to try to find some kind of solution to be a model voice and make some kind of statement.

thank you very much for letting me do a little bit on the uh, on the uh, search sounds somebody that's taking place here. the discussions that are happening detection ration capture the, the defense elements that are being discussed. this is the importance of such a meeting. it's kind of pretty by being gives you, when the, the common and the common agenda and the collective code for action across different topics. including the issues related to the journal you political situation. so the defense crisis, but also the developments issues. and this is where i would roll as office for you and the un office for south sas corporation. when we come in, by not only listening to the defense uh, elements of discussions, but, but also by heating our different services,

whether it's support to the governmental policies or it's a support of knowledge management, then all the charities, but also in terms of supporting the countries is not an undertaking. south south cooperation projects via the u. m. systems come into play, hence our participation and active engagement on the sidelines that are different topics that, that also at the heart of the discussions and that of that, that affected by the different prices. as we speak right now, there is an ongoing discussion on trade, a challenges, trade issues and the role of house house population in economic growth. so what's in line? what i'm trying to say here is that the quote for action and the collective discussions do cover an ad ray of issues, and i'm sure that you know the outcomes document that the ad, you know that the different countries, the group of $77.00 and china are putting together they do cover that

comprehensively, but they do also for, for actions visual quotes for more. so these are the key among themselves, and they do pull off a more unified, a response to the defends development issues that, that affected by many factors into the, the crisis industry. and so deem it just to clarify front of you is there are actually 2 summons that have been taking place in cam. paula one was the summers of the non aligned movement that's already wrapped up. we had something like fast, the heads of state, the for that. and uganda has now taken the chair of that movement. literally the next day. your now out of summit, which is the fed south summit. that's the g $77.00 plus china. that's also a large number of developing countries, and that's also being changed by uganda, but it is a separate summit, a lot of the same issues being discussed, obviously sustainable development, being very high upset before i let you go though, i wanted to ask you team about you and reform specifically because this is something that an online movement has been very vocal about since it's inception.

and just just coming back to that, not fast on this, i've been curious about whether or not there's any kind of of unified position. now we're talking about a huge number of countries, and i know this has been a big push for grades of representation, particularly for small states who pops wouldn't be, wouldn't have their voices. how does loudly is of is, is there a broad consensus on what you one reform would look like in the eyes of an unlikely event? i think the discussions are still going on, but this has been voice and you, i've talked to you guys to have an amplified voice for this, for the front views and the to have the, the forms taking place. and this is something that the un secretary general has also referred to this morning in his statement. the discussions are ongoing rid of the majority of ford for, for uh, such actions to take place. but i see so uh, but it's been going on now,

how would this translate into action remains to be seen. but there is a lot of, from versions if she went around that i see, you know, doing that and do you, do you have a sense of, of what that agenda might, might entail a well, i mean this, this you under form has been like you say, you need the most most agenda and it's we, we don't see any progress, but i think uh the, the most that it should continue to press with this demand. although we, we, we should do this to that and is it this, is it gonna, it's not going to happen anytime soon. but, you know, we're more than 100 countries in, in, in the movement of the g 7, just type in the collect exhausts. i understand it's difficult to, to bring a consensus with such a huge group. but again, this i've seen very much depends on the leadership of the movement. it's sort of

what they think, tell them and say for, for 3 years. and i think this is not really done to you, you've done to, to make a difference in the movement. we don't have a lot of expectation, but i see the pressure from the little as house to defendants have an end to the non line was going to continue. so you mentioned to the new guy that will be sharing nothing, even on line moving, but also the g. 77 in china, obviously me 70. and you're going to have, have a very big influence over the agenda and what's happening over the course of the next few years. now then online movement emerged from, from deep post colonial routes. and there's always been a bit of a suspicion from the west. and i'm wondering within the context of what's happening to a new cane, what's happening and gaza, how much that's influencing we 70 is agenda. what is the top of that agenda? afraid um. what about gender? yes, i'm not really very optimistic. and my reason is that whether it is

the disadvantage sort of that plus china. oh no, no, no, i must manage what determines the way. so the noise generated on, well, it looks at the way that, you know, cut off it is what sort of strips do we bring to the table i, these fireball strips. you know very well, most of the countries in the global saw and then another movement of built, some of the west tree goes when you come to the global problems of global programs with disease or lucky that issues to do with the ecology and so on. and so forth. we, uh, the bridge is produced as of a, my grandson, the wallet. and so all those things the way the duke's gosh is that we, uh, really clients, uh we have,

we have the p o o r a did the p f like one of them is and in many cases they even pay wages for. ready a simple cell phones, no. oh then do we come as a force our that'd be that number. so how do we come as a new trick? do ports if we're still in data, if we us do up still paying to the june of, of the paper. so that is where the challenge will help present. most of the need is big board with fox, which he goes and he speaks very, very well. but at the end of that do what we are looking at is our voice that he brings, being set up for the audio, is that yes, i didn't bother you previously as enough we got on globally in general. how. what if it goes back and forth? how if the countries that, quote unquote, he's leading us to the recipients of 8 as stewards, superior donation us to, you know, at the bottom of the picking cord. that is where the problem is. how are we going

to be taken serious when the next very next day, we are going to be asking for 4448. we're going to be asking for, you know, all sorts of assistance. and i've seen nobody when it comes to all these global organizations and conferences for con presidents, so well with the folks i'm she gets, i think what happens after that. so we spend a lot of grubby task for many of these things. she's but yeah, my guess i chat. mine is not. he's not you every day pass on. but then what, what in effect something what effective agenda does he have got to change the way the wall. it looks like every scene. not only just the way it looks, i forgot to turn it that way. it looks like at least know about tread payment change. like what can we do? the restore plans here, so the se, spoken to none of that movement to stalking, we need to get the ways that you want to go very important point the which is

around financial dependence deem one of the big issues on the table has been about trying to reform, the financial architecture be international financial architecture. and i'm wondering what that looks like in the eyes of the non aligned movement. how do you go about doing that and what is the vision for that? listen, there has been a lot of discussions around the, the form of the financial architecture due to the debt to the need for all the countries of the south. that is an ongoing discussions. that is how for the young d 77 have been empty. finding that voice, and i'm sure that the non aligned movements uh, have been doing the same. i came here for the uh, south summit. uh and i know very much that the g 77 who are the uh, you know, uh the add to fix behind the, uh, this discussion happy pursuing that there is

a serious discussion of the you and also speed headed by other entities that isn't, you know, a whole airport that has been produced by you and this up with uh, you know, uh, it's very good from you and successfully, generally for that citizen need also using south sauce corporation to learn from experiences of other companies that are companies that have been trying to look at different mothers to the needs that's in depth. and this is something that we have trying to pursue with them in terms of all the sharing and knowledge exchange. i think the financial active actually form. we think it's fine. uh and it's we'd be also subject to a lot of discussions and the g 77 and china marketing and major voice and amplifying and relay the message of the countries of this house, the suspect. so we've been talking a lot here about what the non line movement wants reform at the united nations reform of the global financial architecture. you raise the question nicholas about

about the power of these countries actually have to change anything. and the, i'm curious about your thoughts on this. how does the non line movement get what it wants? and right now, is there an opportunity here, as we see increasing great power competition? when we see the divergence of use when it comes to the will and ukraine, what's going on and cause of what's going on as you were talking about that the 2nd cold will between the, the us and china. given that there are potentially science to take here is the power and not taking one and does that raise the relevance and the pro 5 then on the line we spent right now. yes. uh thing. when it comes to uh, good power over it, i send it. no, no. i mean spencer is the perfect phone room to enter to provide no type of this for countries who do no one what? who do not want to be a lender. one of the 2 powers, but on, on the question of economy dependence. and i think the global files are also

not caused some of the rising economies. and in fact, some of the members are d 20 in psych, uh, in the, in the, the chairmanship of the 20 in 2022 was indonesia last year with india. this is a brazil and the next year will be south africa. so full of countries from the south side, you know, lead the, the g 20 and i think this is where they can, they can use their leverage and understand up all this whole countries when to speak at the detroit is home it's database and the bill is being the voice of the global, the house. so you know that that's whole kind of because the, the, the in the global south, the countries on the emerging economies with low level it's the brakes, brazil, a sure in the time the south africa and not the left side new members. they also pressing forward changes in the global financial system. so then there's also

a pricing on there, i guess, there, but as, as the global sales and at the cups summit on books, climate change in lamesa and many other countries are pressing the, the, the countries to do this here to, you know, to dismiss a 4 countries to help them cope with climate change. so that's a lot of questions and that's a lot of organizations and with a multi lateral or regional, they're not putting pressure. and the same thing, the, in the interest of the go, the south end, do you mentioned breaks that in addition to the countries that you mentioned was a, so russia, india, china, south africa, we now have egypt, if you, if you around saudi arabia and the way you join you obviously it's not considered non aligned, you have russia and then you have china. and now you have a ron in there as well. i'm wondering about how we're seeing this, this global order being shaped by these different blocks. nicholas,

somebody threw this one to you. do you see these blocks, these imagining blocks do use even guessing, getting stronger and staff or having more power to, to push the agenda that, that you've been talking about. and you've talked about about desires for change. the question whether or not there is actually the power to, to do it a thank you very much for the base. if we're talking about the long run. yes. if we are consistent on the issue of going to issues one strength, any governors, and to building these economies so that they become viable connor's curriculum is that a highly indebted order is going to be very fragile. do end up we've week and fails steps because one of the things about uh, the blog post house, uh miss mood, especially the, the majority in the that is the african countries. difficult continued has such

a young population, the young population without employment productivity is low. the end result is that you're going to of issues to do with security. and because people have to stop by and say we can't just look, show them. so when you have a weak strips, it is very, very difficult for them to be taken seriously. and that's, that's the, that's, that's why many of the thinking about the many people is that before we even go into all these, we must think about what do we do about strengthening our economies in the global so on one of the things that you should know is that it is in the global assault because the majority, i read the african countries $55.00 or so the $50.00. so we're not some of the most important resources, natural resources, but the on demand globally, the so i was and so i have a very brief question for india just picking up on what you were saying that

obviously there's a lot of results. there's a lot of potential and a lot of the countries that we're talking about. and we've seen great how is tried to work a lot of these countries not only economically but also politically and someone i'll give it the narrative from the west really recently has been about democracy versus or top chrissy. so and do just very briefly let me ask you, is that watching? well, i mean listen to the problem is within the many country and the goal, this house, but they've got so democracy or lack of it. and they need to investigate it, especially if i know you know, question from from the west. because maybe i know the like and the color says it's about the government's. and that seems to be a big problem in many of the countries into the south. this the end they need for this, we need to investigate definitely. and that's to be able to know, to expand and negotiate with other countries addressing all the problems like a that's a climate change folder in

a develop and all those things they need to happen. but those we do have good governments in all the countries in the, in the global south. the not, i guess that's the biggest challenge. living huge challenges ahead, but we'll leave it there for now. thank you to or about guess nicholas on go back and the by uni and him out because he's and thank you to for watching. remember, you can see this program again any time by visiting our website that's out there and don't com for further discussion to go to our facebook page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash 8 inside story. remember, you can also join the conversation on x a handle that is at a inside story for me and it's not as you can the whole team here in the home, bye for now. the examining the impact of today's headlines. the fear of the

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