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kind of, aaron, welcome to the program. i'm this tells you, hey, it's an organization created almost 70 years ago during the cold war era of by lot truism, far removed from the walls. we see now as an on the line movement mess and uganda, and denounced. israel is war on garza and quote, for an immediate cease fine, and also code for the eradication of poverty and the implementation of sustainable development. but how big a role can it's a $120.00 members, including developing powers like india, south africa, and indonesia play on the global stage. and how much influence do they have in creation? i'm a multilateral system. we'll get through all guests and just a moment, but 1st this report from poking the non aligned to movement groups from the principles of depend on confidence. in 1955, many of the applicant age and states taking part in indonesia were newly independent. then having more than 50 percent of the world's population,

the confidence paid the way for the creation of the non aligned movement at the height of the cold war. the movement was viewed as a way for countries to show the neutrality and the biological confrontation between nato countries grouped around the united states and the warsaw pact, nations of the soviet union. the n a n. a to focus attention on the developing world. instead, to create an alternative multilateral model of the globe, looking to promote disarmament, the colonization, an opposition to racism most prominently apartheid in south africa. following the breakup of the soviet union and the emergence of what the n a m has viewed as a unilateral world dominated by the united states. the movement has redefined itself in opposition to wants. it sees as west and identity to try to function itself an ongoing relevant role. the lines movement has grown to include a 120 member states, the camden presidency,

our re mis stephanie has taken over as leader for 3 years. so let's say the changes, the faces or convincing member states to take a unified position on major global issues, while at the same time, balancing that own interest and priorities. but the movement retains a desire to offer an alternative vision to the current global political older. going out to see you inside story the oh, we have available panel to speak about this global movement and the uganda in capital . can paula, we have nicholas thing. grandma, he's been calling us for the daily monitor, the national newspaper in the interviewing capital chicata. and the by uni is a former editor that you cause a post and also in component without some it's been taking place, the my outcome team director of the united nations office for south south corporation, a very warm welcome to you. well, thank you for being on inside story with us today. and nicholas,

i'll start with you as you are also the and kind of paula. so let me ask you, in the face of 2 ongoing was right now, and in ukraine and gaza, where great powers are involved as well as what sun nicole. the 2nd cold war between the u. s. and, and china. what does it mean right now? so the country is there and can paula, what does it mean to be non aligned in the face of these 2 was it's a big group just for. ready what we mean and what to have and what we defined as non alignment. because if the global issues and the depth points that are going to speak of the know that we as the countries in the no, no land movement or the congress include us self. the most that we can do to show off i am really tv is what is it that we

can do in this sort of situation. whereas they convinced that take place, especially in bringing a bottle of these powers to sue for peace. not telling you that we have the size uh most of the countries in the movement and the global so is addressed to very dependent countries on, despite to the fact that we speak about noon alignment, we speak about independence. we speak about as the present. what we've done to sees pro ourselves most of the things that we do, we simply follow the link and we can only make comments that the district of not bind. ready not having a you know, impact freezes. now we know the warranty now because south africa has come out very,

very clearly we discussed of the genocide. you know, these are very big story there. one because south africa is one of the countries that we would call, and the big one of them is show on the african continent. i mean that's so, yep, members of the brakes and all of that so they can speak. now the rest of us, what can we do apart from the comments? there's nothing wrong with that. we can do nicholas class comments. we saw from the composite declaration that came out often to summit, a very clear political statement. like impala declaration includes denouncing israel's actions and gaza, calling for an immediate cease fund. and the, let me bring you in here. i've been wondering around this i did between being not aligned and being neutral, does making a political statement against israel then potentially align you against a great power like the united states, a sedan system. i think the fact that

the sunroof income tyler came up with the spacing and denouncing s o l. a. aggression in, in does a slightly expected. um, is this something that i think goes back to the history of the normal life things when even going further back to the, the bundle of sunny off asia, africa, countries in 1955 where, you know, the principles laid down includes solver and t and independence. and until now there's one country that remains and kind of go patient and that is kind of strange . and i think every sunday of the movement in northeast have definitely assisted on having a statement where they've got to be the creation of the independent state them and by this time. so that is, is, is, it was led to expect the but when it comes to us talking about neutrality, no, not

a life. and there's nothing about that. probably the, but it's actually about taking, actually spawn being in finding solutions to the problems. but we, though we love the lining with one or the other power. now we seem to imagine yourself a new quote more particularly between china ended. i'd states, certainly in the, in the pacific region, we are feeling it by strong. and then i think the countries be expected to align with one or the other and we're trying to expanding his power to africa and beyond that typically true. but and look, and you said this thing that contestation between the 2 big powers even growing, expanding the 2 years ago, the china and russia signed this, lead me to stop as if i miss it. meaning that if one of them is being a pack, i think they would cope with help the other. so basically we are now entering to a new called what situation. and this is i've seen when did not allow me and

a small voice, it's very important. and a lot of the expectation of the place in the compiler, somebody to come up with something to address these issue. and you, i want to talk a little bit more about what's been happening in the asia pacific region in just a moment that you mentioned something there about solving problems. and then on the line with me being a moral voice. they met you work for the united nations and one of the, the biggest criticisms around the you when, when it comes to the war and garza has been about the lack of ability, the un security council. i know, obviously you're not involved with the security council, but i'm asking about the un structure the infrastructure on the un as a whole. that there has been a complete inability to reach any kind of agreement. obviously there would be to our powers of the security council. you've been at the summit, the income paula dema. and i'm wondering about that. the conversations that have been taking place. how much of what's in much to this strong political statement. we seen ongoing how much of that has been in response to account to point somewhat,

to the inaction that we've seen at the u. n. the recent ones to, to try to find some kind of solution to be a model voice and make some kind of statement. uh thank you very much and uh let me do a little bit on the uh, on the uh, search south summit that's taking place here. the discussions that are happening at the declaration capture the, the defense elements that are being discussed. this is the importance of such a meeting, it's kind of pretty by the gives you when the, the coleman and the comment agenda and the collective code for action across different topics. including issues related to the journal you political situations, the defense crisis. but also the developments issues, and this is where i would roll as office for you and the un office for south south

corporation when we come in, by not only listening to the different uh, elements of discussions, but, but also by getting our different services, whether it's support to the governmental policies, or it's a support to knowledge management them all the charities, but also in terms of supporting the countries is not an undertaking. south south cooperation projects via the u. m. systems come into play, hence our participation and acts of engagement on the sidelines that are different topics that, that also at the heart of the discussions and that of that, that affected by the different prices as we speak right now. there is an ongoing discussion on trade, a challenges, trade issues and the role of the house house population in economic growth. so what's in line? what i'm trying to say year is that the quote for action and the collective discussions do cover an ad ray of issues and i'm for that. the outcomes documents

that the ad, you know that the different countries, the group of 77 and china are put things together. they do cover that comprehensively, but they do also for, for action. these will close for most show you very t among themselves, and they do pull off a more unified, a response to the defends development issues that, that affected by many factors into the, the crisis and the some countries. and so deem it just to clarify front of you is there actually to some instead of been taking place in cam, paula one was the summers of the non aligned movement that's already wrapped up. we had something like fast, the heads of state, the for that. and uganda has now taken the chair of that movement. literally the next day. your now out of summit, which is the fed south summit. that's the g $77.00 plus china. that's also a large number of developing countries, and that's also being changed by uganda, but it is a separate summit, a lot of the same issues being discussed, obviously sustainable development,

being very high upset before i let you go though, i want to ask you team about you and reform specifically because this is something that an online movement has been very vocal about since its inception. and just just coming back to that, not fast on there's, i've been curious about whether or not there's any kind of of unified position. now we're talking about a huge number of countries, and i know this has been a big push for grades of representation, particularly for small states who pops wouldn't be, wouldn't have their voices. how does loudly is of is, is there a broad consensus on what you when reform would look like in the eyes of the non lines movement? i think the discussions are still going on, but this has been voice and you, i've talked to you guys to have an amplified voice for this, for the confuse and the to have the, the forms to taking place. and this is something that the un secretary general has also referred to this morning in his statement. the discussions are ongoing rid of

the majority of ford for, for uh, such actions to take place. but i please, so uh, but it's been going on now, how would this trust these interactions remains to be seen? but there is a lot of conversions. if she went around that i see, you know, doing that and do you, do you have a sense of, of what that agenda might, might entail a well, i mean this, this, uh you, under form has been like you say, you need the most of the agenda and it's we, we don't see any progress, but i think uh the, the most, but it should continue to press with this demand. although we, we, we should do this to that. and is it this? is it gonna, it's not going to happen anytime soon. but you know, we're more than $100.00 countries in, in, in the last month or the dfcs and just type of data. but as i know collectively, as i understand it's difficult to, to bring

a consensus with stuff. touch is huge. so group, but again, this i've seen very much depends on the leadership of the movement. it said ok, think that i'm gonna save her for 3 years and i think this is now going to be done to you. you've done to, to make a difference in the movement. we don't have a lot of expectation, but i see the pressure from the global south to do something, just have an end to the number line was going to continue. so you mentioned to the new guy that will be sharing nothing, even on line moving, but also the g 77 and china, obviously me 70. and you're going to have, have a very big influence over the agenda and what's happening over the course of the next few years. now then online movement emerged from, from deep post colonial routes. and there's always been a bit of a suspicion from the west. and i'm wondering within the context of what's happening to a new cane, what's happening and gaza, how much that's influencing we 70 is agenda. what is the top of that agenda?

afraid of what you're not gender? yes, i'm not really very optimistic. and my reason is that whether it is the, the disadvantage sort of the plus china. oh no, no, no, no, i must manage what determines the way. so the noise generated on, well, it looks at the way that, you know, cut off. it is what sort of strips do we bring to the table at these bible strips? you know very well, most of the countries in the global saw and then another movement of the some of the west tree goes when you come to the global problems, global programs with disease, a lot of key debt issues to do with the ecology and so on. on support, we uh, the bridge is produced as of a mighty grants in the water. and so all those things the way the

duke's gosh is that we really clients, we have, we have the p o o r a did the p f like one of them is and in many cases they've been pretty wages for. ready possible cell phones now. oh then do we come as a force? i would have a big that down, but how do we come as a new trick? do force if we're still in data, if we us do a for us to bring to the june of, of, of the paper. so that is where the challenge will help, isn't most of the need is big board with fox, which you guys and he speaks very, very well. but at the end of that do what we are looking got is our voice that he brings a being set up for the yes, i didn't bother you. place you guys enough for got on globally in general. how. what if it goes back and voice? how if the countries that,

quote unquote he's leading us to the recipients of age stewards donation us to you know, at the bottom of that they can coordinate. that is where the problem is, how are we going to be taken serious when the next very next day, we're going to be asking for, for, for, for a we are going to be asking for, you know, all sorts of assistance. if i have seen globally. when it comes to all these global organizations and conferences for con presidents, so well with their focus on free guides, but then what happens after that? so we spend a lot of grubby task for many of these things. she's but yeah, my guess i champ, mind is not, is not you every day pass on. but then what, what in effect, something, what effective agenda does, he have got to change the way the wall. it looks like every scene, not only just the wage looks, i forgot to truly though it looks like a rubies. no, but trade climate change. like, what can we do, the restore plans here,

so the se, stoking to not move me through stroking. we need to get the ways that you want to very important point the which is around financial dependence. dma. one of the big issues on the table has been about trying to reform the financial architecture be international financial architecture. and i'm wondering what that looks like in the eyes of the non aligned movement. how do you go about doing that and what is the vision for that? listen, there has been a lot of discussions around the, the form of the financial architecture due to the debt to the needs for all the countries of the south. that is an ongoing discussions that is helpful. the m d 77 has been empty. finding that voice, and i'm sure that the non aligned movements uh, have been doing the same. i came here for the south summit. uh and i know very much

that the g 77 who are the uh, you know, uh the add to fix behind the, uh, this discussion have been pursuing that there is a serious discussion of the you and also speed headed by other entities that isn't you know at home, any port that has been produced by you and this up with. uh, you know, uh, it's very good from you and successfully, generally for that. there is a need also using spouse hospitalization to learn from experiences of other companies that are companies that have been trying to look at different. some of the student needs that's in depth, and this is something that we are trying to pursue a with them in terms of knowledge sharing and knowledge exchange. i think the financial active actually form. we think it's fine. uh and it's we'd be also subject to a lot of discussions and the g 77 and china marketing and major voice and amplifying and relay the message of the countries of this house, the suspect. so we've been talking

a lot here about what the non line movement wants reform at the united nations reform of the global financial architecture. you raise the question nicholas about about the power of these countries actually have to change anything. and the, i'm curious about your thoughts on this. how does the non line movement get what it wants? and right now, is there an opportunity here, as we see increasing great power competition? when we see the divergence of years when it comes to the will and ukraine, what's going on and goals and what's going on as you were talking about. the 2nd coldwell between the, the us and china. given that there are potentially science to take here is the power and not taking one and does that raise the relevance and the profile of them on the line placement right now? yes. uh thing when it comes to uh, good power over it. i've seen that not in the living space, or is it the perfect for him to, to, to provide an alternative these 4 countries who don't know what, what,

who to know what to be aligned with one of the 2 powers. but on, on the question of it kind of dependence. and i think the global files are also in the accounts some of the rising economies. and in fact, some of the members are d 20 in psych uh, in those in the chat and see of of the 20 in 2022 was indonesia last year with india. this is a brazil and the next year will be south africa. so full of countries from the south side, you know, lead the, the g 20 and i think this is where they can, they can use their leverage and understand up all this whole countries when that's because the detroit is home its database and the bill was big the voice of the global, the house. so you know that that's whole kind of because the, the, the in the global south, the countries on the emerging economies with low level it's the brakes. brazil,

i sure in the time the south africa and not the left side new members, they also pressing full changes in the global financial systems. so then there's also a pricing on there. i guess the police asked the global sales and the cups assignments on the climate change in lamesa and many other countries are pressing the, the, the various countries to do this year to, you know, to dismiss a 4 countries to help them cope with the climate change so that's a lot of questions and that's a lot of organizations and with a multi lateral or regional, they're not putting pressure and the same thing the in the interest of the go the south. and do you mentioned breaks that in addition to the countries that you mentioned, obviously, so russia, india, china, as all africa, we now have egypt. if you, if you around saudi arabia and the way you joining, obviously it's not considered normal lines. you have russia and then you have china

and now you have a ron in there as well. i'm wondering about how we're seeing this, this global order being shaped by these different blocks. nicholas, somebody threw this one to you. do you see these blocks, these imagining blocks do use even guessing, getting stronger and stand for having more power to, to push the agenda that, that you've been talking about. you've talked about about desires for change, but questioned whether or not there is actually the power to, to do it. thank you very much for this bass. if we're talking about the long run. yes. if we are consistent on the issue of going to issues one, strengthening governors and to building these economies so that they become viable colors going on. is that a highly indebted order is going to be very fragile? do end up. we've weak and fatal steps because one of the things about uh,

the blog post house, uh miss mood, especially the, the majority in the that is the african countries. difficult continued has such a young population. now a young population without employment, productive. it is low. the end result is that you're going to of issues to do with security. and because people have to so far, we can't just look, show them. so when you have a weak states, it is very, very difficult for them to be taken seriously. and that's, that's the, that's the best way of many of the thinking about the many people is that before we even go in, all these, we must think about, what do we do about strengthening our uh, economies in the global. so on one of the things that you should know is that it is in the global assault, because the majority i read the african countries are $55.00 or so that's $50.00. so we're not some of the, the most important resources,

natural resources. but when do you mind blow by the so i was so i, i have a very brief question for in the, just picking up on what you were saying that obviously there's a lot of resources, a lot of potential in a lot of the countries that we're talking about and we've seen great how is try to work with a lot of these countries not only economically but also politically and someone i'll give it the narrative from the west really recently has been about democracy versus or talk or see. so, and you just very briefly let me ask you, is that, well, i think well, i mean this and the problem is within the many country and the goal of this house, but they've got so democracy or lack of it. and they need to investigate it, especially if i know you know, question from from the west. because maybe i know they liked. nicholas says it's about the government's. and that seems to be a big problem in many of the countries into the south this they, they need for this we, we need to investigate definitely. and as to be able to know,

to expand and negotiate with other countries addressing all the problems i got, that's uh, climate change for an aide, a developer, and all those things they need to happen. but those, we need to have good governments in all the countries in the, in the global south here. and i guess that's the biggest challenge living huge challenges ahead, but we'll leave it there for now. thank you to or about guess nicholas anger and the by uni. and him out because he's and thank you to for watching. remember, you can see this program again any time by visiting our website. that's algebra dot com for further discussion to go to our facebook page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash 8 and 5 story. remember, you can also join the conversation on x a handle that is at a inside story for me and it's not as you can the whole team here in the home, bye for now, the

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