you just have to keep pushing because no one else can see. the vision is key is youtube. to short documentary, fine african filmmakers from ivory coast and the sea turtle god. and may, in zambia, new series of africa direct on algae, sierra pots of hate are under a state of emergency after an escalation involves guidance of taking control of most of the capital, one prime minister ariel. all right, so what's behind this unrest, and what would it take to restore long lasting stability to the country? this is inside story, the

hello and welcome to the program. i'm joe. know how hate is capitalism war? that's the warning from the countries director of national police for the prompts has been overrun by gangs. the state of emergency has been declared off. the gang members attacked to prisons freeing several 1000 prisoners. the security situation west and off the president of juvenile moyes was assassinated 3 years ago. 4 months protest as have been calling for prime minister ariel on re to step down their angry about the late elections. the rising cost of living and in security. the united nation says the violence forced 300000 people to leave their homes this year . while the foreign minister, as liking the situation in haiti to a was a to help restore order, the un has proposed sending a multinational force. so what's led to this crisis and these international intervention, the way to resolve it, we'll discuss. so one of that with our guests in a few minutes, but 1st this from let me close to the chevy in a country in

chaos. have leon gang, swipe seize control of haiti's main at fort on monday, exchanging files with police and solutions. the attack is the latest and then explosion of vitamins that's included the escape of several 1000 inlets from the countries to biggest presence, leaving some of the co few and emergency measures on place with the funding is escalating. it's forcing businesses and schools to close and hundreds of people to flee for safety. check. i'm with, since the day i left my house, i've lived like an animal. what? because in this space for sleep, even animals don't slips that were crammed together. the gang sled by jimmy chevy to a former police officer known as bob of 2 or 20 over to the government. prime minister of you. andre traveled overseas, trying to get support for the un back security force with the address was sent in

his absence. the situation is getting worse, the national police can do nothing, a guess on guns. only a military force can help us in this situation. in 2019 and increase and few prizes left to protest and escalated into a long drawn out crisis involving job losses. vases and the cost of living and food shortages. more than half of the countries, 11000000 citizens living under for over 2 line will affected 2 years later, the assassination of preston, jewels, and the movies. the 2 low listeners, that's continue to listen. nearly 5000 people have been killed in the balance in one year and on groups now control about 80 percent of the captain according to the united nations. and its calling for funding to tackle the situation and for elections to be held in haiti. the secretary jo reiterates the need for urgent action, particularly in providing financial support for the non,

for the multi multi national security support mission to address the pressing security requirements of the haitian people and prevent the country from plunging further into chaos. the rest in haiti is warming neighboring states. the dominican republic has refused to open for few to cabs. for people sing hate the us has off american citizens to leave quickly. but for those left in the country, there's no escape from the reality of what the un describes as catastrophic levels of hunger and silence that are only getting less. because i'm sure if i'll just single find side story the well, before we go to a panel of experts, that's here from about subaru of the republic of haiti to the states of cutoff francois a deal, who joins us from the very good to have you with us ambassador,

your country sir, is in the grip of anarchy of gang led rule. one of its worst crises, certainly in the modern era. did you ever imagine things could get this bad? well, thank you, mr. all for the position. i got my english and i'll also nice to 1st and foremost is that might be based on the lenses and the families are falling rain with his wife and security for children. i'm the father of encourages all these offices that go on every day because the lines are trying to squeeze that in a safe environment. small falls on holidays. we can't forget that we have something when you stop as soon it's not going to be received. and you know, i should be like, does it show on the assignment you said that what is happening right now is not all

the reason being is one of the better part of the last 20 years in government. and the national forms for us haven't been writing the international community on the risk. i'm say we unfortunately have police force that has not part of the capacity faces clark way of getting work done. we don't have a technical capacity in terms of numbers. we are out numbers and we are going on. fortunately, what's happening today is not all that surprising. it's actually when you have games that are coordinating your efforts, we're seeing all the capacity of the police force as far we've been and take advantage of some wheat, which is a crime is fine. however, there is a solution. the national police force a solution to be able to come to a resolution and security. and for us then has been and has been for the past years

in terms of what we've been our credit for the least was the establishment of a collaboration between the national sports and m. o. 5 national support, who that was. so you believe that an international security force is the onset or part of the onset as it is definitely part of the answer. and it's funny part of the games. there are many, there are many other fives of this the to and from the fact that we have young men and women about our funding rates and getting active it is because they have left me left to know all the alternatives in that route. so in, in, on possibly with security matters. 18. how have you seen a, an area where it has to be invested in each say that we need to invest more demanding and twitching the stick about investment. my paycheck is one of those

countries, one of those lands the most of the itself. oh is the kind of a kind of a golf from buying house. so i'm back to the prime minister ariel henri is out of the country. he went to kenya to try and resolve the block in getting the security forces into haiti. where is the prime minister at this moment? and when is he planning to make his route to this information hasn't been destroyed yet in terms of what you see definitely that came out, i believe. and she went up to the prime minister. she wouldn't mean 18 days of all the current situation and she's probably has presented logistical issues for her not being able to be there. i wonder, i do not have her latest information was worry about. but that does not sound part of the fact that he believes that and his role and he's,

he's please turn the conference right now. i'm positive, francois gale money. thanks for your time. and for joining us as well. let's bring in a panel of experts now from bordeaux in france when the cherokee is with the defense intelligence company. james, he was with the un peacekeeping force in haiti in 2014 in new york roundup. fell by brown, his director of the initiative on non state actors for the brookings institution. and finally, we have ralph emmanuel, francois haitian social entrepreneur, an activist. we're not revealing his location for security reasons. welcome to overview. ralph. let me ask you, 1st of all, what is it like for ordinary haitians now? living in the grip of gang led anarchy? all the economic catastrophe, joblessness hung the sexual exploitation,

the atrocities committed on the streets. this is um, a very satisfied situation for our country. now. and it is hard to imagine and the level of the, the motions that we have, we now fear and sadness, pessimistic man. it's, it's really hard to imagine if uncertainty is, you know, you're not able to put jet fuel life and to say that, okay, in 24 hours, i will be at this location 24 hours. i'll be there, i'll be there. and you know, everything every day that you have a family member coming back from the streets and slides a party. um it's, it's really difficult to, you know, project life in such a chaos. so you put the site in security and uncertainty. very upset. yeah. be.

yeah, it is very hard in them, i believe the, there's some communities all held hostage and, you know, and you're seeing what happens in terms of response from the government. so they, they can curse you, me is yours and everything, but they have not been able, you know, to communicate appropriate b, n. and times the price is the lease that we see the lease that we should expect from our valuable leaders used to hide. you know, from the window is not in the taking responsibility. at least we have been waiting for a communication like face to face, where i would find me nice or should be, you know, and place it in front of the tv and telling people what they are. planes are,

you know, for the next 24 hours for the next 7 to 2 hours, and how the gonna deal with this situation. okay. well, the nfl but right. a, a picture of political failure, social dysfunction and of course rule by games the, with your special speciality in non state actors. in other words and groups like gangs and with, with a specific focus, i know, on haitian gangs tell us how did they become so powerful, essentially defeating the mechanisms of state as well for decades. i hate to have had a rule that study exclusionary but it's a so 3rd on of bringing economy against what i think will benefit. so very narrow across some people while the director of the population has been essentially left to fend for itself and for decades. also, businessman and politicians and paid, they often have the highest level, have been using gas for the economy services to intimidate and course the arrivals

. overtime, however, the gangs have slipped 30 ish and they have become far more powerful, far more organized. and far more ambitious, actually this stems from the access to heavier weapons. but actually this is the socialization. the learning base has beckett's interacting with the point of the people system that has been using them for their purposes. and this is now they do place on a context where he has not had the legitimate government for 3 years, but it has been a maurice was assassinated. and since then, oh oh, i missed the audit. i'm re, has this in the office of the prime minister. he was never on like state that it was all along significant political opposition to his rules. he promised that by february 2024, he would hold the elections that it was not done for many reasons, including a visual sector in this situation. and so we don't know the context of

a government that is weak when um, what do use forces are like the size of them collapse, but of gangs of long use their power to interact in colors, the political system. and now i'm more than what i'm vicious, and the conditions for organizations are absolutely college, essentially collusion with politics and politicians produced a monster and the monster escaped the cage. ones at the terrace. but you, you have experience of african forces, the makeup of expertise. you also have experience on the ground and hate to with the most of the un peacekeeping force in 2014, i want to ask you, is it appropriate to be drawing a security force from african countries to be brought to 80? shouldn't it be people closer to hand with a better knowledge of the situation in the country, perhaps latham countries, or the kind of being or the united states even so the african countries are being involved in the new style. they've provided some police contingents. they speak

french and there you just some cultural connection with the, the patient people. so involvement, the fabric and forces would likely have some positive elements. the problem, as you mentioned, is that they do not have experience on the ground, the type of operations that would be need to conducting both approximately, mostly the urban operations for which uh, for example, the kenya police as no major experience. a flashing american countries were significantly involved in the new status of a lot of experiencing h e. they know the lay of the land. they would definitely be a better option, probably on the account them through experienced. the problem is that not many of them are eager to join to dates among the countries that have committing themselves to the possibility of joining the force. i remember of caribbean countries including jamaica got ya know, behind us believes actually jamaica has

a lot of experiencing the urban operations in the kind of setting that uh uh, that could be for the price parking. uh, guys in uh, kingston and uh with probably uh, the very well suited to operations. maybe the problem is uh, the comp to meet large number of personnel. okay. well, ford way, with all of that in mind, i mean, do you think you'll country would welcome an international security force now, particularly given the legacy of middle stuff that ended in 2017, that was sexual exploitation. allegations made against those un peacekeepers. a cholera epidemic that killed 10000 people that came out of the account. um, obviously we need the use of force. we need to use a force. but i believe i strongly believe we thought a bullying goal strategy. the use of force will not be effective and it showed that in the past, for example,

in to talk with david for the epi center of the complex situation in terms of getting fines. wireless diesel legs this way is a slum on the out of court. outsource of photo plans of to year, 100000 people at this time. and we had around $10000.00 the soldiers there. and actually we are in 2024 we used later. and we know that only one f as temperature of divided. so now we have more a happy centers. so it also, this situation is much more complex for many reasons. one of the reasons is in 2004, the games was, were more or less for thomas. now they have mostly the total punch full of our maritime, you know, start conference them to come see maritime. so it is much more complex and deal

localized in some parts of border prints. we mean which, which means that, of course, there will be both on the ground, but we need a full legal strategies because we should anticipate serial casualties. so most people go, you know, the edges of paper also wrapped in humanity and response. roughly, it's, let me bring the car. let me bring vanda in on that. i mean, is there a risk that's ending 5000 troops from africa into 80, under these circumstances, is at best, a very, very temporary solution without a wider plan as well. absolutely. is this a temporary solution that i think that everyone understand that the emphasis is managed to provide a secular, at the end of our minds to bo, enabled the political process to move forward. certainly at least one election so that there is some legitimate elected body in haiti, but also to enable the reconstruction of the haitian police force,

which nominal is somewhere around $9000.00 men in practice. it's 3000, not a patient or any day. that's a pet, that's probably a high number of not the list that are many challenges for uh, the emphasis of some of which has to do with the number of personal eligibles already mentioned. it's not inevitable that'd be actually has 5000 forces. what kind of rules of engagement they will have? will they take an offensive 5 toward the gangs? will they be in a static position? simply perhaps protecting domains at all between the board and the porch terminal to a central type of for the past. very many questions, a massive amount of uncertainty in one is no doubt going to be a very complex mission. last and for very long time, what a minimum it will last very long time to sell you the gang to a level of security. and it doesn't simply, it was the moment to leave and,

and not have been not even mission. i mean, we're talking about the violence mission, essentially. uh, why don't i want to bring you in on this. i mean, in africa, you'll be perfectly well aware abundantly. so i'm sure the activities of groups like wagner and i wonder whether in the absence of the, the willingness or ability of countries to actually properly police the situation in haiti. whether you can see, or for, see the possibility that the russians get involved here on a different basis on a different level. just uh, i don't see, the russian says deploying wagner or any kind of direct presence in haiti. it would be quite complex. uh, and it would not necessarily advance their uh, themes significantly, however, using the internet media can think this information contains that they've done so

at the nafrica over the past couple years. they could definitely so further dissension, creating a and even more significant to do many, terry and crises on the doorstep of the united states and as distracting the attention of the united states in terms of its security commitments and potentially military commitments away from europe away from china, away from the, from guys bundle. i want to ask you, you talk about a political framework and, and, and so, and i mean, if we assume that the gains of so infiltrate to didn't to haitian societies, is that there is such a degree of collusion between the gangs and politics. do we have to assume that the political future of haiti, at least the foreseeable one, will have to on some basis include those gangs? possibly the political leadership will come from the gangs and i want to,

for instance, who leaves jimmy barbecue service. yeah. you see a man who could be negotiated with is he a man who could rise to political leadership. and so there are a norm, as controversies in haiti about the questions are asking very large number of people have suffered terribly and they hated the idea of any kind of negotiations with the guess of indemnity this. of course, hey, dee has a decades long tradition of such negotiations, taking place that has a simply resulted in empowering the games. so want kind of go see it in ways that, that, that reduce the damage or argument the damage. i mean, certainly the nature of the negotiation develop very much depends on how powerful the emphasis is and what kind of security effect managers to generate on the ground . even the international force is very weak, accomplishes perhaps only holding solve the inflow structures and the gangs

continue to arrest all or the press that any kind of negotiations would be we get the gang wouldn't bell. i asked for a political power of barbecues to mission as yet is a former police officer. he certainly has been very politically active east, perhaps the most politically overly point. i think we asked each of the gang leaders, other gaining this sort of politicians be faxed from their political alliances jersey as himself, personally politically ambitious. and the latest um, several days of wireless, we have had shared his yes saying that he's again trying to bring down the government will find is that already? uh, ralph was checking, he said that an outcome to that. okay. going ro? i'd like to put a word there. yeah. go and barbecue is the use of cleaning, you know, is a cleaning. oh, i know is, is very intelligent and he's been pushing for, you know,

communication and to present himself to have like a, a poster. as a leader, but he's a criminal, and the biggest, the biggest mistake that we should avoid is to validate the gang members. as negotiations, actors, the criminals. and that's the reason i'm saying that, of course we use a horse, but we thought, well, we to go strategy. we are precise intelligent political strategy that addresses 1st by the essentials of these 2nd met galion, planning to address of 5 of on 5 moving people for food and security. and last, a clear path to election, credible action. okay, so to speak. you actually very important give us most of this moment. no, i'm going to those you issue members,

not legal issues. you're probably going to bounce back to you in a 2nd. i'm going to bounce back to you in a 2nd for the final sort. ralph on this, but i just want to bring vendor and what about 5 minutes to real only he's about to make a reappearance. we think in haiti any day now, how will he be received? he will be at presumably great risk and does he have anything politically to think to offer, given that he's essentially discredited and mistrusted so far up by minister on that he has not been willing to step down a lot of the political efforts in hate to have some 3rd, on the negotiations with him of such as through the opposition groups around what used to be the one time at the college and all of civil society. and that is part of the good part is other political part is he still remains a very important act that even in the simplest that thing down of course. but just to step down right now, that is a significant challenge of who will emerge as the either be down elections,

which kind of beheld on the kind of circumstances. so i'm feeling he left for k. yeah, continued saying he would stay in office and the elections would be held in about a year this time. yet it's as role saying earlier, i mean, there is a sense of increasing by the day, by the hour as a result of the latest violence that even his own authority has radically gloves. safety away. ralph, i want to bring you in for a final thoughts here. and, and, and, and, and bring us back down to a community level in hasty in hate to the people of haiti. you spoke about the way they live in such fearful, and i'm 2nd conditions that brutality also the creeping into society with the rules of the gangs and in, in the way that people relate to one another within communities and within society . how this will your country and its communities and its people,

since i survive and recover from all of this as they will. and we will be a very up to mistake. and if you look at our history, we've had so many hurdles. and so many times, of course you have that many people that i've lost, the family members do use a complex situations. but as long as they believe that we could get back when we say, hey, these are useful county, i'm almost out of the population is under 18 years old. so whatever you have in youngsters you hold. and uh, i understand also those uh generational conflicts. and i understand that some come easy as far hills hostage, but we must come back and we should come back. but i of the also, i would like to underline without a political strategy, the use of force will be very effective. and i wouldn't ask the

government, i would pass priming primaries at all. yeah. allow you to leave. make it easy for us to not take your responsibility. it shows that you'll be here for almost 3 years. yeah. the 1st document. nothing building for 2nd, we estimate nothing daily, we're always step back. come together. okay, well let's jump in the present resignation and participate in the political process that you've helped the country. the unimportant appeal that many thanks to ralph and thanks to all of i guess initially, ambassador francois gave them, of course, on the cherokee vanda fell back from and ralph emanuel francois and thank you to for watching. you can see the program any time by visiting our website, delta 0 dot com. but for further discussion, go to facebook page. that's facebook dot com forward slash

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