i saw family drama, and chuck jago homes, running on kid shows. cooking shows you a for you right 2020 full top. you're viewing leaves and much more. don't forget to use the promo code from it that a deal between if you, if you're in the break away region of somebody land involving a new naval base as further west and diplomatic relations with some of the, its government is furious at the agreement, which would give landlocked ethiopia, access to the see, why is this the speed listening and because of the why the consequences this is inside stored the hello that on james space, amalia has ordered out if he's on boss of the record, it's own from addis ababa and demanded that to if you, if you can come to,

let's be shut down. the route between the neighbors has sent it on a deal. if you have, it is done with some of the land, the break away region pain by some of the a part of the agreement would give landlocked if you, if you access to the red sea so far, it's only a diplomatic dispute. but the relations of listening and causing serious concern internationally will be expanding why during the program and asking what might happen next. but to examine the background, to all of this in more detail, this report from when we call some short weeks to simmer intentions between somalia and the to be a, a now a full blown diplomatic dispute. somalia has expelled it to p as a bus to recall its own boy from addis ababa and folded the closure of tools that's considered that's in response to a controversial report deal between it to appear on the break lead region of somebody land the agreements made in january has led to awarded fluids between the 2 sites. what's new is the, the field here,

which has long said that it would not be the 1st government to recognize somebody lands independence. it wouldn't be the 2nd seems to have adjusted the view and decided to take the, the next step, which is to say that they would deal with some other land as an independent state. they have long standing security, economic and political ties. so this is really just a step forward. i'll be a dramatic one that has irritated the government and will issue under a memorandum of understanding the m o u. some money land has allowed its land block neighbor to least part of its coastline. but he'll be a wants to set up a naval base and a commercial report on the red sea. in exchange, if you hope you're offered to recognize the break with region as an independent nation. smalley line, seated from somalia and more than 30 years ago. but its independence is not the intern asking you recognize. an mogadishu consist tamani land part of its territory

in an interview without us, even in january, somalia, as president hassan shake must move a choose, add this up about or for next thing a part of what the company claims as its own. the issue is not with this to be access to the see they asked me to access. so while somebody where everyone is somebody above the question is how, how do they want to, to access the c? by next, the impact of somebody, you changing the voters. so my idea, this is what's going on right now. it is not a commercial. this next station, often a to the latest rounds of tensions between simone, you need to be a, have been stand by another somalis, region pumpkin is a federal member state of somalia. and as announce a new cooperation agreement with addis ababa pumpkin has refused to recognise amendments to somalia as constitution made earlier this week. and is making most woods more autonomy by pulling out of somalia as federal system and wants to govern

themselves independently. what links this amount of land and portland issues is an e p o, p a, has this m o u, with some of the land. and yesterday, invite to the delegation from portland to add a sub of to discuss enhanced relations between e c, o, b and portland. and that seems to have pushed more issue or the somalis federal government to take this step of expelling easier in diplomats. the deal is raising tensions in the home of africa, a region already facing immense politically in stability for the bodies to in the red sea. the hooting forces have been attacked in ships and um, being hit by the us and u. k. and the consumption of these on to sierra for inside story. well, let's discuss all of this now with all guess today on skype from this out of a samuel get to choose a political come and types of specializing in ethiopia. joining us from london is

trauma. ali, he's an activist with the u. k. somali lambda lions. i don't. skype for? missed on bull abdul karim drama. is the chair of the heritage institute for policy studies, a think tank based in the somali capital mogadishu, thank you. all of you for joining us today. now i've covered a lot of diplomatic stores in my time, and normally when i'm are searching them, i think the best thing to do is go and have a look at the key documents involved. what do you try and look for this memorandum of understanding that was signed on the 1st of january? and you can actually find a copy of it. the basic deal is to lease a land 20 kilometers of the coastline from somalia. and by you see ip yet for 50 years, isn't that samuel? but why don't we have all the details when they've been quiet so far? the, to open government as well as the somalian on government. but what we know so far, the basis of the agreement is to allow ethiopia to use a port in somali,

lined in exchange for a share of perhaps a share. and one of us because for, if not the best, the most profitable airlines in africa, which is a to open airlines. but the prime minister has to be saying from the get go, that's april pollution of at least 120000000 needs some kind of 4th. and that's why this was signed. you have to remember that todd somebody and also signed a deal was due by based dp world. and we didn't see a person that's a position to it from somalia. and we are a surprised us anyone that there is no position to something that's going to be changing the make up for the story of this continent that has been prone to conflicts and firemen. and so, so for, but the underlying issue of the fuel that needs some kind of for it to be self sufficient and feed a patient that's in need, shawn. okay. yes, we mentioned that by samuel of a previous deal in 2017,

which seemed to collapse for ip yet to take a state in the, in the existing port, the bubble wrap ports. but there's an argument that some of the land it's been but one. but once before, and tell us with regard to this particular plan, your understanding is this just enable base or is it also a commercial port? because i sort of seen different views on this. james, thank you very much for having me festival. that's an interesting question, but i disagree. i don't think it's the case of someone's being but and kind of country hasn't been bent. i think what we saw, what we've seen is that so mining then an s t o p are ready to actually be a pioneer in africa. they've shown africa and the well that they're ready to collaborate on a win win principal to ensure prosperity, peace and development. in the region, they want to show the, well, actually, africans can work together. um, by working together we will achieve our goals and targets, and that's just

a matter of fact. so that be, and in 2016, i guess let's be negotiated. but you know, how bills all and this bill is exactly the same, the details i currently be, i am out. i interviewed the for a minister of somebody in the republic of somebody that's a couple of days ago. and he said that the technical aspect of the deal is almost complete and very shortly the details of the agreement will be ironed out and somebody that'll be in a democratic peaceful country. and as a result of, you know, uh, conditions on its clinic, its constitution will actually present the deal to parliament. so this bill will not be hidden. it will be one that follows due process and which will be rectified by the parliament and so on. and i didn't had a case and then present it to the well, but we comp put the cart before the horse abdul karim. then why is somalia so upset a uh, thank you james. uh, i think the, the,

the session is that basically if you will be in this case, is proposing to take part of somalia and cut off another part and make it into a separate country. i don't believe any uh, some prospecting country in the world will accept to that. this is no different than some of the making deals with the ticket a or on how to v g, or auto mia and offering to give them recognition and know taking some parts of if you will be a and adding it to instead of to simply put that's the issue and this is an issue between 2 solver and countries being somalia. i need to be a not to between the regions of somalia and other countries that is the issue attend, but it isn't present the it is to create a little bit more complicated. not, isn't it because small the land many would say is a defacto country. the decisions of the president all the parliament in mogadishu

have no effect in, in somalia, and then it's been the situation for full, full since 1991. so this is, this is well over 3 decades. that's the government in mogadishu. and i know that's why you will based, doesn't really have any control of us, of all the line, the tools at the fair, according to james. uh, the truth of the matter is that no country in this world a supports a recognizes somebody that separate the country. so money land itself uh does not agree on a succession or becoming a separate country that our thoughts 5 families in. so molly land and for them and half of the other, do not recognize the idea of secession. i happen to be from that same region. one 3rd of that to british territories of uh for much somebody line. uh has to be in uh, add clarity of uh how to use the filter to use. i need some military and is now

a recognized part of somalia, se optima a and out of the region and market region do not accept and half of the people in how to go to and um, but how do not accept this assessment. so this is not a happy go lucky, peaceful democratic country that has a unanimous mission that it's approaching and it's the whole world recognizes as part of somalia, even if the somali authorities do not operate in in you know how to do so well, let's look at what the 2 countries have signed the deal, some of the land an easier if you get from the deal. shamika, if i can you just heard the abdul karim saying, no country recognizes somali line, but that is the point to this deal, isn't it easy as here? is going to recognize somebody lined it's going to become the 1st the days general of the issues here is that a lot of commentators that you see on your international, these tunnels like yours are be intellectually dishonest. so money land stands in

the right. as it's cases but legal tomorrow, and i want to go around the table arguments all emotional arguments, but i'll give you the facts very quickly. so my line is b l, the state, when it comes to somebody, i'm actually most of the countries that it's neighbors with somebody i received its independence on the 26th of june. 1960 before i, as i said, most of its neighbors. i did recognize that the stock and that's why i'm not able to change something because it did the it should show because it looks to be dismissed on just select bits of history events. they choose to join the somalia and become a component parts of somalia or it was free choice then wasn't taking the $196.00 this that's absolutely not james, this is the status see that's presented on to the media. if you want to look at the details in terms of what happens if it's the,

it was an actual legal union. what happened was someone in parliament at that time dropped to the union in a greek event with the representatives from somebody else. and actually what happened was somebody italiano, did what i called and told him, joe, on the cdn on past the completely different active union, which in effect, rented that so called active duty and none void from the get go. and actually if i give you a very quick example and a very quick history less that i'm sure you will cover this in the future. in 1961, a british judge based in somebody are actually trying to, uh, pretty uh, somebody and soldiers for a crew that it come to the 1961. and he found and he rolled that he could not center it. steve of soldiers who attempted the truth because there was no active union which was rectified. i need being that the legal this happened in the sure. so tonight to tell them you that, you know, we joined with somebody. yeah, i personally disagree. i what i say is it was an illegal occupation and we have

because of the passage ship and i'm talking about the next station of so many of the territories, but i mean what? somebody lined up with an extra 1960, on the 20, you've done your history that we've done your history lesson, but we've got a lot of things to discuss about today here. if you don't mind, samuel, what was easier to get out of this deal. i suppose that's pretty obvious when you look at the fact that easy i appear is the 2nd largest country by population in africa are off to nigeria and it is land long. it has no access to the c. and let's just put everything in perspective. the symbolic of the somalia and government in mogadishu can hardly control the capstone city and the property control a few buildings and look at an issue and that's it. but the reality is that some money non government has been signing deals with different countries. and if. busy there is no going to be the 1st country that's going to be recognizing somebody

land. it's also taiwan. but the reality is this would give you access to a port that's needed, a tool that has a fast growing population. at least a 120000000 by an estimation. uh and this would give you access to a c's and it's would give a mutual benefit to the somebody like government, including uh, share any to open. and like i said, so this is going to be a shared prosperity between somebody lines and ethiopia, and hopefully it will also reach somalia. again, you know, we'd, we'd have your cell from like myself, we've covered this country for the last 3 years. this region, this country has been going for, you know, conflicts and war and the last 3 years. it doesn't need another conflict. what you'll need. so i think you'll get, proposes is unengaged. you meant to somalia and engagement to some of the non to try to bring this to a conclusion. and so it's going back and forth between i'd be some of the and,

and will condition doesn't toast. but this is going to move forward, continues according to the to open government and it's need a t c o band. i hope it goes. it moves forward. i'm doing korean, bring us up to date. now the latest developments, somalia is spelling. ethiopia is i'm boss of the recalling. it's owned by soda and demanding that to in consulate, be closed. why is this happening now? because the original announcements of the deal was in january. what's the, what is the spock now at davis, a good question. uh, i think the obviously, uh, the, the problem initially was that it would be a, has decided to make an agreement uh, with a regional somali, uh, namely somebody line. and that was the problem. and uh, that's that m o, you did not find any support from any country,

no african country. european us, uh, united nations, all the multilateral organizations, african union and e got the islamic countries non aligned countries. now we have, we have been made to understand that by the powers that are mediating on this issue, that for all practical purposes, the m. o. u will be walk back by if you will be a and that to that issue is not going anywhere. it will not happen. in fact, it, uh, there was an effort to, to uh, find a face saving way of walking that back. uh, that has not happened. a meeting that was requested with the president of somalia and the prime minister did not take place. and now when, if you will be again, meet this one of the regents of some of the name of the plan to make a new agreement. that is a blatant index. it happens in the internal affairs of somebody. yeah. uh oh, the problem is do you have the recurring just to be clear, the fact that

a senior official from putting the but i think it was the finance minister was on a formal visit to ethiopia. just days before the decision was made to take out the ambassador and to withdrawal. somali is um, by so the that may have been the spock for this all the efforts of that were being made by uh other countries to mediate between somalia and if you will be, uh, uh, were making some progress. uh uh, and then now if, if you will be a, has a put out a statement that, that they want to make an agreement with another agent or somebody in this case pump land. yes. and without wind ignoring uh that this is part of this offer in the country called somalia. just as the case was with somebody line then that it was necessary for this amount of government as, as they put it to uh, make the statement and expel uh the investigator and close the, the, the order of the closing of the console. its, as i mentioned earlier,

this is no different than so malia making deals with the regions of the deal via without the involvement and knowledge of the federal government. or if you feel okay, sean closing costs so that i know that's in who goes up the capital of some of the land. they actually call it an embassy. the easier for them to see rather than comes to that, the somalia have any power to close that? does it have any ability to do what it's just ordered to? absolutely not james. the reality is it will have 0 impact on the ground, like somebody is usually a tense. it's usually 10. so the various undermining someone that is just a continuation in terms of somebody is publishing towards somebody that actually last year and best of the day to day a bush off, somebody presented his credentials. the president was a b, i. b of somebody, not to an administration or entity in the position i. so how can they even tell i

thought them back to that to go home. it doesn't make sense. james. it's almost like somebody attending germany to close that and the same from like it. what would happen, in essence, somebody that has about as much impact on somebody as a student representative of the model you where we'll talk a no impact on the ground, in my opinion. thank you. samuel people will talk about the security implications of this. because clearly you still have fighting going on in somalia. you still have, i'll show bob in somalia and you still have an african union mission. it was called me so i'm, it was then replaced by the african union transition, a mission at thomas. and that has ethiopian troops, subbing in somalia. do you think they will be able to stay? do you think there's any possibility ip might pull them out?

all the somalia might order them out as well. hopefully they will stay because they have been important to open troops have been important to the reality of some of the but let me go back and address you and guess she keeps saying you're comparing what's happening into somebody not in portland to, to an example. she's giving about to guy or i the region sofa. if you appear to be a cause of functioning government, you open government controls, 100 percent of the nation. that is a fact. so it's difficult to compare the experience. so if you feel bad to what's happening and somebody again, but somebody got somebody and government can hardly control mogadishu, leave her alone. somebody alonzo port allowed. and that's why the children government decided to deal with the some of the non government. and i hope there will be some kind of compromise. i hope there will be some kind of understanding by them. oh god, you should government that this deal is important, not just the field because what's happening if you will face the whole region. but i hope they jump and troops space, but again, we've seen a tax on

a fuel pen since us in somalia in the past week. and that has yet to be decided by the to pin functioning government. again to your guess, she should stop comparing what's happening into the open regions to his country. his country needs to be improved as his country needs support and it needs to work with its neighboring countries to move forward as of cream. let me bring you back to you in on the security implications of this. because our show by, i'll show bob also opposes this new deal for a naval base. and there are some analysts saying that all of this, this big route could help out. sure. bob, recruit. what do you think of that? uh, no doubt. uh, i want to address the 1st to the uh issue that the sir mark had mentioned uh which ease, uh, which has to do with the lack of authority of somalia, every major international activity, whether its the financing facility of everything that goes on in somebody line or

the port of better, but a expenses or a money comes to and it's all come with the clear admission of somalia, the airplanes that land in kind of gauge that have permission from somalia to facilitate people who lives there at going there. and he knows that, and so this idea that there is no authority is it is not accurate. if you will be a, does not close these missions. it is not like that somebody's will send out an army, but that means you to be will not recognize somebody as a country, which means somebody, it will not recognize the feel be as a country and will deal with it to some component to. so that is not an issue at hand to to go to the security of your colleague, our colleague from a, this of, of our mentions that some of the, uh, it doesn't control each country. but if you'll be a controls, i was in, i just of, of oper the african union a couple of week few weeks ago and have been advised that in all directions. i cannot go out of,

i do some of our accept the bi claim because of that. what was that around you see, will be, is as dysfunctional as any country in the world. now, there are wars in every corner. it doesn't control most of the regions and uh, it just defaulted on each basic payments so, so malia doesn't have the same problem that are 80 plus ethnic groups at every, but each of the other is throat. somebody is one nation, one people, few political issues, but nothing compared to the problem is that if you up, yeah. so i don't think use a competitor to shaneka is a very well behaved well, you'll know twice that, sorry, quickly, quickly. so i'm gonna let him quickly about to go. so, you know, you know, he said he wasn't decided by and he was told what's happening and outside departments that were more, we can hardly go to the condition. and i am gets out of a hotel per se, and to compare what's happening in ethiopia, the challenges. so he's, he will be out to the challenge of so some aaliyah that's day and night. and i, i think he should just come out to o'clock, you know, of the bible and see what's happening. if you open somalia and understand this

decision to give it, you'll have access with benefits his country as much as if you open somebody on shore. monica is everyone in some of the land. i know you're in london right now, but as everyone convinced by this deal, because i saw, but soon after the deal was announced, somali mac loans own defense minister resigned and said, ethiopia, it remains our enemy games. you know, the interesting fact is somebody is usually tries to use that as a negative, but actually in my do, it's a positive. so model number is a democracy allows for alternate views, allows for people to hold different opinions. it was his right to reside, and it says, any citizen of somebody that constitutional rights to oppose. but however, that's not the case on the ground. the majority support this deal because they see that the future is bright for somebody. that recognition is important. relations

with your kids important and that somebody is just trying to distract from its internal fields where the government provide 0 public services, all the embassy so called embassy, they talk about all based in bunkers in holland. they provide nothing for the citizen. so rather than focusing somebody that somebody should focus on securing its government in to shoot what else about making considerable gays, not because of some of the agreement with your job, but actually because of somebody is action someone. okay. and i'd like to bring it in. so, i mean, i'd like to bring in something real quickly. we don't have a lot of time, samuel, but how do we stop this? it's diplomatic route. how do we stop this escalating? we? i mean, we need the feed coming in. we need some kind of conversations this, this continent, this region has to be not more i, for many, many years. and they need to sit down and bridge the differences and come up with a conclusion because what's happening in ethiopia, country was a 120000000 people, updates other countries. and i hope this,

our somali brothers and sisters understand this is to the benefit to the region. there's no just need to have the cream. same question to you. how do you solve this becoming mold in the diplomatic spot? look, uh davis. uh, i think the you are absolutely right. we will be neighbors. uh, 4013, nobody's moving out of the region. so madea and if you will be a need to co exist and the way to court exist is to respect to each other to sovereign. instead of totally on integrity and unity, so obviously not undermine if you will be out by dealing with these regions. you obviously do the same commercial ties have happened before can happen again with the entire region. somebody joined the east african community, hopefully to deal with join one day. we're looking for a pan african system not to divide and undermine each other's intent enough territories, but to collaborate and find success and a win win situation that comes only if we respect each other and knocked at each other. thank you very much. all 3 of you for joining us today,

i'll guess samuel gets it you sure mock ally of the green gemma, if you've joined us, hopefully through today's discussion or if the phone rang at some point we've got you covered. you can watch this at any of our programs at any time by getting to a website out. is there a don't call me if you have your own thoughts or comments on this issue? posts them at all facebook page. that's facebook dot com. forward slash ha inside story. you'll find us on x at h a inside story from the james space on the team here in bo. huh. please stay safe . i'll see you again. very soon. bye bye. for now. the on counting the costs to india is economy as on the vines, but the nation's wealth gap is whitening. c, u. s. is spending millions of dollars to clean up its industrial facilities. costs millions of uses around the world will now have to buy microsoft office without counting the cost on out as the era the group it for them to search for clues. this

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the the hello, this is in use our analogies here. i'm for the back people live in doha, coming up in the next 60 minutes. much needed food is dropped into guys that but humanitarian agencies call on is route to open a land border crossing immediately to increase the flow of age 5 volts. mexico breaks off diplomatic relations with ecuador after police on the mexican embassy in quito to arrest the former vice president convicted of corruption. also this our targeting ukraine. second largest city will have the latest some khaki as midsize home. and again.