always getting closer. great savings away. you just go ahead now to the euro early, but i don't to get up to 3 month free subscription or free sit until full experience. the great piece supposed to be a big jump, the exclusive b b the, the use of freedom, south africans and marketing. 3 decades since the end of a pass side to the countries facing major challenges as a heads into an election. so has the governing amc failed to live up to its promises. this is inside the

hello and welcome to the program and the bulk of south africa is mocking freedom day. the historic day of the change, the course of the country hoops will hi, back in 1994 is use of segregation in white rule came to an end, a millions of black south africans costs their vote for the 1st time. but 30 is on many se there's little to celebrate hoops being replaced by disappointment and skepticism the african national congress, which has been in power since that time is accused of not keeping its promises. it's been embroiled and corruption scandals and unemployment. is that an all time high crime is widespread erase based in a quality is still a problem. this is out of us. we comes a month ahead of general elections, which can see the amc lose its majority for the 1st time. so have south africans lost faith in that governing policy? well, put that into, i guess in the moment, 1st the, this report from image in can the 30 years since i thought the goods went to the

post for the 1st free democratic by delivering a final and to decades of a culturally white minority had given the button, i cannot forget how we suffered at the hands of flights in the city at night, but they will wide by cuz who are due to be assaulted black person if they saw them walking on a pavement. the applicant, national congress met by nelson mandela when a landslide victory in 1992 and his remaining powers. since that with a general election a month away. the amc could be at risk of losing its majority. for the 1st time. the economy is stagnant with unemployment, around 30 percent. put those on to $35.00. it's as high as 50 percent. corruption has been a problem. the former secretary general, the amc is facing troll in june. and the amc speaker of the heisman resigned this

april accused of money laundering public services. severely lacking bowling power costs and will to shortages a part of daily life. for many, the amc insists things will improve and defend the record. our task over the last 30 years has been to bridge the huge devise of well an opportunity now country between black and white, between men and women. between the acid and rudo drama. we have done so not only to contract the injustices of the past, but also that we may realize that for potential of any part of me and which every person has a se. but according to the will bank, south africa is one of the most on equal countries in the world. roughly 10 percent of its population holds around 70 percent. the wealth and race is still

a major factor in that division. is there something the opposition party, the economic freedom fighters says it will address radical policies including confiscating white and blind. and the nationalization of mines and bonds, making them popular with young people. the other meno position policy is the democratic annoyance. de priorities during the 20 twenty's day to 2020 non term will be 2. 13, a 2000000 new jobs post. all that we can do to en, blurred chevy installed africa. and, and what's a shipping number 3 of the rates of bothering from the democratic alliance said it would be open to power sharing with the governing amc. well, the amc said it's in it to win. but if the amc wants to hang onto power,

a coalition may be the only way that you can buy out a 0 inside story the. okay, so let's bring in all of, i guess, all 3 of them are joining us from cape down. melanie, so it is a political analyst and a full, a member of south africa's parliament under president nelson. mandela william committee is founder and executive chair. person of the democracy works foundation and zacky act. my 2 is an activist and an independent candidate for south africa's parliament. if i will welcome 2 or 3, if you saki, i wonder if i can start with you. we've heard some of the examples that are of the failings of the a and c in recent years. they finally, it's a great job to dress poverty issues to do with utilities, energy supplies. all of these a site is as reasons to punish the a, n, c. the polls give us

a sense of the lived experience of what it's like the south africans to face these challenges. we can everyone, my experience has been quite a lot of that and the other hall living came democracy. and as you would know in the form a and see the present me not to my understanding is that the people with the modem which gives you the dignity back to the people in many different ways. of course, the degree for every month, for what do we have the clinical disposition of black african people, the disposition and intellectual disposition when people were really. ready kind of cheap bodies for cheese night, but as opposed to human beings,

you pay to be dignified citizens of the country. so you're really part of what was i was calling to inform the install the system to bring you into school when he went to work. when he went to the post office, how we usually come home, every aspect of life was to that full year was just pregnancy. and so like, you know, what happened between, you know, was in the same previous frame because of the items he was needing to make his body to wherever, when you're looking for the agency. right. the thing is, so the sucking so okay,

let me jump in and just just let what i wanted to clarify is whether the reason failings have in some way eclipsed past achievements. wouldn't let me put that to you because also cited is disappointing with, with the ac that it's lost. it's quote moral compass. what do people mean when they say they are and see has lost its moral compass with you? you know, thank you and thank you for having me on the program. i think it's a mix. let's just say the answers left some exposure say under one hand and read concepts about the physical music of freedom. richard moved around and i'm also a child and go out and have my youth serving you during your process yet. i search bixler just see we've got we've, we've taken away, i'm forming a part of it last week. i hate you to call such as a new loss is and so i'm to infinity, but it's almost stops. i mean, reality from a positive to democracy is beneficial, small is that you're suspended. this if you're,

if you're connect types of to the answer and one way or the other, you would have benefits as if you're why it's being corporate big business. your would have benefited by and large majority of somebody comes back to you, the underneath, you know, it has almost remains where they were doing your box. if you go to melanie, do you agree with that? a small elite, the cream of the crop. those are the people that have benefited from the work of the i n. c. in recent years, as someone who was elected as a member of parliament for the amc and the nelson mandela. was it like to hear this criticism of what the party looks like today? so i think many, i like the other 2 guys, william and zaki, i also grew half of my life under a prostate. and i was privileged enough to be part of the parliament announcement data ends in the beginning of the homepage as well. the thing about it is, i mean, many of us, i think one of us, i think everybody on the show would also tell you that we are deeply,

deeply disappointed in, in what has happened and, and, you know, does illusion in some, some respects. i mean, i do agree that it slowly does benefit greatly. that's true of as when insight was off the whites, they have still benefit from post about it. and it's also from people in business. it's also a growing black middle class. and i think one needs to also acknowledge that you know, that it is still as bad as things. oh, for the majority of poor people in this country. it is in some way still better than it was not only because they have democratic rights and freedoms, but also because things in some respects having groups, things like free education, free university education, if you are poor, in water access to water even though in some places that's become a problem now, if, when there is electricity, the majority of people in this country has electricity, etc. so i think there's a narrative that's developed in the country and that is spelled in overseas as well

. but nothing good has happened from in the last city, and i don't believe that is true even though we faced enormous challenges and things have gone wrong. and particularly under this emerging, i'm curious to turn back the clock and talk about the journey south africa has been on since the end of a pass item. the legacy of course, of colonialism, but still very much wants to present to william did negotiations back in 1994 the settlements the board and ends to the 2 opponents. i'd give away perhaps too many concessions to white south africans. i don't know. i don't think so, you know, i, it's against the, i to circle and possibly in the beginning. but i mean, looking back, that was the case. i, you know, retired and because you guys have tons, funds this and when done off to defend play as was strong enough to take a control. i mean we, we could not have another loosens. i'm so really a compromise agreement is actually patching goods. i'm from south africa. i mean,

it's a, you know, put a framework, the democratic 5 most of the rules foster transform a society. so i think the 5 see a lot of the young black years. i'm not blaming. i'm denija batch of 4 because the i, since i was giving away too much to our, to ask because i think i, you know, me, the, and it was just, it was jobs was at the time of year and i was like, works with it. it's up to the best of out the house, you know, it was i could do a better time. and somebody got the framework to transform the society. and i think the finally up, the items in government has nothing to do when he goes to a system was a compromise. but it's a cell in splitting just by yeah, i mean the corruption that your age and incompetence as a nothing to do with a new go say some compromises. let me still dig into this narrative and a little bit more detail if i may, because it is the perception. as you mentioned,

there were some young south africa, somebody just to clarify what south africans were allowed to keep. arguably the spoils of racist white supremacy. they privacy, namely lands and assets, and it doesn't take a course of the economist to realize the wealth begets wealth. and that's a lot of opportunities lease to stock nation. i wonder exactly whether that is why you are now standing as an independent you saw the difference to say this to you between the between 9499, we had well cool series about entering the country was good. and the big key and right to argument essentially became quiet little corruption. and the state country is, is something that i didn't give a section on the delivery of

a c o ensuring the a comfortable administration that has failed. it is not, you know, to ensure that the country goes on. but if you look into the date is the racial divisions that exist. ready serious racial division between african people colored people. the deeper racism that exist is being used to emotion and sought to divide people because no changes come to me for wedding cause people over the last few years. in fact, the cost of living the ability to access with what was being taken away, you can check the arrival time, which was destroyed this now coming back,

but literally was full time. yes, there was. ready commutes around the same time a child seems to be just trying to move from one place to be honest. i would say is why people have been continued to benefit the people like that. so we, in a position of extreme privilege, but the, if we don't things, sites where 2 people at the new 16 besides sort of this. and that's, that's a difficult time to be. melanie, do you agree with that? so i mean, you have a particularly interesting personal story and that you joined the i n c. you married wilhelm voted for with the grandson of one of the architects of a pod side. you will, ostracize from your community for joining the amc. do you think that nelson mandela went far enough in creating a bedrock for

a long lasting so called rainbow nation? you know, i think i prefer a certain committee onto, you know, onto that very well. that's a point was of course the agency wanted to go further at the time and bust, berkeley marley and they were justified to have gone. and so the but it would have resulted in a, in a civil war. we wouldn't have had peace and the, and the amazing thing about a story of 50 years ago is that we achieved and sold africa, which know what something which nobody thought was going to be possible to have a peaceful transition to a democratic state. one of the most liberal constitutions in the world, and these things have fits of us through the last 50 years of constitution standing . even though some young people are questioning and argued fisheries independent, the prices independent. we have an independent prosecuting this already. you know, we have as your trip in the beginning said, we have a president that has gone to excel. we have a speaker who's in front of the quotes. we have an ex secretary general of the n. c

in front of the codes. all of these things are actually phenomenal signs of a country that has, has achieved, you know, for the democratic for so much i do believe so as a white person that we have as wides, intergenerational responsibility that we carry. and that is to contribute to this country. nothing menu, i'd say that opinion with me. but i, i feel very strongly about that. you know and, and that we have a responsibility to keep on contributing to his country and not just sit on the edges and loads and criticize. i'm interesting that you mentioned that you disagree, that because one of the things is often mentioned by members of the i n c is but there was an inability to implement much needed reforms of the hands of tied launch it because of the makeup of the judiciary. a concern being that the today did you victory represent roughly wipes. members of the judiciary represents 30 percent of

the bench, even though whites only make up around 7 percent of the population. what do you, what does that mean in practice? and you know, i think that is over place and, you know, i, they're kind of criticism. i think, you know, how to just introduced to the x. that has to be one of the really important king and independent organizations that has presented us sliding even further down. i mean, this country was a beans in boston right now. it should, it wasn't for the judge. would you disagree and the media sort of society? and then of course also that we've got a big business. so maybe it's a competitive business success which has accomplished. they say that otherwise, you know, as a company we would have been on the phone now. but again, you know, to years many other societies in touch with you guys actually made a ton of balance. and i think we have given the answer to much of the 3 pos adopted rate yourself of a problem, or would you think about single forwarding? does he ask and it has become a developed country, you'd have some of our sort of,

i show the vision is also at the beginning, we were just knocked off and off and i include myself in the, i mean i was a journalist and the yes, the transition uh, i'm really just as you know because of the answers of the price of the past. we thoughts um, feedback. um the answer will be an individual leaders will be more than a prize that will be responsible and honest. that has not been the case of we have no, i mean spend enough to look toward. so the former president jacob zoom is description zacky all still judicial system. there was a judicial dictatorship as an exaggeration. well, this is what i can say about the and the, the community company for the bases that i can check and see clearly the distribution side. now, if anything you truly as become the ratio to terms of

gender and the difficulty is now the new address, particularly new black churches, doesn't come from a background on a, the agency started the, the ration was, they come from the new the and why just the use the political battles are being pulled, you know, when we, when, when we need to look at all public predictors. it's in the way we have to look at the fantasies, corruption in terms of its ministers. as all the 4 digit job is to make a decision, right? why don't i think it citizens the right spot we need? let's move on and talk about coalition building because according to recent polls, just over 40 percent, so vote to say that they will back the want us of course might see

a n c going forward. because if the amc wants to stay in power of the challenging job of coalition building will be necessary would mean for the countries political landscape william to yes, i did. you know, i didn't see maybe i'm under retrace by and see very likely a screenshot of likely to be potentially a play. i play uh, i said probably some and i can probably send, i think i know a lot of subject terms are very watered. it's about colors and politics because they're expecting me to ship them back. oh, um. so for us to be 60, is that extra child from a company some point of view or data? i keep on remind people that they're touchy to call. it shows up as a municipal level. all of the majority of them have been officers successful. i of course have been involved in police together. i sent you independence of windows.

are you sir? police forget us on our side of the guest pass for you and i told her, and probably some of you just called a multi positive child. so now we've, which i've got involved, and i have a subject to do this today about the i to the come see a 4 color settings up for that's after that. so i'm going to run some angle because that's a space we've been trying to beat. and i also think combinations much more appropriate, some bunk bed uh, a more appropriate model for diverse sizes receipt agent. but also um, you know, that have some, some nice, nice instructions, consistency company, some politics. we've seen a lot more research to be seen as a contrast to success stories and after checks on colored probably the semester, but somebody will. so i think it's appropriate model. right, melanie, do you agree with that? but a coalition government would be better suited to the type of south africa that exist today in ferry, i do in practice as i'm concerned about it. you know,

it is to that the vast majority of local authorities have been successful in conversations, but those have been the smaller ones, the big ones like johannesburg. now some of the metro falls where they've had college and governments have been big failures and they've really struggled. and we know from around the world democracy, steve, an old democracy struggle with this and my own experience from having in politics as many of these politicians are not mature enough to actually do what is best for the country. so i'm, i am concerned about it. um, i think so it will work. i think the the, and the reason why the work is that as professor committed mention, the strongest part to go with all doubts from what we can see from the opinion. both still be the and see. so they would be the strong anchor and what they were being, and i think that is what is important when you transition into conditions such a strong party. that thing can hold the collisions together when you have lots of small bodies that can be very unstable. and i think that's the last thing our

country needs at the moment. well then i should probably put that to, to exactly should nice standing as an independent. so does a being part of a small a cohorts of the independent politicians. we couldn't, will strengthen the country, is it more representative of the country today as well? the places the place to start is to say that satisfied the majority of the people and the majority of people don't trust bodies. and so the need for to bring back is, will do constituency work like we will get into the dice. and so is actually the central me personally, i'm joining the issue that works for the prisoner who stands on the basis of acting corruption has a key the for fixing the stance because fixing the site. nothing else could happen. no jobs can happen. and over any of the premises may come at least to

fix the status of i'm warning instead of the countries disabled in july 2021. got an attempted to come by the company to change some people. so they tried to started out of the city and to the commission, i saw the way i send is we need to drag stability. okay. what is where you approach the end of the shared cost you this closing question of the $30.00 is a power should we, should we be surprised that the country might want change of isn't not part of what a healthy democracy looks like. absolutely. you know, the country may have changed out of a problem up so, so far is that the agency is being empowered for too long. and people have been policy and for your advice on the past, not in the presence. and that brings the lack of accountability, and i mean, i said up to now have no real reason or no really incentives, incentives to,

to deliver for you as people. because you know, you could be, can be a finding the right. and so really tons of power, and that has to be the structure of a weakness. search the country is ready for change. melanie, you're not in your head now i, i, i'm not surprised, but people one change and i think it is also, you know, to look around the world and irritable the best kind of thing happens to it. so my level ration movements, i got people start getting impatient and you know, and i have a right to be angry at the moment with what is what has happened in the country. and, but yeah, i mean, i think there's, you know, was, of course, of africa and i think we, we need to hold onto that. okay. well, many thanks to all 3 of you, melanie, for which william committee and zacky talked about. it's been a pleasure to have you on the program and thank you to for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting

a website. i'll just 0. don't com. and for further discussion on facebook page. so that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha, inside story. where you can also join the conversation on tags. handle is a j inside story from a new phone kind of the entire team here. bye for now. the why have american evangelicals become? is real strong as backer is us president joe finding right to stand with israel with no red line. as long as us support continues. is there anything that can stop is real? solve on concept from going on in? definitely a quizzical look at us politics. the bottom line, the latest news, as it breaks, another mazda grey of yours more power, city, and body of over 3 of the there i did it is, are largely last, you know, not

a president in war with in depth for pools scale. this summit was something they've never seen before. from the heart of the story, almost 500 medical workers have been killed inside the gaza strip, putting more pressure on health care systems that tens of thousands rely on indonesia is building a new capital city. deep in the jungles of borneo, this is part of the original open our boss to an issue. but not everyone supports the idea of india and get that someone would definitely have. we see this as an authoritarian decision who's on the 101 east where deals indonesia moving a megacity on out to 0. now, scientists say primates remain crucial for biomedical research. the but some of being given new lives beyond the bodies on the outskirts of virus is nothing in the century for all kinds of founding moves, including those ones used in scientific research. the century houses 22

retired lab monkeys from across europe. this female recess, mcgarr cause can survive 19 years of experimentation in french labs. she was the 1st lab funky to be given a new form at lot then yet being a journalist is a privilege i get to the heart of the story amplified the voices of those have been drowned out by the noise is a 4. is my driving force is what pushes me to take risks facing the trying to find that challenge and a huge risk both we keep politicians and decision makers in check. so the devastating human cost of their decisions working about 0 enables me to make this other voice is relevant to so that there's more that unites us than divides us

investigating the use and abuse of power across the globe. the, the, the hello, i'm sammy say them. this is the news out live from dog coming off to the next 60 minutes. hundreds of students, the rest of it across the us protests against israel's war and gaza spreading to new university campuses in gaza. where all universities have been badly damaged or destroyed vice write a full sized messages of thanks routine to students in america and see one of them is.