the old inadvertently, a couple of people, but the stretch was clearly the largest for white wing, malicious. now, what happened in this context over the last 25 years and actually here, all i, i think that expand with the professor said the last decade. certainly the rhetoric is increased, but this is a phenomenon and it goes back a minimum of 40 years, a minimum, where the rhetoric primarily from the right, whether it's talk, show the average on the radio and united states or television networks or activists, has increased the level of, of i to peroration colonization, an 8 at the same time. there's another phenomenon that the professor also touches upon which is frankly a social cast all edgy for the entire country. and i'm not printing too broad a brush with regard to the guns and the political cessation of gun

ownership because it is a boy. i shot all the time in the rifle range. and it was a member because i was in shooting competitions of the national rifle association. but about 40 years ago, the, the national rifle association became politicized. and it was no longer a gun safety organization, but became a political advocacy. one equating yours or to guns with them, but protecting one cell from the threat or extensively of the government. so all of these phenomena together, kevin creek, and then the last decade of the trump mazda phenomena have progressively increased the tensions to show that there is a everyone, i think, sense is a tremendous threat of violence. so the last thing i'll say, pardon me for being so long with it, is there have been, have, i think it's exactly 54 trials of violence in united states for political of

nations. all of them all 54 were the trump supporters were right wing. and active this who caused committed violence against the people they thought were opponents of donald trump. there is the famous shooting, terrible shooting of republican members of congress. i think it was uh, 7 years ago now. um, but that's the only uh, significant incidents of violence coming from the left. the conclusion is that the tensions has been rising. we shouldn't be surprised. we should all be appalled. and it's because, frankly, and the problem is ation and the increasing stridency from the far right. baba perry, we've just heard what glen call has to say they haven't given what he had to say. what do you think needs to happen right now to calm the situation across the political spectrum? the 1st of all, i want to thank my distinguished colleague for his service to our country and

keeping us all safe. and i'm glad to hear the facts as he knows some 1st hand over the last 20 to 25 years and serving our country. it was my sense that that was the case. i'm not an expert in that his feel, but i also remember i think it was janet the natal. i'm tied up with the homeland security secretary in the obama administration, finding information about the growth of right wing conspiracy. and by what actors coming out of the american military, coming out of the rock pores in the war and i scanned a stand. and then that was very upsetting, of course, to those in government. i needed to express that to members of congress who, based on their politics, were either upset about that or did not want that out as public. so what, what can we do given what my colleague has said about where this is coming from? and given that we know in the case of canada, trump and present the top,

that much of his demagogic rhetoric is related to. and jenny, up this kind of behavior and upside and violence, and use of weaponry on the part of the right way. it would really help if, even if he's not rattled by what happened to him, and he just has a change of heart and mind if it would least change his rhetoric so that he's, he's winning in many polls any way he should sort of dial back if it's if he's able to do that by his personality down, back on the rhetoric dive back on the hateful, this dial back on making fun of his opponents, for example, making fun of a president biden. and not in any way that clever or with the but, but it's sort of schoolyard bully, i that would be something that would move us, perhaps in the right direction, if he's not already created such a constituency that it can't be dialed by. robert perry and glen the call. thank

you both very much indeed for joining us. they give us presence. joe biden has reacted to the shooting. he condemned quoting it sick. i have been fairly brave my, all the agencies of the federal government has some situation based on what we know now. i have tried to get ahold of donald, he's with his doctors. they apparently he's doing well. i plan on talking now shortly. i hope when i get back to the telephone book, there's no place in america for this kind of island. it's sick. it's sick. it's one of the reason why we have to unite this country. we cannot allow for this to be happening. we cannot be like this, we cannot condone this. and so, and i want to thank the secret service and all the ages, including the state agencies that are in gauge and making sure that the people who

and we have more detail become relative to the other end or other people may be injured in the audience. i don't have all that detail. we'll make that available to you. i may be able to come back later tonight, but we'll put out a statement if we don't. if i'm not able to give it free, if it's not convenient for you all. but the bottom line is that the trump rally rally that he should have been able to can be conducted peacefully without any problem. but the idea, the idea that there's political violence or violence in america like this is just on part of just not appropriate. and we, everybody, everybody must condemn it. everybody, i'll keep you informed and if i am able to speak to the, to donald, i'll let you know that as well. so far it appears he's doing well. number one, number 2, that there's thoroughly investigating what happened to anyone else in the audience i have. we have some reports, but not final reports. and every agency, the federal government. and i'm going back to, to my phone,

to speak with the federal agencies that are being put together again to give me an updated pre peters and i, they happen. they learn the more in the last couple hours. so thank you very much. and i hope i get to speak to him night and i'll get back to you if i do just present, do you think it was an assassination attempt? i don't know enough to i, i'll tell you, but i don't have any fax. so i want to make sure we have all the facts before i make some comment. any more comments? starting as low as now from pittsburgh, pennsylvania is calling clark. he's director of a search of this to find a group and associates further with the international sense of account to terrorism . but thanks for joining us. it's any days of course, but from a security perspective, is this a failure? what kind of never be a 100 percent safe but i think it's going to be chopped up as a failure. certainly when you look at what the secret service is, job is to protect the president from something like this to establish

a perimeter and to make sure that nothing even close is can happen. so yeah, i think unfortunately this is going to be, you know, chopped up is a failure on the part of those that were uh, you know, deemed responsible for protecting former president trump. uh, and it's gonna lead to, unfortunately, a lot of conspiracy theories. and we're seeing those manifesto already online. where does america go now then? and what is it very feed route situation, especially in terms of the security of, of candidates coming up to the election. look, it just makes a bad situation worse. this is going to lead to, i think, unprecedented tension. it's going to lead to extremism at both ends of the political spectrum. and it's going to lead to very fraught appearances. but either candidate was a really, really high level of security intact. and it's going to make for a very tense,

next several months and the lead up to the november presidential election just all around a very, very black mark on american democracy today. and at the very sense, see, you mentioned the word extreme is and i mean, what can the security services do then to reduce this in the security sense in the run up to that extra. and i think the cats already out of the bag, there's not much we can do to pull back from extremism. we've been, you know, heading into this full throttle for the past several years. you know, really sense the cobra academic when people have started to kind of log on, said a lot of time online and gravitate toward the political extremes. i don't think there's much we could do to put that genie back in the bottle. it's now about making sure that both, you know, president bite and then form president trump are safe, but also protected the people that show up to these rallies. look, this happened how 30 minutes from where i live. this is very, very unsettling. and you know,

no matter what you think of either political candidate, violence is abhorrent. it's unacceptable. and it's an to technical to american democracy. however, i'm worried that we're going to see more of this. it will lead up to the election. you paints are very bleak, picture that of the, the future to what extent are you personally fearful of democracy in america? well, i'm fearful of, you know, i'm 43 years old and i've never been on the precipice like this. i have 2 young kids that i now have to explain to what happened and why, and i, and i don't know why. i don't know how we've arrived at this point, but we're here and i don't see anything that's going to pull us back for the break . i think that's, that's the worst part of this is that a country that i love, that i have to go to my life to that i will do anything to defend, is now headed toward

a pretty dark place. and i think times are becoming darker. you know, i don't mean to be that the sky is falling, but this is really the combination of what many of us in the counterterrorism community have and warning against for gears. and now we're seeing this come to their, well, that's interesting. i mean, what will the security services be be calculating now going forward, given what you said? a look, i think there's going to be extreme caution and then rightfully so. they're going to go to, you know, great lengths to keep the candidates safe from something like this. but the, you know, one can only fathom what, what happens next. and what kind of a spiral or a cycle this leads us into. i think we're going to see, you know, stream political violence and the next several months leading up to the election as an american citizen, as a civilian and not just as someone that studies political violence that makes me feel terrible. it's a very unsettling feeling. and it's one that i think we all struggle with and we'll

struggle with on a daily basis now. would that then be putting a barrier of creating a barrier between the people and those who would be something that yeah, no question. i think it's gonna lead people to not come out to vote. there's gotta be concerns over violence at the polls. what could happen there? i think look, this is the worst case scenario. and we still don't know the motive. we still don't know the perpetrator or perpetrators. we don't know, you know the goals here. so i don't want to speculate and we'll learn that hopefully in the coming days and weeks, but just all around again, a very bleak day. very grim prospects for american democracy as we head toward what's going to be a monumental election for, for our country calling thought we very much appreciate to your time here on out to 0. thank you as well. the incidence comes just 2 days ahead of the republican

national convention. r n. c will take place some of the war key, wisconsin kicking off on monday and set to last through to thursday. the are and see trump is set to be officially nominated as the parties candidates for the 2024 election in november. he's expected to announce his pick for vice president, which he said he'll do either just before the r n. c kicks off or during the convention of thousands of republicans will attend. it's an event starts, we'll see speeches from big donors, big name politicians, and of course headline speak with slated to be donald trump, himself as close live now to milwaukee in that wisconsin article hanging joins as not from the property. what more can you tell us? well i can tell you i've covered political conventions in the past and we were is at the area where it's going to be today. and i can't remember ever seeing such a huge perimeter around where the events are going to be held. so basically,

secret service is in charge of that particular area and they do screen, you have to have credentials, you have to have tickets, and you have to go through metal detector, your bags are checked. the interesting thing about wisconsin is the state has a law that says, look at localities cannot stop people from carrying weapons either concealed or out of the open. and so at the event, there are 2 places where people are allowed to legally protest the re far from the event and outside of the gauge. but the people as the protests and the counter protesters will therefore be allowed to carry weapons. i spoke to i interviewed the police chief of milwaukee today and said, that just seems like a recipe for disaster. if you've got protesters and anti protestors and they're in the same space and they all a guns. and he said, this is how we do it. it's the 2nd amendment right, that we look for behaviors and if we see behaviors that appear threatening, we will act. but of course we're talking about america where we have somebody medic,

automatic weapons, they can fire lots of bullets very quickly, causing a lot of damage before police can even react. this is going to greatly increase the scrutiny the security of the upcoming convention. it was already going to be tad's, we expect thousands of protesters we, there's a growing concerned, the trump supporters of or don't want to come here with it, with weapons to defend him or perhaps possibly did confront some of the people who are protesting against him. so this is really going to increase the fear in the city is 30000 people to send out milwaukee and patsy. with all that to fear that you mentioned and security, you mentioned move. this inevitably raised more issues. they've been con, control in the us, in the run up to that the next for you. it's to people outside of the us. it might seem like that would be the logical 1st step

. and obviously it could become an issue of president donald trump pretends to be very, very it for the enter a and against any sort of gun restrictions he could possibly change his policies. but really we've seen so many mass tragedies in this country, and there is not lead to really hardly any kind of reform at all. let's not forget 20 children were killed and their priests in their, in their classroom, babies. and 6 teachers were killed at sandy hook and literally almost nothing changed. so it's a very divisive issue. as i've said, wisconsin, they are very, very conservative. they've passed a law that says, you get to carry weapons anywhere. you can see the put any restrictions on that. now will they be inclined to change that in the coming days? it's always so something that a lot of local reporters are going to be asking about. but again, we've seen columbine. we've seen so many students, sandy hook and virginia tech ad each time people say, well,

maybe it's going to change. we saw the 2 members of congress were shot practicing for baseball game, and that didn't change their opinion of the 2nd amendment. so it's pretty ingrained in the political parties, whether or not this will be a week of call for donald trump. well, we're gonna have to wait till you're about to go hanging. thank you. but we can hear from another trumpet support who is in the audience when the shooting began as well. um i was kind of in the back seat of god. and um, i just asked someone standing next to me to take a photo of me with president trump in the background. and um, he took $43.00 photos and then suddenly a whole body of shots went off and we knew immediately what it was. and the man who was taking my photo, it said that doesn't sound good. and then immediately after that, people started to run. some people started to get down on the ground. nobody really knew what to do. and our 1st thoughts were, you know, as president trump ok. and then i heard as we were going out that they shot the

shooter. and i don't know how to them ever before. she could have ever gotten into the valley because they had excellent security. but let me ask you about that what, what, what security you go through. i went through one of the store ways, you know, magnetometers, hector, metal detectors. i had to put everything in putting my car key as you know, on the table next to me. my credit cards, my license so you know, nothing went in with me that and you know, people, i guess people really didn't expect that this was gonna happen, you know, but um it was, uh, it's unbelievable. it really is. unbelievable. could you see, did the president look okay to you before i present far away? and of course people started to panic, so i really couldn't see what was happening on the stage. but again, our 1st thoughts, everybody's 1st thoughts were, is the president, okay. and uh you said that uh you had heard that the gunman, presumably a gunman, wasn't too far from, was, was he shot? i heard that he was shot. someone was on there.

weird it a shot here to come from. right. to my right and it wasn't in the back of the arena. yeah. it wasn't too too close to be. and so is there any reason to believe that anybody else was hurt? there were several shots. it sounded like yes the i hope that nobody was hurt. but um, there were a lot of shots. right. and we did see an ambulance back there with flashing lights . um, any other observations about what you saw in there? um no, just as the police were really well organized and directing people out, you know, and it was very orderly. and um, you know, people were not like history took more angry and very concerned about

rodney latrice, his democratic party strategist and former deputy campaign manager at the ben. it's on his, in for the 16. she joins a slot from dallas. we to in case of the conversation before the here present by and the apologies. but let me ask you again, how do you feel? now when you try to take stock of what's happened, i still feel shocked. it just, it didn't happen that long ago. and in some part, i'm also not surprised at all because again, access to guns in this country is it there's, there's no regulations, almost in a lot of states. they're literally the regulations. but um, you know, it's in some part, it's shocking. and in some part it's just very angry and because this is not a new issue and it continues and still nothing is being done or is it just that? so it was also a case of the powder i zation of politics in america that has been building up. oh,

absolutely. and i mentioned previously to you that this has been an ongoing issue where the rhetoric is been escalated, the rise and hate crimes have as is not a new thing it's, it's not just happening. and we obviously such a massive escalation during the trumps 1st term. and then it's continued by either it's just gotten worse and worse every day. and, and i mentioned previously just the lack of humanity and inability to see people as human beings 1st and is sort of at the forefront here. and we're seeing, we were literally seeing it play out in front of our eyes, given what you say is, and what should democrats and republicans be doing right now to, to bring back as you say, that to manage it would be for seeing in, in the early statements that are coming out from democratic and republican leadership that are there is a call for, for just

a camping down of rhetoric to wait for facts to come out. and i'm calling you to saying that there is no room for this kind of violence in our country. and of course we hear all of those words. and again, the hypocrisy of it is pretty staggering. but i do think that it's important for everybody with any sort of a platform or microphone at this moment to not be pushing the conspiracy theories to, to wait for facts to come out before any sort of statements and speculations are made . i think that's 1st and foremost important, and then as we move on again, just a reminder that words matter and have an impact and especially with the volatility that is being experienced in the united states. we can pretend like you calls for, for action or are following on on the on deck theories are that, that it doesn't have an impact on people's behavior. the at the end, the day obviously people are responsible for their own actions. but we,

we understand the time and place that we're living in and pretending like those words don't matter is ridiculous. you say words match, i mean, do you think people will actually heat this going forward when you consider, for example, that the immense power of social media? yeah, i think honestly that's part of the problem is social media has, has gotten out of control. i obviously have very strong feelings about the platforms, twitter for x or whatever. it's called these days. you know, i think there's a lot of, it was not always a fantastic place to be. it's gotten worse. it's a place where conspiracy theories go to grow and faster. so i do think that that's obviously a massive issue. and, and, and emotions especially right this moment are running high. the reality is they were running behind the floor and i hope everybody is taking a moment, taking stock. that's the, that's the violence that's been experienced across this country. and as i mentioned

previously in communities all across the country, this is not new. this is a, this is one more example of the violence as being perpetuated across this country. and, and i think the only thing we can do right now in this moment is to make sure we're not spreading misinformation and just information. and, and 1st and foremost, is trying to anybody that's watching anybody that's listening, just consider seeing each other as human beings 1st. probably have a chance. thank you very much for joining us. okay, and the call is the us national security and the foreign policy analyst. he joins us from boston via skype. thank you for being with us here again. is there a feeling of things getting out of control, or is that to about a description or just the reaction to us just how i wish i could say that it was just the reaction to what happened and then it serves the emotional shock response. but i don't think that that is the case i, i do agree that the,

the tensions have been increasing. the situation is becoming progressively more alarming. i've said, for in public is almost in every interview i've done this for a decade. the goal is to decade that the united states is confronting the greatest crisis to it, society and institutions since $1861.00, which is one of the country split in half. and for 4 years, the mastercard, the one another to the tune of hundreds of thousands of people in the civil war. and the, i think the previous speakers remarks hit an important point, which is the effective social media. there are other incredibly important or influential factors. tingler social media. let's take that as an example of what's happening. why things, if not spinning out of control, are deteriorating, molest,

when you lose the, when it's already figures lose their authority in or not, i don't shapes the debate anymore and i'm, but i am not a conservative, but this is, this is psychological. especially lexical fact. actually then it, when everyone is empowered and becomes and equal, which one would argue is the goal of democracy. so you have people who are not well informed. so having their opinions given equal weight to. ready those who are, or those who are not responsible for those who are, and you then have a circumstance where whoever shots the language tends to be heard most, and whoever repeats things the most tends to be believed there. that's. that is a phenomenon and psychological phenomena. the truth is secondary to familiarity, that people tend to believe what they hear. and all of those things have been

happening progressively. as our tech not social technologies have evolved. and as, as our politics it become more polarized, largely because of the rise of the far right. and so, yes, things are heard quite dangerous. one last act of 20 years ago i was, i am from the east side of i went to washington for many years. of course, i happen to be on the west coast and someone over dinner was saying, what you do. i said it was a government. then the response was so you are the enemy and as well in a civil shirt. and i said no, no yours. if your, your job is to take my freedoms away and the person was completely serious and it was not. and then a baron comment, that's the phenomenon that has been growing, but hostility to government and, and just crazy, dangerous belief that it's actually more of the basis of fascism which is that the, the government is the enemy and only

a strong man leader can act as mediator protector of the people. all of this has been happening. so yes, things are getting worse. it's very interesting what you said that. i mean, are you saying there's a tension between the government and, and social media? is that part of the issue and cannot ever be reconciled? i think it is part of the problem there is, there are people who are devote their lives to this issue. and then i, i do not but ardent a. the proponents and defender of our 1st amendment to united states, which is the, protects free speech. so as i am and i am, it is the foundation of all, all freedoms in a democratic government is free speech. it seems that unless there are some regulation of social media to filter out or to stop a blatant and troops and frankly, propaganda or,

or instruments indirectly to hostility and violence, then the trend will continue from now that implies controlling free speech. and how does one do that? this is successful here, there are valid but incompatible fundamental values that go into making a democracy and, and how the society and the government can adjudicate this particular issue. we have not worked out, you touched on history of this. it's not the 1st time we've seen high profile shooting and fatality in, in the us over the years. but what would you say is different this time? this well, i think what is different is what i always alluded to and before. and that is for a certainly the past decade since the rise of the market and voltage but,

but quite clearly for several decades before that you have a combination of changing technology. you had the cable television, segmented media providing the, the perspective that a certain segment would like to hear rather than a broader perspective giving more balanced or neutral coverage. and you have the progressive and domination of the republican party by progressively far right. the elements to the point where, you know, the, so the republican party is strong segments is not the controlling one. certainly the trump elements advocate.