first, less cold and towards the end of the week we might be able to call it milder. as far as tomorrow is concerned it will be for many of us a wet start, but before we get to that, i want to this vast animation of what is happening over the next few days. an undulating jet stream across the atlantic spawning areas of low pressure so clearly the weather coming in from the west, moving east and that is a mild direction but not at the moment. we have an area of low pressure still an easterly pushing cold air i will wear but mulled —— mild overall, temperatures four, 5 degrees. still a frost over northern, central parts of scotland. tomorrow a disappointing day, particularly for eastern and central parts, could stay cloudy and damp all through the day but some of these western areas will brighten up on the best of the

sunshine tomorrow across scotland and parts of northern ireland. but then tomorrow night, the clouds will clear, the winds will ease and then into wednesday we've got one more widespread frost on the way this week and then that is pretty much it at least for some time. so no more widespread frost on the way after wednesday morning. here is wednesday morning itself, but suddenly developed here, that warn of mild air in the form of a weather front and rain. ahead of it though, after that cold night, some lingering fog, it could feel quite raw for time on wednesday but after that, a rapid rise in the temperature certainly around about wednesday, thursday, into friday and temperatures above the average for the time of year. thanks, tomasz. and that's bbc news at ten. newsnight is just getting underway on bbc two, with kirsty wark. on bbc one, it's time tojoin our colleagues for the news where you are. goodnight.

"enough is enough", says the home secretary, as he announces what he calls the largest reduction on immigration on record. but what will a cut of 300,000 mean for care homes and construction?

migration to this country is far too— and needs to come down and today we are taking more robust action than any other government before. —— far too high. the government is banking on their new migration plan to change the political weather but, if warnings about care home closures materialise, what then? we'll be joined by the deputy chair of the tory party, the general secretary of the largest trade union in the care sector, and the leader of the reform party. also tonight, an hour ago, the government was defeated in a major rebellion over extending compensation in the infected blood scandal of the �*70s and �*80s. we speak tojustine gordon smith — who, along with her siblings, looked after her late father, who suffered for many years before his death. they should now receive recompense. and... the idf says it's expanding

its ground operation to cover "all areas of palestinian territory, despite the us repeatedly warning against escalating civilian deaths. away from the sound and fury, we are joined tonight by two new friends who've grown up on opposite sides of the conflict, both of whom have lost loved ones at different times, who are speaking up for moderation. good evening. £38,700 — that is the salary that will be needed to qualify for a skilled worker visa, an increase of almost 50% on the current level. those coming on health and social care visas will be exempt, but care workers from abroad who are exempt from salary restrictions will no longer be allowed to bring dependent partners and children. also in the government's five—part plan, the occupations in the government's "shortage 0ccupations list", which allows people to come to the uk on lower wages, is being reduced. at the moment, it encompasses artists and musicians, as well as construction workers

and carpenters — 38 occupations in all — but what's to say these restrictions will drive up growth? we'll hearfrom ben in a moment, but what of the politics of this and whether it will excite the electorate? nickjoins us from parliament. a significant week for migration but another tricky day for the pm? as you were saying, in the last hour or so, as you were saying, in the last hour orso, rishi sunak as you were saying, in the last hour or so, rishi sunak has feet the first commons defeat this government has faced on a whipped vote since the general election, so they lost by four votes after 23 conservative m ps by four votes after 23 conservative mps joined forces with the labour backbencher dame dianejohnson to set up a compensation body for victims of the infected blood scandal. that came after rishi sunak tried to regain the initiative on immigration. we will be seeing quite soon the home secretary, james cleverly, in kigali signing a new treaty with rwanda. that visit could

be happening as early as tomorrow for the i understand that will involve extra cost, extralegal support for rwanda wonderful trip i am told to practical cost, not run the same, this is the pride we demand to put our signature on this new treaty. so a big focus tomorrow on illegal migration but today the focus was on bringing down legal migration. an election looming and a prime minister struggling to make the political weather. time to move on an issue vexing his voters. migration to this country is far too high and needs to come down. fix, high and needs to come down. a five—point plan to cut legal migration by 300,000. first, reduce the number of family mothers accompanying care workers by raising the annual immigration health surcharge by 66%. raise the skilled

workers earning threshold to just under 39,000 from just over 26,000, to prevent the undercutting of british workers. health and care workers will be exempt. scrap the 20% salary discount forjobs where there are deemed to be a shortage of workers to dub only allow independence if overseas workers earn just under independence if overseas workers earnjust under 39,000, independence if overseas workers earnjust under39,000, up independence if overseas workers earn just under 39,000, up from nearly 19,000. and finally, review the graduate route to prevent abuse. this is the largest reduction on record. immigration policy must be fair, consistent, legal and sustainable.— fair, consistent, legal and sustainable. , ., , sustainable. the previous prime minister was — sustainable. the previous prime minister was accused _ sustainable. the previous prime minister was accused of - sustainable. the previous prime minister was accused of being . sustainable. the previous prime minister was accused of being a| minister was accused of being a shopping — minister was accused of being a shopping trolley, veering from one side to— shopping trolley, veering from one side to the — shopping trolley, veering from one side to the other. the current prime minister_ side to the other. the current prime minister is _ side to the other. the current prime minister is clearly veering but he certainly— minister is clearly veering but he certainly isn't steering he hasjust climbed _ certainly isn't steering he hasjust

climbed to— certainly isn't steering he hasjust climbed to someone else best trolley and is _ climbed to someone else best trolley and is being pushed around all over the place _ and is being pushed around all over the lace. ~ ., , ., the place. mixed reactions on both sides of the _ the place. mixed reactions on both sides of the tory _ the place. mixed reactions on both sides of the tory party. _ the place. mixed reactions on both sides of the tory party. it's - the place. mixed reactions on both sides of the tory party. it's a - sides of the tory party. it's a welcome _ sides of the tory party. it's a welcome and _ sides of the tory party. it's a welcome and positive - sides of the tory party. it's a l welcome and positive step i'm glad with some of the points the conservatives have been pushing were adopted by home secretary and i appreciate the outreach he has given to us as well as listening to the immigration minister.— to us as well as listening to the immigration minister. what is going on is there is— immigration minister. what is going on is there is an _ immigration minister. what is going on is there is an argument - immigration minister. what is going on is there is an argument between | on is there is an argument between the political ad line of take that control— the political ad line of take that control and dramatically reduce legat— control and dramatically reduce legal migration and the reality on the ground of what that means to people _ the ground of what that means to people who look after mum, people who look_ people who look after mum, people who look after dad when they are sick or— who look after dad when they are sick or diagnosed with dementia and have to _ sick or diagnosed with dementia and have to go _ sick or diagnosed with dementia and have to go into care for the really, it wiii— have to go into care for the really, it will depend on which one of those wins it will depend on which one of those wihs out _ it will depend on which one of those wihs out in — it will depend on which one of those wins out in constituencies up and down _ wins out in constituencies up and down the — wins out in constituencies up and down the country.— down the country. rishi sunak is havin: a

down the country. rishi sunak is having a very — down the country. rishi sunak is having a very difficult _ down the country. rishi sunak is having a very difficult end - down the country. rishi sunak is having a very difficult end to the j having a very difficult end to the effort up he was the change candidate at his party conference and the autumn statement finally cut taxes neither of those seemed to shift the dial so now he has opted for ideas to reduce legal migration, ideas that have been doing the rounds sometime stop the prime minister will hope that will do for him what immigration did for the vote leave campaign in the final phase of the brexit referendum. a pollster believes rishi sunak is running out of options. fine running out of options. one interpretation _ running out of options. one interpretation is _ running out of options. one interpretation is you're - running out of options. (we: interpretation is you're appealing to a silent majority but there is evidence to suggest that solid majority actually doesn't exist. another interpretation is your appealing to your base, giving them some red meat and emphasising the difference between conservative and labour on such an important issue for some people. a third interpretation is that the economy the most important issue by some distance and the government unable to make many inroads in that, they go to something else instead. as bon jovi thatjon bonjovi wants it, you look for a fight, well, that's all you've got.

look for a fight, well, that's all you've got-— look for a fight, well, that's all you've got. look for a fight, well, that's all ou've not. �* ., ., , you've got. are common to this the minister managing _ you've got. are common to this the minister managing his _ you've got. are common to this the minister managing his party - you've got. are common to this the minister managing his party and - minister managing his party and think the election. is minister managing his party and think the election.— minister managing his party and think the election. is the right of the -a think the election. is the right of the party and — think the election. is the right of the party and he _ think the election. is the right of the party and he was _ think the election. is the right of the party and he was under - think the election. is the right of- the party and he was under pressure to go further from them. he done that and i think these mps feel strongly on this issue. i strongly on this issue. i prime minister pondering _ strongly on this issue. i prime minister pondering his - strongly on this issue. i prime j minister pondering his options strongly on this issue. i prime i minister pondering his options at strongly on this issue. i prime - minister pondering his options at a prime minister hoping finally for a change in his fortunes. well, as you've heard from nick, today's announcement�*s a significant political moment but there's an important economic story behind these plans too. ben is here. what will it mean for the economy? business groups are not happy. they say it will be negative for growth. consider the minimum salary threshold for recruiting skilled workers from overseas. businesses accepted it needed to rise from £26,200, as it has not changed for two years — the blue line — while wages have risen quite a lot — the red line — but look where it's being raised

to — the green dot, £38,700. way above wage inflation. speaking of businesses are saying this will make it really difficult for them to fill really important gaps in the labour market. what about health and social care? health and social care workers are exempted from the higher salary threshold for visas. given what a large share of total visas granted in recent years have been social care visas, that's arguably understandable. yet the new restrictions on dependents of people with visas coming has caused alarm nonetheless that recruitment in health and social care will still be made more difficult. and look at total health and social care vacancies — still 179,000. what's the big picture? the home secretary, james cleverly, says net migration last year of 745,000 would have been 300,000 lower with these new

restrictions in place. many will see that as desirable. yet it's worth noting that the office for budget responsibility actually upgraded its uk growth forecasts on the back of higher than expected net migration in recent years. the economistjonathan portes has estimated that the 0br, as a result of higher immigration, now projects the total labour force to be around 1.5% larger, and gdp up by £40 billion and tax revenues up by £18 billion. now, the economic impact isn't the only consideration for a government of course and it should be noted that the government's own migration advisory committee recommended some of the measures, such as ending the 20%

"going rate" salary discount for shortage occupations. nevetheless, many business groups are calling for some honesty about the economic impacts of today's decisions and about trade—offs involved in curbing migration. and now we're joined by christina mcanea, general secretary of unison, the largest trade union in the care sector, richard tice, leader of the reform party and from parliament, brendan clarke—smith, a conservative mp and the party's deputy chairman. you have heard those figures. the care sector is increasingly under pressure and will continue to be so but the home secretary's statistics are clear, 110,000 care home workers from abroad with 120,000 dependents.

is that sustainable for any economy? is that sustainable for any economy? i think it depends on what they are coming in for i think it depends on what they are coming inforand i think it depends on what they are coming in for and whether the economy needs them or not and clearly this economy needs care workers to come in and health workers. 0ne workers to come in and health workers. one of the weight you attract them is by allowing them to bring independence. but attract them is by allowing them to bring independence.— bring independence. but if there dependents _ bring independence. but if there dependents are _ bring independence. but if there dependents are then, as - bring independence. but if there dependents are then, as it - bring independence. but if there| dependents are then, as it were, bring independence. but if there i dependents are then, as it were, a drain on the economy to health care, education, all these things, is that not a difficult trade—off? it education, all these things, is that not a difficult trade-off?— not a difficult trade-off? it could be but part _ not a difficult trade-off? it could be but part of— not a difficult trade-off? it could be but part of the _ not a difficult trade-off? it could be but part of the problem - not a difficult trade-off? it could be but part of the problem we i not a difficult trade-off? it could i be but part of the problem we have is there seems to be no impact assessment done. some of the language used byjames assessment done. some of the language used by james cleverly were things like, we envisage, i suspect. it was clear they had no real basis for this going forwards. they hadn't done any real research. there was no evidence base to see what this would mean for the it will stick your finger in the air and see what happens. finger in the air and see what ha ens, �*, finger in the air and see what ha ens. �*, ., finger in the air and see what hauens. �*, . . happens. let's look at scotland for

the there are _ happens. let's look at scotland for the there are fewer _ happens. let's look at scotland for the there are fewer immigrants - happens. let's look at scotland for the there are fewer immigrants in | the there are fewer immigrants in the there are fewer immigrants in the care sector because they are paid better, average pay differential is £900 a year. would you like to see higher salaries for care workers to offset that idea that there has to be immigrants to help? that there has to be immigrants to hel? ~ , , that there has to be immigrants to hel? , ., that there has to be immigrants to hel? ~ , ., ., that there has to be immigrants to help? absolutely to we would support the government _ help? absolutely to we would support the government are _ help? absolutely to we would support the government are saying, _ help? absolutely to we would support the government are saying, let's - the government are saying, let's grow our own care workers and support our own care workers the problem is, they have consistently underfunded care they have no strategy for care. boris johnson stood on the steps of downing street when he was elected and said, i have solved care, we have a ready—made plan for it i'm still waiting to see it. nothing has been produced by the tories for care for instead of going after the core problem, which is we have a care system which is cracking on its knees, not sustainable, they are going off to the people who provide that care. if are going off to the people who provide that care. ii to are going off to the people who provide that care.— provide that care. if to date not reform encouraged _ provide that care. if to date not reform encouraged more - provide that care. if to date not| reform encouraged more people into the care sector, domestically, would

you be happy with that? in the care sector, domestically, would you be happy with that?— you be happy with that? in what sense would _ you be happy with that? in what sense would penalising - you be happy with that? in what sense would penalising care - you be happy with that? in what - sense would penalising care workers, existing migrant care workers, would that encourage domestic labour to go in? the reason why they don't go in, it's probably a female work. most of the seller is minimum wage, they can earn more by going down to the local supermarket, £4 an hour more, and if you are a load cody walker, that's a lot of money for labour once net migration down to the— lot of money for labour once net migration down to the would you say that's a pursuit that _ migration down to the would you say that's a pursuit that is _ migration down to the would you say that's a pursuit that is laudable? - that's a pursuit that is laudable? not necessarily to dip we don't have a major problem with migration as an issue. people coming into essential jobs in our society for the what we would like to see is more support being given to people who come into this country to actually make and

invest in training, pay, to encourage domestic labour to take on certain roles. d0 encourage domestic labour to take on certain roles-— certain roles. do you accept that ublic certain roles. do you accept that public opinion — certain roles. do you accept that public opinion is _ certain roles. do you accept that public opinion is broadly - certain roles. do you accept that public opinion is broadly in - certain roles. do you accept that| public opinion is broadly in favour of reducing migration? it public opinion is broadly in favour of reducing migration? it probably is but that doesn't _ of reducing migration? it probably is but that doesn't necessarily - of reducing migration? it probably l is but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a good thing to dip like you, i'm scottish. it's a smaller country and smaller countries need migration to sustain their economy to dip the big worry about this, as i've said, is they've done no assessment. they didn't speak to anyone in the sector, they haven't spoken to the scottish or welsh government, they plucked this out of the air as a sop to the right wing of the party without thinking about the consequences for the country. let me put that to brendan clarke—smith, this is not about businesses not happy, the 0br are factoring in migration as it stands to add 40 billion to the economy and 18 billion to the tax revenues, this

is actually not about economics, it's about playing to what you think your voters want. this it's about playing to what you think your voters want.— your voters want. this is like brexit all— your voters want. this is like brexit all over _ your voters want. this is like brexit all over again, - your voters want. this is like | brexit all over again, isn't it, driving — brexit all over again, isn't it, driving down wages and you've just heard _ driving down wages and you've just heard from — driving down wages and you've just heard from a trade unionist, and they used — heard from a trade unionist, and they used to be the time that they would _ they used to be the time that they would defend british interests and workers. — would defend british interests and workers, talking about training locai— workers, talking about training local people and paying people more. it's local people and paying people more. it's not _ local people and paying people more. it's notiust_ local people and paying people more. it's notjust about bringing people in so _ it's notjust about bringing people in so everything is cheaper all the time _ in so everything is cheaper all the time as— in so everything is cheaper all the time. as you've said, whenever you bring _ time. as you've said, whenever you bring all— time. as you've said, whenever you bring all of— time. as you've said, whenever you bring all of these lower paid workers _ bring all of these lower paid workers over, if they bring dependence, they need to schools and health— dependence, they need to schools and health care _ dependence, they need to schools and health care and they may have eideriv — health care and they may have elderly dependents themselves so there is— elderly dependents themselves so there is a — elderly dependents themselves so there is a real cost with that migration— there is a real cost with that migration as well and of course we want _ migration as well and of course we want the _ migration as well and of course we want the brightest and the best, we want the brightest and the best, we want students to come here and study. _ want students to come here and study, that's another example of where _ study, that's another example of where the — study, that's another example of where the dependents visit we think has been abused. at the end of the day, it— has been abused. at the end of the day, it has— has been abused. at the end of the day, it has to be paid for. so has been abused. at the end of the day, it has to be paid for.— day, it has to be paid for. so you are 'ust day, it has to be paid for. so you are just disregarding _ day, it has to be paid for. so you are just disregarding the - day, it has to be paid for. so you are just disregarding the obr, . day, it has to be paid for. so you are just disregarding the obr, it| day, it has to be paid for. so you l are just disregarding the obr, it is arejust disregarding the 0br, it is what that may what they say? it’s what that may what they say? it's not disregarding, if you look at who is adding _ not disregarding, if you look at who is adding value to the economy, to those _ is adding value to the economy, to those skilled workers who are coming

in, those skilled workers who are coming in. the _ those skilled workers who are coming in, the students who are paying the fees coming and. talking about dependents and it they're not making some _ dependents and it they're not making some sort— dependents and it they're not making some sort of net gain here, there is a serious _ some sort of net gain here, there is a serious discussion to be had about the social— a serious discussion to be had about the social cost that comes with that as well _ the social cost that comes with that as well 0t— the social cost that comes with that as well. of course we want to grow the economy but at the same time, you cannot — the economy but at the same time, you cannot have completely unfettered immigration access without— unfettered immigration access without actually stopping, taking a look at _ without actually stopping, taking a look at it _ without actually stopping, taking a look at it and saying, 1.3 million peopie — look at it and saying, 1.3 million people over two years is too many. sueiia _ people over two years is too many. suella braverman said the announcement today is not going to be much to stop the critics from the right, the party has lost its way on immigration and what she says is this will not kick in until the spring of 2024 so it is, as it were, less than useless. i spring of 2024 so it is, as it were, less than useless.— less than useless. i think it would have been — less than useless. i think it would have been nice _ less than useless. i think it would have been nice perhaps, - less than useless. i think it would have been nice perhaps, looking. less than useless. i think it would l have been nice perhaps, looking at the statistics, we could have done this may— the statistics, we could have done this may be a year ago and we would be celebrating a cut but it's difficult _ be celebrating a cut but it's difficult to look at data over a trend — difficult to look at data over a trend for— difficult to look at data over a trend forjust one year. for e>

add a _ thousands, and you could pretty much add a big zero on the end of that so the time _ add a big zero on the end of that so the time you need to assess, you need _ the time you need to assess, you need to— the time you need to assess, you need to see — the time you need to assess, you need to see the actual needs of your economy, _ need to see the actual needs of your economy, and we are taking action. we estimate around 300,000 less peopie _ we estimate around 300,000 less people will come next year, that is almost _ people will come next year, that is almost cutting net migration in half almost cutting net migration in half a point _ almost cutting net migration in half a point i _ almost cutting net migration in half a point i would say that is quite ambitious _ a point i would say that is quite ambitious-— a point i would say that is quite ambitious, ,':ifi :: i: i: i: , ., , ambitious. 300,000 fewer people cominu ambitious. 300,000 fewer people coming next _ ambitious. 300,000 fewer people coming next year, _ ambitious. 300,000 fewer people coming next year, you _ ambitious. 300,000 fewer people coming next year, you want - ambitious. 300,000 fewer people coming next year, you want to - ambitious. 300,000 fewer people | coming next year, you want to grow the economy, you're going to reduce the economy, you're going to reduce the restricted employment lists so you will take off engineers, you will take off construction workers, may you take ofjoiners, welders. these are people clearly that we do not have burnished and ready to go right now so that will have an impact on growth and it will have an impact on growth and it will have an impact on growth and it will have an impact on the economy.— impact on the economy. these “obs are impact on the economy. these “obs actually — impact on the economy. these “obs actually allfi impact on the economy. these “obs are actually all come i impact on the economy. these “obs are actually all come pretty h impact on the economy. these jobs are actually all come pretty good i are actually all come pretty good salaries — are actually all come pretty good salaries nowadays, i would say. why are british salaries nowadays, i would say. rluug' are british people salaries nowadays, i would say. l’lruy are british people not banging the door to take them then? this are british people not banging the door to take them then?— are british people not banging the door to take them then? this is the loint and door to take them then? this is the point and we _ door to take them then? this is the point and we have _ door to take them then? this is the point and we have far _ door to take them then? this is the point and we have far too _ door to take them then? this is the point and we have far too many - point and we have far too many peopie — point and we have far too many peopie in— point and we have far too many people in this country economically inactive _ people in this country economically inactive at— people in this country economically inactive at one end of the market

but we _ inactive at one end of the market but we also... inactive at one end of the market but we also- - -_ inactive at one end of the market but we also... maybe you don't have the rilht but we also... maybe you don't have the right training _ but we also... maybe you don't have the right training for _ but we also... maybe you don't have the right training for welders - but we also... maybe you don't have the right training for welders and - the right training for welders and engineers and joiners and carpenters, isn't that the problem? that we don't have the right fit to grow our economy? this that we don't have the right fit to grow our economy?— that we don't have the right fit to grow our economy? this is why we have -ut grow our economy? this is why we have put so _ grow our economy? this is why we have put so much _ grow our economy? this is why we have put so much money - grow our economy? this is why we have put so much money into - have put so much money into apprenticeships, why we are looking at things— apprenticeships, why we are looking at things such as the t levels we brought— at things such as the t levels we brought in— at things such as the t levels we brought in and it is of course tony blair— brought in and it is of course tony blair wanted to send everybody to university — blair wanted to send everybody to university and the downside of that, it had _ university and the downside of that, it had serious structural issues for our economy. we have gone about fixing _ our economy. we have gone about fixing that — our economy. we have gone about fixing that and we actually want a sustainable economy that this does not rely— sustainable economy that this does not rely on — sustainable economy that this does not rely on cheap labour from abroad all the _ not rely on cheap labour from abroad all the time — not rely on cheap labour from abroad all the time-— all the time. thank you very much indeed. i all the time. thank you very much indeed- i am _ all the time. thank you very much indeed. i amjoined _ all the time. thank you very much indeed. i amjoined now— all the time. thank you very much indeed. i am joined now by - all the time. thank you very much | indeed. i am joined now by richard tice, good evening. if the new conservative group is saying that common sense has prevailed, then tory mps are content and james cleverly shot your fox. is a tory mps are content and james cleverly shot your fox. is a mass immigration _ cleverly shot your fox. is a mass immigration crisis _ cleverly shot your fox. is a mass immigration crisis of _ cleverly shot your fox. is a mass immigration crisis of the - cleverly shot your fox. is a mass immigration crisis of the tory - immigration crisis of the tory partv's — immigration crisis of the tory party's own— immigration crisis of the tory party's own making, - immigration crisis of the tory party's own making, they- immigration crisis of the tory - party's own making, they promise to take back— party's own making, they promise to take back control— party's own making, they promise to take back control of the _ party's own making, they promise to take back control of the borders - party's own making, they promise to take back control of the borders and | take back control of the borders and to reduce _ take back control of the borders and to reduce immigration— take back control of the borders and to reduce immigration in— take back control of the borders and to reduce immigration in the - take back control of the borders and to reduce immigration in the last. to reduce immigration in the last manifesto — to reduce immigration in the last manifesto. they— to reduce immigration in the last manifesto. they have _

to reduce immigration in the last manifesto. they have betrayed i to reduce immigration in the last i manifesto. they have betrayed the peopie _ manifesto. they have betrayed the peopie who — manifesto. they have betrayed the peopie who voted _ manifesto. they have betrayed the people who voted for _ manifesto. they have betrayed the people who voted for them - manifesto. they have betrayed the people who voted for them and - manifesto. they have betrayed the | people who voted for them and that is why— people who voted for them and that is why so— people who voted for them and that is why so many— people who voted for them and that is why so many more _ people who voted for them and that is why so many more people - people who voted for them and that is why so many more people are - is why so many more people are starting — is why so many more people are starting to— is why so many more people are starting to say— is why so many more people are starting to say they _ is why so many more people are starting to say they will - is why so many more people are starting to say they will vote - is why so many more people are starting to say they will vote for| starting to say they will vote for the reform _ starting to say they will vote for the reform party. _ starting to say they will vote for the reform party. but - starting to say they will vote for the reform party. but this- starting to say they will vote for the reform party. but this is. starting to say they will vote for| the reform party. but this is the point, _ the reform party. but this is the point, the — the reform party. but this is the point, the proposal— the reform party. but this is the point, the proposal so— the reform party. but this is the point, the proposal so they - the reform party. but this is the point, the proposal so they will. the reform party. but this is the i point, the proposal so they will not come _ point, the proposal so they will not come into— point, the proposal so they will not come into force _ point, the proposal so they will not come into force until— point, the proposal so they will not come into force until next - point, the proposal so they will not come into force until next spring. l come into force until next spring. that— come into force until next spring. that means — come into force until next spring. that means there _ come into force until next spring. that means there will— come into force until next spring. that means there will be - come into force until next spring. that means there will be a - come into force until next spring. that means there will be a surgel come into force until next spring. i that means there will be a surge of immigration — that means there will be a surge of immigration between _ that means there will be a surge of immigration between now- that means there will be a surge of immigration between now and - that means there will be a surge of immigration between now and then that means there will be a surge of- immigration between now and then but also, took— immigration between now and then but also, took back— immigration between now and then but also, look back at _ immigration between now and then but also, look back at the _ immigration between now and then but also, look back at the 905, _ immigration between now and then but also, look back at the 905, when - immigration between now and then but also, look back at the 905, when we i also, look back at the 905, when we did not— also, look back at the 905, when we did not have — also, look back at the 905, when we did not have ma55 _ also, look back at the 905, when we did not have ma55 immigration, i also, look back at the 905, when we did not have ma55 immigration, wel did not have ma55 immigration, we had net _ did not have ma55 immigration, we had net immigration _ did not have ma55 immigration, we had net immigration of— did not have ma55 immigration, we had net immigration of about- did not have ma55 immigration, we i had net immigration of about 100,000 per year— had net immigration of about 100,000 per year and _ had net immigration of about 100,000 pervearand reat— had net immigration of about 100,000 per year and real wage _ had net immigration of about 100,000 per year and real wage growth - had net immigration of about 100,000 per year and real wage growth of- per year and real wage growth of about— per year and real wage growth of about 2~8%— per year and real wage growth of about 28% per— per year and real wage growth of about 2.8% per annum, - per year and real wage growth of about 2.8% per annum, we i per year and real wage growth of about 2.8% per annum, we did i per year and real wage growth of. about 2.8% per annum, we did not have _ about 2.8% per annum, we did not have a— about 2.8% per annum, we did not have a health _ about 2.8% per annum, we did not have a health and _ about 2.8% per annum, we did not have a health and social— about 2.8% per annum, we did not have a health and social crisis... i have a health and social cri5i5... we are _ have a health and social cri5i5... we are an — have a health and social cri5i5... we are an ageing _ have a health and social cri5i5... we are an ageing population, i have a health and social cri5i5...| we are an ageing population, we have a health and social crisis... i we are an ageing population, we have a lot of problems we didn't have 20 years ago. a lot of problems we didn't have 20 ears alo. ., , , a lot of problems we didn't have 20 ears alo. ., , h. years ago. that is why you need hi . her years ago. that is why you need higher wages — years ago. that is why you need higher wages and _ years ago. that is why you need higher wages and to _ years ago. that is why you need higher wages and to train i years ago. that is why you need higher wages and to train our i years ago. that is why you need l higher wages and to train our own peopie _ higher wages and to train our own peopie to — higher wages and to train our own peopie to get _ higher wages and to train our own people to get people _ higher wages and to train our own people to get people back - higher wages and to train our own people to get people back into i higher wages and to train our own i people to get people back into work. christine _ people to get people back into work. christine is _ people to get people back into work. chri5tine is right, _ people to get people back into work. chri5tine is right, the _ people to get people back into work. chri5tine is right, the domestic- chri5tine is right, the domestic wages — chri5tine is right, the domestic wages are _ chri5tine is right, the domestic wages are way— chri5tine is right, the domestic wages are way too _ chri5tine is right, the domestic wages are way too low- chri5tine is right, the domesticj wages are way too low because chri5tine is right, the domestic- wages are way too low because we have imported _ wages are way too low because we have imported cheap, _ wages are way too low because we have imported cheap, low- wages are way too low because we have imported cheap, low 5killed i have imported cheap, low 5killed overseas — have imported cheap, low 5killed over5ea5 labour— have imported cheap, low 5killed over5ea5 labour for— have imported cheap, low 5killed over5ea5 labour for far _ have imported cheap, low 5killed| over5ea5 labour for far too long... let's _ over5ea5 labour for far too long... let's be _ over5ea5 labour for far too long... let's be quite _ over5ea5 labour for far too long... let's be quite clear... _ over5ea5 labour for far too long... let's be quite clear... leil- overseas labour for far too long... let's be quite clear. . ._ let's be quite clear... let me finish on _ let's be quite clear... let me finish on the _ let's be quite clear... let me finish on the obr, _ let's be quite clear... let me finish on the obr, the i let's be quite clear... let me finish on the obr, the obr | let's be quite clear... let me i finish on the obr, the obr said in finish on the 0br, the 0br said in the autumn — finish on the 0br, the 0br said in the autumn statement _ finish on the 0br, the 0br said in the autumn statement paper- finish on the 0br, the 0br said in the autumn statement paperju5t| finish on the 0br, the 0br 5aid inl the autumn statement paperju5t a couple _ the autumn statement paperju5t a couple of— the autumn statement paperju5t a couple of weeks _ the autumn statement paperju5t a couple of weeks ago, _ the autumn statement paperju5t a couple of weeks ago, that - the autumn statement paperju5t a couple of weeks ago, that zero i couple of weeks ago, that zero growth — couple of weeks ago, that zero growth and _ couple of weeks ago, that zero growth and because _ couple of weeks ago, that zero growth and because of- couple of weeks ago, that zero growth and because of mass i growth and because of mass immigration. _ growth and because of mass immigration, gdp— growth and because of mass immigration, gdp per- growth and because of mass immigration, gdp per headl growth and because of mass i immigration, gdp per head would growth and because of mass - immigration, gdp per head would be falling _ immigration, gdp per head would be falling by— immigration, gdp per head would be falling by record _ immigration, gdp per head would be falling by record levels _ immigration, gdp per head would be falling by record levels which - falling by record levels which proves — falling by record levels which proves mv _ falling by record levels which proves my point, _ falling by record levels which proves my point, you - falling by record levels which proves my point, you have i falling by record levels which i prove5 my point, you have got to

focus _ prove5 my point, you have got to focus on — prove5 my point, you have got to focus on your— prove5 my point, you have got to focus on your domestic _ focus on your domestic population can stop _ focus on your domestic population can stop importing _ focus on your domestic population can stop importing cheap- focus on your domestic population| can stop importing cheap over5ea5 labour _ can stop importing cheap overseas labour. ., ., ,, , ., labour. you were talking up the idea of defections — labour. you were talking up the idea of defections from _ labour. you were talking up the idea of defections from the _ labour. you were talking up the idea of defections from the reform i labour. you were talking up the idea | of defections from the reform party, before that but will we cne as a result of this question let's wait and see, i will not give a running commentary... it'sjustan and see, i will not give a running commentary... it'sjust an idea. the commentary... it's 'ust an idea. the loint is commentary... it's 'ust an idea. the point is there — commentary... it'5ju5t an idea. the point is there are many tory mp5 are furious _ point is there are many tory mp5 are furious that — point is there are many tory mp5 are furiou5 that this _ point is there are many tory mp5 are furiou5 that this government - point is there are many tory mp5 are furiou5 that this government have i furiou5 that this government have deliberately— furiou5 that this government have deliberately enabled _ furiou5 that this government have deliberately enabled policie5 i furiou5 that this government have deliberately enabled policie5 that| deliberately enabled policies that have led — deliberately enabled policies that have led to — deliberately enabled policies that have led to mass _ deliberately enabled policies that have led to mass immigration. i deliberately enabled policies that i have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million _ have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million people _ have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million people in— have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million people in one _ have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million people in one year. - have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million people in one year. a i have led to mass immigration. 1.25 million people in one year. a city. million people in one year. a city the size — million people in one year. a city the size of— million people in one year. a city the size of birmingham _ million people in one year. a city the size of birmingham last i million people in one year. a city| the size of birmingham last year, this the 5ize of birmingham last year, this year— the size of birmingham last year, this year and _ the size of birmingham last year, this year and it _ the size of birmingham last year, this year and it will _ the size of birmingham last year, this year and it will be _ the size of birmingham last year, this year and it will be the - the size of birmingham last year, this year and it will be the same i this year and it will be the same next _ this year and it will be the same next year — this year and it will be the same next year we _ this year and it will be the same next year. we have _ this year and it will be the same next year. we have a _ this year and it will be the same next year. we have a record i this year and it will be the same i next year. we have a record number, 5.2 next year. we have a record number, 52 million _ next year. we have a record number, 52 million of— next year. we have a record number, 5.2 million of our— next year. we have a record number, 5.2 million of our own _ next year. we have a record number, 5.2 million of our own people, - next year. we have a record number, 5.2 million of our own people, young| 5.2 million of our own people, young people _ 5.2 million of our own people, young people on— 5.2 million of our own people, young people on out— 5.2 million of our own people, young people on out of— 5.2 million of our own people, young people on out of work— 5.2 million of our own people, young people on out of work benefit. i 5.2 million of our own people, young people on out of work benefit. that i people on out of work benefit. that is shameful— people on out of work benefit. that is shameful and _ people on out of work benefit. that is shameful and a _ people on out of work benefit. that is shameful and a disgrace - people on out of work benefit. that is shameful and a disgrace and - people on out of work benefit. that is shameful and a disgrace and we i is shameful and a disgrace and we need _ is shameful and a disgrace and we need to— is shameful and a disgrace and we need to train — is shameful and a disgrace and we need to train and _ is shameful and a disgrace and we need to train and make _ is shameful and a disgrace and we need to train and make work - is shameful and a disgrace and we need to train and make work pay i is shameful and a disgrace and we l need to train and make work pay for our own_ need to train and make work pay for our own people _ need to train and make work pay for our own pe0ple to— need to train and make work pay for our own people to get _ need to train and make work pay for our own people to get them - need to train and make work pay for our own people to get them back i need to train and make work pay for. our own people to get them back into work _ our own people to get them back into work rather— our own people to get them back into work. rather than _ our own people to get them back into work. rather than importing - our own people to get them back into work. rather than importing cheap. work. rather than importing cheap overseas _ work. rather than importing cheap overseas labour— work. rather than importing cheap overseas labour and _ work. rather than importing cheap overseas labour and relying - work. rather than importing cheap overseas labour and relying on - work. rather than importing cheap| overseas labour and relying on that point _ overseas labour and relying on that point and _ overseas labour and relying on that point and for — overseas labour and relying on that point and for businesses, - overseas labour and relying on that point and for businesses, for- overseas labour and relying on that point and for businesses, for of - overseas labour and relying on that point and for businesses, for of bigi point and for businesses, for of big business _ point and for businesses, for of big business to— point and for businesses, for of big business to say— point and for businesses, for of big business to say this _ point and for businesses, for of big business to say this is _ point and for businesses, for of big business to say this is a _ point and for businesses, for of big business to say this is a negative . business to say this is a negative rather— business to say this is a negative rather than — business to say this is a negative rather than looking _ business to say this is a negative rather than looking up— business to say this is a negative rather than looking up their- business to say this is a negative rather than looking up their own| rather than looking up their own people — rather than looking up their own pebble is— rather than looking up their own people is shameful. _ rather than looking up their own people is shameful. you- rather than looking up their own people is shameful.— rather than looking up their own people is shameful. you talk about ounu people is shameful. you talk about young peeple _ people is shameful. you talk about young peeple out _

people is shameful. you talk about young people out of _ people is shameful. you talk about young people out of work - people is shameful. you talk about young people out of work but - people is shameful. you talk about young people out of work but you | young people out of work but you have an issue we can'tjust turn the tap off because we don't have the skills. ~ ., . , , skills. we do, we have plenty peeple...- — skills. we do, we have plenty people,... engineers - skills. we do, we have plenty people,... engineers are - skills. we do, we have plentyi people,... engineers are very skills. we do, we have plenty - people,... engineers are very well paid people,... engineers are very well peid but— people,... engineers are very well peid but we — people,... engineers are very well paid but we have _ people,... engineers are very well paid but we have to _ people,... engineers are very well paid but we have to train - people,... engineers are very well paid but we have to train our- people,... engineers are very well paid but we have to train our own, we have _ paid but we have to train our own, we have so— paid but we have to train our own, we have so many— paid but we have to train our own, we have so many domestic- paid but we have to train our own, we have so many domestic peoplei paid but we have to train our own, i we have so many domestic people of popuiation. — we have so many domestic people of popuiation. we — we have so many domestic people of population, we should _ we have so many domestic people of population, we should be _ we have so many domestic people of population, we should be training. population, we should be training our own— population, we should be training our own peopie _ population, we should be training our own people in _ population, we should be training our own people in the _ population, we should be training our own people in the right- population, we should be training our own people in the right skills| our own people in the right skills with the — our own people in the right skills with the right _ our own people in the right skills with the right apprenticeships . with the right apprenticeships scheme — with the right apprenticeships scheme is _ with the right apprenticeships scheme is open _ with the right apprenticeships scheme is open it— with the right apprenticeships scheme is open it but- with the right apprenticeships scheme is open it but for- with the right apprenticeships scheme is open it but for tool with the right apprenticeships - scheme is open it but for too many people. _ scheme is open it but for too many peppte. work— scheme is open it but for too many people. work no— scheme is open it but for too many people, work no longer— scheme is open it but for too many people, work no longer pays - scheme is open it but for too many. people, work no longer pays because we have _ people, work no longer pays because we have become _ people, work no longer pays because we have become utterly— people, work no longer pays because we have become utterly addicted - people, work no longer pays because we have become utterly addicted to i we have become utterly addicted to the drug _ we have become utterly addicted to the drug of— we have become utterly addicted to the drug of cheap, _ we have become utterly addicted to the drug of cheap, low— we have become utterly addicted to the drug of cheap, low skilled, - the drug of cheap, low skilled, oversees — the drug of cheap, low skilled, overseas labour— the drug of cheap, low skilled, overseas labour and _ the drug of cheap, low skilled, overseas labour and its - the drug of cheap, low skilled, overseas labour and its time i overseas labour and its time it stopped — overseas labour and its time it sto ed. overseas labour and its time it stoned. , , , stopped. some people might see this as a shift by the _ stopped. some people might see this as a shift by the party _ stopped. some people might see this as a shift by the party to _ stopped. some people might see this as a shift by the party to the - as a shift by the party to the right. immigration... abs, as a shift by the party to the right. immigration...- as a shift by the party to the right. immigration... a shift to common sense. _ right. immigration... a shift to common sense. are _ right. immigration... a shift to common sense. are you - right. immigration... a shift to common sense. are you still . common sense. are you still guaranteeing _ common sense. are you still guaranteeing that _ common sense. are you still guaranteeing that you - common sense. are you still guaranteeing that you will i common sense. are you still. guaranteeing that you will not common sense. are you still - guaranteeing that you will not do a deal with the conservatives questioning absolutely guaranteeing up questioning absolutely guaranteeing up and i look you straight in the eyes, iio%, no deals but we did that last time, frankly we still have the scars on my back. the last time, frankly we still have the scars on my back.— last time, frankly we still have the scars on my back. the british people want some common _ scars on my back. the british people want some common sense and - scars on my back. the british people want some common sense and that| scars on my back. the british peoplel want some common sense and that is what we _ want some common sense and that is what we are _ want some common sense and that is what we are going _ want some common sense and that is what we are going for. _

want some common sense and that is what we are going for. 630 _ want some common sense and that is what we are going for. 630 seats - want some common sense and that is what we are going for. 630 seats in l what we are going for. 630 seats in england. _ what we are going for. 630 seats in england, scotland _ what we are going for. 630 seats in england, scotland and _ what we are going for. 630 seats in england, scotland and wales, - what we are going for. 630 seats in england, scotland and wales, not i england, scotland and wales, not northern ireland, _ england, scotland and wales, not northern ireland, absolutely. - england, scotland and wales, not northern ireland, absolutely. youi northern ireland, absolutely. you will be noticing _ northern ireland, absolutely. will be noticing that it nudges northern ireland, absolutely.” will be noticing that it nudges has a profile you would die for right now and getting bigger.- a profile you would die for right now and getting bigger. i don't like snakes! there are _ now and getting bigger. i don't like snakes! there are lots _ now and getting bigger. i don't like snakes! there are lots of— now and getting bigger. i don't like snakes! there are lots of snakes i now and getting bigger. i don't like snakes! there are lots of snakes in | snakes! there are lots of snakes in olitics! snakes! there are lots of snakes in politics! wouldn't _ snakes! there are lots of snakes in politics! wouldn't you _ snakes! there are lots of snakes in politics! wouldn't you be _ snakes! there are lots of snakes in politics! wouldn't you be in - snakes! there are lots of snakes in politics! wouldn't you be in a - politics! wouldn't you be in a better position if he was your figurehead? i better position if he was your figurehead?_ better position if he was your figurehead? better position if he was your fiaurehead? . ., ,. figurehead? i have often said when --eole ask figurehead? i have often said when peeple ask me _ figurehead? i have often said when people ask me exactly _ figurehead? i have often said when people ask me exactly that - figurehead? i have often said when l people ask me exactly that question, the more _ people ask me exactly that question, the more help— people ask me exactly that question, the more help that _ people ask me exactly that question, the more help that people, _ people ask me exactly that question, the more help that people, the - people ask me exactly that question, the more help that people, the morei the more help that people, the more shoulder— the more help that people, the more shoulder that— the more help that people, the more shoulder that is— the more help that people, the more shoulder that is put— the more help that people, the more shoulder that is put to _ the more help that people, the more shoulder that is put to the _ the more help that people, the more shoulder that is put to the wheel, . shoulder that is put to the wheel, and if— shoulder that is put to the wheel, and if nigel— shoulder that is put to the wheel, and if nigel decides _ shoulder that is put to the wheel, and if nigel decides to _ shoulder that is put to the wheel, and if nigel decides to come - shoulder that is put to the wheel, and if nigel decides to come backi and if nigel decides to come back into politics. _ and if nigel decides to come back into politics, fantastic. _ and if nigel decides to come back into politics, fantastic. i- and if nigel decides to come back into politics, fantastic. i rather. into politics, fantastic. i rather like the — into politics, fantastic. i rather like the idea _ into politics, fantastic. i rather like the idea is— into politics, fantastic. i rather like the idea is it _ into politics, fantastic. i rather like the idea is it at _ into politics, fantastic. i rather like the idea is it at the - into politics, fantastic. i rather like the idea is it at the other. like the idea is it at the other day. — like the idea is it at the other day. maybe _ like the idea is it at the other day. maybe we _ like the idea is it at the other day, maybe we could - like the idea is it at the other day, maybe we could have i like the idea is it at the other- day, maybe we could have president of a rush— day, maybe we could have president of a rush alongside _ day, maybe we could have president of a rush alongside president - day, maybe we could have president| of a rush alongside president trump! we have _ of a rush alongside president trump! we have to _ of a rush alongside president trump! we have to focus _ of a rush alongside president trump! we have to focus on _ of a rush alongside president trump! we have to focus on the _ of a rush alongside president trump! we have to focus on the growth and i we have to focus on the growth and opportunity~ — we have to focus on the growth and opportunity. "— we have to focus on the growth and opportunity-— we have to focus on the growth and o- ortuni . . . . . opportunity. -- president farage. so ou would opportunity. -- president farage. so you would welcome _ opportunity. -- president farage. so you would welcome him? _ opportunity. -- president farage. so you would welcome him? i _ opportunity. -- president farage. so you would welcome him? i have - opportunity. -- president farage. so i you would welcome him? i have always said i would welcome _ you would welcome him? i have always said i would welcome all— you would welcome him? i have always said i would welcome all the _ you would welcome him? i have always said i would welcome all the help - said i would welcome all the help and night will— said i would welcome all the help and night will be _ said i would welcome all the help and night will be fantastic - said i would welcome all the help and night will be fantastic help. l and night will be fantastic help. all the — and night will be fantastic help. all the help _ and night will be fantastic help. all the help of— and night will be fantastic help. all the help of possible. - and night will be fantastic help. all the help of possible. we - and night will be fantastic help. i all the help of possible. we focus on action, — all the help of possible. we focus on action, not— all the help of possible. we focus on action, not titles. _ all the help of possible. we focus on action, not titles.— on action, not titles. thank you very much _ on action, not titles. thank you very much indeed _ on action, not titles. thank you very much indeed to _ on action, not titles. thank you very much indeed to you - on action, not titles. thank you very much indeed to you all. i the government's been defeated in a knife edge vote tonight, with two dozen tory rebels voting

foran amendmentaiming to speed up and expand compensation for those impacted by the infected blood scandal. mps voted 246 to 242 — a majority ofjust four — in favour of establishing a new body to help compensate the victims. there have been reports that the total amount of compensation paid out could ultimately reach £20 billion. up to 30,000 people were given contaminated blood products in the 19705 and �*805. thousands have died. justine gordon smith's father, peter, who had haemophilia, found out in 1994 that he had been infected with hepatitis c. he passed away in 2018. justinejoins us now from edinburgh. thank you very much indeed for joining us tonight. you havejust heard the news so can you give me your first reaction, heard the news so can you give me yourfirst reaction, please? i am your first reaction, please? i am stunned. your first reaction, please? i am stunned- l— your first reaction, please? i am stunned. i am _ your first reaction, please? i am stunned. i am stunned - your first reaction, please? i am stunned. i am stunned but- your first reaction, please? i am stunned. i am stunned but i - your first reaction, please? l—n stunned. i am stunned but i think it is parliamentary democracy working.

that is when parliament works, isn't it, when the rights of the people speak. it it, when the rights of the people seak. . , ., it, when the rights of the people seak. . i. . . it, when the rights of the people seak. ., y., ., ., ., 4' speak. it all -- you have all worked ve hard speak. it all -- you have all worked very hard for— speak. it all -- you have all worked very hard for this, _ speak. it all -- you have all worked very hard for this, and _ very hard for this, and obviously you worked to try to convince people but i wonder what this means for the whole community but i will talk about your personal circumstances but all the people who have campaigned for so long, what will the difference to their well—being that tonight's news make? it the difference to their well-being that tonight's news make? it remains to be seen- — that tonight's news make? it remains to be seen- we _ that tonight's news make? it remains to be seen. we must _ that tonight's news make? it remains to be seen. we must give _ that tonight's news make? it remains to be seen. we must give great - to be seen. we must give great praise to damejoe diana johnson and all the other mp5 who stood by her in that way and the labour front bench but i think it will need different things to different people because obviously so many have died. they have left loved ones behind. and then there are those who are near death now. i mean, you know, it willjust mean different things to different people but it is one step further. i am just concerned what

the government might try to do to limit things now.— the government might try to do to limit things now. let me ask you a bit about your _ limit things now. let me ask you a bit about your own _ limit things now. let me ask you a bit about your own circumstance . bit about your own circumstance because your father randolph peter found out that he had been infected with hepatitis c in1991r found out that he had been infected with hepatitis c in 1994 and he died in 2018. for all that time, you and your sisters are looked after your father so how difficult a time was it for both you and your sisters but obviously for your father as well? it was awful for dad. he was just... such a vital and just a capable person. he was a musician, he ran concerts, gigs, platform jazz, or that kind of thing, such a vital man. and when he was infected, he lost everything, his home, hisjob, his wife, his health, everything, and he became a recluse. he withdrew from us. i remember once having to

cancel a holiday because my dad was homeless. he lost an inheritance of about 271,000 because he was not well enough to manage his finances. it was just devastating. and well enough to manage his finances. it was just devastating.— it wasjust devastating. and it obviously impacted _ it wasjust devastating. and it obviously impacted you - it wasjust devastating. and it obviously impacted you in - it was just devastating. and it i obviously impacted you in terms it was just devastating. and it - obviously impacted you in terms of what you could do with your lives? absolutely, absolutely. it impacted myself and all my sisters in different ways. in my own case, i had, i lived in london, i had to come up and then we had to step in and take care of him. we got absolutely no support or anything. the thing is, because the infected blood inquiry started in 2017, there was no infrastructure in place for care, nothing, you werejust abundant to manage. and my dad also had undiagnosed non—treated diabetic and sloppy which is a disease that affects the liver so the more

opiates you pumped into him, the circuit you got and it was like watching a parent being tortured to death and it took every ounce of courage i had to. —— the sicker it got up and the government says it wants to help victims and makes your compensation is that when the report comes back, and it is £20 billion which is a substantial sum of money. i wonderfrom your which is a substantial sum of money. i wonder from your point of view, is it really about the recognition of what you all went through as much as the compensation? first what you all went through as much as the compensation?— the compensation? first of all, i don't believe _ the compensation? first of all, i don't believe it _ the compensation? first of all, i don't believe it is _ the compensation? first of all, i don't believe it is £20 _ the compensation? first of all, i don't believe it is £20 billion. i the compensation? first of all, i l don't believe it is £20 billion. the inquiry sat in front of rishi sunak and jeremy hunt and pointed out that we are talking about 6000 families so it is probably not going to be anything like that amount of money. the second thing is that it's not just about recognition, it is about actually repairing the damage that is done to your life. the huge hole that, the entire career, everything

that, the entire career, everything that i would add a loss, that is the big issue and then there is all the time, years of life we have lost. we had to care for our dad 24/7, he tried to kill himself twice. that was awful. it was very traumatic and then there is the trauma from having gone through all that. it's not something you can easilyjust get back. at least with some compensation, you might be able to start rebuilding your life. we are the ones that have paid the price for what the government did. thank ou so for what the government did. thank you so much — for what the government did. thank you so much for— for what the government did. thank you so much forjoining _ for what the government did. thank you so much forjoining us, - for what the government did. thank you so much forjoining us, justine gordon—smith. as south gaza faced further bombardment today, israel says it has hit more than 200 "terror targets" and is hitting hamas command centres, but airstrikes have killed and wounded dozens of palestinians, including in areas where israel had directed people to seek shelter, according to journalists on the ground. the us state department has been increasingly critical of civilian deaths but say it's too early to make a definitive assessment of whether or not israel was heeding calls to protect civilians

in its renewed military operations. the us secretary of defence, lloyd austin, said, "in this kind of a fight, the centre of gravity is the civilian population. and if you drive them into the arms of the enemy, you replace a tactical victory with a strategic defeat." in a moment, we'll be speaking to two new friends from across the political divide, both of whom have been bereaved in the decades—old conflict, about the desperate need for moderate vices to be heard rather than hate—filled extremism, but first, here's mark. the ground thrust into khan younis is taking the israeli military into more dangerous territory, both with regard to displaced civilians and in its relationship with its most powerful ally. israel has warned people to move out of certain areas in the south, with a complex map suggesting where it might be safer. america says that shows it is having an influence over israel's tactics.

it is very rare for a modern military to take those kinds of steps, basically telegraphing their punches before they actually conduct operations. so i think they are listening, i think they are receptive. of course, saying in advance where you will be warns hamas as well. so, in order to protect its soldiers, the israeli defence forces are still using a great deal of force. this is their footage, but that is something, along with the continuation of the campaign more widely, that the israeli public strongly supports. the israeli army and the israeli prime minister, benjamin netanyahu, feel that they have promised the nation that they will deal a serious blow to the military infrastructure and decapitate the leadership so they are trying to prove also to the israeli public that they are doing all they can

to take the most lethal hamas brigades out of operation. and while the bombing and loss of life continues, many in the region look to america and other western powers to rein in israel and end the conflict. translation: on one side i there are 121 countries that say stop the war and no more bloodshed. and on the other side there are three to five countries that give carte blanche to israel's attacks. there is a global mechanism that takes action only when these three to five countries give the 0k. as for how long it will go on, that is one of several points of tension with the americans. prime minister netanyahu has said up to one year. the americans want it over much sooner. israel has indicated it could use aid as a pressure point, having briefly stopped deliveries after the ceasefire ended. america says it should

not be conditional. and while israel has also said it might carve a security zone out of the territory of the strip, america is squarely against that. if the us puts pressure on israel, will they bow to it? my understanding is _ the united states has given around two weeks for this operation, in private, to take place. - two weeks isn't a very long time and the civilian toll _ to the palestinians is massive. israel may claim that they had achieved the military goal- and that it is not because of us i pressure but ultimately, if the us puts their foot down saying, we are going to stop giving i you military aid if the war| doesn't stop by this date, israel really doesn't have a choice — they need to wrap up. - at the weekend, thousands joined relatives of hostages calling for their return. it is a reminder of domestic reasons why this cannot go on indefinitely. in the quest to get them back,

the conversation will eventually turn to further exchanges with hamas and how much of a victory against that group will have to be good enough for israel's leaders. let's speak now to magen inon and hamza awawde, who grew up on opposite sides of the israeli—palestinian conflict but last night met for the first time to host a vigil outside downing street. thank you both very much forjoining us. hamza, you left ramallah the day after the attack.— us. hamza, you left ramallah the day after the attack._ i i after the attack. what happened? i saw the news- _ after the attack. what happened? i saw the news. i— after the attack. what happened? i saw the news. i knew _ after the attack. what happened? i saw the news. i knew what - after the attack. what happened? i l saw the news. i knew what happened was really huge. i lived all my life in conflict and to know the consequences of every situation and this situation is unprecedented, so i had to make a choice. if it was up to me, i would have stayed, if it was only made the trip this was a time when i and volunteer to drop

but i have a six—year—old son and i think it's about him. sol but i have a six—year—old son and i think it's about him. so i went to italy. think it's about him. so i went to ital . . . , , ., italy. tell me what happened to your cousin. italy. tell me what happened to your cousin- last — italy. tell me what happened to your cousin. last week, _ italy. tell me what happened to your cousin. last week, i— italy. tell me what happened to your cousin. last week, i called _ italy. tell me what happened to your cousin. last week, i called my - cousin. last week, i called my mum, who lives south _ cousin. last week, i called my mum, who lives south of _ cousin. last week, i called my mum, who lives south of hebron, _ cousin. last week, i called my mum, who lives south of hebron, and - who lives south of hebron, and asked, what's happening? she said, the army came today and your cousin, her brother or son, was going to the supermarket to buy cheese. 0n her brother or son, was going to the supermarket to buy cheese. on his way back, a shot him on his leg look expensive pellet that damaged his leg really badly and he was in hospital. leg really badly and he was in hosital. �* , ., leg really badly and he was in hosital. . i. . , hospital. and your family were breathed in — hospital. and your family were breathed in an _ hospital. and your family were breathed in an earlier- hospital. and your family were breathed in an earlier conflict. | breathed in an earlier conflict. your grandfather died in the 19705. let me turn to you, magen, because you suffered a terrible loss on october the 2nd. what happened? —— october the 2nd. what happened? —— october the 2nd. what happened? ——

october the 7th. fin october the 2nd. what happened? -- october the 7th.— october the 7th. on the morning of october the 7th. on the morning of october the 7th, _ october the 7th. on the morning of october the 7th, terrorists - october the 7th. on the morning ofj october the 7th, terrorists attacked my parents' village and my parents were killed by a shoulder rocket which _ were killed by a shoulder rocket which hit their house directly and it burned — which hit their house directly and it burned down completely with my parents _ it burned down completely with my parents in — it burned down completely with my parents in it. it burned down completely with my parents in it— parents in it. what kind of people were your parents? _ parents in it. what kind of people were your parents? they - parents in it. what kind of people were your parents? they were i were your parents? they were amazing. — were your parents? they were amazing. the _ were your parents? they were amazing, the best _ were your parents? they were amazing, the best parents - were your parents? they were | amazing, the best parents one were your parents? they were - amazing, the best parents one can hope _ amazing, the best parents one can hope for— amazing, the best parents one can hope for at — amazing, the best parents one can hope for at the best grandparents. my kids. _ hope for at the best grandparents. my kids, they are 11,.— my kids, they are 11,. i'm very sor my kids, they are11,. i'm very sorry for— my kids, they are 11,. i'm very sorry for your _ my kids, they are 11,. i'm very sorry for your loss, _ my kids, they are 11,. i'm very sorry for your loss, and - my kids, they are 11,. i'm very sorry for your loss, and you i my kids, they are 11,. i'm very i sorry for your loss, and you have both responded in a way this terrible war, this suffering and hate, with a peaceful approach. was that something that you felt immediately, that you wanted to pursue peace and quickly? yes. immediately, that you wanted to pursue peace and quickly? yes, i think my parents _ pursue peace and quickly? yes, i think my parents had _ pursue peace and quickly? yes, i think my parents had close - pursue peace and quickly? yes, i l think my parents had close friends among different communities in

israel. — among different communities in israel, including among the arab and bedouin community and, when i went to israel— bedouin community and, when i went to israel the _ bedouin community and, when i went to israel the day hamza left, i went to israel the day hamza left, i went to be _ to israel the day hamza left, i went to be with _ to israel the day hamza left, i went to be with my siblings and people from different communities in israel canre _ from different communities in israel came to pay their respects, including _ came to pay their respects, including israeli palestinians and muslinrs— including israeli palestinians and muslims and christians and, as a family. _ muslims and christians and, as a family, we felt that we are in this unique _ family, we felt that we are in this unique position, that we can offer some _ unique position, that we can offer some kind — unique position, that we can offer some kind of hope, perhaps, because it felt— some kind of hope, perhaps, because it felt as _ some kind of hope, perhaps, because it felt as if— some kind of hope, perhaps, because it felt as if my parents, the way they— it felt as if my parents, the way they lived. _ it felt as if my parents, the way they lived, is the vision that we want _ they lived, is the vision that we want everyone in the area to live. | want everyone in the area to live. wonder, want everyone in the area to live. i wonder, hamza, was your want everyone in the area to live. i wonder, hamza, was your reaction and that of yourfamily wonder, hamza, was your reaction and that of your family automatically, yes, we want to move for peace now? this is what we want to do the i want to, to both of you, whether

feelings of revenge even for a second? i feelings of revenge even for a second? ~ . . ., second? i think what i learnt of the reason i second? i think what i learnt of the reason i don't _ second? i think what i learnt of the reason i don't have _ second? i think what i learnt of the reason i don't have a _ second? i think what i learnt of the reason i don't have a grandfather. second? i think what i learnt of the j reason i don't have a grandfather is because he was killed by israel to dip i did not think about this dip i was really sad. all my friends and grandfathers and because of israel doctor as i grew up and started thinking about thinking honestly, what can be good for me, for my people, for humanity, ifelt like, for other people doctor there has to be peace. it's not about... and for other people doctor there has to be peace. it's not about. . ._ be peace. it's not about... and now ou are be peace. it's not about... and now you are speaking — be peace. it's not about... and now you are speaking about _ be peace. it's not about... and now you are speaking about about - you are speaking about about this. what do you want palestinians to feel in their hearts about this? mr; feel in their hearts about this? iji grandfather died feel in their hearts about this? m1: grandfather died so feel in their hearts about this? m1 grandfather died so palestinians now would have a betterfuture grandfather died so palestinians now would have a better future and, after 50 years, we are still fighting for basic rights. we

shouldn't