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tv   Verified Live  BBC News  January 10, 2024 4:00pm-4:31pm GMT

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we'll bring you reaction to the announcement from one former post office worker who was forced into bankruptcy. i'd like, you know, to get to the end of this, really, and sticking plasters are, whilst appreciated, you know, i just feel as though we're not moving forward. president zelensky warns that any delays in western aid to ukraine will only increase the strength of russia. and the united states�* top diplomat has said there will consequences if a tax on shipping in the red sea continue. hello, i m matthew amroliwala, welcome to verified live, three hours of breaking stories and checking out the truth behind them. we start here in the uk with a major
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development on a story which has dominated the headlines for the past week thanks to a tv drama. the prime minister has announced new legislation, to make sure that hundreds of post office branch managers convicted in one of the biggest miscarriages ofjustice the uk has ever seen are swiftly exonerated and compensated. more than 700 sub—postmasters were given criminal convictions for fraud and false accounting over a period of around 16 years after it introduced a faulty it system. some went to prison. many were bankru pted. we�*ll get reaction from one sub postmaster in a moment — but first our political correspondent iain watson reports. the post office told us over and over... "you�*re the only one." that was a lie, actually, because... itv made a drama out of a crisis, a scandal that started more than 20 years ago came to public and political prominence.
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fewer than 100 sub—postmasters have had their wrongful convictions overturned and there�*s pressure to clear more names and pay out more compensation. the prime minister said there had been an appalling miscarriage of justice. there has been a flurry of ministerial meetings this week and finally today, an announcement. i can announce that we will introduce new primary legislation to make sure that those convicted as a result of the horizon scandal are swiftly exonerated and compensated. and rishi sunak also announced a £75,000 up—front payment to those postmasters who hadn�*t been convicted but who took legal action against the post office because their livelihoods had been affected. we will make sure that the truth comes to light, we right the wrongs of the past and the victims get the justice they deserve. prosecutions took place notjust under a conservative government but a coalition which included the lib dems and initially under labour. sir keir starmer welcomed today�*s announcement. people lost their lives,
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their liberty and their livelihood and they've been waiting far too long for the truth, forjustice and for compensation, so i'm glad the prime minister is putting forward a proposal. we will look at the details and think it's the job of all of us and i think it's the job of all of us to make sure that it delivers the justice that is so needed. this has been described by the justice secretary as an unprecedented scandal. and passing a law to exoneration whole swathes of people all at once and passing a law to exonerate whole swathes of people all at once is certainly seen as a radical step. but some have doubts about politicians invading the territory usually occupied byjudges. some of those who have reviewed miscarriages ofjustice believe there is a better solution than an act of parliament. it�*s only the court of appeal that can definitively say in each individual case, this conviction is unsafe and therefore must be quashed. acts of parliament
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won�*t really do that. but what of the company behind the glitchy computer system? fujitsu has been awarded other government contracts worth billions of pounds. but ministers say they won�*t act until after a public inquiry has concluded. there are some questions about who is more responsible, fujitsu or post office or others? when the inquiry has identified responsibility, then those questions can be answered. today�*s announcement on exoneration and compensation will be welcomed by many victims of the scandal, but their long wait forjustice isn�*t over yet. iain watson, bbc news, westminster. lee castleton was left bankrupt after his battle with the post office and his story features prominently in that tv drama which has propelled this into the spotlight. lee welcomes the prime minister�*s annoucement. hejoined me a little earlier and he told me his reaction
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when the problem began. the potential interim payments would be appreciated. it�*s a little bit of a caveat there, i would just like to get to the end of this, really. sticking plasters, whilst appreciated, i just feel as though we�*re not moving forward. i�*d like to get everything done, really. but it seems that heels are still being very sticky and being dragged behind and it would be nice if we could get some short, sharp steps forward. i�*m not surprised you came to that conclusion because your case has spanned over 20 years, i was listening to you on the radio this morning and it is staggering, awful story. for viewers who don�*t know your particular story, let�*s just go through it. because when it first happened, the initial deficit, you didn�*t think, you were not suspicious of the computer were you initially?
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no, not at all. i thought that potentially i was doing something wrong, or that i had missed something. but when it repeats itself and recurs repeatedly then you start to look at things and a different way. ijust felt as though no matter how many times i reached out, i reached over 12 weeks 91 times, i was just kind of lost in the system and no—one seemed to take hold of it. ijust got bounced around. and it became absolutely apparent to me that there was something very wrong. what was the post office�*s approach? you mentioned there, you called them 91 times, the numbers, they were getting bigger and bigger so when you approached them — give me a sense of what they said to you? well, initially, it was about whether i had done something wrong. so they would go over the balance, the procedure to balance each time. which we would quite happily do
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but we could not find anything that was wrong. the one thing that stood out the whole time was that we were having issues, screen freezes and things that you would have to do twice, payments and things. and itjust didn�*t seem right. and as more and more of these things occurred it got more and more fraught and became more of an argument between one side and the other. once relationships like that break down it becomes very difficult. over the 12 week period it became very fractious and obviously, went on to be even more fractious. it was then that i really learned what power can do. in terms of what power can do, you had a deficit, i think, by the time they took a civil case against you of about £25,000 but the costs that you had to pay as a result of that civil case being brought against you, tell viewers what that amount was, because it is staggering?
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yes, it was staggering to me at the time as well, it�*s £321,000. if you put that into the thought process, i was actually representing myself by that time because i had completely run out of money. the post office were totally aware of the situation. they knew that in no uncertain terms, no matter what the case was, i was not going to be able to pay those kinds of costs anyway. even thejudge prior to the hearing told them that it was going to be a very difficult route to take, to recoup anything and they were not interested at all, they wanted to go ahead and press ahead. and so hearing that £321,000 costs were awarded against me was devastating and it led to my bankruptcy. yes, you had to become bankrupt. give me an idea of the impact
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it had on yourfamily, your children, your wife and, more importantly, how the local community treated you ? so, we were living in a small fishing town in east yorkshire, very close to where we were both born. i had been a stockbroker for two years prior and wasn�*t a very good one, to be fair. we thought that this was a great way to cement our life in the north. we owned our house completely, we had no mortgage or anything at the age of 35 and we decided to invest in a post office. little did i know that that would lead to completely being ostracised in the small town, people abusing us in the streets as being thieves, particularly my children being bullied. this led on to all kinds of mental issues, anxiety for my wife lead to seizures and epilepsy and for my daughter, bless her, being the oldest of two children,
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she suffered at school and she was spat at by a boy because his parents couldn�*t get their money from the post office any more because it was closed. and it led on to an eating disorder for my daughter, which lasted, she�*s 28 now, and thankfully recovered but it went on for at least ten years. as a parent, very difficult to take. it is devastating, every single aspect. when you stack it up, all the things that have happened to you and your family, how do you even begin to try to work out what kind of compensation is due to you? and what would it mean if the judgment against you is actually overturned? myjudgment is a civiljudgment and it was heard in the high court.
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it�*s still not set aside, it still stands as a record of the court. that�*s probab;ly a little bit to do with my fault for example because i have a bit of a trust issue in setting that aside. i know the post office would like to say that side and i�*m sure we could work it out. they criminalise people, the people that went through terrible traumas in very similar circumstances possibly worse than my family. they�*re now looking to have those exonerations and moved forward as a batch. one of the things that have been been announced. that really concerns me, the minister, kevin hollinrake mentioned that some of these people will be guilty but they all need to sign a document to say that they committed no offence, and i worry about that. having talked to many of my friends
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who were victims of this, to say that some of them were guilty, if you were in a room of a 100 people and two of them said they were thieves, how would you react to the other 98? i find that very, very difficult. i don�*t understand why that caveat needs to be there. i don�*t understand why we�*ve got into this situation and i don�*t understand why individuals cannot be treated properly. around the world and across the uk. this is bbc news. let�*s look at some other stories making news. the london to birmingham stretch of the now—truncated hs2 railway could cost as much as £66 billion alone. that�*s almost twice as much as the original estimate for the entire project. the hs2 ltd executive chair said reasons for the cost increase include original budgets being too low, changes to scope, poor delivery and inflation. the parents of a british tourist
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who died after a helicopter crash in the grand canyon are to receive a £79 million payout. 31—year—old jonathan udall was one of five britons, including his new wife, who died after the aircraft crashed and burst into flames in february 2018. a lawsuit brought by his parents said he could have survived had the helicopter been fitted with systems to help prevent the fire. the actor stephen fry has called for an end to the use of real fur in the bearskin caps worn by the king�*s guard on duties such as guarding buckingham palace. he is backing an animal welfare campaign calling for them to be made with artificial fur instead. you�*re live with bbc news. israeli air strikes have intensified on southern and central gaza despite israel saying it will shift to a more targeted campaign. the military says it has hit a further 150 targets and killed dozens of militants in the last 2a hours.
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the hamas—run health ministry said another 147 people were killed and more than 2113 were wounded in gaza in that time. in a sign of the desperation there, hundreds of people have besieged aid trucks carrying flour and canned food in gaza city. the palestinian refugee agency unrwa says more than two million palestinians are now totally reliant on aid. america�*s top diplomat, antony blinken, has met the head of the palestinian authority in the west bank during his latest tour of the region. at a meeting in ramallah, mahmoud abbas told him no palestinian should be displaced from gaza or the west bank. the state department says mr blinken stressed that a route towards a palestinian state must be part of the solution to the conflict. the united states says that us and british navalforces have shot down 21 drones and missiles fired by yemen—based houthis towards international shipping in the red sea. the uk defence secretary
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grant shapps says it was the largest such attack yet. us central command says they were shot down with no injuries or damage reported, adding that it was the 26th attack by the iranian—backed houthis on commercial shipping lanes since mid—november. a houthi spokesman said they were targeting an american ship which was providing support to israel. mr blinken has also been in bahrain. live now to shashankjoshi, defence editor at the economist. thank you so much for being on the programme. we were listening to antony blinken a few moments ago saying there would be consequences if these attacks continued. he didn�*t map out the consequences, but do you think warnings like that are going to be in anyway effective? well, it�*s not the first warning. it has been one week since the us and i think about 13 of its allies including the uk published a joint
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statement warning the houthi of consequences if they continued, and since then they have launched what we call an un—crude surface vessel, effectively a jerome boateng, at shipping, and they�*ve launched this intense barrage at warships in the last 2a hours, so clearly, previous warnings have not been effective, and i think that now a military response against the houthis is very likely indeed, probably in the coming days if not sooner than that. i know it is difficult but what sort of thing would you expect? weill. i know it is difficult but what sort of thing would you expect? well, the americans have _ of thing would you expect? well, the americans have already _ of thing would you expect? well, the americans have already attacked - americans have already attacked using naval helicopters houthis boats, they destroyed three of them several days ago, so they have already taken action against some houthi vassell�*s. i suspect what we will see is a series of air and naval strikes by the us, the uk and very possibly others in that red sea
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coalition against houthi military assets in yemen on land and i would expect that would include missile stockpiles and depots where offensive weapons are being kept, it could involve strikes against any radar facilities being cute could involve strikes against any radarfacilities being cute to enable these attacks, but of course we don�*t know precisely where these facilities are all of the details. we know the houthis are backed by iran, just how far do you think iran is prepared to go and how dangerous would you say the current situation is? . . , , ., would you say the current situation is? . , ., ., , would you say the current situation is? . , ., . i. is? iran has provided virtually all these missiles _ is? iran has provided virtually all these missiles but _ is? iran has provided virtually all these missiles but more - is? iran has provided virtually all these missiles but more than - is? iran has provided virtually alll these missiles but more than that is? iran has provided virtually all. these missiles but more than that it has also facilitated the targeting process for the houthis by providing intelligence on the nature and location of shipping transiting the red sea. so, iran is notjust arming the houthis it is also specifically facilitating this campaign. i don�*t think this moment is tremendously dangerous in the sense that i don�*t think the risk is of a bigger regional conflict, lebanon is far more dangerous in that sense,
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however, i think there is a challenge in that any strikes could end up politically strengthening the houthis and not actually fixing the problem and that i think is the bigger challenge for the western governments involved in formulating their response. you governments involved in formulating their re5ponse-_ their response. you talk of challenges. _ their response. you talk of challenges, as _ their response. you talk of challenges, as it _ their response. you talk of challenges, as it stands i their response. you talk of i challenges, as it stands now their response. you talk of - challenges, as it stands now with so many attacks, i think this is the 26, it is having a real economic impact which is presumably why the houthis are doing it? yes. impact which is presumably why the houthis are doing it?— houthis are doing it? yes, the red sea is virtually _ houthis are doing it? yes, the red sea is virtually closed, _ houthis are doing it? yes, the red sea is virtually closed, we - houthis are doing it? yes, the red sea is virtually closed, we are - sea is virtually closed, we are seeing shipping firms having to go round south africa, adding about ten days to their voyage. all of this is not adding up to any kind of economic crisis or supply chain crunch but if it continues, alongside other disruptions, for example we are seeing relatively one low water levels in the panama canal as well, you could see cumulatively an impact on economies, but i think an impact on economies, but i think a bigger problem here is the principle of freedom of navigation is at risk notjust in the red sea but also of course from russian
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actions in the black sea, chinese actions in the black sea, chinese actions in the taiwan strait and the south china sea, so this ought to be you think is a broader problem, a broader challenge, to the open maritime order, notjust in the middle east but beyond as well. that is how antony _ middle east but beyond as well. that is how antony blinken framed it as well to journalists, thank you so much for being on the programme and giving us that analysis, shashank joshl ukraine�*s president zelensky has warned that any delays in western aid to his country will only increase the strength of russia. speaking during an unannounced visit to lithuania, he said that russia has hit ukraine with around 500 missiles and drones in the last few days with ukraine destroying 70% of them. he appealed for more help with air defence systems saying they were the number one thing which his country lacks. live now to olexander scherba, ambassador—at—large at the ukrainian foreign ministry.
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thank you for being on the programme. those warnings from president zelensky about delays, but he has made that same comment so many times over recent months, how frustrating is it, that�*s still the stuff that you require is not actually arriving to you? it is frustrating. _ actually arriving to you? it is frustrating, it is _ actually arriving to you? it 3 frustrating, it is frustrating for us people living in ukrainian cities that get bombarded every day, we in kyiv are more or less covered because we have a better system but people in kharkiv and kherson really close to the frontline, they live in terror every day and we need more of this protection, and of course our president doesn�*t get tired asking for it. is president doesn't get tired asking for it. , . ., ., for it. is it clear to you with the e es of for it. is it clear to you with the eyes of the _ for it. is it clear to you with the eyes of the world _ for it. is it clear to you with the eyes of the world perhaps - for it. is it clear to you with the eyes of the world perhaps on . for it. is it clear to you with the i eyes of the world perhaps on the middle east now that russia is taking advantage of that situation? well, russia is taking advantage of
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everything possible, and i wouldn�*t be surprised if russia had its finger also in this situation in the middle east or other conflicts throughout the world. and most importantly, russia is building the axis of evil around the world, russia, iran, north korea, to name a few, who are doing theirjob, they are supplying russia with all kinds of new and modern and very potent weapons, whereas, where is the access of good? it is there but sometimes it is not doing itsjob. —— axis of good. for example the united states still delaying this supply of weapons for our soldiers. it is frustrating. in supply of weapons for our soldiers. it is frustrating.—
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it is frustrating. in terms of stockpiles. _ it is frustrating. in terms of stockpiles, you _ it is frustrating. in terms of stockpiles, you mentionedl it is frustrating. in terms of _ stockpiles, you mentioned washington and of coursejoe biden is being thwarted in his attempts to supply more military aid to ukraine by republicans, he is being blocked in that particular avenue and that direction, in terms of your stockpiles, how long can you keep going effectively without new weapons thing from the united states and elsewhere?— and elsewhere? well, i have a friend who fi . hts and elsewhere? well, i have a friend who fights in — and elsewhere? well, i have a friend who fights in donbas _ and elsewhere? well, i have a friend who fights in donbas from _ and elsewhere? well, i have a friend who fights in donbas from february i who fights in donbas from february 22, he left his comfortable life in austria and went to this war and he writes to me that right now, they are using in a month what they used during a day in the first stage of this war. so, it is really stretched really thin, the artillery supplies on the frontline. but we don�*t have any other choice, any other option,
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we have to fight, otherwise we die. you know what is happening in washington, you will have heard some of those voices, some of those voices echoing in europe as well, suggesting that perhaps now might be the time for ukraine to negotiate some sort of settlement with russia, are you there in ukraine beginning to feel more of that pressure to force you to the table? . to feel more of that pressure to force you to the table?- force you to the table? , as president — force you to the table? , as president zelensky - force you to the table? , as president zelensky said - force you to the table? , —.3 president zelensky said today, he doesn�*t feel any pressure on the official level, but we see of course here with these so—called experts and these so—called negotiate now demos in european capitals, and the question is, what should we negotiate? feeding more of our people to that crocodile in moscow? feeding more of our land, of our
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freedom? the interesting thing is that the more these people in the west project this peaceful spirit and they think that they contribute to peace, the less chance there is that naughty would really be interested in negotiating because he knows that the time welcome that the west will be weak enough to force ukraine into something unspeakable. at least this is his hope. 50m; ukraine into something unspeakable. at least this is his hope.— at least this is his hope. sorry to cut across _ at least this is his hope. sorry to cut across you. _ at least this is his hope. sorry to cut across you, the _ at least this is his hope. sorry to cut across you, the un _ at least this is his hope. sorry to cut across you, the un are - cut across you, the un are discussing it, the russian ambassador currently describing this session anti—russian propaganda. really briefly, a simple, straightforward question to end with, are you winning or losing this war at the moment? ~ ., ., , ,., , moment? well, we are absolutely winnin: moment? well, we are absolutely winning the _ moment? well, we are absolutely winning the war, _ moment? well, we are absolutely winning the war, because - moment? well, we are absolutely winning the war, because we - moment? well, we are absolutely winning the war, because we are i winning the war, because we are alive, and this war was supposed to
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last 15 days, we are almost in the third year of this war, so we are winning. but we need that the west does its part, too. we have the reliable piece of it, the west should be the reliable piece, too. gisela, ambassador at large at the ukrainian foreign ministry, thank you for speaking to us as that session at the un security council continues. —— olexander scherba. i will be back with more of the main stories injust a moment. hello there. this cold, fine, settled spell of weather is continuing today. we�*ll see the best of the sunshine, i think, across more southern parts of the country. but here again, we have more of that easterly breeze taking the edge
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off the temperatures. further north,a bit more cloud around. big area of high pressure dominating the scene. around it we�*re getting some clouds in off the north sea. that�*s affecting northeastern parts of the country, so this is where we�*re seeing the cloudier skies through the rest of today, north and east scotland and eastern england, maybe thick enough for the odd spot of light rain or drizzle, a little bit of wintriness over the high ground. best of the sunshine, southern, south—east england. some glimmers of brightness for western wales, northern ireland and also western scotland. temperature—wise, maybe a degree up on yesterday, highs of six or seven degrees. factor in the wind, though, it�*ll feel much colder than that. as we head through tonight, it stays cloudy across some northern and eastern areas. where skies are clear, though — central scotland, southern, south—east england — this is where we will see some of the lowest temperatures, perhaps down to minus four, minus five celsius in central scotland. similar values towards the south—east, but less cold where we have the cloud. but mist and fog could also be a problem where the skies are clear. so for thursday, similar story again. most of the cloud will be towards eastern areas with the odd spot of drizzle. southern and western parts seeing
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the best of the sunshine. scotland doing pretty well with the sunshine, i think, through thursday afternoon. the temperatures a little less cold again, up to eight degrees, so a degree or so above what we�*ve had earlier in the week. it�*s still cold but less cold. friday, then, probably the best of the sunshine across scotland, some sunshine developing for northern ireland. elsewhere, it stays cloudy and rather gloomy, ithink, for large parts of england and wales, maybe some brightness western wales, south—west england, and again temperatures up to around eight degrees. it�*s all change, though, as we head into the weekend. although there�*ll still be some sunshine in the south, we�*ll see these cold fronts spreading southwards. behind it, arctic airfloods southwards, so it will be turning colder with increasing snow showers certainly affecting northern scotland, the northern isles where accumulations will be increasing. further south, a better chance of staying drier with some sunshine, but it will be cold for all. into next week, it stays cold, further sunshine and snow showers, and then there�*s a risk of some more widespread, perhaps disruptive snow
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welcome to bbc news. let�*s turn to our headlines... a major development in the uk�*s biggest
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miscarriage of justice. rishi sunak announces a new law to compensate and clear the names of hundreds of postmasters wrongly accused of theft. opposition activist alexei navalny is seen for the first time since disappearing from a central russian prison last month. and 80 years after d—day, we speak to the woman who helped map the beaches for the normany landings. we will have all those stories any few moments. time for a look at the business news now with tadhg enright. we start in the us — and the boss of aviation giant boeing says the company "acknowledges its mistake" after some of its newest planes were found to have loose parts. investigations began after a panel in the fuselage of a 737 max 9 jet operated by alaska airlines blew out mid—flight last week, opening a hole in the side of the plane. thankfully no—one was injured.

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