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tv   Verified Live  BBC News  April 4, 2024 3:00pm-3:30pm BST

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arms sales to israel. and with 55 million demenia suffers around the world, a new medical trialto learn whether blood tests can spot the early signs of the disease. it would transform diagnosis and mean that people could be screened for dementia in their 50s, long before symptoms emerge. hello, i'm matthew amroliwala. welcome to verified live, three hours of breaking stories, and checking out the truth behind them. after almost 20 years and an international manhunt, a court has just found a 75—year—old man guilty of murdering a uk police officer by planning the armed robbery in which she was shot dead. the 38—year—old officer, sharon beshenivsky, was shot and killed on her youngest daughter's fourth birthday as she arrived at the scene
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of the robbery in the city of bradford, in west yorkshire, in 2005. piran ditta khan, 75, spent nearly two decades evading justice. he was extradited from pakistan last year, the last of the seven men involved to face trial. let's speak to danny savage, who is outside leeds crown court. this who is outside leeds crown court. verdict coming l little this verdict coming back in the last little while, just tell us more about the background. matthew, this was a shocking _ about the background. matthew, this was a shocking crime _ about the background. matthew, this was a shocking crime back— about the background. matthew, this was a shocking crime back in - about the background. matthew, this was a shocking crime back in 2005 i was a shocking crime back in 2005 and it feels like a shocking crime now. a west yorkshire police officer, unarmed, responding to a call of an alarm being activated at a travel agent in a city centre in bradford, west yorkshire, in november 2005. bradford, west yorkshire, in november2005. she bradford, west yorkshire, in november 2005. she and her colleague pull up in their police car opposite that business on a busy friday afternoon, they walked across the
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street towards the front door of the travel agent, just as they arrive, three gunmen burst out of that building having carried out a robbery and a gun is fired. pc sharon beshenivsky is shot dead with fatal injuries, her colleague pc teresa milburn is a shot as well, injuries which she does recover from. then launched is a huge manhunt to track down those responsible. this was a huge story at the time in the uk. over the subsequent months and years that followed that raid, they slowly but surely tracked down and caught those involved. seven people in total, six of them caught relatively quickly, even though two of them had fled to somalia, and they were brought to justice, but the ringleader, the man who planned the raid, piran ditta khan, took years to catch. he fled to pakistan in the weeks and months that followed that shooting and went
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to ground. it was with the cooperation of the authorities in pakistan that the uk police finally tracked him down, got him arrested in pakistan and got him brought back to the uk last year, and over the last seven weeks in leeds crown court, he has been on trial. in the last hour, he has been found guilty of the murder, even though he was not in the business at the time, he was driving around, but because of his involvement, because of his planning, he isjust as responsible for the murder of pc sharon beshenivsky as the people who fired the gun is that day. here was the reaction on the steps of the court. while we welcome today's conviction, our thoughts are firmly with pc sharon — our thoughts are firmly with pc sharon beshenivsky, pc teresa milburn— sharon beshenivsky, pc teresa milburn and theirfamily sharon beshenivsky, pc teresa milburn and their family and friends _ milburn and their family and friends. they went to work on that day back— friends. they went to work on that day back in— friends. they went to work on that day back in november 2005 fully expecting to come home to their families— expecting to come home to their families and friends. due to the
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horrific— families and friends. due to the horrific actions of those individuals who have now been convicted — individuals who have now been convicted for those fences, that was not the _ convicted for those fences, that was not the case. west yorkshire police have remained doggedly determined to brin- have remained doggedly determined to bring all_ have remained doggedly determined to bring all of those to justice that we are — bring all of those to justice that we are responsible for these offences. i - offences. i know you have been offences. — i know you have been talking to sharon's husband. he has often been in court throughout this trial. have we had reaction from him so far? ihla we had reaction from him so far? fir: reaction immediately after the verdict, but we have talked to him in the past, when piran ditta khan was arrested and brought back to the uk. he was talking about the fact that this was almost like an ongoing nightmare, because there was always somebody who was outstanding, always somebody who was outstanding, always somebody wanted by the police, and he felt like he was reliving it all the time and wanted just to see an end to it.. he got some sort of
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closure and end today because the final member of the gang has been caught. piran ditta khan is 75 years old now and is likely to receive a lengthy sentence when he comes to sentencing. we still have a date yet to be set for that. but here is a man who is likely to die behind bars. i saw sharon's husband at the beginning of the trial several weeks ago, to hear the case being set out, and in due course, we will hearfrom him, once sentencing has taken place. him, once sentencing has taken lace. . ~' ,, him, once sentencing has taken lace. ., ~' y., ., him, once sentencing has taken lace. . ~ ., , , place. thank you for bringing us the latest details _ place. thank you for bringing us the latest details on _ place. thank you for bringing us the latest details on the _ place. thank you for bringing us the latest details on the breaking - latest details on the breaking story. more on that throughout the course of today's programme. three former supreme courtjustices are among more than 600 legal experts calling for the uk
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government, to end weapons sales to israel. in a letter to the prime minister, they say exports must end, writing that "the provision of military assistance and material to israel, may render the uk complicit in genocide as well as serious breaches of international humanitarian law. " rishi sunak is already facing growing cross—party pressure, after seven aid workers, including three britons, were killed in an air strike in gaza. president biden is due to speak to the israeli prime minister, benjamin netanyahu, the first time since that strike — that has brought international condemnation. our diplomatic correspondentjames landale begins our coverage. the air strikes that killed international aid workers in gaza have prompted global condemnation, and now they're shaping political choices. more than 600 lawyers have written to the government, urging it to suspend arms sales to israel, because they believe there is a risk it's breaking international law. they said, "serious action is needed
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to avoid uk complicity in grave breaches of international law, including potential violation of the genocide convention." "to continue the sale of weapons and weapon system to israel falls significantly short of your government's obligations under international law." the whole framework of international law, governing war, it dictates that the fact that you have been provoked and attacked, however outrageously, does not mean to say that you can do whatever you like. it doesn't mean to say that you can indiscriminately slaughter innocent civilians and children. it doesn't mean to say that you can attack aid convoys. british arms sales to israel are small — some of it are parts for american—made warplanes like this — but halting the exports would be a huge diplomatic blow to israel. at westminster, labour are pushing ministers to publish their internal legal advice about israel's
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compliance with international law. the lib dems and the snp want arms sales stopped now, as do some conservatives. i wholly agree with the lawyers who have written the letter today, the sheer scale of destruction is enough for us to take a political view to say that arms should not be sold to israel. you have seen the wanton destruction of acres of land in gaza, it is leading to starvation and famine. we have reached the obscene position way we, the uk, along with the us, are having to build a supply bridge from the sea to gaza and drop stuff from the air to gaza and drop stuff from the air to try to give food to needy people when this has been created by a so—called ally. you have to ask whether they are any longer for it to be an ally of decent western countries. some mps believe the foreign office is ready to do just that but claim downing street is resisting.
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but officials deny this, and the former home secretary, who is visiting israel, says number ten should stick to its guns. we owe it to israel to stand with them. i think that we should maintain this military relationship, from which we benefit just as much as they do, and i think that it would be a tragic shame if we were to walk away from our closest ally in this region. these lethal air strikes are disrupting more than just aid supplies to gaza. they're also causing tensions within israel's allies, and the government has a difficult decision to make. james landale, bbc news. the israeli government says the findings from its investigation in the deaths of the seven aid workers are still some weeks away. the world central kitchen staff and security personnel were from a number of different. the polish prime minister, donald tusk, has this morning called on israel to provide compensation for the polish citizen killed. the aid group's founder was blunt in his assessment.
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they were a target, systematically, car by car, so this was not bad luck, a situation where, works, we dropped a bomb in the wrong place. no, this was over 1.8 kilometres with a very defined monetarily in convoy that had signs in the roof. a very colourful logo that we are very proud of and it is very clear who we are and what we do. let's speak to nick waters, open—source analyst at bellingcat. he's been investigating this incident. welcome to the programme. i know you have been locating the vehicles. what have you actually established? how far apart where these three vehicles? ,., ., ., ., ., . how far apart where these three vehicles? ., ~ , ., vehicles? good afternoon. we started to look at the — vehicles? good afternoon. we started to look at the images _ vehicles? good afternoon. we started to look at the images and _ vehicles? good afternoon. we started to look at the images and videos - to look at the images and videos published online showing these
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vehicles from the convoy and working out precisely where they were located. they are spread along the road next to the sea within about 2.8 kilometres distance.- 2.8 kilometres distance. now, in terms of what _ 2.8 kilometres distance. now, in terms of what you _ 2.8 kilometres distance. now, in terms of what you established i 2.8 kilometres distance. now, inj terms of what you established as 2.8 kilometres distance. now, in i terms of what you established as to weaponry, what have you found out? when you are trying to hit a vehicle, you are trying to track a moving target, and so it is necessary to be watching that moving target to make sure the munition actually impacts it directly, especially if you are using a munition that either a warhead or a relatively small explosive payload. these vehicles were struck directly. we don't have impacts next to the vehicles. the impacts are on the vehicles. the impacts are on the vehicles themselves, which indicate they were struck very accurately. each one was struck very accurately on the body of the vehicle. we have
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even seen the _ on the body of the vehicle. we have even seen the pictures _ on the body of the vehicle. we have even seen the pictures of— on the body of the vehicle. we have even seen the pictures of the - on the body of the vehicle. we have even seen the pictures of the logo | even seen the pictures of the logo of world central kitchen on at least one of the roofs of the vehicles. one assumes that the drone operator can also see that. am i right in that assessment? the can also see that. am i right in that assessment?— can also see that. am i right in that assessment? the strike took lace at that assessment? the strike took place at night- — that assessment? the strike took piace at night- i _ that assessment? the strike took place at night. i don't _ that assessment? the strike took place at night. i don't know - place at night. i don't know precisely what kind of optics the platform used to carry out the strikes was carrying. for example, if it was only thermal, i don't know exactly what would show up on the roof of that vehicle. that is beside the point anyway, because the movements of these vehicles, they are quite distinctive vehicles, three large white vehicles that have left a warehouse and they are travelling along a de—conflicted route. ifind it hard travelling along a de—conflicted route. i find it hard to travelling along a de—conflicted route. ifind it hard to believe travelling along a de—conflicted route. i find it hard to believe the idf did not know what these vehicles were when they fired upon them. thank you very much. we are going to take a short break but when i am back, we are going to turn to an investigation that
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suggests israel is using an ai targeting system called lavender. that is coming up.
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now to a story getting quite alot of attention online since it's been published. it comes from a collaboration between two independent outlets, run by israeli and palestinian journalists, called +972 magazine and local call. their investigation claims that israel is using a previously undisclosed ai targetting system called lavender in its war in gaza. the story is also now being reported by outlets like the independent and the guardian, its headline, the machine did it coldly, identifying 37,000 hamas targets. the bbc hasn't independently verified details contained in the report.
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but let's talk to the journalist behiond the story from +972 magazine and local call, yuval abraham. thank you so much forjoining us on the programme. i will talk about the details of your investigation in a moment or two, but tell me a little more about the sources for this particular investigation and the story. particular investigation and the sto . . ~ particular investigation and the sto . ., ~ particular investigation and the sto . ., ., ., ., story. thank you for having me. for this story. — story. thank you for having me. for this story. i — story. thank you for having me. for this story, i spoke _ story. thank you for having me. for this story, i spoke with _ story. thank you for having me. for this story, i spoke with six - story. thank you for having me. for this story, i spoke with six israeli i this story, i spoke with six israeli intelligence officers, i think some of them might be described as whistle—blowers. they were drafted for the military, many of them said they were shocked by the atrocities of october the 7th, and i think at least some of them felt that they were responsible for killing entire palestinian families. i can think of two of them talking about it like
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that. others said they were involved in really dramatic policies that led to the deaths of so many palestinians in gaza and they felt a responsibility to share that information. let responsibility to share that information.— responsibility to share that information. ., ., information. let me go through the detail, because _ information. let me go through the detail, because the _ information. let me go through the detail, because the system - information. let me go through the detail, because the system that - information. let me go through the | detail, because the system that you are talking about and have identified is called lavender. in simple terms for viewers watching this, what does it do and what were the numbers of people it actually targeted? the numbers of people it actually tar: eted? . , the numbers of people it actually tarueted? . , ., ~ , targeted? lavender is an ai -based s stem to targeted? lavender is an ai -based system to create _ targeted? lavender is an ai -based system to create human _ targeted? lavender is an ai -based system to create human targets, i targeted? lavender is an ai -based| system to create human targets, to mark them. at its peak, according to sources, it managed to mark 37,000 palestinians in gaza as suspected low level hamas orjihad militants. the way it works is, for people who don't know, they're machine scanned most of the population in gaza,
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collecting information, and it gave each individual rating between one and 100 east on how likely the machine thought that individual belong to the military. it has a list of indicative features, something like somebody is in a whatsapp group with a militant, or somebody that replaces phones all the time, it raises or lowers your rating. sources said that this machine, when they were using it, the idf knew that in approximately 10% of the cases, it was making what was regarded as errors. it was marking complete civilians, or people with a very loose connection to hamas, and the supervision in place for the first six weeks of the war was so place for the first six weeks of the warwas so minimal place for the first six weeks of the war was so minimal that one is a source says they would spend roughly 20 seconds per targetjust to listen if the target was a male or female, and if it was a female they cancelled it, and if it was a male they bombed, without checking why they bombed, without checking why the machine made the decision is
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that it made. let the machine made the decision is that it made-— the machine made the decision is that it made. ., , ., ., ., that it made. let me ask you another auestion that it made. let me ask you another question linked _ that it made. let me ask you another question linked to _ that it made. let me ask you another question linked to the _ that it made. let me ask you another question linked to the ai. _ that it made. let me ask you another question linked to the ai. there - that it made. let me ask you another question linked to the ai. there wasl question linked to the ai. there was also an additional automated system that had been dead, where is daddy? tell me how that impacted. that that had been dead, where is daddy? tell me how that impacted.— tell me how that impacted. that is the next step- _ tell me how that impacted. that is the next step. where _ tell me how that impacted. that is the next step. where is _ tell me how that impacted. that is the next step. where is daddy - tell me how that impacted. that is the next step. where is daddy is i tell me how that impacted. that is| the next step. where is daddy is an automatic system that looks for these targets when they enter their family houses. it scans thousands of people that were marked by lavender, the ai machine, and it alerts intelligence officers at the moment they enter the house, and the israeli military, according to numerous sources, carried out a policy of bombing these people using unguided missiles when they were in the most civilian spaces, inside family houses, collapsing the house on itself and killing often, according to sources, the predetermined limit was 20 palestinians at the beginning of the war. that is perjunior hamas
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suspected operative. the reason they were using the unguided missiles was because these targets that were generated were not considered important enough to, as one source said, waste expensive munitions upon, like a more precise bombs that could hit one particularfloor. you could hit one particular floor. you touched on _ could hit one particular floor. you touched on the _ could hit one particular floor. you touched on the ratios in the middle of that answer. you were also told that the ratios around collateral damage or civilian casualties were changed after october the 7th. tell me more about that.— changed after october the 7th. tell me more about that. again, sources described to — me more about that. again, sources described to me _ me more about that. again, sources described to me getting _ me more about that. again, sources described to me getting into - me more about that. again, sources described to me getting into the - described to me getting into the bases and people feeling grief for their friends bases and people feeling grief for theirfriends being murdered or abducted into gaza, and the decision was to basically push the system that already existed to its peak. they said that these predetermined
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collateral damage of degrees, one source at the beginning said it was 20, maybe 15 for the low ranking militants, they said it was 700 people for the senior commanders, for a single assassination strike. 300 civilians were accepted as collateral damage for the assassination, for example. 300, they said that is completely unprecedented compared to anything in the military. one source said the policy was so disproportionate, there was an element of revenge in it. the reason why these degrees were so high was away for revenge, to express this disregard that was everywhere for palestinian civilian life. i everywhere for palestinian civilian life. . ., ., , ., life. i will come to the israeli military response _ life. i will come to the israeli military response in - life. i will come to the israeli military response in a - life. i will come to the israeli i military response in a moment life. i will come to the israeli - military response in a moment or two, but a final question, did you get any information about how reliant the israeli military was on
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these ai systems in terms of the duration of the war? you are talking about these systems being in play now or the early stages of this war? from what i understand, and i don't have the full picture on this, from what i understand, the policy of mass assassinating legend ai marked low ranking operatives inside their houses stopped after two months will stop partially because it is rarely destroyed most of the houses in gaza. 70% of the houses are destroyed. also there was pressure on israel to stop. there was pressure to pick more senior targets, they are still using intelligence for drone strikes, ai can be used as well, but it is still playing an important role in the way israel is bombing gaza. may be the last thing is, there is a looming
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attack that benjamin netanyahu was saying is going to take place. i think it is likely they will implement these systems again in rafah. pa. implement these systems again in rafah. �* . , ., rafah. a final, very quick thought, 'ust to rafah. a final, very quick thought, just to return _ rafah. a final, very quick thought, just to return to _ rafah. a final, very quick thought, just to return to what _ rafah. a final, very quick thought, just to return to what you - rafah. a final, very quick thought, just to return to what you said - just to return to what you said about the human oversight in all of this, how long were you saying there was human interaction to look at what the ai system had actually thrown out?— what the ai system had actually thrown out? ,., . ., thrown out? one source said that they would _ thrown out? one source said that they would spend _ thrown out? one source said that they would spend roughly - thrown out? one source said that they would spend roughly 20 - thrown out? one source said that - they would spend roughly 20 seconds per target before bombing that person's house, often killing an entire family. the only supervision that he was asked to do is to check, to listen, if it is a male or female. one source said they felt
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like a human rubber stamp on the decisions that were made by lavender. where that source was serving. we don't know if it is happening everywhere, but in some particular areas, this was the case. thank you very much for speaking to bbc news. i said we would have the response from the israelis. the bbc has contacted the israeli defence forces today but have received no answer yet. yesterday, the idf responded to the claims made by the various media groups in the uk that have reported this, they say they directed strikes only towards military targets, that they do not use an ai system to identify or predict whether a person is a terrorist. the israeli forces say their analyst... they denied carrying out strikes where collateral damage is excessive
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and they outright reject claims over any policy to kill tens of thousands of people in their homes. let mejust take of people in their homes. let me just take you to brussels because we are expecting to hear from nato leaders. we have the 75th anniversary, but so much attention around ukraine, and only yesterday they were talking about how to insulate nato against any possible second donald trump presidency. we will keep an eye on those pictures when there is movement. now, more than 55 million people around the world sufferfrom dementia, with ten million new cases every year. so a new five year trialis being watched with alot of interest. blood tests for dementia will be offered, at more than 50 memory clinics across the uk. the aim — to find out whether the test can spot the early signs.
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the trials are being run with thousands of volunteers and the plan is to introduce �*screening' for dementia in over 50s. fergus walsh, reports. what can our blood tell us about our brain? this small trial in oxford is looking for clues. lucy, like many of the healthy volunteers, has a personalfamily motivation for being involved. the main driver for the dementia was because my mother had dementia, and ijust have very close personal experience of how miserable that is. i mean, she wasn't... fortunately, she was relatively old, she was in her 80s when it started, and she died at 97. but her last few years were really mired by the disease. what is your first language? over the next five years, around 5,000 people will take part in research assessing blood tests to see how accurately they can
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identify various forms of dementia. most notably alzheimer's disease. in alzheimer's disease, rogue proteins can build up in the brain over 20 years before a person shows problems with memory and understanding. the test will search for biomarkers in the blood which can identify the early stages of dementia. if a reliable blood test for alzheimer's is eventually approved by the nhs, it would transform diagnosis and mean that people could be screened for dementia in their 50s, long before symptoms emerge. the studies will aim to include people from diverse backgrounds and ethnicities so a wide cross—section of society we will talk to people behind that
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trial a little later in our programme. that is such an important story. there are so many people suffering from dementia around the world. i will take you back to those life pictures in brussels. in the last few moments, joe biden has urged a sacred commitment to nato on the 75th anniversary. very much in contrast with the recent comments from donald trump. back in brussels injust a moment from donald trump. back in brussels in just a moment or two. it is remaining and settled for the rest of this week and as we head into the weekend, we are looking at some stormy weather, with a new named storm. we are in between weather systems today so a relatively quiet day before the next area of low pressure moves through during the overnight period. it will remain chilly in northern and
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eastern areas. the best of any sunshine across the midlands. the same across wales, but they will be showers here. blustery through the channel. chilly across scotland. this evening and overnight, wet and windy weather spread northwards across the country. as it bumps into the cold air across scotland, we are likely to see some snow. it stays cold here, but a very mild night for england and wales. potentially some disruptive snowfall across central and northern scotland for the early part of friday. even fairly low levels, but mostly on the hills. the rain, sleet and snow will ease through the day. most of the country on friday will have a bright day. scattered showers, most of these across northern and western areas. temperatures reaching 17 or 18 degrees across southern and eastern areas. still chilly across scotland but those temperatures will recover as we head into saturday because
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this deepening low pressure system has been named as storm kathleen. that is going to bring very strong winds to the republic of ireland. a very blustery day expected on saturday. the rain clears northwards and then a very windy day with sunny spells and scattered showers, most of the showers towards southern and western areas. it is going to be a very windy day wherever you are. particularly around northern ireland. but look at these temperatures. even scotland are very mild. it could be up to 21 degrees across eastern parts of england. on sunday, storm kathleen passes to the north—west of the uk so another mixed day. the best of any sunshine towards eastern areas. another blustery day, a mild day, but not as warm as saturday.
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