six months of war in gaza. was this week a turning point?

as the israeli military admits a "grave mistake" over the death of seven aid workers in gaza, is this the week when israel's prosecution of this war became untenable, in the eyes of the world? we discuss with a former lord justice of appeal, the head of oxfam gb and a former officer in the israel defense forces. also tonight: how worried should we be about artificial intelligence being used on battlefields? one source says they would spend

roughly— one source says they would spend roughly 20 seconds per targetjust to listen_ roughly 20 seconds per targetjust to listen if— roughly 20 seconds per targetjust to listen if the target was a male or female — to listen if the target was a male or female. and if it was a female, they— or female. and if it was a female, they cancelled it. if it was a male, they cancelled it. if it was a male, they bombed, without checking why they bombed, without checking why the machine made the decisions it made _ and ukraine and arsenal footballer oleksandr zinchenko tells newsnight why he would be willing to return home to fight for his country. you talk about going back. if, at some point, you thought it was of more value to go back and fight if you were called, would you go? i think it's a clear answer — of course we would go, i would go. good evening. on sunday, we mark six months of war in gaza. some statistics: on october 7th, more than 1,200 israelis were killed by hamas. more than 100 hostages kidnapped from israel on that day remain unaccounted for. since october 7th, some 33,000 people have been killed in gaza by israeli forces, according to the hamas—run health ministry. this week, seven aid workers were killed

by the israeli military — taking the total number of aid workers who have perished in the conflict to 196, according to the united nations. the world food programme says 1.1 million people — half of the gazan population — are experiencing catastrophic food insecurity. this week, the israeli government — under immense pressure from washington — said it would open up more humanitarian aid routes into gaza. we'll discuss what difference that will make on the ground in a moment, and also, whether this week represented a turning point in international support for israel's prosecution of this war. but first, let's look at those new aid corridors. since the war began, most aid has entered gaza via the kerem shalom crossing, at the southern tip of the territory. but tight israeli security checks at kerem shalom has led to long queues of aid lorries backing up

on the egyptian side of the border. to ease the flow, americans had announced plans for the construction of a temporary port off the gazan shoreline to receive aid from sea. and they and other nations, including the uk and jordan, had also resorted to airdrops of aid. but those were dangerous. five palestinian children were killed last month in a crush following an airdrop. also, the world central kitchen — whose workers were killed on monday — had created a makeshiftjetty from rubble to bring in some food supplies by sea. so, what will now change? israel has said the erez crossing into the northern part of gaza will be opened for the first time since the hamas attacks on october 7th. and aid for gaza will also be allowed to flow through the israeli port of ashdod and then travel down to the erez crossing. israeli officials have also said they will increase the amount of aid moving through the kerem shalom crossing. but we don't have a timeline for when these three measures to ease the flow of aid will be implemented.

joining me now is sir alan moses, a former lord justice of the court of appeal, who was one of the signatories of a letter this week from 600 lawyers, academics and retired seniorjudges warning that the uk government is breaching international law by continuing to arm israel. also, we have aleema shivji — oxfam gb's interim chief executive, and isaac zarfati — executive director of standwithus uk, an organisation which aims to educate and counter misinformation about israel in britain. welcome to you all. i want to start with you, aleema. how much difference do you think these new aid routes will actually make on the ground? i aid routes will actually make on the round? ~ ., , aid routes will actually make on the round? ~ . , , , ground? i think it really depends on israel. so ground? i think it really depends on israel- 50 we _ ground? i think it really depends on israel. so we welcome _ ground? i think it really depends on israel. so we welcome the - ground? i think it really depends on israel. so we welcome the opening | ground? i think it really depends on i israel. so we welcome the opening of erez and the use of the port of ashdod, but we know from what is happening in rafah now is convoys are stuck on the other side of the border, there is a lot of bureaucracy and checks in place. even though aid is ready to come in,

it is trickling in a lot more slowly thanit it is trickling in a lot more slowly than it should. so it is up to israel and israel needs to make sure these routes open immediately and that they are open constantly and that they are open constantly and that aid can flow freely. and part of that also means stopping the fighting. because right now, our colleagues and partners inside gaza are trying their hardest to deliver aid. we have reached over 250,000 people, but it is a drop in the ocean of what is needed. so what we really need is the opening and a ceasefire. i think oxfam has about 30 people on the ground delivering aid. one thing the israeli government has said is it is not the fault of the israeli government aid is not getting to the people of

gaza, it is the fault of un organisations and also the charities. what is your response to that, any truth in that at all? not at all, our colleagues and partners are all risking their lives to deliver aid. are all risking their lives to deliveraid. it are all risking their lives to deliver aid. it is hugely challenging, what is trickling in is not as much as what needs to come in. when it comes in, people are delivering aid under bombs and threats to their own life. because they feel compelled to support their fellow citizens. so it really is up to israel to enable safe humanitarian access and enable aid workers to do their work and enable citizens to survive.— citizens to survive. we will come back to the _ citizens to survive. we will come back to the experience of - back to the experience of individual aid workers shortly. sir alan, was this a watershed week, do you think, in this conflict? because we had such a public and international outcry at the death of those seven aid workers. we had this letter we referenced from eminent legal minds in the uk. do you sense this is an important moment? i

in the uk. do you sense this is an important moment?— in the uk. do you sense this is an important moment? i think it is an im ortant important moment? i think it is an important moment. _ important moment? i think it is an important moment. i _ important moment? i think it is an important moment. i wouldn't - important moment? i think it is an important moment. i wouldn't say| important moment. i wouldn't say that it _ important moment. i wouldn't say that it was — important moment. i wouldn't say that it was a watershed moment. it is far— that it was a watershed moment. it is far too— that it was a watershed moment. it is far too early to say. and it is a moment, — is far too early to say. and it is a moment, however, in which certainly, mines _ moment, however, in which certainly, mines were _ moment, however, in which certainly, mines were mobilised as to the breach— mines were mobilised as to the breach and potential breach of the united _ breach and potential breach of the united kingdom's obligations under international law. and that, it seems to— international law. and that, it seems to me, it's important to underline-— seems to me, it's important to underline. ~ . .,~ ., underline. what did you make of the idf investigation into _ underline. what did you make of the idf investigation into the killing, - idf investigation into the killing, the death of those aid workers that was released today? was that satisfactory or should other repercussions follow from that? well, how does one know? this is the trouble _ well, how does one know? this is the trouble with war and with observations on war and the fog that it creates. all one can say is that it creates. all one can say is that it is a _ it creates. all one can say is that it is a start. but many questions remain to — it is a start. but many questions remain to be answered. and it is far too early— remain to be answered. and it is far too early to expect them to be

answered. the one thing one can say about— answered. the one thing one can say about this _ answered. the one thing one can say about this week is that rather like looking _ about this week is that rather like looking at— about this week is that rather like looking at the vanishing point in perspective, that hope must remain and that— perspective, that hope must remain and that the rest of us here who feel so paltry in our efforts when we hear— feel so paltry in our efforts when we hear of the work of those trying to bring _ we hear of the work of those trying to bring humanitarian aid. but as a lawyer, _ to bring humanitarian aid. but as a lawyer, all one can do is emphasise the importance of the obligations on the united _ the importance of the obligations on the united kingdom. we chose to enter into — the united kingdom. we chose to enter into a treaty back in 1970 was the genocide convention, the triggers— the genocide convention, the triggers obligations, and it is up to us— triggers obligations, and it is up to us to — triggers obligations, and it is up to us to obey them, including ensuring _ to us to obey them, including ensuring there is means of access and means— ensuring there is means of access and means of existence for those in gaza _ and means of existence for those in gaza and _ and means of existence for those in gaza. and that is our obligation. let me _ gaza. and that is our obligation. let me turn— gaza. and that is our obligation. let me turn to you, isaac zarfati. how important in your eyes was this week, was this a watershed moment for you? week, was this a watershed moment for ou? ~ week, was this a watershed moment for ou? ,, . ., for you? i think that what happened was a tragedy- _ for you? i think that what happened was a tragedy. i think _ for you? i think that what happened was a tragedy. i think israel - was a tragedy. i think israel admitted _ was a tragedy. i think israel admitted it was _ was a tragedy. i think israel admitted it was a grave - was a tragedy. i think israel- admitted it was a grave mistake. but we need _ admitted it was a grave mistake. but we need to hear— admitted it was a grave mistake. but we need to bear in mind _ admitted it was a grave mistake. but we need to bear in mind what are - we need to bear in mind what are the objectives _ we need to bear in mind what are the objectives of this _ we need to bear in mind what are the objectives of this war? and _ objectives of this war? and remember that israei of— objectives of this war? and remember that israel of eventually—

objectives of this war? and remember that israel of eventually needs - objectives of this war? and remember that israel of eventually needs to - that israel of eventually needs to end this — that israel of eventually needs to end this war— that israel of eventually needs to end this war with _ that israel of eventually needs to end this war with eliminating - that israel of eventually needs to i end this war with eliminating hamas and bring _ end this war with eliminating hamas and bring the — end this war with eliminating hamas and bring the hostages _ end this war with eliminating hamas and bring the hostages back. - end this war with eliminating hamas and bring the hostages back. israell and bring the hostages back. israel is going _ and bring the hostages back. israel is going to — and bring the hostages back. israel is going to learn _ and bring the hostages back. israel is going to learn from _ and bring the hostages back. israel is going to learn from this - is going to learn from this incident, _ is going to learn from this incident, i'm— is going to learn from this incident, i'm sure - is going to learn from this incident, i'm sure israel. is going to learn from this - incident, i'm sure israel needs to restore _ incident, i'm sure israel needs to restore the — incident, i'm sure israel needs to restore the confidence _ incident, i'm sure israel needs to restore the confidence and - incident, i'm sure israel needs to restore the confidence and the i restore the confidence and the trust. — restore the confidence and the trust. in — restore the confidence and the trust, in order— restore the confidence and the trust, in order to _ trust, in order to enable humanitarian _ trust, in order to enable l humanitarian aid workers trust, in order to enable _ humanitarian aid workers to continue and do _ humanitarian aid workers to continue and do important work _ humanitarian aid workers to continue and do important work in gaza. - and do important work in gaza. but again. _ and do important work in gaza. but again. we need— and do important work in gaza. but again, we need to focus _ and do important work in gaza. but again, we need to focus on the - again, we need to focus on the objectives of _ again, we need to focus on the objectives of the war, - again, we need to focus on the . objectives of the war, to eliminate hamas and — objectives of the war, to eliminate hamas and bring back— objectives of the war, to eliminate l hamas and bring back the hostages. we mentioned — hamas and bring back the hostages. we mentioned you served _ hamas and bring back the hostages. we mentioned you served in the - we mentioned you served in the idf. when you read about what happened, was this an aberration, was it surprising? there are people who say the idf is very careless with palestinian life, you accept that? not at all, i think the idf has a strong — not at all, i think the idf has a strong awareness about - strong awareness about humanitarian law. strong awareness about humanitarian iaw i myself— strong awareness about humanitarian law. i myself served in— strong awareness about humanitarian law. i myself served in the idf - law. i myself served in the idf and i rememberthere_ law. i myself served in the idf and i remember there were _ law. i myself served in the idf and i remember there were officers - i remember there were officers that were expert in— i remember there were officers that were expert in international law, i were expert in international law, that advised _ were expert in international law, that advised us to _ were expert in international law, that advised us to make - were expert in international law, that advised us to make sure - were expert in international law, - that advised us to make sure we were doing the _ that advised us to make sure we were doing the right things. _ that advised us to make sure we were doing the right things. again, - that advised us to make sure we were doing the right things. again, we - doing the right things. again, we are talking — doing the right things. again, we are talking about _ doing the right things. again, we are talking about a _ doing the right things. again, we are talking about a six _ doing the right things. again, we are talking about a six month - doing the right things. again, we. are talking about a six month war. we are _ are talking about a six month war. we are talking _ are talking about a six month war. we are talking about _ are talking about a six month war. we are talking about one - are talking about a six month war. we are talking about one of - are talking about a six month war. we are talking about one of the i are talking about a six month war. i we are talking about one of the most complicated — we are talking about one of the most complicated war _ we are talking about one of the most complicated war zones ever- we are talking about one of the most complicated war zones ever come up| complicated war zones ever come up with tunnels, — complicated war zones ever come up with tunnels, where _ complicated war zones ever come up with tunnels, where a _ complicated war zones ever come up with tunnels, where a terror - with tunnels, where a terror organisation _ with tunnels, where a terror organisation embedded - with tunnels, where a terrorl organisation embedded itself with tunnels, where a terror - organisation embedded itself among civiiians. _ organisation embedded itself among civiiians. using— organisation embedded itself among civilians, using civilians— organisation embedded itself among civilians, using civilians as _ organisation embedded itself among civilians, using civilians as human. civilians, using civilians as human shields _ civilians, using civilians as human shields and _ civilians, using civilians as human shields. and what _ civilians, using civilians as human shields. and what happened - civilians, using civilians as human shields. and what happened now| civilians, using civilians as human. shields. and what happened now is something — shields. and what happened now is something the _ shields. and what happened now is something the idf _ shields. and what happened now is something the idf will— shields. and what happened now is something the idf will learn. - shields. and what happened now is something the idf will learn. and i something the idf will learn. and bear in _ something the idf will learn. and bear in mind _ something the idf will learn. and bear in mind this _ something the idf will learn. and bear in mind this is _ something the idf will learn. and bear in mind this is the _ something the idf will learn. and bear in mind this is the first- something the idf will learn. and bear in mind this is the first timel bear in mind this is the first time something — bear in mind this is the first time something like _ bear in mind this is the first time something like that _

bear in mind this is the first time something like that happened i bear in mind this is the first time something like that happened in| bear in mind this is the first time i something like that happened in six months. _ something like that happened in six months. it— something like that happened in six months. it is— something like that happened in six months, it is quite _ something like that happened in six months, it is quite a _ something like that happened in six months, it is quite a long _ something like that happened in six months, it is quite a long period - something like that happened in six months, it is quite a long period ofi months, it is quite a long period of time _ months, it is quite a long period of time that— months, it is quite a long period of time that those _ months, it is quite a long period of time that those things _ months, it is quite a long period of time that those things didn't - time that those things didn't happen _ time that those things didn't ha en. ., time that those things didn't ha en. . ., time that those things didn't hauen. ., ., ., time that those things didn't hauen. . . ., ., time that those things didn't hauen. . ., ., ., ., happen. there are a lot of aid workers who _ happen. there are a lot of aid workers who were _ happen. there are a lot of aid workers who were killed - happen. there are a lot of aid i workers who were killed besides those _ workers who were killed besides those in — workers who were killed besides those in the tragic incident this weeic — those in the tragic incident this week. ~ ,., those in the tragic incident this week. . , , ., week. we saw the numbers earlier. no-one was — week. we saw the numbers earlier. no-one was targeted _ week. we saw the numbers earlier. no-one was targeted by _ week. we saw the numbers earlier. no-one was targeted by the - week. we saw the numbers earlier. no-one was targeted by the idf. it | no—one was targeted by the idf. it is no—one was targeted by the idf. is nothing to do with targeting. no-one was targeted by the idf. it is nothing to do with targeting. we j is nothing to do with targeting. we need is nothing to do with targeting. this. need to is nothing to do with targeting. we need to remember there is also a terror— need to remember there is also a terror organisation _ need to remember there is also a terror organisation in _ need to remember there is also a terror organisation in gaza - need to remember there is also a i terror organisation in gaza stealing humanitarian — terror organisation in gaza stealing humanitarian aid, _ terror organisation in gaza stealing humanitarian aid, using _ terror organisation in gaza stealing humanitarian aid, using it - terror organisation in gaza stealing humanitarian aid, using it to - humanitarian aid, using it to restore _ humanitarian aid, using it to restore its _ humanitarian aid, using it to restore its power, _ humanitarian aid, using it to restore its power, taking - humanitarian aid, using it to restore its power, taking it i humanitarian aid, using it to - restore its power, taking it from civiiians. — restore its power, taking it from civiiians. so _ restore its power, taking it from civiiians. so we _ restore its power, taking it from civilians, so we need _ restore its power, taking it from civilians, so we need to - restore its power, taking it from civilians, so we need to see - restore its power, taking it from civilians, so we need to see it i restore its power, taking it from civilians, so we need to see it inj restore its power, taking it from i civilians, so we need to see it in a broader— civilians, so we need to see it in a broader aspect~ _ civilians, so we need to see it in a broader aspect. we _ civilians, so we need to see it in a broader aspect.— broader aspect. we need to acknowledge _ broader aspect. we need to acknowledge this _ broader aspect. we need to acknowledge this is - broader aspect. we need to acknowledge this is a - broader aspect. we need to acknowledge this is a very i acknowledge this is a very disproportionate response by israel in an enclave of 2 million people, people have nowhere to go, there is no safe place inside gaza. ianthem no safe place inside gaza. when israel launched _ no safe place inside gaza. when israel launched its _ no safe place inside gaza. when israel launched its attack- no safe place inside gaza. when israel launched its attack on - israel launched its attack on northern— israel launched its attack on northern gaza, _ israel launched its attack on northern gaza, it _ israel launched its attack on northern gaza, it waited - israel launched its attack on - northern gaza, it waited almost a month— northern gaza, it waited almost a month and — northern gaza, it waited almost a month and opened _ northern gaza, it waited almost a month and opened a _ northern gaza, it waited almost ai month and opened a humanitarian corridor _ month and opened a humanitarian corridor i— month and opened a humanitarian corridor. i don't— month and opened a humanitarian corridor. i don't think _ month and opened a humanitarian corridor. i don't think there - month and opened a humanitarian corridor. i don't think there is - month and opened a humanitarian corridor. i don't think there is anyl corridor. i don't think there is any precedent — corridor. i don't think there is any precedent for _ corridor. i don't think there is any precedent for something - corridor. i don't think there is any precedent for something like - corridor. i don't think there is any precedent for something like that corridor. i don't think there is any. precedent for something like that in the history— precedent for something like that in the history of— precedent for something like that in the history of wars. _ precedent for something like that in the history of wars. make _ precedent for something like that in the history of wars. make sure - precedent for something like that in the history of wars. make sure thatl the history of wars. make sure that all the _ the history of wars. make sure that all the gods — the history of wars. make sure that all the gods and _ the history of wars. make sure that all the gods and civilians _ the history of wars. make sure that all the gods and civilians or- the history of wars. make sure that all the gods and civilians or those i all the gods and civilians or those hamas— all the gods and civilians or those hamas didn't _ all the gods and civilians or those hamas didn't prevent— all the gods and civilians or those hamas didn't prevent to - all the gods and civilians or those hamas didn't prevent to go - all the gods and civilians or those hamas didn't prevent to go sell. all the gods and civilians or thosel hamas didn't prevent to go sell to all the gods and civilians or those . hamas didn't prevent to go sell to a safe place. — hamas didn't prevent to go sell to a safe place. and _ hamas didn't prevent to go sell to a safe place, and then _ hamas didn't prevent to go sell to a safe place, and then it—

hamas didn't prevent to go sell to a safe place, and then it launched - hamas didn't prevent to go sell to a safe place, and then it launched its| safe place, and then it launched its attack— safe place, and then it launched its attack on _ safe place, and then it launched its attack on the — safe place, and then it launched its attack on the north. _ safe place, and then it launched its attack on the north. the _ safe place, and then it launched its attack on the north. the reason - attack on the north. the reason israei— attack on the north. the reason israei is — attack on the north. the reason israei is not _ attack on the north. the reason israel is not getting _ attack on the north. the reason israel is not getting into - attack on the north. the reason israel is not getting into rafah. attack on the north. the reason . israel is not getting into rafah now is because — israel is not getting into rafah now is because israel— israel is not getting into rafah now is because israel is— israel is not getting into rafah now is because israel is aware - israel is not getting into rafah now is because israel is aware there - israel is not getting into rafah nowj is because israel is aware there are 1 million— is because israel is aware there are 1 million civilians _ is because israel is aware there are 1 million civilians and _ is because israel is aware there are 1 million civilians and it _ is because israel is aware there are 1 million civilians and it doesn't - 1 million civilians and it doesn't want _ 1 million civilians and it doesn't want to— 1 million civilians and it doesn't want to attack— 1 million civilians and it doesn't want to attack them, _ 1 million civilians and it doesn't want to attack them, and - 1 million civilians and it doesn't want to attack them, and it - want to attack them, and it negotiates— want to attack them, and it negotiates with _ want to attack them, and it negotiates with the - want to attack them, and it negotiates with the united i want to attack them, and it - negotiates with the united states to create _ negotiates with the united states to create a _ negotiates with the united states to create a safe — negotiates with the united states to create a safe area. _ negotiates with the united states to create a safe area. but— negotiates with the united states to create a safe area.— create a safe area. but the really chillin: create a safe area. but the really chilling words _ create a safe area. but the really chilling words that _ create a safe area. but the really chilling words that we've - create a safe area. but the really chilling words that we've heard i create a safe area. but the really i chilling words that we've heard not 'ust chilling words that we've heard not just from _ chilling words that we've heard not just from you tonight is this idea that the — just from you tonight is this idea that the war can only end when hamas is destroyed _ that the war can only end when hamas is destroyed. if that is what you are saving — is destroyed. if that is what you are saying to us, then the rest of the world — are saying to us, then the rest of the world needs to despair. aleema, let me pick — the world needs to despair. aleema, let me pick pp _ the world needs to despair. aleema, let me pick up on — the world needs to despair. aleema, let me pick up on experiences - the world needs to despair. aleema, let me pick up on experiences of - let me pick up on experiences of individual aid workers, did they take any comfort from the investigation by the idf and the conclusions it has reached? how did they feel at the moment, did they feel like they are potentially being targeted? fisid feel like they are potentially being tarueted? . ., ,, , ., feel like they are potentially being tarueted? �* ., ,, , ., ., targeted? aid workers and our colleagues _ targeted? aid workers and our colleagues and _ targeted? aid workers and our colleagues and partners - targeted? aid workers and our colleagues and partners are i targeted? aid workers and our- colleagues and partners are worried every single day about whether they will survive and continue to provide aid. aid workers cannot be targeted, thatis aid. aid workers cannot be targeted, that is completely against international humanitarian law, and they also cannot be collateral

damage. here, the war is taking place on one of the most densely populated places on the planet, there are 2.2 million people and you have spoken about the north of gaza, that of three million civilians and there is a real risk of famine in there is a real risk of famine in the north of gaza. latest data this week is the people of gaza, northern gaza surviving on 240 calories a day, less than a can of beans. civilians that were not able to leave the north, it is not that they didn't use, many were not able. older people, people with disabilities and families that could not move who are stuck in the north. and there are 100 israeli hostages still in gaza, we should mention. isaac, on the geopolitics of this, very significant moment is what analysts are saying. the united states is to israel that unless you change policy, you may not get our support. —— says to israel. how significant is that and how is that viewed in israel? j significant is that and how is that viewed in israel?— viewed in israel? i think the ma'ori viewed in israel? i think the majority of _ viewed in israel? i think the majority of israelis - viewed in israel? i think the majority of israelis want - viewed in israel? i think the majority of israelis want to l viewed in israel? i think the i majority of israelis want to see viewed in israel? i think the - majority of israelis want to see the hostages _ majority of israelis want to see the hostages back— majority of israelis want to see the hostages back at _ majority of israelis want to see the hostages back at home. _ majority of israelis want to see the hostages back at home. they- majority of israelis want to see the j hostages back at home. they know

that to _ hostages back at home. they know that to achieve _ hostages back at home. they know that to achieve that, _ hostages back at home. they know that to achieve that, hamas - hostages back at home. they know that to achieve that, hamas must i hostages back at home. they know. that to achieve that, hamas must be removed _ that to achieve that, hamas must be removed from — that to achieve that, hamas must be removed from power. _ that to achieve that, hamas must be removed from power. right - that to achieve that, hamas must be removed from power. right now, i that to achieve that, hamas must be removed from power. right now, we all know— removed from power. right now, we all know that — removed from power. right now, we all know that hamas _ removed from power. right now, we all know that hamas leadership i removed from power. right now, we all know that hamas leadership and i all know that hamas leadership and the hostages — all know that hamas leadership and the hostages are _ all know that hamas leadership and the hostages are in— all know that hamas leadership and the hostages are in rafah _ all know that hamas leadership and the hostages are in rafah and i all know that hamas leadership and the hostages are in rafah and it- the hostages are in rafah and it seems — the hostages are in rafah and it seems like _ the hostages are in rafah and it seems like there _ the hostages are in rafah and it seems like there is— the hostages are in rafah and it seems like there is no- the hostages are in rafah and it seems like there is no other. seems like there is no other solution _ seems like there is no other solution other— seems like there is no other solution other than- seems like there is no other solution other than to - seems like there is no other solution other than to get i seems like there is no other. solution other than to get into rafah — solution other than to get into rafah the _ solution other than to get into rafah. the disagreement i solution other than to get into i rafah. the disagreement between israel— rafah. the disagreement between israel and — rafah. the disagreement between israel and the _ rafah. the disagreement between israel and the us— rafah. the disagreement between israel and the us is— rafah. the disagreement between israel and the us is mainly- rafah. the disagreement between israel and the us is mainly on i rafah. the disagreement between israel and the us is mainly on how to achieve — israel and the us is mainly on how to achieve this _ israel and the us is mainly on how to achieve this goal. _ israel and the us is mainly on how to achieve this goal. obviously, i israel and the us is mainly on howl to achieve this goal. obviously, the israelis _ to achieve this goal. obviously, the israelis visited _ to achieve this goal. obviously, the israelis visited and _ to achieve this goal. obviously, the israelis visited and met _ to achieve this goal. obviously, the israelis visited and met the - to achieve this goal. obviously, the israelis visited and met the us i israelis visited and met the us officials — israelis visited and met the us officials last— israelis visited and met the us officials last week. _ israelis visited and met the us officials last week. they - israelis visited and met the us i officials last week. they presented them _ officials last week. they presented them with — officials last week. they presented them with a — officials last week. they presented them with a plan, _ officials last week. they presented them with a plan, the _ officials last week. they presented them with a plan, the us - officials last week. they presented them with a plan, the us has i them with a plan, the us has reservations _ them with a plan, the us has reservations about— them with a plan, the us has reservations about it. - them with a plan, the us has reservations about it. i- them with a plan, the us has. reservations about it. i believe that at— reservations about it. i believe that at some _ reservations about it. i believe that at some point, _ reservations about it. i believe that at some point, they- reservations about it. i believe that at some point, they will. reservations about it. i believe i that at some point, they will find a balance _ that at some point, they will find a balance to — that at some point, they will find a balance to enable _ that at some point, they will find a balance to enable israel— that at some point, they will find a balance to enable israel to - that at some point, they will find a balance to enable israel to achieve the objectives _ balance to enable israel to achieve the objectives of _ balance to enable israel to achieve the objectives of the _ balance to enable israel to achieve the objectives of the walk- balance to enable israel to achieve the objectives of the walk while i the objectives of the walk while maintaining _ the objectives of the walk while maintaining their— the objectives of the walk while maintaining their humanitarianl the objectives of the walk while i maintaining their humanitarian aid and international— maintaining their humanitarian aid and international law. _ maintaining their humanitarian aid and international law. sir- maintaining their humanitarian aid and international law.— and international law. sir alan, i want to ask _ and international law. sir alan, i want to ask about _ and international law. sir alan, i want to ask about one _ and international law. sir alan, i want to ask about one of - and international law. sir alan, i want to ask about one of the i want to ask about one of the egyptians people have had to the eu signed, which is that the uk an arms industry —— one of the objections. we sell arms to a lot of repressive regimes. would you call for that to end as well or are you singling out israel because of what is happening in gaza? brute israel because of what is happening in gaza? ~ ., israel because of what is happening in gaza? ~ . , ., ,

in gaza? we are singling out this situation, in gaza? we are singling out this situation. it _ in gaza? we are singling out this situation, it is _ in gaza? we are singling out this situation, it is not _ in gaza? we are singling out this situation, it is not an _ in gaza? we are singling out this situation, it is not an attack - in gaza? we are singling out this situation, it is not an attack on i situation, it is not an attack on israel — situation, it is not an attack on israel it— situation, it is not an attack on israel it is— situation, it is not an attack on israel. it is an attack triggered by the court's — israel. it is an attack triggered by the court's ruling back injanuary, the court's ruling back injanuary, the international court ofjustice, that's— the international court ofjustice, that's it _ the international court ofjustice, that's it that there was a risk of genocide — that's it that there was a risk of genocide. and once they had said that, _ genocide. and once they had said that, it _ genocide. and once they had said that, it triggered obligations on those _ that, it triggered obligations on those who had signed up to the convention. it is notjust a piece of paper, — convention. it is notjust a piece of paper, it _ convention. it is notjust a piece of paper, it is something that for our own— of paper, it is something that for our own protection and our own reputation. _ our own protection and our own reputation, we have to obey. so i think— reputation, we have to obey. so i think it _ reputation, we have to obey. so i think it is — reputation, we have to obey. so i think it is wrong and unfair to accuse — think it is wrong and unfair to accuse those who signed the letter of singling out israel. it isjust that— of singling out israel. it isjust that this — of singling out israel. it isjust that this situation requires a stand to be _ that this situation requires a stand to be taken in accordance with the law. you are seeing israel's reputation from london, is that reputation under threat?— from london, is that reputation under threat? , , , ., ., under threat? this step, although i believe in your good _ under threat? this step, although i believe in your good intentions, i under threat? this step, although i believe in your good intentions, it | believe in your good intentions, it is a hard step against israel.

israel is now fighting, not only in gaza, in iran, the main front. the decision... there is no weight to say that if you put an embargo on israel of weapons, it will harm israel. it is the forefront of war against terror, of radical islam. i wish the israeli government would think_ wish the israeli government would think of— wish the israeli government would think of the words, it is excellent to have _ think of the words, it is excellent to have a — think of the words, it is excellent to have a giant's power but it is tyrannous — to have a giant's power but it is tyrannous to use it like a giant. israel_ tyrannous to use it like a giant. israel has — tyrannous to use it like a giant. israel has plenty of weapons to conduct — israel has plenty of weapons to conduct this war. it might be thought— conduct this war. it might be thought any embargo will only affect future _ thought any embargo will only affect future wars. one has to look at who has the _ future wars. one has to look at who has the power in this. we future wars. one has to look at who has the power in this.— future wars. one has to look at who has the power in this. we do have to leave it there. _ has the power in this. we do have to leave it there, but _ has the power in this. we do have to leave it there, but thank _ has the power in this. we do have to leave it there, but thank you - has the power in this. we do have to leave it there, but thank you all - leave it there, but thank you all very much to speak to us tonight. according to a report in an israeli magazine, one of the reasons for the high death toll in gaza is

that the country's military has been using artificial intelligence to identify targets. the un secretary—general, antonio guterres, said in response to those reports today that he was "deeply troubled" by the allegation. the israeli defense force has denied it uses alto pinpoint strikes, but how concerned should we all be about al being used by militaries? here's james clayton. how do the israel defense forces select their targets? well, according to a report this week, it uses surveillance data, combined with al, to pinpoint hamas militants. but there's one claim by the author of the report which was particularly chilling. one source says they would spend roughly 20 seconds per targetjust to listen if the target was a male or a female. and if it was a female, they cancelled it. if it was a male, they bombed, without checking why the machine made the decisions that it made. today, the un secretary—general waded into the debate. no part of life—and—death decisions, which impact entire families, -

should be delegated to the cold calculation of algorithms. - the israeli defense forces deny that they use ai to target hamas militants, but the story does get into a much darker, dystopian fear that many security experts have — of ai being used on the battlefield, with very little human oversight. there is no universal, agreed—upon definition internationally about what an autonomous weapon is. but fundamentally, what we're talking about is a weapon that can make its own decisions on the battlefield about whom to kill. this fictional video was created by the future of life institute in 2021, in a futuristic world, where bots could seek and exterminate targets. but this technology is already here. we already have facial recognition and image—recognition technology, combined with drones that can fire autonomously. there are multiple reports that al is helping drones

locate targets in ukraine. we're certainly beginning to reach the point where technology is now potentially outpacing the kind of moral discussion. so the moral discussion is, effectively, are we happy to delegate to a weapon or to software decisions or activity that we would delegate to a person that we trust? the kinds of things that people have been warning about, we're seeing start to happen in ukraine, and it looks like increasingly in gaza as well. and so these technologies that, a decade ago, were very theoretical, are very real today, they're coming out of the battlefield. and right now, there are no special rules in place for how militaries use ai. we know that al systems are notoriously unreliable. they make mistakes. and in war, those mistakes can have life—and—death consequences. anna hehir, at the future of life institute, believes autonomous weapons could lead

to a catastrophic event for humans. there is a grave risk of accidental escalation between military powers. when you have autonomy — whether it's an autonomous weapon system or a targeting decision support system — when you're escalating decisions in, let's say, a tinderbox environment like the taiwan strait, you magnify the risk of huge scale and harm. but countries have talked about trying to regulate autonomous weapons for years, with very little success. in truth, any sufficiently - interesting, exciting system that looks like it gives an advantage on the battlefield has - generally led the way, - and then either legislation or regulation has followed. there are no special regulations surrounding how countries use ai autonomy in warfare, so they have to comply with the law of war, but there are no additional regulations or guardrails around how militaries use this technology. i think the default trajectory we're

on is no additional guardrails, and militaries are on their own to figure out how they use it. and there are going to be pressures to use this technology, including in ways that might be harmful. and that's why some people are so fearful of an alarms race — computers making more and more decisions by themselves, with potentially dire consequences. the propaganda war between russia and ukraine has spread into online video games. gamers can now virtually visit the soledar salt mine in ukraine — the scene of major battle early in the war — in a new minecraft modification called minesalt. and the ukrainian footballer oleksandr zinchenko, who plays for arsenal, has lent his likeness to one of the characters. zinchenko sat down with kirsty to reflect on his own commitment to ukraine's freedom. kirsty started by asking him what the new minecraft—based game, minesalt, was about.

i think playing this game with the other guys, we can do and reach a lot of good stuff, so. is the feeling that the russians are using local versions of minecraft to do a lot of bad stuff? yes, 100%. they're trying to do what they can, what they do the best, is propaganda, you know. they're trying to put their trust through something in every russian head. i couldn't believe that it could be in 2020s that using this kind of gaming and tv propaganda, you can reach your target, you know. but once again, i think if we're going to be united all together, we won't let it happen again, you know? and that's why we need to stick all together. you must have friends in ukraine with kids and friends also in ukraine who are fighting. what contacts do you have with them and how are they doing?

every time when i was talking to them, you know, ifeel sorry. i feel sorry because i'm not there as well. i'll be honest with you, i really want to be in ukraine. and i said to my my wife and my family, and to be honest, the feedback is exactly the same, that all of us we're going to live in ukraine after my football career. you know, the question is where we are more helpful for our country at the moment, so here, or being there? this is the question. and the answer is is clear at the moment that i can do much, much more being here than rather than i will be in ukraine at the moment. it's tough to understand that just recently we've been in the same school, we were playing in the playground, on in the football pitch and now they have to defend our country on the frontline. and honestly, it's so hard to accept this, but it is what it is. we cannot give up.

you talk about going back, if at some point you thought it was of more value to leave this behind and go back and fight, if you were called, would you go? i think it's a clear answer, of course. you would go? i would go. it's interesting you say that right now, because, of course, zelensky now has enacted the bill, which will reduce the age of particularly young men from 27 to 25. it must be very hard, they've fought a hard war. it's kind of a stalemate just now and people are exhausted who are fighting? the only message is clear that it's so super tough, for all of us and for all the country, that if the president decided to do that, that means there is a tough situation at the moment. i imagine that when you're back in ukraine, you have been to see children, you've been to see families. but tell me what it's like for some of the young children who've lost their family?

there is one place in ukraine which is called city of kindness. and i'm talking quite often, you know, with the with this lady, which organises everything since the invasion. when i ask her how many kids you have at the moment? and she said, like 300 kids and 80% of them is below five, which don't have parents anymore because of the war. anything involved with the kids for me, it's super tough. i'm such a sensitive person. also, i know that there is some kids which is like below 18, girls which have been raped by russian soldiers as well. and when you talk to the lady personally and she's saying these stories to me, my heart is just... ..my heart wants to explode because this is something like... ..this is not what they deserve. instead of living their lives,

having some dreams to achieve these dreams, they're just struggling like that, they're losing their parents, they're losing their family members. and this is... i don't know how to explain. it's super tough. you fundraise, obviously, for ukraine, but i think you also must be giving money too to help, your own money? i don't want to tell you the number. of course, all of us, i don't want to be a special one to tell you something. but of course, of course. but you're in a position to give a lot? yes, exactly. and that's what i have to do, this is my duty. that's why i decided to carry on being here, you know? i imagine it's more than a million? well, it's probably, probably. i would say is around that, maybe more. i didn't count. the financial concerns of countries are very many and ukraine is but one of them. and i wonder how concerned you are that perhaps some countries

will feel we can't give as much as we've been giving? what i know 100% that during this invasion we showed to the rest of the world that we can make the resistance against this aggression, terrorist aggression, and we can win this war. but the only thing is we need support. we need support from the others. and maybe some people realised, maybe some not. but today we are a proper shield for all of europe. we need this to protect our lands, not to occupy it like the others are doing for no reason. this is simple as that. so you don't have to understand anything about politics. it's just simple like that, to protect ourselves. because today it's ukraine, but tomorrow it can be your country, you never know. you're going to euro 2a, you're in the qualifiers, just let's say you get the playoffs, how would you like to face some of your teammates if you were to play england? well, i really hope that we are not

going to face them straight away. first of all, i really hope that we're going to qualify from the group stage. but then also, nobody likes to face england because they are one of the favourites of this competition. and when i would love to face them, it's only in the final. laughter. but a lot of people in that final might be holding ukrainian flags? well, i hope so, the stadium will be blue and yellow... ..like it was in glasgow, like it was in glasgow, we were all holding ukrainian flags. even kieran tierney, my teammate used to tell me that, "oh, my god, i felt like we were playing away". yeah, it did feel like that. well, let's have a much bigger significance this year to see the ukraine side. since the invasion, especially while we are wearing ukrainian badge on our chests, this is like extra motivation for us, you know, to bring some more positive emotions to our people, which is supporting us a lot. because like you said as well before the interview to me that all of us ukrainians,

we love football so much, so it's another opportunity — it will be another opportunity for us to talk about ourself to the rest of the world. after all, this is over, many, many ukrainians have settled in other parts of the world, and they probably thought they were going to these parts of the world temporarily. but what if people feel that it's a different country now and that they don't want to go back, what do you feel about that? well, at some point i can understand them. but once again, if you ask me my favourite place in the world, it will be ukraine because it's my homeland and i neverfelt myself somewhere else, like i feel when i'm in ukraine. i really hope, and i have a dream that this war will end very, very soon and we can rebuild our ukraine like we really want. and i can guarantee you that when when the war will end, we will rebuild it in the best way we could. that's for sure. like also with my teammates

in the national team, when we're talking about, like, "guys, let's imagine the war will end very soon and our first home game in front of our fans." you know, even now, my skin is... ..it�*s so hard to describe these emotions and i have no doubts about that. but i have dreamed that ukraine will rebuild in the best way they can and i really hope it will be. if you close your eyes where is the place in ukraine that you see? place? yeah, what's your favorite place that you see in... kiev. kiev, straight away. the best place in the world. thank you very much, indeed. thank you so much, pleasure. and you can watch a longer version of kirsty�*s interview with oleksandr zinchenko on the bbc iplayer. that's all from us tonight. victoria's back monday. till then, have a good weekend. goodnight.