isn't about me. i would say to this isn't about me. i would say to him more broadly that he makes some very wise observations about the need to ensure that the communities that are given significant sums of money, rightly so i'd align with what they were entitled through a legal process, that the appropriate framework of support is in place to assist them through receiving this money in a way which isn't destructive to their lives. factor eight yesterday was a very emotional day for many of us, and i am privileged that i was with constituents in the central hall yesterday, cathy young and her two fantastic daughters, lisa and nicola and so ijoin the minister in paying and so ijoin the minister in paying a great tribute to the infected blood committee.

the community gave a standing ovation to brian langstaff yesterday and that's something i will never forget. robert francis is an excellent appointment and can the minister confirm that he will be able to meet others in this house and can he also, and he knows i have raised this with him. can he guarantee that, looking at the composition of the authority going forward that that will include representatives of the infected and affected, and that they will have the rightful representation on that board? can i welcome the comments in relation to hepatitis b. this has always been one of the issues of contention, so can i ask the minister to consider some people with hepatitis b have been missing

out on the existing schemes, and can he have a look for me to find a way that those with hepatitis b get access to the existing schemes? i know the scottish infected blood forum has asked that question. can i alsojust forum has asked that question. can i also just clarify in terms of interim payments, he mentioned the living but can i ask him if interim payments will be made to the estates of those who have sadly passed away? my of those who have sadly passed away? my penultimate question is, some people will raise eyebrows at the fact that the compensation, the interim compensation, is less than those in the post office, so can he give some explanation about why the figure has been brought about today? i echo the comments made by the shadow minister in relation to looking at criminal charges and i welcome his comments on memorial. does the minister agree with me that there are two other lessons, the first is that members of this house,

regardless of political persuasion, can get together to deliverjustice. the second lesson is that those, like for example in the infected blood community, a key lesson for the general public is never, ever give up fighting injustice. i thank the honourable gentleman forgetting his engagement and the points he has made today. i was there yesterday for the two hours of brian langstaff �*s presentation of his report and it was a very moving moment for all of those who have suffered and waited for so long. i am gratefulfor suffered and waited for so long. i am grateful for his endorsement of the appointment of sir robert francis, it seemed to be welcomed in the gallery, and i recognise that what is absolutely critical if this is to be successful, is that the communities need to be fully engaged

and the explanation of how this scheme is being constructed and any concerns around the wider support thatis concerns around the wider support that is needed are interrogated fully, before those regulations come back to the house. but throughout this it is about reconciling speed and efficiency with consultation, and efficiency with consultation, and that is why it was done in the way that i have done it over the last few months. he makes a point about hepatitis b and access to the schemes and i would be happy to correspond with him separately on that because oppositely there are lots of technical issues there. he asks about the amount of £210,000. you can see it is an irregular amounts because i was trying to get the maximum amount that could be universally paid to those infected and a life without any risk of paying the wrong amount, and that was the maximum that i was advised,

and as quickly as i could. what is really important is that we get to the examination of entitlements and get to that balance and payments, and get that payment out as quickly as possible. this is not a stalling tactic, it is trying to reconcile competing priorities of responsibility of taxpayers money but also trying to do it as quickly as possible for the most vulnerable community. in respect of the memorialisation, these are matters where they will need to be wide engagement and i wouldn't want to make binding commitments today. i have said what i said and this will be a matter that myself and other ministers will return to in due course. steve brian. i thank the minister for what he said, and how he said it. i know he, the prime minister and particularly the chancellor sat next to him will make this right. clearly, the majority of the recommendations are for the health and social care sector, and the health select committee which i check will play its part, working with the secretary of state in nhs

england and she is on the bench as well, to make sure that all the recommendations, unlike some previous excepted patient recommendations are implemented. can i ask him about the five loss categories. i know his two small refinements. 0n the financial loss award, if it will reflect the reality for many infected victims that cannot access life insurance, for example, will it reflect those elements of financial loss? i for example, will it reflect those elements of financial loss? i think the chair of _ elements of financial loss? i think the chair of the _ elements of financial loss? i think the chair of the select _ elements of financial loss? i think the chair of the select committee | the chair of the select committee for his office and i thank the chancellor for his unwavering commitment to resolve this in a timely way, both while i was chief secretary, and now in this role. with respect to the five loss categories, he makes a legitimate point about specific elements of additional burdens, consequential of the conditions that people have. now, this is a matter that it will be no doubt raised by some in the

communities, but the structure around injuries, social impact, autonomy, care and financial loss, clearly with social impact and autonomy they capture a range of unspecific, but a basket of goods, if you like, or things that people would have not been able to procure at the same cost. so i can't give him a specific answer on that. jonathan montgomery and his team of experts have tried to do everything they can to look at the law, look at what would be entitled in different circumstances, and give the best assessment. that will be the sort of conversations that will happen with the communities in coming weeks. can i welcome the minister �*s statement today. i am just reflecting on the fact that he has talked about those infected and affected being fully engaged, and i just wanted to gently remind him of the maxim "no decision about us

without us", and the lack of transparency so far in the expert panel, and it is only today that we will learn the names of the people who have been advising the government. but can i also welcome the appointment of sir robert francis as the interim chair of the infected blood body. of course, it is worth reflecting on the fact that sir brian yesterday but in his report of the failure of government to respond to sir robert francis �*s compensation framework document, which the leader of the house commissioned when she was a paymaster general, and the government promised several times that they would respond to and that was never published. ijust wondered if the paymaster general could set out, because we have also not had a proper written response to the second interim report from sir brian last april, are all the recommendations, all 18, are they

being accepted by the government, and if not, why not? and, could he alsojust and if not, why not? and, could he also just confirm how the government is going to ensure that the compensation authority is accountable directly to parliament, as recommended by the infected blood inquiry? i as recommended by the infected blood inuui ? . ~ inquiry? i thank the right honourable _ inquiry? i thank the right honourable lady - inquiry? i thank the right honourable lady for - inquiry? i thank the right honourable lady for her l honourable lady for her observations, and the engagement we have had on an ongoing basis since i was appointed. i do take seriously what she says about no decision without full engagement. i made a decision that in order to get to this point, where we would in principle accept the recommendations of brian langstaff, move forward with the independent expert panel. as i have said to her previously, i was always prepared to reveal the names of those individuals. i did not want them to be distracted while they were doing urgent work to make progress quickly. their names will

be available shortly today. sir robert francis and i had a number of conversations about the interaction between government and the expert group, the logic that i used to get to these heads of loss and to get to this scheme today, and i am delighted that he is in a position where he is prepared to facilitate in essence the engagement with the communities. i have also been mindful of the principal of government managing public money, whilst also recognising sir bryan �*s imperatives around setting an arms length body that is arms length from government in order to restore or generate some trust with a very, very vulnerable community. reconciling those two has not been straightforward, but she asks about the accountability of the arm �*s length body and i think these are matters that will need to be discussed further with respect to the regulations that we have to lay before the house. what i would say

to her, you know, yes, a number of my predecessors have done a lot of work on this. i am pleased that we have made significant progress, but there is an intense amount of work to be done to deliver this over the next three months and i look forward to working constructively with her and sir robert francis to make sure that we get this to the right place as quickly as possible. thank you, mr speaker. we have heard descriptions of institutional defensiveness today but we should be clear about what we are actually talking about. this was a grubby secret kept secret by the department of health. the people who suffered as a consequence of this were treated as an inconvenience to be managed, and this flies in the face of what we are required to do in this house in terms of holding ministers accountable for what happens in their departments. we really do need to learn from this, to improve how we behave and how we hold the executive to account in

future. if we don't, this will shame at all and notjust future. if we don't, this will shame at all and not just those who future. if we don't, this will shame at all and notjust those who are directly responsible. could i perhaps say to my right honourable friend that what we really need to look at now is to make sure that we do properly establish a duty of candourfor do properly establish a duty of candour for civil servants in the advice they give to ministers, and a requirement that ministers must satisfy themselves that they are giving appropriate challenge and consideration to the advice they receive so that everyone involved in delivering services in the future can be held directly responsible, and this place does not continue to be a surround? i and this place does not continue to be a surround?— be a surround? i thank the honourable _ be a surround? i thank the honourable lady _ be a surround? i thank the honourable lady for - be a surround? i thank the honourable lady for her- be a surround? i thank the - honourable lady for her comments, and i agree with her instinctive reaction. her reaction to what sir brian says about the duty of candour. it would be for the government more widely to determine how we respond to that in a formal and coherent way. my right on a friend the chancellor when he was in

a previous role moved quite a lot of things forward within the department of health, as i know the honourable lady knows, but i think it is important when somebody spend that amount of time going into that depth of evaluation and number of insights and recommendations, that government looks at it very carefully. but i do think that brian langstaff makes wise observations that we need to listen to and apply to the way that we do government in this country. thank you, mr speaker. can i echo the points that have been made about welcoming the statement today. it has been a long time coming, and for many of my constituents in edinburgh west, as for many others, and their families and friends, this is a very poignant day. there have been reassurances called for by organisations like haemophilia scotland and the recommendations will be adhered to in a way that perhaps they haven't been in the past. so, with the minister agree

that having the involvement with various groups of affected and infected people will help to ensure that that happens?— that that happens? absolutely, i auree that that happens? absolutely, i a . ree with that that happens? absolutely, i agree with the _ that that happens? absolutely, i agree with the honourable - that that happens? absolutely, i agree with the honourable lady l that that happens? absolutely, i i agree with the honourable lady and when i went to edinburgh i was keen to meet a representative group of scottish infected blood campaign organisations, and i did and i had a very candid conversation with them. i set out where we were as a government, what we were planning to do on this day. at a high level. those conversations need to continue. as i say, the immediate priority is under sir robert francis �*s guidance and that engagement will continue through the month ofjune so that these regulations are informed by the wisdom experienced and views of those we are seeking to support. flan and views of those we are seeking to su ort. . and views of those we are seeking to su . ort, ., , ., and views of those we are seeking to suuort, ., , ., ,y and views of those we are seeking to suuort. . ,. ,, support. can i start by commending my constituency _ support. can i start by commending my constituency labour, _ support. can i start by commending my constituency labour, the - support. can i start by commending

my constituency labour, the right l my constituency labour, the right honourable memberfor my constituency labour, the right honourable member for kingston my constituency labour, the right honourable memberfor kingston upon hull north for her courage, determination and persistence in relentlessly pursuing this matter over the years? i wholeheartedly support her call for the rapid payment of compensation before any sufferers die, as i know the minister has that in mind. the prime minister has that in mind. the prime minister said that a travesty like this should never be allowed to happen again, and i think that rests on the whole question of the duty of candle that sir brian langstaff recommended. that means a legally enforcement duty of candle for the entire public service, notjust some promise. as it turns out, we have, the minister has in front of him the opportunity to do that —— candour. the victims and prisoners bill has a clause imposing a duty of candour, in a very limited way. can he look at that clause and expanded to cover the whole of the public sector under

all circumstances?— all circumstances? well, i defer to the riaht all circumstances? well, i defer to the right honourable _ all circumstances? well, i defer to the right honourable gentleman i all circumstances? well, i defer to the right honourable gentleman 's| the right honourable gentleman 's and considerable experience and wisdom on many matters. i do recognise his points, but i do think to move on this matter in this way in this short timeframe would not be the right step. i do think that it would be right for us to urgently engage with him and the committee and others to make sure that the government comes up with the right complete response to deal with a very sensible point that sir brian has made. i very sensible point that sir brian has made. ., ., _ very sensible point that sir brian has made-— very sensible point that sir brian has made. ., ., , ., has made. i want to pay tribute to my constituents _ has made. i want to pay tribute to my constituents and _ has made. i want to pay tribute to my constituents and the _ has made. i want to pay tribute to my constituents and the many - has made. i want to pay tribute to | my constituents and the many who have campaigned and fought for so many years for justice for those affected by this scandal. and also many scandals, with state institutions covering up their wrongdoing and blaming the innocents. how long do we have to wait for those in this place to

finally balance the scales of justice? the events of yesterday show how necessary it is to end the culture of cover—ups that have shamefully been hard—wired into our institutions. i shamefully been hard-wired into our institutions. , . , , . institutions. i very much respect the points _ institutions. i very much respect the points he — institutions. i very much respect the points he has _ institutions. i very much respect the points he has made. - institutions. i very much respect the points he has made. in - institutions. i very much respect i the points he has made. in regard institutions. i very much respect - the points he has made. in regard to hillsborough, i am the points he has made. in regard to hillsborough, iam not the points he has made. in regard to hillsborough, i am not able to answer his question specifically on that. my remarks are around the compensation scheme. but they are a number of comments made about the incidence of public inquiries in a range of issues, what that says about our state and the failure of it in different ways, and as the honourable gentleman says, the considerable effort required that should never have been required by individuals to apprehend the state for what has happened. these are wider matters that we will need to come to terms with, but i don't think i will be able to do justice to his remarks today. mr think i will be able to do 'ustice to his remarks today. mr speaker, i a- reciate to his remarks today. mr speaker, i appreciate the _ to his remarks today. mr speaker, i appreciate the statement _ to his remarks today. mr speaker, i appreciate the statement today - to his remarks today. mr speaker, i appreciate the statement today is l appreciate the statement today is about compensation but there was no

opportunity yesterday or much today to ask specifically about the couegein to ask specifically about the college in hampshire. my constituent sent his son to the college back in the late 70s and early 80s and he wrote to me last month saying how distraught he was that that school is now trying to paint itself as a victim, when in fact we know it was in receipt of funds to conduct experiments on children. can i write on the friend give me some assurance from the dispatch box that the government is considering very carefully how the helsinki declaration may have been breached, and some guidance as to what the steps may be taken? the and some guidance as to what the steps may be taken?— steps may be taken? the right honourable — steps may be taken? the right honourable lady _ steps may be taken? the right honourable lady very - steps may be taken? the right. honourable lady very eloquently makes a very important point, and i have met with in the course of my engagements, a number of former pupils from this school. i believe that sir robert in his report, one full volume contains what happened

there. so many individuals underwent medical treatments that was not envisaged by their parents, and where consent appears not to have been secured. this is a massive aspect of the work of sir brian langstaff and the government will need to examine it very carefully, and the implications for who is culpable and how we should most appropriately respond to avoid anything like that happening again, and i hope what i have said today, with respect to compensation, will give some modest measure of comfort to those that i met, and those like them who are not here today. this care are not _ them who are not here today. this care are not words _ them who are not here today. this care are not words enough to pay tribute to all those campaigners, infected and affected, and they include my constituent lynn who lost bill. i pay tribute to my right on

the friend the member for kingston upon hull north and journalist like caroline wheeler. the smiths lost colin aged just seven years old to aids, having been given infected blood from arkansas prison at ten months. we now know from the inquiry the risks of giving this blood were known. the family want "sorry" to turn into something today for those who die every week. on their behalf can i say to the minister today, make sure we have a proper timeline for this that we stick to. implement the recommendations as fast as possible. put the victims at the heart of the decision making, and no more delays. this group of people have waited far too long and have been through far too much already. finally, mr speaker, the smith family want his son to have his name back, although they have always made sure that we have never forgotten it. can i say today, colinjohn smith.

it. can i say today, colin john smith. ., ~ i. it. can i say today, colin john smith. ., ~ ., ., ., , smith. thank you. the honourable lady makes _ smith. thank you. the honourable lady makes a _ smith. thank you. the honourable lady makes a moving _ smith. thank you. the honourable lady makes a moving tribute - smith. thank you. the honourable lady makes a moving tribute to . smith. thank you. the honourable| lady makes a moving tribute to her constituents, and i can assure her that the government has heard the pleas that have been made, and we have set out today a clear timetable on the journey to the regulations and i will update the house later in the early autumn with the speaker 's permission, and where we have got to and then the timeline for further detail, subject to the advice of the interim ceo and the interim chair. she makes the point about stigma as well, which is obviously a massive, massive part of this for so many that i have met and for her constituents and the smith family. we recognise that as part of the scheme. i think the memorialisation process must also recognise, particularly those who were so badly stigmatise in the 80s and 90s. i

stigmatise in the 805 and 905. i know 5tigmati5e in the 805 and 905. i know from meeting some of the affected community in peterborough, the minister talked about stigma. i heard about the disk of a nation that they face, and also a lack of trust in public institutions, many of the community faces. this all leaves a very long legacy. with this in mind, how confident is he that this scheme will benefit, or will affect everyone infected and everyone affected will capture everybody, and how confident is he that everyone who should be compensated will come forward? i compensated will come forward? 1 think the honourable gentleman compensated will come forward? i think the honourable gentleman for his question and i am confident that this scheme will work. it will work as quickly as it possibly can. i mentioned the interim payments of £210,000 today do the infected who are alive, but the speed with which

we process applications of affected and infected is very much what is on my mind as we have set up this shadow board and i will continue to work with my officials to do everything we can to move the timeline from the right to the left, conscious of how long people have waited. , ., ., waited. first of all, can i welcome the fact that _ waited. first of all, can i welcome the fact that the _ waited. first of all, can i welcome the fact that the minister - waited. first of all, can i welcome the fact that the minister has - waited. first of all, can i welcome i the fact that the minister has moved so quickly. the sorrow expressed yesterday had to be translated into action, and the fact that the authority has been setup, the chairman who will have the confidence of the victims has been established, and payments will be made quickly, at least interim payments, is good. but people like my constituent trevor marston, who was used as an experiment by people who described children as cheaper than chimps and more readily available, will only, justice will

only be given when those who cynically used their position, they devised experiments, denied that they were happening, then tried to destroy the evidence and then defend their actions. those people only have justice when the elite within the civil service, and the professionals who cynically abuse their positions, know that they will face criminal charges because that's what they are. faced those charges and this government must make sure that all the evidence is made available so that it can be brought to justice. the available so that it can be brought to 'ustice. ., ., ., , to justice. the right honourable gentleman _ to justice. the right honourable gentleman makes _ to justice. the right honourable gentleman makes a _ to justice. the right honourable gentleman makes a powerful. gentleman makes a powerful representation on behalf of trevor and more generally with respect to some of the conclusions that sir brian has made in his remarks. what happened was truly shameful with respect to experimentation. as he will be aware, today i am speaking

to the issue of compensation. but it is an urgent matter to really isolate who knew what and when, and take that from the report and establish what courses of action in different ways across a range of issues that we have raised in the house today, what is the most appropriate way to deal with all of them. ., . ., ., , them. can i welcome what my right under friend — them. can i welcome what my right under friend has _ them. can i welcome what my right under friend has set _ them. can i welcome what my right under friend has set out. _ them. can i welcome what my right under friend has set out. i - them. can i welcome what my rightj under friend has set out. i welcome in particular the efforts that he and his predecessors have clearly made to remove friction from the process of getting the victims of this unforgivable episode, the compensation they clearly deserved. he will recognise that, as the system bed down and begins to operate, there is always the risk of that friction creeping back in, and can he make sure that he and his ministerial colleagues keep their eyes on this process, work with sir robert francis to make sure that this process continues to be without friction, so that people continue to be able to easily access the

compensation they need? absolutely. m riaht compensation they need? absolutely. my right under— compensation they need? absolutely. my right under friend _ compensation they need? absolutely. my right under friend makes - compensation they need? absolutely. my right under friend makes a - compensation they need? absolutely. my right under friend makes a wise i my right under friend makes a wise point. the need to swiftly expedite payments in full to as many qualifying people as possible is the imperative that has guided me to this point, and it will be the imperative that sir robert will take forward in his conversations. we must not introduce unnecessary complexity to establish peoples qualifications to receive payments when that is unnecessary. so there is a tension but we have actually got to resolve it, to get these payments out. that's why we will need to prioritise, particularly around those groups that are infected and alive and many of those who are suffering the most, many of whom i met recently. mr who are suffering the most, many of whom i met recently.— whom i met recently. mr speaker, does the minister _

whom i met recently. mr speaker, does the minister understand - whom i met recently. mr speaker, does the minister understand that | whom i met recently. mr speaker, i does the minister understand that as well as a duty of candour, really, really need is my right friend the member for hillwood really need is my right friend the memberfor hillwood has really need is my right friend the member for hillwood has consistently put before this house, a public advocate to make certain that victims in the future of scandals such as this have somebody to look after them and take them through processes, and that would stop this happening ever again. can he say something about when he expects all of the payments to have been made question he talks about an interim scheme which goes on until the end of this financial year, and then he is talking about the full payments being made going further forward. when is his deadline for getting this done? i when is his deadline for getting this done? . ~ when is his deadline for getting this done? ., ~ ., ., ., , this done? i thank the honourable lad for this done? i thank the honourable lady for her _ this done? i thank the honourable lady for her question. _ this done? i thank the honourable lady for her question. she - this done? i thank the honourable lady for her question. she talks i lady for her question. she talks about a public advocate. i am not in about a public advocate. i am not in a position to respond to that today, but it is clearly one option that is available, and it will be part of a wider response to the report. to be

clear, the interim payments of £210,000 that i have announced today do the infected life will be paid within 90 days starting in the summer, but the full payments will begin by the end of the year. i am constrained somewhat because we are setting up an arms length body. there is an interim chief executive and i think there will be 20 people employed in this organisation by the end of next week, but i can't account for the processes and the way it will be established, and therefore how quickly, but everything i have said to david foley, the interim chief executive, is designed to impress on him at the need for speed to expedite as many of these claims as quickly as possible in full.— of these claims as quickly as possible in full. of these claims as quickly as ossible in full. ., . ., possible in full. can i commend the minister on — possible in full. can i commend the minister on his _ possible in full. can i commend the minister on his statement. - possible in full. can i commend the minister on his statement. i - possible in full. can i commend the minister on his statement. i know. minister on his statement. i know from our compensation how seriously he takes his moral duty on this issue. and i also know my work in

the cabinet office in 2022 that one of the most fraught areas of consideration will be a wider eligibility. that is notjust a function of complexity, it is also a function of complexity, it is also a function of complexity, it is also a function of capacity. the minister mentioned the arms length body will have 20 employees in the next couple of weeks, but could he just reassure the house that if sir robert francis comes back in a few months�* time and said in order to make quick decisions we need more capacity, and therefore more people, there will be no quibbling on adequate resource in this organisation until ministers rightly identify the priority of getting this money out as quickly as possible to as many people as possible? i thank ithank him i thank him for what he did when he was in office to bring forward interim payments and to make progress. he�*s right with respect for the business case for the arm�*s—length body under plans for

the number of people to be employed in its. i expect robert francis and the interim chief executive to work out plans to expedited as quickly as possible and to assert what they needin possible and to assert what they need in terms of resourcing to make it deliver as quickly as possible. i will do everything i can to prioritise swift delivery in the decisions i make.— prioritise swift delivery in the decisions i make. thank you, mr seaker. decisions i make. thank you, mr speaker- the — decisions i make. thank you, mr speaker. the timeline _ decisions i make. thank you, mr speaker. the timeline in - decisions i make. thank you, mr speaker. the timeline in sir i decisions i make. thank you, mr | speaker. the timeline in sir brian langstaff�*s report highlights the b of failures, delays and cover—ups over decades that resulted in even more patients being supposed to hepatitis c and hiv. while several countries accepted liability and set of conversations schemes in the 19905, uk of conversations schemes in the 1990s, uk victims have had to spend another 30 years of their lives not

just dealing with ill—health,