we know most voters could vote in may but we still collecting all of the data on about how many people were able to and how many people had difficulties. we were able to and how many people had difficulties. ~ ., ., ., difficulties. we have to leave it there but thank _ difficulties. we have to leave it there but thank you _ difficulties. we have to leave it there but thank you for - difficulties. we have to leave it there but thank you for some l difficulties. we have to leave it| there but thank you for some of those pieces of advice. if you haven't registered there is still time. let's turn back to the campaign trail in stoke to caroline lucas the mp for brighton and the green party's only mp. i asked our other political contributors this question, were you surprised at the election was called yesterday? totally gobsmacked. yes, it took me totally— totally gobsmacked. yes, it took me totally by— totally gobsmacked. yes, it took me totally by surprise. i had bought into the — totally by surprise. i had bought into the idea that we were looking at an— into the idea that we were looking at an autumn election and it has required — at an autumn election and it has required a — at an autumn election and it has required a shifting of meetings and priorities— required a shifting of meetings and priorities and plans. | required a shifting of meetings and priorities and plans.— required a shifting of meetings and priorities and plans. i know you are standin: priorities and plans. i know you are standing down _ priorities and plans. i know you are standing down but _ priorities and plans. i know you are standing down but you _ priorities and plans. i know you are standing down but you had - priorities and plans. i know you are standing down but you had as - priorities and plans. i know you are | standing down but you had as green

is a good set of local elections. what is the best case scenario as we go into this general election for the green party? we go into this general election for the green party?— go into this general election for the green party? go into this general election for the green pa ? ~ ., , ., ., the green party? we are planning to stand in every _ the green party? we are planning to stand in every constituency - the green party? we are planning to stand in every constituency possible | stand in every constituency possible so that's _ stand in every constituency possible so that's going to be the first time we have _ so that's going to be the first time we have done that. of course the prizes _ we have done that. of course the prizes winning some seats so as well as holding _ prizes winning some seats so as well as holding onto the seat in brighton paviiion— as holding onto the seat in brighton pavilion there are three other target — pavilion there are three other target seats we have in bristol, headed — target seats we have in bristol, headed fish in north and waveney valley— headed fish in north and waveney valley in— headed fish in north and waveney valley in suffolk and we are looking on course _ valley in suffolk and we are looking on course to do well in all of those three _ on course to do well in all of those three at— on course to do well in all of those three at a — on course to do well in all of those three. at a minimum i hope we will -et three. at a minimum i hope we will get more _ three. at a minimum i hope we will get more mp5 the next time around. that matters because it looks pretty likely i_ that matters because it looks pretty likely i think that labour will be the next — likely i think that labour will be the next government that the question— the next government that the question is what kind of labour government and if people want a labour— government and if people want a labour government that is going to be botder— labour government that is going to be bolder and braver than the best way to— be bolder and braver than the best way to do— be bolder and braver than the best way to do that is to get greens into

pariiament— way to do that is to get greens into parliament to hold the next government to account whoever they are and _ government to account whoever they are and push them to be brave and bold are and push them to be brave and hold when— are and push them to be brave and bold when it comes to the challenges ahead _ bold when it comes to the challenges ahead. we _ bold when it comes to the challenges ahead. ~ . , bold when it comes to the challenges ahead. ~ ., , ., ahead. we have seen the government over the last — ahead. we have seen the government over the last 12 _ ahead. we have seen the government over the last 12 months _ ahead. we have seen the government over the last 12 months trim - ahead. we have seen the government over the last 12 months trim the - ahead. we have seen the government over the last 12 months trim the net l over the last 12 months trim the net zero policy, we have seen the labour party trimmed their £28 billion green economic plan. both in the sense point to the country simply not being able to afford what had previously been set out. truth? not being able to afford what had previously been set out.- previously been set out. why are they wrong? _ previously been set out. why are they wrong? the _ previously been set out. why are they wrong? the cost _ previously been set out. why are they wrong? the cost of- previously been set out. why are they wrong? the cost of inaction | previously been set out. why are l they wrong? the cost of inaction is vastly— they wrong? the cost of inaction is vastly more — they wrong? the cost of inaction is vastly more than the cost of action. we know_ vastly more than the cost of action. we know the cost of climate change is serious _ we know the cost of climate change is serious and significant even now in terms _ is serious and significant even now in terms of— is serious and significant even now in terms of the costs to the local economy— in terms of the costs to the local economy and the national economy, more _ economy and the national economy, more flooding and freak weather events _ more flooding and freak weather events and drugs. and certainly that's— events and drugs. and certainly that's only going in one direction. those _ that's only going in one direction. those costs— that's only going in one direction. those costs are going to get higher.

everybody _ those costs are going to get higher. everybody from the committee on climate _ everybody from the committee on climate change to un bodies are saying _ climate change to un bodies are saying that we know the costs of tackling — saying that we know the costs of tackling climate change are much less than — tackling climate change are much less than the cost of having to deal with it _ less than the cost of having to deal with it afterwards. we know as well it's actually— with it afterwards. we know as well it's actually one of the best ways of getting — it's actually one of the best ways of getting people back to work, of making _ of getting people back to work, of making a — of getting people back to work, of making a more prosperous economy and getting _ making a more prosperous economy and getting fuei _ making a more prosperous economy and getting fuel bills down would be precisely to do something like a street— precisely to do something like a street try— precisely to do something like a street by street home insulation programme which this government after 14— programme which this government after 14 years has proved unable to do. �* ., ., , ., do. but all of those things need to be aid do. but all of those things need to be paid for- _ do. but all of those things need to be paid for. where _ do. but all of those things need to be paid for. where are _ do. but all of those things need to be paid for. where are you - do. but all of those things need to be paid for. where are you taking| be paid for. where are you taking money from to spend on those areas? there are plenty of places we would not be _ there are plenty of places we would not be spending money, for example an airport _ not be spending money, for example an airport expansion on nuclear power— an airport expansion on nuclear power on — an airport expansion on nuclear power on the roads. the greens are totally— power on the roads. the greens are totally upfront about saying we should — totally upfront about saying we should be having a conversation

about— should be having a conversation about taxes on the wealthiest. it makes _ about taxes on the wealthiest. it makes no — about taxes on the wealthiest. it makes no sense at all we tax income but not _ makes no sense at all we tax income but not assets. many other countries around _ but not assets. many other countries around the _ but not assets. many other countries around the world to have a form of taxation _ around the world to have a form of taxation in— around the world to have a form of taxation in terms of extreme wealth and i_ taxation in terms of extreme wealth and i think— taxation in terms of extreme wealth and i think we should look at that. frankly. _ and i think we should look at that. frankly, loss the policies i am describing pay for themselves over time _ describing pay for themselves over time a _ describing pay for themselves over time. a home insulation programme wouid _ time. a home insulation programme wouid pay— time. a home insulation programme would pay for its self over time because — would pay for its self over time because it _ would pay for its self over time because it would create more employment and it would be good for people's— employment and it would be good for people's health. they would be less demand _ people's health. they would be less demand on the nhs. it would be good for the _ demand on the nhs. it would be good for the pockets because they would not be _ for the pockets because they would not be paying so much on their energy— not be paying so much on their energy bills. that is why i think it's even— energy bills. that is why i think it's even more tragic that neither this government nor it seems the incoming — this government nor it seems the incoming labour government are willing _ incoming labour government are willing to — incoming labour government are willing to act in the interests of both— willing to act in the interests of both the — willing to act in the interests of both the environment and of people. it's both the environment and of people. it's really— both the environment and of people. it's really interesting because with the government and the labour party there are politicians obviously squeamish about talking about putting taxes up but he are being quite clear that you think taxes for

some people should go up. for the extremely wealthy. _ some people should go up. for the extremely wealthy. for _ some people should go up. for the extremely wealthy. for the - some people should go up. for the extremely wealthy. for the top - some people should go up. for thei extremely wealthy. for the top 1%, some people should go up. for the. extremely wealthy. for the top 1%, i would _ extremely wealthy. for the top 1%, i would have — extremely wealthy. for the top 1%, i would have no problem in saying that for them _ would have no problem in saying that for them taxes should go up. countries _ for them taxes should go up. countries like switzerland, that was not a _ countries like switzerland, that was not a radical regime and the sky didn't— not a radical regime and the sky didn't fait— not a radical regime and the sky didn't fall in. you have groups like the petrie — didn't fall in. you have groups like the petrie artic millionaires who are what— the petrie artic millionaires who are what they say they are, they are patriotic— are what they say they are, they are patriotic millionaires who believe they should be more taxes on assets notjust_ they should be more taxes on assets notjust income. i would be the first— notjust income. i would be the first to — notjust income. i would be the first to say— notjust income. i would be the first to say that ordinary people are paying a lot of tax right now and we — are paying a lot of tax right now and we could have a much fairer tax system _ and we could have a much fairer tax system if _ and we could have a much fairer tax system if we — and we could have a much fairer tax system if we were willing to attack some _ system if we were willing to attack some of— system if we were willing to attack some of those with extreme wealth a bit more _ some of those with extreme wealth a bit more -- — some of those with extreme wealth a bit more. —— tax. some of those with extreme wealth a bit more. -- tax.— bit more. -- tax. what voters are most concerned _ bit more. -- tax. what voters are most concerned about _ bit more. -- tax. what voters are most concerned about is - bit more. -- tax. what voters are most concerned about is things . bit more. -- tax. what voters are l most concerned about is things like cost of living and health and education. what are the greens offering on those basic key things?

on the cost of living for example its energy— on the cost of living for example its energy bills which is one of the major— its energy bills which is one of the major concerns people have had and we would _ major concerns people have had and we would not locked into a dependence on fossil feels then we could _ dependence on fossil feels then we could get— dependence on fossil feels then we could get our energy bills down. so precisely— could get our energy bills down. so precisely the kinds of policies that would _ precisely the kinds of policies that would see — precisely the kinds of policies that would see is invest in green energy would _ would see is invest in green energy would go _ would see is invest in green energy would go a — would see is invest in green energy would go a long way to tackle the cost of _ would go a long way to tackle the cost of living crisis. when it comes to health. — cost of living crisis. when it comes to health, we want to keep the nhs property— to health, we want to keep the nhs properly public but we also want to tackle _ properly public but we also want to tackle issues like a pollution. air pollution — tackle issues like a pollution. air pollution is causing huge amount of asthma _ pollution is causing huge amount of asthma and ill—health so we would look at _ asthma and ill—health so we would look at some of the causes of ill health— look at some of the causes of ill health as — look at some of the causes of ill health as well. when it comes to things— health as well. when it comes to things like — health as well. when it comes to things like the sewage in our waters we are _ things like the sewage in our waters we are the _ things like the sewage in our waters we are the first ones to say we should — we are the first ones to say we should be _ we are the first ones to say we should be bringing water back into public— should be bringing water back into public ownership is a first step toward — public ownership is a first step toward cleaning that up and making sure essentially the money that should — sure essentially the money that should be going into renovating over victorian— should be going into renovating over victorian infrastructure, that money should _ victorian infrastructure, that money should be _ victorian infrastructure, that money should be going into doing that not into iining — should be going into doing that not into lining the pockets of distant

shareholders. we believe our offer on the _ shareholders. we believe our offer on the doorstep is one that is resonant— on the doorstep is one that is resonant with a huge number of people — resonant with a huge number of people and people would like to see that botd _ people and people would like to see that bold view represented in parliament. | that bold view represented in parliament.— that bold view represented in parliament. ., ., ., ., , ., parliament. i am going to ask you one more question, _ parliament. i am going to ask you one more question, what - parliament. i am going to ask you one more question, what sort - parliament. i am going to ask you one more question, what sort of i one more question, what sort of election do you think this is going to be? what do you fear, do you fear there is a danger of it becoming very personal? do you fear they will be messages playing on scaring people? i be messages playing on scaring --eole? ., ~' be messages playing on scaring --eole? ., ,, ., ., ., people? i do think we are at a situation right _ people? i do think we are at a situation right now _ people? i do think we are at a situation right now where - people? i do think we are at a i situation right now where people people? i do think we are at a - situation right now where people are pretty— situation right now where people are pretty turned off by the whole boiiticai — pretty turned off by the whole political process. it looks as if politicians are taking lumps out of each other— politicians are taking lumps out of each other and that is not very inspiring _ each other and that is not very inspiring. so i hope we will talk about— inspiring. so i hope we will talk about policies rather than attacking individuals. i hope we will be able to inject— individuals. i hope we will be able to inject a — individuals. i hope we will be able to inject a bit of hope into this debate — to inject a bit of hope into this debate because there are ways we can make _ debate because there are ways we can make this _ debate because there are ways we can make this country so much better and

there _ make this country so much better and there are _ make this country so much better and there are positive policies we can promote — there are positive policies we can promote. and i hope people will be honest _ promote. and i hope people will be honest. that is the biggest concern is that— honest. that is the biggest concern is that you — honest. that is the biggest concern is that you just have so much deliberate misinformation being put out there _ deliberate misinformation being put out there by all parties that it's not helpful to the political debate. so let's _ not helpful to the political debate. so let's be honest, let's be upfront with the _ so let's be honest, let's be upfront with the british public about the scale _ with the british public about the scaie of— with the british public about the scale of the challenges we face but also make — scale of the challenges we face but also make clear there are some positive — also make clear there are some positive answers out there. thank ou for positive answers out there. thank you forjoining _ positive answers out there. thank you forjoining us. _ positive answers out there. thank you forjoining us. in _ positive answers out there. thank you forjoining us. in terms - positive answers out there. thank you forjoining us. in terms of - positive answers out there. thank| you forjoining us. in terms of that final point caroline was making we were hearing on the programme a while ago that throughout the course of the next six weeks we will regularly return to our colleagues at verify just to explore into regularly return to our colleagues at verifyjust to explore into great depth and try to get to the bottom of some of the claims that are being made during this campaign. let's turn to the polling because polls

collected before yesterday's announcement give labour a 20 percentage point lead over the conservatives and it's still too soon to see how the public mood will shift now and election is imminent but the big trends over the past few months give some pointers on the scale of the task facing the political parties. our poll tracker will be keeping you up to date throughout the election campaign and our head of statistics is here with the latest. ., ., ., ., , the latest. you are about to be bombarded _ the latest. you are about to be bombarded by _ the latest. you are about to be bombarded by polls _ the latest. you are about to be bombarded by polls for- the latest. you are about to be bombarded by polls for the - the latest. you are about to be l bombarded by polls for the next the latest. you are about to be - bombarded by polls for the next six weeks and we will be combining all of this data from all of the different polling companies to give you a sense of the big trends. you can see that 20 point lead labour have opened up recently but let's go back overly to the start of the parliament. the conservatives really hit a high point of a labour in

early april and 2020 a week after borisjohnson announced the early april and 2020 a week after boris johnson announced the first lockdown. they lead to drift downward as lockdown scheme and went and came again but if you remember in december that year margaret keenan got the first coronavirus vaccine and as the roll—out got under way the conservatives opened up under way the conservatives opened up a bit of a lead again. even taking a by—election seat and top place on the council in hartlepool from labour. but here is the last point you could say that the poll average for the tories was at or above labour. november the 30th 2021 is the day that stories of lockdown parties in downing street first had the papers. for much of 2022 any gap in favour of labour was a little bit smaller than a cautious statistician would say it's definitely because the tories could be higher here and labour could be a bit lower. but there was a big kick in the polls

just around the time of the mini budget in september and you can see that the conservatives hit the low point and lay with a high point in mid—october, the day before rishi sunak took over. there was a quick partial rebound and after that they did pick up a little bit of ground gradually on labour early in 2023. since then labour has been hovering in the mid—40s but the tory vote has been slipping a bit since then. so the conservatives... experts and politicians themselves to take polls with a pinch of salt but they don't ignore them. and look at the biggest events of the last five years you do get a feel for how much it takes to really shift public

opinion. much it takes to really shift public 0 - inion. , much it takes to really shift public oinion. , ., ., much it takes to really shift public oinion, , ., ., .,, opinion. plenty more from robert throu~h opinion. plenty more from robert through the _ opinion. plenty more from robert through the coming _ opinion. plenty more from robert through the coming weeks. - opinion. plenty more from robert through the coming weeks. just l opinion. plenty more from robert through the coming weeks. just a j through the coming weeks. just a reminder that you can stay right up—to—date with all of the election coverage on the bbc news website. that is constantly being updated by our correspondence on the ground with the various political leaders and various video and latest analysis available to you. we will be back in the campaign trail in the next few minutes but let's turn to allow the big story today. the ex post office was polyvinyl given a second day of evidence at a public inquiry into

the horizon it scandal so let's head their to our correspondent who has been listening to everything through the course of today. yesterday we had tears from paul venables and some tough questioning. what have we had this afternoon? it some tough questioning. what have we had this afternoon?— had this afternoon? it certainly hasn't been — had this afternoon? it certainly hasn't been as _ had this afternoon? it certainly hasn't been as emotional - had this afternoon? it certainly hasn't been as emotional as i hasn't been as emotional as yesterday. here today we are seeing her answer these questions and straightforwardly and sometimes comparatively you will remember she was chief executive between 2012 and 2019. those with a letter use of the scandal. the part of the scandal where sub—postmaster is accused the post office of an alleged cover—up. that is what the inquiry counsel has been zeroing in on today. forensic as he always is and he has focused on the year 2013. that is when the

forensic investigators were hired. he has put it to paula vennells that once that interim report was delivered highlighting the fact there could be problems with past prosecutions the executive team decided to shield the ball from that information. paula vennells denies that but jason bay put it to her that but jason bay put it to her that the executive team was concerned that once the board was away they would then notify sub—postmaster is, parliament and even the public. she was also pressed on the fact that i a top lawyer who had delivered a report highlighting that perhaps they were not being proactive about the issue of past criminal covered extinctions had a difficult relationship with paula vennells. susan crichton gave evidence earlier saying that she had a bust up with paula vennells and was then made to sit on a chair

outside of the board meeting. paula vennells said she didn't remember that happening. she did remember her being excluded from the board meeting but not any bust up prior to that. and another key part of this is the media strategy. earlier today the inquiry was shown an e—mail by mark davies the head of pr at the post office who oversaw an aggressive campaign during his time there. he e—mailed paula vennells advising that if they were to respond to second xi's report by looking back at previous prosecutions through a larger timescale it would make front page news. and paula vennells responded, i will take your stay. jason be credited to her that media should not be the concern here when it comes to these prior criminal

convictions or possible miscarriages ofjustice. paula vennells insisted that despite how that e—mail read media outcomes didn't factor into a decision making. i believe the inquiry is still going on and we have come to her queue a lot more about this alleged cover—up so it's worth taking a listen. it would be sensible to tell alice first and — it would be sensible to tell alice first and she wondered if susan was overreacting and she could be right. she will— overreacting and she could be right. she will undoubtedly make the legal case against it and emotionally she might— case against it and emotionally she might throw in the towel if we press ahead _ might throw in the towel if we press ahead it _ might throw in the towel if we press ahead. it might also be a way of saying _ ahead. it might also be a way of saying she — ahead. it might also be a way of saying she can't cope with more pressure — saying she can't cope with more pressure. if she leaves in the short term _ pressure. if she leaves in the short term it _ pressure. if she leaves in the short term it witt— pressure. if she leaves in the short term it will be a major setback. she is demonstrating she wants to right

the wrong — is demonstrating she wants to right the wrong. she has the confidence of the wrong. she has the confidence of the internal— the wrong. she has the confidence of the internal team. the wrong. she has the confidence of the internalteam. i need to the wrong. she has the confidence of the internal team. i need to find a way of— the internal team. i need to find a way of coming this time and buy time to think— way of coming this time and buy time to think carefully. we can do a iessons — to think carefully. we can do a lessons learned internally and if we do it ourselves they could be some reconciliation. how we handle this was a _ reconciliation. how we handle this was a great deal about the values of the business. and then reflections, susan _ the business. and then reflections, susan was — the business. and then reflections, susan was very emotional... the line ou susan was very emotional... the line you haven't — susan was very emotional... the line you haven't read _ susan was very emotional... the line you haven't read is _ susan was very emotional... the line you haven't read is possibly - you haven't read is possibly important _ you haven't read is possibly important. neal— you haven't read is possibly important. neal was- you haven't read is possibly important. neal was the . you haven't read is possibly- important. neal was the senior independent _ important. neal was the senior independent director— important. neal was the senior independent director and - important. neal was the senior independent director and i- important. neal was the senior independent director and i was| independent director and i was obviously— independent director and i was obviously going _ independent director and i was obviously going to _ independent director and i was obviously going to talk - independent director and i was obviously going to talk to - independent director and i was obviously going to talk to him i independent director and i was - obviously going to talk to him about susan _ obviously going to talk to him about susan and _ obviously going to talk to him about susan and that _ obviously going to talk to him about susan and that could _ obviously going to talk to him about susan and that could have _ obviously going to talk to him about susan and that could have been - obviously going to talk to him about susan and that could have been full| susan and that could have been full of three _ susan and that could have been full of three reasons. _ susan and that could have been full of three reasons. i— susan and that could have been full of three reasons. i may— susan and that could have been full of three reasons. i may have - susan and that could have been full of three reasons. i may have askedj of three reasons. i may have asked because _ of three reasons. i may have asked because if— of three reasons. i may have asked because if there _ of three reasons. i may have asked because if there is _ of three reasons. i may have asked because if there is an _ of three reasons. i may have asked because if there is an issue - of three reasons. i may have asked because if there is an issue you - because if there is an issue you speak— because if there is an issue you speak to — because if there is an issue you speak to the _ because if there is an issue you speak to the set _ because if there is an issue you speak to the set and _ because if there is an issue you speak to the set and he - because if there is an issue you speak to the set and he may. because if there is an issue you i speak to the set and he may have suggested — speak to the set and he may have suggested it— speak to the set and he may have suggested it because _ speak to the set and he may have suggested it because he - speak to the set and he may have suggested it because he would i speak to the set and he may have i suggested it because he would have been away— suggested it because he would have been away or— suggested it because he would have been away or alice's _ suggested it because he would have been away or alice's health - suggested it because he would have been away or alice's health was i been away or alice's health was generally— been away or alice's health was generally quite _ been away or alice's health was generally quite straightforward i been away or alice's health was i generally quite straightforward may have suggested _ generally quite straightforward may have suggested i— generally quite straightforward may have suggested i speak— generally quite straightforward may have suggested i speak to- generally quite straightforward may

have suggested i speak to neil. i generally quite straightforward may have suggested i speak to neil. iiiiti�*ej have suggested i speak to neil. we have suggested i speak to neil. have e—mails of you sending this bits of— have e—mails of you sending this bits of the — have e—mails of you sending this bits of the notes onto meal. in both meeting _ bits of the notes onto meal. in both meeting susan was emotional. she swings _ meeting susan was emotional. she swings between wanting to get away from it _ swings between wanting to get away from it att— swings between wanting to get away from it all with a settlement and leave _ from it all with a settlement and leave immediately to building a case to fight— leave immediately to building a case to fight and defend her reputation to fight and defend her reputation to accepting that the most satisfactory outcome would be to manage — satisfactory outcome would be to manage the mediation scheme through to a satisfactory ongoing process. each _ to a satisfactory ongoing process. each time — to a satisfactory ongoing process. each time we finished the meeting positively— each time we finished the meeting positively and we found ourselves with the _ positively and we found ourselves with the second site interim report. she wished — with the second site interim report. she wished she never allowed alice to persuade her to do the independent review. she showed in her view— independent review. she showed in her view have resigned over it at the time — her view have resigned over it at the time. what does that refer to? that is— the time. what does that refer to? that is what— the time. what does that refer to? that is what i mentioned earlier today — that is what i mentioned earlier today which _ that is what i mentioned earlier today. which i _ that is what i mentioned earlier today. which i didn't— that is what i mentioned earlier today. which i didn't or- that is what i mentioned earlier today. which i didn't or couldn't remember— today. which i didn't or couldn't remember or— today. which i didn't or couldn't remember or didn't— today. which i didn't or couldn't remember or didn't even- today. which i didn't or couldn't- remember or didn't even understand at the _ remember or didn't even understand

at the time — remember or didn't even understand at the time she _ remember or didn't even understand at the time. she had _ remember or didn't even understand at the time. she had commissionedl at the time. she had commissioned had the _ at the time. she had commissioned had the meeting _ at the time. she had commissioned had the meeting with _ at the time. she had commissioned had the meeting with richard - at the time. she had commissioned l had the meeting with richard morgan and the _ had the meeting with richard morgan and the lawyers — had the meeting with richard morgan and the lawyers and _ had the meeting with richard morgan and the lawyers and had _ had the meeting with richard morgan and the lawyers and had come - had the meeting with richard morgan and the lawyers and had come away i and the lawyers and had come away from that— and the lawyers and had come away from that meeting _ and the lawyers and had come away from that meeting with _ and the lawyers and had come away from that meeting with the - and the lawyers and had come awayl from that meeting with the shouldn't of been _ from that meeting with the shouldn't of been a _ from that meeting with the shouldn't of been a review— from that meeting with the shouldn't of been a review possibly. _ from that meeting with the shouldn't of been a review possibly. i- from that meeting with the shouldn't of been a review possibly. i can i of been a review possibly. i can only— of been a review possibly. i can only imagine _ of been a review possibly. i can only imagine that _ of been a review possibly. i can only imagine that she - of been a review possibly. i can only imagine that she spoke i of been a review possibly. i can only imagine that she spoke to| of been a review possibly. i can i only imagine that she spoke to alice about— only imagine that she spoke to alice about that _ only imagine that she spoke to alice about that and — only imagine that she spoke to alice about that and i _ only imagine that she spoke to alice about that and i was _ only imagine that she spoke to alice about that and i was out _ only imagine that she spoke to alice about that and i was out of - only imagine that she spoke to alice about that and i was out of that i about that and i was out of that ioop~ _ about that and i was out of that loop i— about that and i was out of that ioop~ ithink— about that and i was out of that loop. i think that _ about that and i was out of that loop. i think that is _ about that and i was out of that loop. i think that is what - about that and i was out of that loop. i think that is what that i about that and i was out of thatl loop. i think that is what that is. that— loop. i think that is what that is. that doesn't _ loop. i think that is what that is. that doesn't really— loop. i think that is what that is. that doesn't really make - loop. i think that is what that is. that doesn't really make sense. | loop. i think that is what that is. i that doesn't really make sense. she wished _ that doesn't really make sense. she wished she — that doesn't really make sense. she wished she had never allowed alice to persuade her to do the independent review. the woman is doing _ independent review. the woman is doing an _ independent review. the woman is doing an independent review are they? _ doing an independent review are they? frie— doing an independent review are the ? y , ., doing an independent review are the ? g , ., ., , they? my understanding of this with hindsiaht is they? my understanding of this with hindsight is that _ they? my understanding of this with hindsight is that susan _ they? my understanding of this with hindsight is that susan had - they? my understanding of this with hindsight is that susan had gone i they? my understanding of this with hindsight is that susan had gone to | hindsight is that susan had gone to alice because — hindsight is that susan had gone to alice because you're _ hindsight is that susan had gone to alice because you're remember- hindsight is that susan had gone tol alice because you're remember that alice because you're remember that aiice taiked — alice because you're remember that alice talked about _ alice because you're remember that alice talked about kickback - alice because you're remember that

alice talked about kickback from i alice because you're remember thatj alice talked about kickback from the business _ alice talked about kickback from the business and — alice talked about kickback from the business and i— alice talked about kickback from the business and i had _ alice talked about kickback from the business and i had not _ alice talked about kickback from the business and i had not been - alice talked about kickback from the | business and i had not been involved in that— business and i had not been involved in that conversation. _ business and i had not been involved in that conversation. she _ business and i had not been involved in that conversation. she had - business and i had not been involved in that conversation. she had taken i in that conversation. she had taken advice _ in that conversation. she had taken advice from — in that conversation. she had taken advice from richard _ in that conversation. she had taken advice from richard morgan - in that conversation. she had taken advice from richard morgan who i in that conversation. she had taken. advice from richard morgan who had said very— advice from richard morgan who had said very clearly _ advice from richard morgan who had said very clearly this _ advice from richard morgan who had said very clearly this is _ advice from richard morgan who had said very clearly this is just - advice from richard morgan who had said very clearly this is just a - advice from richard morgan who had said very clearly this is just a no i said very clearly this is just a no win situation. _ said very clearly this is just a no win situation. she _ said very clearly this is just a no win situation. she had - said very clearly this is just a no win situation. she had a - win situation. she had a conversation _ win situation. she had a conversation with- win situation. she had a conversation with alice i win situation. she had a i conversation with alice and win situation. she had a - conversation with alice and alice had persuaded _ conversation with alice and alice had persuaded susan— conversation with alice and alice had persuaded susan that - conversation with alice and alice had persuaded susan that we i conversation with alice and alice i had persuaded susan that we needed to continue _ had persuaded susan that we needed to continue with _ had persuaded susan that we needed to continue with the _ had persuaded susan that we needed to continue with the independent i to continue with the independent review _ to continue with the independent review. , ., , , . ., review. then you see my reflection on what happened _ review. then you see my reflection on what happened with _ review. then you see my reflection on what happened with second i review. then you see my reflection | on what happened with second sight as i on what happened with second sight as i write _ on what happened with second sight as i write this today in the 2nd of september 2013 is that susan was possibly— september 2013 is that susan was possibly more loyal to her professional conduct and put her integrity— professional conduct and put her integrity as a lawyer above the interest — integrity as a lawyer above the interest of the business. when had susan _ interest of the business. when had susan crichton put her professional conduct _ susan crichton put her professional conduct requirements and integrity above _ conduct requirements and integrity above the — conduct requirements and integrity above the interest of the business? i above the interest of the business? i wrote _ above the interest of the business? i wrote this — above the interest of the business? i wrote this completely wrongly. what _ i wrote this completely wrongly. what i _ i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was — i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was trying _ i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was trying to _ i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was trying to say- i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was trying to say if- i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was trying to say if i-

i wrote this completely wrongly. what i was trying to say if i may| i wrote this completely wrongly. l what i was trying to say if i may is as i what i was trying to say if i may is as i said _ what i was trying to say if i may is as i said earlier— what i was trying to say if i may is as i said earlier susan— what i was trying to say if i may is as i said earlier susan had - what i was trying to say if i may is as i said earlier susan had two- as i said earlier susan had two responsibilities— as i said earlier susan had two responsibilities here. - as i said earlier susan had two responsibilities here. and i. responsibilities here. and i respected _ responsibilities here. and i respected it— responsibilities here. and i respected it 100%- responsibilities here. and i respected it 100% at - responsibilities here. and i respected it 100% at the i respected it100% at the professional— respected it100% at the professional conduct- respected it 100% at the - professional conduct requirements respected it 100% at the _ professional conduct requirements of the generai— professional conduct requirements of the general counsel, _ professional conduct requirements of the general counsel, that _ professional conduct requirements of the general counsel, that was - professional conduct requirements of the general counsel, that was her. the general counsel, that was her rote _ the general counsel, that was her rote she — the general counsel, that was her rote she also _ the general counsel, that was her role. she also had _ the general counsel, that was her role. she also had in _ the general counsel, that was her role. she also had in parallel- the general counsel, that was her role. she also had in parallel a i role. she also had in parallel a major— role. she also had in parallel a major project _ role. she also had in parallel a major project that _ role. she also had in parallel a major project that she - role. she also had in parallel a major project that she was i role. she also had in parallel a i major project that she was leading and had _ major project that she was leading and had accountability— major project that she was leading and had accountability for- and had accountability for delivering _ and had accountability for delivering for— and had accountability for delivering for the - and had accountability forl delivering for the business and had accountability for- delivering for the business which was this— delivering for the business which was this independent _ delivering for the business which was this independent review i delivering for the business which was this independent review ledl delivering for the business which i was this independent review led by second _ was this independent review led by second site~ — was this independent review led by second site. the _ was this independent review led by second site. the latter— was this independent review led by second site. the latter had - was this independent review led by| second site. the latter had bumped into att— second site. the latter had bumped into all of— second site. the latter had bumped into all of the — second site. the latter had bumped into all of the issues _ second site. the latter had bumped into all of the issues and _ second site. the latter had bumped into all of the issues and problems i into all of the issues and problems with covered — into all of the issues and problems with covered today— into all of the issues and problems with covered today and _ into all of the issues and problems with covered today and what - into all of the issues and problems with covered today and what i- into all of the issues and problems with covered today and what i wasl with covered today and what i was trying _ with covered today and what i was trying to _ with covered today and what i was trying to say— with covered today and what i was trying to say very _ with covered today and what i was trying to say very badly— with covered today and what i was trying to say very badly is - with covered today and what i was trying to say very badly is she i with covered today and what i was trying to say very badly is she had j trying to say very badly is she had not managed _ trying to say very badly is she had not managed to _ trying to say very badly is she had not managed to combine - trying to say very badly is she had not managed to combine those i trying to say very badly is she had i not managed to combine those two responsibilities— not managed to combine those two responsibilities and _ not managed to combine those two responsibilities and she _ not managed to combine those two responsibilities and she hadn't i not managed to combine those two responsibilities and she hadn't and | responsibilities and she hadn't and ithink— responsibilities and she hadn't and i think this — responsibilities and she hadn't and i think this is — responsibilities and she hadn't and i think this is her— responsibilities and she hadn't and i think this is her point _ responsibilities and she hadn't and i think this is her point about- responsibilities and she hadn't and i think this is her point about she i i think this is her point about she wouldn't — i think this is her point about she wouldn't have _ i think this is her point about she wouldn't have led _ i think this is her point about she wouldn't have led business- i think this is her point about she wouldn't have led business get. i think this is her point about she i wouldn't have led business get into a situation — wouldn't have led business get into a situation that _ wouldn't have led business get into a situation that it _ wouldn't have led business get into a situation that it was, _ wouldn't have led business get into

a situation that it was, she - wouldn't have led business get into a situation that it was, she had i wouldn't have led business get into a situation that it was, she had not| a situation that it was, she had not led the _ a situation that it was, she had not led the project _ a situation that it was, she had not led the project management- a situation that it was, she had not led the project management side l a situation that it was, she had not| led the project management side of that as _ led the project management side of that as well— led the project management side of that as well as _ led the project management side of that as well as she _ led the project management side of that as well as she could _ led the project management side of that as well as she could have i led the project management side of| that as well as she could have done. we had _ that as well as she could have done. we had a _ that as well as she could have done. we had a conversation _ that as well as she could have done. we had a conversation and - that as well as she could have done. we had a conversation and i- that as well as she could have done. we had a conversation and i put - that as well as she could have done. we had a conversation and i put an. we had a conversation and i put an additional— we had a conversation and i put an additional resource _ we had a conversation and i put an additional resource to _ we had a conversation and i put an additional resource to support - we had a conversation and i put an additional resource to support heri additional resource to support her and so _ additional resource to support her and so i _ additional resource to support her and so i am — additional resource to support her and so i am genuinely— additional resource to support her and so i am genuinely very- additional resource to support her and so i am genuinely very sorry. and so i am genuinely very sorry that i_ and so i am genuinely very sorry that i did — and so i am genuinely very sorry that i did not _ and so i am genuinely very sorry that i did not mean _ and so i am genuinely very sorry that i did not mean this- and so i am genuinely very sorry that i did not mean this in- and so i am genuinely very sorry that i did not mean this in the i and so i am genuinely very sorry. that i did not mean this in the way that i did not mean this in the way that it _ that i did not mean this in the way that it could — that i did not mean this in the way that it could be _ that i did not mean this in the way that it could be read. _ that i did not mean this in the way that it could be read. it _ that i did not mean this in the way that it could be read. it was - that it could be read. it was about _ that it could be read. it was about it— that it could be read. it was about---_ that it could be read. it was about... , ., , ., i] about... it is the waiters read. i am really _ about... it is the waiters read. i am really very _ about... it is the waiters read. i am really very clear _ about... it is the waiters read. i am really very clear and - about... it is the waiters read. i am really very clear and i - about... it is the waiters read. i am really very clear and i don'tl am really very clear and i don't think— am really very clear and i don't think there _ am really very clear and i don't think there is _ am really very clear and i don't think there is anything - am really very clear and i don't think there is anything else - am really very clear and i don't think there is anything else in. am really very clear and i don't i think there is anything else in the notes _ think there is anything else in the notes with— think there is anything else in the notes with susan _ think there is anything else in the notes with susan that _ think there is anything else in the notes with susan that puts - think there is anything else in the notes with susan that puts it - think there is anything else in the notes with susan that puts it this| notes with susan that puts it this badly— notes with susan that puts it this badly but— notes with susan that puts it this badly but that _ notes with susan that puts it this badly but that was _ notes with susan that puts it this badly but that was the _ notes with susan that puts it this badly but that was the point - notes with susan that puts it this badly but that was the point is i notes with susan that puts it this l badly but that was the point is that she had _ badly but that was the point is that she had not— badly but that was the point is that she had not balanced _ badly but that was the point is that she had not balanced those - badly but that was the point is that she had not balanced those two . she had not balanced those two aspects — she had not balanced those two aspects of — she had not balanced those two aspects of her _ she had not balanced those two aspects of her role. _ she had not balanced those two aspects of her role. but - she had not balanced those two aspects of her role. but i- she had not balanced those two aspects of her role. but i was . she had not balanced those two i aspects of her role. but i was sure ithink— aspects of her role. but i was sure ithink this — aspects of her role. but i was sure ithihk this is — aspects of her role. but i was sure i think this is now— aspects of her role. but i was sure i think this is now the _ aspects of her role. but i was sure i think this is now the third - aspects of her role. but i was sure i think this is now the third time . i think this is now the third time that i_ i think this is now the third time that i had — i think this is now the third time that i had gone _ i think this is now the third time that i had gone back— i think this is now the third time that i had gone back to- i think this is now the third time that i had gone back to susan. i think this is now the third time i that i had gone back to susan to help her— that i had gone back to susan to help her in— that i had gone back to susan to help her in her— that i had gone back to susan to help her in her words— that i had gone back to susan to help her in her words restore . that i had gone back to susan to| help her in her words restore her reputation — help her in her words restore her reputation and _ help her in her words restore her reputation and give _ help her in her words restore her reputation and give her- help her in her words restore her reputation and give her the - help her in her words restore her. reputation and give her the resource to be _ reputation and give her the resource to be able _ reputation and give her the resource to be able to — reputation and give her the resource to be able to lead _ reputation and give her the resource to be able to lead this— reputation and give her the resource to be able to lead this going - to be able to lead this going forward _ to be able to lead this going forward. ~ , , ., ., to be able to lead this going forward. ~ , y., ., , , forward. why did you write or type somethin: forward. why did you write or type something that _ forward. why did you write or type something that didn't _ forward. why did you write or type something that didn't express - forward. why did you write or type | something that didn't express what you believe? it�*s

something that didn't express what you believe?— you believe? it's clumsy but i did not mean what _ you believe? it's clumsy but i did not mean what this _ you believe? it's clumsy but i did not mean what this reads - you believe? it's clumsy but i did not mean what this reads when l you believe? it's clumsy but i did i not mean what this reads when you read it— not mean what this reads when you read it irr— not mean what this reads when you read it in the — not mean what this reads when you read it in the cold _ not mean what this reads when you read it in the cold light _ not mean what this reads when you read it in the cold light and - not mean what this reads when you read it in the cold light and i- read it in the cold light and i think— read it in the cold light and i think there _ read it in the cold light and i think there are _ read it in the cold light and i think there are plenty- read it in the cold light and i think there are plenty of- read it in the cold light and i. think there are plenty of other documents _ think there are plenty of other documents around _ think there are plenty of other documents around this - think there are plenty of other documents around this that i think there are plenty of other i documents around this that show think there are plenty of other - documents around this that show that it was— documents around this that show that it was that _ documents around this that show that it was that balance _ documents around this that show that it was that balance in _ documents around this that show that it was that balance in the _ documents around this that show that it was that balance in the project - it was that balance in the project management— it was that balance in the project management part _ it was that balance in the project management part of— it was that balance in the project management part of her- it was that balance in the project management part of her role - it was that balance in the project - management part of her role because she was— management part of her role because she was a _ management part of her role because she was a director— management part of her role because she was a director of— management part of her role because she was a director of the _ management part of her role because she was a director of the business - she was a director of the business leading _ she was a director of the business leading this — she was a director of the business leading this piece _ she was a director of the business leading this piece of— she was a director of the business leading this piece of work- she was a director of the business leading this piece of work as - she was a director of the business leading this piece of work as well| leading this piece of work as well as the _ leading this piece of work as well as the lead — leading this piece of work as well as the lead lawyer. _ leading this piece of work as well as the lead lawyer. did _ leading this piece of work as well as the lead lawyer.— as the lead lawyer. did you think there was a _ as the lead lawyer. did you think there was a choice _ as the lead lawyer. did you think there was a choice to _ as the lead lawyer. did you think there was a choice to be - as the lead lawyer. did you think there was a choice to be made? | there was a choice to be made? between — there was a choice to be made? between on the one hand a lawyer ptasma _ between on the one hand a lawyer plasma professional obligations and their integrity and on the other the needs— their integrity and on the other the needs of— their integrity and on the other the needs of the business and susan triton— needs of the business and susan triton had — needs of the business and susan triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't. triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't- why — triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't- why did _ triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't. why did you _ triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't. why did you type _ triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't. why did you type it? - triton had made the wrong choice? no i didn't. why did you type it? i've - i didn't. why did you type it? i've tried to explain. _ i didn't. why did you type it? i've tried to explain. because - i didn't. why did you type it? i've tried to explain. because she - i didn't. why did you type it? i'vej tried to explain. because she had these _ tried to explain. because she had these two — tried to explain. because she had these two areas _ tried to explain. because she had these two areas of _ tried to explain. because she had these two areas of responsibilityl these two areas of responsibility and i_ these two areas of responsibility and i think— these two areas of responsibility and i think she _ these two areas of responsibility and i think she neglected - these two areas of responsibility and i think she neglected the . and i think she neglected the business _ and i think she neglected the business side _ and i think she neglected the business side and _ and i think she neglected the business side and focused i and i think she neglected the business side and focused as| and i think she neglected the - business side and focused as she had to do— business side and focused as she had to do att— business side and focused as she had to do all of— business side and focused as she had to do all of the — business side and focused as she had to do all of the time _ business side and focused as she had to do all of the time in— business side and focused as she had to do all of the time in her— business side and focused as she had to do all of the time in herjob - business side and focused as she had to do all of the time in herjob on - to do all of the time in herjob on the legat—

to do all of the time in herjob on the legal side~ _ to do all of the time in herjob on the legal side. that _ to do all of the time in herjob on the legal side. that is _ to do all of the time in herjob on the legal side. that is what - to do all of the time in herjob on the legal side. that is what i - to do all of the time in herjob on the legal side. that is what i was| the legal side. that is what i was trying _ the legal side. that is what i was trying to— the legal side. that is what i was trying to say _ the legal side. that is what i was trying to say i— the legal side. that is what i was trying to say. i wasn't _ the legal side. that is what i was trying to say. i wasn't trying - the legal side. that is what i was trying to say. i wasn't trying to l trying to say. i wasn't trying to say she — trying to say. i wasn't trying to say she either— trying to say. i wasn't trying to say she either hadn't - trying to say. i wasn't trying to say she either hadn't and - trying to say. i wasn't trying to say she either hadn't and the i trying to say. i wasn't trying to - say she either hadn't and the legal saiga _ say she either hadn't and the legal saiga rifte — say she either hadn't and the legal saiga rifte she _ say she either hadn't and the legal saiga rifle she shouldn't. - say she either hadn't and the legal saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— - say she either hadn't and the legal saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— aw. say she either hadn't and the legal saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— aw i l saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— aw i thought— saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— aw i thought she _ saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— aw i thought she wouldn't. _ saiga rifle she shouldn't. —— aw i thought she wouldn't. tan - saiga rifle she shouldn't. -- awi thought she wouldn't.— saiga rifle she shouldn't. -- awi thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381165- — thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381455. this — thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381455. this is _ thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381455. this is the _ thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381455. this is the note - thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381455. this is the note of - thought she wouldn't. can we look at full 3381455. this is the note of a - full 3381455. this is the note of a meeting — full 3381455. this is the note of a meeting slightly earlier on the 31st ofjuty_ meeting slightly earlier on the 31st ofjuly 2013 between alice perkins and susan triton. you are not present _ and susan triton. you are not present. but he was sent this note. if present. but he was sent this note. if we _ present. but he was sent this note. if we took— present. but he was sent this note. if we took at— present. but he was sent this note. if we look at the bottom of the first page please. the bottom two paragraphs. the board had been

incited _ paragraphs. the board had been incited on— paragraphs. the board had been incited on the issue and had been a land they— incited on the issue and had been a land they found out what happened and the _ land they found out what happened and the fact the full paper had been so htand _ and the fact the full paper had been so bland and did not help to build the confidence in the handling of the confidence in the handling of the affair— the confidence in the handling of the affair they have been the possibility of a discussion on the previous— possibility of a discussion on the previous week but because we are needed _ previous week but because we are needed to— previous week but because we are needed to discuss issues in relation to the _ needed to discuss issues in relation to the strategy and funding negotiations with the government which _ negotiations with the government which required board decisions these had to— which required board decisions these had to come first and we run out of time _ had to come first and we run out of time for— had to come first and we run out of time for the — had to come first and we run out of time for the second site issue. in the course — time for the second site issue. in the course of what followed the following points were made. susan crichton _ following points were made. susan crichton said she now thought it had been right— crichton said she now thought it had been right to have the inquiry as it revealed _ been right to have the inquiry as it revealed the imbalance of power between — revealed the imbalance of power between the postmasters and the post office which needs addressing. this was a _ office which needs addressing. this was a huge — office which needs addressing. this was a huge and complex issue for the business _

was a huge and complex issue for the business. alice perkins commented i thought— business. alice perkins commented i thought the outcome had in some ways been good _ thought the outcome had in some ways been good for the post office the way the — been good for the post office the way the process had been handled had been deeply flawed. i backed susan crichton's _ been deeply flawed. i backed susan crichton'sjudgment on been deeply flawed. i backed susan crichton's judgment on the appointment of second sight because we did _ appointment of second sight because we did not— appointment of second sight because we did not want to appoint one of the big _ we did not want to appoint one of the big four. she seemed very confident— the big four. she seemed very confident in them and given his strongly— confident in them and given his strongly stated opinion to having an inquiry— strongly stated opinion to having an inquiry in _ strongly stated opinion to having an inquiry in the first place i had wanted — inquiry in the first place i had wanted her to feel some ownership of the process— wanted her to feel some ownership of the process once we decided to go down _ the process once we decided to go down that— the process once we decided to go down that route we had lost control of the _ down that route we had lost control of the process and i had lost confidence in simon baker early on but had _ confidence in simon baker early on but had been told repeatedly he was a good _ but had been told repeatedly he was a good and capable of handling the role. a good and capable of handling the role we _ a good and capable of handling the role. we should never have got into a position— role. we should never have got into a position where we didn't see the draft _ a position where we didn't see the draft untit— a position where we didn't see the draft until days before its publication. i understood second site investigation had been dependent but in the civil service they would have been some one marking — they would have been some one marking it — they would have been some one marking it who was close to all the

key people — marking it who was close to all the key people and second site and knew what was _ key people and second site and knew what was going on. by the time i found _ what was going on. by the time i found out— what was going on. by the time i found out that second site had an effect _ found out that second site had an effect changed the terms of reference to which they were working it was _ reference to which they were working it was too _ reference to which they were working it was too late to retrieve the situation _ it was too late to retrieve the situation and the organisation shoutd — situation and the organisation should have a proper time to consider— should have a proper time to consider second site's findings. susan — consider second site's findings. susan crichton questioned my understanding of the endgame and said the _ understanding of the endgame and said the post office had seen the report— said the post office had seen the report days earlier and had been contacted — report days earlier and had been contacted by the ceo and had come back early— contacted by the ceo and had come back early from holiday to handle it. back early from holiday to handle it which — back early from holiday to handle it. which had not been ideal. susan triton— it. which had not been ideal. susan triton said — it. which had not been ideal. susan triton said that as a lawyer it was inappropriate for her to influence key stakeholders and she would have been criticised had she come close to them _ been criticised had she come close to them i— been criticised had she come close to them. i commented if she felt unabte _ to them. i commented if she felt unable to— to them. i commented if she felt unable to play that role it should have _ unable to play that role it should have been— unable to play that role it should have been flagged up and that someone else could have been broken to perform _ someone else could have been broken to perform it. privately i am

astonished at this view which i simply— astonished at this view which i simply do _ astonished at this view which i simply do not recognise from my experience elsewhere. this is what you are _ experience elsewhere. this is what you are referring to isn't it when he said — you are referring to isn't it when he said of— you are referring to isn't it when he said of susan crichton she had put her— he said of susan crichton she had put her professional conduct requirements and her integrity as a lawyer— requirements and her integrity as a lawyer above the interests of the business? — lawyer above the interests of the business? ., lawyer above the interests of the business? no. she had not marked these people properly had she? business? no. she had not marked i these people properly had she? those are alice's words. _ these people properly had she? those are alice's words. what _ these people properly had she? those are alice's words. what i _ these people properly had she? those are alice's words. what i was - are alice's words. what i was referring _ are alice's words. what i was referring tom _ are alice's words. what i was referring to... we _ are alice's words. what i was referring to. . ._ are alice's words. what i was referring to... we will leave the in . ui referring to... we will leave the inquiry and _ referring to... we will leave the inquiry and some _ referring to... we will leave the inquiry and some really - referring to... we will leave the | inquiry and some really detailed referring to... we will leave the - inquiry and some really detailed and tough questions again to paula vennells. that is likely to go on for a good little while yet. i will point you to the bbc website because continuous coverage of that post office inquiry is on the. i am back alive with more from the general

election campaign in just alive with more from the general election campaign injust a moment. live from downing street, this is bbc news. party leaders hit the campaign trail after the prime minister fired the starting gun for a snap summer election in six weeks' time. rishi sunak and labour leader sir keir starmer have been touring the country, with their messages for voters. even though there's more work to do and i know it will take time for you to all see the benefits of that, the plan is working and we have that economic stability back. this election is for you, because you now have the power, the chance to end the chaos,

to turn the page and to rebuild britain. on the first full day of campaigning, we are following leaders around the country and with rishi sunak as he tries to hit the ground running. leader of the snp says leader of the snp sastuly the 11th can be independence day for scotland if his makes gains. and one other headline this hour, this is the scene live at the post office it inquiry, former boss paula vennells is appearing for a second day. welcome to downing street. a much quieter downing street than 211 hours ago, because party leaders have hit the campaign trail with six weeks to go until the general

election. the prime minister, rishi sunak, said only the conservatives offer