hello, i am thinking of famous collaborations through history, and am doing it with victoria derbyshire from newsnight. hello. hi. and nick from newsnight too. hi. famous colla bs? i'm thinking lady gaga and beyonce. under pressure bowie of queen. i'm going to say kylie and jason. especially for you, i'm feeling under pressure because what i have done, i have kind of invaded the newsnight outside broadcast in birmingham which will be on bbc two tonight life, and it is quite a fancy production you have here. we are in the central ivory of birmingham, it's a stunning building, the heart of it is a cylinder, essentially, and so each floor, you are surrounded by a circle of books. ——we are in the central library of birmingham, it's appropriate for new skies because adam fleming is the more intellectual side of the bc, and all these books here,

we actually had surprised him out of the mediaeval history section, but we are lucky he is here now. the funny thing is, we have been sat in front of the computing section, so i don't know how good yourjavascript per programming is. we will catch up with one newsnight is doing on what is happening in the general election campaign today. newscast from the bbc. hello, it's adam in birmingham. hello it's victoria in birmingham. and it's nick in birmingham. this is where you started out as a journalist. i love birmingham, i worked here in my firstjob as a report on radio, commercial radio, as you know, had no staff, i was the only reporter and comparative bbc local radio, there loads of reporters, so we were so hungry. i had sharp elbows, that's where i developed my sharp elbows.

what was your favourite story from that period? it was all quite serious stuff, it was the tail end, this is showing my age, the west midlands serious crime squad and the corruption involved in that birmingham is a mega new dispatch, superb use to was around the rotunda and the roads here. and nick, for us political journalist, many a site of many tory political conferences. that's right, after the political parties moved away from the seaside i pined for blackbird —— blackpool, it has been fascinated, near of the _ last 15 years, just scale of development. as the incredible economic development going on and it is the new, by the side of the old, but the great thing about birmingham are the waterways that you just don't see them, they are not obvious, but once you know the waterways, incredible.

more canals than venice, is that true? it probably is true. we would go virtually from birmingham to scotland, because the snp launched their manifesto for the election, and the of course was ready steady james cook, hello james. hello, adam. do you want to tell us about the vibe launch? the lunch was here l in edinburgh, a place on the outskirts of the city, l which i was told was a bakery and cultural centre, - which i didn't understand, do you know what type mints, but the pastries were good, . not much i can tell you, . and the vibe, it was busy, lots of snp politicians there, notjustjohn. swinney, the leader, who— was in charge of the launch but they seemed pretty buoyant, it seemed. relatively slick, it went off, from their perspective, - without a hitch. the document is shiny.

it's not very long, only 20 pages long, and i said - ——it's not very long, - only 28 pages long, and i said tojohn swinney, it smells of ink, he said" well, - it's been printed, so it would". also, we have a copy to the fair, not in colour, saving money on the printing, and nick has the open—ended page independence, right at the front, not the first page got but the first few. the first page, james has it there, it says vote snp for scotland to become an independent country, so if you were in any doubt, there it is all. i'm sure james can talk about it, but it talks about howjohn swinney is saying that if they get a majority of parliamentary seats in this westminster election, that would be a mandates, as they say, to begin immediate negotiations with the uk government to give democratic effective

the scotland independent. james, tell us what that paragraph of the manifesto means, because i remember two years ago when nicola sturgeon was first minister and leader of the snp, she said and general election where the snp won the majority of seats in scotland should almost be a referendum and negotiation start straightaway. there has been previous talk about whether or not the bar for negotiations to open on scotland simply - seceding from the rest - of the united kingdom would be a majority of votes in a scottish referendum, which is obviouslyj a much higher bar than the majority of the 57 scottish seats that - are being contested this time around, so in that sense, - yes, we have pretty- much heard this before. what i wanted to know from a john swinney, i because it was not totally clear in the text, when you look - at the text it says if the snp wins a majority of scottish seats, - the scottish government would be

empowered to begin immediate . negotiates of the uk government to give democratic effective - to scotland becoming i an independent country. i wanted to know if that meant that she thoughtl you could skip the referendum, and answer was no. he said there must be a referendum, it is the only democratic route - to independence for scotland. so that is clear. it would be a 2—stage, at least, process, but let us be - clear, the labour party— and the conservatives are adamant that no matter what happens after this election, _ there are no circumstances - whatsoever in which they would entertain allowing a second _ referendum on independence a decade after the first one, _ and it is the supreme court has ruled, up to westminster to decide whether or not| scott and converts again. scotland can vote again. so if the snp do not get it majority, james, is that independence dead for, what, a generation, five years? what do you think? that is the question, _ i was saying to john swinney, look, conversely, if you say, -

if you do not get the majority, do you that that is scotland's, in essence, voting to remain. for now in the union, - and he said not to prejudge what scottish people i say, but the questions are really fair one. i think either way, - it is very difficult to see if the snp continues, - and it continues it is continuing to insist that only route _ is a referendum, if both of the uk parties say, what made there may not be a referendum, _ that it's almost as not matter. in practical terms, obviously. the snp would argue it matters a lot, they say in moral terms what scotland votes for here, | but in practical terms, | it is difficult to see out there would be any progress towards a referendum, - and in that sense, yes, i obviously if scotland does not vote by a majority of seats for the snp, i then clearly their cause is dented. we've talked a lot aboutjohn swinney, that is here him in his own words, here is talking about the broad principle of independence as he sees

it in this manifesto. in 2021, they voted for a scottish parliament with a clear majority for independence and for a referendum on the questions of independence. that democratic choice must be respected. at this election, we have the opportunity to reinforce the case for scotland becoming an independent country, it is the substance of the case that would take us there. and that starts with the economy. the "they" he is talking about obviously being the people of scotland, nick what did you want to say? i wanted to askjames about the idea of a referendum because it seems that the wording for that opening negotiations with the uk government is the gold standard referendum, the 2014 one, which was essentially gifted by westminster done under westminster parliamentary powers for stub they gifted that power

to the parliamentary scotland for two years, is that rather than unilateral referendum decided by holyrod? i think that stems back - to the supreme court decision that said an official, - as you say, gold standard referendum can only be held - with westminster's sent consent, but let's be honest, i it does not seem likely that there is going to be - a referendum anytime soon. if you are the snp, you would say, i look, we had a mandate from the last holly rood election in 2021, and that between the snp. and the greens, they had a majority |of seats in the scottish parliament, j still do, and that amounts - to a mandate for a referendum but i think moving on from it, given we know, whether right or wrong, it wouldn't happen, - the question is what happens next was to mark the debates - about independence now goes to the next scottish i parliamentary election in 2026, just a few years' time, -

because what the snp is trying to do here is to say, "the uk is broken, it is no low growth, _ low productivity, high inequality, these problems are entrenched, | the conservatives, they argue, have made them worse, - and they contend that the labour i party will be unable to fix them i so they are thinking into a year's time, they will be going - to the scottish population - in the 2026 holyrood election and saying, the problem is notjust the tories, i it's a whole westminster system now we need to revisit this _ and is notjust by any means this general election, - their referendum strategy or independent strategy, i i think they are looking forward - to it because they know they are not in a great place in the polls. they are bracing themselves forl losses here, but they are looking to see how they can perhaps spring back in what they hope for 2026. l

the labour party hope to use this election as a springboard - in scotland to gain seats and spring| onto the same at holyrood and take control of the scottish government. james, the thing that surprised me weed the manifesto on my laptop on the train up to birmingham, was how much the snp are talking about things that should happen in england and the uk, generally, for example, the rates of income tax and the rest of the uk being increased the same as the rates and scotland because the scottish government has control of that the income tax rates and thresholds, and also talking about the budget for the nhs in england should be. explain why they think they should talk about all that stuff? it requires some picking apart for newscasters i and we talked about this before, - newscasters will know how it works, but the scottish government overall budget is in part determined, - in large part, determined - by what happens at westminster because if the uk government decides to increase spending on anything, - anything that is reserved - to westminster and devolved to holyrood, increased spending on the nhs in england, -

there will be a consequential increase in the scottish - government's overall budget. they do not need to spend it on health, butjohn swinneyl | is strongly suggesting what he want| to see is a uk government, whoever it is after this election, _ to increase spending on the english health service so that the budget he can spend, and he said - he would spend it on the scottish health service, goes up. - that is part of this. debate, but it's also about political dividing lines. he's trying to say, look, _ we are a socially progressive party, we believe that with a bit higher taxation, and you debate - iwhether it is a bit or a lot higher, i and worth noting that the threshold at which people and scotland pay | more tax than england is around| £29,000, you are not talking - millionaires here, john swinney says it is only a little over that. that they are paying extra, but it goes up and up, l the point is that he says we are just having to do this because of the state - of public services we need - to raise the money somehow, and scotland's aggressive

tactician model, he says, | ——and scotland's aggressive taxation model, he says, i is something english should embrace. and james, it's interesting because the manifesto says the uk government should increase and if you are spending in england by 16 billion, which through the consequences, as you say, would yield 1.6 billion for holyrood, and what is interesting about that it highlights the fundamental challenge for the snp in this westminster election, which is that both they are a government and opposition. they are a government because they been in power in holyrood for 17 years, but in opposition because they are in opposition to the uk government, and that sort of demand request for the uk government to spend more money in england so it bounces a scotland is that large of the opposition side rather than we have been responsible for the nhs in scotland for 17 yhears. than we have been responsible for

the nhs in scotland for 17 years. and the idea about rejoining the eu without any details. all of these things are designed to showcase the difference - between the parties - and in john swinney's view, showcase what he sees - as a fundamental difference between an english electorate, - which he suggests is moving further away from is scottish electorate, which she suggests is further- to the left, so it's definitely- a case of sticking out the ground. james, thank you very much, and talk about the nhs, victoria, that is a big theme of your show in birmingham tonight. it is, we are here to talk to our audience of 50—60 people and a group of politicians including the man who wants to be in two weeks�* time, wes streeting, and maria from the conservatives and the lib dems, but we are here to talk about their expenses with the nhs. ——to talk about their experience with the nhs. every person has a story about the nhs wherever you are in the country, and a few examples. we will hear from a university student called lily who has been

waiting over one year for a mental health treatment. the target is 18 weeks. 18 weeks. she has been waiting for 12 months. she has been diagnosed with anxiety and depression, she almost forgot what she's waiting for, she's lost in the system. we will hear from amanda, who has arthritis and has had for many years, she can barely walk, she uses walking sticks uses a wheelchair. she's currently waiting for an operation on her hand, she says, but they would not do that until she lose weight but she can't do because she can't move around. she has been kind of trapped. so who has solutions to those intractable problems? and listen to the on sunday because wes streeting had been on laura's show doing an interview, and build up the discussion regarding what labour is talking about in their manifesto and the extra money to put

into the nhs for actual appointments to deal with the waiting list victoria was talking about is the tip of the iceberg. what the nhs budget is overall. that started a bigger conversation, and applied to the lib dems and tories as well, which is that the manifesto promises are small beans compared to the nhs budget overall. that's right, if you think about it, the conservative government of david cameron and george osborne, increased interest would increase about one point one over inflation, so that is small beans in comparison. what wes streeting would be telling victoria tonight is that this is a very difficult fiscal solution, made worse, i'm sure he will say by the liz truss mini budget and labour is having to cut its cloth accordingly, but it was interested in what wes streeting said in that interview with laura, he talks about what they're putting in the labour manifesto,

the two billion extra spending, and here is on that list, that's an interest times with and doubled the aggressive cancer scanners, he said that is the foundation, and then laura instantly active on that, and said it'sjust a start, and it's interesting that the labour party trying to be incredibly cautious about what they are saying, and wes streeting, who is one of if not the best communicators in the labour party, may have perhaps gone ever so slightly off message. i suppose that is the beauty of an election campaign, these front benchers from whatever of a party at the turn of the things that is and you can basically take the plot line and quizzed him about things they'd said before and we know more as a result. hopefully, with our audience, that is what they will do. we want a conversation between members of the audience and the politicians. it does not need to be adversarial or a question and five or four

politicians answer, let's have a conversation to see what potential solutions there are, and also, of course, we know about the pandemic, but there were issues in the nhs in england before then, so why are we where we are now? and are the sums, as nick said, been promised by labour, promised by conservatives, are they really enough to affect any kind of mini transformation question. in terms of hosting a show like this, this is quite weird for me, because i sit in a little newscast cupboard, designed to look like a living room, we are in a giant library, and i can see about five cameras and your 50 seats over there for the audience, what difference is it meek when you have actual voters in the studio with you? for me, you just get this incredible energy from people. it is late at night, it is after the watershed, people are kind of up for it, and the want to be

here, they want to have this conversation with people who can come up with policies that affect their daily lives. it is a real, for me, the most dynamic of shows. what victoria says now, it shows what she is amazing at, which is very good at interviewing politicians, and you like doing that, but she completely comes alive when you have people who are not politicians, people who have stories to tell, and it is one of the great privileges working with her. this is turn into, this is your life victoria derbyshire. it's really interesting, showing your workings and behind the scene, but when we have people in newsnight who are not politicians who have stories to tell, they gather in what we call the green room she goes in before and talks every single one of them, get their story, it's what really brings victoria alive, and it brings

newsnight alive, and will bringing to life tonight when you are hearing those stories from people who do not have a mandate, hornet elected, they have their story to tell. victoria, i think i should bring a big red book for this is your life, within your early years. it was a good show. it was all right. that is television for you, other source of it, never a dull moment in this campaign, a few things to pick up some of which an are eye—catching, inflation is it the 2% target. that was the objective and what the bank of england was meant to do to manage the economy. and the rishi sunak target was to halve it, and he said 11%, he more than half of that, he hit the target rate when gordon brown independent rates give to the bank of england, and it was meant to be 2%. interestingly, services and other parts, when you break the inflation rate down, service is quite high, it looks sticky, and i think the markets, this afternoon,

were suggesting that we may not be heading in the direction of a particularly early cut in interest rates. victoria, did you see the taylor swift eras tour might have an impact on the inflation rate because so many people are going to her concerts, the tickets are so expensive, and hotels jack up their prices. my 20—year—old son will be responsible for inflation, he has a ticket for august at wembley. she's doing it over two months, i went this moment. ——she�*s doing it over two months, i went this month. and nick, in terms of the inflation, it feeds into the bank of england having a meeting tomorrow and thursday to decide interest rates, but the rule is that the bank of england do not make a this decision about interest rates unless there is an election on, because it may help one side or the other. the committee in charge of it would be very cautious about doing anything, because we're so close to the elections, two weeks tomorrow, but it is interesting

that the markets where pricing in that we would not be seeing an immediate cuts in interest rates. the other numbers people are assessing over, and i do mean a certain bit of politicians obsessing over it, opinion polls. it's winding me up. i'm allowed to say that? they are great tools, not the whole show. i agree, and how many times in recent memory have the polls been wrong. i am so wary of it. there is an election burn the polls are do the polls run elections, and he seems the polls are running the general election, because of these massive polls where they're porting ten to 12,000 people, your normal run—of—the—mill poll is 1500 people, this is thousands of people, and have so much data that they are then able to impose that data on the 650 constituencies and say that is what will happen there and there, and it isjust having an incredible impact, but you know, in the parties,

in the labour party, they are not complacent, but, you know, they have smiles on their faces, and in the conservative party, the mood is really bleak. we should remember that the bbc has rules about how this journalist look at these polls, we are never to start a story saying a poll today said this. the other eye—catching story, nick, this is from chris mason, one of the prime ministers close protection squad being under investigation for placing a bet on the day of the election. that is right, and it dates back to craig williams, who was the prime minister's parliamentary secretary during the last parliament, facing an investigation, unofficial investigation, because he on the 19th of may ——an official investigation, because he on the 19th of may pleased a bet that there would be a july election, and then on the wednesday after that sunday, the prime minister made that announcement. craig williams issued a statement

he will cooperate with any inquiry and admitted it did not look particularly good, but what happened after, there was that the announcement about craig williams, is that it's the gambling commission said we want to look at every single bet placed in the month of me ——we want to look at every single bet placed in the month of may related tojuly poll, and they're going through with a fine tooth comb. and a police officer has been arrested and suspended from duty. i was just going to... you're such a pro, victoria, i was in to read it off my laptop and you knew it by heart, that is why it will be a great story tonight on newsnight. thank you for having us on newscast. thank you for stealing the show. newscast on bbc. hello there. wednesday was a decent day right across all four nations. in fact, we saw temperatures in excess of 20 degrees,

and we haven't seen that for over a week. but you may have heard a rumour that things are going to get warmer still. and in fact, into next week, we are likely to see temperatures widely into the mid 20s, maybe peaking as high as 28 celsius, somewhere in southeast england. perhaps for many, that's something to look forward to. but before we get too carried away, let's concentrate on the rest of this week. turning warmer, yes, with some sunny spells, but there will also be some rain pushing into the west. now we can see the first signs of that through today with this weak weatherfront here, but more significant rain waiting in the wings. but for the majority of us, it will be a dry, settled and sunny start, a beautiful start. a line of nuisance cloud, really from northern england down to wales and southwest england that could produce the odd spot or two of rain, and some showery dribs and drabs across northern ireland and into southern scotland with that weakening weather front. to the far northwest, temperatures perhaps struggling, 15 degrees generally to the north, we're looking at 18—20 celsius

with highest values of 22 celsius somewhere in the southeast. but it's certainly worth bearing in mind if you're a hay fever sufferer, well, we are looking at very high pollen levels quite widely across the country. now into friday, our weather front will continue to push in from the west. it will start to weaken off as it drifts its way steadily east. but there's likely to be some heavier bursts, particularly across parts of northern ireland as we go through the day on friday. some showery outbreaks of rain into western scotland, clouding over generally, but central and eastern areas should continue to see some sunshine, and, again, some warmth. we might see high teens perhaps in sheltered eastern areas of scotland, highest values, perhaps of 23 celsius somewhere in the southeast. now that weather front, as it continues to track its way steadily east, will fragment and weaken. so there is a risk of some cloud, maybe a little bit of drizzle around on saturday. but on the whole, high pressure will build and the winds are likely to swing around to more of a south—westerly for the second half of the weekend. and it's that south—westerly wind that will drive in this warmer air. so you can see looking ahead,

a lot of dry, settled, sunny weather and turning increasingly warm. alleluia.

welcome to newsday, reporting live from singapore, i'm arunoday mukharji. lets get you the headlines.. president putin leaves north korea after signing a defence pact with kim jong—un. translation: the comprehensive partnership agreement signed - today provides also for mutual assistance in the event of aggression against

one of the parties. intense heat is feared to have killed hundreds at the annual hajj pilgrimage in saudi arabia. a police officer protecting rishi sunak is arrested over alleged bets on the general election date. and scotland lives to fight another day. a draw against switzerland keep their euros dream alive. welcome to bbc news — broadcasting to viewers in the uk and around the world. we begin in vietnam, where russian president vladimir putin has landed — his latest destination on his whistle—stop tour of asia. vietnam is a long—time ally of russia — but has been courted

by other major countries.