no place in our violence has no place in our country. hakeem jeffries, the minority leader in the house of representatives, democrat leader, my thoughts are and prayers are with former president donald trump, i'm thankfulfor president donald trump, i'm thankful for the president donald trump, i'm thankfulfor the law thankful for the law enforcement response, thankfulfor the law enforcement response, america's democracy, political violence of any kind is never acceptable. some more and more reaction coming in as will absorb news of what has happened in butler pennsylvania. shocking news and disturbing for everybody to see what has happened, reports of other victims and casualties, we are working to confirm that. we know from cbs reporting that the alleged gunman in these cases is either been killed or neutralized and taken into custody, we are working to confirm that as well, but it is certainly right now an active investigation. that is what the secret service is telling us. i want to take a look at a

moment. again, this taking placejust a matter of moment. again, this taking place just a matter of minutes ago 30 minutes to an hour ago at the very beginning of this rally in pennsylvania. the former president, donald trump taken to the stage just a few minutes natures. this of scene that played out.— that played out. take a look at what happened. _ that played out. take a look at what happened. gunshots. l what happened. gunshots. screaming. _ you can hear the screams, you can hear the shots, see the reaction from the crowd there, as that shooting took place. we know the former president donald trump has been taken out for medical treatment, now reportedly doing fine according to the campaign. 0ur senior north american correspondent garrett was outside the rally and has been speaking to eyewitnesses to stop the city a

witness to what one of them told them. i witness to what one of them told them-— witness to what one of them told them. ., ., ,., :: told them. i was about 50 feet from the president _ told them. i was about 50 feet from the president and - told them. i was about 50 feet | from the president and noticed three _ from the president and noticed three shots were fired. i saw a light— three shots were fired. i saw a light smoke and then everyone was very— light smoke and then everyone was very panicked and went down immediately. puts up i saw a large — immediately. puts up i saw a large speaker fell immediately and then all over the president was secret service etc stop everyone's very scared and someone _ everyone's very scared and someone was russian ambulance a few feet _ someone was russian ambulance a few feet over for me.— few feet over for me. someone from the crowd. _ few feet over for me. someone from the crowd. yes. _ few feet over for me. someone from the crowd. yes. did - few feet over for me. someone from the crowd. yes. did you i from the crowd. yes. did you see where they were coming from? i see where they were coming from? ~' . ., from? i think there were coming from? i think there were coming from that post — from? i think there were coming from that post building - from? i think there were coming from that post building over - from that post building over there — from that post building over there. . , , from that post building over there. ., , , ., , there. that building is outside there. that building is outside the perimeter. _ there. that building is outside the perimeter. that's - there. that building is outside the perimeter. that's right, i the perimeter. that's right, it's outside _ the perimeter. that's right, it's outside the _ the perimeter. that's right, it's outside the perimeter. l it's outside the perimeter. what _ it's outside the perimeter. what did you do when the shots rang out? i what did you do when the shots ran: out? .., ., ,, ., rang out? i collapse on the round rang out? i collapse on the ground in _ rang out? i collapse on the ground in haiti, _ rang out? i collapse on the ground in haiti, but- rang out? i collapse on the ground in haiti, but the - rang out? i collapse on the - ground in haiti, but the rumors president— ground in haiti, but the rumors president trump was hit in the air and — president trump was hit in the airand rumors he president trump was hit in the air and rumors he was being presented evidence but there's a lot— presented evidence but there's a lot of— presented evidence but there's a lot of chaos.—

a lot of chaos. what you saw one person _ a lot of chaos. what you saw one person be _ a lot of chaos. what you saw one person be taken - a lot of chaos. what you saw one person be taken to - a lot of chaos. what you saw one person be taken to the l one person be taken to the evidence. i one person be taken to the evidence-— one person be taken to the evidence.- what - one person be taken to the evidence.- what was l one person be taken to the| evidence.- what was it evidence. i did. what was it like when — evidence. i did. what was it like when the _ evidence. i did. what was it like when the shots - evidence. i did. what was it like when the shots rang i evidence. i did. what was it i like when the shots rang out? everyone stopped and hunkered out, some were running and try to stay— out, some were running and try to stay stitt— out, some were running and try to stay still but. it out, some were running and try to stay still but.— to stay still but. it must've been very _ to stay still but. it must've been very scary _ to stay still but. it must've been very scary for- to stay still but. it must've been very scary for you. i to stay still but. it must've i been very scary for you. yes. the chimeras _ been very scary for you. yes. the chimeras of _ been very scary for you. yes. the chimeras of the - been very scary for you. yes. l the chimeras of the president? yes. this must've been very shocking for you.— yes. this must've been very shocking for you. yes i did not exect shocking for you. yes i did not exoeet to _ shocking for you. yes i did not exoeet to be _ shocking for you. yes i did not expect to be shot _ shocking for you. yes i did not expect to be shot today. - shocking for you. yes i did not expect to be shot today. in . shocking for you. yes i did not expect to be shot today. in a i expect to be shot today. in a statement — expect to be shot today. in a statement from _ expect to be shot today. in a statement from the - expect to be shot today. in —. statement from the trump campaign, trump... . iwant to bring in lindsay stravinsky, residential historian. we hear this news and see those shots being fired at the presidential

rally, what goes through your mind as a story? flit rally, what goes through your mind as a story?— rally, what goes through your mind as a story? of course, my first instinct _ mind as a story? of course, my first instinct is _ mind as a story? of course, my first instinct is to _ mind as a story? of course, my first instinct is to watch - mind as a story? of course, my first instinct is to watch how - first instinct is to watch how it happened, and i think we all have to be a patient to know exactly what unfortunately, and then my second thought is to think back to past moments when there has been violence are on presidential candidates or presidents orformer presidential candidates or presidents or former presidents and that is never a good sign because we know that political violence very rarely happens in one off, they tend to be clustered, and it means there are lots of other problems in society we have to tackle. horn society we have to tackle. how concerned _ society we have to tackle. how concerned given _ society we have to tackle. how concerned given what - society we have to tackle. how concerned given what you just said about the potential for an environment that would lead to more political violence after this event? i more political violence after this event?— more political violence after this event? ~ ., ., this event? i think we have to be extremely _ this event? i think we have to be extremely concerned - this event? i think we have to | be extremely concerned about it. of course, we saw generally 62021, was he was a different form of political violence but nonetheless political violence. we have seen fbi offices

targeted and journalist targeted and journalist targeted and journalist targeted and bombs sent to political figures, targeted and bombs sent to politicalfigures, thankfully thus far, at least with some of those cases, the law enforcement officers were able to step in and prevent serious wrongdoing, and i'm grateful they were able to do so today and that the former president seems to be ok, i'm hoping that most of the people in the crowd have recovered. and it warns that in the next two months we have to be vigilant against other forms of political violence.— other forms of political violence. . ,, ., violence. looking back at the histo , violence. looking back at the history. this _ violence. looking back at the history, this is _ violence. looking back at the history, this is not _ violence. looking back at the history, this is not the - violence. looking back at the history, this is not the first . history, this is not the first time that unfortunately we have seen an american politician, the presidential candidate targeted in this kind of way and then we should make sure that we don't know exactly what happened here butjust walk us through walking through some of the history of political violence.—

the history of political violence. , , , ., the history of political violence. , ,, ., ., violence. the first essuman of this is andrew _ violence. the first essuman of this is andrew jackson, - violence. the first essuman of this is andrew jackson, and i violence. the first essuman of| this is andrew jackson, and the this is andrew jackson, and the assailant gun misfired an introduction was able to the person with like campaign —— with his cane until police came. some other notable incidents are president lincoln, james garfield emma or president kennedy, but those who have not survived, but there have been presidents who have survived, in —— including ronald reagan. looking at what is happening today, the variety of things in society, including patient senses —— tensions, and personal animosity, we saw a rush of political assassinations, including most famously doctor martin luther king, and president kennedy, so i'm hopeful that that parallel is not something we are going

to see in the coming months. it is something will have to bite and camping on guard know as well, just looking towards the potential, again, we don't but this is like it might�*ve have change the state of this race? i think it absolutely has to be a factor for some i think it absolutely has to be a factorfor some i'm sure his protective detail with be extra wary of any potential threat. in a worry about moments of tension, there's the potential for potential threats. if someone sees i threats against her because, they might want to fight back, and of course we do not know what to seven, but we don't want to cichlids about who is what or what is behind it, but especially when so much political as rick does tend to include violence or adjacent terminology, it can encourage

people who are not necessarily stable to pursue but in action in rely. stable to pursue but in action in rel . ., ., in rely. looking at it from campaign _ in rely. looking at it from campaign and _ in rely. looking at it from campaign and at - in rely. looking at it from campaign and at some i in rely. looking at it from campaign and at some of| campaign and at some of the events taking place in this country of the past years, it's impossible to ignore the events of generally six that took place, the storming of the capitol building, violence on that as well, is this something that as well, is this something that in your mind has been building up. there's been tension and political violence, think literally we have not seen an event like this until now, but looking at the bigger picture, how would you assess the level of tension and political violence right now in the us question mark i think the us question mark i think the level? i the us question mark i think the level?— the us question mark i think the level? i think the level is actually high- _ the level? i think the level is actually high. it _ the level? i think the level is actually high. it is _ the level? i think the level is actually high. it is never- actually high. it is never wanted are acceptable in a democracy or —— the only acceptable way is to xmas

ourselves with the ballot box —— box. we know that when he starts to build in the system, throughout history and throughout history and throughout the world, that when political violence becomes more acceptable as a solution, when people thinks it is ok to take matters into their own hands, or when they think that their country or way of life is threatened, then they started explore the more radical actions or preserve our favorite. and if anyone encourages that type of violence or doesn't speak out against that violence, it can start to build a permission system, which is why it is important meant with any one the platform or influence because it out and says it is not acceptable or warranted whether it's on the left or right. 0verly, we can start this stemmed the tide, but looking at everything that is been happening for the last five years, we should really be on guard for any isolation. and

on guard for any isolation. and those calls _ on guard for any isolation. and those calls are _ on guard for any isolation. and those calls are something we've been here from politicians, both republican and democrat today, and ijust want to both republican and democrat today, and i just want to ask, lindsay, looking back at history, when we see a campaign marred by violence, and if we're looking back at ronald reagan or other campaigns for example, how does that change the next weeks and months? how does it affect the way a presidential campaign is able to move forward or not? it is one of those _ to move forward or not? it is one of those really _ to move forward or not? it 3 one of those really extreme shock to the system which changes the narrative and the dialog and the focus of the conversation. so i suspect this will dominate in news in the coming weeks, it will change the rhetoric and language and speech of all those involved and will change the intensity of former president donald

trump supporters and might change the dynamics. it might change the dynamics. it might change the dynamics on the other side as well. i suspect it will be seen, once history books are written, and historians are terrible predators, but once those books are written, i said yes we will see this as a turning point in the camping. see this as a turning point in the camping-— see this as a turning point in the camina. . ~' ,, ., ., the camping. thank you for that perspective. — the camping. thank you for that perspective. stay _ the camping. thank you for that perspective, stay with _ the camping. thank you for that perspective, stay with us - the camping. thank you for that perspective, stay with us if - perspective, stay with us if you can, i want to come back to rodney davis, former congressman of illinois who is over this ash always joining us in these important political moments, thank you for sending by with us today. what did you make of what we just heard there and the potential for an event like this to change the way that this camping lays out going ahead? i way that this camping lays out going ahead?— going ahead? i have certainly witnessed — going ahead? i have certainly witnessed the _ going ahead? i have certainly witnessed the violence - going ahead? i have certainlyl witnessed the violence myself as we spoke earlier. i witnessed the increase in security measures on republicans and democrat in washington, dc, and that's

potential right, that would happen. those guarding president biden will be on edge might be able to make sure they do not take security for granted and so with those guarding president trump and all democratic leaders to stop thatis all democratic leaders to stop that is just what happens. unfortunately, in today's polarized environment, that travel —— threat level has remained high at all times. todayis remained high at all times. today is one of those days where i think if the secret service and others were preparing for this event looked back, maybe they could have done things differently, and the good thing is that they will in the future.- will in the future. donald trump in _ trump in his campaign has, of course, looking back at the events of generally six, this is been a campaign that is often used charged language and not shied away from competition. are you concerned at all about the potential for some sort of retaliation by trump supporters are

republicans and copying it —— caveat in that by saying course we do not know yet to has done the shooting. i we do not know yet to has done the shooting-— the shooting. i have been a victim of— the shooting. i have been a victim of left-wing - the shooting. i have been a| victim of left-wing violence, victim of left—wing violence, running from but it's on a baseball field been fired at me and my friends and true to my friends. i have been a victim of pyrite violence leaving the house for ungenerous six and witnessing that gender —— tragic day. but let's be clear, violence is violence, i'm concerned about violence of any sort, whether it is somebody who wears a red shirt or a blue shirt here in the united states. and that is what most americans are concerned about. i am equally concerned about violent activities that you republican convention this week in milwaukee, and probably even more so in the chicago area at the democratic convention. it’s the democratic convention. it's worth asking — the democratic convention. it's worth asking given what you said about your experience and those worries, were you

concerned that something that this could happen along this camping trip in 202a? and just seeing the way this country has been a bit charged and divided? i am, but i look back, as your historian that he just had on, i remind viewers that the united states of america has experienced much more polarized times in our nation history. i was somebody who represented a lincolns oil congressional district, and were around during the worst time for polarized vision in our street during the civil war. i'm sure we have it address the issues around security are chemical i'm concerned we have law—enforcement agencies that don't talk to each other and

don't talk to each other and don't prepare for security event measures like we saw today. i am very concerned that we need to do better here in the united states of america and at sharon intelligence where we know something like this could happen in an event like today. this could happen in an event like today-— this could happen in an event like toda . ., ., , , ., like today. former congressman rodney davis — like today. former congressman rodney davis of _ like today. former congressman rodney davis of illinois, - rodney davis of illinois, thanks for the insights, i want to bring christina ruffino in studio with me, it former white house correspondent, great to have you with us. this news, the shots fired at this rally, the shots fired at this rally, the former president donald trump, the situation right now is obviously fluid but it is difficult not to look ahead to the republican national convention which is scheduled to begin in wisconsin. and convention which is scheduled to begin in wisconsin. and you have to wonder _ to begin in wisconsin. and you have to wonder how _ to begin in wisconsin. and you have to wonder how it - to begin in wisconsin. and you have to wonder how it will - have to wonder how it will impact the security procedures around the convention, wisconsin is an open carry state, i am wisconsin is an open carry state, iam in wisconsin is an open carry state, i am in colorado, wisconsin is an open carry state, iam in colorado, a wisconsin is an open carry state, i am in colorado, a gun from the state —— state, which

means you can walk around karen you're going and it is legal. any press release that was in june, guns were going to be allowed within the area of the rnc, they could not go into the building because of security, but the perimeter or outside in the sidewalk, where you see people selling t—shirts and walking back and forth, in wisconsin, you can legally have a gun on yourself, and ak—47, he had gone, and you have to wonder they already heightened tensions are on the political system the season, this was article to be a frenetic and high stress republican national convention, this was only going to exacerbate that. you cannot tell me these delegates, many of whom are incredibly pro—gun, would not be looking over their shoulder or looking twice and everyone who has a gun on them in milwaukee.— in milwaukee. some breaking news coming _ in milwaukee. some breaking news coming out _ in milwaukee. some breaking news coming out from - in milwaukee. some breaking news coming out from the . news coming out from the washington post, reporting that two are dead in that shooting. there at that rally in

pennsylvania, two people dead, that includes the apparent shooter, that is coming from the washington post reported that. we heard from various eyewitnesses that are north american correspondent had been speaking with who had been reporting, and we should of course were next reiterate that donald trump is safe, he has been treated for any sort of injuries at the local medical facility about what washington report —— washington post reported that there are two dead, including the shooter. people say that other people had been struck by the shots, but that does no apparently include the shooter, as reported by the washington post. and scary to hear that other people have been hit by that attack. other people have been hit by that attack-— that attack. and i am hearing from sources, _ that attack. and i am hearing from sources, that _ that attack. and i am hearing from sources, that it - that attack. and i am hearing from sources, that it does . from sources, that it does track, that other people have

been hit, and i know that seven or eight shots were fired. the first thing i ask, because in because like that, you never really know what is happening, we just had the 4th ofjuly in washington, i grew up with guns, it is hard to tell what that moment is —— what that sound is. the first thing i texas —— checked if it was real, and the answer was yes. the most important thing is that the former president is safe, and the most important thing is that the threat to the crowd is neutralize, and then attention will turn to the campaign, which is where it will go. and not only the rnc, how does the white house to react, i reached out a few moments ago, and they said they will have a statement in an hour. and talking about other presidential assassinations, when donald trump got off the ground and raised his fist into remind me of when teddy roosevelt was campaigning and the bullet went through his speech and that's his case and

he got up, meet next make sure the guy wasn't hurt and continued his speech in a dramatic camping —— moments with the blood and the shirt, he did not win the campaign. but the other campaigners suspended there is until he was ready to go back. so if donald trump takes a camping but does president biden policies campaign until he goes back. what does happen? it campaign until he goes back. what does happen?— campaign until he goes back. what does happen? it would have a real domino _ what does happen? it would have a real domino effect _ what does happen? it would have a real domino effect on _ what does happen? it would have a real domino effect on the - a real domino effect on the campaign, what happens on the republican side and what happens with residentjoe biden and protection around him. i want to go to gary who was there in pennsylvania, he has been reporting on everything thatis been reporting on everything that is been taking place. they are outside the rally. gary, what more do you have for us? you can see behind me the police activity is still intense. we are in a lockdown, the sole area is no lockdown,

and we are inside that cordon, and we are inside that cordon, and we are inside that cordon, and we can't move. pretty much, the public has all going home now. we are still waiting to hear any details about those casualties dimension. we certainly spoke to people who had seen people, a few people put into eminences. we spoke to several eyewitnesses that identified what they said is the position from where the truth into place, which is a single—story building, which is the rights of the stage, as donald trump would have been on stage to his right. 0ne donald trump would have been on stage to his right. one of the eyewitnesses said he saw a man crawled up onto that roof with a rifle, and that you pointed this out. he says, to the secret service and police were around, he said it was a few minutes before the shooting started at around 614 p.m. local time. started at around 614 p.m. localtime. so started at around 614 p.m. local time. so lots of issues

there. he also said he had seen there. he also said he had seen the man killed by the security services here. we don't have any detail about what happened or how that happened, but another eyewitness, who is just another eyewitness, who is just a teenager, said he saw the snipers on the other roofs around here, the secret service, people like that, he saw them shoot, he saw the muzzle flashes as they shot back at what appears to be at this stage the lone gunman. so there's a lot of detail still to work out. we know from all our eyewitnesses that donald trump seemed to go down after the shooting started. we were actually pretty much on air. we were on the bbc world service, and i heard what sounded to me like six or eight shots if you —— a couple hundred meters away, and it was clear. sometimes you wonder about cars backfiring or motorcycles back friend, this was clearly gunfire. it was a rapid volley

of a number of six to eight, i estimates that they heard, and then you heard the screaming and people rushing and saw people rushing out from there and try to get away as quickly as possible. we were on air, as i say, and went out to make sure because we had no idea where the shooting was coming from physically, whether it would continue, how much it was our homage people were involved, no idea, so the safest places always underground when those things are happening. to be honest, it's shocking because lots of people we spoke to today, whether you agree with their political views are not, they came here to seek their candidate. 0ne when i spoke to, devon, a localfarmer who looks —— lives to doan —— two was done of road, it was his first rally, he says is a proud one owner, but he says there's some nudity —— lunatics out there, and you could hear in his voice

the future of his son who was standing next to them, and what is the experience for that man as his first ever political rally at the most developed country in the world to see people shooting up one or another. a sad day for this country. as. another. a sad day for this country-— another. a sad day for this count . �* , , , country. a terrifying expense as well for — country. a terrifying expense as well for everybody - country. a terrifying expense as well for everybody was - as well for everybody was there, you could see tiny hairs in those voices, the eyewitnesses you will spoke with. just to update our audience with a view of new bits of information coming from the afp news agency. this is according to former president barack 0bama who is quoted saying there is no place for political violence in this country. cbs news also who is our new us news partner send it out and updates. cbs news reported that two with law enforcement for sources have said the shooter is dead and that the shooter was a male, so that the shooter was a male, so that does seem to confirm inlets of what we have been

hearing from the people that gary has been speaking with underground outside that ready in pennsylvania. i want to begin charles arena, former secret service agent. we thank you for coming on bbc news. 0bviously lots of specular action at this point about what is been taking place, what kind of security response there might be. if you could walk us through the details that we do know here. how would the secret service respond in your experience to a shooting at an event like this?— event like this? former president _ event like this? former president trump - event like this? former president trump has i event like this? former president trump has a | event like this? former- president trump has a high level security for two reasons, one he is a recent former president out of office, and he's also the presumptive republican nominee, here one week before the public on convention. so he carries a lots of resources around them

on the security side. at this site, i can tell you, you have three layers of security, you're the inner bubble that you're the inner bubble that you start respond to the shooting and to shield the warmer president from additional gunfire, and of the middle permits are which screens people that come into the rally for weapons, which is why i find it interesting we are not hearing where the shooter was. was he inside the screened area or further away outside because you didn't have an ulcer permits are. —— outer perimeter of law enforcement. it's important to note, we have heard from several eyewitnesses that the by two of the bbc they saw roof on a visit near where the outdoor rally was taking place, someone with their riley nash with a rifle. we can work

to verify those reports but most of the people have two of the bbc that. if that is the case, what does that tell you as a secret service expert? what kinds of plans are in place for someone who might be outside event? inside there is lots of security, but is it the same for buildings around an event like this? it same for buildings around an event like this?— event like this? it is, which is why the _ event like this? it is, which is why the former - event like this? it is, which| is why the former president event like this? it is, which - is why the former president but you hear many eyewitnesses at the scene describing the secret service counter snipers on nearby roofs. you know what, that does not sound on to me about what you are describing of where people have told news reporters where they saw somebody. if you look at the rates of gunfire, you can hear only one hit, there appears to

be only one hit, that tells me there was a greater distance involved of acquiring the target, being the former residence, and having someone have six to seven mrs only one hit. but there are countermeasures in place to have to cash these types of things, and in this case, it appears the minutes of work, but i can tell you the fbi is going to coming. the fbi is going to coming. the fbi is going to coming. the fbi is going to lead the investigation because this was an assassination attempt. the secret service will hand over the investigation to the fbi. they will stay a part of the investigation. and this rally area and this location of where the shooter was now becomes a crime scene, and they will work it exactly as a crime scene. they would interview witnesses, they will look for ballistics, and all the other things that are associated with making the

case of what possibly went wrong care. case of what possibly went wrong care-— case of what possibly went wron: care. . , ., wrong care. charles, we heard from a report _ wrong care. charles, we heard from a report on _ wrong care. charles, we heard from a report on the _ wrong care. charles, we heard from a report on the ground, i from a report on the ground, our north american correspondent, he says the area where she is right now outside the rally has been locked down for security concerns. i want to ask you, in terms of what happens after the shots ring out, and we're looking at video right now of secret service with the former president, they are guarding him, what are the particles in place —— protocols in place one there is ace suspected assassination attempt? what happens next? tina attempt? what happens next? two thins attempt? what happens next? two thin . s are attempt? what happens next? thorn things are going on here sobhy of the sound of gunfire, which all secret service agents are very familiar with and know to respond to. and then you have the visual of the former president grabbing the right side of his face by his air. as

they are seeing these two things happen, the agents, you can hear it on the video, they start screaming at the former president to get down, to drop to the ground, while they are simultaneously responded, so they can put their bodies on top of his. then you see the additional response of more manpower. additional response of more manpower-— manpower. just a “umping, welcomeh manpower. just a jumping, welcome interviewers - manpower. just a jumping, welcome interviewers on i manpower. just a jumping, i welcome interviewers on bbc news, this is breaking news that we are bringing you, former president donald trump has been rushed off the stage with visible blood on the side of his head and his air after shots were fired just minutes into that ready that was taking place in security teams rushed in to protect the former president at the event in pennsylvania. he then raised a fist to supporters. he was taken away in a carfor medical supporters. he was taken away in a car for medical treatment. us media report that two people

are dead as a response to this incident. a spokesperson for the campaign said that mr trump wasafine the campaign said that mr trump was a fine and undergoing checks at a medical facility. look at gunshots, screaming. that was the moment when shots rang out minutes into the campaign event in pennsylvania outside the city of pittsburgh. i will go to gary 0'donoghue but first i want to read this statement, just coming into us from the white house, from presidentjoe biden. he told us that i have been briefed on the shooting trump's rally in pennsylvania and i am grateful to hear he is safe and doing well. i pray for him and his family and all those who were at the rally as we wait further information. jill and i are

grateful to the