with covid, so we had killed people with covid, so we had an underfunded nhs, and ifi killed people with covid, so we had an underfunded nhs, and if i can -ive an underfunded nhs, and if i can give you— an underfunded nhs, and if i can give you some figures very quickly, under_ give you some figures very quickly, under the _ give you some figures very quickly, under the thatcherjohn major under the thatcher john major governments, under the thatcherjohn major governments, the nhs spend went up at around _ governments, the nhs spend went up at around 2% per year per person after— at around 2% per year per person after adjusting for age, and under the blair— after adjusting for age, and under the blair and brown government it went up— the blair and brown government it went up 5.8% per year per person, after— went up 5.8% per year per person, after adjusting for age in the population, and in the two terms from _ population, and in the two terms from 2010 — population, and in the two terms from 2010 onwards, it went down 0.7% and 03% _ from 2010 onwards, it went down 0.7% and 03% per— from 2010 onwards, it went down 0.7% and 0.3% peryear, and from 2010 onwards, it went down 0.7% and 0.3% per year, and this was historic— and 0.3% per year, and this was historic underfunding of the nhs, so the waiting lists for treatment had .one the waiting lists for treatment had gone up _ the waiting lists for treatment had gone up 1.9 times from 2009 until 2019. _ gone up 1.9 times from 2009 until 2019, before the pandemic, and the nhs was _ 2019, before the pandemic, and the nhs was under such extreme pressure

because _ nhs was under such extreme pressure because of— nhs was under such extreme pressure because of underfunding, before the pandemic, _ because of underfunding, before the pandemic, so that it was not able to cope _ pandemic, so that it was not able to cope and _ pandemic, so that it was not able to cope. and more generally, the social and economic inequalities that were damaging _ and economic inequalities that were damaging the health of the people, what we _ damaging the health of the people, what we know, if you look at two countries, — what we know, if you look at two countries, the uk and the us, pre—pandemic, our countries had the slowest— pre—pandemic, our countries had the slowest improvement in health and the biggest increase in health inequalities of any rich country pre—pandemic, and then during the pandemic, — pre—pandemic, and then during the pandemic, the countries that were most _ pandemic, the countries that were most hit _ pandemic, the countries that were most hit with the decline in life expectancy work at the us and then the countries of the uk and germany. -- were _ the countries of the uk and germany. -- were the _ the countries of the uk and germany. —— were the us. it shows that if you are ill—prepared to deal with the health— are ill—prepared to deal with the health of— are ill—prepared to deal with the health of the population in non—pandemic times, the impact of the pandemic will be so much greater — evenif

even if we had more money and investment in the health service before the pandemic, baroness hallett was also saying that we were planning for the wrong pandemic because we were looking at influencer and we didn't take on board the two coronavirus outbreaks that had happened in asia with mers and sars, we were a bit too focused on influenza and flu. i and sars, we were a bit too focused on influenza and flu.— on influenza and flu. i read that, and i'm sure _ on influenza and flu. i read that, and i'm sure that _ on influenza and flu. i read that, and i'm sure that she _ on influenza and flu. i read that, and i'm sure that she is - on influenza and flu. i read that, and i'm sure that she is right. i on influenza and flu. i read that, l and i'm sure that she is right. that was hot _ and i'm sure that she is right. that was not a — and i'm sure that she is right. that was not a particular to my expertise, but i'm sure that she is right _ expertise, but i'm sure that she is right to— expertise, but i'm sure that she is right. to come back to my concern with local— right. to come back to my concern with local governments and their inability— with local governments and their inability to deal with this, over the decade from 2010, central government supports the local government supports the local government went down by 59%. wow. 59% reduction. and local government was supposed to deal with a

consequence of the pandemic, and they had _ consequence of the pandemic, and they had been cut to smithereens by brutat— they had been cut to smithereens by brutal cuts — they had been cut to smithereens by brutal cuts. theyjust were not in a position— brutal cuts. theyjust were not in a position to — brutal cuts. theyjust were not in a position to deal with what was needed — position to deal with what was needed and to handle the pandemic, which _ needed and to handle the pandemic, which is _ needed and to handle the pandemic, which is why we suffered so badly. you cannot — which is why we suffered so badly. you cannot do that kind of brutal cutting _ you cannot do that kind of brutal cutting and expect that we can respond — cutting and expect that we can respond to normal life. let alone a pandemic — respond to normal life. let alone a pandemic. let us look ahead. baroness _ pandemic. let us look ahead. baroness hallett said that this was about learning the lessons say that this doesn't happen again. are you happy with her ten recommendations, including this overarching body that looks across the whole united kingdom for planning? from what you have said, is it a question of more money invested to make sure that this doesn't happen again? as well as the planning?— this doesn't happen again? as well as the planning? away that i would ut it is it as the planning? away that i would put it is it isn't _ as the planning? away that i would put it is it isn't only _ as the planning? away that i would put it is it isn't only for _ as the planning? away that i would put it is it isn't only for money - put it is it isn't only for money stop— put it is it isn't only for money stop it — put it is it isn't only for money stop it is — put it is it isn't only for money stop it is hard to do things on this

scale _ stop it is hard to do things on this scale without money, but it isn't only more — scale without money, but it isn't only more money. it is recognising two important things: number one, deating _ two important things: number one, dealing with the help of the population, and this is especially true when — population, and this is especially true when a pandemic, takes across government— true when a pandemic, takes across government action. and i think that baroness _ government action. and i think that baroness hallet recommended cross government action and high level cross— government action and high level cross government commitments to deal with this _ cross government commitments to deal with this i_ cross government commitments to deal with this. i am sure that is right. the second — with this. i am sure that is right. the second is to make sure that there _ the second is to make sure that there are — the second is to make sure that there are public services which are appropriately funded, was publicly funded _ appropriately funded, was publicly funded appropriately? no, of course it wasn't _ funded appropriately? no, of course it wasn't. local public health was drastically— it wasn't. local public health was drastically cut. so, in a public health— drastically cut. so, in a public health people employed by local government were not in a position to do test _ government were not in a position to do test traced an isolate, which they— do test traced an isolate, which they should have been. —— test,

trace. _ they should have been. —— test, trace. and — they should have been. —— test, trace, and isolate. so we need more nroney, _ trace, and isolate. so we need more nroney, but — trace, and isolate. so we need more money, but we also need proper cross government— money, but we also need proper cross government coordination.— government coordination. professor sir michael marmot, _ government coordination. professor sir michael marmot, thank - government coordination. professor sir michael marmot, thank you - government coordination. professor sir michael marmot, thank you very | sir michael marmot, thank you very much forjoining us here on bbc news. the professor is one of the people who, as he said, gave evidence in this part of the covert back inquiry. this part purely focused on the planning of the pandemic —— covid inquiry. this report doesn't deal with things like partygate and what happened during the pandemic, because the inquiry itself is still continuing and will be continuing to take evidence until 2026. through the stages we will have other reports that baroness hallett will publish. she was keen to get this report out, because she wants action taken now to prevent it happening again as you have heard in the last 15 minutes or so. we will have more reactions throughout the

afternoon, but for the moment, back afternoon, but forthe moment, back to afternoon, but for the moment, back to you in the studio.— to you in the studio. thank you, nicky schiller. _ to you in the studio. thank you, nicky schiller. another - to you in the studio. thank you, | nicky schiller. another important inquiry we are monitoring is a post office inquiry into the horizon it scandal, they are taking a break at the moment but we have been hearing from sir ed davey, who was the postal affairs minister. we will continue with that inquiry as soon as they come back from their break. first, the justice as they come back from their break. first, thejustice secretary has called for the chair of the criminal cases review position to step down after an independent review into the case of andrew malkinson who was wrongly convicted of rape and spelt 17 years in jail. shabana mahmood said the report showed that helen pitcher is unfit to fulfil her duties and says she has begun the process to replace her. our legal correspondent dominic casciani reports. this was the scene when andy malkinson won his campaign to be exonerated. jailed in 2004 for a rape he never committed, his case was quashed

after compelling evidence that the case was untenable from top to bottom. his innocence proven, but his battle for the full truth has continued. today, an independent report has revealed majorfailings by the criminal cases review commission, the body that investigates wrongful convictions. in 2007, forensic scientists found dna on the victim's vest top that had to be from the true attacker. by 2009, greater manchester police prosecutors and the ccrc all knew of its importance. but the miscarriages body rejected the first of three appeals by andy malkinson for help. five years into my imprisonment they knew about another man's dna, they knew. the cps knew and greater manchester police knew. and ccrc knew. but they did nothing.

today, the report author said that his plight exposed failings throughout criminal justice and specifically by the miscarriages body. there was a complete failure to understand the evidence at the time of the first application, and the significance of the new dna evidence was completely missed. the second application, the approach to that was too rigid. even at the time of the third application, when everything had been made clear, the heavy lifting had been done by the charity representing mr malkinson. in a statement, the chair apologised to mr malkinson, but he says it's too little, too late. get rid of the decision—makers at the ccrc, get a whole new bunch and retrain them in a way that is not sycophantic to the appeal courtjudges. you know? because i think that is what is going on as well. they are too afraid, too timid and fearful of upsetting high courtjudges.

and they shouldn't be. they should be absolutely fearless. a wider review into alleged failings by greater manchester police is still under way. today, andy malkinson begins his fight for compensation, but that could take years. the government pass independent advisers on climate change shape of the uk is in danger of missing the 2030 target to cut climate to carbon emissions. more measures like heat pumps and onshore wind turbines to replace... keir starmer needs to reverse the steps taken by the previous panellist minister to slow down the transition to net zero. abbey environment correspondent has more. from renewable energy to electric cars to home heating, the uk needs to rapidly speed up the energy transition says the government pass independent climate

advisers. they are particularly concerned about how we keep households warm. tote concerned about how we keep households warm.— concerned about how we keep households warm. ~ ., . households warm. we will never force an one to households warm. we will never force anyone to rip — households warm. we will never force anyone to rip out _ households warm. we will never force anyone to rip out their— households warm. we will never force anyone to rip out their existing - anyone to rip out their existing boiler and replace it with a heat pump. boiler and replace it with a heat a um n . p, boiler and replace it with a heat --um. ., ~ , , pump. former prime minister rishi sunak announced _ pump. former prime minister rishi sunak announced rollback - pump. former prime minister rishi sunak announced rollback of - pump. former prime minister rishi sunak announced rollback of plans| pump. former prime minister rishi l sunak announced rollback of plans to replace gas burners from 2035, but the climate committee says that this move was ill—advised. tote the climate committee says that this move was ill-advised.— the climate committee says that this move was ill-advised. we really need to net to move was ill-advised. we really need to get to these _ move was ill-advised. we really need to get to these new— move was ill-advised. we really need to get to these new technologies - to get to these new technologies because they are more efficient at lower cost to households and they will remove some of the vulnerability to these very volatile fossil fuel markets that we have seen over the last few years it has caused so much hardship for so many households. this caused so much hardship for so many households-— households. this community owned wind turbine — households. this community owned wind turbine near— households. this community owned wind turbine near bristol— households. this community owned wind turbine near bristol is - households. this community owned wind turbine near bristol is the - wind turbine near bristol is the tallest in england and one of the few built on during recent years. wind farms and land are now one of the cheapest sorts of electricity and the climate change committee says that lower cost energy is needed to boost the uptake of heat pumps. the lawrence weston estate in bristol are proud of their turbine

and believe it will lower their bills on time. abs, and believe it will lower their bills on time.— and believe it will lower their bills on time. . , . ., , bills on time. a small little group have done _ bills on time. a small little group have done it. _ bills on time. a small little group have done it. you _ bills on time. a small little group have done it. you are _ bills on time. a small little group have done it. you are going, - bills on time. a small little group have done it. you are going, wellj have done it. you are going, well that is what _ have done it. you are going, well that is what the _ have done it. you are going, well that is what the people _ have done it. you are going, well that is what the people haven't . that is what the people haven't done. �* ., that is what the people haven't done. . . . done. and that we are feeling the treat, i done. and that we are feeling the great. i don't _ done. and that we are feeling the great, i don't think _ done. and that we are feeling the great, i don't think we _ done. and that we are feeling the great, i don't think we get - done. and that we are feeling the great, i don't think we get much i great, i don't think we get much benefit ourselves, but we will, be patient. to benefit ourselves, but we will, be atient. ., , ., , patient. to help more people across the uk switch _ patient. to help more people across the uk switch to _ patient. to help more people across the uk switch to low _ patient. to help more people across the uk switch to low carbon - the uk switch to low carbon lifestyle is like getting heat pumps are more insulation, the government advises words alone are not enough and they want to see strong policies from the new labour administration that will make that stretch the neck switch to different lifestyle attractive and affordable and easy. nature also needs a new approach according to the committee. current uk plans for new forests and restoration are advancing too slowly. there needs to be a significant uptake in planting in the next year or there will not be enough trees to soak up excess carbon by 2030. now be returned to

blenheim palace whether european leaders are meeting. we know that one of the key topics being discussed is illegal migration challenge which brings many of them together. sir keir starmer has talked about coming up with a common european approach to tackling it, but what might that mean? bbc verify have looked into it. fin but what might that mean? bbc verify have looked into it.— have looked into it. on the key objectives _ have looked into it. on the key objectives for _ have looked into it. on the key objectives for the _ have looked into it. on the key objectives for the day - have looked into it. on the key objectives for the day pass - have looked into it. on the key - objectives for the day pass meeting of european leaders to discuss closer collaboration to tackle illegal migration. what might that closer co—operation look like? we first look at the scale of the joint challenge. small boat channel crossings in 2024 are around 15,000. the annual peak was in 2022, nearly 46,000 for the whole year. the eu has faced its own problems with this form of migration which are of course a regular. much of that has been crossings off boats across the mediterranean and crossings so far

in 2024 are around 80,000. the peak was last year with 263,000 people crossing. as you can see, the uk pass experience as part of the bigger picture of boat crossing is facing the continent. most people are irregularly by boat into the eu or the uk make asylum claims, and in 2023, around 84,000 people applied for asylum in the uk, close to the highest levels in 20 years. that equates to around 1.2 per thousand people. how does that compare to europe? well, in 2023just people. how does that compare to europe? well, in 2023 just overi million people sought asylum across the eu, the highest since 2016 and equivalent to 2.3 people per 1000 people. on a national basis, the uk figure is lower than the likes of italy, france, and germany, and much lower than cyprus at 13 per thousand people. so, what about closer co—operation? well, in april, the eu agreed a new asylum and migration packed to require eu member states

to share responsibility for asylum seekers. could the uk potentially joined the scheme or something similar? well, labour did say before the election in its border plan that it wanted a new agreement with france and other countries on return and a family reunion, there they added that they wouldn't sign up to any eu quota scheme because the uk isn't a member state, so any agreement would have to be outside that. here are some historical context: the old dublin system allowed the uk to return asylum seekers to eu member states without considering their asylum claims. the uk left that system in the latter stages of the uk membership, as you can see here, transfers of asylum seekers into the uk shown in blue were higher than transfers out, shown in red. so, what this underlines is that while pan—european agreements can potentially help to manage such common migration challenges when it comes to the impact on people, it can work in both directions. haifa.

comes to the impact on people, it can work in both directions. now, we could turn to — can work in both directions. now, we could turn to the _ can work in both directions. now, we could turn to the post _ can work in both directions. now, we could turn to the post office - could turn to the post office inquiry. ed davey apologised to alan bates for refusing to meet him in 2010. pat mcfadden who held the same job from 2000 and 72,009 said that politicians were very reliant on others telling the truth as they made decisions around horizon it failures. we rejoined the inquiry now by sir ray davies giving evidence. it now by sir ray davies giving evidence-— now by sir ray davies giving evidence. . . , ., evidence. it creates a live file. the sub-postmasters - evidence. it creates a live file. the sub-postmasters are - evidence. it creates a live file. i the sub-postmasters are trained evidence. it creates a live file. - the sub-postmasters are trained on the sub—postmasters are trained on the system. next paragraph: as with any large organisation ends with ensuring accuracy. a new heading: action taken, begins with post office limited is a regular system, ends with an undertaking by the fsp. then, all other paragraphs to the end of the document, no court has

ever ruled problems with the horizon system. going back to the start of that, on page three where it begins: scrolling down... there. when you read this, or when you would have read this, or when you would have read this, or when you would have read this, would you have expected that some system or process for verifying the accuracy of what you're being told had been undertaken? xanax yes. i would have assumed i was being told the truth —— yes. assumed i was being told the truth -- es. ., , . , , -- yes. you see the way it is presented — -- yes. you see the way it is presented to _ -- yes. you see the way it is presented to you _ -- yes. you see the way it is presented to you is - -- yes. you see the way it is presented to you is as - -- yes. you see the way it is presented to you is as a - -- yes. you see the way it is i presented to you is as a matter -- yes. you see the way it is - presented to you is as a matter of fact. it presented to you is as a matter of fact. ., , �* presented to you is as a matter of fact. ., ,�* '. fact. it doesn't say: post office alle . ed fact. it doesn't say: post office alleged to _ fact. it doesn't say: post office alleged to us — fact. it doesn't say: post office alleged to us in _ fact. it doesn't say: post office alleged to us in the _ fact. it doesn't say: post office alleged to us in the following. l fact. it doesn't say: post office | alleged to us in the following. it doesn't say post office at say to us

of the following. it doesn't say: we have asked for a briefing from post office and they have provided the following. it office and they have provided the followinu. ., , ., . ., following. it does not say that, no. and so, following. it does not say that, no. and so. would _ following. it does not say that, no. and so, would you _ following. it does not say that, no. and so, would you read _ following. it does not say that, no. and so, would you read this - following. it does not say that, no. and so, would you read this as: - following. it does not say that, no. | and so, would you read this as: this is essentially being she ex�*s own account to you. on the document on the right—hand side, can we see a brief two days, note that this is from the post office? it is the latest august... a to b is for your meeting with jfsa. latest august... a to b is for your meeting withjfsa. in that document, can we get page two? can we see a heading of the integrity of the horizon system and a paragraph that says that the horizon system has beenin says that the horizon system has been in place for ten years, yes? and then on the left—hand page, if

we scroll down, we can see the next, the system is currently being updated, on the right—hand side, the system is currently being updated, on the left—hand side, the integrity of both horizon and horizon online... and so it goes on. the entirety of the information in the sections i have read to you appears to be cut and paste from the post office briefing. they have right clicked, swiped, cut and paste, or copy and paste. is that what you would have expected to have happened by your officials when they were briefing you? it is not attributed to post office. it briefing you? it is not attributed to post office-— to post office. it is not what i expected- — to post office. it is not what i expected. when _ to post office. it is not what i expected. when i _ to post office. it is not what i expected. when i saw - to post office. it is not what i expected. when i saw thesel to post office. it is not what i _ expected. when i saw these documents in the _ expected. when i saw these documents in the bundle sent to me, it became obvious— in the bundle sent to me, it became obvious that — in the bundle sent to me, it became obvious that there had been the cut and paste. — obvious that there had been the cut and paste, and it surprised me. why is it surprising _ and paste, and it surprised me. brainy is it surprising officials and paste, and it surprised me. wig is it surprising officials would simply swallow whole what the post office were telling them by cutting

and pasting an account into a ministerial briefing? l and pasting an account into a ministerial briefing?- and pasting an account into a ministerial briefing? i would have thou . ht ministerial briefing? i would have thought that _ ministerial briefing? i would have thought that they _ ministerial briefing? i would have thought that they would - ministerial briefing? i would have thought that they would have - ministerial briefing? i would have thought that they would have had ministerial briefing? i would have i thought that they would have had a meeting _ thought that they would have had a meeting and argued, well, not argued, — meeting and argued, well, not argued, but probed, a bit. this meeting — argued, but probed, a bit. this meeting had been planned for. i asked _ meeting had been planned for. i asked for— meeting had been planned for. i asked for it injuly two months after— asked for it injuly two months after coming into office. it didn't happen— after coming into office. it didn't happen until october, only so there was plenty— happen until october, only so there was plenty of time for them to prepare — was plenty of time for them to prepare. given that there had been a number— prepare. given that there had been a number of— prepare. given that there had been a number of party questions and letters, — number of party questions and letters, this was an important meeting — letters, this was an important meeting for me and people knew that. i meeting for me and people knew that. i would _ meeting for me and people knew that. i would have expected a quality brief~ _ i would have expected a quality brief. ~ to, i would have expected a quality brief. ~ u, ., brief. we can get rid of the right hand document. _ brief. we can get rid of the right hand document. i— brief. we can get rid of the right hand document. i attended - brief. we can get rid of the right hand document. i attended the l hand document. i attended the meeting itself. the document on the left, go back to page one. scroll down. stop there. you will see that

in the attendees are listed sir alan and two lawyers, one from shoe smiths and one from kumar rich called izzy hogg at basingstoke who have defended in a number of safe postmasters prosecuted. this was on the 7th of october. we know izzy hogg was seema misra pass solicitor and that her trial started a few days later on the 13th of october 2010. we also know that through other evidence of david smith of the post office and the executive team at the post office were watching the trial very closely. once your recollection seema misra pass case discussed at the meeting? l

recollection seema misra pass case discussed at the meeting?- discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember. — discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember. i— discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember, i think— discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember, i think that _ discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember, i think that in - discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember, i think that in the - discussed at the meeting? i cannot remember, i think that in the replyj remember, i think that in the reply i remember, i think that in the reply i gave _ remember, i think that in the reply i gave to _ remember, i think that in the reply i gave to sir— remember, i think that in the reply i gave to sir alan bates, there was a reference — i gave to sir alan bates, there was a reference to it. in i gave to sir alan bates, there was a reference to it.— i gave to sir alan bates, there was a reference to it._ in | a reference to it. in the reply? in the rel a reference to it. in the reply? in the reply on _ a reference to it. in the reply? in the reply on the _ a reference to it. in the reply? in the reply on the 7th _ a reference to it. in the reply? in the reply on the 7th of— a reference to it. in the reply? ml the reply on the 7th of december. that may— the reply on the 7th of december. that may be because he wrote two letters _ that may be because he wrote two letters subsequent to the meeting and it— letters subsequent to the meeting and it may have been in there. i am sorry— and it may have been in there. i am sorry that _ and it may have been in there. i am sorry that t — and it may have been in there. i am sorry that i don't know. i cannot remember— sorry that i don't know. i cannot remember it being raised at the meeting — remember it being raised at the meeting. we haven't got a note of the meeting? i haven't been given a note _ the meeting? i haven't been given a note |_ the meeting? i haven't been given a note. ., r' the meeting? i haven't been given a note. . , the meeting? i haven't been given a note. ., , ., note. i asked the department for the minutes. note. i asked the department for the minutes- they _ note. i asked the department for the minutes. they were _ note. i asked the department for the minutes. they were not _ note. i asked the department for the minutes. they were not able - note. i asked the department for the minutes. they were not able to - note. i asked the department for the minutes. they were not able to give | minutes. they were not able to give it. would minutes. they were not able to give it- would you _ minutes. they were not able to give it. would you have _ minutes. they were not able to give it. would you have followed - minutes. they were not able to give it. would you have followed the - it. would you have followed the lines in your— it. would you have followed the lines in your briefing? - it. would you have followed the lines in your briefing? by - it. would you have followed the lines in your briefing? by and i lines in your briefing? by and larue, lines in your briefing? by and large. yes- — lines in your briefing? by and large. yes- the _ lines in your briefing? by and large, yes. the lines, - lines in your briefing? by and large, yes. the lines, the - lines in your briefing? by and | large, yes. the lines, the key lines in your briefing? by and - large, yes. the lines, the key lines itook— large, yes. the lines, the key lines i took from — large, yes. the lines, the key lines i took from them, they wear that, as they say, _ i took from them, they wear that, as they say, listening mode. the reason for that— they say, listening mode. the reason for that was— they say, listening mode. the reason for that was that there was a possibility of a court case, and

they— possibility of a court case, and they said — possibility of a court case, and they said it was prudent to adopt that approach with the comments made _ that approach with the comments made i_ that approach with the comments made. i don't know how many questions _ made. i don't know how many questions i asked. i was keen to listen _ questions i asked. i was keen to listen and — questions i asked. i was keen to listen and hear their points of view — listen and hear their points of view. if— listen and hear their points of view. , ., . listen and hear their points of view. i. . ., listen and hear their points of view. . ., . , view. if you look at our ob'ectives at the foot — view. if you look at our ob'ectives at the foot of i view. if you look at our ob'ectives at the foot of the t view. if you look at our ob'ectives at the foot of the page, _ view. if you look at our objectives at the foot of the page, you - view. if you look at our objectives at the foot of the page, you are l at the foot of the page, you are advised by mr whitehead that tactically, it would be advised to seek to establish at an early stage where the legal action against post office is imminent or planned, if so it would be prudent to adopt a subdued approach in the comments that you make. did you read that as being a device, ie, to establish a concurrency of court action? therefore giving you an additional reason not to commit to anything? well, i am not sure about a device. i well, i am not sure about a device. i assume _ well, i am not sure about a device. i assume they were giving me their best advice. is

i assume they were giving me their best advice-— i assume they were giving me their best advice. is begins with the word tacticall . best advice. is begins with the word tactically- they _ best advice. is begins with the word tactically. they may _ best advice. is begins with the word tactically. they may have _ best advice. is begins with the word tactically. they may have been - tactically. they may have been wantin: tactically. they may have been wanting to _ tactically. they may have been wanting to protect _ tactically. they may have been wanting to protect me - tactically. they may have been wanting to protect me as - tactically. they may have been wanting to protect me as a - tactically. they may have been - wanting to protect me as a minister, i do wanting to protect me as a minister, i do not _ wanting to protect me as a minister, i do not know. but, it is difficult because — i do not know. but, it is difficult because i— i do not know. but, it is difficult because i cannot remember all of the details _ because i cannot remember all of the details of— because i cannot remember all of the details of that meeting. i can remember how my considered sir alan, i am happy_ remember how my considered sir alan, i am happy to— remember how my considered sir alan, i am happy to go into details about that, _ i am happy to go into details about that, but— i am happy to go into details about that, but i— i am happy to go into details about that, but i don't always follow the advice _ that, but i don't always follow the advice of — that, but i don't always follow the advice of my officials, and that is why the — advice of my officials, and that is why the meeting was taking place. the advice — why the meeting was taking place. the advice continues: you should emphasise that the issues raised by the jfsa are emphasise that the issues raised by thejfsa are contractual matters for post office and make clear that the government shareholder has an arms length relationship and doesn't have any role in the company pass day—to—day operations, and establish whether legal action is contemplated or committed to taking place. if so, note it would be for the relevant process and the legal process to

decide on thejfsa case and the... is effectively subdued. in the next page: demonstrate a willingness to hearjfsa“s side of the story. jfsa claim they post office and officials are covering up the problems with horizon, but make clear that you are not in a position to offer substantive comment and avoid committing to setting up an independent or external review of horizon. do you think you are likely to have followed that? i am horizon. do you think you are likely to have followed that?— to have followed that? i am pretty sure that i would _ to have followed that? i am pretty sure that i would have _ to have followed that? i am pretty sure that i would have followed i sure that i would have followed those _ sure that i would have followed those lines, yes. i may well have asked _ those lines, yes. i may well have asked one — those lines, yes. i may well have asked one or two more questions than they wanted, but it wasn't a meeting which _ they wanted, but it wasn't a meeting which sir— they wanted, but it wasn't a meeting which sir alan had wanted to put his case _ which sir alan had wanted to put his case. ., , , which sir alan had wanted to put his case. . , , , case. that is serve ed davey giving evidence to — case. that is serve ed davey giving evidence to the _ case. that is serve ed davey giving evidence to the post _ case. that is serve ed davey giving evidence to the post office - case. that is serve ed davey giving evidence to the post office inquiry. j evidence to the post office inquiry. if you want to keep following that, we have a live page on our website.

so read david has apologised to sir alan bates for initially refusing to meet him when he was serving as postal affairs minister in 2010, saying in his witness statement that the letter to mr bates was poorly judged and that he did go on to meet him five months later. he also says he would have acted differently if the post office told the truth, and he was put on the spot by the council inquiry about who had lied to him, then a dem leader said he dealt with pawn animals and the former managing director, david smith. he said that these are the people passing information it was untrue. not surprising that people are accusing others of lying, but this has been a session during which the audience had been unhappy with the audience had been unhappy with the answers given lights are ed davey about his period as postal affairs minister. if you're a fan of warmer summer weather, this

summer has certainly made you wait for it. the next few days will be probably to your liking. tomorrow, some places getting 31 degrees. hot for some of us, pretty humid forjust about all of us. the jet stream, the wind high in the atmosphere steering weather systems around the globe bending to the north of our shores and allowing us to draw this very warm and humid air up from the south. feeling the effects of that this afternoon across england and wales where we are seeing some sunshine, more cloud and rain for northern ireland and the west of scotland. in the north—east of scotland, some brightness, low 20s in temperatures. in the south of england and wales, into the middle 20s. those of above the average for the time of year. 28 behind the south—east corner. 27—28 for the south—east corner. really humid tonight, misty and murky for coasts overnight lows of 13—17 . a pretty warm start tomorrow morning. we see that sunshine across many parts of england and wales and those temperatures will really respond

through the day. misty and murky for the western coast. cloud generally for northern ireland and scotland. rain into the western isles where it will turn breezy. for many spots, pretty warm, 21—90 from belfast and 21—22 from belfast and glasgow. 30 degrees in london. some places could get 31 degrees. it probably won't last all that long. this frontal system pushing in from the west on bringing in from the west is bringing some outbreaks of rain. if that front moves slowly enough, it may bring eastern parts of england warm air. another pretty warm one across eastern parts where we see sunshine, although some showers and thunderstorms could erupt. further west, a band of heavy rain moving slowly and cooling things off. 16 for belfast, 18 for plymouth, still the mid—high 20s across parts of central and eastern england. however, through saturday and into sunday, that rain will slide northwards and eastwards, sweeping the heat and humidity away.

a cooler day for all of us on sunday, not a bad day weather wise, spells of sunshine, one or two showers, top temperatures north—south15—22 .

live from london. this is bbc news.

the king has arrived at a major summit in blenheim palace, where uk“s new prime minister welcomes dozens of european leaders, and promises to reset relations with the eu. lam i am lewis vaughanjones live at that summit at blenheim palace. big issues being discussed, the war in ukraine and how to tackle illegal migration. it's day four of the republican national convention, where donald trump will formally accept his party's nomination. we are live in milwaukee where the theme is make america great once again. donald trump set to take the stage and talk about a new golden age for america. joe biden pauses his election campaign — after catching covid — with reports, more democrats are telling him to drop out. student—led protests in bangladesh intensify

again — with the death toll growing and the national tv