♪ sonali: welcome to bloomberg markets. equities are struggling to gain traction after a rally that defied every doomsday scenario on wall street. let's get a quick check on the markets because the s&p 500 is now lower on the day in the nasdaq is following suit. the s&p 500 down almost 0.1 percent, looking it could in flat on the day. nasdaq 100 is also down more than 0.7%. we were only about two basis points higher yesterday but we

are at levels above 460 once again where we started last week. the 10 year yield is at 418 and much more economic data and this week before the fomc next week. on the equity side, looking at the biggest losers, nvidia, apple and tesla are dragging the index lower. dollar tree shares are having the worst day in nearly a year after announcing plans to shutter about 1000 stores in an effort to improve profitability. valero energy continues to rise ever hitting a record high yesterday with energy the best performing sector in the s&p 500 today. earlier today, former new york fed president bill dudley gave us his take on where the rate path goes from here. >> marches off the table, may is probably off the table, too. we are talking about the fed cutting rates probably sometime this summer and it will be maybe three.

given the inflation data, maybe that will shrink to 2. there is still plenty of time and plenty of meetings this year to cut rates at any time. sonali: ken griffin also spoke this week about the fed and said the bank needs to be more careful. he said pausing and changing direction back toward higher rates quickly would be the most devastating course of action to pursue. we will discuss this now with lara riem. you were early to say inflation could have a sticky path lower and could potentially stay a little higher for longer. we've seen two months of data upsetting the course. do you think it could get worse in terms of the inflation story moving forward? >> i don't think it has to get worse. what we are experiencing is familiar. every month it's like the data looked great but there is one

factor the cause the upside surprise. this is what we keep hearing. that is the 3% inflation backdrop, not by 2% inflation backdrop and that's the problem. that's what the fed will have to wrestle with. i think it will be a lot harder for them to cut rates and markets currently anticipate. sonali: when you say much harder, do you mean the on the first rate cut or even the first one would be difficult? >> i think they will have to wait until deeper into the third quarter then june. i really use this phrase specifically -- surgical rate cuts. i think markets need to move away from the idea that there will be any easing program where we are cutting on a regular basis. it will be a net and a talk and it will have to be carefully snuck in between markets that are still racing higher today and data across the board that

looks really strong. sonali: how do you think about the data ahead? we had critical data yesterday when it came to the inflation print and we are drum beating to that fomc meeting next week. what are you looking out for? >> in retail sales, they will always be important. beyond that, i think the employment picture still looks really solid. i'm also looking at business investment. we are seeing an economy firing on all cylinders but the last two quarters, business investment has slowed a little bit. i expected to stay really positive but as we look ahead, the economy just remains strong. it's really about inflation. at the margin, when we look at the consumer and saw that the liquid see numbers which bear watching, i think we will get another month of solid consumption. sonali: when you think about what we've seen in the yield curve, the longest inversion on

record. what is that telling you? are you worried that perhaps we haven't baked in what's worse to come when you think about a landing? >> it's a point that is not discussed enough, the yield curve inversion may not be as reliable of a signal of recession but if we think the economy is going to stay robust and not move into recession, that yield curve has got to re-normalize. i think it's a combination of a couple of rate cuts in the second half of the year and long-term rates moving higher. i think we retest 5% on the 10 year sometime this year. but i'm not sure it's going to have the same consequence the rapid move in the third quarter of last year had on broader markets. sonali: you mentioned the idea about inflation being supported around the 3% level. does that mean rates stay high for longer and what does this

mean for you in terms of the discussion in terms of what the true neutral rate might be? >> i moving away from this higher for longer because i see it as a renormalization back to the 1990's and early 2000. i think we got complacent that rates should somehow be so low even if the neutral rate stays where i think long-run estimates are between 2-3% and that's a wideband but we really need to have that in the back of our mind because i think there is a lot of uncertainty around those estimates. that's a world where interest rates could easily come to rest with the fed funds rate between three and 4% and long-term rates could be around 5%. that may sound bearish but for asset allocators, that's a rich and bierman with a lot of potential. we need to diverse away from -- diversify away from traditional

assets. sonali: were long-term rates shift toward 5%, that is higher than we are right now. where do see investments going? >> the good news about solid fundamental backdrop is that private credit, high yield, private equity really offer a robust opportunity for double-digit returns. the good news is, we are out of that era where there is no alternative but equities. if you even think equities will go up 10 or 15% over the year, you can counterweight that with real opportunity in your portfolio for other double-digit returns. i think that's important. we see so much concentration in the mag7, you want to diversify and balance that in your portfolio. for an asset allocators come it's finally good news where they were great or targeted ways to do it. -- there are great alternative

ways to do it. sonali: rates will still be higher than what we see now but do you see company start to struggle a little more than they have been in that environment? >> we are clearly going to see select companies that have been kept afloat by artificially low interest rates bearing the difficulty. what has been the problem with higher interest rates is that we moved there so fast. now that we are in a world of higher interest rates, i compare it to someone moving from san francisco to chicago. the first winter is horrible and the second winter is ok and now it's chilly but i'm getting used to it and by the third winter, you understand this is what winter is. it's a long way of saying that with higher interest rates, the longer we are here, the more companies will build this into their financing costs and the more that markets and even households will manage through it. sonali: we thank you so much for

being with us. we will go from the treasury market to the rest of the bond market. the implied cost of refinancing junk bonds is now at its lowest since may of 2022 and is falling because have spurred a wave of corporate bond sales and had pushed back the maturity wall of debt. we get the report now from london. how do you think about this maturity wall and why it's finally coming down? >> the maturity wall is usually not a problem if companies can raise new debt in order to refinance. that wasn't a problem at all in the decade leading to 2022. everyone knows what changes that central banks started jacking up rates in order to tackle runaway inflation. at that point, we had a problem and that spurred concerns among the investors. if companies have to repay a large amount of their debt in a

short time, are they able to raise new debt to acceptable levels? in 2022, that wasn't the case and we are concerned that when we make this year and next year, companies will have trouble in big trouble repaying their debt. that's starting to change now. refinancing costs are decreasing and that allows the wave of debt we see in the maturity wall is being pushed back to 2025-2026. sonali: how do you see the problems that could still lie ahead? rates are being pushed a little lower by the market and it's helping out some of these companies would've otherwise refinanced at higher rates but what can still happen from here? >> everything is falling into place in the credit market. it creates this equilibrium that allows the companies to issue at a relatively cheap rate. the problem is we are pricing in a scenario even a no landing and

we have inflows to credit funds on the back of relatively high interest rates still. if one of these things changes in the fed for example doesn't cut when we expect and by the amount we expect, if there is some kind of landing and of fund flows start becoming softer than we have now, and the situation could be rather fragile. sonali: we appreciate your time and your reporting. coming up next, we will talk to oppenheimer on why the options market is showing you signs of stress and opportunity. we will talk about why he's keen on which sectors in particular this year. stick with us, this is bloomberg. ♪

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sonali: this is bloomberg markets. it's no secret that markets have rallied and a massive weight out of the october lows. nvidia and bitcoin have been big drivers but what's less known is what's next for stocks and other assets. we will bring in alon rosen from oppenheimer. also abigail doolittle. when you look at the risk on appetite that has been pervasive across wall street, do you worry that things are getting a bit toppy and some trays look crowded and if anything were to back off that it could have a bigger impact? >> great to see you. it's been all about nvidia that's been the driver of the market with a lot of correlation to bitcoin. they been going hand-in-hand on

this meteor rise. what we have seen is a little bit of euphoria hit last friday with questions on why the strong reversal and there was nothing fundamental. we are getting technicals in this market and liquidity has been driving it, investors are taking money out of cash and have been putting it into the market finally. what we saw was the relative strength index is very notable. the rsi did an incredible 83 weekly on nvidia friday. this is massively above the 200 day which are levels that are unheard of with not even cisco in the first quarter of 2000 when it hit its highs. we are seeing a little bit of it to credit situation and the call option volume was massive nest but led to a complete collapse and a rug pull across the semi sector. we are seeing general risk on with e code data being interpreted positively. with eco-data being interpreted

positively. if it's hotter, maybe they will cut rates sooner, if it's cooler than its positive inflation is going lower. it's been a challenging to see what exactly might cause this market to turn to risk off and we've been focused on more underperforming sectors abigail: great to chat with you alone. let's talk more about nvidia. you can substitute the word nvidia for market rally whether it is the october, 2023 or 2022 low, it's up more than 600% over a year-and-a-half or so. you are saying it's a little bit crowded and i'm looking at the technicals and it looks as though lower highs, less momentum and weaker buying on the recent highs. for nvidia, if the consolidation turn into something more like a crash but a correction, would that just pull the rug out beneath the markets? >> 100%, think we got a taste of that friday when you saw a big

reversal in the market once nvidia turned. it does feel like as nvidia goes, so goes the market but in general, we are seeing a day like today where nvidia is a little weaker and tech is being sold and we are seeing other pockets of strength in the market. if you look at fundamentals which is not my territory that many people still think nvidia is cheap and thanks it goes up two or three times from here. there is a big battleground on where should trade. bears feel its up and it's getting too crowded from what they are able to add versus the potential competition ahead. even the bears are scared to step in front of this train for now. abigail: what if we were to see this, why would a potential rotation to other styles like small-cap not save the market from nvidia?

>> i think right now the general trend up has been phenomenal. technical strategists think anything under s&p 5400 is cheap. we are seeing investors look for value outside of technology. it feels like a chase here but from what we saw friday, it was a good taste of that potential risk off. every dip we've had has been a one day wonder and we going right back up so is been challenging to think we should just go straight down and we been saying for the last month and a half that if you are not long, you are short because you are underperforming if you don't have long stuck exposure across different areas. we are promoting to stay long and keep your long exposure but we are entering a more seasonal time ahead. we are using etf's again to add downside protection and investors are short stock or short futures, we think is a good time to use the cheap

implied volatility to add complexity to the portfolio using options as part of your hedges. sonali: you mentioned you were looking outside of big tech names to add some value and investors are doing more of that but how do you define what that means? >> if you look at the russell 2000, it's trying to break out of its current range. we are up against 20 seven. look at a sector like china, that's become on investable as of late. nobody as long as been extremely frustrating year to date. it will try to break out of its recent range. we had a very active kweb trade and our desk today. we sold the march 27 calls and but the may calls around 80,000 times which was a notable motion earlier and people are looking for those catch up place in the get u.s. tech and why can't china catch up to that more than it has? we are seeing people try to find

value. biotech is been in focus. without a great call from a research team specifically viking which is outperforming its $116 price target. it's a massive move from as low as 10 to almost a hundred. it came back to around 63 a couple of days ago we are back pitching that. we think that has a good app side by the end of the month. i think biotech, financials, energy, china, we could see where money rotates out of tech into those areas for further upside. sonali: with thank you so much for your time. he is the head of derivatives at oppenheimer. also our own abigail doolittle. quantz is having the best year since 2008. we will talk about those details next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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sonali: this is bloomberg markets. trend following quantz are rallying back on wall street and having their best year since 2008 and it's thanks to the relentless stockmarket gain and sharp moves across commodities. we reported on this. one of my favorite stories on the terminal now. i like to say i was a failed quand to -- so to see them succeeding is great so what's driving them back? >> last year was a pretty tough one. this february, they're having the second-best month on record for many of the big names we mention. we mentioned aqr and mulvaney. a big part is equities. the gaming equities have momentum so they don't care about fundamentals. they care about the price and been doing amazing ul and in

commodities, there have been more niche markets like sugar or soybeans that have been doing -- have had specific trends. that's been a really big driver of the returns as well. sonali: you wrote that aqr has second-best month on record in february. what about the others? they may not be as large as a qr. >> they are smaller and they also had the second-best month for each of them. the best month since 2008. it's another time of high volatility where they managed with commodities which is a slightly bigger driver than equities. we saw some of the biggest durations in 20 years in some of the soft commodities. writing those trends has been beneficial for them. they've had some draw in january

as well as a some of the gains we are seeing is like 30 or 45%. an incredible start to the year compared to what we were seeing from all other markets. sonali: how do you think about these returns moving forward? is there something that can throw things off especially when there is the underlying critique in a market that perhaps it's these trend followers that are exacerbating the market moves in the first place? >> this is an interesting and environment. people are saying that the trend forward is doing well when stocks are down by a lot and when stocks are up by a lot. you can argue that at this strong momentum trend continues, they will continue to do well. whether they exasperate the moves as been a big debate. it's very divided on wall street. we've seen that maybe they have had some impact but more broadly, a lot of the -- a lot of them are setting the thesis they are responsible for the big moves.

they can operate in a small market like sugar having a big position but they can have some sizable moves. sonali: what are you watching next? is it the commodity market or the equity market to be watching for these guys? >> i think the commodity market is interesting. it can continue to show big gains. the way those charges thrive is they need macro certainty so this is a market we know is very sensitive to that. sonali: we thank you so very much for your time. it's very impressive. let's take a quick check on the markets because we are still watching some red on the screen. the s&p 500 is still down, up less than 0.1% but still down on the day and then the nasdaq 100 is down more than 0.7% with yields still in the rise. 4.60 on the two-year and 4.18 on the 10 year. more data at this week and a lot

of stalling out before we head into the fomc meeting next week. coming up, we'll talk to searchlight capital about the private equity industry. stich uhis is bloomberg. ♪ go deeper with thinkorswim: our award-wining trading platforms. unlock support from the schwab trade desk, our team of passionate traders who live and breathe trading. and sharpen your skills with an immersive online education crafted just for traders. all so you can trade brilliantly. when i was your age, we never had anything like this. what? wifi? wifi that works all over the house, even the basement.

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sonali: this is bloomberg markets. we've been talking about how equities are struggling to gain traction today. we are one week away from the fed's next rate decision and you are watching a lot of uncertainty. getting a check on the markets, we are still seeing a lot of red on the screen with the s&p 500 down more than 0.1% and the nasdaq 100 down nearly 0.8%. cuban youth though you are seeing the two basis point move, we saw the inflation print yesterday. holding at just under 4.61 and the 10 year yield is holding up strong, three basis points higher. on the equity side, were watching shares of social media

stocks after the house passed a bill to dan tiktok in the united states unless's chinese owner sells the video sharing app. it now faces a lesser known future in the senate which opposition is based on both sides of the aisle. we are also watching bitcoin for a fresh all-time high and net inflows yesterday top $1 billion for the bitcoin etf. coinbase rose even more intraday be securities raised the target to a street high of $300 per share. once topic on a pop this week was paramount on report that apollo receptor the company about a possible takeover of their asset purchase and just as monday, we heard from a large shareholder of pearman who talked about a potential deal. >> there is so many large technology companies as well as traditional media companies that it would be natural to buy paramount local and you can get it -- we think it's selling at a significant undervaluation here

and there is so much negativity around it. everybody hates it. your me -- you remember the great john tech john templeton said to buy when there is maximum pessimism. sonali: another media deal is charter communications. it's looking at a takeover ofaltice usa. there is a lot of talk when it comes to dealmaking in the industry and we will bring in eric zinterhiofer from charter. you look at this industry and you are finally seeing some life breathed back into it. how likely are large-scale mergers in this industry, particular with the support of private equity? >> thanks for having me. as we talked about earlier, it's hard to comment on these things. i am chairman of charter and white alma mater is apollo and i know a lot of the folks there well. we are big shareholders in television.

needless to say, i am close to a lot of people in this world and won't be commenting on any details related to m&a. what i will say broadly speaking is that the prerequisite to the kind of large-scale mna you were referring to, big strategic's coming together really predicated on two things, one is the regulatory environment changing and the other is operational excellence. you think about the traditional media companies, they need to prove this transition of streaming and they need to prove that the traditional ecosystem can be rebuilt in a healthy way. as you may know, charter is trying to do that and we are trying to help along those fronts. when that happens, i think you'll see larger scale strategic m&a. in the interim, i think private equity players can anticipate that. they can identify companies moving in that direction and potentially make some good

investments. sonali: if you are looking at these massive shifts across industries, from where you are sitting, there is still a private equity industry with tons of dry powder but the cost of financing is higher and even if it goes down a little this year it's still higher so how does that math work? >> way it works as the market is a little bit bifurcated right now. equity markets are at all-time highs. on the other hand, people are either ai focused or private credit focused in their skew at least among big alligators. there is a big middle in my opinion that's being ignored. there is a lot of public comedies out there particularly if you are less than one billion a market cap where your valuations are much less than the larger companies is expensive to be public. you are illiquid and i think that's really opportunity lies for private equity. these companies don't want to be public anymore. sonali: whether you are in that

big cap moment or whether you are in the less than $1 million area, there were questions about what your existing debt load looks like. if you look at a company to potentially take it over, how do you feel about companies that are still saddled with potentially too much debt? >> you are right, the other dynamic going on now is that we are in an era of deleveraging. despite these buoyed markets, capital structures were set up with zero interest rate environment so the debt is a multiple of ibita at about six times which is average. needs to come down to four in the way to do that is to have a deleveraging skill set as an investor. this is something we really focus on. in an industry you know well where you can add value, go to that company and say we will come in with security is still provides real upside to the equity but actually d relevant -- but actually direct -- d leverages the company need that skill set in this era we are in.

sonali: you've seen a lot of your rivals in the private equity community push into private credit either in addition to what they are doing or even instead in some cases. do you think that's almost an overcrowded space at this point? how do you keep chasing returns in a space like that when the banks are also stepping in? >> what apollo is doing and others is interesting. i think it's very positive for the economy. you are basically taping -- taking leverage bank balance she's that are prone to dislocations and moving all of that private credit to less leverage balance sheets at scale. i think that will provide great credit and be a boon to companies over the next 10 years. that being said, those firms are vacating a lot of the equity spaces that are still very necessary as a result of pushing into this credit realm. it creates room for more

creative equity players. sonali: does that mean you doubled down on the business of private equity? >> yes. sonali: you talk about these deals under $1 billion. you look at where the hurt is in you look at valuations in aim other industries, do you start to go where others are not? what does that look like? >> we've always been doing that. for us, it's about transforming businesses. you can take great traditional businesses and transform them into something special that can excite investors with growth. we took a business called shift for public which is no public company. we partnered with them to do that. it was an incredibly successful company and resulted in him leaving the first mission to space and financing it which is an amazing story. we turned that from a traditional payments business to a software business and a high-growth business. we are doing that with televisa

univision. it's the biggest content producer for hispanics on the planet. there is 600 million spanish speakers and we built a streaming platform from scratch which will be profitable this year is growing rapidly. those are the kinds of transformations you can do with traditional businesses as opposed to buying the perfect high-growth business at too high valuations. sonali: how do you feel about an exit opportunity for the companies you on currently? is there a window to take advantage of the ipo market? does it look attractive and what last? >> for the right companies, you can do it. if you bond them well enough come you don't need a crazy multiple to sell them. we do a lot in infrastructure and we are the fourth largest builder of fiber across our companies which is a hot area. there is a lot of public private partnerships to do this with all of this infrastructure money coming in so i think there will be opportunities for exit in those areas. sonali: the next 12 months, how

much will it pick up and how much are you willing to put to work? >> we are willing to do both. we are kind of balance between buying and selling now. we were like that last year which is -- which was a tricky year. we made for investments already in a recent fund so i feel pretty good about the investment environment particularly to help companies deleverage. that's where we been focus. sonali: we thank you for giving us a look under the hood in the deal environment. coming up, we are looking at unitedhealth because it faces a class-action lawsuit over its retirement plan and cancer clinics across the country are suffering from a cyber attack on the insurer. stick with us, this is bloomberg. ♪

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♪ ♪ ♪ sonali: this is bloomberg markets. it's time now for stock of the hour. shares of unitedhealth are slightly higher today despite news of a class-action lawsuit claiming that united prioritizes business relationship with wells fargo over workers retirement savings. doctors across the country are stretching to keep their practices afloat. a cyber attack on the unitedhealth change health care unit last month, shares of unit health have broadly been under pressure until a three day snapback this year. we reported on his broader story. there has been a lot of impact across doctors across the country. explain what change health care is and how it was hacked? >> change health care operates a

system that sits in between the health insurers and health care providers and basically helps insurance claims go from one to the other and payments flow back. they said they had a process of about $2 trillion worth of payments each year. it's important for make sure people can get paid. sonali: what happened on february 21 and three weeks later, where do things stand? >> change was the victim of a cyber attack that basically force them to shut down their networks as they make sure they were safe and figured out a way for them to come back online. they are in the process of getting systems back up and running but in the meantime, a huge backlog of payments and claims are piling up. some doctors offices are not getting the cash that they need and are trying to figure out workarounds in the meantime. sonali: what is the government

doing and what are other health care companies doing to ease the pain for these doctors and their clients? you have had some dire reporting in this story alone that potentially clients have to be turned away given the stress the doctors are facing? >> doctors and practices are running low on cash and needing to go to banks to take out loans , going to their lines of credit. there was one practice i talked to that if things don't get that are in the next 4-6 weeks was considering asking their owners to maybe put their personal assets on the line to guarantee loans or they might have to consider sending patients elsewhere. in the meantime, the government has been very strongly encouraging unitedhealth to help get the money moving more quickly and to be more open and transparent about their medication. there are other health care entities, one of the large health care costs especially for

cancer clinics are drug cost. the drug wholesalers have been offering more flexibility for some of the smaller cancer clinics in order to pay their bills so the cancer clinics can keep treating patients. sonali: thank you so much for taking time to talk to us. currently it's the most read story on the bloomberg terminal today. make sure you check it out. coming up next, we will talk about private credit. charisse clark suarez will join me to talk about a $500 million debt deal. stick with us, this is bloomberg. ♪ ♪

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giving our clients an exclusive advantage. principal asset management actively invested. you don't have to worry about things like changing tax rates or filing returns. avalarahhh ahhh >> content is king so if you are paramount global and you own the rights to csi and the got other admission impossible and you've got the nfl in the super bowl

and paul's extraordinary grants that are there, all the active 60 minutes and cbs sunday morning and all the different things you watch, if that content is valuable however you end up getting it. sonali: that was john rogers the founder of aerial investment speaking about media content which brings us to today's wall street be. if you think private credit is hot, asset-based financing is the new game and tune. they have about $48 billion in assets in 2016. today, we learned that kkr is leading a have billion-dollar finance packaging for harborview equity partners, a money manager that's known for acquiring famous music rights of artists including nelly and justin bieber and many more. the founder and ceo joins us now. when you look at this debt

package, it's interesting because when people think about hard assets, asset-based financing, consumer loans or auto loan, how do you start making music a part of this category? >> it's so great to be here with you again so thank you for having me. music is a lifelong asset. many of us have the soundtrack to our lives. we have titles and songs we been listening to for the last 50 years. we discover new music every single day. music has been a long stalwart and a part of our lives for a long time. it really allows us to experience that every single day. that translates candidly into cash flow. you heard john roberts talk about it. i have respect for the content platform. content is queen and the reason for that is because it is such a part of the human experience.

cusick royalties and music cash flows are a royalty on the human experience. you really want to find ways to think about financing those cash flows as we look to acquire them so we can continue to do this work on creating liquidity around this asset class. sonali: the $500 million you recently brought in, you also edit 300 million dollar credit line you expanded at the end of last year. what does all this extra capital really do for you? >> the extra capital fuels our business. we are a young firm and are excited about the momentum over the last three years since our inception. our focus is to be focused on all things in the media, entertainment and sports arena by focusing on being a trusted partner into the creator economy and the creative ecosystem. we started with music and started to do some things outside of music which we are excited about as well. we made two investments in film and production companies, building our ecosystem around the broader media sports and

entertainment platforms. the recycling of capital helps us to continue to do a great job for our stakeholders and ensure air limited partners around the world including her big partners like the team at apollo. it helps us recycle capital to continue the mission of investing in these great assets and be a partner to the overall creative economy. sonali: you kind of have the fun part of the finance job we get to be close to these really large names in society these days. something that's interesting in the financial world is how much you brought in apollo and nowkk r these, massive credit giants. it's worth explaining how these royalties have almost credit like qualities. >> absolutely, we are targeting high single digit unlevered yields in a date by day basis. you think about our own lives, the wonderful thing about being

in non-correlated investment space over the last few years despite many of the life-changing events we've all been through whether it's a the pandemic or inflationary periods for deflationary periods, the one thing that is consistent is that our cash flows have grown. we have created a portfolio construction methodology that allows us to have really stable cash flows against a pool of seasoned assets. then you talk about folks like apollo for kkr, that allows them to create great product investments for their clients which are obviously lp's like ours but also insurance companies those who participate in the insurance ecosystem which is much of the american population. these are good, high-quality assets. they are fun but they are good high-quality assets to deliver yield that is not correlated to the broader economy in the

broader economics we see happening every single day. sonali: from what i understand is what drives yields is how you pick the catalogs themselves, how those communities are developing around artists. we are showing some of the ones you are involved with. when you look at artists to essentially invest in, how are you picking what has staying power? >> it's a combination of a lot of things. we talked about this in the past. because there is so much technology that allows us to see how are our audiences are identifying who they want to spend time with, how they want to listen and what they are listening behavior is, we don't hose -- hold ourselves out as the purveyors of culture. we believe the audience is the purveyors of culture. we really are following the audience and we see the audience in a variety of different places

where we are fans and some places where we are emerging fans. that's the most important to us is by identifying audience. the reason why that dovetails to stability of cash flow is because you can basically find music and content that resonates with an audience and that audience shows up and listens on a continuous basis. it's measurable and therefore investable and you can see those cash flows and have the ability to forecast into the future. that's a big piece of how we think about our thesis. it's very data intensive and that's partly because we are very passionate investors in the broad media and entertainment space but also with a strong credit background. that's the team we built. sonali: we have to leave it there but thank you so much for being with us. back on the heels of a have billion-dollar debt deal today. shares of u.s. steel are taking a turn. the biden administration will voice concerns about a merger

with japan's nippon steel. on april 12, u.s. steel will hold a special meeting of shareholders in connection with the proposed agreement to be bought by nippon steel. this has certainly been a very highly watched deal, one of the largest steel deals in many years. according to people familiar with the matter, u.s. officials and lawyers have drafted a statement and that the white house is privately informing the japanese government about the president's decision. we will keep an eye on that as we have more updates about that deal. let's take a check on the markets because we are still watching markets trade lower on the day. the s&p 500 is trying to be flat, down about 0.1% and the russell 2000 is the one place you are getting a bounce back from the job factor data yesterday, up about 0.6%. semiconductors are still down more than 2.5%. that does it for bloomberg markets. stick with us through the close.

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