>> welcome to bloomberg markets. the latest u.s. jobless claims data adds to evidence the labor market is cooling, paving the way for the fed to possibly cut rates this year. the s&p 500 floating above 5200. just below the market right now. we are seeing highs on the day. 2/10 of 1% higher. you are not seeing the same love

for the nasdaq 100 flat on the day. the dow jones industrial average still in the green. the vix relatively calm. let's look at the bond market. this is where all the interesting action has been. we have the two year yield above 480. you're seeing the direction of travel downward in yields. it is above what we saw in the 10 day low of 470. still well above the mark. the 10 year yield at 448. new york crude at 79. early up on the day. gold spa still on the rise. roadblocks plunging on weak bookings. the game a down more than 20% on the day. a tough day. airbnb posting a weak outlook for the estate sector.

equinox up about 11% on the day. much moves abroad. bank of england held interest rates steady but set it's clear interest -- indicating markets render pricing the pace of easing in the months ahead. earlier, francine lacqua sat down with bailey about the next steps. >> our forecasts are conditional on a number of things. we use of the market curve to set them up. it is important if we find the forecast with the market curve produces best judgment which has inflation below target or above target but not at target, we say so. we say this is where we got to. best collective judgment is that . it follows i think and this is a

comment i made earlier. what we are saying is if the world evolves as the forecast suggests, probably the case would be there for a less restrictive policy. >> everything is conditional. is june a live meeting? >> all meetings are live. >> is june likely? >> that is a different question. >> the key point i would make is we have changed our view on the likely persistence of inflation. second round effects. it is good news. we think there is evidence to suggest it will be less pronounced than we thought it would be. that is a judgment. i am looking at these three key indicators. services, inflation, pay and the labor market to judge the persistence question. >> there is an assumption looking at history that once you

cut, you continue cutting. without prejudging what you will do, can you give us an idea of how you see the cycle different? >> one thing i would say about this which is quite interesting and something we looked at during this round. i the history of the npc most of the cutting cycles have actually been prompted by some sort of shock or other rather than being a natural cyclical -- we have reached the top and i would go down the richard goodness curve. there is not of history. >> because you are not cutting in a recession, it could be one and done? >> i think that would be unusual. as i said earlier, nothing is settled. nothing is ruled out. >> what can you tell us about the play between interest rates

and a cutie? some may for -- and qt? they are in different directions. >> qt operates in the background for us. we don't think it has large impacts in terms of markets. this is the critical point. when we sit down to decide on what the right interest rate setting is, we take into consideration everything including markets. obviously. markets will have absorbed and taken into account the impact of qt. qt is always there. if there is any effect from qt, we will capturing in the movement of markets. >> you don't think it is confusing for markets? >> i don't think so. >> you are not expecting to end it before the end of the year to make sure there is no confusion. >> i don't think there is any difficulty if we get to the

point where we are going to cut interest rates to have qt going on as well. sonali: in the u.s., signs of cooling labor markets are feeling more fed rate cut bets. michael mckee joins me with more. jobless claims higher than expected. there are extraordinary things going on. moments with school recess. how do you read into that? mike: this is not a surprise if you follow jobless claims on a year-to-year basis. new york city public schools sent their kids on their spring holiday break usually in april which is what happened at the end of april and so the first of may numbers reflects the thousands of new york school workers who can file for unemployment. when they are on vacation. we got a big jump up. probably back down next month. 231,000 is the number.

well ahead of the year today average. continuing claims rose a tiny bit. they are also below the year to date average. it does not look like a deterioration in the labor market. what is going to matter is next week when we get ppi on tuesday. wednesday, cpi and retail sales. also tuesday, we have jay powell speaking in europe in a moderate conversation which means he could say just about anything and make news except for the fact he will not have the retail sales numbers and those are good -- those are the ones that are going to matter to the markets. it is hard to say whether we will get any change in the odds of a fed rate cut or not. sonali: we thank you for keeping an eye on the data. the big stuff is next week. up next, affirm ceo is joining us on the health of the can sooner.

-- of the consumer. the shutter market for loans has been catching a lot of investors attention. we are going to ask him about it next. this is bloomberg. ♪

sonali: this is bloomberg markets. we are going to talk about buy now pay later because consumers have embraced it at scale. it allows them to pay for purchases in installments paired what is not as clear is how many of these loans are perhaps under more stress. a recent survey conducted for bloomberg news found 33 -- found 43% of those who own -- who own money to bnpl services said they are behind on payments.

we are going to discuss this with the affirm ceo who just reported earnings this week. gave a big picture here on what delinquencies look like for you guys but why do you think it is so many customers are reporting that much stress on a broader scale as the polls show? max: i'm not sure i can speak to the industry but obviously affirm is built on the idea of underwriting every single transaction, not charging late fees. it is a fundamental alignment between us and the borrower. if the borrower does not pay us back, we cannot benefit. we will lose money if they don't pay us. it is as black as that. he may be an outlier in the sense that our customers help perform to what sounds like a fairly dark sounding survey but also public. our numbers are in plain sight at all times. we just printed our last quarter

yesterday. our delinquencies were ever so slightly down year on year and sequentially, it is 2.3% as it has been for some time. we are doing just fine. the rumors of bnpl's difficulty are greatly exaggerated from my point of view. cannot argue with survey data. i cannot argue with the bloomberg story on the phantom debt which is basically mathematically inaccurate in as following sense. the vast majority of installment loans are reported to credit bureaus. we have been since the very beginning of our time as a company. so the loans in channel are required to be reported. paid for is typically not reported. apple just launched their furnishing should it is great they led the way. it is a really healthy thing for the industry. we certainly follow them. generally speaking, majority of

paid for loans are not reported. sonali: paid for loans you. said or not reported that is a fact. if you have the paying for loans are operating outside of the traditional way credit reporting system, how can you have comfort as an investor in the broader credit markets that there are not a significant amount of stresses in that system? max: let's do the math. the industry volume for the tire industry was $50 billion. the weighted average of a paying for loan is three weeks. 52 over three, just over 17. $50 billion divided by just over 17, that is either the $3 billion range. 1100 billion dollars or one point $1 trillion of overall outstanding credit card debt in the united states, .3%. are you worried about phantom debt in the scale of .3% of overall credit card world? credit cards revolve. they charge late fees. they have all sorts of hidden

charges. with paid for, you never pay interest. never in our case or any the industry case as well. there is no revolving. the bnpl paid for world, for the health of the consumer to build credit but it is not a systemic risk. sonali: do you think there should be broader were sporting -- broader reporting standards? max: there are already emerging new standards for paying for reporting. industry united behind experian and apple as they stepped forward and said we need to bring this to the level installment loans are. and there are several industry associations working on standardizing. all of us are going to report paying for loan for stop -- full stop. everyone was to make sure it is right because when you miss report someone's credit, that is a far worse offense than not reporting it. the industry trend towards not reporting every kind of loan at bnpl is absolutely real.

shelley: do think that is enough to put to rest the fears around this phantom debt worry a lot of investors have? max: it certainly should be given the tiny scale represents and the fact everyone is going to reported. my responsibility is to affirm shareholders. liquid sees remain public leave physical and benign -- publicly visible and benign. sonali: you have said they marginally decreased. if that is true, i'm curious what that means about your underwriting standards. we have seen a lot of credit card companies say those to liquid sees have been increasing. they are projecting increases. have you had to tighten standards to address this current economy? max: not very recently. we have generally held underwriting standards had about the same. the benefit of underwriting every transaction is you don't have two sue -- to super long-term decisions. we look at each borrower separately and ask the question, given what we understand about your financial situation right

now within and outside of a firm, is this a sane decision for you to borrow money given we will not compound your interest and charge you late fees whether you're on time or not? we better get it right. our underwriting standards are necessarily very tight because he want to make sure we get paid back. we want to make sure the customer is able to pay us back. sonali: there are a lot of concerns about the state of the consumer more broadly. you feel that among investors in merchants. shopify when they put it, you saw wall street latch onto their guidance and have some fears about the direction of travel when it comes to the consumer. you saw the firm stock feel that concern and sympathy. what would you say to the strength of the consumer right now and how it holds up in the higher interest rate environment throughout this year? throughout this full year, 2024. max: economists are the only people who get to keep their jobs whenever they are wrong and they are wrong all the time. judging by the weather in new

york. i grew up in chicago where weather changes all the time. i don't know what is going to happen to the consumer right now. they are shopping reasonably well. for a time, we saw a giant demand in travel because people were tired of being cooped up in a post-pandemic world and were trying to get out of town. that is normalizing a little bit. every flight i take and i travel way too much is always sold out so there are of people traveling. i think we will see a lot more as the summer gets through. as the holiday sales come in. inflation is real. that is probably a far more important thing from the consumer health consumer spending point of view. from affirm's stance, the fed rate is not an important contributor to the business. one of the things we said for a year and a half is so long as the fed is careful in moving the

rates, will be just fine. you saw was post quarterly numbers yesterday. profit numbers remain very strong. in the world of cost of capital changing significantly over the last two years. we are not super dependent on short-term rate changes which is a nice place to be. consumers are dependent on inflation and i worry what happens to the economy over a long term if the prices don't arm allies. -- don't normalize shelley: you have always said you should not be revolving the cup of coffee. you think it is such inflation is so hot that consumers are trying too hard to put money on credit and all its different forms? max: another important and perhaps little-known fact about paying for and monthly installments, all of us, every provider has what we call a floor of our transaction sizes. as far as i know, no one has

paid for a cup of coffee in paying for. sonali: groceries let's say. max: if you're spending $50 on groceries, you should reconsider your choice of grocery provider. if you are spending on a passover seder and a couple hundred dollars, that is not an unreasonable thing to finance. i am sympathetic to a use case i am not sympathetic to the daily i want to pay it forward for a $20 thing. it signals something else in a person's life. generally speaking, transaction floors are an important self enforcing guard against people over using these kind of products. i do think that revolving on a cup of coffee or groceries or anything that does not survive the useful life of an item that is shorter than the revolving period is a profoundly bad

personal economic idea. sonali: that is affirm ceo max loves can. answering are tough questions about phantom debt that may or may not be out there. still ahead, bob purity of real term talks his company's growth in the industrial real estate market. a highly watched market at this point in time. we are going to talk about that next. this is bloomberg. ♪ investment opportunities are everywhere you turn. do you charge forward? freeze in your tracks? or, let curiosity light the way. at t. rowe price, we ask smart questions about opportunities like advances in healthcare and how these innovations will create a healthier world tomorrow.

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shelley: -- ali: it's taken to the risk and opportunities we are seeing in commercial real at tate lycan districts -- logistics and factories. we are joined by abigail doolittle and the real term ceo. a transportation focused investment manager $11 billion in assets under management. it is interesting because you have one of the hottest areas in

real estate. people love it. on the other hand, you have interest rates and the real economy you have to think about and worry about. how do you think about where we stand right now and where the risks are in either rate staying too light or the economy starting to turn downward? bob: we thing about interest rates, it has resulted in a standoff between buyers and sellers. the sense is as rates come back in, we will see more transactions. it is undeniable when we think about industrial sales over the last year, it has gone from $150 billion in transaction volume down to 80 billion, 87 billion this year. it might be 15% off. the dust is not settled. we are not at a point where there is a market clearing capital stack people can put together on the debt and equity side to get back to some normalcy. there are green shoots. maybe that word is used too much

across the real estate space but there are green shoots to indicate people are getting back to business. maybe ago: the fact you're -- abigail: given the fact your real estate is going in one door and going out the other door. you have a birds eye view on the economy. are you able to see -- there is still this debate about with that there is a recession ahead. based on your business, are you able to have a firm view? bob: we don't see a recession at all. there has been a technical freight recession. member what we are going off from where it had been. we had a market that had e-commerce growth of 15% prior to covid. covid went to 40% annualized growth for two years and now we are down to eight or 9% per year. that is a strong tail given by the consumer. when we contrast that with where that has come from which coming out of the retail side of things which has found an equilibrium,

it has been able to move forward, but it has done it on the back of tomb lien square feet of industrial properties put into the market over the last four years. to give some context, that is enough space to cover the island of manhattan three times. massive supply put in place. construction starts and industrials are down by 45% from this quarter, first quarter to first quarter last year. abigail: maybe the supply helps to explain why we have some degree real estate conversations together with newsmakers such as yourself, why there is so much interest in your space. i have been hearing more about how on the one hand you have the big guys like the black stones and the kkr's and there is no middle ground on the others there is someone, a real specialty niche. what is it about your space folks are liking even given the supplies, the potential it will be filled up to capacity? bob: i think you are right on

the specialist side. most investors are looking for a different take from what they can get in the larger asset management firms. we focus on real assets for the transportation space. that would be real estate and infrastructure. we see the performance of that property type, has been very strong. as we think about the market moving forward, we see growth in that space that will exceed industrial being the area where people want to be today from an investment point of view. sonali: we thank you so much. bob fordi and abigail doolittle. coming up, we are going to take you live to the bloomberg technology summit with we work co-founder adam neumann. a lot going on in the real work -- the we work world. we are going to ask him all about it. that is up next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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sonali: we are going to get a check on the markets with abigail doolittle because we do have an interesting move in bond yields lower despite some sparse data given there is more data next week. abigail: we have a move lower for bond yields and this has been the case since the fed last week. investors are getting used to the idea the fed is not going to be hiking this year. waiting for more data ahead of the june meeting. expecting a cut in september. looking at the two year yield

moving lower at 481 so it is close to the 5%. there were some folks on the panel coming from the milken conference saying we could come below 5%. we could be on guard for the possibility of higher for longer but not so much because of data. there may not be adequate buyers. it is worth noting we have stocks a little bit higher but that has been the trend. after the three down weeks, we have had yields lower and stocks going for a third week higher. sonali: has the relationship been more sustained? abigail: it seems to be sticking but it has been over the last week yields have been higher so we are going to have to have more information. you know i love charts. there is more reason to think we see yields go higher. may be significantly higher. the two year yield could be setting up for a move above 6%. jamie dimon, all of our favorite

, he recently said we could see yields go above 8%. he has been prescient in the fact your ago he was talking about 6% and then 7% so he has been the outlier in terms of higher for longer taking the case but i think we have to wait for the data and see what happens. generally: all of that data not coming until next week. we have the bond options. another area, real estate. you have been covering that space closely. we had one conversation on a rosier part of the market. what is still looking under pressure given where rates stand? abigail: it is all about office. anything that is not class a office is under pressure. in terms of vacancy rates being higher. this wall of mortgages coming due by the end of 2025. everyone is talking about how we are going to have this come to jesus moment.

if that happens this year, a lot of people thinking it will start to open up. values could be between 10 to 25% lower and that could put pressure on the overall commercial real estate market. sonali: we should say according to bloomberg's reporting, one in every 37 homes are now considered seriously underwater. you have to wonder how much rez these are going to feel the pain. we are going to go to break before you bring you back to the bloomberg technology summit. we have the we work co-founder adam neumann coming up shortly. stick with us. this is bloomberg. ♪

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sonali: let's take you to the bloomberg technology summit in san francisco. adam neumann is speaking with brad stone. >> it is quite technical but let's say something else about what to i said -- about back to i said. 50% growth in one year. without spending any money on a business that has aging buildings. i think is the worst office markets maybe in the history but deftly the past 40 years. it is a global phenomenon. if they achieve these very rosy plans i think are unfeasible, they would need to in 2025 grow from that to not go cash flow negative. what i'm telling you is the plan they are planning to approve or if they approved would be a plan

that takes the cash flow negative from when it came out of bankruptcy and we are planning to show it to in the positions. you can take it as -- brad: this is not over. we do love a redemption story in silicon valley. steve jobs famously went back to apple. what would you do with we work? considering the obstacles it faces with the economy and work from home, what is your vision? adam: i think the only reason we were interested in we work is because of flow. brad: what you describe what flow is? -- why don't you describe what flow is? adam: are going to go by that clock or that clock? brad: you leave that to me. adam: i need to manage the questions -- answers. brad: roughly yes. adam: i will give you the short version. the very short version and i moved to this country in 2002, i lived in an apartment building with 135 apartments.

the first thing i noticed as the neighbors were not talking to each other. i had this great idea. why don't we create company called concept living? i was in diversity. i had four other students with me. we went to the entrepreneurship competition and we did not go to the next stage. number going to the dean. i understand you cannot reverse whatever happened but why? what a great idea to bring community into buildings. . would have increased -- when it made people pay more rent. -- would have made more people pay more rent. he said it not you can or cannot disrupt an industry. interesting lesson of that is if you are right now and entrepreneur, if you are a dreamer, if you are a student and you have something believe in, don't let anybody stop you. the worst case scenario is you will fail and you will learn great lessons that you will apply to the rest of your life. that is one. taking it 22 years forward, 70% of today's 40 year old and

younger in america are renters. they spent 34% of their total income on rent. not only that. we live in a time where we are so connected digitally and we heard in a panel about how more connected we are going to be. never this connected physically. there is loneliness. rental illnesses. oneness between a person and themselves. their neighbors and their world. we delivered that vision by the liver and integrated company. we built our own tech manager on buildings. we own our own buildings. traditionally, landlords would be landlords and use third-party providers to build technology for that. third-party providers because they are not the owners would do what they thought was best. third-party provider technology companies are based on accounting system. have to rebuild architecture to base it on what we think is more important. to deliver our mission is the

resident, the human being. by putting the resident first and building this flexible architecture, we are able to do almost anything we want in the building. community commerce. our residents, doing extremely well and deliver on this promise of the net operating income is up more than 30% since we took over which any real estate terms is a very large number. our residents have services. when izz -- one is a yoga teacher. one is an insurance salesperson. average age 32. they want to give these services. they come to us. we are putting it through two things but it is getting integrated into the app. now you are another resident should you would like to buy or consume the service. from the moment you go to flow and you can check out flow at flow. live. it says do you want community? do you like pets if you like wellness, do you like that attaining. you like lifting weights? whatever the thing you are going

to say, we are going to know about you. when the next event is going to happen, you're going to offer it to you. by doing these things, you are allowed to deliver on this mission. as an entrepreneur, i get the bug usually everyday. i try to stop it every month. i look at my cto right now. he has to build a system ready to receive all these ideas about building the architecture the way we did you would not be able to deliver on our promise. brad: when andrews and hurwitz invested 350 million in this new idea, you could hear the collective gasp from the tech press because they were betting on you after a quite public experience with we work. why do you think they made that investment? adam: first of all, that is a question for andreessen horowitz. i know ben has spoken about it and said different things. we also put in 350 million ourselves. brad: you had some of these apartment buildings already. adam: and we chose the best ones. the other ones we sold.

created perfect alignment between us and andrew sent. i happened to be coming back from a board meeting. our board meetings are amazing. mark is our board member. ben joins the meetings. we suggest we talk about whatever it is. without getting into details, my cto had quite an experience. everybody was so excited. we gave an idea of a new thing we want to do in 2025. mark had been based on 30 years of expanse at a lot of investing and did not think it was a good idea. the speed in which they communicated it, the strength which they pushed back in the table was something i was not used to pit it is the kind of partners you need. he's not just tech investors. these are entrepreneurs who have built multiple businesses. the combination of them with everything they do best and the team and myself, everything we do best comes together and i think it is the right business

at the right time. brad: i'm also hearing implicitly maybe you did not have the same kind of elation ship that we work -- kind of relationship that we work and friendly pushback is a good thing. adam: you're saying friendly pushback. it is friendly because we are partners and friends. brad: was month co she sent and his colleagues doing the same thing? adam: on more thing about mark and then. the pushback is real. it is not a soft pushback. i will give you one fact about my board from before. for nine years every single decision that was ever brought up in the board was unanimously a yes. not one time in the record was there a no until the time when i said i'm stepping down. that was a yes also. sonali: that was the flow co-founder adam neumann at the bloomberg technology summit. fasten the conversation about his new start up and we work.

time for the stock of the hour. shark ninja, the company behind shark vacuum cleaners and ninja blenders boosted its annual profit and sales forecast river -- driven by better-than-expected cells. for more, i am joined by the ceo mark baraka's. it is interesting, at a time when a lot of people are worried about consumers, you are putting up numbers investors are getting excited about. what kinds of customers are coming to the table? are these homebuyers looking to fill their kitchens with new appliances or are they repeat customers? mark: thanks so much for having me. as you said, shark ninja had a great first quarter. her business grew 28%. a crew 22% in north america. it grew 40% internationally. we go to market under two leading brands, shark and ninja paired the shark ninja consumer is a discerning consumer. we offer market-leading

performance for our products. we offer great quality and we do it at a great extraordinary value. a lot of the consumers coming back to us are consumers who are repeat buyers having brought shark or ninja products before or consumers who are getting into the shark or ninja brands as we enter into lots of new categories. sonali: as far as new products, if you are buying a ninja, what else are you planning on buying? mark: we are in 33 different product categories. we are in 26 markets around the world. if you ask about the ninja brand as an example, we are in market leader in blenders and food processors. we are the fastest-growing outdoor cooking appliance company with. our grills and ovens. . we have just expanded into outdoor coolers with our ninja frost volt. it is completely sold out and is a social media hit.

there are lots of products within the shark brand and ninja brand for consumers to own and two by sonali: on the ninja brand, a lot of viewers know you for making their smoothies before working out with a ninja or making smoothies based on this health pushed you have seen across america especially on the heels, a lot of these weight-loss loss drugs have inspired that push. are you seeing that and how much can that drive things for you moving forward? mark: i think ninja is about empowering the consumer to do great things in the kitchen, outside the home. it does not stop with our blender products. our air fryers. outdoor cooking appliances. the shark brand, we are the fastest growing hairstyle or brand in the world right now. we are the second-largest largest vacuum brand in the

world. there are so many products for us to get consumers excited about. i will mention within our ninja brand, there is a project called the ninja creamy. has one billion impressions on tiktok. consumers when you talk about health, rather than making a smoothie or a protein shake, they are turning it into ice cream and for 300 calories they are eating a pint of ice cream and enjoying it and social media is driven culture around the products we bring to market. sonali: you brought up social media couple of times. curious how important that is for you from a marketing perspective, how many dollars it may save you and if tiktok faces trouble in the u.s., what it could mean for you and the spread of your brand. mark: as a company, we spend over 6% of sales on r&d and we spent over 9% of sales on

advertising. our advertising is this always on 360 marketing approach to create consumer demand. we do that through tv. we do that through social media. we do that through experiential events. whether it is instagram or tiktok like you mentioned, consumers are finding lots of ways to be able to express their interactions with products. youtube is becoming a bigger vehicle for us. read it, pinterest as well. in the advent -- the events having happens with tiktok, there are lots of ways for the influencer and community to be able to demonstrate and talk about shark or ninja products. years ago, you would go online and write a five star review about the product whereas today consumers are making videos and communicating those two other consumers about how much they love the products. sonali: you're talking about new products as well. when you think about the lineup you have ahead, what product for

the sake of shark ninja are you pushing the most and at what price point? what is going to be the biggest growth area? mark: we are in 33 different product categories. we launched 25 new products a year. we just launched into the cooler space with the ninja frost volt. we launched an indoor outdoor cooling system called the shark flex breeze that is doing great. there will be 25 new products that will launch into the market and our growth has all been organic over the last 16 years. we were a small company in 2008 and today we are a market leader in our space. we grow the business through growing existing categories we are in. we expand into new and adjacent categories and we grow internationally. through those growth pillars, we have been able to grow at a compounded growth rate at 20% a year for the last 16 years.

sonali: ceo of shark ninja. thank you for your time. as your stock hits at a fresh all-time high. coming up, we are going talk about a global search in sales that covers companies from cvs to coca-cola. it is today's wall street beat. you're going to talk about that next. this is bloomberg. ♪ you know what's brilliant? boring. think about it. boring is the unsung catalyst for bold. what straps bold to a rocket and hurtles it into space? boring does.

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you have to make it. and if you want a successful business, all it takes is an idea, and now becomes the future where you grew a dream into a reality. the all new godaddy airo. put your business online in minutes with the power of ai. sonali: this is bloomberg markets. time now for wall street beat. from u.s. to europe to asia, companies are seizing on stronger investment demand and a lack of funding around funding costs headed into issuing the most that in years. michael tobin wrote a feature. one of the most read stories on the terminal and he joins us now. talk about what exactly is coming to market. there has to be some awareness

of risk when you are thinking about investing in credit. michael: everything is out there. high-grade investment companies are hurting the market. within 40 deals in the u.s.. it feels like post labor day. we have lbo lunches coming out. leveraged loans are on fire. we have gotten some repricing's for a pretty big name that hit the market this morning. within high-yield, we sell another one of those companies that was struggling a few years ago. the upsize twice. sonali: you are close to the ground. you talk to the investors. do they think this party can last for are they trying to get ahead of something? michael: part of the recent has been so busy as we are coming up on memorial day. some people we have talked to on the buy side are saying it makes sense this russian be happening now. people want to get their orders

in. there is not whole of clarity on what the fed is going to do. we have had a window where companies can find attractive levels to issue debt high-yield spreads are inside of 300 basis points and have sat there for a little bit. . it is a good time for borrowers to come to the market. sonali: you were talking about complacency. calm in the market but next week is cpi. it is kind of like you have to get in front of a few things. are investors not concern particularly when it comes to high yields and leveraged loans they're going to be more cracks in the market? michael: sometimes these cracks come up and sometimes there is a pause. usually when that happens, you see a pendulum that swings. we talk about this a lot when we talk to people in private credit. if there is a pause in the market, that is where you can see some of the private credit issuers come in and fill the void. usually when there is that pause, it will take a pause for a week or so and then come back. i don't think there were any

larger concerns about a freeze up in the market. sonali: i went to here bore -- i would hear more about the issuer that came to market. . what is the because difference between the stress being felt on the prior cycle and today where to your point on volatility, the move index is calmer this week than it was for the past few weeks. michael: we have a bit more sense of where interest rates are. sonali: as simple as that. michael: cloud software group was a leveraged buyout that happened a few years ago. elliott and vista partners had acquired the company the debt sat on -- now they are able to basically come to market and sell a deal in one day. sonali: pretty incredible stuff. once the system starts

unclogging, it on clogs at the same time. michael tobin we thank him so much. i'm sonali basak. that does it for bloomberg markets. yields lower. stocks up. stick with us through the close of the day. this is bloomberg. ♪

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>> from the world of politics to the world of business, this is balance of power.