u.s. trading day on this thursday, june 13. top stories, more evidence of cooling inflation with today's u.s. producer price report, which unexpectedly dropped in may for the most in seven months. good is for the fed, which held rates steady at yesterday's meeting. a view from the c-suite, inflationary pressures on the on the ground economy, we will talk with snap-on ceo nicholas pinchuk and the dhl supply chain ceo oscar debok. tesla's shareholder vote a win for elon musk, who tweeted that shareholders are backing re-approval of his $56 billion pay package. is this symbolic? we will discuss with matt levine. i'm katie greifeld in new

york. take a look at markets, interestingly, some of those gains you saw yesterday and at the trading bill starting to come back a little bit. s&p 500 still higher but only to the tune of about .1%. we had a big, big rally after cpi and then the fed meeting yesterday. but gains cooling a little bit. the nasdaq 100 is the outperformer right now, up about .8%, a healthy margin. a big winner and a big loser, and that is your small stocks, small caps currently down about .7%, certainly not feeling the love today. let's get back to that eco data because u.s. producer prices unexpectedly declined in may, the biggest dip since october. mike mckee, unexpected more good news for the fed. mike: it appears that way, maybe we are starting to see some

possible flaws in that, and that make the why the markets are pulling back a little bit. we did see jobless claims rise, and remember jay powellthere's e same thing happened last year, this exact same week, so does it hold that jobless claims stamped or will we repeat last year's slide back down after a couple of weeks? something to watch. cannot but yet on the fed cutting rates because of that. how about cutting rates because of inflation? maybe there, as well. good news on ppi, down .2% on the month, big surprise. the core flat. but look at why it fell. ecan on the bloomberg terminal, get yourself one if you do not have one. purple is energy, almost all of

the drop in last month's ppi comes from a fall in oil and energy prices. does that continue? that is something else to watch. where do we find ourselves at this point because of all this? as you mentioned, markets are pulling back a little bit. basically, they are disregarding with the fed said. fed's median yesterday was for one cut this year. markets are pricing in bite january of next year more than two cuts, two and a half cuts basically. two this year? we will see where we end up after we get more data. tomorrow we have inflation expectations and the initiatives survey, more to hang your hat on. katie popped definitely those inflation expectations closely watched the markets in the fed. before i let you go, the question that started to work its way around wall street -- when does bad news just become bad news? when do we start worrying about

growth here? right popped we would have to see growth indicators start to fall. bank of america out with the latest consumer spending report this morning said it seems to be holding up very well going into june. people are still spending money. so we will watch that. of course, things like the ism, etc. so far, the atlanta fed's gdp tracker has us over 3% for the quarter, so not yet was the answer. kailey: not yet, you heard it here first. let's bring this conversation to the markets with sophie lund-yates, hargreaves lansdown lead equity analyst. she joins us now. let's start with the macro and with the fed. if you look at the nasdaq 100, those big tech stocks that you closely track, feels like it has gone parabolic in the last couple days. you couch that against the macro environment, and maybe all that worrying we did about the federal reserve's rate trajectory in their path, maybe you did not matter after all when you look at the fundamentals.

sophie: great to be back. to be honest, i think you hit the nail on the head. so much of what we read about either have not come true, i think we cleared a lot of landmines the market was worried about, things like this huge recession that was apparently around the quarter that has not appeared, but at the same time, really what these tech stocks have in their margin potential and cash flow potential and growth potential, simply on a scale that was not priced in going into this year. particularly surrounding apple in very recent trading days as they try to clearly map their ai path. suddenly a convergence between the macro and what tech stocks were doing, on separate paths just not normally a story we tell when it comes to stocks. katie: mike mckee said it is not yet time to ask the question when we start to worry about

growth, the answer is not yet. but when you take the conversation to the tech sector and plan ahead, even if we did start to see the economy start to turn, maybe some of the delayed monetary effects a little bit ahead of the fed themselves, how does tech fare in that environment? looking at its performance over the past couple years, it feels all weathered at this point. sophie: unfortunately, i do agree. i think we are in a situation where people will say it is a rising tide that has lifted a lot of ships, but not all of those ships deserve to be there. i think that as the cycle starts to turn, because we know that it will, i think there will be some names that are caught out. what i would say, as well, particularly as you move to other areas, bigger companies, things like the s&p 500, we know we are in a situation with the top 50 stocks in the s&p, correlation is at historically

low levels. that tells me that volatility is doing something interesting. but gains are accounting losses, which is not something we normally see. katie: beyond big tech, i thought this note from your notes was interesting, that you continue to see margin pressure from retailers at the midpoint of the value chain, but you see continued strains for travel stocks and luxury. that is interesting because even though we are seeing the pace of inflation cool a bit, the fact is that prices are a lot higher, an absolute level than they were a couple years ago. i have heard that to be bearish basically on some of those sectors that you named. your obviously taking the other side of that. sophie: i am. i am choosing the path of positivity for the sectors. yes, inflation is high. yes, i do not think consumer spending power is out of the woods yet. but we only need to look at the absolute strength of some of the sectors. the numbers from delta, for example, one example.

yes, growth in lecture is slowing, but it is still more than other corners of the market. i think that means we have seen some of those valuations return to relatively more attractive areas. yes, inflation is running hotter than a year ago, but that has been achieved without nature damage to the economy at. so that means, to me, those corners of the market that are more resilient, i think they will continue to be so. katie: retailers maybe a little pressure here, but travel stocks, luxury, sounds like experiences and the higher end of the food chain still resilient in the type a backdrop we are talking about. we are in a situation where the category -- the categorization of spending has been completely upended. it means a little bit of trouble -- i do believe in food retail, as you are suggesting as i mentioned in my notes, i think

households are redistributing well they're spending, so they will be strict with the household budget so they can soak on that trip. so they might treat themselves to that more expensive bag or what it might be a christmas time. incredibly resilient. katie: always great to check in with you. thanks to sophie lund-yates of hargreaves lansdown. a quick look at what is moving underneath these markets with emily graffeo. let's talk about broadcom having a great day. emily: biggest intraday rise for that stock since march 2020. it was an all-around earnings beat for the chip supplier second-quarter revenue and eps beat, full-year forecast beach, german buy strong demand for, you guessed it, ai. katie: i heard about that, yeah. emily: even in june, it is still causing investors to cheer at

these earnings reports. this company supplies chips for big tech companies like apple. they are also getting a boost from their integration of a cloud company, vmware, which they acquired in november. all-around, when you look at what the street is saying, they say that integration of the company was very successful. piper sanderson less in berkeley's both raising price targets on bar, -- on broadcom. barclays says broadcom is one of the best ways to play ai. katie: broadcom also planning a 10 for one stock split so hot right now. tell me about next decade, not a name i am super familiar with. emily: me neither, but the story caught my eye because the stock is already at 64% year-to-date to date, and liquefied natural gas company, to billion-dollar market cap. on the smaller side, but they are planning to sign a supply deal with saudia aramco.

aramco agreed to buy natural gas from decade's plan project in texas, and this will be the first u.s. purchase deal for the saudi energy plant -- giant. they plan to buy 1.2 million tons of lng a year, the contract is looking to be up to 20 years, but they are still working on that.we do not talk about energy that much, but a caught my eye, up as much as a percent in the premarket. pairing those gains a little bit but still in the green. katie: we're so busy talking about ai, a different conversation. dave and buster's, ticker play, having a terrible day. emily: the prior guest was talking about how experiences are somewhat resilient, but it seems like there's some trouble at some food names, and this is one of those. those shares down as much as 12% . you look at the earnings report, it was a mists on multiple metrics. first quarter revenue 588 million dollars versus estimates

over $600 million. all around, true securities saying the results were muted buy stiff macro headwinds. less consumers going to these arcade venues and buying the food there. it is a mixed bag with these experience names. some have done well, but then you have companies like dave and busters that cannot get it together. katie: have and have-nots, down the most since september 2022. emily graffeo, thank you. coming up, tesla surging after elon musk says shareholders are backing his $56 billion pay package for the second time. more on their annual meeting, next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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katie: tesla holds its annual meeting this afternoon. on the agenda, elon musk's paypal package. he said on twitter that shareholders approved's pay package and that the move to relocate tesla's legal home from delaware to texas has been approved buy wide margins. here to discuss is bloomberg opinions matt levine and my cohost on the weekly money stuff podcast. we are basically doing the podcast but on tv. we talk about elon musk all the time he tweeted the results, partial, but looking like the results, earlier. could anything changed between now and this afternoon? what is going to happen? matt: you can change your vote until the time of the meeting,

so it is completely locked-in. the tweet was pretty informal. not clear his information is correct. but assuming that it is, he seems to have enough votes for both proposals. katie: does it matter? even if the shareholders we approve it, is it just symbolic? matt: i do not think it is just symbolic. oh -- a lot will say that. but a judge found that the former shareholder vote was not well informed. this shareholder vote is probably a bit better informed. so you get another bite at it. they're still appealing the decision on the pay package. it may not have that much legal weight. if the shareholders want to do this, why should the delaware

courts get in the way? relocation to texas is also interesting. i think this vote is legally binding. not sure of that. i think there has been talk of the possibility of lawsuits and deliver to keep tesla in delaware, despite the shareholder vote. i think it is an uphill fight. probably if they vote to move to texas, they're moving to texas. katie: that would be interesting. a nice reminder that we're talking about a two-pronged shareholder vote. want to talk about the fact that you have written about the elon musk attention auction, basically, and when it comes to his different companies, they are all competing for his attention. even if shareholders re-approve this pay package, it feels like this does not necessarily fix the problem of the attention auction, that his attention is clearly divided and he is spending more time on other things than tesla right now. matt: right.

before the judge struck down his pay package earlier this year, he was asking for another giant pay package to keep his attention on tesla so they could do ai or that got pushed aside buy this package being struck down. he could come back next month and say any more money, more shares. he needs this stake in tesla because it is a big chunk of his liquid wealth i'm sort of supports a lot of his other activities -- and sort of supports a lot of his other activities. deceive need to focus is artificial intelligence -- does he need to focus is artificial intelligence at tesla? i am not sure. katie: does tesla need elon musk at this point? it is a mature car company, dealing with mature car company problems.

is elon musk the proper ceo for this company now? matt: i don't know. i think there is a belief among some shareholders that this company would be better off getting down to business and not doing other elon musk projects. i think if you are voting to approve this pay package, you think tesla has an elon musk premium, that there is something else going on, and that is linked to elon musk in his attention and his ability to come up with new ideas. i'm not sure that is completely right. i think some shareholders have changed their minds on that. katie: what is the basis for rear proofing the pay package? there is the idea that fair is fair and it was approved 2018. the past couple months, he has

unmet metrics. seems hard for me to block out this history that we know happened. matt: he has not unmet all of the metrics. tesla was a $50 billion-something company, and it was highly ambitious. he exceeded the metrics. some of that came back, but it is still not at $60 billion. it is pretty close to its top target. part of it is fair is fair, he was given this award in 2018 for the work he was going to do between 2018 and 2022. the fact it was taken away, some feel he should keep the compensation for that past work. the other thing is it is a question of keeping him happy and at tesco. if you think there is an elon musk premium, disapproving the pay package, it might be bad for

the stalker company. katie: i will see you at 1:00 p.m. today because we record our weekly podcast, new episodes out every friday afternoon. we discuss wall street, finance, billionaire pay packages, and other stuff. now to the supreme court, which is out with opinions today. they prefer -- preserve full access to a widely used abortion pill, k secured major stakes reproductive rights and election-year politics. joining us with more is joe mathieu's. set the scene, what do we know so far? joe: a unanimous ruling, which is something, overturning a federal appeals court ruling that would have barred mail-order access to the so-called abortion pill, something that has become a very big issue on the campaign trail and american politics

across the country in the wake of the supreme court's ruling that struck down roe v. wade. it has to do with the standing in this case. they essentially said the antiabortion doctors and organizations who brought this case did not have standing because there was no harm. they were not directly affected buy the law. he wrote the federal courts of the wrong forum for addressing the plaintiff's concerns about the fda's actions. they could go to congress or to the fda but not the supreme court. katie: all right, thank you for that update. we will have full coverage throughout the day. still ahead, a look at the companies making the most social bus today in our social climbers segment, up asked -- up next. this is bloomberg. ♪

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katie: time for social climbers, a look at the stocks making waves on social media. apple is not paying openai to use its chatbot. apple believes promoting chatgpt users is of equal or greater value than monetary payments, according to people familiar. sam altman said openai is on pace for $3.4 billion of annual revenue. next, gamestop calls with huge volumes yesterday as the shares dove in the final stretch of trading. no way to tell if he was directly involved, his exit could weigh on the company,

closing 17% lower. finally, donald trump will meet with executives today as he is embraced buy the business elite. jamie dimon, jane fraser, brian moynihan, and tim cook are said to be among those expected to attend. you can follow the latest company buzz on your bloomberg terminal. look at these markets, s&p 500 flipped into negative territory, .1% or so lower right now. nasdaq 100 holding onto those gains but not quite as robust as they were about half an hour ago, still higher buy about .3 percent. small-cap losses intensifying. coming up, the c-suite view on the latest inflation rate with nick pinchuk of snap-on and oscar debok of dhl supply chain, next. this is bloomberg. ♪ ed the wedding would be too much? nahhhh... (inner monologue) another destination wedding??

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caroline: we know that u.s. producer. katie: we know that u.s. producer prices declined for the first time since october. definitely a surprise dropping at 8:30 this morning. let's talk about that and transition to the c suite. we'll do that with matt miller. how are you? matt: i'm doingly well, how are you? katie: i'm excite to talk about this. we were expecting a slight increase. a decline actually. if you break apart the components, it's pretty interesting, pretty interesting read on the economy. matt: it's fascinating that good news continues to be good news, right? we get a decline in p.p.e. we also -- p.p.i., we also got a jump in continuing claims. last month the household survey was a little bit disappointing. you have a deceleration in inflation, but we also may see, because of this deceleration in economic growth. katie: i mean, i asked mike

mckee at the top of the hour, can i worry about growth? is now the time? he told me not yet. let's talk to executives who run companies who deal with the public. we're going to get the boots on the -- boots on the ground at how it's playing out with the c.e.o. of snapon. he joins us now. snapon is a manufacturer of high-end tools and equipment. great to have you back with us. let's start with the ppi. if you look at a component, nearly 60% of the decline was due to gasoline costs. you also saw prices fall through diesel fuel, commercial electric power, and jet fuel. are your customers seeing those declines? >> i don't think they would recognize it as a pap panel decline. this is more business as usual. when you're in business, like if you run snap-on or you're if you're running a garage, the hits keep on coming and prices change all the time. for us, for example, steel is up. hot rolled steel is down.

freight costs, you're going to have dhl on, freight costs are going through the roof. ocean freight seems to be pretty high. you have to manage all of those. but this is sort of everyday business for us. we don't see any big change. katie: not any you're feeling and seeing yet. with that in mind, i'm curious, you write in your notes that you're well positioned should we see commercial inflation reignite. i'm curious how likely is the scenario you see that, and what does well positioned mean here? how do you prepare for that? >> we tend to make in the markets where we sell, so we don't have long supply chains. snap-on makes most of its products itself, so that's the kind of situation. plus when you talk about how we go to market, one of our big components of going to market is right to the end user through our vans or direct sales force, so we control the interface with the user, and we control the upstream fairly well.

we're kind of balanced for that. the big portion of inflation here is actually about the smaller businesses that are worried more than anybody else. and the individuals that are working in the factories and garages, i was just with some of them, and they are cash-rich. their businesses are going well, but they are confidence poor and worried about the future. >> i have to say first of all, i tinker on my motorcycles, and when i can afford to, i always pick up the snap-on tool. it's like a luxury product for me. if i see the van, i chase it like a kid with an ice cream truck. >> i can stop it for you, if you'd like it to stop, let me know where you're going to be, i'll have it stop. matt: thanks so much. when i go to my ducati dealer or talk to the big car shops around me, they're always having a tough time getting labor. do you see that slowing down? i mean, do you see those positions filling up? how does the labor market look to you? >> the labor market, snap-on is a little different.

we don't have trouble filling jobs because we never laid anybody off in the pandemic. we actually held everybody through the pandemic, even though our volume was down. so people tend to gravitate toward us. we say that this advantage of saying your people are your most important, one of your most important assets, on occasion you have to act like it. so we try to do that. i do think if you're talking about garages, or talking about factories, the national association of manufacturers say there are today 516,000 jobs open. before the pandemic, there were 400,000. so that's staying the way it is. garages are the same thing. there are two reasons for this. one is that finding the skills, upscaling the -- up-skilling the american workforce, people are studying other things which they can't translate into jobs, whether it's welding or fixing a car, which is pretty fix. secondly, there's a p.r. problem behind these jobs. people tend to think of them as

dark, dumb and dirty. they are no longer like that. they tend to think people who enter those careers are settling for the consolation prize of our society. and this is simply not true. the thing is, when you work in a began or work in a factory -- work in a garage or factory, the average factory worker makes $978,000 a year with benefits. so you're able to keep your family warm and safe and dry, but you're also able to realize that what you do makes a difference. if you think about it, during the pandemic, when fear was palpable, factories and garages were still working. because what they did was essential. so the essential nature -- they don't get paid the most. pitches gets paid a lot -- patrick ma miami gets paid a lot. it's because he does someone else no one else can do. but the people across business that do these technical jobs are essential.

part of the struggle is to get people trained. well, first to get people to believe that these are worthy of an american calling, and second, to get them trained. that's the real issue. matt: nick, people will pay also a premium for your products, because they are made in america by skilled laborers who really care about their jobs and the product. on the other hand, if i look through a home depot, or if i scroll through amazon, seemingly everything is made in china. so while you've always produced here, it doesn't seem like anyone else has brought that much manufacturing back. do you see that from your peers? >> i'll tell you this, the national association of manufacturers, i was just in washington with them, and here's the issue. the supply chain problems were the children of the pandemic. we had a lot of problems, and it became clear we wanted to bring it back. manufacturers were all ready to bring things back. but what happened was, even though the government, whatever administration, i'm not talking

about a particular administration, but generally if you look at the current one, i will talk about this one, ok, we have the chips act, we have the infrastructure, great things. but they don't recognize the broad value of manufacturing. so manufacturers, particularly small ones, are sitting there saying, well, should i expand? should i hire more people? we got an election coming up, and you're wondering what the policy is going to be. it's not enough -- people are talking about, ok, for those guys, just those small manufacturers, let's raise the individual rates. and the 199 exclusion, a deduction for small manufacturers is going to go away. so their prices, their costs will go up. they're already paying $50,000 for employee and recreation cost. so they're saying, gee, does america really want manufacturing? it's not just saying i like manufacturing, you know, or i endorse it. when push comes to shove, they

actually have to support it without sacrificing the interest of manufacturing. this great endeavor on the altar of other things. small manufacturers, when luke at their outlook, are very low, and part of it is because of this. katie: nick, i really only have a minute left with you, and i really want to get this question in. i want to talk about auto technicians here, because taking a look at your last earnings release, there was that concern there that maybe the technician audience that you have is starting to pull back here. i'm curious, if that's the case, what's the catalyst to bring that demand back? >> well, i think some of these things, first of all, as i said, the garage, i was just in garages last friday, so the garages feel they have cash. but what they're doing is they're looking at inflation, and they're seeing that milk is still 31% above pre-pandemic levels. they're hearing about the wars. they're not paying attention to the fed. they don't pay attention to the

man behind the curtain. but they're thinking about wars. they're hearing about the border. it's a migration. they're worried about china. and they're worried about the outcome of the election, what's going to happen. and so those things, you have to get used to inflation or those things will have to be resolved. what's happening to the technicians is they're still buying, but they're buying shorter payback items. like the hand tool behind me. they can say, look, i don't know what's going to happen in 15 weeks or three months, but i'm sure i can pay for that time. i'm going to buy as much of those as i want. but they're not buying the big boxes hunted me, because it will take them longer to pay that off. we've seen this before in the great financial crisis. any time things get uncertain, that's what happens with the people who work. katie: nick, unfortunately, have to leave it there. hope to have you back on soon. feels like every time we're just getting started, nick pinchuk of snap-on, thank you so much. joining us now, we have oscar

debok, c.e.o. of dhl supply chain, a leader in global logistics. i want to bring you something nick just told us, freight costs are going through the roof. you also see container shipping rates still climbing here. what's your outlook? how long will this last? >> well, i think that's always difficult, but i think what is interesting to see is the freight rates are obviously high, although it's good to see now with the ppi you just presented, at the surface, it's actually the fed, so that's no longer called for for price increases. that's good to see that starts to gradually stabilize. the other element which i think is good to see, inbound volumes are increasing, so that's also good to see, because that means it's the inbound volume into the

economy. you start to see customers, our customers, start to gradually build up their stocks carefully and also building on the point that was made with the earlier speaker. this is in order to be prepared for a decent in q4. matt: i wonder about the freight costs. if i look at the baltic dry average, we've come, what looks like back to normal, slightly elevated, but nothing compared to the pandemic, oscar. how much are we looking at just a normal freight cost right now, or how elevated is it? >> it's difficult to say what is normal, what is not normal. what i think is at least those ridiculous jumps that were there in the past, ups and downs, i think we sort of start to see that gradually it starts to stabilize. what is most important with those rates is that you start to get a bit more predictable, so

that companies can build their cases on it, can focus on the basis, and can price on it. i think we're getting gradually more into that situation. katie: i'm curious to hear your thoughts on what you're seeing when it comes to on-shoring and near shoring. like matt mentioned, a lot of companies talk a big game coming out of the pandemic, they were going to bring supply chains closer to home. you haven't seen as much of it as you might have thought. what are you seeing from your clients when it comes to that impulse? >> what we clearly see is, as you know, i call it only shoring. customers no longer bet one single market for their strategic components. they make sure they have at least two markets to come in from, so you're never exposed to whatever is going to happen in the near future. that's actually a trend you clearly see.

that doesn't mean they move away from where they were before, but it actually means that their future investments, their next capacity increase of production, they'll make sure that they will do that in a separate market than when they were before. and obviously that will be near to the markets. so we've seen major growth in mexico. we've seen major growth in malaysia and the rest of southeast asia. we see major growth in countries like india as well. but also two countries close to europe like, for instance, turkey and morocco. so you start to see the trend is happening. obviously it doesn't simply happen in a few months' time. that is gradually evolving, but whenever we've invested in mexico and malaysia, it fills up right away. katie: it's a good perspective there, too, that we're talking about a longer time frame. it's not going to happen overnight. you mentioned some of the countries benefiting from that push, mexico among them. i'm curious whether your clients

are running into any issues that maybe they didn't foresee when it comes to near shoring, on-shoring, omni shoring, as you say. >> i mean, the issues that you run into, it's always a capacity game, right? the capacity, it starts obviously with capacity of real estate, but it also is the capacity of attracting people, attracting talented people that actually can do the job. it is also the limitation of some of the infrastructures, because some of the markers that i mentioned, there's also the limitation in those markets to be able to carry those increased volumes going forward. so those are challenges. we obviously are trying to help our customers as much as possible with, on the one hand, investments in buildings, but on the other hand, also making sure that we have people available, well trained people available to do those jobs. and on the other hand, it what's really important is the investments in digitalization, being collaborative, having more visibility of data, having more regenerative a.i. to make sure.

on that basis, we had a forecast for your capacity need, therefore your people, therefore your building, therefore your trucks. the better you manage capacity, the better you can also handle the scarcity of resources. katie: oscar, always great to speak with you. really appreciate your time. our thanks to oscar debok of dhl. matt, thank you, too, for joining me. we should do this more often. matt: it's been a pleasure. maybe we should start our own show. katie: yeah, maybe in july, we'll see. what happens when failure isn't an option. that's what we explore in the new book "what went wrong with capitalism." that's next. this is bloomberg. ♪ ♪♪ i earned my degree online at southern new hampshire university. after i graduated, i started a new job. i was finally able to realize my purpose and passion in life.

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>> this is bloomberg markets. you're looking at a live shot of the principal room. coming up, an interview with former u.s. commerce secretary wilbur ross at 3:30 p.m. eastern. this is bloomberg.

katie: time for our daily wall street week conversation. since the great depression, the u.s. government has stepped in to prevent economic and financial fallout from private sector failures. ruchir sharp a, author of "what went wrong with capitalism" sat down with david westin to talk about whether the government is doing too much rescuing. >> on one hand, you have all this great data that the american economy is relatively brilliant, but if you look at the number of people who are happy in america with the state of the economic union, it is at close to record lows, according to many polls. there are about seine in 10 americans today -- seven in 10 americans today who want major change to the economic system or in the language of the polls, have it completely toned down. that's pretty dramatic. only 35% or so americans today who feel that they're going to be better off than their parents.

50, 60 years ago, about 70%, 80% felt they would be better off than their parents. there's a real feeling something has gone wrong, and i think that it's particularly the fact to do with capitalism. most young democrats in particular in america today would rather have socialism than capitalism. that's such a big statement for this beacon of american capitalism and all that we've spoken about of global capitalism. they are saying they would rather have socialism, a large cohort of the millennials and young people, rather than capitalism. so something has gone wrong. what i've done in this book is look at deep down what's gone wrong. as i say, the first step is to first diagnose the problem, but i feel that in america today, we don't even diagnose what the underlying problem is. david: why does it make sense, having studied this now, if you didn't know anything about our society, didn't read the polls,

and you looked at our growth rate, unemployment, which is close to lows of all time, most indications would say this should be a pretty happy economy. so why is it not? >> exactly. because i first said, there's a sliver at the top which is doing very well. but we had this track of economy out here that even now if you look at it, the bottom 50% to 60%, they don't have any excess savings. they're not able to spend that much. and as i said, there's a feeling that they're being squashed by what's happening at the top. economic mobility, social mobility, all of it declined significantly. this is a country where people would move around the lot and people would be in search of an opportunity. there's a great feeling in america today that they don't have a quality of opportunity. yes, at the top, things look very good. the stock market is doing great. the likes of nvidia are in the

stock market, but i think that deep town, there's some really solutions, and that's what i try to examine in the book. what's really happening? if you look at the trend over the last 30 to 40 years, our trend growth rate is slowing down. productivity growth rate is slowing down. and the same time equality is rising -- inequality is rising. a lot of americans today, their trust in the government is at record lows. so they know growth has also been funded by an increasing amount of debt. and the faith that the american government would be able to do something about that, to have the future determined by the american government, that leaves people in a very perilous state, can we really trust government to make good on their obligations and their promises when they've got so much debt? even though the economic growth is ok, economic and social

mobility is at record lows. david: is it the government's fault? 2008 and 2009, the great financial crisis. there was concern about a depression, and there was a lot of government intervention, both in the monetary side and fiscal side. a lot of people thought that was necessary to save us and the world from depression. then you had a pandemic. we brought the economy to a stop. and again, it was thought that we need ad lot of stimulus. was it the government's fault? did you not they need to come in and have this level of stimulus and support? >> i say in the book, we have a crisis, i can understand the government needs to intervene i'm not the kind of person who's liquidation, just let things go and melt away on its own. what i'm shown in the book is just look at the progression of capitalism over the last hundred years. we have gone from this liquidation argument, which caused the great depression in the 1930's, to now, where you liquefy, liquefy, liquefy. the moment you have even the

slightest crisis like you had last year, the impulse is we got to intervene. the problem is we only have one case point, which is what we use all the time to justify intervention, which is if you don't intervene, we'll have another great depression. another great depression. ♪

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katie: let's look at these markets right now. we're seeing a complete reversal of yesterday's action. you can see the s&p 500 lower on the day. big tech is your outperformer, up .4%. small caps, yesterday's winner, now today's biggest loser. the russell 2,000 down about 1.1%. we'll continue to follow that. coming up, "bloomberg technology. i'm katie greifeld. this is bloomberg. ♪

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>> from the heart of where innovation, money, and power collide in silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology," with caroline hyde and ed ludlow. caroline: i'm caroline hyde in new york. tim: this is "bloomberg technology." caroline: we push ahead to the vote results on elon musk's pay package that has tesla, it kicks off. tim: broad cam surgeries. caroline: and we'll dig into the terms of apple and open a.i.'s partnership, their landmark agreement. but first, let's check in on the markets. you've got more fuel. we've got still record high after record high across bench marks. if you look at the s&p 500, fourth straight rec