you've got more options than you know. book now. announcer: from the heart of power, money and innovation collide, this is "bloomberg technology." ed: live from san francisco, this is bloomberg technology. coming up, full markets coverage ahead as stocks push higher amid fading recession fears. plus, warner bros. plunges after a $9.is billion writedown. and ar spending nearly 06 days in space, nasa is working on a contingency plan to bring the starliner crew home. let's get right to financial markets.

it's interesting what's happening in the long run. that's actually warner bros. discovery, so let's go there then. that's a nice story for a day. down 9.4%. the story's really clear. 9.1 billion writedown on the legacy tv networks. and the issue with that or the story with that is tradition linear tv is not valued as it was when warner bros. merged with discovery because everyone's gone to streaming. let's bring in bloomberg's hanna miller who has been covering this story. it's a big number. it's overshadowed earnings and things aren't going particularly well. give me the specifics of the writedown and the reasons behind it. >> yeah. so basically what the c.e.o. discussed on the earnings call was that things have drastically changed in the media landscape. valuations are different, market conditions are different. and this is a more realistic value for their traditional tv

networks. and this is a signal to other major media companies to maybe take a look at their own traditional tv holdings and see if they too are overvalued. ed: i want to refocus on the technology story within it. which i think is, everyone went to streaming. and so they were left with properties that just weren't worth what they were at the time. the other issue for warner bros./discovery of course is we're now down 11% in the session, is ha happened with sports writes and nba. that was a point of discussion. just update us on what's going on. >> yeah, so what happened with warner bros. was they missed out on the $76 billion deal to get media rights for nba games starting for the 2025 to 2026 season. they are now suing the nba, alleging breach of contract. that lawsuit was mentioned briefly during the call. saying they are confident in their position and it's in the hands of lawyers right now.

ed: bloomberg's hannah miller, interesting story, big market move. thank you for keeping us up to date on it. now let's get back to financial markets and bring in causeway c.e.o., fundamental portfolio manager. about $49 billion of assets under management. and we're trying to work out in aggregate whereas going on. the nasdaq 100 has been an interesting index to track this week. the sort of angst disiet of monday -- anxiety of monday faded, on a weekly basis we're still softer. you've got concerns about growth. then we've got some economic data this morning that makes us feel that maybe recession risks are fading and we have a clearer picture on the fed. when you woke up this morning, what was your picture of financial markets? >> it was about the same as it was yesterday. which is reasonably optimistic. and that's a function of, again, so much liquidity added to the u.s. and global economies during and after the pandemic. and much of this is still

working through the system. but we have still very strong consumer in the u.s. labor's holding up. wages are holding up. there isn't a reason to panic even though markets do that from time to time. so we're looking forward to some good earnings from our companies. and for those, for example, in technology where they depend on industrial production, to be well placed. ed: thank you for bringing it back to technology. this is "bloomberg technology," after all. i mean, it's interesting you go to earnings. the story was really clear. the commitment to capital expenditures for a.i. infrastructure, maybe in microsoft's case you learn the lesson that you don't miss three estimates in this environment. how selective are you being within that group or other names we're so focused on around the a.i. story? >> the a.i. story is like, and this has been well encapsulated

on our website, our portfolio manager for telecommunications median technology, brian cho, there are three seekles and this -- cycles and this first one, building, is all about the basic building blocks, meaning semiconductors and you certainly saw that in the nvidia boom but the memory semiconductor stocks have had a big run too as they should. they had a pullback. they're very interesting. to your point about hyperscalers, they're absolutely critical in the next phase which is delivery. so we need them to build up the cloud infrastructure and they're also -- this is true of the ones that we as investors prefer, like alphabet and meta, they're benefiting from their use of a.i. as they get more customer engagement and hyperscaler, like alphabet, not only do they have tremendous -- they can look forward to in phase iii the deployment, getting enterprises

on cloud. they -- enterprise must have massive cloud access because they have so much compute needs with their data. ed: monday was a global market event in the sense that it started in the asian session, went to europe and then to the united states. but it also shone a light on taiwan and korea. those markets. and when i was looking at your holding, samsung really jumps out. you have a particularly strong view on samsung. explain the thesis there and where it sits in your holdings. >> correct. samsung is one of our, both our international and global fund, up with of our largest holdings -- one of our largest holdings and the reason is they trade at very reasonable multiples. it's trading somewhere around book value. 1.5 times book sometimes. but they're a major player in memory semiconductors and the need for memory as a.i. compute expands goes up multifold.

so memory demand rising which is great for samsung in d-ram. they compete with mike ron and samsung's on the cusp of a major break through with memory so they will be able to provide the more advanced memory chips and all of this emphasis will put pressure on regular d-ram so there's some shortages we. like to see this. so the supply-demand balance is very much in favor of less supply and more demand, good for pricing. samsung is well placed there. plus in this phase iii of delivery, they have -- or in phase ii in deployment, there they are with mobile phones that will be a.i.-enabled. so those galaxy phones should fly off the shelf. they have other consumer electronics. they're in foundry display. samsung has it all. ed: it's really interesting to hear you outline that. we've done quite a lot on the show about high bandwidth memory and if there's going to be this

ramp in expansion of a.i. accelerated driven growth, you have to have the corresponding high bandwidth memory but we've not discussed this much with the investor base. sticking with chips, you also are interested in some of the more cyclical areas, oosk, industrial -- automotive, industrial, i look at some of the names outside of the united states, why is it that you like that area? >> automotive, maybe there's been a slowing of auto sales, but it doesn't matter so much as the content. chip content. and these automotive-related semiconductors and samsung, samsung is german, are experts in that area. so we are expecting them to see, again, content growth overwhelm or be more important than overall auto sales, barring a recession. and we're not expecting one any time soon.

but they're also very strong in industrial chips and to see that in industrial automation, and then think about data centers and the need for power regulation. they're both really well placed there. and those stocks have fallen some 30%-plus over the last one month in the case of renaissance. so the value is there as well. so you get the undervaluation and the growth upside. it's a great combination. ed: really good to have you here on "bloomberg technology." thank you for joining us and that focus on chips in particular. ok, coming up on the show, we're going to be joined by the next door c.e.o. on the company's earnings but also this overhaul of next door, the social network, next. that's next. next. shares of bumble. you have seen this? date something over -- dating is over. the stock is down the most on record, a really severe cut to its outlook.

there are some specific factors relating to bumble and its properties within that. but it's a pretty grim look for the dating environment or app-based dating. you look at the stock year to date down more than 60%. it's a name that we'll continue to track. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪

♪ ed: next door's second quarter revenue beat analysts' estimates and the company projected stronger than expected sales growth. pointing to improvements in the company's ad technology as a key driver of sales. and its c.e.o. announced plans

for a, quote, complete transformation of next door's core social network. delighted to say that the c.e.o. is here with us onset in san francisco. this is interesting. let's go through the financial stuff. and then we'll get into the platform itself. it's kind of high single digits growth on the user base side and then you talked a lot about where the ad growth is. but just the factors behind both pieces of growth. why is that happening? >> thank you for having me, by the way. it's great to be here with you. let me just go through the numbers very quickly because we had a very solid and productive quarter. on the revenue side, with he grew 11% year over year. so the first time in a few quarters that we're returning to double-digit growth and we feel really good about. on the user side, over 45 million weekly active users. that's 8% growth. on the bottom line, a loss of $6 million which represents 23 points of adjusted margin improvements. so on all three of those vectors, we feel very good about

our performance in q-2 and we also announced that we raised guidance for the rest of the year. so solid execution and we're looking towards the future now. ed: let's define complete transformation. there's been change at next door, a change with you. >> a complete transformation of leadership. ed: complete transformation of leadership and a return, but what is it that you think that the actual platform will get to advertising, the actual platform needs to be different or do differently? >> next door has an amazing opportunity. we want to be the essential neighborhood network because we think local is so core to everyone's life. it's so important that we have rich, local lives. and that is the opportunity for nextdoor as a consumer internet company. our toential is not reflect -- our potential is not reflected today in the quality of our product. when we talk about complete transformation, we're talking about making the product so good that every time our users and advertisers visit, they're delighted. we have an extremely high bar, very high expectations, and so

it seems a little over the top to say complete transformation, but we're setting our sights extremely high because we think we can reach that potential. ed: there will be loads of people watching the program, "bloomberg technology" audience, who might be on next door. my wife and bought our first home this last year. we were new to a specific neighborhood and we wanted to learn about what was going on. that makes sense to go to nextdoor. but i still look at scale. compared to other social media platforms, quite small. how do you take it to another order of magnitude greater, bring in people for the first time? >> it's a great question. nextdoor's been around for 14 years. as mentioned, almost 95 million verified neighbors in 11 countries around the world. we have some good scale. primarily next door has been known for utility. so we call ourselves a social media product, but it's really about solving your everyday problems around local. you have a home, it's one of

your most important financial assets. and you want to protect that. you want to make sure that you feel safe. you want to make sure that you're happy at home. and so nextdoor primarily has been used around things like, i need a baby-sitter. i need a plummer. i want to make sure that my home is kept up to date. i want to feel safe in a crisis, whether it's some natural disaster or whether there's a spait of crime. i've lot a pet. these are really important use cases that people rely on us for every single day. we talk about weekly active users. the other social media services that you're talking about, they typically talk about daily active users. so the question for us is, what can we do to ensure that we are delivering value to our users on a daily basis? not just lost pets and service providers and times of crisis, which are absolutely indispensable and nextdoor can be a lifeline, but on a daily basis, how can we make your local life better? that's where our target is. ed: the other part of the story being investment in ad

technology improving the value against that. thank you so much. let's stick with earnings. retail trailing. the company reporting 5dz billion in net new deposits as it expands its product pipeline. robinhood co-founder and c.e.o. joined bloomberg open interests earlier this morning. listen to this. >> we shared in the earnings call that july volumes were about 20% higher than what we reported across june. august has continued very much the same, $1 billion in net deposits in the first week. about half a billion of that came this monday. and the overnight session for 24-hour market on sunday night was about 3 opinion x a typical day. so 24-hour markets have just been ripping and customers tend to be buying the dip.

they're more -- there are more buyers than sellers, which we think is a really good sign for the health of the retail market. >> we saw on monday morning, as the markets kind of tanked, and there was a lot of fear out there, some of the more traditional -- your more traditional competitors have problems with log-s in and obviously that makes customers very angry, especially if they want to get in there and buy the dip when it's at 5%. and could lose opportunity any minute that goes by. how did your technology hold up during those shutdowns on other platforms? >> our technology is strong. we made a lot of investments, we were fortunate not to have any issues of a significant nature when all of the competitors were down. and a lot of customers were actually looking to robinhood and we've had challenges in the past, no doubt about that. but that's hardened the company, hardened the infrastructure and now when we see high volumes,

we're ready for it. so we were happy to see customers moving to robinhood and kind of pointing to us as one of the most reliable platforms during this recent bout of volatility. ed: that was robinhood c.e.o. coming up on the show, the c.e.o. of jobi joins us to discuss e.v. toll expansion in that p can's earnings. that conversation coming up next. next. this is "bloomberg technology." it will take billions of solar panels to power the world today. aes is making scale like that closer to a reality. introducing maximo, our new ai-enabled solar robot,

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at morgan stanley, old school hard work meets bold new thinking. to help you see untapped possibilities and relentlessly work with you to make them real. ed: time for talking tech. first up, defense tech startoff has raised $1.5 billion in a new funding round valuing the company at $14 billion.

it plans to spend hundreds of millions of dollars on a new facility to ramp up manufacturing of rockets, underwater vehicles and other autonomous weapons. plus microsoft and palantir are set to combine their cloud tools to sell software to u.s. defense and intelligence agencies. as part of the agreement, palantir will integrate its products with microsoft's azur, he was cloud services -- azur, he was cloud services. meta sold $10.5 billion of investment-grade bonds, boosting the kept's cash pile as it -- the company's catch pile as it spends heavily on -- cash pile as it spends heavily on a.i. let's stick with earnings. after the closing bell on wednesday, important news about dubai. i'm delighted to bring in the c.e.o. of joby. i just want to get right to that

dubai project. we've spoken so many times over the years where i ask you, when are we going to see a joby fly and where? and it seems like you're closer to answering that. >> absolutely. first, thank you so much for inviting me on here and our flight test facility, it's amazing to be with you. on dubai, we're so excited. we're spreading across the line where we've got incredible support, a six-year exclusive in dubai to provide air taxi service and our target is to launch that service by the end of next year. really, really pleased with the progress that we're making and, again, thank you for being -- having us today. ed: i'm really interested in the business model long-term. you know that i also take a microscope to your financials. your losses and sort of cash burn are at pace with the street's expectations. just explain the timeline of how

that changes and when you start becoming meaningfully revenue-generating. >> thank you. we are executing exactly to plan and we have very rigorous financial discipline. we are methodically ramping our production, we just announced that we enrolled the third aircraft off our pilot manufacturing line and we have the fourth and fifth coming along quickly behind. we're going to have four aircraft in our flight test program as we're driving certification. and we've completed the first three stages of certification with the f.a.a. and we're now working on the fourth stage where we've announced that we're 37% complete there. so as we move into commercialization, we can begin to generate meaningful revenues and reduce the cash burn on the company. so very, very pleased with

progress. ed: is america moving fast enough on e.v. toll? america? >> absolutely. we have incredible bipartisan support in washington, d.c. and this last year we were invited to new york where we were able to fly our air taxi in new york city from the wall street helipad. it was a dream come true for me. i've been working on this for many, many years. and seeing the age of clean, quiet, emissions-free aircraft being able to fly in a city like new york is really exciting. we have an incredible partnership with delta airlines and we're working to build with the port authority to build best in class infrastructure at new york, j.f.k. and laguardia. ed: when does that happen? the ability to take one of your e.v. toll from wall street to an

airport in the real world? >> it's coming very soon. again, we're making great progress with the port authority on the permitting of those takeoff and landing locations. connected to the delta hubs, so you can get off your delta flight and onto a j oby flight very seamlessly and be in a matter of minutes into manhattan. so we think this is a really exciting opportunity and it's coming very, very soon. really paced by the speed at which we can get that infrastructure built. ed: c.e.o. of joby. great to have you back here on "bloomberg technology." coming up on the show, we're joined by the co-founder and c.e.o. of cla -- klaviyo to discuss that company's earnings. this is "bloomberg technology." this is "bloomberg technology." ♪where ya headed?

susan: where am i headed? am i just gonna take what the markets gives me? where are you headed? where am i headed? where am i headed? am i ya know, that's backed by j.p. morgan's leading strategists like us. when you want to invest with more confidence... the answer is j.p. morgan wealth management oh, thank you so much i couldn't have done it without you. honestly, i don't do a whole lot here. i'm really just here for the at&t internet, it's super-fast so, any pre-launch concerns? what if nobody buys them? that's mean or, what if everybody buys them? oh, i hadn't thought of that that's probably not gonna happen can we handle that kind of traffic? the network can handle it! i downloaded eight hours of true crime stories just during our last video call i'm learning a lot

ed: welcome back to "bloomberg technology." ed ludlow in san francisco. i want to show you a chart that maybe you didn't know you needed. this shows normalized performance going back to 1999 with nvidia going in one direction in this session and monster beverage corps going the other direction. the point being that nvidia has once again overtaken monster as the best performing stock on the s&p 500 this century. which is an important data point but i'd also say this courtesy of dan curtis of terminal data editor that think about the c.e.o. of nvidia. he has a 3.5% stake in nvidia. he could buy all of monster

beverage corps and every single share and still have enough money left over to go out and buy another chip company or even if he wanted, lululemon. some size and scope of inriddia. how it's overtaken some of the wildest stock stories we've ever seen, one of which was monster beverage. let's turn back to the earnings story. klaviyo reported earners. c.e.o. founder and c.e.o. joins us now for more. my goodness, look at your stock, up 27.25%. 35% growth on pretty decent customer growth where would you like to start? this is best day for your stock since you went public. >> yeah. thanks for having us and thanks to those around the world for a great quarter. really delivering for our customers and partners. i'm really excited about the 150,000-plus now businesses that we serve. we have a bunch of great brands

in the quarter. bar stool sports, hershel supply company, and we're really -- what makes klaviyo special is we're helping businesses take control of their relationships with consumers and then drive revenue. i think when the economic environment is a little uncertain, software like klaviyo becomes a must-have. ed: so on it being a must-have, it's also interesting to look who is on the other side of the table for you. you added like in the quarter samsonite, for example. why does a company like them need klaviyo? >> what klaviyo's software does is we help pull all of a business' data together, so take sampsonite, one of the largest luggage travel companies in the world, we help them organize that data and then deliver personalized experiences across a variety of channels. from email to s.m.s. to mobile messaging. and because of how well klaviyo connects with the other systems inside of an organization, and a lot of the advanced

capabilities, including a lot of the a.i. features we've released in the last few months, klaviyo a.i., those two factors are why businesses are choosing to work with us. because we're a revenue engine. ed: i like to look at geography as well. it's really interesting that the region, which continues to be a driver for you, why? why is there such engagement in europe and the middle east and africa? >> over the last few years we've -- we're executing our strategy really well. we've done a lot of expansion into europe and with that we launched our product and a lot of our documentation. we added -- we went beyond english into french. we formally launched in the french region. and now we've established that playbook, it happened, we launched in q-2, we really like the growth we're seeing and we're going to take that same playbook and use it across the rest of europe and extend that around the rest of the globe into asia and other parts of the americas and whoo what we've

known for a long time is there are businesses using klaviyo in over 08 countries but we're trying to build a product experience that's native toking them. so doing things like -- native to them. so doing things like expanding s.m.s. capabilities. we have doubled countries where we support text messaging. we plans to grow that. really excited about the growth we're seeing internationally and in europe in particular. ed: you're a boston-based company with fewer than 2,000 employees. what's the talent story for you right now, particularly in terms of a.i. and head count? many companies are actually cutting certain areas to reallocate to areas of growth like a.i. what's your strategy? >> from a technology standpoint, we are very much believers in using artificial intelligence both for our customers and for us. so we've seen good productivity gains from using a.i. across klaviyo. some of our own engineering resources in doing that. but in terms of our head count strategy, we're a global business. so we look for the best talent

around the world. i know we started in boston but we have offices now in denver, in san francisco, and london and sydney and we're planning to open more over the next few quarters. so we look for folks that are really ambitious. we say high slope, they want to be learners. and wherever that talent is, we want them to come join forces with us. ed: c.e.o. of klaviyo and klaviyo up more than 27%, best day since going public in september. thank you. all right. let's talk a little bit more about europe and tech. weak sales and a drop in new orders for its factory business. though it did record a jump in software demand in the third quarter, siemen's. we asked their c.e.o. where the strength to the company's top and bottom line is coming from. have a listen to this. >> it was driven by another strong quarter of smart infrastructure, our electrical business grew by 21%. but also a very strong softer

business. the underlying of the softer business was very strong but we also had a couple of large wins. they don't repeat in that size again, but this helped quite a bit also to drive our top and bottom line as well. >> so some fairly lumpy numbers this time around. which probably aren't repeatable. you have stuck to your guidance for the full year. given what you've just said, given what you see in the world at the moment, how predictable is the business right now? >> yes, we indeed -- we confirm our guidance, our full-year outlook for the growth. we will end up at the lower end, though. and we also confirm on our e.p.s. guidance. the same holds true for our businesses and regarding the i.v.c., profitability for the full year and the s.i. on the upper end. so the predictability, it's really -- there are -- the biggest element which we have

here is that over the last three years, the automation business was growing tremendously fast. and this ended up in quite a bit of stocking in our distribution channels. and this stocking effect hats to go down. we have to destock on the one side and the market has to pick up on the other. this is the unpredictability, how fast does that go? when will the market pick up? we see a certain light in chemical industry, also in china, which is a leading indicator. but this is not really the momentum we need in order to really grow there. therefore we still have a muted market for automation. it is temporary effect, structural, we believe this market keeps on going because there's a demand for higher automation and digitization in the whole industry. ed: that was see men's c.e.o. -- siemen's c.e.o. coming up, former nasa executive discusses the plans that are being hatched between nasa and spacex to return the astronauts

that have been stuck in orbit after complications on that starliner test mission. really interesting conversation ahead. this is "bloomberg technology." ♪

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ed: this is "bloomberg technology." you're looking at a live shot of the principal room. this is bloomberg. ♪ so we have an update on the boeing starliner test mission. nasa is working with elon musk's spacex on a plan to return the two astronauts back to earth in february, 2025, after technical complications caused them to be stuck in orbit for about two months on the international space station. nasa's going to make a final decision in mid august on

whether to deploy this backup plan. i want to bring in an expert who knows the inner workings of the space agency. former nasa executive, white house assistant director for space policy, and joins us now. the extension of that plan is that there is a crew mission going up in september with spacex and then maybe the two astronauts currently on i.s.s. could hitch a ride back february of 2025 which seems a really long time away. just your reaction to where we are right now that a backup plan is needed. >> you know, the great thing about this backup plan is that we have it. because if we didn't, then i think that there would be, especially when you look at the global geopolitical environment, i think that we would have a much harder time if we didn't have this option. so it's great that we have this option. i think that's the first and

most important thing. and it's important that america has two options to carry humans safely to space. what i do see also is massive boeing and spacex prioritizing human safety first as they should. so that's equally important. ed: there is reporting out there about nasa officials or teams within nasa sort of not being 100% aligned on what the best plan was to do. as best you can, just help our audience understand how nasa works, you know, now in this era of space we have commercial partners, you know, leading the activity, but nasa still has a central role. >> absolutely. the astronauts are nasa employees. they're nasa astronauts and these companies have contracts with nasa so nasa has a responsibility to review and

authorize decisions because at the end of the day, the buck stops with them. and so if you step back a few weeks ago, there was a task that was consulted, 26 of the 27 jets that were fired and the goal was to ensure that these thrusters were working properly and were needing -- meeting performance requirements. now the team is going back and analyzing that data. so there are two reasons, that could really go either way. one could say, well, we've analyzed the data and we think that this boeing aircraft can come back with the astronauts or without the astronauts. then there's another reasoning which is that spacex is really the way to go. so either way there are people,

and this is good when you have disagreement, and now they have a bit more time, given the spacex mission that's going up in september, to analyze the data further and then they'll make a decision based on the performance of the thrust, the performance of this helium leak that they are monitoring and they will make a call midaugust based on all the information they have available and they will obviously make a decision that includes the priority -- that prioritizes human safety first, that prioritizes a safe landing and that also builds confidence in the system. ed: that's what i want to ask about. because we just showed the chart of boeing spending on the starliner project. and it's been well reported the cost overruns, the delays. how to your mind did nasa and boeing as partners now go back out and bring public confidence

in the program going forward? >> when it works. and that's the point we're trying to get to. a point where it will work and there is confidence that's built in the system so that it can ferry humans and then the public will have confidence in the system, but we have to get it to work first. which is why the analysis of these firing tests that were conducted recently have to be completed. but nasa will not make a decision until they have conducted a thorough analysis and believe that the data provided moves them in one direction or another. ed: ezinne also a senior fellow at the harvard bell centre. the other big piece of talk is china and its satellite constellation ambitions, might they do something similar to starlink? and if they were to, how does

that work, the competition for space, the proximity of a u.s.-run constellation to a chinese constellation? your thoughts on that. >> you know, what is great about this question and this scenario is that we are already living it. before the spacex constellation went up, we had smaller constellations but we still had constellations in space and then a megaconstellation was put up by a u.s. commercial company which gave us the leverage to understand and to plan for what it would look like if a strategic competitor in this case a nation like china, put up constellations of their own. so through the constellation that we have up there, put up by spacex, we have been able to have discussions and even remediations to radio astronomy issues, to night sky issues based on what the satellites can

see or what they prevent us from seeing, from here on earth. we have had conversations about orbittal degree which is the amount of junk left in space and we've had conversations about space sustainability and figured out policy and engineering solutions to all of these issues. and so i think that we are actually in a better place as the united states to prepare the best we can for this constellation because we have an example up there today. if we didn't, then i think we would be in a completely different place. however, that doesn't mean that we can plan entirely, as you say, for what will happen. ed: it's great to have you back on bloomberg technology. thank you. former nasa executive and currently a field goal at the harvard bellford -- currently a fellow at the harvard bellford center. app something working on its smallest desk top computer yet.

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ed: apple is planning a new version of the mac mini that will be its smallest desk top computer yet. this is part of a broader overhaul of the mac line with a.i.-focused chips.

bringing in bloomberg's mark who broke the story. the focus here is m-4. and bringing m-4 in. just explain the basic details of what you've reported. >> yeah, so the mac mini last revamped in 2010 under steve jobs. now about 15 years later, it's getting another redesign. that's a really big delta in between new designs. and this is essentially because of these new processors and ipad pro in a box. they're able to shrink this down into something that is about the size of an apple tv box. something probably smaller than four by four inches. this will be a very popular computer. it's going to be marketed as the smallest desk top computer ever made. not only by apple, but by any computer company. and this is going to have a supremely powerful chip. the m-4 pro chip is going to have even better graphic sports power and a.i. processing and c.p.u. performance than the new ipad pro.

so this is going to be very exciting to mac fans coming later this year. ed: the ideas outlined to us by our bloomberg sources are really interesting. what i try to understand and apple didn't comment on the story, of course, is where the mac mini or mac kinds of six within the line of apple products, who is the buyer here? >> this mac mini is going to be for people who want to hook up a computer to their tv, there are some people who hook up -- connect macs to their tv's in their living rooms or office. but also someone who has a desk top at home and wants to do laptop-esque work. so the same amount of work you would do on a desk top, so web browsing, email, photo editing, video editing, you'll be able to do that with this machine and hook it up to any monitor you have. it's stand-alone. so this is going to be a pretty modular machine. ed: another exclusive piece of reporting. thank you. ok. for years the likes of google and open a.i. have been racing

to build ever bigger and costlier a.i. models using a tremendous amount of online data. think chatbots like chat gbt which can handal wide range of complex queries. but some startups are now betting on a different strategy. small language models, automating a more limited set of day to day corporate taxes without requiring as much data. bloomberg has been writing about exactly this. so you've heard of the large language model. now is the time of the small language model. what is the small language model? >> small language model is kind of what it sounds like, right? a large language model is a ton of data, often gathers from all over the internet and used for a range of tasks. chatgpt people might use it to write shakespearean sonnetts about ice cream or use it to summarize meeting notes. a very diverse range of tasks that are related to human language. these small models are trained on a much smaller, more refined

set of data. and the idea is that for a lot of companies, and let's be clear, companies are really the customers for a lot of these large language model, they're the ones with lots of money, right? and a.i. companies want them to pay for them. they're going to need them for specific things. and maybe one thing that they are really good at, something related to coding, perhaps, a chatbot that's very focused on tax prep questions, for instance. so the hope by a lot of these companies that these models will be more energy efficient and they will be more focused and they'll be more helpful in general. ed: who is leading the way in small language models? kind of seems like an odd question but every time a very cutting-edge large language model comes out, we cover it as news on the show. do we have a sense of like who is focused on that area? >> yeah. so we have actually like a pretty big range of companies that are involved in this. there are a couple startups that are very focused on this. i spoke with one called rcai.

they are totally focused on customizing open source small models and so they customize them for customers, including a company called guild, which used it to make a career coaching chatbot so they could scale up more than they could do with their human career coaches. sokana.ai is a company in japan working on this and the big tech companies have increasingly been releasing these small versions of their larger flagship models like openai recently released a mini. ed: bloomberg's rachel metz on small language models. a new term for daily use here on the show. that does it for this edition of "bloomberg technology." lots to recap. don't forget to check out our podcast, you know where to find it on the bloomberg platforms. the term noll. as well as online at apple, spotify and ihop. we'll show you beautiful pictures in a moment but for now this is "bloomberg technology."

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>> bloomberg markets. as it goes, we had one single data point which has reinvigrated the bullish case. the biggest drop in a year. so it's not a bleed in the jobs market. that is what they say to us. as far as markets are concerned, they say -- nvidia is up 4.2% but still down 27% from its high. the nasdaq is still in a correction. never made it to that correction territory. the nasdaq is in a correction.