inflation is continuing to gain traction as they think about rate cuts. we will see what the number tells us. >> how many rate cuts, and how soon? this number tomorrow is once again going to be a big deal. >> we did get another record high on snp, that will do it for us over here at overtime, fast money starts now.>> this is fast money, here is what is on tap tonight. bad for intel, is this the signal to sell? we will dive into it. plus humana humbled, with the biggest drop in over two years after saying earnings would be half expectations. things are way worse than just the numbers. and toss that tesla tank shares are tumbling after a slowdown this year, stock down 25% this

year, what the analysts are saying about this once unstoppable stock. i'm melissa, on the desk tonight with t.i.n., karen, and dan. after hours lows, the earnings fall is just getting started, let's get the details on the numbers with christina joining us onset.>> they gave me the lowdown, i'm serious.>> clearly investors are worried, they outlines what they will stay on the call for, intel owns 90% of that company, it's obviously going to impact the revenue stream. they announced some weakness, and the programmable solutions, chips that are made or a

specific task. budgets are shifting toward a.i. products. lastly, foundry came in lower than anticipated, some of that has to do with packaging, so those are three factors. they do anticipate an 11% drop in quarter one. seasonality, that falls in line. they are really going to push that on the call. in december, holiday sales refresh.>> we knew that quarter one was seasonally weak. we knew that. and yet the first quarter revenue was $2 billion less than what they were expecting.>> three factors. that's why those three factors have hit. >> what about datacenter?

this is market share loss that people think does not end. >> data center revenue is down year-over-year, it came over 4 billion, i asked about that as well. they have lost market shares. that is something we already know. the last sentence that they said was for every quarter, earnings and revenue they expect sequential growth and year-over- year growth for 2024, but they won't really change anything for the full-year outlook or anything like that. obviously they are trying to put a positive spin, but it is a pretty negative reaction.>> my grandmother used to say little guy, if you have nothing good to say. the core wasn't that bad.

computing is half of the business, of 33% year-over year. datacenter is down, i get it. intel can figure this out, the quarter was good, but the stock has tumbled. it has gone from 25 to 50. the question you have to ask yourself is not should i be selling it, but where would i buy intel on this selloff?>> would you want to buy it? >> is interesting, this was a late one during the party, obviously it is up year over year, but this is a stock the street has not been behind. the lowest percentage of ratings that i can remember, 12 buys, 30 holds, seven cells. expectations were so low.

analyst and investor expeditions have been really low. when you see that sort of revenue guide for the current quarter, they are already one month into it, nd there is a chance that it comes in at the low end of that. you have seasonality and share loss issues that push into the next quarter. so where do you buy it? probably somewhere with a three handle when it starts to look cheap on the out year numbers. in quarter to you at some point have two kitchen sink 2024.>> things were kind of cyclical, the whole space obviously defines that, but intel, before today's loss in the after hours, it went 18 times. to me i think there is still a

better look. this is enormous, i'm not buying the seasonality thing. it's going to be christmas for a long time.>> intel history.>> exactly. it is caught up in the bubble, but it deserves a pretty big penalty, it is unfortunately back to the penalty box for them.>> mobilize should not be underestimated. i'm concerned about what is going on with the datacenter, because they are losing ground. there was nothing in this prince that we didn't know. we knew that client business was strong. we knew they were going to put a drag on the end of the quarter. i think the fact that the streets are negative, investors are on the win here, i think it is positive. i have been adding into this strength. a lot of this started in the mid-30s, back to the levels dan is targeting, they are pointing

out a.i. is nascent for all of us. look. this is chip usa, at some point everybody is going to get behind this stock, i'm not saying investors have to own it here, but i do think the bigger story for intel is going to be about rating and broadening the business that right now they are frankly losing.>> there has been a shift toward neutrality. i have seen a tone change. we look at the standalone business, and your point about making everything work in the u.s., they are going to be focusing on mature notes.

it is 2027. are you holding on for several more years? or more blunders with the product launches >> in my family i'm still little guy, i've got aunts and uncles. nobody cares >> it's one of those ancestry things. dan said three handle, tim said mid-30s. operating margins were a lot better, they came in almost 17%. it is up significantly from last year, and it should be, it was an absolute disaster.

one push up on stage, isn't that right >> not one. sometimes he does drop to the floor and then get right back up. >> he should stop. or do more than one.>> to tim's point, it's going to come your way, there is nothing that they said, nothing that's going to change in the next couple months that is going to change the story. that's just a fact. i would be focused on the reports next week, that has actually doubled in the last three months. think about the expectations. this isn't a company that doubled revenues, they are supposed to have revenue up, this is the inflection point of 20%.>> keep us posted on the call.>> let's bring in jean, a matching partner of deepwater

asset management. what is your take? are you as dour as some of the guys on the desk?>> i was multitasking, listening to the call and picking up some negativity from the desks. i appreciate that recap. yes, i am. the call kicked off with intel being an a.i. everywhere company and talking about near-term weakness in march, you saw the shares move up a couple percent. also they talked a lot about new products. that is i think the central point to this intel story. will the new products catch on with attentional customers? when they talk about a.i. opportunity, being an a.i. everywhere company, the opportunity is really the sweet spot of this, in the gpu market, the most competitive market. when we think about where this company is going down the road, they are going to grow revenue

this year, call it 15%, maybe. that's to get to a revenue growth rate that is going to be more a.i. paradigm shift, you've got to get into that gpu market. i have questions about how you will compete with essentially nvidia, amd, and three, the hyperscalers making their own chips. they are trying to compete in this market, my sense is that this is intel's growth at 10% to 15% growth. we are not going to get the big lift that we are hoping for.>> what should it be valued at?>> right now it is trading about 27 times. it's a similar multiple that nvidia trades at, about 30 times, because people are looking at nvidia, with an out

year, if you put this all together, melissa, this should probably trade right around where it is at, and grow earnings around 10%. when i put all the pieces together, there are better ways to play the opportunity.>> you just mentioned that intel has to worry about catching up to nvidia and amd, but the hyperscalers, the big customers, big cloud players like microsoft and google, they have all signaled that they are going to be designing and making their own gpu's. doesn't that just place the second tier players that much further behind? doesn't it pose a risk as we get further into the year? the cost to compute, it is something they really have to start thinking about as they commercialize a lot of these

products.>> yes is the answer, from a competitive standpoint, nvidia is in a great spot. they will have more of a challenge in the years to come. they've got nothing but good news in the last few weeks. there have been rumors about how much apple is spending on nvidia, this is a great time for nvidia, but these tech companies don't want to spend that much money, they want to do that in a more cost effective way. i think there is an opportunity for these hyperscalers to do better, competitively. we will see how that plays out. we are talking about 300% growth for nvidia this year, going to high 40s this year and next year, high teens. i'm not suggesting that nvidia is the best way to play, there are opportunities. yes, i think it is an untold

story with what the hyperscalers are doing >> intel might actually bit of a homeland security play. in this landscape, what could happen in november? new sanctions against china, could there be a rewriting on intel on the back of that alone?>> yes. we owned intel. we owned it a year ago. we gave up on it when they had these issues. one of the central reasons we owned it is this domestic theme. i think it is in the and if it category. unfortunately when i put that positive, and then think about the other competitive dynamics and products dynamics, and also the fact they are not only

building and designing chips, they are building them, the only other company that does that in the world is samson, and they don't do a very good job at it.>> jean, thank you for being on. do you think the street is to out? could the pie grow for nvidia?>> i think of that 2024 number, is it too high? i think they can ultimately exceed that. there will be more competition that ends up happening in 2026. it is hard to do chips, we have learned that. i think the street is modeling properly how this massive spike is going to go up and then come back down. i think analysts are doing a pretty good job taking about

2025.>> what is the readthrough to amd? more broadly, we've had a monster relative group that moves in monstrous ways in the chips space. does this make sense to you? >> amd had the stock. we had a high 40s multiple, and we also have the fundamentals now, that's going to play out. i think things are going to be fine, ultimately they are gaining shares, the softness that intel has talked about, they've talked about mobilizing, and other parts of the core business are not seeing the traction that they want to see. things blew up a few weeks ago. we shouldn't be surprised by the estimates. i think the fundamentals are fine. i don't have a strong sense of

the stock. it seems like nvidia is a better opportunity now. >> jean, it's great to hear from you on intel, intel shares are down by 8% as the conference call gets underway.>> i think hat he had to say about nvidia is the most important thing. one of the things i got wrong last year was how this company was going to grow into those out year estimates given the bump they had in guidance. look at fiscal year 2025, they are expecting high teens earnings growth and mid to high teens sales growth. this is a 75% gross margin company that is going to have a lot more competition on price, and also competition from customers. even if they have modest estimates going forward, the story is going to be very interesting. granted the stock is up, all of

the customers are going to be reporting next week. i think you want to keep a close eye on this one, it could be an accident waiting to happen.>> is your conviction faltering at this point? >> my conviction is that they were not doing anything near term, much every quarter this happens, i think the stock is going to trade where it is, i think this is an opportunity. i am not as negative as everybody here.>> we will stay tuned, and bring you all the headlines as we have them. visa, capital one, t-mobile are all on the move. but first, a huge buzz kill, humana is tanking. one trader says it is hard to overstate how bad the report was. details on why when fast money returns.>> this is fast moy,ne with melissa lee, right here on

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♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ buzz kill on humana, the health insurer sinking 11%

after reporting numbers less than half of what analysts expected. the move came a week after the company warned that costs are running higher than expected in the fourth quarter with shares at their lowest level since april 2020. yes, this is an example of a stock going down on the same thing, even worse than a couple weeks ago.>> even worse than if they had said nothing a few weeks ago and only said this. well, this is a change, for sure. earnings moved so much from this medical loss ratio being 2% worse. they operate the business at lower to middle single digit net profitability. if your biggest expense is 2% off, that digs in a huge amount into your overall profitability. i cannot understand why they did not think we had a big

fourth quarter, medical loss ratio was very high, and then not waiting to see if it could continue. the most innocuous cases, every big rush at the end of the year, to get procedures or whatever the costs were, we know that it takes a little while for claims to come in. this is a very dramatic trend. is it going to continue? that i don't understand at all. it looks way worse. the the best is that that he did not know it was coming, the worst is that they did. they really screwed up the delivery of what wasn't good news already.>> the good news may be that they are assuming the higher rates to be the new normal. they are talking about a reset for the industry.

maybe it is conservative.>> i think they've said that the industry is going to reprice, but they are going to gross slower. it's going to be worse for us, i don't like that either.>> analysts are completely offsides. karen knows this, they cut guidance in half, from $30 down to $16, which is incredible, in one week. the optics around it even make it worse. the guide is terrible. the optics may be even worse >> earnings were good, the stock was down minimally today,

just the delivery of that bad news is so poorly done. would you feel comfortable saying oh, they are conservative this time?>> i wouldn't. i'm intrigued by cheap valuations. it is wait and see.>> coming up next, details on the quarter for visa, and the latest on paypal's a.i. upset. how to trade all these moves, up ahead. we will be back right after this. [ music ]

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oh, ohhhh. k joins us with the latest on lisa and capital one. >> once again management is calling consumers resilient, the ceo is on the call, saying we are off to a solid start in 2024. consumer spending remained resilient. we are seeing more overall spending, but u.s. spending did

slow down. revenue was up 9% in the quarter, earnings rose 11%, payment volume up 8%. cross-border volume was up by 6%. visa did forecast a bit below estimates, so that is also weighing on shares here. growth appears to have plateaued. expectations were high going into this. then capital one increased provisions for credit losses, revenue growth was slow, only 1% of a net charge-off, climbing to 2.5 billion. dylan quincy, that is another key thing wall street is watching. delinquency rate was 3.99%, up from 3.71%. back to you.>> kate, thank you. we heard bits and pieces of the capital one stuff from

discover.>> we were going to say let's wait and hear what they have to say. capital one reinforces what i thought was going on with discover. visa, we've seen this before, it seemingly happens every quarter, the report, the stock sells off, and a week later it is an all-time high. there's nothing not to like about the visa quarter, in my opinion. >> visa should be rallying along with the rest of the stock market rallying around growth that may or may not be there. we should be feeling the momentum of the consumer, the gdp of today, and the pole position underappreciated. what do you do with growth that says low double digits for the

full year? i think it is a little lighter than people expected, but it was a good run into this.>> i thought we were going to ask about capital one?>> you can talk about capital one. choose your own adventure. >> i thought capital one was bad, a tick up higher, but after discover we were expecting something worse than that >> you are worried about the consumer.>> guy says this all the time. we have seen the consumer confidence, we've seen the gdp. the stock market is at an all- time high.>> everything seems great.>> mark this on your

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s&p has risen, jumping 243 points. another half percent closing at a record high. the nasdaq also climbed about 2/10 of a percent. a couple booze, starting with boeing, the stock is tanking again after a halt on expanding production of the jets. boeing is unlikely to meet production goals for 2025.

bank of america has downgraded from a neutral to a buy. bank of america also cussed estimates down dramatically. most analysts didn't really see the economic impact. i understand the fear factor, but the faa is digging in, it's what they have to do. the analyst committee falls through, and you are also looking for catalysts and when this is going to change. 420 24 we are not going to really go with boeing. to some extent it can be delayed, but not to allied - - to some extent things can be delayed, but not denied.>> when this first happened we all said how can they stand by the stock

so readily? granted we didn't know what the impact was, but all these things take much longer to unfold.>> the good news is for boeing, it's bust. the defense business you are not getting for free, but you are getting it at a huge discount. you had a 7% bounce over the course of 10 days, not a big deal. now you have to wait and hear what they have to say.>> united rentals is at an all-time high, soaring nearly 13% after beating estimates and giving better-than-expected guidance for the year. they plan to buy back one and a half billion dollars in stock this year, karen, you know this

was a great conference call. >> there is a lot to like. the numbers were really good, but it had some things in there, they did a large acquisition in december 2022. there are more opportunities to come. business is great, the outlook is really good. we have the infrastructure. there has been a huge transformation in this business. a couple years ago they had more debt than i was comfortable with, but they could deal with it. it is a new story, even after a number of acquisitions. all that said, it's up $75, it was kind of a lot. i had to take some money off the table. >> does the story get better with lower interest rates? >> lower is better.

if building is supported, yes. >> investors are apparently unimpressed by the offerings. paypal shares are down nearly 25% over the past year. the problem was how he cast what was going to happen. he said something like it's going to be mind blowing. how do you deliver on mind boeing - - how do you deliver on mind blowing? >> paypal is the fee, i think it's going to flex a muscle. i think alex is going to flex a muscle. some of these announcements, innovations and enhancements were not earth shattering, it's more than what people saw.

they need to fix the checkout process, it is clunky. >> tim and i went to college together, i remember this thing like it was yesterday, he used to tell people it was going to be mind blowing only to have them be incredibly disappointed in the aftermath.>> there's a lot of different context to have that conversation. the beginning of the end was in 2021, with a rumor that was going around that they were interested in pinterest. they've never been able to recover from that.>> i try to come up with an acronym. i see a lot of things i can think about that tim sees. to your point, if this is your first league, your first coming out, they brought n a lot of great people. they have a great balance sheet.

>> he is laughing at himself >> i think his thing being left out of the a.i. party, that party is very concentrated with some big names. i think we will have lower lows, some of these names will look like unusual values. >> maybe i will change up the acronym. >> to what, zebra?>> people play the rules, you might as well change it, nobody follows the rules. by the way, here is a behind the-scenes look at how the algorithm is formulated. he was considering switching out p for pellets on.

>> it would have been tough. it would have fit into the bicep, but we want to show you how seriously we take our acronyms, i dug deep. tesla, we will kick the tires and look under the hood and see the numbers. plus, champagne problems, as wine and spirits were the only disappointing part of a record year for revenue. we will discuss the numbers over a tin of caviar, next. ♪♪ so you can rise from pain. icy hot. fresh, warm hot dogs! when i'm not selling hot dogs, i invest in a fund that advances innovations like robotics. fresh, warm hot dogs, straight out of my torso!

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after hours lows, intel will seek costs to keep us going in the 60% follow-through range for the next couple years. the stock is down 9 1/2%. tim, do you have further questions that you would want to have answered as a shareholder?>> we want to know how much of this is within the

realm of expectation. this isn't just about capacity and trying to hold serve. the story has to be new products, and that pipeline.>> chest tesla shares are diving more than 12% after an earning report. his comments sparked a slew of price cuts. phil has the details. phil? >> when you listen to that call, and i encourage people to listen to that call, it really isn't clear where the slowdown is coming from that tesla's warning about. this was essentially a warning, not saying cells sales were deliberately going to drop, but they were sitting lower on the delivery. you did mention price target cuts. some went as far as to call the

conference call a train wreck. guidance lacked details, that's an understatement, there are very few details from tesla after hours, the use the words notably lower when talking about delivery growth. the street - - they exceeded 2.1 billion vehicles to be delivered this year, an increase of about 18% relative to last year. by the way, last year, deliveries were up 24%, before that, up by 40%. the market globally is slowing down. elon musk did talk about increased petition, and where is it coming from? you guessed it, china.>> chinese car companies are the most competitive in the world. i think they will have significant success outside of

china, depending on what trade barriers are established. frankly if there are not trade barriers established, they will be much demolish most of the car companies in the world. they are extremely good. >> one other thing, the next generation vehicle that came up on the call yesterday was a focus for a lot of people saying deliveries are slowing down as they go to a next- generation and lower-priced vehicle starting in 2025. when you listen to that explanation, why would your sales of your vehicles ight now, why would deliveries slow down? the bottom line is this, if you

were expecting tesla to have a gangbusters in 2024, that's just not in the cards. especially not from elon musk. >> he seems to indicate that they were starting this up in texas, he wants all of the engineers to basically live on the line and be there, that's why you're not putting it into another factory. to your point, you are not taking production down, you are starting up a new in. it's a curious explanation to say we are going to have notably lower volume growth next year because of this transition.>> that's what spooked analysts, melissa. they didn't get any details, they didn't get an explanation. the lack of details and the vagueness in terms of deliveries next year, that's the reason we are seeing price target cuts.>> phil, thanks.

i also felt like they were not pressed about the details, were what the word notably meant when it came to the forecast of notably slower growth. not sure what the dynamic was on that conference call, but it didn't feel like people were answering questions. >> it seemed very curated, they knew what the questions and answers were going to be, some of them were scripted. i think phil said it adequately. they came out, they raised estimates, robots, a.i., all this other stuff, it's not what you would value for a company. they are trying to tell you it's not an auto company, look over here. they were asked those sort of

things, the stock is down 30% in a month. it's down 50% from the all-time high in late 2021. the operating margins were a disaster. some people .2 automotive margins that flattens out, but the gross margin is down 8% from a year ago, people were justifying $1 trillion market cap, it does not exist anymore. this is going to be a messy year. interest rates in china, they are not going away anytime soon.>> part of the call that was in the governance issue, elon musk talking about 25%, that shouldn't be part of the selloff, but i think it was. if you are a tesla owner surprised by something elon musk says, remember when he took a picture of himself by the side of the road with a bankruptcy sign in front of

him? the comments today were nothing relative to that, funding secured, i'm going to just twitter and i'm going to be the ceo. you cannot be surprised. it would be ridiculous to say how can he even do that?>> has the hiatus come to an end? we will dig into the details coming up next. [ music ] now earns 5% apy. 5% apy? that's new! yup, that's how you business differently.

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welcome back to fast money. lv mh has jumped, with revenue jumping 10% in the holiday quarter. analysts are confident about 2024. this is in your acronym, helmet.>> the price to earnings basis was very low for them, the lowest in a long time. part of what has gone wrong is china, and if china is bottoming, that's very good for them. wine and spirits had a good quarter, probably because all of all of those shareholders who owned the stock during the fourth quarter of last year. it was a good time to drink.

but i think there was a lot of pent-up demand, from that chinese consumer that we have not seen yet.>> selective retailers of 25%, is that a read through >> again it gives you a little china, a little discretionary, a little bit of a stock that has been beaten up. some of those companies have been beaten up bcha.y in>> coming up next, final trades. [ music ] at ameriprise financial our advice is personalized based on your goals, whatever they may be. all that planning has paid off. looks like you can make this work. we can make this work. and the feeling of confidence that comes from our advice... i can make this work. that seems to be universal.

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that first time you take a step back. i made that. with your very own online store. i sold that. and you can manage it all in one place. i built this. and it was easy, with a partner that puts you first. godaddy. >> there it is. >> yes, it tells me to do it. they have done such an extraordinary job. united rentals i had to sail some upside calls point >> i like tim's bicep. you can buy it on the way down.

so, last break you heard me giggling as we came back. i will tell you why, because dan is in pain about something and i found that amusing. some people say that's mean- spirited i think it's actually kind of funny. >> checking on intel down 10% right now. >> my mission is simple. to make you money. i'm here to level the playing field for all investors. there's always a market somewhere, and i promise to help you find it. mad money starts now. >> hey, i'm kramer. welcome to mad money. i'm just trying to make you a good old money. my job is not to entertain, but to educate. teach!