jimmy. >> disney. again, the narrative has changed. >> wow, okay. jenny? >> nextera. 9.75% yield. >> all right. so we are green for now. i'll see you on "closing bell." "the exchange" is now. ♪ ♪ thank you, scott. i'm brian sullivan in for kelly evans once gain. here is what is ahead. it was yesterday's big market reaction, was it just an overreaction to an increase in inflation, or an excuse to take profits, or something maybe more alarming? lots of ors. one of our guest says it's just a matter of time until we see more, not less, inflation. we'll tell you why. plus, shares of robin hood surging after the company posting a surprise profit and it got more aggressive in courting

customers away from bigger brokerage firms. what happens when those promotions expire? we'll ask. and ev demand is slowing. one company that is trying to change your minds. an interesting concept. markets rebounding today after the worst session in nearly a year following the increase in consumer led inflation. but was that number just a blip or could we be looking at more of a worst case scenario that will require the fed to either keep rates high or simply not cut for longer than we think? steve liesman is here with more on no doubt the great debate on wall street. >> exactly, brian. there are two opposing scenarios out there that dominate this debate over that hotter than expected inflation number. the one held by i would say a majority of economists that i'm reading is that it was mostly a blip and inflation will resume

that downward trend. you had one-time vehicle increases, but it will decline, and the pce coming february 29 will be cooler in part because it has a lower weighting for housing. austan goolsbee talked about this today, saying higher inflation for a few months is okay, it still means we can be back on the path to the 2% target. he added one should not judge the trend from one month's numbers and pointed to that difference between housing inflation and the cpi and market gauges that show rents falling. but there is, of course, the more worrisome scenario that needs to be considered. the easing of inflation is behind us, and that last mile from 3% to 2% is a tougher one and could require a harder landing. >> the fed may have to hold rates higher, staying in restricted territory longer. that by definition increases the

risk of recession. so yes, my assessment is that the risk of recession has gone up moderately. >> while stocks have recovered, the more hawkish outlook on the fed remains. the market looks for around 105 basis points of cuts this year, not the 175 basis points it looked for a month ago. for now, the inflation report introduces risk to that coveted soft landing scenario. it could only be countered by better inflation data. >> all right. let's dive a little deeper in. we're going to add another voice to the conversation and your first guest says he's not surprised by the market selloff, because it was only a matter of time before tight labor and product markets result in more, not less, inflation. here to explain that view is richard burnstein, ceo and chief investment officer of richard burnstein advisers.

good to have you on the program. what do they call it, this is steve's term, the emaculate disinflation or something, is that dream now dead? >> well, brian, good to be with you again. i think -- our view can be summed up very quickly here. in terms of any 40-year career, there has never been a time when the consensus economic forecast correctly forecasted a recession. that's never happened. recessions are always a surprise. so if you accept that history, what you want to look for are situations where, if you think there's going to be a recession, look for situations where the leading indicators are rolling over, and the economists are ignoring that. what do we have today? we have the exact opposite. the leading indicators are troughing, and economists are calling for a slowdown in recession. that says that we're likely to have more positive surprises in

the economy, not only for the consensus forecast, but for the fed itself, which argues that there's probably going to be more inflation relative to expectations rather than less, which means the fed is handcuffed in terms of flexibility. >> i feel like the economy is kind of the economic version of the kansas city chiefs, steve. about mid season, they weren't looking like they used to, they were starting to lose. they lost to denver, everyone acted like it was over. here comes the slowdown. in other words, they just kept outperforming, and in many ways, i feel like the american economy just every time something is like we're done now, it surprises to the upside. >> yeah. give me a call after the show and tell me who taylor swift is in this scenario of yours, brian. in any event, i think that's right. and richard is right, as well. the economists had it dead wrong in forecasting the recession last year, and it sure doesn't

feel that way. i would point people's attention to tomorrow morning at 8:30, we'll get the retail sales report. it's supposed to show some cooling of consumer spending, but not all that much. so we'll see. we're now at a 3% or so gdp forecast for the first quarter. so that's not really much of a cooling. people have tried to -- i think people misunderstand or don't understand at all the american economy. i was thinking about this, brian. you cover the energy business. you realize there is an economy the size of saudi arabia inside the united states. we have a whole tech economy. we have an incredible technology economy that is just out there. it is just wrong to predict recession with an economy as dynamic as the united states without major, major policy errors. >> yeah, it certainly is. steve, as usual, makes good points here.

why have most -- i mean, i'm not picking on any one person here. almost every major economist has gotten it wrong to some degree. is there a way to go back and say, what exactly -- was there a moment intime where we missed kind of the same thing? >> so brian, i think the monkey wrench in forecasting has been the tremendous amount of monetary and fiscal stimulus that was put in the pipeline because of the pandemic. you just look at money growth for a second. money growth peaked out at 27%, the highest in modern u.s. history. that rivals us have peru at that point. i'm not sure that's something we should be proud of. i think what most economic models haven't been able to deal with is that extreme amount of monetary growth. what it may mean is to -- for that amount of growth to work its way through the python, to come out the other side is going to take a long period of tight

monetary policy. it's not just that you can do it for six months or a year and say we conquered everything. the money multipliers are high. we know about the long lag times of monetary policy. shouldn't they last longer and be more powerful at 27% money growth than at 4, 5, or 6? i don't think too many economic models have that in the models, because we've never had anything like this. >> we never had a model. steve, i feel like -- honestly, steve, i feel like this is an amazing moment in history, because if we pull this off, all that money growth, if debt ends up not mattering at all, and it hasn't mattered. there's still a lot of demand for u.s. debt. $34 trillion, nobody seems to care. it's like monetary theory warped maybe. rewrite a textbook moment? >> well, we did have the inflation to go along with it, but i would point out, i didn't

know burnstein was going to hit me with an m2 discussion. that said, i think m2 has been negative and falling year over year for quite a while, if i'm not mistaken. i'll look that up in a second. so i don't know that the previous growth in the money supply explains the current growth unless, of course, you factor in those lags that he was talking about. i do think, brian, it's worth thinking about what this whole thing might mean for stocks. it is interesting, the rally is taking place today. it's not a huge rally, it's a bit of a rally in some cases. but with the funds rate, the new outlook for the fed, the hawkish outlook for the fed is still in place. so there is still upside or a possibility for a recoveryin the stock market. the other thing is, if the fed does more, it likely means there's more growth out there. so we're at this, you know, classic tension here between what the fed is going to do

more. why is the fed going to do more? because the economy is doing more. i don't think just because the fed is doing more it's a reason to give up hope on growth or give upgrowth on earnings. >> we could probably -- rich, we have to leave it there, because when you brought up that, you opened this pandora's box and all these ideas came out. we have to say goodbye for now. steve and rich, thank you very much. great discussion, guys. all right. shares of robin hood surging 9% today. they reported a surprise profit in the fourth quarter. the relatively still new online -- new-ish, as the kids would say, notched more than $4.5 billion in deposits last month, the highest monthly total since 2021's meme stock craze. also worth mentioning, the average transfer balance topping $100,000, suggesting that robin hood is starting to serve wealthier clients, going beyond

the core of that sort of young first-time investor thing. while one in three net deposits come from competitors, the overall assets peal in comparison to a schwab or fidelity. kate rooney has an interview with the ceo of robin hood. take it away, kate. >> thank you. thank you so much for being here in person. >> thanks for having me. >> i want to start where brian kicked off there with net deposits and sheer amount of money you're seeing flow in from fidelity. part of this has been some of the promotions and incentives for people to move money. what gives you confidence that people are still going to transfer money to robin hood after the promotions end? >> it's been a combination of things. i would say the promotions have been an element of it, and really we're able to offer these promotions because we're a technology company. we lowered the cost of servicing these customers relative to a traditional brick and mortar

institution. right now, for gold customers, we're offering not just a 3% match on contributions into retirement accounts, but on 401(k) rollovers and incoming transfers, as well. and really, the idea there is we can offer this because we are a technology company. our cost of servicing is correspondingly lower, and it's a great value proposition for people that are moving in larger accounts and who have accumulated assets because you get an immediate boost to your retirement savings through it. >> brian mentioned that, as well. $100,000 was the average size of the transfer. has that changed at all, the demographics of the average trader on robin hood? you had this reputation for being for younger, first-time active traders. is that a misconception at this point? what does your demographic look like? >> if you remember about a year and a half ago, as the market

changed, we sort of changed the strategy in the business quite fundamentally. we said we would focus on three things. one is serving active traders rather than novice first-time investors. we've been focused on growing share with customers, so not just being sort of like the side account or the account for discretionary investing, but doing more of the retirement and more of the savings. and then the third thing, expanding internationally. it's always good to see sort of like some of the results coming in, because these sorts of strategic shifts take time to execute and reflect in the business model and the financial profile of the company. but yeah, the results oh of this quarter showed that is actually working. you see gold subscribers growing 25% year over year. you're seeing continued growth

in market share for equities and options, and that's sort of a testament to all the improvements we've made on the active trader side. and then now you're seeing these like strong inflows where you have people putting in, you know, six, seven figures plus into robin hood. which wasn't really a story that people talked about or really associated with robin hood. but the experience actually is quite good. not just for a small account, but for larger accounts, as well. >> what are they buying? what are you seeing in terms of trading for robin hood? >> the accounts moving in tend to have larger portfolios that they have been holding elsewhere. so you've been seeing those moving in. but yeah, if you look at q4, you've seen continued strength in equities market share. so equities market share went up by 14% year over year. options market share also went up considerably. and the crypto market share has

been quite strong. as we kind of announced in november and december metrics, that increased substantially, as well. so we kind of see market share coming to robin hood from across the board in all assets we offer. >> how important is crypto to the business going forward, and have you seen that momentum continue that you saw in fourth quarter? sit only based on prices? and if that's the case, is that sustainable going forward? >> yeah, typically what we have seen -- and just to level set, in q4, total quarterly revenue was a little over $470 million. of that, $43 million was crypto revenue. so it's important, and we're a major player in the crypto market. but we're also a diversified business. we have added all sorts of other revenue streams from assets based revenue, subscription revenue with robinhood gold and all the other assets that we trade.

so it's important, but it's still sub-10% of the overall revenue mix. and i think what we focus on is there's periods of price appreciation in crypto, bull runs and kind of winters. and in the bull runs, you tend to see a lot of retail engagement and excitement and volumes can tend to increase quite dramatically. but in other periods, we continue to invest. we're continuing to add functionality, we're expanding in the eu and there we have been tracking our market share. if our market share continues to increase during the winters, i think that positions the company very well to capture the lion's share of the activity during the bull runs. >> you sound a lot more aggressive than the analysts. if going after fidelity and schwab, you have $100 billion in assets. fidelity is $12.6 trillion.

they don't seem to be shaking in their boots in terms of robinhood coming for their client base. should they be worried at all, and will robinhood get to the trillion dollars of assets, what are you doing to make that happen? >> i would say that at first, nobody was really concerned when robinhood came out and offered commission free trades and no account minimums. they would say we don't want those accounts any way. our premium customers don't mind paying those commissions. and then you saw very quickly that narrative shifted and, you know, the industry was forced to adopt our business model largely. largely forced to adopt the user interface. there's a reason why every brokerage app that's relevant starts looking more and more like robinhood, right? so i think it's certainly -- the incentives are for them to koimd of ignore us taking assets, but

if we keep plugging away and continue to take share, they'll have to respond somehow. >> what is to keep them from responding in the way that you guys have offered incentives to take market share and to offer a 1% match, things like that? couldn't they do the same thing? you kicked off the brokerage price war. what if they adapt and try to steal market share back? >> i think they will try limited things, but offering 1% matches or% m 3% matches when you have 5 trillion in assets can get quite expensive. it puts a lot of pressure on the financials. so it's a little bit of, yeah, it's a little bit of the inknow -- innovators dilemma there. >> have you seen the movie? >> i watched some clips of it. >> what did you think? >> i think that -- i think that

the story of -- the real story of robinhood via the pulitzer prize winning, oscar winning narrative has yet to be told. so yeah, hopefully someone will figure out how to tell the true story and maybe the book and the movie will do a little bit better in the marketplace. >> we'll see. great to see you in person. brian, back over to you. >> kate, have you seen the movie, kate? i have not. >> i hate to say it, i haven't seen it. >> i'm in it. >> it's on my list. >> apparently i'm in it or my voice is in it. people keep pinging me telling me i just watched "dumb money." >> sarah mentioned this morning that he should have won an oscar. i'm with her. >> i want a slice of that. kate rooney, thank you. i guess my voice is in it

because it's so melodious. robinhood is a disrupter 50/50 company. we are accepting nominations for companies that are changing the game. scan that qr code on your screen or go to cnbc.com/disrupters. nearly a trillion dollars of commercial real estate debt set to mature this year. we'll talk to don peebles about some of the biggest risks now and some of the opportunities out. there plus, we're talking crude, computing, and crinkle cut prize, all part of "the exchange," coming up. ♪♪ at cdw we get your teams work in different places, in different ways and across countless different networks. so how do you get everyone on the same page? microsoft surface devices, orchestrated by cdw. they adapt to each user

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america's most reliable 5g network. sure is a lot safer than becoming a stuntman for money. get a free line of unlimited intro for a year when you buy one unlimited line. plus, get the new samsung galaxy s24 on us. welcome back to "the exchange." some more worrying signs, like we needed more, in the commercial real estate space this week. new data from the mortgage bankers association showing commercial loans this year swelled over $900 billion, a jump of 40% from the earlier estimate of $659 billion. many loans set to mature last year were extended to 2024, this year, and 2025, which is next year. those now need refinancing, or a

sale at disappoints. richard was on "squawkbox" earlier today sharing a bleak outlook. >> people have lost confidence, and that's why there's no liquidity, no transactions occurring. even the stress funds have not been that active yet, because they don't know what anything is worth. but at the same time, this is not going to be a moment in time where everything blows up. it's just going to be kind of a dull pain that continues in the system. >> times are tough for the industry, but it's something our next guest has experienced before and thinks relief will come, not from the banks but from the private credit industry. joining us is don peebles, m. don, this rolling real estate apocalypse has not come upon us yet, en masse. certainly some buildings. we have talked about this a lot.

right now, can you figure out the value of a building? i read an article this morning. one of the problems is nobody seems to know what a lot of these buildings should be worth. >> well, i mean, i guess richard's xhecomments, and rich is certainly pessimistic about the market. i'm pessimistic about office buildings as well, but i don't think the reason we're not seeing activity is because people don't understand value. i think we have a good handle on the value of many of these buildings. if you operate from the perspective that office occupancy is changed forever, until something else shocks the system, probably decades from now, we're going to have a hybrid workforce. so that has had a major impact on office buildings. this is different than the early '90s, because the banks don't have overleverage. they are 60% of the value of those assets when they made the loans. so they can take a 40% hit in

value and not be hurt. it's the equity that's wiped out, and the banks just don't want to deal with all of these headaches. they were hoping things would change. they're not. so we'll begin to see more asset sales happening mid year into the third and fourth quarters, where we'll see a lot of activity, i think, in terms of commercial office buildings. >> i heard a crazy story from a good friend of mine, somebody you probably know but i won't say his name on air. he told me a story that i thought was insane, but i can't prove it. you probably can. which is you tell me the story about a new york city building, say it was bought for $700 a square foot, and it's in distress and they told the building for $350 a square foot. the guy that bought it lost half his value, but in the real estate transaction, new york city valued the building at $703

a square foot, even after the sale at half its value, because they have to pretend this is not happening for tax reasons, for tax revenue reasons. is that possible? >> yes, it is. in fact, i started in the real estate business as an appraiser and consultant. i built and owned the largest properties in washington, d.c. we prospered in the early '90s because the government was refusing to recognize the massive decline in commercial real estate that took place. so what's going to happen is the government is going to force property owners to sue them. and appeal their assessments and sue them to get their values lowered. and that's because they cannot afford the massive revenue loss. d.c. alone is going to be down $400 million in property tax revenue this year alone. >> but that's insane. i want our audience to

understand what you just said and you just confirmed. let's say a house valued at $500,000. they sell the house at $250,000 because they can't afford the $250,000 and they need to dump out, and whatever up to or state they live in, values the house at above $500,000, completely ignoring the reality of the situation, because they're desperate for tax money. i get why they're doing it, it's wrong, but i understand it, don. but is that kind of behavior going to dissuade sales because future buyers are like, i can't be on the hook for those taxes when i'm underpaying for a building. >> no, i don't think it will be. because what happens -- d.c. for example has about 170,000 particles they assess annually. about 5,000 appeals when we were in that business. commercial property owners will use the system, they're hire lawyers and work the system and get reductions.

it'sthe residential homeowners and small commercial property owners who can't avail themselves of the litigation process to get their properties down. so these governments will take a view of let's let everybody fight for their reductions, and we're going to hold value and new york, d.c. and others will have to do that or they will be almost insolvent. >> that to me is one of the most interesting stories. it shows you how needily d.c. and new york city are for money. not the case with miami, though. every time i go to miami, it's like warmer and there's a new building popping up or my buddy is opening a new restaurant, whatever it is. the growth of miami is just gobsmacking. >> yes, it is. when we came down to miami in 1997 and started developing the royal palm hotel, what we saw then was a city being built.

we're seeing a global city continuing to be built. it would be like going to new york city in the early 1900s and watching that city build and being a part of it. miami has a tremendous run ahead of it. it's going to catch its breath. things are going to slow down a little bit. but miami's got a great runway ahead of it. south florida does. great market there. >> but it will slow to your point. nothing goes up forever, or does it? >> miami will slow. we're seeing it now. on the residential side, miami is slowing down in terms of volume and prices are pulling back. the covid euphoria is over now, and now we're seeing a more stable and level environment, which is going to be good, because in order to get more for businesses, things have to stabilize a bit. >> i don't know if you can see me, i can see you. but i have to say, you have fantastic taste in ties.

go back and watch the segment. you'll understand what i'm getting at. >> thank you. i credit my wife. >> i think we have the same tie on, although yours is probably much nicer than nine. the 13 fs are trickling out. if you don't know what that is, it's the hedge funds come out every quarter and release their holdings. that's a much better way to say it. we have tiger global's latest filing. leslie, we also call it whale watching. >> i don't know if we tdubbed i whale watching, i don't know where that came from. but these are some of the largest managers equity long holdings, back dated to the end of the year. these are fourth quarter filings. so tiger globals came out a short while ago. they're reducing exposure to somce chinese names. they sold out of a position of alibaba, worth about $128 million at year end.

they all paired back. jd.com, holding about $250 million at the end of q4. also, tiger global did reduce exposure to big tech names, like alphabet, meta, and microsoft, as well as nvidia. could be a little profit taking there. but tiger did increase its stake in amazon by 24%. and it upped its stake in taiwan semi by 48%. also worth noting, a sizable slash in uber, paired back by 41%, and 30% respectively. and worth noting, brian, this was a comeback here in 2023 for tiger global. their firm was up about 29% in 2023. so kind of interesting to follow these moves and see what led to that performance. back to you. >> certainly is. leslie picker, thank you very much. i know we'll see you later on, because apparently i've got to

read a poem for so-called activist investors. i'm going to say, usually i just ignore the prompter and say what i want, but i have to read this. roses are red, violets are blue, do blocked deals attract you? again, folks, just reading here. all right. leslie picker knows the answer to that. she will join us to explain. meantime, a lot of buzz around disney lately after their announcements about taylor swift. nelson peltz calls it their spaghetti against the wall plan. saying disney's management may be a day late and a dollar short. >> it's not that i'm not satisfied. this company sells at a multiple of their pronouncements. they made these like this management team just came into office about a week and a half ago.

they have been here for 20 years. all of a sudden they have awakened and they want to start making all these announcements.

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welcome back to "the exchange," everybody. i'm tyler mathisen with your cnbc news update. house intel chairman mike rogers is warning of a serious national security threat without providing any details. rogers says he's asking joe biden to declassify all information about it, whatever it is. national security adviser jake sullivan expressed surprise at the statement, say thing is a briefing for congressional leaders already on the books for tomorrow. we shall see. arrests for illegal crossings on the u.s./mexico border fell by half in january, making it the lowest -- the third lowest month of joe biden's presidency. it's welcome news for the white house, as immigration is one of the biggest issues in this year's presidential campaign. thousands of porsche,

bentley and audi cars are impounded in u.s. ports after a supplier found a subcomponent that broke anti-force labor laws. according to the financial times, volkswagen has delayed delivery as it replaces the component that came from western china. volkswagen stressed it didn't know about the part's origin and notified u.s. authorities as soon as it was notified. brian, back to you. >> tyler mathisen, thank you. on deck, the action, the story, the trade on three key names ahead of their results. that's coming up. ameritrade is now part of schwab. bringing you an elevated experience, tailor-made for trader minds. go deeper with thinkorswim: our award-wining trading platforms. unlock support from the schwab trade desk, our team of passionate traders who live and breathe trading. and sharpen your skills with an immersive online education crafted just for traders.

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welcome back to "the exchange." we're going to go from the cloud to underground, and then we'll maybe get a burger, with the trades on kissco, occidental and shake shack. joining us is a cnbc contributor. great to have you on. you ready? we got three names to go through. >> i'm ready. thank you for having me on. >> let's start with cisco systems. it's been a rough go, this is formally the largest company in the world back in the day, and they are planning to restructure again, including possible

layoffs of thousands of employees. it's been a tough run. would you touch cisco now? >> we've been holding a position in cisco for a while, and you mentioned some of the areas that are struggling. but we look at the results of the company. they've been strong. the reason why we saw shares sell off is because of forward guidance. so when you look at it, they've been indicating that customers are taking a pause after a heavy flow of buying. so that has slowed down and they believe that will be transitory. so i think inves tors can wait. another thing i mentioned that is strong is they haven't seen a macro level change yet. they believe it's a smaller level change, and i think investors can stay in there for a bit. >> it always feels like cisco is kind of in the process of semi organizing constantly over the last 15 years. it will come up tonight, because

jim's got an interview with chuck robbins, ceo of cisco. that's tonight. stock two, occidental petroleum. it's been a tough run, but the massive chemicals business offers some insulation from oil uncertainty. the street listening for balance sheet details following their buyout of crown rock, but you are a selling here. >> i would pair it back here. this is something that's not really a focus of our portfolio. but you mentioned the ball hans sheet, that's one of the areas i've been looking at. that's the capital ratio, obviously a little higher, the higher leverage there. for shareholders looking for that strong cash flow to be put to good use for their purposes, whether it's buybacks or actually incrossing the dividends. so we look at the leverage being

used, that could be a hindrance. if you look at it from the risk perspective of prices for energy and oil, which has come down from their peak, if that trends upwards, can be another headwind. so for me, it's a pair back for me. >> and finally, burgers, apparently, are back. shake shack's investors have been making bacon. the stock has been hot with potential for margin expansion under new leadership. you like shake shack, and i'm assuming probably as a consumer and investor. >> consumer and investor, and this one would be my valentine for the day. if you look at it, the same store sales are trending in the right direction. and there's a consumer discretionary restaurant still holds demand there. so that's a positive sign. and you mentioned the margins, another reason they're able to do that is because they're implementing those kiosks. they're going to hope any keep

costs down when it comes to labor, and then hopefully beef prices subside, as well. the trading obviously a little bit of a higher size as far as valuation. but i think there's opportunities for investors to get it, especially with a pullback on earnings. >> thank you. have a great day. >> thank you, brian. coming up, carl icahn, next. see that? that's like the gap in my health insurance. gap in your health insurance? yeah, it didn't cover everything when i got hurt. good thing i had aflac. hmmm the cash i got from aflac helped pay for medical expenses, groceries, rent. it really helped close that gap. go, go, go! yay! go aflac! go duck! get help with expenses health insurance doesn't cover at aflac.com wish we had aflac on our team.

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call today or go to gentlecure.com. were you worried the wedding would be too much? nahhhh... (inner monologue) another destination wedding?? why can't they use my backyard!! with empower, we get all of our financial questions answered. so we don't have to worry. empower. what's next. we'll be right back. carl icahn revealing a nearly 10% stake in jet blue earlier this yeek, but it's not the ownership that caught our attention but the timing. he started buying a week after the merger with spirit airlines was blocked. leslie picker is back, exploring whether the current anti-trust environment is sparking more activist style activity. puns aside, leslie, what did you find out? >> you're right, deals can create a breeding ground or

activists. carl icahn started building up his stake after a judge blocked the $4 billion acquisition of spirit. jetblue's stock plummeted 44%, representing an opportunity for carl icahn to get in. once ownership was revealed, shares surged 22% yesterday alone, although giving some of that back today. but it's a case study how broken deals is becoming more common in the regulatory environment and can be fodder for activists. there are a few other examples of this. last year, the ftc found the $7 billion acquisition of grail to reduce competition. carl icahn had been critical of the pursuit of grail.

our own david faber reported a year ago that operation blizzard as it appeared its tieup with microsoft was faltering. to be sure, this is important. not every broken deal faces the activist ire, but when it leads to shareprice weakness, activists can see that as an opportunity. certainly, something to keep an eye on as we see a tighter and stricter regulatory environment. ryan. >> we shall see, and see what uncle carl wants to do with jetblue. leslie picker, thank you. more rhyme time, huey lewis style, because apparently, it's hip to be bear.

who knew? you will meet a fascinating company looking ctohange the way you view electric cars, and it all has to do with subscriptions. that is next. - i got the cabin for three days. it's gonna be sweet! what? i'm 12 hours short. - have a fun weekend.

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wireless that works for you. it's not just possible, it's happening. welcome back to the exchange. concerns about slowing ev demand ramping up on wall street. who could've seen that coming for, like the last two years? city trimming its ev forecast for the year.

morgan stanley's adam jonas, now says it's fashionable to be in ev bear. this company is called fin, fin, and it offers short-term subscriptions, 16 to 18 months for both traditional and electric cars. with 20,000 subscribers, around 40% have opted for evs. maximilian farris, thank you very much for joining us. does the service, in part, you want to make money, but in part, it's designed to help people understand the electric driving experience, because for those of us who have done it, it does have a bit of a learning curve. >> it definitely does, but once you have tried it, people tend to never switch back. we see a very strong option in our service, not only from -- specifically, ev cars.

people want to try out the technology without any of the risk. >> i have three friends that recently sold their evs and went back, but that aside, they all have unique circumstances. i'm looking here in the united states. i see a lot of gas-powered internal combustion engine cars, are you seeing an uptick in demand in the u.s. on the electric side, maximilian? >> absolutely. we've seen it both in europe and the u.s., even though in the u.s. it's more geographically dispersed. an environment where demand is significantly stronger in some states where -- versus others. the infrastructure still needs to be built out in the u.s. >> how are you different than a lease? >> so, you can go online to fin.com, get your car delivered in a couple of days, and then, everything is delivered to you and everything is taken care of for you. the maintenance, insurance, registration, all of that is

taken care of by us, and you can focus on the driving. >> are there mileage limitations? >> you can pick a mileage package that works for you, and we are flexible. typically, everybody finds a mileage package that works for them. with atypical subscription, 750 miles are already included, and you can opt for other packages. >> you are a german company, very heavy in germany, mostly on the east coast of the united states. i imagine you have growth ambitions. of the people picking the electric side, is tesla still the overwhelming choice, or are we finally starting to see the audis, the fourth of the world, the volkswagens of the world finally start to make a dent? >> there are two kinds of people. there are, basically, tesla ev drivers and non-tesla ev drivers. we expect the second group to grow significantly, and see a lot of interest in audi,

specifically, but also with ford, other brands. there is significant demand for mercedes. >> i said about a year ago, there are two types of people. nobody wants evs, they want tesla's, ecause tesla's are their own thing. they are not car people, necessarily. all of my buddies that own tesla's are tech forward people. they want the rich letter and all the dials and knobs, and they want to feel like they are driving, a "traditional car." they are different things. >> 100%. there are two kinds of people, and the tesla people definitely also want the whole customer experience associated with the superchargers, with the infrastructure that has been built up. we see, definitely, custom group that is quite loyal to tesla, and we also see a custom group that just want to get the best car for the best price. >> sorry to cut you off, my man, but the show is over.

it's over, so i appreciate it, maximilian for the company is called fin. that does it for the exchange. i will see right here at 7:00 p.m. for last call. power lunch is up next after this quick break. an office. hi! hello! a cinema. so automated. yes, the definition of a car changes... but one thing stays the same. it's a mercedes-benz. that first time you take a step back. i made that. with your very own online store. i sold that. and you can manage it all in one place. i built this. and it was easy, with a partner that puts you first. godaddy.

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coventry direct, redefining insurance. (fisher investments) at fisher investments we may look like other money managers, but we're different. (other money manager) how so? (fisher investments) we're a fiduciary, obligated to act in our client'' best interest. (fisher investments) so we don't sell any commission-based products. (other money manager) then how do you make money? (fisher investments) we have a simple management fee, structured so we do better when our clients do better. (other money manager) your clients really come first then, huh? (fisher investments) yes. we make them a top priority, by getting to know their finances, family, health, lifestyle and more. (other money manager) wow, maybe we are different. (fisher investments) at fisher investments, we're clearly different. good afternoon, everybody and welcome to power lunch. i am tyler mathisen, i'm glad you could join us. stocks reacting to the worst day in