the making, but the nikkei is back at record levels. do you believe it took 34 years? it's thursday, february 22nd, 2024 "squawk box" begins right now. good morning welcome to "squawk box" here on cnbc we are live from the nasdaq market site in times square. i'm andrew ross sorkin along with joe kernen. becky is out today we have so much to discuss three hours of nvidia. is that the plan >> coming after an hour of nvidia which i was just watching >> look at futures at this hour powered by nvidia. surging after the results. we will get to that in a moment. the dow would open up 120

points nasdaq up 360 points s&p is up 60 points. look at treasury yields. ten-year note at 4.3%. two-year note at 4.662%. over overnight, joe mentioned the nikkei topped 39,000 the previous record was 38,515 was reached 34 years ago. >> i can do the math 1990 >> a lot of folks have been waiting a long time for that >> we don't want to do anything like that. we have seen it. we can see what can happen it was ahead of itself, obviously, but a lot of issues over the past. they have to have some kids over there. that's number one. that is stagnating. >> what do you think about nvidia ahead of itself? >> i don't know. i'm doing the math we will talk to our analyst in a

second i was doing the math it is not quite a 15% gain today. a look at nvidia this is the new high chipmaker topping profit and sales expectations up almost 100 points another 14%. the market cap at the close yesterday was $1.68 trillion it went over $1 trillion if you add 14% to $1.68 trillion, you are not that far from $2 trillion it got there fast. revenue. this is not normal more than $22 billion. that is tripling of revenue year over year in that quarter. 265% increase on strength of the a.i. business. the company projected better thanexpected revenue for the current quarter. lifting taiwan semi and asml and super micro. all trading higher jon fortt sat down with the

nvidia ceo jensen huang. he talked about the enterprise software companies which are the ones driving demand for nvidia's technology >> what will happen is the world's enterprise software platforms represents $1 trillion that $1 trillion represents service now and it represents data platforms like snowflake and box and s.a.p. and oracle these data platforms will be r revolutionized the way to think about that is simple the platforms used to be tools that experts learn to use. in the future,s tools companies offer a.i. agents to hire to use the tools.

>> you can see more of the interview with jon on "closing bell overtime. joining us now is chris from wolfe. every time you turn around, you have to raise it where were you six months ago, ch chris? do you remember your target six months ago >> it's been moving higher it has been the top pick for some time now. it is hard to keep up with numbers when they are moving this fast. another very good report with good upside to the numbers you know, what's extraordinary about it is that they are doing that without the full impact from china which was impacted by the trade restrictions that dropped 20% of revenue to

5% of revenue because of the trade restrictions now they have a new product out and that should start to contribute in the second half as well you know, even on the very good numbers, there is still supply constrain and still a demand that hasn't been addressed >> the company said they will make more and they will satisfy more of the demand when does that reach an equil equilibrium? does it? are we so early that the demand continues? is it a matter of years that the demand continues to outstrip supply the numbers will keep going up or could it be this year where we are making enough to make this transformation? >> this is always an issue with semiconductors the lead time to procure new

capacity is on order of a year it was about a year ago that chatgpt came out in the open and we realized what a big deal that was and it fueled the buying frenzy here. you know, as you get into the second half of the year, there will be more supply. what they said on the call is they have a new product coming out at the end of the year it is popular because it has more performance and that is what people want the people want the product at the end of the year to be tight as well. the other factor is and i think this has been the biggest factor in terms of how much the individual numbers are going up is pricing is going up semi conductors for the last 0 ye 30 years, pricing comes down the difficulty of the cost of making semiconductors is on the last chip, the price tripled

the performance went up ahead of the orders that is the magic of a.i the price is going up, but the performance is going up a lot more and it is a great the value proposition with the hyper scale customers buying it. >> we're not there, but we might as well be you know it never gets -- are we there? >> i think more probably it's slowing. >> maybe we never get there. >> you don't get the same reduction in cost per tran

transistor >> they make too many and we get a glut and pricing would collapse could that ever happen where are we here? are we warming up before the game still with a.i. are they just coming out on the field? are we in the second inning? >> you know, the best analogy i could find is the tech bubble in the late '90s we both lived through. i think a.i. is so transformative that at one point you can't say there's not a bubble here. at some point that could very much happen because you have so much money coming into it. you know what happened in the tech bubble and what bust the bubble is bad ideas. bad money chasing everything i think that probably happens with a.i. as well. the question i ask is is it 1997 for 1999 i feel it is closer to 1997.

>> chris, you had the bubble burst because software companies and not just software companies, but web sites that grew up on top of the physical infrastructure and then the physical infrastructure play which was for the companies that was overvalued and overinveoverd i wonder if there is a bubble here, who gets hit first >> it is a tough one to call right now, two things. one is you are not satisfying all demand every cloud customer on the show is claiming i can't get enough chips and i need to invest more. for the time being, the next year or two years or so, i think we're okay because we're still finding out what the real level of demand is and they are in shortage right now the difference between now and

late '90s is valuations. nvidia is now at 27 times my number that is a far cry from the '90s. for a stock that has posted such growth for so long, this is not new for them they have been doing 50% annual growth for some time now even before chatgpt frenzy started. you know, they are generating real cash. there is real earnings and real growth there is a real multiple in the stock right now. >> thatt expression that no tree grows in the sky i think this tree has made it. if it gets to 900, then we have to get rid of that expression. nvidia in the last two or three years has grown to the sky it will be $3 trillion

eventu eveneve even eventually >> i remember, joe, having that conversation years ago with apple when apple passed $1 trillion that was -- there was real earnings with apple at the time. there is real earnings with nvidia now. >> there is. chris, thank you chris caso we will check back with you. yesterday, our friend -- >> which one >> we have a lot tom lee. do you remember what he said >> sitting right there >> i can see his silhouette. his aura is still there. do you remember what he said about nvidia i was the one talking to him at that point he said that right now the perception is it has gone up so much that there is profit taking before the numbers are coming out because it is normal i have a feeling nvidia will post numbers that are well above

what anyone was expecting and it will give back all of what it is losing today he has a feel for a lot of different stocks. >> he is a smart guy >> a lot about sentiment as a market watcher who knows a good batting average in the business? you can win a battle title the at .330. >> yes, you can. coming up, we will talk about rivian it is feeling a power train. the company slashing jobs and the forecast we will talk about what happens after this. we are waiting on results from moderna stephane bceanl will join us at 6:0 a.m. eastern time. >> announcer: this cnbc program is sponsored by baird. visit bairddifference.com. wh? these straps are mind-blowing!

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then stephane bancel will join us at 6:50 a.m. eastern time the weekly job report is released at 8:30 a.m. eastern time then this. over to you. i know they always look happy to me. >> i like these cars. >> rivian. they look like thomas the tank engine who is mad some of the characters were mad on thomas. the rivian shares are happy, but not this morning >> cars look happy shareholders don't. >> not happy the cars are happy shareholders are not the ev maker laying off 10% of the salary work force. new truck and suv output is flat this year. the ceo blaming challenging macroeconomics conditions and higher interest rates making monthly vehicle payments more expensive. he will join us live at 8:15

a.m. eastern time. you know, people are still worried. who was talking about this yesterday later in the day li leslie people think about renting ev. there is anxiety about that. you don't know exactly where you will have to stop and how long -- >> on the rental. >> on the rental in general when you buy one, you have the same anxiety you think it is really macroeconomics after what we have seen in evs for the last year, you don't think this has to do with the general issue? the transformation to ev is not going smoothly right now. >> 100% agree with you i do think the idea that evs are a major part of the rental

fleets early on is a tough one because the magic of ev is that you put it in the garage and have the charger in the garage you are hardly ever charging it at a station somewhere if you are renting it, by default, you have to use public infrastructure >> you have solar panels on the roof charging the ev maker in the garage and also your generator in case the power goes out. you are green everywhere and your neighbors are saying what a great person that individual is. >> i know. >> i wouldn't be saying that >> i know you would not. >> what a virtuous -- it is the domain of losers i try not do it. i want to be a winner. royal caribbean shares are

moving higher. cruise line raising guidance on the demand and bookings. the first five weeks of the year have been the strongest seasonal bookings in the company's history. we had someone on who had a rivian some people love them. they did not like it. >> "consumer reports" is critical of them very critical. >> i like them because they make me smile they make me happy don't they >> are you dripping with sarcasm? >> no, they he look alive from the front. they look alive. they look like my owner loves me i'm fun. i have a tent. a rivian tent. this is fun. the ringling bros. and barnum & bailey is making changing under the tent. we will talk to the ceo of feld entertainment next >> elephants

>> no. >> as we head to break, check out the shares of nvidia "squawk box" is coming right back at ameriprise financial our advice is personalized based on your goals, >> announcer: "squawk planner" is sponsored by ameriprise financial. looks like you can make this work. we can make this work. and the feeling of confidence that comes from our advice... i can make this work. that seems to be universal. i can make this work. i can make this work. no wonder more than 9 out of 10 clients are likely to recommend us. because advice worth listening to is advice worth talking about. ameriprise financial. trading at schwab is now powered by ameritrade, unlocking the power of thinkorswim, the award-winning trading platforms. bring your trades into focus on thinkorswim desktop with robust charting and analysis tools, including over 400 technical studies. tailor the platforms to your unique needs with nearly endless customization.

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and i think that's where the power of tiktok lies. if you save one person, that's one more person that can change the world too. right? ♪♪ welcome back to "squawk box. you won't see elephants or tigers or lions, but after a seven-year break, feld entertainment is back and reima reimagining ringling bros. and barnum & bailey. we have kenneth feld here with more >> good morning. >> i grew up on the show i loved the elephants.

i'll say it loud and proud what are you doing now >> we re-launch ed ringling bros and barnum & bailey. we are opening in brooklyn tonight at barclays. the show is completely different. it is reimagined for audiences today and tomorrow >> what does that mean >> it means that the scale is larger than ever and when you go in and look at what we have, it is different you will not go in and think of the preconceived idea. it is different. it is really like the ultimate playground we have 75 performers from 18 countries. what they're doing is extraordinary. what we want is people in today's world to have simple fun. that's what this is. we're non-lingual. everybody can enjoy it and it

creates conversation on the way home the new ringling bros. and barnum & bailey has the great pace and acts are extraordinary and performers it is something inspiring for young kids people can do all this stuff and it is amazing and it gives them hope >> this is more human stunt base than anything else is that fair to say? >> it is more than just that it is the sense of humor it is the feeling and excitement and it doesn't exist any place else that's the key it is unique when you go into ringling bros. and barnum & bailey, there is nong nothing else like it that is the way we have done it. people are excited since the beginning of the year, we played not just with ringling, but people want to go out. over 1 million people every week

since the beginning of the year. >> clowns are okay, aren't they? >> humor is good >> no clowns why did clowns get canceled? >> scare people with white, crazy makeup and red noses >> you can do dogs, couldn't you? dogs are happy to do those tricks >> we have a dog we have a robotic dog. >> put on the apple thing and put on elephants >> i'm fascinated by trying to put up a new production like this and where you find these performers from and how much you have to pay them and the cost of the arenas has gone up astronomically since you last were doing this. i assume you are competing for talent and other things with the cirque du soleils of the world

how does the big work? >> we are in the entertainment business we have disney on ice. we havhave jurassic world. we have monster jam. we have ringling bros. and barnum & bailey. we have supercross we are in every venue across and we play in 80 countries. we are around the world, but in all of the venues and stadiums and arenas we plan ahead. we are family business we are looking five and ten years ahead and booking venues that far in advance. if you think of the concerts that go out today, they're booking a year or two and they won't go out for three years for different things the venues can count on us to be there and it is the same time every year because people have habits of when they want to go that's what we do and we are

used to touring large entertainment that's unique. >> how elastic is the price? it feels in the post-covid world with the yolo effect, there is premium tier ticket pricing. >> there is dynamic pricing. that is great. you can have $150 vip experience or you can go and see ringling bros. and barnum & bailey for $20. our key is we want all families everywhere we bring the entertainment to your town and that's really the key of all -- >> what is the most popular? >> ringling is popular monster jam is popular. >> is there one thing right now? >> post-covid with everything off the charts last year was the biggest year we had this year is comparable to it. people want to go out.

i think they want to go and experience something live. it is tactile. you can see it the memories you have from a live experience last a lot longer than the memories from a movie. >> will you tell your joke >> please. >> you have to tell your joke. it was toby tyler. ten weeks with the circus. the orphan runs and joins the circus >> i wanted to run away and join a home >> that's a good one >> that's why i'm not in the comedy business. >> the lady with the big horns is gone? you don't have freaks and geeks left >> excuse me >> you don't have any crazy -- remember the circus? >> we have things people want to see today. they don't know they want to see it >> it is way too woke, ken come on. it is a lot easier than

transporting the animals around on the train that was a logistical nightmare. >> the mile-long train for each show you talk about that. >> the margin is better as a result of not having the animals? >> you know, we just opened six months ago with this we created it knowing what the business model we had. the great thing is people are coming and they are coming in greater numbers than ever. >> they are telling us we have to go. thank you. >> thank you >> ken feld. we have to update everything, andrew. coming up, waiting for results from moderna we will have the numbers as soon as they are released the u.s. is waiting on cybersecurity on the ports and borders. that's next. as we head to break, this is the

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moderna just released results of 55 cents a share. analysts expected a loss of 97 cents a share. not hard to figure out with the loss of sales for covid-19 vaccines it is confirming the sales outlook and looks at the regulatory approval of the rsv vaccine in the first half of 2024 the ceo stephane bancel will join us at 6:50 a.m. eastern time. in the meantime, the biden administration is boosting cybersecurity at port infrastructure and establishing the new maritime security director is joining us

she was the first woman to serve as the chief information officer for the white house. thank you for joining us there have been lots of concerns about what technology we have been using at the ports and how secure they are. how secure are they? >> there's a lot of concerns with the complexity of the operations and technology. in fact, a lot of people may not realize the ship-to-port cranes are built in china and not in the united states and not other nations that build these types of cranes. there is a lot of concerns of remote access and remote control and whether or not there could be a type of future escalation of conflict with us and china with some disruption of operations >> is there anything we identified, genuinely, to suggest there are or the chinese government has the ability to hack into or built trap doors,

if you will, into the cranes and other technology at the ports? >> i appreciate you asking this question we do know that a japanese port did have issues. we also do know that the fbi has done a very thoughtful research report and report out by fbi director christopher wray talking about the near and present dangers. what is known about the chinese capabilities here are not going to be shared with the general public because we don't want to tip our hands to other cyber criminal groups who want to conduct mayhem on the port operations if fbi director christopher wray says there is an issue, i'm going to listen to him and take heed >> what do you think more generally the security issues are at the ports right now are we spending enough money or not spending enough money to

secure our ports >> we are spending a tremendous amount of money. there are great lessons learned to be taken from the smaller level to the larger level. los angeles sports ports stood e operations there is a lot of increases there. as a world, we have been spending an estimate from cyber crime magazine of $1.75 trillion over the last five years to protect all critical infrastructure, not just port infrastructure i wish the news was better despite the money that has been spent, the improvements made, that the cyber criminals are improving their tactics, so we need a playbook for not if they attack the ports, but when they attack the worse are they resilient >> what is your answer to that today? >> some of the ports would struggle the good news is there is a lot

of thought processes put into this and a lot of practice -- >> which ports are most vulnerable >> i don't want to name any specific locations what i would say it is known that the more complexity in the operations, the easier it is for nation states and cyber criminals to hide. the more complex in operation, the more challenging it is to protect despite your best efforts. this is where the playbook of practicing for when the disaster happens and how resilient are we and recoverable and the call treat. that is the next step to take. the work the biden administration is doing right now is critical and vital, but it doesn't erase the realities today. >> theresa, thank you for bringing this topic to our attention and hope folks in

washington are paying attention as well. thank you. when we come back, more here on "squawk box." sam altman with more on the reports of seeking funding for the chip development we will talk about it next black-owned businesses grew almost 5% from 2019 to 2020 according to the recent government data. that is lower than hispanic and ai asian american business. experts say more action is needed to celebrate these add advantesag celebrating black heritage i'm sharon epperson. >> announcer: currency check is sponsored by interactive brokers. the best informed investors choose interactive brokers

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welcome back to "squawk box. sam altman is setting the record straight speaking with intel ceo pat gelsinger, he said tonight pay too don't pay too much attention to the numbers. they will be big if he had to correct every report in the media, he would not be able to do his job. perhaps some of the numbers that started with a "t" were a little too much i would say watch this space i think he is going to be in the chip business. >> we try to pitch in with the mistakes we do our part coming up, moderna reporting results.

you know what? i can't do things like that. results just moments ago stephane bancel is with us on the quarter and we hope we would not have to say the word covid because they have a lot going on vain cancer cces we already did "squawk box" is coming up. >> announcer: executive edge is sponsored by at&t business next level moments need the next level network. of cyber each year. that rate is increasing as more and more businesses move to the cloud. - so, the question is... - cyber attack! as cyber criminals expand their toolkit, we must expand as well. we need to rethink... next level moments, need the next level network. [speaker continues in the background] the network with 24/7 built-in security. chip? at&t business.

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moderna shares are trading higher following the quarterly results. joining us is the moderna ceo. someone we have been talking to for years. stephane bancel. i knew we would have to talk about covid a little, stephane it was my wish we could get through the interview without talking about it we can't that is how things work. you are in the world where, you

know, one of your main revenue drivers is no longer there you have to find new ways of running the company. your stock is up today to over 90 i think where was the high somewhere above 400 or almost 500 at one point, stephane how do you manage a company worth $30 billion and $150 billion? >> good morning, joe the chance we have is the platform there is so much more to moderna than covid that is what we are excited about. this year is going to be the first year where people outside the company start to see a different moderna. the platform you are highly aware of because you have been following the company for many years is rsv productivity and we communicated the fda approval is expected in the spring

we are known in europe and asia and other countries. that is exciting we have a very come ppetitive product with a good safety profile. i think it will be a good difference in the marketplace if it is approved for pharmacists and other approved for pharmacies and healthcare professionals because it comes in -- the two products currently on the market are very cumbersome to prepare, they can lead to medical errors and as you know, pharmacies and hospitals have a shortage as there have been strikes in the pharmacies in the fall because in the fall season, pharmacies are already busy to deal with the regular business, and they have to do flu vaccination, covid vaccination, rsv vaccination, so very busy. we think we're going to bring a new product and i can't wait to launch it. in addition to that, we have a

very, very important new pipeline we showed positive data for the program, we should file it this year for potential launch in '25. we're expecting now very soon the data for next gen covid product, mr 1283 and we should go the flu-covid combo product and that could launch in '25 if you think about '24 and '25, we're going to get the company back into sales growth, we're going to get to profitability and we're very excited about all the products we can give to patients. >> stephane, looking out a year, two years, five years, your platform, just the messenger rna technology that you've helped pioneer, do you see that generating more vaccines that

you can be very nimble in terms of upgrading -- basically upgrading the software for each different strain or do you eventually see it more with your cancer vaccine development is it equal? and then that begs the question, can -- will a.i. eventually determine some of the things you can do with your platform in terms of mrna? >> so those are all great questions, joe first, we are platform company, so why we started with vaccine as you said, we are so excited about our cancer treatment as you know it is an individualized treatment we shared on your program back in december that we are showing long-term efficacy three-year survival data, people with melanoma will benefit with no occurrence of disease

so i believe vaccine is going to become a very important cornerstone of the company liquid biopsy, the ability to detect cancer very early in a blood draw, is going to help people get cancer detected earlier and as we all know, early prevention is a key to very high outcome. and we believe because of our technology, basically, teaches your immune system the mutation of your cancer cell, the cancer has been growing, we believe earlier we're going to go in cancer development the higher efficacy is going to be. we have to prove it, of course, but that's what we believe scientifically i believe oncology could in a few years become more to nowhere than infectious disease vaccine. the infectious disease will be very big, sooner in the 10 billion plus sales for the franchise, but cancer is going

to be more another piece, we should this year go into late stage last study in several rare disease, there is no medicine for that today. we think we'll change care there. and then on we get inhaling through the lungs, we believe it should be applicable to disease and that data could come out this year. it will be a very exciting year. >> stephane, before we go, can you just reference to this day we still, social media sees questions about the -- whether there were a lot of negative side effects for some of the messenger rna vaccines and i'm trying to figure it out exactly when you offset how many lives were saved because covid was not

as serious for most people after you got either the pfizer or moderna, whatever vaccine you happen to get. some were maessenger rna do you have any concern about the side effect profile or is it about what you would expect for a new technology >> if you look at the data, and there was a recent paper published on more than 100 million lives, it confirmed the same things, the side effect profile is what you see in vaccines, in a bit of fatigue, or some chills for some people some people don't have side effects. if you look at safety, the safety is very, very strong. there has been cases reported of, you know, heart information, mostly in young men, which we should not discount too quickly the risk of covid, joe if you look at the data of this season, the chance of an elderly 65 and above to get the -- because of covid is ten times

higher than flu. and what still is sad is you see a lot of people getting the flu shot, and not getting the mrna shot why if you are very, very young you might think you have low risk, but we should look at long covid. i know a lot of young scientists that getting the booster shot, not because they are worried of getting -- but they are worried about long covid 16 million americans had or have long covid 4 million americans right now out of jobs because of long covid, and we all know people that had long covid. and it is terrible on the quality of life. so i think we should not discount too quickly the impact of this virus. >> and i think a lot of the people that you see out in front sort of criticizing if there were some other outbreak of something and there was a messenger rna vaccine, they

would be the first in line to, you know, if it was -- think of something even more serious than covid. i think we need to obviously keep things in perspective stephane, we're out of time. but good to have you on this morning. good luck. thanks >> thank you okay coming up, nvidia dominating the headlines this morning the stock soaring after a xthow t quarter. ne, the chipmaker is powering the a.i. ecosystem. "squawk box" coming back with that and more. two big hours ahead after this a! whoo! ♪♪ these guys are intense. we got nothing to worry about. with e*trade from morgan stanley, we're ready for whatever gets served up. dude, you gotta work on your trash talk. i'd rather work on saving for retirement. or college, since you like to get schooled. that's a pretty good burn, right? got him. good game. thanks for coming to our clinic, first one's free.

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when you partner with barclays, every change leads to a bold possibility. you have the vision. we have the insights, financial solutions and global perspectives to help you make it real. barclays corporate and investment bank powering possible. good morning the blockbuster report from nvidia taking center stage for investors this morning a breakdown of the quarter and the demand for a.i., it is all straight ahead. and reading the tea leaves

of the fed minutes and what investors should take away from the post meeting statement fed officials expressing caution about lowering rates too quickly. plus, with its new $60 billion in congressional funding, the irs is more than doubling audits on the wealthy you got exclusive comments from the irs chief about where he's focused on next. those of you with private planes, watch out, as the second hour of "squawk box" begins right now. good morning and welcome back to "squawk box" here on cnbc, live from the nasdaq market site in times square. i'm joe kernen along with andrew ross sorkin. thank god we didn't buy that jet, you know what i mean? they're looking at private jets.

>> i didn't buy with you yeah >> thank god >> thank god >> so you -- >> i went with another group no, i didn't. >> here are the futures right now, but thank god we didn't, right? like we were close >> close >> so close. >> look at the nasdaq! look at the nasdaq that's not -- >> one stock. >> you don't see that every day. >> that's a big percentage gain right now. the nasdaq that's helping the dow as well all the chip stocks are up let's look at the treasuries ten-year, just waiting for the next data point to see what happens. 4.31 is above where we were a month or six weeks ago when we were sure that we were going to get some cuts. maybe three, maybe four, maybe six, maybe seven now i don't -- would you get on any. i don't know end of the year, couple. >> were we betting on -- the market was, jamie dimon was not.

>> no. now i think because no one predicted -- you see alan byner? >> yes. >> done. >> mission accomplished with the soft landing anything that happens now is something different. that scares me right? >> let's talk about the story of the morning, nvidia, shares soaring in the premarket, earningearn ings beating expectations. the company continues to see a boost from its excitement, all the excitement over a.i. and artificial intelligence. the ceo jensen huang saying he expects continued growth in the coming years take a listen. >> what's going to happen is the world's enterprise software platforms represent approximately a trillion dollars. the trillion dollars represent most platforms like service now. it represents data platforms like snowflake, dropbox, box, sap, oracle. these application oriented

platforms and data oriented platforms are all going to be revolutionized with these a.i. agents that sit on top of it and the way to think about that is very simple the platforms used to be tools that experts would learn to use. in the future, these tools, companies, will also offer a.i. agents that you can hire to help you use these tools or to help you reduce the barrier of using these tools. >> the results pouring over into the chip sector, fueled by excitement in a.i. demand. look at the stocks up across the board. supermicro up, arm holdings up as well. joining us more for more on the a.i., growth stage investor and enterprise tech and a.i., where are we in this -- if we're playing baseball, where are we in the cycle, where are we in the game >> first of all, thanks so much

for having me on, andrew it is a pleasure to be here. i think we're still early on in the game there is a lot of excitement, great for me to come on the show right after the blockbuster earnings, because nvidia in many ways is the bellwether for a.i. demand, for gen a.i. demand in particular in this industry. there is going to be a lot of investor appetite and continue to be, but frankly, you know, there will be significant funds to deploy and will be deployed, so based on what we're seeing in the market today, i think it might be prudent to take a measured approach. it is a very, very fast adoption cycle. faster than we have ever seen from any platform shift. and very often it is not the first or second or even third wave of companies that make it and i think there is still a lot to be proven, particularly on the b to b application side of things. >> when you say on the b to b application side of things, give me some examples of how you

think that plays out >> i think there is a couple of things right now a lot of the value in these private companies are accruing to the infrastructure companies, right these are the companies that are running the foundational models and these are also some of the companies like nvidia, like openai, that are powering all the applications that sit on top of it. as well as all the other companies that sit on top of it. from the application side, right, there are a lot of things that have to be proven out we're seeing a lot of companies get tremendous growth right off from the start, but they haven't really crafted something that is super important. and that's user retention, right? a lot of these companies are still figure out their business models, still figuring out how to hook users and keep users on the platform and until we see more stabilization there, i think there is going to be a lot of movement around what companies survive, and what companies might get -- >> do you put yourself in --

now, the data here, is this 1996, which means there is still a lot of room to run is it '99? there was, if you remember, back in the day, on the infrastructure side, you could argue an overbuild in the late '90s in telecommunications, in some of the different tech hardware platforms at the time and all the software, websites and other things being built upon it, but 20 years later, you look back and say, yeah, that all happened, but look where we are today. so, how do you see that? >> that's such a great question, andrew the compression, right, if we think back to the dotcom era, there was a great run on investment between 1996 and 1999 what i would argue is those three years have now been compressed down. take chatgpt, right? it took chatgpt two months to reach 100 million users.

that's just staggering we're still early on, but it could be 1998 versus 1996 in my opinion. >> if you could invest in this space right now, would you stick with an nvidia just because there is so much demand and that demand is going to persist, or do you say, values move -- every time people said there is an over valued company, they have been wrong, or do you say there is other places you can play in that are, i don't know if they're value plays, but where the market hasn't fully recognized where the opportunity is >> well, i'm a private investor, i would say, you know, for institutional investors and retail investors out there, nvidia does feel like a safe place for money right now. however, if you're looking into the private markets, i think there is a lot of opportunity to invest in really exciting companies. again, proceed with caution. but on the private market side, you're getting this interesting dynamic because when you're

investing in private companies, venture capital perspective, you are buying preferred shares, right? so these are shares that get paid out first, and you're getting this interesting dynamic where your downside risk might be to get your money back. it is a 1x times your money, but the upside risk is 10x or maybe more it depends on your risk tolerance. >> okay, cathy, great to see you. thank you for joining us as we try to make sense of the numbers and where all of this goes next. thank you. >> thank you so much. coming up, donors keep pouring millions of dollars into nikki haley's long shot campaign and now she's attracting thousands who gave to president joe biden back in 2020 in that campaign outraising former president trump for the month of january we'll talk all about it after the break. le> and then later, reading the tea aves of the fed minutes and what it means for investors.

we're coming right back. (grunting) at morgan stanley, old school hard work >> announcer: this cnbc program is sponsored by baird. visit bairddifference.com. (laughter) at 88 years old, we still see the world with the wonder of new eyes, helping you discover untapped possibilities and relentlessly working with you to make them real. old school grit. new world ideas. morgan stanley.

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nikki haley is -- says she's staying in the 2024 race despite trailing former president trump and this is fueled by a $16.5 million fund-raising haul in january, from some big donors. joining us now is puck's teddy slifer i understand, i see, i read "the wall street journal" op-ed pages, she points out, governor haley, points out that there were 15 people at the beginning of this, all announcing that to try to get the gop nomination. now there's one. now there's one.

and i don't know how many potential legal issues are remaining and how that plays out for trump, but if you're the last person standing, you might as well stay in, and i think that's what don'terors are thing too. it is that simple. >> sure. the haley campaign over the last few days has been really stressing that they do not see the south carolina primary this weekend as the be all and end all event for nikki haley's campaign they're going to say that and not talk about herself explicitly as an insurance plan against, you know, a trump legal catastrophe. but donors will. donors will tell you that privately, the haley bet, at this point in the cycle, is not all about her winning the election or winning the primary through normal means a lot of this has to do with the belief that who knows what is going to happen in a trial in may or june or july, and wouldn't you rather be the person who is still running for president of the united states

than not >> yeah. exactly. there is a lot of, i don't know, a lot of side benefits that go along with that. people will follow you along, you'll be very important i understand that. but the numbers don't lie and we know what's happening probably in south carolina. >> sure. >> the crazy thing, teddy, is that in this surreal, bizarro world we're living in, we have got a crazy similar narrative on the other side because yesterday we had a guy come on, who actually said gavin newsom is not liberal and in fact he's doing a great job on homelessness and crime in california i still see articles that michelle oh definitely waiting in the wings so both sides are doing cya because the nominees, the presumptive nominees are so unpalatable to most americans. it is bizarre. >> i think what's different is

the republican donor world is actively preparing for a possibility that donald trump is not the republican nominee and the democratic donor world, that is not the case. i think there is lots of wish casting, lots of major givers who, you know, acknowledge in private moments that joe biden has, you know, an age problem obviously. and that joe biden may not be the strongest democratic nominee, but i -- >> he's it you think he's it? >> yeah. >> i'm not convinced i'm not convinced. there could be -- i don't know the same type of legal catastrophe you talk about on the trump side, we'll see how the state of the union goes, we'll see what he can muster, maybe they'll main line some prevagen, but people in the know, they know in their heart of hearts, they know this guy should probably not be the nominee. >> maybe but i think the donor and establishment more broadly is

commit at this point the time for democratic party elders to discuss whether or not joe biden was the best nominee was in 2022. it was in may 2023 it is february 2024. the democratic convention is in a few months i don't think there is any serious efforts to be made to -- >> two years from now -- >> wait. >> two years from now, you've seen what happened in the last two years, you see joe biden from two years ago, you see him now, we're talking about five years from now, five years from now. >> i'm not going to disagree with you about the age issue what i don't understand -- i don't disagree with you. what i don't understand, though, is, and teddy said, look, in 2022, the elders of the democratic party should have -- that was the time for them to make a choice. >> more and more are doing it now. >> what about the elders of the republican party >> they're on board because of

the base you can't win without 35%. >> and my question to you is given the fact that this man is on trial around the country, is that a good thing or a bad thing? >> do you think -- do you think the -- >> it is so empirically obvious but i'm wrong in that are people who -- >> you haven't figured out the trial in new york, what a sham the way this came out and turned out? who is damaged for the $355 million? does the trial in georgia seem to be going well for you you can't see how someone would come to the conclusion that none of these things -- that they're all orchestrated in trying to take down the leading nominee? you can't see how people would think that so 40% of the country -- 40% of the country doesn't understand that andrew -- >> did you see january 6th >> you mean the insurrection where people were home for dinner isn't it usually preceded by armed. you really believe that was going to be an overthrow of the

u.s. government? >> teddy, you're here, you're listening, go ahead, you can comment on all -- what do you think? this is our life >> sure. i mean, look, the -- i can tell you what i'm hearing from my reporting, when you talk with people who are, you know, democratic, major donors, they're not blind eye. they know joe biden has a problem on his hands you ask them what will you do about it and, you know, these are some of the smartest wealthiest people, on "squawk" all the time andi haven't hear a clear convincing answer. the age problem that biden has is often met with, what aboutism what about trump's age what about trump's legal problems and none of those answers are solutions for joe biden is as old as he is -- >> and kamala harris is waiting in the wings. >> unclear who the replacement

would be and from a donor perspective, it -- the democratic party is going to have tons of money. joe biden is doing very well in fund-raising so far. maybe not doing as well as obama was, but doing well, there is obviously lots of anti-trump energy, lots of anti-trump money that is going to flow into democratic super pacs. none of which can really necessarily affect, you know, the fact that joe biden, you know, would be the oldest president of the united states in history and you can maybe put up some tiktoks or memes that make him seem young and cool and hip, but this is a, you know, this is a law of nature that biden is as old as he is, and it is -- >> warren buffett is fine at 994 but some people are gone at 75. >> so, teddy, the question becomes do you see a moment? you said 2022 was the time for the elder statesmen in the party, i don't know if elder is

the wrong word to use in this case, but whomever they are, to have made a change, do you see a possibility that anything happens potentially this summer? at all >> i do not at this point. i think that the party is pot committed. i think whether media elites, ezra kline or nate silver talking about the idea that biden may not be the strongest democratic nominee, whether media elites might say that, the democratic establishment is not objective on this point. they are -- the only person who can make a decision about that would be joe biden for biden to step down and obviously it is not in his self-interest to do that i don't really think that there is a, you know, political science experiment or rational conversation happening within the democratic party elderly establishment about this question, it is a question for joe biden who has, you know, at this point little reason to think that he can't beat trump again after beating him four

years ago. there is an arrogance and ego that comes with being the president of the united states and i don't necessarily think there are going to be drawing up plays that, what if it is gavin newsom or gretchen whitmer or whatever, at the end of the day, he's the president, resident of the white house, and there is a low chance there is a bait and switch that happens. >> yeah, you keep hearing it, the party that boots the presumptive nominee first will be the one that wins you heard that bandied about as well, right? maybe nikki haley is the person that -- i don't know time passes. we'll see what it looks like by the time november -- >> thank you, sir, for weighing in and joining our debate. >> joining the fray. >> joining the fray. come on in >> debate. >> debate. it is not really a debate. >> the country is having a debate you can't just say that 40% of

your fellow citizens are either wrong or traitorous. you can't. you heard jamie dimon say that please don't turn it into this crazy -- either you're a treasonous or you're just dishonest. >> i get that. i'm saying we now have so many people who worked with president trump in the white house come on the air -- and i talked to the same people who say between biden and trump, it is not even close, they're voting for trump. i can give you names that say that you just got to look around. we got a 51st state, immigrants that now make up a 51st state. >> i'm not saying this president is doing -- >> announcer: time now for today's aflac trivia question. the cincinnati reds earned five national titles and two world rihaiohips in the 1970s. who was the team's manager the answer when "squawk box" returns. good thing i had aflac. hmmm the cash i got from aflac helped pay for medical expenses, groceries, rent.

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the reds placed second in the nl west for a second consecutive season all right, welcome back to "squawk box. i'm dominic chu with your morning movers we'll check things off right now with a check on nvidia shares are up north of 13% premarket over 2 million shares of volume at this point. most folks know the story now, surging a.i. demand for chips, much better forecast for the current quarter. by the way, you're seeing a slew of analysts coming out this morning with target price hikes on the heels of that report. not many upgrades since over 90% of coverage already has the stock at buy or equivalent look at key bank, hsbc, jpmorgan, stifel, bernstein, deutsche bank amongst others upping their target prices and if you look at the ripple effects throughout the entire semiconductor industry now, you're seeing gains across the board. chip designers, advanced micro,

manufacturers, equipment makers, asml holdings and writ large the entire semiconductor etf, vaneck up 5.5%, keep an eye on manufacture many of the ripple effects outside of nvidia rivian, the electric vehiclemaker reporting a wider than expected loss on the quarter on better than expected revenues, but did lay out a full year production forecast that fell well shy of some analysts' estimates. it expects to make 57,000 units for the year consensus estimates was closer to 80,000 units. they will cut some of the salaried work force citing uncertainty around economic conditions those shares down nearly 16% and be sure to tune into the next hour of "squawk box," for an exclusive interview with rivian founder and ceo rj

scaringe and royal caribbean, they're higher by around 5.75%, couple thousand shares of volume. the cruise line operator is boosting its full year profit forecast amid a surge in demand for travel amid -- adding that bookings have been significantly higher than the same time last year all four quarters of the year seeing higher demand, travelers spending more money while on board as well. so, royal caribbean, joe, up 6%. i'll send things back over to you. >> all right, dom, thanks. coming up, the minutes from the federal reserve meeting showing that they're in no hurry now to cut interest rates. we'll find out what that could mean for investors "squawk box" coming right back

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dream do come true. xfinity gives you reliable wifi with wall-to-wall coverage on all your devices, even when everyone is online. maybe we'll even get married one day. i wonder what i will be doing? probably still living here with mom and dad. fast reliable speeds right where you need them. that's wall-to-wall wifi on the xfinity 10g network. welcome back to "squawk box. federal reserve officials indicated at the last meeting they were in no hurry to cut interest rates and expressed optimism and caution on inflation. senior economics reporter steve liesman joins us now with more we saw him yesterday morning in d.c. he's back. what do you think? >> you know, these minutes show as you say, andrew, most officials were more concerned about inflation than they were with recession and they were more concerned about cutting rates too quickly.

and what is important about these minutes is it comes even before that upside inflation surprise reported by the government several weeks later here is a quick rundown. they emphasized the risks of cutting rates too quickly. there were concerns that inflation progress could stall and they were worried about upside inflation risks from things like stronger consumer demand, loosening financial conditions and geopolitical risks that could hurt the progress we had on the supply side only a handful, maybe not even that, of committee members showed much concern at all for the recession risk that may be out there if they stay too tight for too long if there is any disagreement, it is hard to find and some on wall street don't think the fed has taken the risk of a downturn seriously enough, after the minutes. the economists wrote the odds of a policy error appear higher following the minutes, there is significant disinflation in the pipeline if the central bank waits for clear signs that the labor market or the broader economy is deteriorating, it will be behind the curve.

the chance of that may rate cut now trading at the lowest probability of the year, just 30% now, so the market is writing that off they're more confident in rate cuts coming in june and july here is the chart that looks at a number of cuts, they're pricing in fewer than four cuts now, 3.7 right there that's down, you can see on left part of the screen from seven cuts expected for the year, that was last month's pricing if the fed was this hawkish before the january inflation data, there is little doubt their positions may have hardened since, which is to say don't expect much from the five fed speakers today, including the fed vice chair at 10:00 a.m. the minutes suggest there is more disagreement on wall street about policy, more disagreement than debate than there looks to be at the federal reserve. >> wow so, again, i go back to the question of who got it wrong meaning, clearly the market has got this wrong, but then you

had -- you had jamie dimon on the other side of it who seemed to get it right and where were people -- why do you think the market wasn't focused that way >> i'm not sure the market had it wrong, andrew what is -- you know, you are talking about blinders, which i think is a good -- it is right but i think alan fails to tell us in that piece where he thinks the -- he thinks the fed ought to be doing right now. the really weird situation is this, andrew more and more i read that people think these january inflation numbers were a blip. and yet they have changed their fed call based on what they think a blip is. so, almost ipso facto they think the fed is making a mistake here why would you change your policy based on a blip? if you thought the fed should cut in early spring because of the direction of inflation, over, by the way, a long time, and by the way, that is also

inherent in alan blinder's piece, which is that you have six months of inflation running at 2%, is it the right call here to say, you know what, let's push all of this ahead or perhaps as oxford -- other people i quoted all week, andrew, you'll remember, think the fed is making a potential mistake here. >> steve liesman, thank you, sir. let's keep it going now. markets, rates and more with the president of yardeni research. and half the time when we have you on, ed, you -- whatever the overreaction of the day is you kind of bring us back to the mean and i guess you probably do that with some calm today as well >> i try. >> you feeling that? we may not get seven rate cuts, but you think inflation is trending lower maybe it will be uneven? and the economy is doing pretty

well so, we're somewhere in the middle between panicking on either side. >> well, joe, you covered everything i was going to say. yeah, look, i -- i think inflation is continuing to come down, the cpi both core and headline excluding shelter is around 2% right now. and that's on a year over year basis. there tends to be an effort by economists to microanalyze the inflation numbers and looking at auto insurance and so on and the fact is the fed really has to focus on the overall inflation rate they can't control individual components and the overall inflation rate is moderating, the rate, the labor market is great, some people just get people who are disagreeing with me on that, that's the macro economic data, looks just fine. from the fed's point of view, i believe their story, they said

they were going to cut by two to three times this year, not by five to seven, and i thought that they wouldn't do it the first half of the year, because the economy is doing fine. why mess with success? inflation is coming down, the economy is strong, the labor market is doing well and now we got the roaring 2020s in the stock market led by nvidia >> so, let's say that just to try to figure out whety there a things to worry about. i worried about the opposite way, the strong economy is great as long as inflation is under control. the minute the fed starts worrying about, you know, the stop and start disaster of the '70s, that's in the back of their mind all the time. >> absolutely. >> and maybe we're not headed for recession until they get so nervous that they do cause one from thinking that they need to get down to 2% that maybe the economy never, you know, not night follows day

there will be a recession, maybe it is always a policy mistake. you don't think they will make that mistake >> well, recessions are usually caused in the past anyways by something breaking in the financial system so you get a financial crisis, which then becomes a credit crunch and that's what causes recessions. and so, yes, indeed, we had a financial crisis last year in march. we could have had a run on the banks, but the fed came in so quickly with liquidity facility that they averted a credit crunch and reverted a recession. i think they have done a good job here i think -- i agree with them, there is no rush to lower interest rates and while most economists have been very upset about a possibility of a recession or something significantly breaking, because after all, i mean, the fed funds rate,up 525 basis points, i think the fed has not only tightened, it normalized interest rates are back to normal and the economy lived with these rates before i think it could live with them again. i think it is healthy for the

economy to have an interest rate that is good for investors in terms of risk free investing, and is good in terms of allocating capital >> yeah, people forget that point, i think, ed, that somehow we did normalize, the economy didn't fall off a cliff. there is some type of break in the future, we got some room to lower rates with dry powder, money has a cost again and assets are being priced more realistically, you know, when rates are -- so there is a lot of positive things so that makes you, in terms of the s&p for this year, would you be surprised if it performed like it did in 2023? >> i find myself not worrying about a melt up. i worry slow civilized bull markets. i don't like stampedes the problem with melt ups, they're followed by meltdowns.

for now, you know, the roaring 2020s. it started on november 30th, 2022, when a.i. -- when openai introduced chatgpt a.i. has been around for a while, suddenly just took off as an investment theme. tremendous amount of money is being thrown at this and i think some of that is going to pay off in better productivity so, again, that looks pretty good >> do you like getting up and coming on or next time do you just want me to just summarize what i know you're thinking because when were you -- that was the '70s >> we were there together. >> i got there in '84. yeah so i know what -- i can finish your sentences we don't need to come on >> no, we can do this together, you know, travel the country >> if you don't feel like getting up -- i think he's okay

with -- it is a binary choice, right? >> i like waking up and talking to you guys. >> i would punt on that too. thank you, ed. "squawk box" will be right back. to help you see untapped possibilities and rely work with you to make them real.

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coming up, irs commissioner danny werfel is on talking about restoring fairness to the tax system he sat down with robert frank to discuss. and the next hour, rivian founder and ceo rj sricange is joining us to discuss quarterly results. some of the layoffs as well. we got a lot coming up you do not want to go anywhere back after this.

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with its new $60 billion in congressional funding, the irs is more than doubling the audits on the wealthy and cnbc's robert frank caught up with irs commissioner danny werfel for a rare interview.

robert, a lot of times you're interviewing someone and they have the person being interviewed is sort of in silhouette did you go in silhouette so you didn't -- so danny doesn't know who you are? >> i was not an irs whistle-blower he gave us a lot of great information. >> did you give a fake last name >> i did not my taxes are easy and i follow the rules. i had nothing to worry about no partnerships for me >> w-2, that's it. >> irs commissioner danny werfel saying to me yesterday one of his chief goals is, quote, restoring fairness to the tax system, that means targeting the wealthy, partnerships and large corporations >> when i look at what we call our tax gap, which is the amount of money owed versus what is paid, for millionaires and billionaires that either don't file or underreporting their income, that's $150 billion of our tax gap. there is plenty -- >> per year? >> yes there is plenty of work to be

done and in doing that work, not only are we going to help the united states' financial situation, but we're also going to build trust, that we're not just focusing on low and middle income, the opposite. >> yesterday, the irs launched deducting them as business expenses. >> there are more than 10,000 kornt jets operating in america today. many of them, most of them, worth tense of millions of dollars that the depreciation schedule on those is front-loaded all in the first five years what does that mean? when these individuals and companies issue tax returns their deduction on corporate jets can be tens of millions of dollars. >> werfel said the two beg red flags looking for aside from private jets are offshore income and limited partnership income interesting is that the number of partnership it's in past

exploded in recent years and the irs' ability to tackle complex returns no money or auditors drastically reduced. the area they're going after. >> do you think the trump tax cuts and all the things that came along with those, made it a lot easier to see -- like there's nothing that a w-2 earner can do? is there >> no. >> the maximum deduction is x. >> right. >> so when you get your, you know, the, your employer gives you whatever it is, withholdings, it's there. >> even before the 2017 taxes not much w-2. >> not the ones getting audited. >> i know. you could write off new jersey state tax, write off -- there's nothing. what's your maximum amount to try to offset your income? >> deductions, $24,000. >> $24,000 >> yes. >> bring in our guest right now on this. yale law school managing

professor, former treasury official and former policy director and chief economist at the white house -- white house house ways and means committee good morning to you both i want to actually start with alex for a second. seems to me, maybe you can tell me if i'm wrong. you think the approach to the irs, that they're taking, will create problems? and i mean, sort of not understanding why we shouldn't be trying to look for more of this money >> no. it's not exactly my view i absolutely do believe in addressing the tax gap it's hundreds of billions of dollars per year i think putting more dollars efficiently and effectively into the irs to try to make sure that people are paying what they owe is a good idea, but what i don't really like is the gotcha part of the agenda. it feels a little political that we're going after these guys these bad guys, these -- these guys on jets look, if the guys who fly on

jets aren't paying what they owe they should pay what they owe and irs should audit them and em force the law. no question. the question, trying to say tax code is better if we squeeze more out of this group of people and leave this other group of people alone truth is, there's problems with the tax gap across the board businesses, partnerships, sure guys who fly jets, perhaps but elsewhere as well. small business owners as well, and the politics are talking about small business owners is just -- >> and the thing i don't understand about this is, a., you go towards where the money is b., just discussed it's very hard for people to, you know, do shenanigans with their w-2 income once you get into the loc world and other world, a self-supporting system, that's where problems lie shouldn't you be going and looking there first? and sounds to me like you're saying go look at the small

businesses first, over the big money. why would you do that? by the way, i'm not suggesting we shouldn't be looking at all the money across the board, but -- speak to this. >> my point is that we should focus on the money shouldn't focus on the characteristics of the individuals. if wherever that -- wherever the evidence leads us, that's where it should go it shouldn't be about getting the bad guys, because they look like they're bad guys. should be, like, about getting the money, wherever the money may be. >> and natasha, if you look right now at this fairness in the tax system, top 1% pay 46% of the federal income taxes. look at audit rates, has been a big focus for the irs, top is audited as ten times the rate as middle and most of america what unfairness is there, do you think, to address here given these disparities where the wealthy are already the biggest taxpayers and most audited >> i want to take issue with

what alex was saying, which is, the irs is following the money, and here we are in a two tiered tax system in the country as you already have discussed, wage and salary earners are fully compliant with tax obligations their taxes are automatically withheld the top 1% responsible for a disproportionate share, 30% of the tax gap annually about 150, closer to $200 billion a year, and so what the irs is doing here is prioritizing its new resources in exactly the areas it needs to, where it's lost the most capacity historically. audit rates for millionaires down 80% the last decade something the agency needs to fix. >> alex? >> i agree that we, that high-income people pay most of the tax. it makes sense they would be audited more they are audited more. they were audited more in the past the question is looking forward,

where should we be allocating resources? >> where do you think it should be -- just a sec. >> not allocating necessarily -- >> let's just suggest for a second i'm putting you in charge of the irs the mandate -- here's the mandate, alex. the mandate is to try to, i'll use the word "recover" or "collect" what is legally obligated to the paid. you have only so many resources, and your job is to collect as much money as is legally obligated to the paid. how would you go about structuring audits or anything else >> so i think it's a science-based approach i think the idea is to think whether it's artificial intelligence, whether it's machine learning whatever the techniques are to find the efficient, to find efficiently the dollars that can be collected that are owed

we want to collect those dollars. we want to put resources into making sure people pay the taxes they owe the only concern i have is that when you say that this is also making the tax code better, because we're sticking it to the billionaires that's the problem the billionaires need to pay what they owe. absolutely so does everyone else. that's all i'm saying. >> natasha and alex thank you for the corporation and debate not going anywhere for better or worse. thank you for coming in and bringing us that interview ahead of the irs. big hour ahead ceo of rivian talking about evmaker's quarterly results, layoffs and other issues plus, much more on what was nvidia's below outquarter. huge guidance, how it's moving the markets isth morning and more when we come right back. what do you mean? these straps are mind-blowing! they collect hundreds of data points like hrv and rem sleep, so you know all you need for recovery.

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good morning stock futures green across the board. looking at a strong open especially for the nasdaq, because of nvidia. that's right big region, stellar quarter from the a.i. leader. stock shooting up in pre-market

closing in now on a $2 trillion market cap just past $1 billion not long ago. on the other side rivian shares sliding on disappointing production guidance. we'll ask the ceo of the ev maker about the challenges ahead. the final hour of "squawk box" begins right now. good morning welcome to "squawk box" right here on cnbc pliv at market site in times square a big hour ahead i'm andrew ross sorkin along with joe kernen. becky's off today. take a look more importantly the nasdaq right now is up a whopping 355 points about an hour before the market opens s&p 500 looking to ode about 61 points higher all on the back of

that blowout nvidia news we will get to that, though, in a moment take a look, though, at treasury yields right now ten year note sitting at 4.335 two year note at 4.697, joe. >> exhausted, after these two hours. >> right >> how's my girl on my side hopefully today >> my daughter >> yeah. hopefully. >> hasn't texts me about joey. >> i need a break. i probably need this break no i need abreak. start going to dom chu a look at the day's -- >> look at the elexdscelection. >> no, no. stop >> the circus, andrew ross sorkin is back guys, this is -- i could listen to you need more fuel in the tank first two hours great. >> we're ready to go, baby >> you're going, you're not

going to be able to take a nap too much stuff going on right now. >> you mentioned, joe did, nvidia this has got to be a check of the stock of the day, the week, maybe even the entire earnings season at this point 13% gain nvidia. traders and investors calling in the most important stock in the market heading into this earnings report last night now that it's come and gone that a.i. appeal revenues rosier current forecast leading to a 13% gain over 2.5 million shares changed hands at this point in extended trading nvidia ceo spoke about just how big of an opportunity it still has when it comes to expanding its business across the entire tech landscape, fueled by, of course, a.i. take a listen. >> for most of the eanterprise and enterprise software companies don't have the large expertise in computing at this point. we'll do it for everybody. optimize it for everybody.

creates this for and with everybody and make it run in every single cloud for everybody. what they, the way we monetize it is through the engine, nrvidi operating system for a.i enterprise and acceleration algorithms to pay for it, gpu per year like at operating system. run everything it creates and enables. that's as we grow into enterprises we grow into enterprise software. grow out to the edge this is going to be a very, very significant opportunity for us. >> now, joe mentioned nvidia closing in on a $2 trillion market cap by the way, at a 13% gain nvidia adds roughly 216 billion, 216 billion to its market cap at the opening bell add entire mcdonald's at opening bay, in contrast the trend continues for nvidia this morning check out our computer chip

stocks and different parts of the supply chain advanced micro up 5.5, taiwan semiconductor up 4%. applied materials on equipment side, up 3.5%. 2.5% gains for intel up big in the pre-market cap things off with a check on doordash 4% 25,000 shares are volume help from analysts at morgan stanley upgraded food delivery plat foreign minister nover weight to equal weight up to $145. longer-term growth story core restaurants and grocery delivery business, improving user loyalty trend and expectations for the doordash company as a whole to be gap or traditional accounting profitable on that basis this year, andrew doordash shares up nearly 5% i'm tired now and send things back over. >> come on just getting started just getting started the morning is starting. >> except for the jobs -- >> rock and rolling here.

>> and so these numbers are unbelievable for nvidia? dom? >> so just trying to figure out -- >> if the potential for a.i. is warranting this much investment into hardware to build out this thing. >> right. >> what the hell -- what does it look like? what will our lives look like based on what a.i. is going to do. >> you have to -- the whole thing. believe a transfer of economics from, frankly, labor to more technology. >> that's bad. >> correct >> maybe it's a productivity thing? >> never happened before always wrong, today. >> they say. that's the -- you think that has to be the economic situation. >> dom, has the internet not changed? think about, before the internet, what our lives, some of us remember that. i mean, it's unbelievable. >> a totally different thing our kids grow up with it and is a.i. the same thing and what does it look like, dom

what the hell does that look like or mean for me, joe kernen? >> think of about, i was in, in late high school, college when the internet was kind of first just kicking off like the mid, mid-1990s to late 1990s. transformative look how much it rocketed innovation, right? in the next 15 to 20 years if at this pace a.i. will be the same kind of trajectory, basically you remember that disney-pixar movie "wally," everybody just gets the -- >> flying around in space? >> forget the obesity aspect computers basically are going to do everything for us, i'm not sure whether or not that kind of a thing is going to be net beneficial for the human race, or whether or not we trigger things like some of the bad health outcomes that come along with not doing things for ourselves. >> all right dom, thanks. back to broader markets. next guest says making it stabilized, set up now for

recovery more on the m & a pipeline and market bring in stephon ce cellancoy, from goldman sachs and -- i mean, is it that? can we finally say waiting for this >> i think waiting for gado is a good way to describe it. one, thanks for having me on i think if 2021 was ten on the m & a scale, 2022 a two. right now at a three or four, feels like in 2023 there were almost no transactions over $10 billion first month of the year. first month, month and a half. we've had numerous this year that said, overall count relatively tepid i think it's a hard call that said, we all talked about green shoots last year roll into this year think about interest rates and the interest rate cycle coming down we all debate when that's going to happen. certainly providing fuel to the fire i think the big debate and

frankly debating aid a lot abou technology and what does that look like onshoring. big debate private equity. 40% of the market in 2021 waiting largely on sidelines both to monetize as well new investment looking carefully, really a big barometer. >> and both sides of the transactions are attractive now? buyers and sellers seems that way. >> always that way, but a lot of folks sat in board rooms over the last year said earnings good, demand good. look for, a little different depending on what geography you go toe around the world. why should my business are worth less just because interest rates are different? looking at more expensive capital and sellers saying my business is still very good. a lot of that hasn't changed that being said with interest rate cycle changes and a lot of

boards looking at their prospects saying certain pieces of inflation haven't changed wage inflation, certain dimension there's. the big change, though, a lot of people able to get core demand growth as well as pricing over the last couple years. right now getting pricing is getting harder inflation coming down. folks are thinking a little more conservatively about their businesses and boardrooms. feels like they're getting close, the figures. >> the thing i was going to ask you. which is, when you see more m & a activity, is it the argument you made that people do deals oddly enough when most confident. oftentimes worst time to actually be doing it meaning, should have done it when the least confident, and that it often spells end of the cycle not beginning of one >> look, i think two sides to that there's no question confidence, ceo confidence, board confidence, number one driver of m & a. dynamics out of covid, strategic

repositioning, diversification growth now xrextraordinarily well capitalized companies, weight-loss other molecules, accumulating them to drive growth cakes confidence. look at dynamics whether technology and health care investing in cycles makes a ton of sense different sides. then the classic consolidation where folks looking for synergies to drive earnings in sectors but as you say, comes back to ceo confidence and i would say sitting in many, many board rooms, ceo confidence, board confidence, particularly with some of the growth we talk about a.i., technology that confidence is going to grow. >> and stis the real opportunit in rationalization and defensive sort of plays? with a.i. all the potential and with the cloud, whatever you

want to talk about it. is it -- is it playing offense offense or defense for m & a and pe >> i think it's both certainly for pe, facing pressure on monetization returning capital. presher pressure rationalizing portfolios and investing technology, investing in growth and new domains. industrial tech, consumer tech and a.i. changes a lot of that dislocations how people think about this, people placing growth bets opportunity bets looking forward. other sectors, let's take energy as an example, have seen greatest consolidation we've seen in decades in energy starting in the third quarter of last year and continues through today. you know, it is accumulating molecules, accumulating scale and looking for growth in attractive bases depends on the sector and

strategic rye poepositions lookg for scale. scale, still, think about credit, think about ratings, think about just defensive positioning when there is a lot of uncertainty and volatility, scale matters. thinking from a defense perspective as well. >> okay. all right. thanks i think it's going to be better. you're excited aren't you >> about which part? >> dealmaking? >> i love dealmaking it may be, but often worry where you are in a cycle when there's a lot of it. and also think the big headlines -- >> when's that >> i -- i know it was -- whose fault it is. >> could be yours. >> no, no. you know -- downed middle, my friend. >> okay. we're going to hear exclusively from head of ev maker rivian up by 17% almost 18% now

company's ceo r.j. scaringe joins us after the break to talk about it you don'wa tt nto go anywhere. we're coming right back. (grunting) at morgan stanley, old school hard work meets bold new thinking. ( ♪♪ ) partnering to unlock new ideas, to create new legacies, to transform a company, industry, economy, generation. because grit and vision working in lockstep puts you on the path to your full potential. old school grit. new world ideas. morgan stanley. every day, more dog people, and more vets are deciding it's time for a fresh approach to pet food. they're quitting the kibble. and kicking the cans.

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welcome back to "squawk box. shares of ev maker rivian deep in the red after reporting fourth quarter results and phil lebeau joins us with the company's ceo. phil >> thank you, andrew bring in r.j. scaringe r.j. a rough report for you guys let's be blunt announced 10% of your salary workforce will be laid off as you guys are cutting costs i'm curious in a general sense, how much has the ev market slowed down in the last three months >> we've seen historically high interest rates and along with a lot of the geopolitical uncertainty, particularly for products in the premium segment. we're seeing effective interest rates, effective uncertainty, really impact how people think about purchase decisions and it led us to accelerating launch of

our center pack to make sure we have a full portfolio of products available. >> so when you look at where the market is right now, your guidance for building 57,000 vehicles this year is well below what the street expected at 81,000 where's the disconnect we've been talking about the market slowing down. why did analysts miss it by such a wide margin? >> well, our products flagship products, they have been performing really well relative to the market. so we have the best selling electric vehicle with a price point over $70,000 and so as i said impact of interest rates is impacting the whole segment. the whole, call it premium segment, but relative to the rest, we saw the still have the best selling product in the market as we look at 2024, a few things playing out. one making a number of changes to the way we operate our plants

as well as our material costs building materials and shutting down the plant for several weeks in the second quarter to make these changes. so that's an interruption to production and then we're being very realistic just around the overall number of vehicles purchased at these price points. at, you know, in the price range of over $70,000. as far, as i said, as far as premium products go we have the best selling ev in the united states. >> let's talk about numbers. you lost $43,000, roughly speaking, per vehicle, that you built in the fourth quarter. about a $12,000 increase in the amount lost compared to the third quarter. i know you outlined changes that you're making in terms of cutting your costs is it realistic to think that you can get back or get to some type of a profit, positive profit margin in the fourth quarter given the losses where they're at right now

>> well, if you look at fourth quarter of 2022 compared to the fourth quarter 2023, we reduced overall costs per vehicle by about $81,000. that's a combination of better operation -- you know, better, more efficient operations within the plant and really improving some of the fixed cost absorption due to the ramp-up. the other big element here is continued progress on our material costs, and that's all the components going into the vehicle. the shutdown i referred to we're going to be making is pretty significant changes across the vehicle in terms of cost structure in terms of componentry. that will be a huge enabler to get to positive margin and as we talk and earnings call yesterday, we still have confidence and want to be very clear that the fourth quarter of this year we will be, we will be positive growth margin. >> do you have confidence, enough capital to make it to the

r2 fluxion '26 >> incredibly excited about r2 when i look at the brand strength that we've established with our launch products, r1t, r1s and how consumers responded. brand survey, came out number one rated brand with, by far, the highest rate of repurchase meaning if you buy a vehicle again would you buy rivian again? significant degree relative to all other brands rivian came in the number one spot. as we think about taking that position and now applying it into a smaller footprint vehicle with a meaningfully lower pricepoint, to be able to translate not only brand excitement but importantly the significant market share that we've built with our flagship products, we're incredibly excited. with that said, the organization is heads-down focused and delivering to that, the product

itself that's coming together beautifully. we'll be unveiling it march 7th, and that really -- represents -- >> r.j. running up against a break. i don't mean to belabor this understand strength of the brand where you're at, but to get to my question. are you confident you have the capital needed to get to r2 production or do you think there's a possibility of a capital raise between now and then >> what we've said is, we're very confident in the capital we have supporting operations through end of 2025. there is a variety of ways we intend to ensure we can launch r2 certainly opportunities to look at capital markets also driving efficiency to everything that we do, and the emphasis on driving cost efficiency and into operations how we deploy capital from a capex view and the gross margin side is highest focus within the whole business. >> r.j., i know it was a rough

report, and you're going to be talking about the r2 unveiling march 7th. looking forward to talking to you, just seeing the r2. appreciate you coming on andrew and joe, back to you. >> phil, thanks. coming up, talking more about today's marquee stock mover nvidia in the market growth -- the whole narrative, and a can't didn't miss interview with democrat presidential candidate dean phillips, finally going to be on "squawk box. we will beig bk. rhtac

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after last month's massive solar flare added a 25th hour to the day, businesses are wondering "what should we do with it?" i'm thinking company wide power nap. [ employees snoring ] anything can change the world of work.

from hr to payroll, adp designs for the next anything. welcome back to "squawk box. google saying it is pausing ability to gemini artificial intelligence services generating images of people joe, listen to this. the company said the tool has been creating inaccuracies in historical pictures some users on social media complaining the

a.i. tool generates images and historical figures like the u.s. founding fathers as people of color. you know, not weighing in. tip of the iceberg same done with google search google said it would work to re-release an improved version of the software soon and a post on x saying going's saying the a.i. feature can generate a ride range of people, generally a good thing but missing the mark here some people putting this in another example of -- woke, anti-woke -- >> but it had to be -- i mean, it's not just, like, some random thing. i mean it had to be -- like -- someone wrote algorithms that directed it that way right? >> i think in the world today, not actually write a -- so code -- >> literally -- >> erecting the a.i. program. >> and woke and other things.

>> don't you think a.i. would program it to be woke? wouldn't surprise me. >> i don't know what woke means anymore. >> go to break and take me, like, about a second and a half. i know you know. >> i know -- it's li, kewhat you see -- i know, but i don'tknow

welcome back to "squawk box. rick santelli here and cme hq live breaking news of the

morning. today initial continues claims initial claims suspected, expected potentially 216,000 note, 201,000. 201,000. that is the lightest, well, since january when we were 189,000, and that was lightest going all the way back to 182,000 and that was in september of '22 and the reason i bring that up is the next to that 1969. looking continuing claims 1 million 862,000. it's a little bit light. rearview mirror, downgrade 1 million 895 to 1 million 889 and that is significant, because 1 million 895 before the revision, that was the biggest, highest, since november of last year and i think the reason that that's so important, of course, is that we missed 1.9 million mark now, you see yields moving a bit higher i think moving higher is they

continue to be well-behaved. drum roll, please. saying this a while. nikkei over 39k. i remember working at drexel when we were trading and puts on it december '89 wondering if it would shoot through 39,000 it didn't, of course only had to wait what? 34 years of course, minutes to the ecb, 7:30 eastern this morning moved yields higher unlike the minutes yesterday truly didn't have much effect on the market because 20-year option was such a dog. joe, back to you. >> a lesson there somewhere, 34 years, rick. it's a scary lesson. >> we know what it is, joe when the government gets crazy and banks get crazy and everybody's play be footsie, okay that's what happens. sound familiar >> yeah, but 34 years? that's mind blowing. talked about the dow 1,000 years

to get back over 1,000 i'm sorry. ten years to get back over 1,000. remember back in the '60s but never talked 34 years. >> i remember joe graham don't you? >> i do. remember him dressed up like a pharaoh predicting earthquakes he gets a bad wrap unbalanced volume, his deal. a great technical strategist kind of lost his mind. >> what do you think about 313 trillion of global debt? i hear a lot of news stories today i liked the one phil was talking. how do analysts miss a big ev situation? i don't know pretty much impossible to me governments never pig winners andwinners -- pick winners in a good way that should be the story on every newscast just like the story with evs

how did everybody miss it? a moment in the future we are say that how markets pay a whole lot more attention to debt. >> yeah. because it's going to be bigger, thy neighbor no currently worth anything. or at least that isn't devalued significantly. you would think. >> i agree >> all right thanks, rick nvidia stock spiking in the pre-market after -- better than expected results much better. and revenue. this a day after high-flier palo alto network plummeted on weak guidance so is the gross stock narrative collapses or not here to weigh in, jon fortt. that's best of times, worst of times. >> joe, after that nvidia report you can't argue the growth narrative is collapsing. a.i., pixie dust for growth in the market and like tinker bell, nvidia appears to have plenty of shares micro up 12% pre-market.

arm up 7 amd 5. nvidia's earnings beat powered by strong demand for a.i. chips for datacenters. details offered on the call and ceo shared after, industry-wide lift just starting with the chipmaker. nvidia strength suggests continued demand for specialized data center hard ware and arm flexible chips and demand for lower calls, alternative chips from amd and intel pap software angle, too justin sees a future a.i. helpers allow more to use enterprise software calling in the new opportunity for the trillion dollar enterprise software platform companies. intellectually honest here disappoint add day after palo alto every bear in the woods would be calling in proof positive with inflation, growth is done, but nvidia didn't disappoint despite higher rates china had wins and more. growth lives, joe. >> i can see how nvidia's

results are good for nvidia. maybe a couple partners, but not the whole growth narrative >> well, joe -- on the other hand the nvidia stock narrative doing great. don't confuse that with growth stocks in general. i mean, the lesson of the week is not ignore palo alto networks and believe nvidia all the stocks high multiples don't deserve them, while some do there are real headwinds a hot inflation report on producer prices after a hot jobs report and have seen earnings reports with cautious guidance suggesting many ceos feel more confident about cutting costs than growing revenue so in about an hour back to s&p global purchasing managers index d data, early read on whether sentiment it shifting. a lot more small cap whether nvidia selling a billion more chips for a.i. nvidia making it tougher on

other names. those numbers don't look at nvidia's maybe get the palo alto treatment. durable margins replaced soaring sales as metric of choice. nvidia the rare company delivering both. key word, rare notable not like the other stocks joe, it's not. >> and let me see. i was going to ask you this anyway about jensen huang but in a different way. i mentioned fake popcorn on the air and then watching and said andrew is a futurist. >> thank you. >> and not everyone knows this but -- after talking to jensen huang, can you describe the a.i. futch jer think of the money we're spending, better be good what does it mean? dom chu says on a "wally" satellite playing "fort nite."

>> my younger son already sitting in a comfortable chair playing "fortnite. >> i understand the -- >> what i got. jensen described last night a future where a.i. agents help you use more complicated software okay interesting. put down alongside what bret taylor told me a few days ago. a new sierra a.i. start-up, chair of openai talked about it as if it's the new user interface. right? you think about how we went from these clunky interfaces of green text on a black screen hard to interact with software to mac allowed us drag and drop. easier web 2.0, google maps allowed us to do more a.i. allows us to converse and get stuff more quickly is the argument maybe finally unlocks that big productivity boost from software

that has been coming but not quite here for a long, long time i think that's the hook. >> because i'm trying to -- >> my question is -- >> how much we're spending on hardware buildout, it better be good tell me what it's going to do. >> i'm a cynical man, andrew. >> i never believe this stuff until there's enough evidence of it really happening. i see it happening for companies in pockets, but is it happening overall yet? not yet. but it makes sense to me how it could. >> i wanted you to tell me that the singularity is possible in my lifetime. the drugs and maybe a convergence between silicon and human matter will allow me to live forever is that possible [ imitating arnold schwarzenegger ] >> i'll be back. >> i think much better -- more

mature -- not sure. >> definitely keep going to church. >> mortality, i mean cover all of my bases, i think. >> regardless. >> because i need to. and stop by the confessional occasionally, andrew say three hail marys >> yeah. on the other happened -- i forgot -- took me to church, joe. i was there. >> must be guilty. >> before you go to church, read the newsletter you can get there quicker by using that qr code there on the screen or type in cnbc.com/otoh if you like to do things the hard convey, like some catholics. you know it means more that way be sure not to miss an interview with nvidia ceo jensen huang later today on "closing bell: overtime" to hear more about the conversation i had with him yesterday. coming up, democratic congressman and presidential candidate dean phillips joining

us about the upcoming primaries and his campaign and what happens next stay tuned for all of it "squawk box" returns after this. awkward question... is there going to be anything... -left over? -yeah. oh, absolutely. (inner monologue) my kids don't know what they want. you know who knows what she wants? me! with empower, we get all of our financial questions answered. so you don't have to worry. empower. what's next.

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welcome back to "squawk box. futures right now continue to have a lot of green and especially on the nasdaq 360 points the dow up about 200 points this morning and that's up a solid gain in the s&p up 66 or so. a lot of it, good feelings about growth stocks with nvidia's report after the bell yesterday. >> minnesota congressman and democratic presidential candidate dean phillips announcing layoffs to his campaign staff a few days ago. plans to campaign in michigan ahead of the democratic primary in that state but steadfast in his plans to remain in the race against president biden. congressman phillips joins us now and thrilled to have him on the broadcast. good morning to you. >> good to be with you guys. >> start with a very basic

question what do you see as the panel forward for your campaign? >> totally reasonable question sometimes initiatives like this, campaign's a principle a long shot and confess that is exactly the case, someone had to do it and that's indeed why i am two men who are 70% of our entire country does not want to see atop of the ticket, when 86% of the tickets believe president biden is too old to serve another term with his competitor donald trump facing federal indictments, somebody had to say the quiet part outside stop being a sheep and stand up and do something my whole history in business taking on duopoly. the ice cream business, gelato and frankly democrats and republicans stifling democracy in the united states, i make the case a dangerous duopoly far more focused on their own interests

instead of inspiring competition, and my layoffs are result having to assess the marketplace if you will and we're an early-stage start-up. i have to be become more of a gorilla campaign and make the case to american there's is an option despite the democratic party does not want primary voters to know there is. >> how do you stick it out afford to stick it out how long do you stick it out especially given even looking at polls today. what would be the inflection point, packing it in, or what is the pass so that that inflection point doesn't come the path >> you know fnknow, first earn delegates and win the first ballot how you earn the democratic nomination hard to compete against the democratic party i will and how long i'll continue as long as i find supporters willing to invest a little bit in the cause i intend to go all wait because i think it's incumbent on me to

demonstrate to the country who's better positioned to beat donald trump, in my case. i believe joe biden will lose. he's a good man. but he should not be running again. he's behind in every single major poll in the battleground states his approval numbers historically low and clearly in decline. my job is to introduce myself to the country. crisscross it every day i can and be in a position where national head-to-head polls will indicate who's better positioned to win delegates and conventiongoers in chicago at least the option to choose a nominee who is actually in position to win the election, versus coronating someone who is not. we'll compete and -- to the last, quinnipiac poll. not great numbers but the last two standing next generation candidates i think it's important that both nikki haley and i stick around and demonstrate what americans do with the moment in crisis.

>> what do you say to democrats who are desperate to beat president trump, that what you're doing, what your campaign, unto itself, is damaging to him and to that cause if that is, in fact, the cause? >> well, that's -- i think an interactional argument i'm running as a democrat in a primary by definition i don't steal votes from the everbal democratic candidate to not offer americans alternative when so clearly begging for one is -- >> congressman, the other problem. i see you and -- you are an impressive guy, you're young i like the cut of your jib, i like everything. then i hear you say my only problem with joe biden is his age. i mean -- you got me going with you for a second then you say, i like all of his

policies and i like everything he's done -- i mean, a defense secretary who worked with both types of presidents, robert gates, said joe biden's been wrong about every major foreign policy initiative for 40 years so look at the rest of -- look at his policies now. look at immigration. if you didn't say -- look at the -- biden ink, with the influence peddling seen with him and his brother and son and -- none of those things bother you? it's just his age, your own problem? >> no. i didn't say -- you asked why i got in the race. i got in the race because americans were demanding an alternative. my differences with the president. no question. i think president biden is a good man, is what i said leader of the past, in washington 50 years, his foreign policy missteps are clear. southern border an unmitigated embarrassing disaster, been so for decades. >> why ratings are where they are. that's the -- when you lost me had me at hello and then lost me

saying that, he's great but he's just too old. >> no, no. a lot more to it, guys when i'm president i want to initiate something called american dream accounts, federal government gives $5,000 investment accounts to every baby born in america children will have every baby b. children will have an app on their phone in school, learn how to invest, financial management, entrepreneurship as an inventive to graduate high school, that fund would be worth about 20 to $25,000 so every young american has a chance to succeed in this economy. i believe we have to build seven million homes in america we've got to find a path to ensure that every american has health care, and we stop paying such exorbitant rates. we've got to secure the southern border, and we have to be investors in peace, both at home and in the world not rocket science >> how would you grow the economy and deal with the deficit? >> well, first of all, i think it's time that this country

considers a national value added tax, a small consumption tax, to finance at least some of our most important programs, perhaps medicare and social security, or a dedicated revenue float to pay down the debt, $34 trillion now, $800 billion in debt services out of control i want to have a pro-growth economy. i think we have to make it easier to do business in this economy. both for small businesses, you think young entrepreneurs and large businesses alike as a business person, and a progressive, let me assure you, i know how to build businesses, take care of workers, and grow this whole economy for more people right now, we've got 60% of americans living paycheck to paycheck, 40% cannot afford a $400 emergency it's not working for everybody it's not about redistributing income it is about redistributing opportunity. that means raising the foundation for all americans i think we can do it and i think it's time for

business leader who hasn't had bankruptcies, who hasn't had his family foundation shut down. >> don't use the p-word. >> most of your campaign has been -- >> progressive >> it appears to have been about, i don't want to say attacking president biden, but to some degree, attacking president biden as opposed to attacking former president trump. and i'm curious how you think about that tactically. >> well, first of all, perception is that when msnbc, for example, your sister organization, has had me on the network one time in four months, despite being the ranking member of the middle east subcommittee on foreign affairs in the house of representatives. it's been hard to make my case from a policy perspective. i'm not someone who's attacking the president. i'm simply representing that about 86% of the entire country is saying every day and wondering why the heck those in washington won't say it publicly that's probably why you anticipate -- that's why you hear that. as for donald trump, look, there were a couple policies of his that i think were actually smart. i think the man lacks character.

he lacks empathy i think he's dangerous, and i think both men should be looking at retirement, not leading the free nation -- freest nation in the world and the most important seat of power, perhaps, in world history. it's as simple as that they're both problems. joe biden's a good man donald trump is not. >> congressman, we appreciate you joining us you have an invitation to come on back. >> i'd love to >> please do thank you. >> thank you guys. we're going to talk markets and get you ready for the trading day ahead. futures right now are strong this morning based on that report from nvidia yoreatin"sawbo ou' wchg quk x"n cnbc at morgan stanley, old school hard work meets bold new thinking. to help you see untapped possibilities and relentlessly work with you to make them real. ( ♪♪ ) we're in the security business... our job is to help people feel safe. not only our customers but those who matter most to them.

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welcome back to "squawk box. yale university is going to start requiring students to submit standardized test scores again. this follows testing optional policies during the pandemic students applying for admission in the fall of 2025 will now have to submit numbers, though yale says they can come from other tests besides the s.a.t. and the a.c.t. yale said making tests optional may have unintentionally disadvantaged students from lower socioeconomic backgrounds. joining us now to talk markets and earnings, kara murphy, chief investment officer of kestra investment management.

jon fortt was just on, kara, saying palo alto on one hand and nvidia on the other. i mean, what does it say about the overall market it's a market of stocks once again. we're back to that >> well, clearly, nvidia has been a huge driver of the market today. even before last night's earnings, nvidia was driving about half of the earnings growth within the tech sector. so, clearly, very important in a market cap weighted index. but i also think when you have so much attention and so many dollars going into just a handful of names, it means that there still remain wide swaths of the market where people are not paying very close attention, and as my good friend likes to say, there's prime rib available at hamburger prices, so there are a lot of areas of the market that i think could provide really interesting opportunities that are sort of being left behind on a day like today that nvidia is taking all the attention. >> like what >> well, so, in my mind, the biggest example of this is small caps versus large caps

this is just sort of extreme, but you have large caps that have outperformed small caps for an extended period of time, and by one of the widest margins that we've ever seen typically, we see large caps have a premium over small caps of about 40% today, they're running at about 100% premium to small caps now, yes, i think large caps have more economic tailwinds in their favor, but at some point, that's reflected in the prices so, again, if you look at the russell 2000, it's down about 18% from its peak, so it's still pricing in recessionary conditions so, if you look in some of those over overlooked areas, you can find some really good businesses that are trading at pretty beaten-up valuations >> this year, is it going to be a multiple story or an earnings story? we're going to have to count on earnings growth, i guess >> i think you're absolutely right. typically, in the early part of a cycle, which would have fit with a 2023, you see valuation start to pick up before earnings now, this is the second

consecutive quarter of positive earnings, so that's good we've gotten confirmation that american companies have growing earnings, but you need a really fundamental increase in order to be able to sustain a market rally. so, from here, we would like to see more coming through earnings rather than seeing valuations taking off >> and will the fed stay out of the way, do you think? will companies be able to do what they do or is it inflation fears going to get the fed a little bit -- become too much part of our lives, which they've been for the past five years or ten years, too much part of our lives, i would say >> i would like nothing better than to fade into the background, but unfortunately, i think it's a little bit early for that to happen i mean, just think about what happened to the markets late last year as the fed started to talk about the end of the fed rate hiking cycle. we had the pivot party, markets

rallying, yields falling, and now some of that is starting to be unwound the next move is still important to the market, and i also think you're starting to see distress getting into areas of the market that are more exposed to changes in rates >> okay. kara, thanks sorry to sort of be talking while you're talking but we got about five seconds >> that was fun. >> yeah, that was something. got one more left tomorrow god willing. make sure you join us. "squawk on the street" is next ♪ good thursday morning, welcome to "squawk on the street," i'm carl quintanilla with jim cramer at post nine of the new york stock exchange. david faber has the morning off. equities are bid across the board as nvidia comes through as a major catalyst for tech, even with yields climbing to two-and-a-half-month highs our road map begins with nvidia's monster quarter, sending the stock up double digits premarket revenue rising more than 260%

year on year ev