helicopter crash. new developments ahead michael cohen returning to the stand, lawyers for donald trump, trying to convey ten you to discredit him. and attempts to refloat the cargo ship that collided with the key bridge in baltimore are underway right now all right. >> 6:00 a.m. here in washington alive. look at the white house on this monday morning good morning, everyone. and kasie hunt. wonderful to have you with us. it is just before 6:00 a.m. here on the east coast. and we're going to start with breaking news out of iran this morning. matt nations, president ebrahim raisi killed sunday morning when his helicopter crashed in a remote area, or ron's foreign minister and other government officials were also on board after an event near the border with azerbaijan, rescuers reached the crash site overnight there were no survivors arounds

government immediately calling an urgent meeting russia's invasion, and america struggle to defend the west. david good morning. i'm very grateful to have you here this morning at big picture. let's talk about who this man was, what he meant in the region, and what this turn of events means for all of the tensions that have been swirling in recent months well good morning casey obviously, a great tragedy that this helicopter went down and it was pretty clear by late yesterday, just from the silence of the iranian officials that they had very little hope that there would be any survivors raisi himself was a very conservative cleric who came in very close to the

supreme leader of a country, the president of garan is the number two official. >> obviously, the supreme leader, ayatollah khomeini is this the most important decision-maker, but the two were very close and he came in to basically run the crackdowns that we have seen on dissent and human rights. >> he accelerated the support for terror groups including hamas hezbollah the arming of the houthis he became made the decisions along with the ayatollah to support russia in the war in ukraine. and of course iran has now become a major supplier of the drones at many other weapons systems that they're using. >> and he has accelerated but not put into overdrive. >> the nuclear program so the question for the united states now is, does the ailing

ayatollah khomeini, whose mao in his mid 80s choose somebody or designee, there will be an election, but it's obviously not an open one. >> choose somebody who will follow them that same path david, what do you make of the fact that we seem to be hearing from state tv that this was something that should be blamed on the weather, that there is no sense at this time that there were there was foul play. >> we're hearing that from the majority leader, chuck schumer a member of the gang hang of it here at home. >> but that also seems to be the story that is being pushed forward on iranian state tv, which is something are other national security analysts have noted as remarkable an important, what is your view of it? if remarkable, because for all of the steps that i mentioned before, one of the things that we noticed about

president rice, he's government is that they didn't want to tip in which emma war with the united states, with israel. they understood what the impact of that would be even last week there were some indirect costs in qatar with united states just to make sure that this didn't all spin out of control. so as soon as this helicopter went down, obviously, the country was right for all kinds of conspiracy theories and i'm sure we well, here are some particularly from the right wingers in iran, but all you had to do was look at the photos of the rescuers trying to make it up that mountain. sayyed in this pea soup of a fog. and it seemed pretty clear that whether could well and had a lot to do with this. >> yeah. david standby for me for a second. i want to bring in cnn's frederik pleitgen, who is live for us. he's

actually reporting on assignment in poland right now, but fred, you've traveled to iran recently and i wanted to get your perspective on these unfold holding events and also kind of just check in with the latest on what we know at this hour by their case. >> but we know that right now what the iranians are centered, i do. it's trying to get the bodies away from that crash site and bring them back to first tabriz, which is where that chopper actually was supposed to be going. and then of course, tehran and for any sort of other sort of burial ceremonies that are going to take place in the next couple of days. and i think on the one hand, of course, you have the whole aftermath of this crash, which of course was a huge shock to the whole power structure of the islamic republic. but then also you have the leadership of the islamic republic, namely the supreme leader himself already thinking about how things move along now in the future, one of the things i thought was quite interesting because this chopper essentially disappeared off all the radars that pretty much noon time one p.m.

yesterday, it took them a long time to get to that crash site. david was talking about the atrocious weather conditions out there. and then of course also the fact that its mountainous, very difficult terrain as well. but you already had prim, leader coming out, chairing a meeting of a ron's national security council and there on the one hand, of course, back at that point in time saying that everybody was praying that those onboard the helicopter would serve would be found alive, but then also already looking towards the future and saying, look, everybody needs to be assured that there is not going to be a break getting the government that all the government services and everything will continue as they had before that there's going to be that continuity. i think one of the things that the leadership right now is trying to project is stability in the wake of all of this, because i think there's two points to as david was talking about and he's absolutely right. of course, president raisi is the second most important figure in the country the most, the second most important decision maker, but we also have to keep in mind that the foreign minister of the country, hossein amir-abdollahian was also killed on that crash and he was

absolutely instrumental to forming around foreign policy very often, of course, at odds and against the united states, but definitely something someone who had the reins of iran's foreign ministry. and of course, also someone who was very important in the past couple of weeks, as we almost got to that war between israel and iran, which of course could have been catastrophic for that region. so you not only have the head of government of iran being killed, but also pretty much the architect of the current foreign policy of iran as well. but wake of that, the iranians, of course right now trying to project that stability while at the same time, i know from on-the-ground that of course, the whole country has put into a morning mode. now you have black flags popping up pretty much everywhere in one of the most important places it's actually in a place called mosab in the east of iran, which is of course one of those spiritual centers, but also is essentially the home area of ebrahim raisi, where he comes from religiously and of course, where he comes from politically as well, pc all right, for him

to liken for us, fred, thanks for scrambling to get up for us and david sanger, i really appreciate you joining us here to kick off the show as well. thanks to you both all right. >> coming up here, lawyers for donald trump, hoping to hammer michael cohen's credibility when he returns to the stand just hours from now plus donald trump suggesting there could be a three-term president if he wins in november, we'll talk about that assignments are going on the tornado here i'm thinking language and die and i thought that was it fine when earth with liev schreiber premieres june 2 at nine on cnn. >> not to bet on a subway series foot-long, except we add on a new foot-long sayyed kick. we're talking about $2 a footlong to row three footlong pretzel $5 footlong cookie. every effort foot-long deserts are perfect sidekick water wallace, your favor, subway service up to date when it comes to investing, we live in

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welcome back. >> we're going to dive right back into our breaking news this morning. the death of iranian president ebrahim raisi. he was one of nine people onboard a helicopter that crashed over the weekend in a remote part of the country. iran reports there were no survivors. matthew chance looks back on raisi's leaf let me she was a staunch critic of the west, even seen as a possible successor to the iranian supreme leader behemoth racy came to paris in 2021 winning an election with a record low turnout. >> and for three years enacting policies that made him a polarizing figure at home and abroad his presidency saw a dangerous escalation and tensions with israel in april, he supported a major attack against the country in an unprecedented response to a suspected israeli strike on the iranian consulate in syria,

which killed several iranian commanders throughout races presidency, it ran pressed ahead with its nuclear program violating an international agreement. while blaming the us for withdrawing. and european states for not living up to their end of the deal to run also supplied lethal drone technology to russia, fueling the conflict in ukraine allowing moscow to strike deep behind the front lines meanwhile, at home raisi oversaw a brutal crackdown on dissent, suppressing a 2022 uprising sparked by the death of mahsa amini, a young woman in the custody of a religious morality please. it all cemented his status as a loyal hard liner, potentially in line. does exceed iran's 85-year-old supreme leader, president races sudden death plunges that succession into

chaos racy died along with his minister of foreign affairs has seen a mere abdullah rayon the top iranian diplomat took office in 2021. after a long career with the foreign ministry all right, that was cnn's matthew chance for us. i want over here in panel and now elliot williams, a cnn legal analyst, former federal prosecutor, stephen collinson, as cnn politics senior reporter. matt gorman is here. he's former advisor for tim scott's presidential campaign and karen phineas, cnn political commentator i want to start with you, steven. you are the man who looks at the big picture here for us and right now, what we have coming in our statements from hamas morning, this man has below morning this man, the russians, morning this man, and of course, we heard matthews reporting about the way he approached the country, the death of mahsa amini in particular galvanizing the streets of iran how do you see

his death impacting broadly what this has been an incredibly tense period of time in the region. and with the united states i think those messages explain the axis of pao that iran has created not just throughout the middle east, but it's closer relationships now with russia the way it's factored into since campaign in ukraine with the supply of drones and everything like this. i don't think we should expect any change to iran's policy domestically or internationally . or indeed to american policy razi was a very repressive figure domestically, as you pointed out, the lesson of history is that when there is political uncertainty and around that leads to more repression. having said that this has been a time of great upheaval. you talked about those demonstrations. there was an islamic state terror attack on iran, which was a great embarrassment to the regime very recently, we had this shooting war unprecedented

between israel and iran and this will factor in, i think to the succession of the supreme leader, ayatollah. ayatollah, how many razi was seen as a potential successor that was going to happen anyway, the ayatollahs 85 is very sickly this could bring all that forward and we can see yeah a front-loading of that succession crisis. right. and you mentioned the continuation and clearly they seem to be trying to send that message by me even in the fact that they're acknowledging, it seems the weather was the cause of this. that they do want to continue on this track. i think it's worth reminding everyone, especially as we are confronting the ongoing war in israel and gaza that raisi was actually a holocaust denier. this is what he told cbs back its september of 20 i believe let's watch this do you believe the holocaust happened? >> that's six million jews were slaughtered move any mass,

any atari he mass eddie, look historical events should be investigated by researchers and historians initial on all, um, would you a tough up? >> while they should, there are some signs that had happened if so, they should allow it to be investigated and researched. >> i'll correct myself. this was september 2022. so an extraordinary recent i've set of comments where he says there that they should allow it to be investigated. again, he's talking about the holocaust. this is what the us holocaust memorial said at the time the iranian government has a long history of d9 in the holocaust and delegitimising the state of israel, putting the regimes unadulterated antisemitism on full display history teaches us the dangerous if ignoring antisemitism from any corner. but coming from a head of state is concerning and needs to be universally condemned elliot williams, i mean, big picture as we are. i asked, even know if they're trying to continue

all of this. i mean, this is the world in which we are living as these very present tensions continue to royalist, i guess the question i have in picking up, i don't know if any of this has come across your reporting, steven, but in terms of uncertainty, it's rare that there is ahead of government who dies in office. it doesn't happen that often. they often seem to expire when their time is up and what are we hearing or understanding about a leadership vacuum at a influential country in the middle east. >> i think the key here is that the supreme leader has all the power. ultimately in terms of foreign policy and domestic policy. he orchestrated the rise of razi, the last arena election by a standard of elections that are very, very repressive and very closed. this was even more so. so the power is still there, but the point the succession is unclear going forward into he was a new generation of the islamic revolution. and it's unclear at this point exactly who would

follow that. i expect we'll hear from us conservatives. this is the time to put more pressure on iran to try and destabilized that regime the issue there is that over the last 50 years, us efforts to destabilise around have looked more optimistic than they actually turn out to be in practice all right, we're gonna lot more here up next, an attempt to refloat the cargo ship, crash into baltimore's key bridge. that is happening right now. we've got to live update this is a secret, war, secrets and spi hey premier sunday, june 2, attack on cnn for over 25 years, loves sack has been rewriting the rules of comfort. >> it's okay to change your style, get messy yet immersed loves shaq. >> you make the rules getting your dream kitchen is easier than you think. >> cabinets to go can design a beautiful high-quality, and affordable kitchen make over. that is sure to wow, choose

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>> so you know, this is the most significant development yet in getting the port of baltimore reopen, remember the dali has been back there blocking the port of baltimore as it leads the shipping channel that goes in the chesapeake bay then beyond. that is so important because this is a place where goods, large and small come through. we're talking things as smallest spices, as big as cars, 15,000 jobs directly impacted here, you can see over my shoulder here the dali and the hive of activity that is taking place here we are seeing the police boats, we are seeing more activity happening this morning, high tide occurred at 5:24 a.m. and that is what cruz because here are trying to take advantage of all the work here really began overnight at 2:00 a.m. to try and build job some water that was onboard the ship. they've been trying to run tug boats up and down the channel here to make sure that it is clear. so when they finally move this ship, that it will be okay. there are about

five times hug boats around the dali right now to try and push and pull it into the secret terminal here in the port of baltimore that is where it's left 55 days ago. and it has been blocking the port ever since. once you to listen now to governor wes moore, he says, the impact here will be felt in baltimore and worldwide i'm proud that we're on track by the end of may. we'll have that federal channel reopened and within within days, we're going to have that massive vessel, the dali out of that federal channel we are as a hearing here and capitol hill last week where we heard from investigators from the national transportation safety board. >> the significant thing about the dali is there were a total of four power failures onboard to import and the head of the national transportation safety board says, she wants to know why hi, the crew switched over to backup circuit breakers that are not been used for months. so the investigation is still

playing out here. casey, we are hearing though, that there'll be 2028 before this bridge is fully rebuilt. this is just the first significant step on that years-long path. >> wow it's gonna be awhile pretty amazing pictures. they're pittman team for us. always grateful to have you. thank you so much alright, coming up next here, how will the us government respond to the helicopter crash that killed a ron's president will be live at the white house the are going off and the tornado i'm thinking nine die and i thought that was it mildly birth with liev schreiber premieres june 2 had nine on cia. >> i started bright star care to provide a higher standard of care it's been my goal for 20 years. >> and it always will be if you're an experienced caregiver with that same passion, join the brand that supports you most my frequent heartburn had me taking an acid

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back, breaking news out of iran overnight that nations president ebrahim raisi reported dead after his helicopter crashed in a remote area iran's foreign minister and other government officials were also on board. they had an attended they had attended an event near the border with azerbaijan. cnn white house correspondent arlette saenz joins me now, live from the white house. arlette, good morning to you. what are we hearing from the white house at this hour? or will the white house really has not said much since the first reports of the crash relating to the iranian president raisi emerged yesterday afternoon, and they have yet to respond to the fact that it was confirmed that he was killed in that crash. all we know at this point is that president biden had been briefed on the reports of the crash yesterday afternoon as he was traveling from atlanta to detroit. but beyond that, the us, the white house, the state department hasn't put out any type of comments, but they have been watching all of these reported credibly closely and likely will be very careful in

the type of language they will use. one thing that the white house and us officials will also be watching closely plea is what will happen now. what who might emerge as his successor at a time when the region has been destabilized amid that conflict between israel and hamas. now, the us has no diplomatic relations with iran, but there have been private back channel talks in the past. there have been indirect talks when related to trying to revive the nuclear deal between the us and iran. there have been backed channel talks in regards to some of the iranian-backed proxies that have destabilized parts of the region. but we will be waiting to see what exactly the white house has to say going forward and they will be keeping a very close eye on who might be announced as raisi successor in the coming days, weeks whenever that might happen all right. >> are led signs of force at the white house also worth noting that the senate majority leader, remember the gang of eight said yesterday he spoke to intelligence authorities and said there was no evidence of

foul play. so for whatever that is worth, our thanks very much for that report. i really appreciate it all right. >> now this today, michael cohen returns to the witness stand for more cross-examinatio n in donald trump's criminal hush money trial last week, the defense hammered cohen over inconsistencies in his testimony, but courtroom theatrical may have over overshadowed what our next guest insists is the smoking gun. here you can see two documents including handwritten notes outlining money that trump owed cohen. cohen says part of that payment is reimbursement for the hush money payment to stormy daniels and joining us now is cohen's former attorney, lanny davis, who sits with our panel. and good morning. wonderful to have you here. this document does seem to be at the center things but we do know that you're former client and you had it tough day on the stand on thursday as some real significant questions raised about whether he actually had lied to the jury. what is the prosecution do you think they need to do next to try to adjust some of this other

thing. >> documents speak for themselves and in this particular case, the key issue that the jury will have to decide respect whatever verdict they come up with. hope mr. trump does the same is whether or not donald trump reimbursed keyword that you use reimburse versus reimbursed versus paid legal fees when he wrote checks from the oval office? as a sitting president of $35,000 per month to michael cohen. most of them from his personal checking account. if they were reimbursements. that is a crime to reimburse for a crime that michael cohen did the time for a crime of contributing money to somebody to stay silent right before an election for political reasons. so if it's a reimbursement, that would be a crime, mr. allen weisselberg the cfo closest to donald trump, not testifying wrote on a piece of paper. the number $130,000 times two so that the income taxes would make michael cohen hole had the number one

30 times to his two 60 he added up to other numbers that were owed to michael cohen for a total of $210,000 multiplied by two divided by 12 months equals $35,000. there's no way those were legal fees. those numbers are corroborated by other witnesses as to why he was paid. and we have allen weisselberg speaking with authenticated handwriting. and we don't eat michael cohen's testimony. >> well, but what about this phone call? i mean, did he lie to the did michael cohen lied to the jury about the phone call where he said that he told donald trump about stormy daniels, but actually the text messages show that he was concerned about a pranking teenager. >> well, first of all, the phone call has nothing to do with the document that says donald trump didn't eat less very relevant to whether or not donald trump knew because right now we're talking about allen weisselberg. another it is not relevant to the document that speaks for itself. >> i just gave you the math and they're not legal, but again, i mean, this is this is allen weisselberg. don't we do not have to show that donald trump

knew about all of this for him to be the one that's on the hook for it, allen weisselberg is close to donald trump, the jury's going to have to infer that donald trump knew about that document, but we know that he wrote $35,000 a month checks, 12 checks, if he claims they will legal fees. >> that's a problem. let me address your credibility issue. you're gonna michael cohen saying that he didn't remember one phone call, but he did remember a frequent that i know he did. is to ask keith schiller to hand trump the phone when he wanted to talk to trump. that is confirmed. so the two things may show that he forgot. i'm not sure of the word lie is justified. >> all fair enough. hello, lanny, i'm sure you and i are gonna be spending a lot of time together today. i really appreciate you got to really be with us. >> all right. up next we're going to continue to follow the breaking news out of iran, where that nations president has been confirmed dead after a helicopter for crash we just shipped are millionth monthly coffee subscription boxes. >> so we're sending custom. thank you gifts to our team, our customers it's just as excited as we are and knows

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breaking news out of iran as that country's president, ebrahim raisi, has brynn pronounced dead in the wake of a helicopter crash that also killed the iranian foreign minister. >> our panel is back with us. we are also joined by joel ruben former deputy assistant secretary of state in the obama administration. i get that right. >> thank you very much for being here. and let's talk about this in the context of a region that has been absolutely fraught with tension, including a hot war between iran and israel. that of course the us was also involved in helping israel defend itself from, as you watch events unfolding, i do think it's significant and noteworthy that what we're hearing from iranian state media right now is that this was a crash that was caused by the weather. there have been lots of questions by our national security experts. we've had on this morning about whether there would have been something else to that. they point to that as remarkable and noteworthy. what's your view yeah, case you like barbie, i got to be where any conspiracy theories

that are being put out there right now, i'm glad that we hear that statement coming from iran, that this was whether alone, there's enough conspiracy theory in the middle east when i think about raisi, think about domestic repression, four and foreign aggression what he has done over the last several years is radicalized. >> iran's leadership to a level that we have not experienced partnering with russia against ukraine being the leader of iran when the hamas attacks occurred on october seventh, a couple of years ago essentially leading the most deaths. >> let me let me pause one second. i'm so sorry because we do actually have some breaking news that's coming from our christiane amanpour, who joins us now to fill us in on where she is. >> why? she's there, and what we're learning here at cnn christiane well, i'm here at

the icc and i have just had an exclusive interview with the icc prosecutor, karim khan way he has announced the icc is seeking a warrants in relation to the october 7 attacks in israel and the gaza war he is seeking arrest warrants for the top three hamas leaders, yahya sinwar mohammad al better known as muhammad dave. >> and is smile hernia. there are two which are the heads of the military wing of hamas, and one is the political wing. in addition, because of events in gaza since after october 7, he is seeking arrest warrants for the prime minister of israel, benjamin netanyahu and indeed, the israeli defense minister, yoav gallant here is what he told me and then i will explain the charges were here at the

icc you are today announcing that you are applying for a warrants for top military and political leadership in the israel god was a war since the october 7 events. first and foremost explain to me exactly what you're asking for and who you are charging today. christian, we've applied for warrants to the pre-trial chamber of the international criminal court in relation to three individuals that are hamas members sinwar, who is in charge on the ground. that's yahya sinwar. absolutely dave who's in charge of the al-qassam brigade and hernia who's one of the political bureau based in doha. >> what are the charges the charges are extermination, murder, taking of hostages, so rape and sexual assault in detention. >> so these are the key crimes

that are alleged to have been committed by these three individuals. >> the world was shocked on 7 october when people were ripped from their bedrooms, from their homes, from the different kibbutzim in israel and people have suffered enormously and we have a variety of evidence to support the applications that we've submitted to the judge's. >> you have also issued warrants against the top political and military leadership of the government of the state of israel we've applied for warrants. >> of course, the judges must determine whether or not to issue them, but we've applied today will apply for warrants for prime minister netanyahu. and also minister of defense gallant. four crimes of causing extermination causing starvation as a method of war, including the denial of humanitarian relief supplies deliberately targeting civilians in conflict so this

is an incredibly important moment in this ongoing war. >> and the prosecutor karim khan insisted that this is because of evidence. he said that what we have done is so these arrest warrants on these charges and our level of evidence has been we have reasonable grounds to believe that there will be convictions based on this evidence, not anything lower than that. so i thought that was really important to be able to bring up to you in addition, when it comes to the israeli state, the state of israel, which is a democracy, i asked him why why this is the first time they icc has ever sought indictments and arrest warrants in a democracy and i said, well, they have a judiciary and independent demand hi crissy. why can't they do it? and he said, if in fact they decide to take over and they decide to actually the

judicial system itself there decides it wants to take this ahead. well, then it can, but so far and he pointed out that he's been warning israel and in fact, the international community about the lack of humanitarian aid, about the starvation and famine that have been reported by not only us officials, but also many international aid officials. he said, and this is a paraphrase of a quote i have been telling you this for months. if you don't do something, don't complain when my office takes action. so in in the issue of whether or not they're going to be able to actually issue arrest warrants. well, they will if they get permission from there trial judges, that is the next process and in the fact that neither israel nor the united states, nor other countries, some are actually parties to the icc. the actual practicality of getting those arrests and anytime soon is obviously something probably more in the distance, but it

does. he said put everybody on guard around the world that in his words, nobody is above the law. this is not political, this is not ethnic, this is merely applying the law according to our mandate, the ics casey christiane, can i ask what are the implications if they do get these warrants for travel for the prime minister, benjamin netanyahu and other israeli officials and also, are they at the icc assessing the ramifications of this for them politically considering the level of backlash this is going to receive from officials here in the united states let me address that question first. as you know, and i put it to him. there was a letter signed to the icc, wendy's reports first started to surface weeks ago by several republican senators who essentially told the icc and karim on personally. and i'm paraphrasing again, if you go ahead with this, we will sanction you. we will make sure

that none of this can be carried out. and he took it as a threat to the mission and to the mandate but that's one issue, but he said nonetheless, we cannot be bound by those kinds of political statements. we are, we have an international mandate. that means when we'd whatever country it be, whether it's against putin in russia, whether it's in many of the other countries that they look at this is about evidence. this is about applying the law equally now in terms of travel, as you know, and we can use putin as the example because he was well as his hunch woman were indicted months ago by the icc in relation principally to the illegal abduction of ukrainian children. now, putin, also, russia is not a member of the icc. nonetheless, he for instance, chose not to travel to a big meeting in south africa in the last few months because it might have been the case that he might have been arrested because south africa is party to the icc you see so

the individuals could travel in terms of places where the icc does not have jurisdiction, but it would probably not be wise according to the icc for them to travel places where the icc does have jurisdiction and some analysts have also said that this comes at a predicting that something like this might happen at some point. it comes at a time when this war is in a really very, very heightened stage when there's a potential attack further invasion into rafah, while the hostages, the israeli hostages still have not been released. and for that, they have indicted hamas on the hostages as well. that this is also something that had to happen right now because it's been going on for seven months, casey. >> all right. are christiane amanpour without exclusive for us, christiane very grateful to have your reporting. thank you very much.

>> our scene and stephen collinson back with me and joel rubin is here as well. >> i'm joel, can i just start with you at you worked in the obama a state department. this is going to ripple through our politics today in a major way. what is your initial reaction? >> this is a travesty of justice. the equating of hamas terrorists with the elected leader of a sovereign government, the democratic state is just such a profound inversion of the principle of justice. there is no doubt that the war in gaza, that israel's can ducting is fierce, difficult, and painful, and harming palestinian civilians. but the idea that somehow that is equal to an unprovoked terrorist assault led by hamas and yahya sinwar, the leader here is named that unprovoked attack somehow is equal. now, the israeli response equal now to that in the eyes of

international court of justice, and it now any terrorist state knows that it can take down the sovereign states leader if it conducts an attack, it just boggles the mind and it shreds the un's credibility and carlson, what are you seeing this big picture? obviously there are a lot of people here in the united states who are concerned about the humanitarian crisis that is unfolding in gaza. the president has been grappling with protests over that, but to joel's point, i mean, this is a a pretty remarkable step that it says hamas and israeli leaders right now it's extraordinary and it's going to have massive international implications the thing i think of most immediately is how this impacts into the politics in israel how it is lightly to make prime minister netanyahu feel even more of that. he's going this alone if he has to that may cause them to take it even more hard line on this issue in rafah and all rebounds back to the united states and sharpens is very difficult political position that the

present is in because critics of netanyahu in the us, we'll see this as a vindication for their criticisms of the operation into into gaza and i just wonder how this will go down among the presence political advisors, as we head into the critical point of a campaign where this is going to be a big issue. >> yeah, i mean, joe, how do you see the likely response from the biden administration on this? because we know that senator tom cotton, for example, has already put out a letter in anticipation of this saying, essentially that he is going to make it impossible for icc officials to even operate in the us. basically try to use a powers to do that. what are what, what do you expect in terms of a response from the biden team on this? >> well, the icc is is an entity we've always had a difficult relationship with the united states, and i think the president biden, he's going to point to the reality, which is that hamas started this, this war, this conflict, and he is working president biden, that

is working to end it. and working with the israeli leadership the prime minister on a plan for the day after. and what would that look like? an all of those points it will continue to reiterate, but i think he's going to point out the big picture that this is this is not appropriate that we do not compare sovereign states directly in courts of law. in their leaders. their elected leaders to the heads of terrorist organizations. and i think he'll stand firm on that principle. >> karen videos with us as well. i mean, karen, this is obviously something that the biden team has had to grapple with. do you think joel is right? >> i do. although i think this is a prime example of how different it is. what you may do politically and what you may need to say politically is so very different than what you may what you need to do diplomatically. and this exerts so much more pressure on the president, given this dynamic, the dynamic with republicans in congress you had at least defining over the weekend congresswoman in israel

criticizing president biden i think in the context as we were speaking about this earlier this morning with what's just happened in iran so it's just a huge stew of, i would say international chaos and many ways. and yet how you handle that from a diplomatic and national security framework is not necessarily going to be what he will need to do and say politically and just from a practical standpoint, what happens when you have a stateless entity that is in a region that the icc claims to have jurisdiction over, which is palate plus gaza, i believe west bank jill, you can correct me on this, but not israel, which is not a member of the icc. >> so how do you, how does the icc even have teeth to go after israeli leadership? and these stateless bodies that it's just what i mean is it's a legal gray area in this space of international law. if it might have just been a public statement from the icc to step in and say, we are doing

something about these two entities that we he are equating with each other. but as a practical matter, nothing i think really happens in terms of sanctions on anybody, right? >> right. >> yeah. go ahead. yeah. >> to me, it comes off like a premeditated political punishment of the israeli leadership that apparently there were think about this for months and warning for months that's not illegal operation, that's a political operation. it's unfortunate pains me to say that because someone who believes in international cooperation, multilateral, was in united nations we need to have credible institutions there that do uphold the rule of law. and this idea that what is now the icc going to go in and go into gaza and find sinwar and arrest him and bring him to trial. that's nonsense. and so it's ultimately in the practical world going to make it much harder for these israeli leadership is execute their duties as sovereign heads of state of a democratic country. it's going to make it much harder for them. it's not

gonna have any real impact on hamas steven, we've seen the travails and you mentioned kind of what what's going on inside israel right now. i mean, netanyahu kind of had a setback potentially over the weekend with benny gantz, a part of his coalition government coming out and saying that he's if he doesn't change course, he's going to leave that of course, you had some comments also from you golan, the defense minister, who here has also one of these people here. what impact does this have in terms of i mean, it strikes me that it might actually strengthen netanyahu's hand inside israel. what's your view of how we should be interpreting that? >> i think it's gonna be very difficult now for hello ganz to come out and follow up his statement that he might leave, which is it's been bubbling up for a long time and it's been expected. we've seen these tensions inside the coalition a very right-wing coalition that netanyahu is reliant on very right-wing parties. they're also forcing his hand. >> but just domestically, politically when the prime minister is perceived as under

attack from the outside, it's can be very difficult for that to that fracturing of the cabinet from galan's want you to take place? >> yeah. i mean, joe, you're very familiar with the internal politics of israel. how do you look at this question? >> yeah, i concur completely luck. we were just seeing a bit of a a tipping point. now in israeli politics where senior leaders of the now we're posing premise units and yahoos recent decisions related to ceasefire for hostage deal. his day after planning. they're going to now pull back because they're going to be seen as essentially throwing netanyahu to the wolves. and they themselves can end up following him there. and i think makes it harder now for them to raise significant opposition domestically and premise netanyahu to stevens point. look, he's plaintiffs right-wing base. he needs to keep his coalition intact and he has some very firm will only strengthen his hands that's to play. >> i mean, we shouldn't lose sight of the fact to that netanyahu has legal problems of his own in israel right? which is part of why he wants to

remain in power, is exactly. >> and in many ways, he is continue to keep himself immune from that prosecution because of this governing coalition. karen, the relationship between biden and netanyahu, we know has actually been pretty fraught. and it was one that he tried to keep pretty behind the scenes in the beginning, but has since been more public. and i'm. pushing back against some of what netanyahu has done here. how do you expect him to balance a response to this with that relationship that he has with netanyahu well, i think it certainly puts pressure on him as we were just saying, it puts him more netanyahu more in a corner. >> and i think therefore demands some kind of a comment from the president of support at a time when, as we know, he has also trying thank to press netanyahu to prioritize getting the hostages out, not making the full assault on rafah. so

how that conversation i think unfolds today we'll be very interesting to read out in terms of, because again, i think it becomes more important to reaffirm the reaffirmation of support for it that we've heard from the president all right. are jeremy diamond is standing by now with more on this jeremy, can you we've been we've been just digging into the politics on the ground in israel around this, this, of course, going to probably land there like an earthquake. what are you learning in hearing from officials there? >> well, we've reached out, to for reaction obviously to the prime minister's office as well as the defense minister's office. since these are the two individuals on the israeli sayyed who the icc is seeking arrest warrants four so far, no reaction, but there's no question that this will indeed prompt significant reaction inside of israel. well and i suspect that it will also prompt quite a bit of defiance from the israeli prime minister

himself. we got a taste at the end of last month as there were rumors circulating that the icc might indeed issue or seek arrest warrants against top israeli leaders. we got a taste of what the israeli prime minister's reaction would be when he preempted effectively play this move saying that a decision by the icc to issue arrest warrants for israeli political officials or military commanders. he said would be a quote, scandal on a historic scale. he also called it, said it would be an indelible stain on all of humanity and an unprecedented anti-semitic hate crime. so that is the kind of language which that i think we will, we can expect to hear from the israeli prime minister as we expect reaction soon an unprecedented anti symmetric reality that's very, very strong language there. >> a jeremy diamond for us first of all, i'm jeremy. thank you for being here to share all of that reporting again, we're reporting here now at cnn at the icc is