all russian and soviet dictators, their problem is they always think that they're the last line of defense. you are in power. you have the right to, if you decide, to destroy it so nobody else will get it. the united states doesn't even notice that the soviets are on edge. they didn't even put the soviet reaction into ronald reagan's presidential daily brief. [indistinct radio chatter] [narrator] before andropov can act, the able archer operation wraps up on schedule. [pilot] roger that. [narrator] andropov is finally persuaded that this really was just an exercise. this time.

[tim] the united states didn't know to ratchet down the tension when it really mattered. that is an indicator of just the lack of understanding that the united states and the soviet union had of each other. but in a nuclear confrontation, lack of understanding can have catastrophic consequences when adversaries have nuclear weapons pointed at each other and don't understand each other. ♪ every day in every state across the country, our political system is bankrolled by an army of fund-raisers, pulling in millions of dollars a race.

sometimes it looks like you might imagine-- knocking on doors, calling every name in the phone book, and emails--so many emails. but for all those little fish throwing $100 to their local race, it's the whales those campaign fund-raisers really need-- powerful, rich individuals and companies. and when they donate $25,000, $100,000, a million dollars, they want a favor...or 10. it should be obvious that's corrupt, but with a wink and a nod, political deals toe the bribery line every single day. and we may never have noticed that if a certain illinois governor hadn't flung back the curtain with an unrepentant ego, a political corruption crime spree, and a set of unprecedented audio recordings that shined a bright light on the inner workings of american political power. ladies and gentlemen, meet rod blagojevich. ♪

♪ it was early morning, 'cause i used to get up every morning and turn on the 6:00 news, and, you know, like, you're kinda waking up, and then you're like, "well, wait, what?" [helicopter whirring] oh, sh--, they outside of blagojevich's house! they got cameras, they got cars, and then they march him out. and you're like, "that's our governor, joe." breaking news-- the illinois governor, rod blagojevich, charged with plotting to sell barack obama's former senate seat. tapper: remember this guy? he sure hopes you do. governor rod blagojevich went down in a blaze of infamy for one of the largest political corruption scandals of our time. the governor was allegedly trying to sell

the illinois senate seat vacated by president-elect obama. in fact, part of the governor's sales pitch was that the seat still had that new obama smell. [audience laughter] appointing someone to the senate is a rare opportunity when the will of the people is swapped wholesale for a gubernatorial power trip. blagojevich had the sole authority to place whomever he wanted straight into the halls of the u.s. senate, and he was not shy about wanting a little something in return. with the fbi recording his phone calls, for the first time since nixon, the public was able to listen in on raw backroom politics, and there's nothing quite like hearing it from the horse's mouth. reporter: the criminal complaint quotes blagojevich as saying the senate seat "was a valuable thing. you just don't give it away for nothing." another quote-- "i've got this thing, and it's bleeping golden." [blagojevich speaking]

"i've got this thing, and it's [bleep] golden." -yeah. -[audience laughter] "and i'm not just giving it up for [bleep] nothing." [laughter] was there a second [bleep] in there? tapper: racking up a staggering 24 criminal charges, governor blagojevich's actions essentially boiled down to four things-- extortion, bribery, corruption, and wire fraud. and it wasn't just about the senate seat. blagojevich was also found guilty of extorting a children's hospital. you can't write this stuff. he's an arrogant punk who thinks that, you know, he's bulletproof. well, he's not. he was convicted on 18 total charges and sentenced to 14 years, the longest sentence ever handed down to a governor. people loathed blagojevich for the way he politicked, but was what he did so blatantly criminal? 'cause the truth is that the line between what's illegal and what's allowable is much murkier than we'd like to think, and this is where the rod blagojevich story

gets interesting. let me reassert to all of you once more that i am not guilty of any criminal wrongdoing. [camera shutter clicks] was rod a corrupt politician or just a politician operating in a corrupt system that still thrives to this day? so, governor, thanks for doing this. thank you. so you've been out of prison now for almost two years. a little over two years. and you're still very outspoken about how you feel like the case against you was unjust. there isn't really an argument about what you said. -right. -it's on tape. right. the question is whether it was illegal and whether it was morally wrong. look, if you're saying, "do we have a fund-raising system in america that you can arguing is legalized bribery?" i think there's truth to that. but did i do anything other than that standard that every other person in politics does, from president biden on down? i did the same as them and nothing worse.

there is this real problem in american politics today where prosecutors are weaponizing themselves, criminalizing routine illegal practices in government politics, and i think it's wrong when they do it to bill clinton. it's wrong, i think, when they did it to president trump 'cause i have strong views on that, and i know it was wrong when they did it to me. okay, lot to unpack there. let's talk about the chicago and illinois system, because you're hardly the first governor in history, even in recent history, to--to go to prison. what's the situation here that causes this to happen? well, i think it's time-honored here, and there's a long history in chicago politics, illinois politics, where pretty much everybody gets rich. ah, chicago politics. it's like going to a pay pond when you go fishing. like, if you are a prosecutor, you cannot be in illinois and not get something. illinois is steeped in a rich history of political corruption that dates back a century to the prohibition era, when bootlegging gangsters such as al capone bought off politicians and police departments,

keeping them drunk on power and...also just drunk. in rod's lifetime, illinois has developed a rap sheet that any mobster would be proud of-- more than 1,700 convictions for corruption, including nearly 30 chicago aldermen, eight stage legislators, two u.s. congressmen, and before rod came onto the scene, three governors. in an odd way, the very people who should hate the idea of corruption are kind of proud that this is al capone's illinois. chicago is a wink and a nod town. -it's a shot and a beer town. -[clink] lot of it has to do with family relationships, because a lot of the political leadership in chicago and illinois are family-related. there's the daley family, the madigans. all of these families sort of become part of this mafia. -yeah. -a political mafia, and they're the ones who make the rules. i didn't come from that. i had to marry into it.

i met a girl on the 6th of march, 1988. she was wearing a red dress, and she happened to be the daughter of an old-fashioned chicago political war boss. and she's my wife patti. we fell in love. patti blagojevich is a loyal wife, she is a tough customer, and she's the daughter of dick mell. she's complicated. that budding relationship between those two is how rod goes from this nobody politically, finding a way to kind of imbed himself into one of these big political families in chicago. they have so much power. i don't think it was, you know, some great surprise that, like, you know, when it comes time to meet the parents, that dick mell was the father-in-law and the--the powerful city council chieftain. we're gonna try to work together to put this great city back together so that we're all part of it and we all feel free. dick mell was a guy who always had the voice in the backrooms. he was a power broker in that kind of chicago classic sense.

before politics, it was a nice relationship, but for the most part, respectful. and then because i was in the family, and i was actually pretty good at helping her dad, local politics, knocking on doors and trying to get him votes, there was an opportunity to run for office. in rod blagojevich, mell could see a guy that eventually, if he does it right, "i could sort of pass the mantle toward." rod was an immediate hit with illinois voters, who sent him first to the state house in 1992 and then to the u.s. congress in 1996. dick mell says, "i can see you being governor." and i gotta be honest, i'm sure if i'm looking at it from dick mell's position, he's saying, "man, if i can elect this guy governor, i can run the whole state."

reporter: the campaign for illinois governor has gotten pretty lively. you've got chicago congressman rod blagojevich. what's that name again? -bala-jo-vich. -reporter: bala-jo-vich, huh? -bala-jo-vich. -you sure? positive. tapper: during rod's 2002 governor's campaign, dick mell's membership in the old school chicago elite was a definite bonus, but it was rod's working class bonafides and people skills that did all the rest. coming from the family he did, he had a real working class chip on his shoulder, and his two heroes were elvis and richard nixon, both because they were guys who came from the wrong side of their tracks and fought their way up and were kind of disdained by the elites.

in fact, if those two gritty 20th century icons fought their way into a single person, you might actually end up with rod blagojevich, for better and for worse. the rod blagojevich that i first met was youthful. he was energetic. he had this kind of mane of black hair that was super thick, and you could tell it was filled with hair product. the hair-- so iconic in its own right, that it became a comedy staple on every late night show. -the hair. -the hair. really, it looks like you're wearing a toupée that's also wearing a toupée. [audience laughter] he had a huge infatuation with elvis presley. ♪ his charisma was disarming. [cheers and applause] [amplified voice] thank you. thank you very much. [cheers, whistles, and applause] but the elvis of illinois was itching to lose his colonel parker, because despite the many benefits of dick mell's patronage, rod was still in his shadow. you know, he really became known

as dick mell's son-in-law first. and i know he hated that. he didn't know how to both be his own man and not let dick mell foreshadow him. the only way for rod to survive outside of his father-in-law's machine was to create his own cash flow. so his first step was to hire two of chicago's most bare-knuckled political fund-raisers, chris kelly and tony rezko. chris kelly and tony rezko could generate big bucks. they were fund-raisers. they were donors. you know, let's just call 'em what they were. they were influence peddlers. they wound up being able to shake the bushes here and help rod raise money. they promised access and favors if blagojevich won, and they got results. where dick mell's good old boys would fetch $2,000 at a time, kelly and rezko would shake loose 50 grand. all that money plus rod's appeal to voters who had felt ignored by the entrenched chicago political dynasties--

well, it proved to be an unstoppable combination. he ran on some things that were uniquely important to black people. healthcare for kids is a good idea. when he said, "free rides for seniors on public transportation," that resonated with black people specifically. blagojevich became governor in 2003. -congratulations, governor. -thank you. may god bless you. [cheers and applause] how do you view your-- your time as governor apart from the scandals? how do i say this in a way where i don't sound like a guy without any humility? but i truly believe i was a great governor. i can't think of any governor in my life that did anything for anybody i knew that can walk around and say, "you know what? thank you, governor. my daughter had healthcare through you." free public transportation for seniors and the disabled? i did that 'cause they raised the sales tax, which hurts working people and poor people and seniors. with the legislature raising taxes

that hit lower-income illinoisans hardest, and rod striking back with policies to offset that, it's no surprise that his populist agenda made him a lot of enemies amongst the big political families. to the people and the masses, he was on our team, and to the aristocracy and to the political elites, he was this guy that was taking their resources and giving 'em to the peasants, and so he became robin hood. i knew the reality that i'm gonna have resistance from the old guard, the old ward bosses, the madigans, daley to some extent, my father-in-law, and so the goal was raise money now and raise a lot of it so that you can afford to make enemies, and you can afford to lose support. right, but some of these people that you were-- that you were relying on like chris kelly were--were corrupt. -right? -turned out that chris had problems in his own personal business, and he was found guilty of those things. had nothing to do with me. but, like, a lot of the people in the world of fund-raising are not necessarily... -they are not. -...upstanding individuals. -no, they're not.

-yeah. -no, they're not. what's the saying? "ignorance is not a defense"? tony rezco and chris kelly-- they started compiling this list of different entities that were state contractors, and they hit all those people up for money, probably with rod's assistance. "hey, you got a contract? you wanna keep it? or you want to get more? you gotta pony up." a lot of people in play have scalpel-like tendencies when they fund-raise, and rod was probably more of a meat cleaver. [beeping] -[telephone rings] -kelly and rezco were using government levers to squeeze anyone they could for a campaign contribution-- kickbacks like a cushy job or a fat contract, a little light extortion such as holding up teachers' funds. they had deep pockets to fill and a financial machine to do it. you can't trade official actions as a governor in exchange for campaign contributions or jobs. i mean, there is one simple word for that.

it's called graft. graft is simply the use of political power and authority in exchange for personal gain. to state the obvious, appointing unqualified people to state positions because you wanna use the government as a vending machine for your political campaign-- that's completely illegal. the m.o. was to make money from every state petitioner possible, and small-town hospital ceo pam davis looked like just another easy mark. but in this case, the whole shakedown process is recorded by the hospital executive who was getting shaken down. [laughs] woman: he needs to reset your wire. [laughs] oh, god, another wire. sorry for, uh... -i don't care. -just in here. uh, the governor really wasn't on my radar, um, at all until i experienced an extortion attempt through one of his, um, colleagues. pam's hospital system wanted to build a new facility in plainfield, illinois. seems pretty straightforward,

but there were red flags right away when she went to get government approval for the project. davis: in my case, the governor had appointed individuals to this board who had either contributed money to his campaign, so they bought their way on, or individuals that were controlled by the governor and other individuals and would approve only those projects where a kickback was going to be given. turns out the board was willing to approve the hospital. all she had to do was use builders and lenders who were in their pocket and pad the contract so the board could take... let's call it a transaction fee for their trouble. it became clear to me that this was a major extortion attempt, and i was furious. so i called the fbi. the feds set her up with a wire so they could listen in on her meetings with board members and get the dirt straight from the source. she'd be meeting with these players, and they would be basically laying out the whole scheme to her.

davis: the contract would be padded, um, by roughly $10 million so that that money would go then to the various players. at one point, i decided, i wonder if this goes up to the governor, because the governor appoints these individuals to the various boards. the feds were wondering the same thing, and over the course of their investigation, their suspicions proved to be spot on.

out of the public eye, rod's fund-raising goons, chris kelly and tony rezko, felt safe to strong-arm money from donors across illinois. but unbeknownst to them, the fbi was following their every move as part of a far-reaching corruption investigation into the blagojevich administration. as the money rolled in, their role in rod's administration only grew, which had his father-in-law, dick mell, feeling as though he'd been served divorce papers. as dick mell famously said, he got replaced by a trophy wife or trophy wives. those were the people who were getting the love that he should have gotten and wasn't getting. we all know that you got here because of dick mell. rod says, "i got my own team, and so don't talk to dick mell." not only does he not do what you wanna do, but he said, "don't talk to my boss. i'm the boss now."

well, dick mell ain't feeling that, and dick mell is not the type to be like, "so, may i talk to you privately?" mell wears his heart on his sleeve, his anger on his sleeve. ...leave me out! he can love you today, and if he starts hating you tomorrow, he can, you know, pull the switch just like that. and mell becomes more and more resentful of being cast aside, and so that fueled this tension in that family to the point where it eventually exploded. [explosion] that explosion came in 2005, and though it may not have aired on reality tv, it was still inextricably linked to garbage. rod blagojevich closed down this landfill which dick mell was a part owner of. rod said that this was for environmental issues. tapper: what did he want you to do? leave it alone, and i had learned that it was operating in violation of the environmental laws. i had knowledge of that. uh, ultimately, i decided i had a duty,

that i had to shut it down, and then he made some accusations that really unleashed the furies. dick mell called a press conference and basically accused rod blagojevich of selling board and commission seats within state government. reporter: mell has had a falling out with his son-in-law, the governor. this is a family at war. ♪ so your father-in-law, dick mell, accused chris kelly of selling political favors for campaign contributions of $25,000 to $50,000 at a time. tell me about where were you when you heard that he was leveling this accusation. i remember vividly. it was early january of 2005, and this was the consequence of me shutting down his landfill. the very next day, he called a press conference, and he was clever enough to accuse chris kelly, not directly me, but that's me. i don't think he envisioned that it would turn into something that would ultimately land me in prison, but i know he did this to hurt me politically and cause me problems with the fbi. tapper: mel's allegations backed rod into a corner,

giving the fbi room to prosecute his inner circle, until in 2008, the feds secured a secret wiretap on the governor himself. feeling the squeeze, rod started looking for some kind of escape route, and then a golden opportunity landed right in his lap. at this defining moment, change has come to america. [cheers and applause] now that senator barack obama is president-elect barack obama, someone will have to take over his senate seat. this is the governor's decision. uh, it is not my decision. the criteria that i would have for my successor would be the same criteria that i'd have if i were a voter. senator obama becomes president obama. he resigns his senate seat. according to the law here in illinois, you as the governor get to name his replacement. now you're excited about this, and you say on tape, "i'd like to get the [bleep] out of here," and you're talking about options for yourself.

does that mean, "i'd like to get the [bleep] out of here," you were sick of being governor? that's absolutely the things i was saying, of course, and i was looking at all kinds of options. so he attempted to trade obama's seat for a golden parachute. he begins to be heavily courted by all sorts of people who would love to be that u.s. senator. they saw something really valuable here-- a very valuable bargaining chip that could elevate his power in some way or-- or benefit them monetarily. when i said i wanted to get the eff out of here, it's because the fbi people and my persecutors were all over me, and it's the sort of thing, when that stuff's swirling around you, you know that stuff's swirling around you. -right. -and it's there. it's everywhere, and it-- and it was just very clear to me that they were determined to get me no matter what. i guess one question i have is knowing that they were looking at you, why did you talk about this stuff that way? look, i had 2,896 days in prison to ask myself a thousand questions, including that.

but you know what? what's the alternative? i have all my staff and lawyers. we all go to saunas and get naked and talk to each other so nobody's got wires on 'em? -no, or-- -what's the alternative? or you just don't say anything, or you just say, like, "this seat is very important, and we wanna make sure the best person gets it. and separately, i am thinking that i'd like to not be governor of illinois anymore." well said. i don't make a habit of telling politicians how to avoid jail time, but here's the thing. being more cautious could have gotten rod everything he wanted and kept him out of prison, but caution is not really in rod's dna. [blagojevich speaking] [line disconnects] ♪ jackson: you know they taping you, so you can't say that out loud, right? breaking news-- the illinois governor charged with plotting to sell

barack obama's former senate seat. reporter: illinois rod blagojevich was arrested tuesday morning by federal authorities and charged with corruption. dude. dude! dude. you know they trying to get you, dawg. but why? why?

reporter: the day after being arrested on corruption charges,

illinois governor rod blagojevich walked out of his house and headed back to work. -[camera shutter clicks] -tapper: all in all, rod blagojevich was facing 24 charges connected to four specific events-- the attempted sale of obama's senate seat, withholding legislation that would benefit a children's hospital and racetrack in an attempt to get political contributions, and the attempted extortion of a highway contractor. [amplified voice, chanting] 2, 3, 4, blago must go! i personally think he should at least step aside if not resign. my husband is an honest man, and i know that he's innocent. jackson: he thought that he had the moral high ground. i don't believe there's any cloud that hangs over me. -man: governor, governor-- -well, getting back to that, can we discuss your-- i think there's nothing but sunshine hanging over me. he didn't show any of the humility or anything. you just can't stick your finger in the eye of the federal government. let me reassert to all of you once more that i am not guilty of any criminal wrongdoing,

that i'm confident that at the end of the day, i will be, uh, properly, uh, exonerated. [reporters speaking at once] i represented rod blagojevich in two of his criminal trials. i mean, he wanted to fight his case. he believed he was innocent, and he was working to that end to try and prove his innocence. anyone who believes that this was a selling of some senate seat doesn't understand politics. every single day in politics, that is what happens, is this horse-trading. and if you really listen to this in context, what you heard was talking with various people, getting annoyed, talking about nonsense, and then the end. nothing really that was ever acted on. later, rod blagojevich's lawyers would argue that what rod did specifically with the senate seat was no worse than when president eisenhower appointed earl warren as chief justice of the supreme court. back in 1952, dwight eisenhower's about to win the nomination

to become the republican president. earl warren, the governor of california, is withholding the delegation's votes. governor warren tells eisenhower, "i'll deliver the delegation for you on one condition. i wanna be the next chief justice of the supreme court." ike, the great war hero, shakes hands, says, "you got a deal." he wins. one year later, earl warren is the chief justice of the united states supreme court. rod wanted a political appointment from obama, and for that, he was prepared to trade obama's old senate seat, which is actually legal. otherwise, eisenhower would have gone to jail, and americans would not have "liked ike." do you see yourself as somebody who was just trying to function in perhaps an inherently corrupt but legal system, and that theoretically almost any politician could be snagged the way you were? absolutely. of course i do, except i'm giving me higher marks. because i was using that money that--that-- and that power gave me to fight an established system that served itself on the backs of the people,

and when you do that, you piss a lot of people off, and they wanna get rid of you. but do you think that you're earthier about it? like, more outspoken about it? well, i wasn't hiding any of it, but these--because it's legal, and that's how you govern. abraham lincoln was able to get the 13th amendment passed at congress, which ratified the emancipation proclamation, freeing slaves. he had to make political deals with members of congress to get the votes to pass it. -that's how you get things done. -you're not comparing yourself to abraham lincoln. -by no means. -okay. -and please say that. i'm not comparing myself to abraham lincoln. you're not-- or the emancipation proclamation. okay, right. he's a lot taller than me, and i never did anything as great as that, of course not. -but you're also not talking about the--i mean, the emancipation proclamation-- of course i'm not. governor blagojevich tried to sell the appointment to the senate seat vacated by president-elect obama. the conduct would make lincoln roll over in his grave. you're very critical of pat fitzgerald. yeah, he's an evil guy. he's a wicked guy. he's a scoundrel, and he deserves to get an ass kicking. you know? and he's a big coward. anyway, go ahead. sorry. well, i think he would take issue with everything you just said.

you know, he has a reputation for being the choirboy, for being, you know, an upstanding, moral person. he sees himself as, "i am trying to uphold some basic standards for our politicians." that's how he views it. governor blagojevich has been arrested in the middle of what we can only describe as a political corruption crime spree. we had a political and public narrative that we had to overcome, and when the entire potential jury pool believes that your client is guilty before they've even heard the evidence, you're going into the trial like if it's a basketball game, you're losing 100 to nothing. or it's like if you're a governor, and you're getting impeached 114 to 1, and the lone vote in rod's favor-- his sister-in-law, deb mell. done from office and eager to prove he was not a crook, rod knew exactly where to plead his case. please welcome to the program governor rod blagojevich!

[applause] you are a charming dude with the best set of hair i've ever [bleep] seen. [audience laughter] so i want this to be real. got some challenges ahead, but, uh, i'm gonna trust in the truth and as it says in the bible, "the truth shall set you free." rod blagojevich just...kept...talking. how are you? you wanna get on tv? come on in. i think he was able to warm himself a little bit with the public. better to be seen as a klutz than a crook. sure, everyone loves a good laugh, but oversaturating the talk show circuit may have had unintended consequences, as david letterman told rod when he appeared on the "late show" in 2009. the more you talked and the more you repeated your innocence, the more i said to myself, "oh, this guy's guilty." [laughter] so during the period from your impeachment to your trial and your sentencing, you did a lot of media appearances. what was the strategy behind that? my feeling was like, "look, i didn't do any of that stuff," and what does somebody do who's being lied about?

but you have a tremendous desire to get out at the highest mountain and yell out, "i didn't do it." well, letterman said that the louder you yelled it, the more it made him think you were guilty. yeah. yeah, i mean, i didn't-- i didn't convince him, but, uh, i think i convinced donald trump. that's why i got invited on "celebrity apprentice," right? i have great respect for your tenacity, for the fact that you just don't give up. but, rod...you're fired. ♪ what i saw over the course of rod's career was a guy who started off as kind of a charming rogue and a guy who really did give voice to concerns that people had to someone who became almost a parody of himself. and by the time that trial came around, he really was his own worst enemy. see you in court. he thought that the court of public opinion could save him, but he had disturbed forces that decided, "it was a wrap for you, dude." don't poke the feds, fam. just don't do it.

man: blago, can i get your autograph? reporter: at verdict today, in a notorious case that federal prosecutors did not want to hear, rod blagojevich was convicted today on only one count.

-see you guys! -man: way to go, baby! tapper: the jury was hung on all but one of the charges against blagojevich, and without unanimous consent, the result was a mistrial on the remaining 23 charges. the jury, like a lot of people to this day, just could not agree on whether what he'd done was actually illegal. in that first trial, the jury deadlocked on everything except for lying to the fbi. -right. you were convicted of lying to the fbi. -right. -do you acknowledge that you lied to the fbi? -no. no. i don't. i'll tell you about that. it was about how much of your associates that were fund-raising for you, the degree to which you knew what you were doing. yeah, it was-- the issue was i said, i didn't, as a practice, track fund-raising. and who got contracts? i didn't. i didn't look into who got contracts. i wasn't interested in that. i had 27,000 contributors. i wasn't tracking who gave me money, who got what. the first trial was too confusing for the jury, and they had a lot of paper documents. it was a lot of witness testimony. man: governor, are you anxious for this to begin?

i feel great. absolutely. what the government did in the second trial is they pared down their--their case, and they believed that everything was in the tapes and they needed to make this trial a lot simpler. [blagojevich speaking] he was swearing a lot... ...and upset and not appreciative of the position that he had. and i think that was more influential in the jury's decision than-- than anything. it made him look bad. breaking news right now-- the jury has reached a decision, convicting blagojevich on 17 counts of corruption. -reporter: wire fraud. -bribery. blitzer: attempted extortion. solicitation of a bribe. blitzer: racketeering. conspiracy to commit bribery and conspiracy to commit extortion.

rod blagojevich was convicted on almost all counts and sentenced to 14 years. patti and i are obviously very disappointed, uh, in the outcome. i, frankly, am--am stunned. when did you realize, "oh, shit, i might actually be going to prison"? -from the beginning. -really? -i knew i was a dead man. -really? -yeah. -why? 'cause they have so much power and resources, and i, you know, wasn't really surprised when i got 14 years. the justification for the judge was, "you treated this like a golden glove boxing match," but those corrupt liars are lucky dueling is outlawed, 'cause i'd have challenged them to a duel. rapists and murderers get so much less time? that's why this system is so wrong and so broken. let me offer you an alternate theory. sure. my alternate theory is that the entire system of justice that we have in this country depends on prosecutors and police who are incentivized to get convictions. -mm-hmm. -period.

what do you think of that? well, i think you're almost right. [laughs] i never took a penny. no one says i did. i keep saying that 'cause that's so important to me. i don't want people to think that i was some-- one of these corrupt politicians that was taking cash. tapper: but remember, even though he never actually got that envelope full of money, that was because the feds closed in before the senate deal was done. the offers being considered, campaign contributions or a lucrative job in a nonprofit, the fact of accepting them-- that would have been simply illegal, hence, the charge of conspiracy to commit bribery, which he was definitely guilty of. rod's argument is no cash changed hands, but prior to that, there had been plenty of money changing hands. there's ample evidence these government positions, these government contracts-- they were effectively for sale. it does not matter if rod blagojevich actually won the argument and got the money or the donations he was seeking.

it's the ask. if something goofs it up, but the burglary or robbery's interrupted, it doesn't make it less of an intended burglary or robbery, right? he had his day in court. that 14 years was what the system gave him. so you went to prison for almost eight years? 2,896 days. and let me tell ya what gets you through prison when you have to face something like that. it's love and it's faith-- love for my daughters and my wife. you know, when i was arrested, within days, the vegas oddsmakers had it 9 to 1 that she was leaving. so in that sense, i've been so lucky and blessed. after he was sent to prison, patti proclaimed his innocence, and she did try and go to any leader that she could find to have him either pardoned or commuted. and when all else failed, patti blagojevich knew exactly who to appeal to next.

after rod goes to prison, patti was essential in keeping their life together. more than anything else, maybe, she got in donald trump's ear. trump had a connection with blagojevich 'cause rod was on "the apprentice," and patti blagojevich was on fox news every day. you know, we know that president trump is a kind man, and he's compassionate.

he's always been kind to my family. and when you speak on fox news, you have a direct connection with donald trump. today the president sprung from prison former illinois governor rod blagojevich, who was convicted after attempting his own quid pro quo. yes, uh, we have commuted the sentence of rod. i watched his wife on television. quote, um, "i watched his wife on television..." -yes. -end quote. how did--how did that happen? i think he just saw--he-- he would tell me he liked the fact that i was fighting back. i remember him saying something like, uh, "you know, i have friends that go through what you're going through, and they're in a corner. they can't even move, and you're out there throwing punches." i think he liked that. i'm so grateful to him. sometimes things happen in life where god intervenes in the most unbelievable ways. trump, blagojevich, fox news? i'm not sure how much god played a role in any of this. when rod came home from prison after eight years,

his daughters had grown up. how are your relationships with them? they're good. i'm-- i'm getting to know them. our family was broken for a long time. the difficulties that i talked about with my father-in-law, those were heartbreaking, because in spite of everything, i love him, and he's been good to me in so many ways. and, uh, you know, it's been a tough road for my wife. our lives could have been so much simpler, so much better. understandably, rod looks back on the time away from his family with regret, not for what he did, of course, but that he was sent to prison in the first place. but what else would you expect from rod? i am a political prisoner. i was put in prison for practicing politics. wait a minute. you're a political prisoner? nelson mandela was a political prisoner. political prisoners have no due process. i was thrown in prison and spent nearly eight years in prison for practicing politics, for seeking campaign contributions without a quid pro quo. you do have an obligation to at least admit what you did wrong, and you refuse to do that, and you're creating a whole new alternate universe of facts,

and that may be big in politics today, but it's still, frankly, just bullshit. a reporter, uh, asked you if you wanted to say sorry to the people of illinois, and you said, "sorry for what?" -do you still feel that way? -very much so. i've done a lot wrong. criminal? none. you and your defenders argue that the persecution, prosecution of you is about the criminalization of politics. in other words, there is horse-trading that goes on in politics. "you do me this favor. i'll do you this favor," and that's all you were doing, and that it's legal, but they made it out to be illegal. well, first of all, it's not illegal. now you can argue whether we should improve our laws. that's a valid thing. i would think there's a lot of room to improve the fund-raising laws, but that's not illegal at all, and it's a common practice. now ultimately, after i've been in prison for four years, the appellate court reverses that big lie of the sale of the senate seat, and they said it's routine political logrolling.

and look, that's partially true. the court did vacate the conviction related to obama's senate seat, but they never said he did nothing wrong. the court said there was a jury instruction issue, and they upheld the remaining 13 counts. so contrary to his claim, he has not been exonerated. and for the love of elvis, we can only hope that rod's crimes are not routine. if there is a big lie, it's that he's a victim, especially since every other charge was upheld, including the extortion of a children's hospital. gandhi, he ain't. this isn't some sort of mystery, that, "gosh, i didn't know. i had no idea. it's so gray." really? i think most of us have some gut sense of when we're beginning to get in trouble. i don't believe blagojevich has ever done any reflection on right and wrong.

extorting a hospital-- never occurred to him that that might harm the citizens that he was elected to protect. he--he has no ability to look at anything but himself. that's it. that's it. what's the worst thing that can be said about you that's accurate in your view, other than you were stupid to say that stuff? sure. look, i've been accused of being a narcissist. i might plead to a misdemeanor on that, okay? um, i think i-- my judgment of some people was way off. i think i should have been a lot more vigilant and see some of the warning signs. i knew they were aggressively out there raising money, and i didn't slow it down because i wanted to raise the campaign money. i could have been more vigilant on that in retrospect. ♪ close, but no cigar. whether or not rod trusted the wrong people, he set them loose on illinois because they brought him the most money. whether the rules on political fund-raising

are flimsy guardrails at best,