twitter feed that were put into evidence is part of the new york trial, which raises the question, just how far the tentacles how far reaching, and what do, what is official and not become? obviously is a huge, huge question now, tim, if trump's effort to get the justice department to go along with his false claims of widespread voter fraud is definitely protected and that's it has to be out of the special counsel's federal election subversion case how much is left of the case against trump then do you think yeah that's the question the judge chutkan will have to answer that. >> special counsel will argue, kate, that the vast majority of the conduct was undertaken in his role as a candidate for office, not as president and justice roberts opinion actually explicitly says there are things that they president does that are not official undertaken in his role as a political candidate. this is the argument that mark meadows

made in the georgia case, arguing for immunity there and the judge, they are rejected the argument that all of that campaign activity was official, and i think you'll hear the very same argument in front of judge chutkan. most of what is alleged in the special counsel's indictment, special counsel will argue, i think persuasively is not official conduct, but it's rather activity that the president did as a candidate for reelection, not in his official capacity as president thank you both for coming on. >> it's really as good to see you inherit, hear from you today you are seeing a new central starts now are we seeing the first cracks among congressional democrats and their support for president biden, a new statement just made on cnn. >> and with the supreme court's new ruling, donald trump's plans to try to overturn his new york criminal conviction, a category five hurricane breaking records and

bearing down on new targets and kind of a glass tap empty glass, half-full the same time. a teenager accidentally shoots himself in the leg. not great. but lessons and first aid helped him save his own life life. i'm john berman with sara sidner who just touched her own toes and kate bolduan. this is cnn news central happening. >> now, fallout and fear new threats, new warnings, the supreme court has spoken the president now enjoys absolute immunity when engaged in official acts. the concerns spelled out and a nine no words from dissenting justice sonia sotomayor, who wrote the president, is now a king above the law, a blistering dissent after the court's conservative majority the liver donald trump, a huge immunity when we are already seeing what is going to happen next, because

trump is re-posting the idea of political retribution and he's getting his lawyers geared up to you. the decision to overturn his state hush money conviction just days before sentencing. cnn's katelyn polantz leads us off here. katelyn, there's been plenty of response from donald trump. he has gone on social media praising this decision. have we heard anything from special counsel jack smith? >> we have not yet, sarah, but that is something we are very much expecting to hear because there's going to be have to be interpretations of this supreme court ruling that now gives the president some level of core immunity around that office. and this is an argument that trump's team is going to be making in lots of different courts not just in the coming days, in hearings and proceedings, very likely before judge tanya chutkan in dc, where that dc immunity case or i'm sorry, the election subversion case that donald trump is facing, that this immunity decision came out of.

that is going to be moving forward. so will here from them there and then there are the other cases in florida. this question of immunity has come up. their judge, aileen cannon's very likely to look at it there as well. and then in new york, we're already starting to hear from a different set of folks. the new york lawyers for donald trump, they have taken a letter to the judge overseeing that case where donald trump was convicted by a jury previously and has his sentencing set for next week. they're arguing that it should be thrown out because there were things that were brought into that trial, tweets when donald trump was president ledgers from the white house, hope hicks testimony she was an adviser to trump when he was the president those things were in trial and should have been taken out. they're gonna be arguing things like this to the judge up there in new york. here's will scharf, one of trump's attorneys last night on cnn what we have in new york is a situation where a substantial number of official acts of the presidency, things

that we believe are official acts were used as evidence to support the charges in that new york trial we believe that that corrupts that trial. >> that indicates that that jury verdict needs to be overturned. and at the very least deserve a new trial where those immune acts will not come into evidence we're probably going to have to see how this state prosecutors in new york are going to respond to that as well. >> and if there's any ability for donald trump to push his sentencing back as his team also indicated, they would very much like to do it for next thursday. sarah, there are so many potential repercussions from this decision. it was an enormous decision, one that we have not seen before. katelyn polantz. thank you so much for going down all of the different cases and what may just happen. >> there's also new reporting this morning on how both president biden and donald trump's campaign and are hoping to energize or bases off this historic moment. cnn's jeff zeleny, as much more on this. he's joining us now. you have what are you hearing from

your sources is the crisis growing are fading? within the biden campaign and among democrats good morning. >> it is definitely not fading is president biden is waking up in the white house, said, today, there are many democrats who are still wondering how seriously both the president and his top advisors are taking their concerns there was all this talk over the weekend about sort of really taking a hard look at things. there are very few signs that the president himself and his top advisors are reconsidering or listening to the anger and concerns from democrats on a phone call last night with top donors jen o'malley, dillon, the campaign chair was telling people, i'm told she said we are clear-eyed about this. we're not pollyanna-ish, but then went on to say the president's health is fine should his health is probably better than most of the health of the members of the national finance committee who are on this call, which certainly does not indicate a level of

seriousness that they are considering things. but i'm told this morning that the biden team will be looking at new polls and data that is coming in this week likely tomorrow, uh, to assess the damage on the democratic ticket, how much is is this going to impact house races? how much is this going to impact senate races? we know there is a broad scale panic among some democratic house members, particularly in swing states and other difficult districts about all of this. and there is just a sense is the president sort of reconsidering or at least looking at this carefully or is he simply digging in and in a bunker of his own and it also kind of the broader question that this gets to write is which base, which side, which voted, which voter base does this? >> impact more obviously, both are trying to energize you can think of it two ways, right? energize the base or stop the

bleed, or at least make sure people don't stay home is there a sense now, even though it is very early which side this likely motivates more look, i think on the losing side of any argument and certainly biden fans and supporters and democrats were would have been on the losing side of the supreme court argument. that certainly is a motivating factor. and we heard that from the president last night when he returned to the white house from his weekend it to camp david, he set the stakes of this very high. let's listen she said in every use of official power the president is now a king above the law with fear. >> for our democracy. i dissent end of quote so should the american people dissent i dissent so certainly the president and thera essentially reading from justices sonia sotomayor's dissent and saying he dissents as well. but what

this does, it certainly raises the stakes of the election, but it also that is one of the things that is fueling some concern among democrats if this election is truly as consequential, if democracy you see is truly on the ballot, is he the strongest candidate now, on the other side of this, donald trump and his supporters have had a very good run of days here from the debate last thursday, certainly not a flawless performance by any means as he was giving one misstatement after another, but a stronger performance than joe biden. but that's supreme in court ruling yesterday. and all of its legal effects here. now, trying to essentially a hold or change his new york conviction. this certainly has donald trump's supporters in a very pleasant and happy mood this morning? of course, we should point out for months from election day this week, a lot could happen, but first and foremost, all eyes today are on democrats and the biden campaign. are they going to make any moves as of now, zero

evidence that they are giving in or really even listening are considering any of these concerns from democratic officials okay yeah. >> and you make a great point. the unknown is how this looks and feels 74, 24 hours out. you, there's no way of knowing how how that compares to how this looks and feels two months from now. but still, you don't, you can't wait to decide on strategy until then. that's for sure it's great to see you, jeff. thank you. john alright, cnn senior political analyst mark preston is with us now in this vein, mark, one of the things we've all been looking for visible cracks between democratic members of congress are elected officials, and the biden campaign or biden white house. we may have just seen, if not a full crack, but like a hairline fissure on cnn? then earlier this morning, kasie hunt was talking to congressmen mike quigley from illinois, democrat arden biden, supporter, who kcso what do you think should biden consider getting out and quick loose response was what i'm

stressing is it has to be his decision, but we have to be honest with ourselves that it wasn't just a horrible night he then continued, but i won't go beyond that out of my respect and understanding for president biden, a very proud, proud person who was served our country extraordinarily well for 50 years. he said, i just want him to appreciate it this time. how much an impact, not just on his race, but on all the other races? this coming in november. again, that's my quigley. that's a big supporter of president biden. there, who really did just seem to crack the door open a little bit to the possibility of urging president biden to get out. what do you think? >> john i would. argue, that it's even more than a crack because quickly as somebody who is congressman quigley, somebody who's very well-respected within the parties, not bombastic. he's not somebody who goes out there and tries to capture headlines, but this is exactly what i'm hearing right now. just got off the phone this morning with two democrats. we have a lot of power here in town and they're on opposite sides of this

right? now. we're seeing a democratic party in this, in this crisis right now about how do we move forward? what is the best option and right now, they don't see a great option and in fact, this is where we're going to start seeing where the blame game starts being a passed around. we've certainly seen that the biden campaign come out against some of their own surrogates and had been very critical of some of the assessments that they have said publicly about the debate this morning same thing i heard, but at the same time, john, there are all these democrats who say it's time to go and then who will be blamed if joe biden does stay on the ticket, if he were to lose a lot of what ifs, if he were to lose, who's going to blame for that? >> there's also something that's developed over the last 12 hours or so, which is the bed wedding backlash, backlash, if you will, you've had biden loyalists pointing the finger at some of the democrats who question the debate performance, saying, you're a bed wetter, so a backlash against the bed wedding but now

there's a backlash against that. peter wells from vermont was saying, hey, wait a second here, these are legitimate concerns you're not helping yourself by attacking us. help us help you public gala a few minutes ago on cnn. i mean, as loyal a democrat as there is saying, it's stupid to call people breadwinners right now. there's a lot of criticism here, mark because you, because no doubt you need all of your support and to the point of not having congress here in washington this week, that was a good thing for joe biden in the sense that you have a lot of congress folks together, you have a whole town full of reporters thereafter, a lot of tough questions they didn't have to necessarily face that what they are going to face though is what paul was saying earlier. >> they're going to be going in walking in 4 july parades. they're going to be meeting with their constituents more importantly, they're gonna be meeting with the democrats that have helped elect these congresspeople back home. and if they start getting an incredible amount of pressure, it really is a fight that fight to survive fire right? so if your congressperson, you feel like joe biden is going to cost you your election, then you're

going to come out publicly and say that he probably needs to step aside. >> the biden campaign, though mike come forward saying, we've got 127 million reasons why you should stick behind us. this, do fundraising number for you and they got a lot of cash, which is good for the campaign but also a complicating factor, right? because again, if we're in this hypothetical west wing world where someone else ends up trying to get the nomination. not as easy for them to use. this money, is it? >> no, it isn't because of how the federal election laws are set up and who can actually be on the ticket. look, i think that they could be able to get around that, you know, there are ways is as much as let me just say this, you're on there doesn't seem to be anything set in stone in our laws anymore. so i'm sure that the democrats could get around it if they had to do it. but more important politically you, imagine if joe biden decided to say, look, i'm stepping aside and then you had the likes of gavin newsmen or gretchen whitmer or anyone else come in and try to take on kamala harris, who's the first

african american vice president. i mean, imagine the split in the party there where you have african american constituents even the likes of james clyburn, who helped joe biden get elected like really is credited with making that happen. could you imagine the internal fights that would happen if there were some kind of battle for the democratic nomination in just a few weeks before their convention, it would be something to be clear, actually, vice president harris has the clearest path to using that money would be clear. she could probably use it, however, she wanted to everyone else more complicated. but as you said, once a campaign finance law at this date anyway mark precedent great to see swirling. appreciate you and i need to pool our resources. and by the celtics, sarah it's going to cost a heck of a lot of money. all right. congresswoman alexandria ocasio cortez, calling the supreme court consumed by a corruption crisis after the unity ruling, she's now valley to file articles of impeachment plus the biden administration is taking steps to protect millions of american workers from extreme and potentially deadly heat and an incredible

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concert event, with performance by keith urban it bibi wrexham for killers, and many more go for dinner america. >> thursday, july 4 as seven eastern on cnn this morning, we are looking at all of the major ways as the supreme court's historic ruling on presidential immunity will impact not only donald trump's legal cases, but the future of all american presidents with us now to

discuss the cnn, legal analyst, norm eisen and cnn presidential historian tim naftali. >> thank you, gentlemen for coming in on this really consequential de, norm first two, you we know the expression, no person is above the law. we say it all the time, is part of just convert per-station. did the court just decide that actually there is someone above the law, the president sarah even. the majority in this reprehensible opinion that represents a fundamental break with two-and-a-half centuries of american tradition pays lip service to the idea they write. of course, no one is above the law, but then they claim allowing the president to do things like commit political assassinations has no legal redress. well, what's the meaning of their proclamation that a president is not above

the law. if he can engage in those kinds of conduct, this is one of the worst opinions in american history from the supreme court. a number of members of whom have fatal conflicts. they were involved in they have spouses or other involvement. alito and thomas in the underlying conduct. and they have indeed put the president above the law for certain actions this is for official acts. >> they were very specific. this not personal actions, but official acts tim, i want to get to you about what this means for the role of the presidency moving forward because it was based on donald trump's case and directly affects him, but it effects all presidents going forward, correct indeed. >> and i think donald trump is the beneficiary of a struggle among constitutional experts over the effects of the

pushback against the imperial presidency in the cold war the court's majority includes people who were in administrations that faced that we're in the midst of scandals there. they're veterans of the george w bush administration of the reagan administration in many ways, the conservative jordi seemed to be arguing some very old cases in an attempt to remove the sword of damocles. the possibility of criminal prosecution over future presidents. but in doing so, they have opened the door to presidential abuse of power if you think about the ways in which a richard nixon lyndon johnson, john f. kennedy, i want to make clear this is not a partisan problem. this is a presidential problem. the way in which they use national security to authorize wiretaps,

for example, the case of nixon breaking into daniel ellsberg psychiatrists office. the ways in which they use their core constitutional authorities to abuse presidential power. you can see that yesterday's decision by the supreme for opens the door and actually protects future abuse of power by president tim because you brought it up. i want to show the audience something that was sort of a joy, sort of go back in history and look at what happened with nixon and really dig down into that i want to let people here for what nixon said when he was asked a question about whether a president and what they do if they're allowed to do something illegal. in the course of their job, that would be illegal to anyone else. but the president here is how president nixon responded when he was interviewed by mr. frost when the president does it,

that means that it is not illegal by definition exactly when the president does it. >> that means it is not illegal. so in this context with what the court has decided norm, does this mean that nixon basically would have been able to do what he did completely legally without any recourse you could have had a, substantial portions of richard nixon's wrongdoing that drove him from office because it was conducted from the oval office using his official advisors to engage in break-ins, wide variety of other illegal acts it would have been impossible to prosecute, essentially what the supreme court majority, again, including terribly conflicted justices who have no business sitting on this case under any standard of judicial ethics, what they've done,

sarah, is rewrite american history it goes all the way back to the founding american idea. >> we overthrew king george the third because we did not want a ruler to have this kind of absolute immunity. and the supreme court has now altered that and we have to be honest that we're facing a major party political candidate who has said he wants to be a dictator on day one, he wants to assert autocratic powers. they've just given him a license for dictatorship within the purview of official acts that should be extremely alarming. and it makes this momentous election really a referendum on the future of american democracy norm. >> of course, you have the justices saying, look no president should be prosecuted for doing their job whether it is saying, look, we're going to send people to war or or

something else. >> but there are some real big questions that we were all be asking as to what constitute an official act and who gets to decide that we will discuss that more. and the de ahead, normalize them and tim naftali. thank you both so much for your insights. kate, hurricane beryl is the earliest atlantic storm on record to carry winds of 160 miles per hour. this category five storm, it is on the move we have an update on a track this election seasons stay with cnn with more reporters on the ground. >> and the best political team in the business follow the voters follow the results, fall hello, the facts follow. cnn okay, everyone, our mission is to provide complete balanced nutrition are strength and energy ensure with 20 please seven vitamins and minerals nutrients for immune health,

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the night impress the note glue, manny you think that our democracy is at risk. >> we have to be very concerned why do you, think he's doing this? and can he be talked out do you think he's guilty? the lead with jake tapper today it four on cnn. >> right now, hurricane beryl is on the way to jamaica, prompting the activation of national disaster response plans by the government. they're the brand new numbers just the brand new numbers.

keep this in stained wind speeds at 165 miles per hour with this storm so far one person has been confirmed killed by the storm with fears that the death toll, of course, could rise as it's movement continues. this is the strongest hurricane to pass through the eastern part of the caribbean, dating back to 18, 51, it's also the earliest category five storm. the storm is now moving away from the windward islands where it took what's described as being just 30 minutes to cause widespread destruction in grenada. grenada, the hurricane is expected to hit jamaica's coastline by tomorrow also today, we are looking at this with more than 60 million people under heat alerts across parts of the united states. the biden administration is announcing the first of its kind rule to try to help protect millions of workers from heat-related illnesses and death, establishing the country's first federal safety standard on excessive heat in the workplace. or let sciences at the white house. and with this one for us are like, what

are you learning about this well, k president biden later today is expected to talk about these new first of its kind regulations that would extend protections to workers who are working is extreme heat conditions. the president will be receiving a briefing on extreme heat and other climate-related issues for expected for the summer a bit later this morning. and it is there where he is expected to talk about these new rules from the department of labor's osha, which will require that employers identified he. hazards for workers also talk about the ways that workers develop heat illness and how employers could respond to keep their employees safe. it's also this new rule which would take potentially years to implement a would also call for implementing work sanders, things like rest breaks, access to shade and walker water while these workers are on the job, it's officials estimate that it could impact around 35 million americans at the same

time, president biden will also be unveiling about $1 billion, which will go to communities to try to prepare for potential weather and disaster related events. it comes at a time when so many parts of the country are under extreme heat warnings and advisories at a time also, when there has been an increase in heat-related deaths in recent years. so part of what the administration is trying to do is show that they are doing something to help protect those workers working in extreme heat conditions. but for president biden, this is also another opportunity for him to remind voters of the threat posed by climate change. that is something he tried to bring up in the debate against trump last week saying that climate change remains the one existential threat to this country. he believes that he has a platform policies that he has rolled out to try to address some of those issues. and so we'll see how exactly president biden prepares to make that argument a bit later this morning when he speaks at this briefing relating to extreme heat our luck. >> thank you. john all right.

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>> we are falling breaking news in kenya where as we speak protest have ramped up again leading to new clashes in the capital nairobi tear gas flash bangs are seeing it all play out there. it still happening, right? now. a heavy police presence as dozens of protesters fill the streets again, they are fighting for getting a better cost of living, at least 39 people have been killed in clashes with police. and the last two weeks, cnn's larry madowo is in nairobi. i know. i just saw you two seconds ago running away from a bunch of tear gas as headed your way. what are you

seeing at this hour and what are you hearing as well we're hearing some of the protestors shouting ruto moscow refined to president william ruto, who is respected and internationally that is facing a big revolt here. >> locally, especially from young people who feel there's illusion by him. so some of these protesters have become violent in the last few hours having a lot of stones of the police here who keep trying to break them up with de gas. even though a recent high court ruling and cannone told the police not to use tear gas, flash bangs, or any kind of brute force against unarmed protesters. in this case, these guys are not exactly unarmed because they've been throwing a lot of stones around here. if you look on the floor, on the cops, you see a lot of stones that have come from these guys. and so far to the credit of the cops, at least in this case, they've been showing a lot of restraint against the drugs coming from the other side. this began these protests three weeks ago against a controversial finance bill. president william ruto was forced to withdraw that bill. but these young people now are

angry generally about the high cost of living in the country they are upset about corruption in kenya and some of them grimly upset about extravagant lifestyle of some government officials. and so there been coming out here every tuesday and thursday for the third straight week to try and express the voices and some of them say, we're peaceful telling the police not to break them up as violently as they are doing. it's muted right now, but this kicks off at any time and the police throws yoga, sometimes the throw tear gas back at them, and that's a rough just came straight at us that's the danger here. that's why we're wearing all this flak jackets and helmets because we don't know whether we are saved from the tear gas or from the rocks from any of the things that's being used in this very chaotic scene. which we've been seeing for the last three. again, there's another rock coming right at us. that's one of the big dangers of covering these protests that you just don't know what's going to come from the protesters or how the police are going to react. and sometimes we are in the car up in the middle of that between the police and the protesters

and you've been caught up in this before we saw when there were a few protests are storming, parliament were able to get into parliament, but live rounds were using can you watch that happen just before your face so far you were telling us right? >> that there are no live rounds, those banks that we're hearing are actually rocks hitting some of those those metal sheets that have covered the buildings, correct? >> that is correct. we have nothing too many live rounds even though some of the protesters claim that have been live rounds, i think he's about to fire another as it is done grenade or tear gas. so that's one of the dangers here. but we did see outside parliament last week as protesters stormed parliament, please, using live rounds and we have done reporting here at cnn that some of these processes were unarmed police used excessive force, violating their own rules. and there's been no response so far from the kenya police or from the ministry of interior. in fact president william ruto said, the police did their best in

those circumstances and call them criminals larry madowo, please keep yourself and your team has safe as possible as you're watching these protests unfold yet again, they're in the capital of kenya. appreciate your time this morning. john. >> alright, this morning, congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez said she will introduce articles of impeachment against the supreme court over its ruling on presidential immunity. she called the court's ruling, quote, and assault on american democracy, and that the supreme court has become consumed by corruption crisis beyond its control. and she added is to congress to defend our nation from this authoritarian capture. again, those are her words with us now cnn's sunland safadi, sunland, how serious is this move from the congresswoman? >> well, john underscores the anger that democrats on capitol hill are feeling in this moment in the wake of this ruling, and their desire to show mainly to voters that they are trying to do something we've heard them pledge that they will move aggressively legislatively, and we heard this proposal from

alexandria ocasio-cortez to, move articles of impeachment against the justices on the court but notably, there's not much that they can do right now in a republican congress. so for the moment, these are just words and proposals. it's likely not going anywhere significant though we are also hearing from speaker of the house, mike johnson, notably last night he respond you to president biden's comments, the white house his own response to the immunity ruling and johnson slammed biden's response as despicable and dangerous, saying he's desperate now, this is mike johnson saying of biden that now that he believes that biden showed the country that he's unfit to continue that day. he does not have the capacity to serve, so all of this, of course, wrapped up in the response to that huge ruling from the supreme court, john, it asked for the political campaigns on that. we've been talking about the idea that maybe we'll begin to see some cracks among democratic members of congress the biden campaign

here, what's been happening over the last few hours that's right. >> the level of concern is only growing with each day. and frankly, our john, we just heard on our air just a few hours ago first congressmen to really show some openness to potentially replacing joe biden, the first democrat i should say congressmen, mike quigley on air with kasie hunt just a moment ago you have to be honest with ourselves that it wasn't just a horrible night, but i won't go beyond that out of my respect and understanding. >> president joe biden and that really farther than we've heard many other democrats go in the last few days since the wake of the debate. and that's certainly is a remarkable statement coming from an ally and a democrat in the party. we also heard from sheldon whitehouse. he told wp ri cool. i think a lot if people i think like a lot of people, i was pretty horrified by the debate. i think people want to make

sure that this is a campaign that's ready to go and win, that the president and his team are being candid with us about his condition. that was a real anomaly and not just the one way he is in these days. so certainly remarkable statements. john coming from democrats and really speaks that concern the panic among democrats about the nominee that they potentially will put forward. john shows that perhaps this, the campaign is not out of it yet, as it were a sunless everybody great to see you. >> thank you very much. okay. let's talk about that joining us right now is former trump administration official, matt map hours and democratic strategists and co-founder of lifter their voices, julie were against gate. so we just heard some of what mike quigley said to casey khan, julie, another thing that quigley said was, i just want him biden. i just want him to appreciate at this time just how much an impact not just his route, not just on his race, but on all the other races. coming in november kind of indicating what a fear it has to be for a down-ballot

democrat is the impact not just on the present and not on the white house, but also the impact on them as well. hearing tried and true democrats like my quickly just take that in isolation what impact does that have hearing that public? okay look, it's a huge impact. >> i think a lot of these members you're gonna go home for 4 july recess. they're going to see what their constituents say. that's going to be determinative for them as to what they're going to say when they come back to washington next week. look like any democrat. i think congressman quigley and i and any democrat, we just want to beat donald trump. that's the that's priority number one. because of the supreme court's decision yesterday, that threat to our democracy has become even more severe so if joe biden is the best pathway to do that, then that's fine. if joe biden is not the best pathway to do that, then we need to find somebody who will. but the bottom line is, we need to beat trump. and that's all that matters right now how that's decided, who decides that and what the tipping point is that is what is not clear, right

now, though, julie, right. >> because it seems the fallout is not over what it looks like today and how it fuels today. unclear if it would look and feel the same for democrats in two months. we don't, but democrats don't have that kind of time. we don't have the time and only joe biden can decide, right? he has the delegates committed to him, pledged to him to be the nominee. so it's only up to the president or the president has to make a decision. the president has to figure out truly look in the mirror and think about the fact whether he is the best person to carry us forward in november, and that's something that i hope he gives a lot of thought to over 4 july recess i hope you hear some people not just in his own circle, but also from leadership in congress and others. he doesn't need to listen to the punters. he doesn't need to listen to us, but he does need to listen to people who look at polling. he needs to do some polling of his own quickly to see what the base of the democratic party wants. look at this party has never won with the majority of the white vote since linear johnson need to know what voters of color wants specifically, black women are the backbone of this party. we need to figure out whether jumping over kamala harris if

he drops out, is going to offend them. there's so many things to consider, but he needs data and statistics, not planning just to tell them what to do, but on the data and statistics on polling, i mean, that's one thing that you're looking for in terms of the next round of polling coming out. and what and what it looks like in the impact of it. i'm curious if you have an idea of for you and yes, you're not in the business of helping democrats, but in the business of analyzing analyzing data that's available, how big of a dip i'll call it. do you think would be the threshold for any political party to start taking action beyond freaking out you got to remember going into the debate, joe biden's numbers were close to rock-bottom. they truly worried if you look at and even some pretty deep blue states, he is underperforming significantly. he was there's a polling that showed that he was actually down in new jersey. some of that was even before the debate, some well, that sample is taken after the debate. so you're not going to see a precipitous drop. the

challenge is going to be, you're going to see just enough to have a drop. there's not gonna be able to climb out of it because voters, opinions of him are so cemented this point, they assumed he was probably his age was too big of an impact going into the debate, he confirmed it because the debate and the problem that democrats have right now is that joe biden, at least as of today, is still the second least popular politician in america, the most unpopular is kamala harris. and i just don't see it. now, look admittedly, i'm not democrat. i'm not going to give advice, but i find it very hard to believe that a delegation, the democratic national convention the delegates that convention are going to pass over the sitting vice president who happens to be the first woman of color to ever have that position to potentially become president. and so i'm not sure why the democratic party would trade joe biden, who admittedly is the second least popular politician for the most unpopular. i'm not sure that setting them up for success in that's the predicament the democrats find themselves in. and that's coming on the heels of some early state polls now,

coming out, there's not a ton of polling that's really reliable since since thursday night. but napoleon new hampshire came out yesterday, showed donald trump, even joe biden by two points. last time that same firm or that same institution polled was december joe biden was leading down from i ten points in december. he's now down by two. that's the problem that democrats are find themselves in states like new hampshire and even potentially new jersey, which julie and i both know well, are potentially competitive. they're the floor is fallen out right now i mean, the thing is in terms of, you know unpopular candidates and unpopular politicians, that's, that's been the conundrum throughout this race has been both candidates are not liked. >> donald trump and joe biden. and so that's the phenomenon of the double haider. that's how this is that's how this is kind of come to light julie what are you watching? four to indicate, i asked him, what are you watching four because we're really in the middle of it. and so it's hard. i don't want to

get into place of like, what is it going to look like in two weeks on unclear because we're in unchartered territory. but what do you want to really watch for or listen for? i think going i think 4 july holiday is is it important indication because that is what a lot of politicians are meeting and greeting and hearing from their constituents but how do, how will you know, do you think to indicate it's either the bed wedding brigade as has been described, the pushback has been by the biden campaign against people who are speaking out and concerned. or this is something more that is not going to go away. and they really do need to deal with it. is there for you? there are tipping point that you would be yeah. and matt matt noses because we both do this for a living. look, you need to see some qualitative and quantitative data. you really need to look at data to see what's going on. and the rest of us are mapped by the way, if, if, if any republican wins new jersey, this year, i will go up to new hampshire and i will buy you the biggest dinner of your life. it's never going to happen. let's take that decline assault. let's say that

well, the grain of salt, but i will also say this look you and i both know we need to look at real qualitative, quantitative data. the rest of us don't really know what's going on my gut. your gut. anybody's gut is not the way to go here. what we need to do is look at, as i said, i want to see a sample for voters of color with a huge oversample, specifically of black black women to see where they think this party needs to go. they are the backbone of the democratic party and matt is right if you jump over kamala harris, the first woman of color how does that affect democratic turnout? let me just i was just handed this a tweet by tim ryan. obviously, he's run he's served and he ran a democratic primary as well for president. tim ryan just posted. we have to rip off we have to rip the band-aid off too much is at stake. the vp has significantly grown into her job. she will destroy trump in debates, highlight choice issue, energize our base, bring back young voters and give us generation i'll change. it's

time that from someone who's been in the bright spotlight of a presidential primary, who's represented an important state of ohio as well i don't know. i mean, that's the real question. the real question is we don't know. he may be right. he may be wrong. we need to see the data and we haven't seen any data. we have seen flash polls, some of which are not reliable as we just talked about the new jersey polo and others others, we don't know. and the biden campaign does know because they pull all day, every day. and the dnc should know they don't know already and that's something the rest so must needs to take a look at before we come to any conclusions. yeah, it's really interesting. it's great to see you both. thanks. thanks, guys. let's continue this conversation. john. >> all right. the sensational murder trial in massachusetts that has gripped the nation. a hung jury in the case of a woman accused of killing her police officer boyfriend sunday dr. sanjay gupta reports on hold for the devastating effects of alzheimer's

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ashanti, maybe wrexham the killers and many more go for in america. thursday, july 4 at seven eastern on cnn i'm tom foreman in washington and this is cnn the sworn in major advancement for people with amputations, a bionic leg linked to the brain, seen as jaclyn howard is with us now, how exactly does this work? >> yeah, john, it's really fascinating science. the user's own nervous system is what controls the bionic leg. in this case, that's how it's works. electrodes are placed between the amputation site on a person's leg and the bionic leg itself and signals from the nervous system wrecked the legs, movements and the leg is able to sense its own positioning and send signals back to the person's nervous system. and in one study, john, people with amputated legs who were equipped with this bionic leg, they undeen