clearly want the children raised by the government so i hope the press corps picks up on this and i hope republican and democrat leadership put together some sort of plan for january in which we work our way back to where america was in the 19 1960s just to be very clear this was the 1960s and thank you for watching these

night. >> laura coates live starts right now. president biden takes the test but will it matter tonight on laura coates? it's live alright, zero tolerance no room for error, no mistakes. size of any which way you want. that seems to be the center of that biden has to not only meet, but exceed every time he speaks and even then, it might not be good enough. the question is whether tonight's high-stakes press conference was good enough for him to live to fight another day. now, he said thinks that he will i always have an inclination. were there is playing sports or politics just to keep going, not style. i just got to just paste myself a little more. i'm determined on running. but i think it's important that i real i allay

fears. i see let them see me out there but however, biden performed tonight or how he does next week or the week after or let's be honest, the day after the hour after it may not matter to those in his own party who have their minds made up, but anything is maybe a day late and $1 short. >> three more house democrats came out right after the press conference to say that he should go right after that press conference. now we're up to 17 in all and even before the press conference sources said more, we're ready to come out, but they were waiting for the nato summit to end. now last week, the president said, only the lord almighty could convince him to step aside night tonight, he offered a slightly different answer. when he was asked what he would do if he saw polling that shows vice president kamala harris doing better again? and it's trump. well, he said this if your team came back and showed you data that she would fare better against former president

donald trump. >> would you reconsider your decision to stay in the race? >> no. unless they came back and said there's no way you can win some people say that oh hey, i'll talk louder. >> some people say that well now the president did misspeak right out of the gate in his first answer. and by the way i have misspoken then again, i'm not running for office, but therein lies the problem for this president because his critics now scrutinize everything he does. every slip-up he makes no matter whether the average person will do it or maybe the average candidate look i wouldn't have picked vice president trump to be vice president. i think she's not qualified to be president misspoke your answer is vice president harris vice president trump, right now, donald trump is using that to

both were age and memory. >> how do you combat that from tonight? >> listen to him listen to him talking about trump. >> okay. well, we can do that because the president does have a strong point. the former president donald trump, he misses all kinds of names as well. >> all of the evidence, everything deleted and destroyed all of it. all of it because of lots of things like nikki haley is in charge of security viktor orban, did anyone ever hear of him is probably like one of the strongest leaders anywhere in the world and he is the leader of right. he's the leader of turkey know, he's actually the leader of hungary but gaffes aside those just a few of them where are the leaders of the democratic party right now? >> the ones who could have the talk with the president or the ones who could maybe say it's time to rally around around him or vice versa. well, tonight,

cnn has learned that president barak obama and former speaker nancy pelosi, they have talked in private about biden. we're told they have expressed concerns about the path forward and neither is quite sure what to do. not sure what to do then. what would you have voters do besides cough on live television? hold on not today, satan hold on excuse me. i see if i were running for president right now in this happened to my boys, would you say that i was longer qualified it is were happening and i was a candidate for office would i be completely inept would you judge me differently than every other anchor who may have sneezed on air or clear their throat differently, would you

look at it as a one-off for episodic in some way would you say to yourselves this my friends is the very reason this person can no longer be trusted or what you say that maybe you'll have to wait and see how her voice performance for the rest of the show now, i didn't use that example willingly to make sure that you've got the point and drove it home. my voice did, in fact give out. but that's sometimes what happens but again, as i mentioned earlier, i'm not the one running for president and you don't have the same standard for me. but i'll tell you there are people who have followed this very closely. people who have watched a number of gaffes, people who've watched a number of coughs and sneezes and boy vocal clearings and everything else and mispronunciations of names. and joining me now is white house reporter for the wall street journal, annie linskey, former democratic congressman joe crowley and pollster frank luntz. glad you're all here with me right now. anyone want a cough drop no. we're good. okay. let me begin with you here because the number of

lawmakers that are now calling on biden to step aside is actually growing tonight. it's right now the number is not nine or ten is now 17. yeah. that's significant but just 213 democrats in congress right now on the house side. so how should biden view this and what are the next 48 hours look like well, my reporting is that the next 48 hours are incredibly important for the president. >> the way the president's team is seeing this time period is attacked i'm which, you know, they, they have to be able to withstand the pressure for the next 48 hours because after that, in their view, the attention and the focus of the political world and really the world moves to the rnc and the convention. and they feel that if they can withstand the pressure that they've had they can just hold on for 48 more hours, then they're going to have some relief. they're also looking at a calendar where, you know, if there's going to be sort of a change of some

kind is it has to be done sooner rather than later, but they're looking at these 48 hours. importantly, the president is going to be in rehoboth beach over the weekend and i was with him last weekend in the pool, traveling with him on air force one to his various stops around the country. and he was out and about. but this weekend, he's not going to he's going to be down this weekend in rehoboth and i think it's a time that he typically spends with his family. i'm going to be there as well, but this is going to be a time that i think there's some real a lot of reflection or that's the sense that we're getting from people who are close to the president. i mean joe, he has said he is staying in this race. he has been emphatic about it. he has been defined about it tonight. he was a little bit different about it, but still nonetheless saying that he intends to stay in this race. people are not taking that for at face value. and there's also this he said that he would only reconsider its decision if they told him that he could not win listen to i mean, we think about how he has said this and not winning. you

can find the polls that would suggest there is reason to be pessimistic but what is the ultimate test for him? what would be the moment he would say aha or i've heard enough. >> well, i think the fact that only 17 people so far members of congress have come out and said that he should step aside for someone else. i think one of the things that why that's the case some of the polling that came out recently that showed that still virtually tied in many respects i think what that really says we all know that there are people who die hard, trump-bites diehard biden 19 cetera. but i also think it's because it's about character. one person has it, the other one is a character. and they really completely different in that regard. and that's why they could so-called. so i think gave pause to some of these members to say he had a pretty good night tonight. there wasn't as we had a couple of flops, but he did really well, especially on control of the issue foreign affairs, and some pretty complex issues in terms of what

he has. i think has to continue to do this. and i think it's put a lot of pressure on him because before the debate, i don't think he saw every day every word he is going to say was going to be under a microscope, but it will be now. >> that's that the sort of the rub of being a candidate, right? and being somebody who is known as the leader of what we call the free world. and i want you frank, listen to you for a second. what a group of pro biden supporters who were speaking tonight in the battleground, state of michigan, a state that people talked about is the uncommitted vote. what are you gonna do about it? and this what they told cnn's gary tuchman and about the president's news conference. listen relieved. >> i think he should stay in your opinion, has changed i'm not sure he should stay, yes and how about you how do you feel you weren't sure how do you feel now? same. i think he's the logical choice okay. now you thought he should pass the torch. >> how do you feel right i still believe you should pass the torch now, we can often

talk about what happens inside the beltway. >> and then what happens outside the beltway. you and i have talked about a kind of a tale of two parts of the country. how do you see this? >> well, there's two joe biden's and we saw tonight the joe biden that was reading off the teleprompter delivered a very powerful speech. he saw that they after the debate, when he was the joe biden of 1015 years ago. but then when he has to do it off the cuff it's a completely different experience and yes, canada is make mistakes and by the way, you covered for your situation really well i've seen it happen before. you mastered it. he doesn't do it as well and i don't think that our expectations are too high. i do think that both candidates are flawed. and in fact, i only conclusion is to make everybody angry which is he was good enough to survive for another day, but not good enough to put this behind them. i think you're right about this

weekend. i think monday is going to be the key day, both in terms of his interview that night and in terms of having spent two days with his family truly assessing where things are there are going to be a few more democrats in the next 24 hours are going to be frustrated with him. and you can't say that referring to the vice president as donald trump, that's really major significant. i watched them, the group of students and everybody reacted to it. it is a big deal about monday. >> monday puts you that much closer to the dnc, but you that much closer to a presidential election. and by the way, it's the first day of the rnc convention. and if you're trying to distance yourself and change the narrative the talk and focus on what's going on there, including a vice presidential running mate, annie, that would put that lester holt interview smack dab in the middle of the conversation. so it's a little bit head-scratching about the timing. and that's why i was curious about your reporting on biden's aides that are restricting his public

appearances or that there's choreography behind his preparation. what is that telling you? yeah. i mean, one of the things that has become clear in the last few weeks since the debate is that the joe biden that we saw in the debate is one that many, many people have seen behind closed doors at the wall street journal, we reported on that in june. we reported on in early june, weeks before the debate all. right it, took us months to put together since that story was published in that p.sit is we interviewed people who spent time with the president behind closed doors in unscripted meetings. and the picture that came from that was his performance was very uneven. he would lose his train of thought. it would he would pause for long periods of time. he would say the wrong word. you'd had had struggles with the details of policies. but at other times, he was fine and it was completely on it and it's completely with it and since we wrote that and since the debate

we've just had more and more stories come, more and more people come for ford saying varies very similar thing so i think that led us to look at how is it that so many people were surprised by this to be, and how was it that this was such a surprise to so many people and part of it is this very stage-managed presidency. now, of course every presidency is every, every president is in a bubble. but this bubble is just much thicker than other presidents. what was going to say, i mean, i think most american voters would assume that there is going to be distanced and there's going to be a sort of do not touch aspects of a presidential candidate, let alone actual incumbent. but you hear about a former president former president barak obama my and former speaker nancy pelosi, currently huddling together in some fashion to figure out what is the best path forward and the future. and you got congressman jim hines was warning that democracy may not avert a second trump presidency you served in house leadership. what do you make of these conversations that are happening? not in front of the camera?

>> well, it's natural when i think they're confronted as they perceived to be by the performance of the president two weeks ago. and the fallout ever since. so especially from the people on the hustings, the people out there on the frontline districts you know, they're the most vulnerable democrats and they're talking to the leadership. it's the job of leadership to listen to these folks gather that information. they're looking at the polling. they're looking at deep trouble. see polling, looking at dscc polling, there begging the white house to give them more information and they're looking at the median the polling that they're doing as well, they gathered all that. i think i came jeffries is doing that. i think chuck schumer's we don't think nancy's doing that obviously to look broke both barack obama and as implosive, they are to stallworth, leaders of the party right now. even though they hold the titles anymore, they once had, they are still behemoths when it comes to their ability to persuade he is the future and this is something that was not addressed by either candidate joined the debates. the public

doesn't want to know what happened over the last four years. they want to know what you're going to do over the next four and every ten they keep focusing on the future for biden they're wondering if this is how he is today. how's it going to be two months from now at the next debate, i wasn't going to be four months from now at the election, or even four years from now. and neither candidate is spending as much time as they should be. and i'd be critical virus has democrat, i'd be critical of how biden has been handled. you should have gone out the day after and engage people live not through a teleprompter. >> he was in north carolina and that rally you're talking? yes, but he's but it wasn't the true given take. he never put himself in jeopardy, waited 15 days and you can't do that. you can't. if he needs that much protection that he's not going to make it. that's a fair observation. >> well, we say playing devil's advocate, there were mistakes made by the former president donald trump, but that debate, and we didn't see him for like ten days or more

mistakes. >> they were lies that's different than his case. >> that's not all unless he speaks the better he does and arise had his people are going to hate hearing that for joe biden, you have to come out and be heard for donald trump. be silenced while lin-manuel miranda said that ehrenberg said that smile more and talk less, thanks everyone so much. let's continue this conversation right now with former democratic governor of new york, david paterson. he is skeptical that president biden will in fact be the victor come this november, governor patterson. thank you so much for joining me this evening. i wonder governor did president biden dispelled i'll any of your concerns or doubts about his political viability in november well, i think that he demonstrated a lot of contrition. >> this evening, even referring to some of his gaffes and the debate as stupid mistakes. and i think that that sacrifice that he made ignited a passion. i think go for him from the

audience. you wound up rooting for him because he was really trying to be honest about himself but we'll interesting aspect of this has it's been two weeks and an hour since the debate ended. and yet, donald trump was leading in the polls by one percentage point at that time. he's now leading by two percentage point so that tells me that most democrats are so afraid of what president trump would do to the country, that they would probably rather vote for joe biden in any form, rather than risk the consequences. >> well, that in some ways echoes the sentiment of george clooney is op-ed yesterday about this start that he's saying that leadership should stop health type of delaying people they did not see what they saw. and yet he's been out almost 20 times now without similar moments of concern as the debate raise. now, different ones have happened, but governor, you know, firsthand what it's like to

face public and private calls from your own party to step aside and you can supposed to end your own reelection campaign because of the distraction it potentially posed for your administration. what are the lessons that you think president joe biden ought to take from your political experience? >> i think that you have to put in my case, it was the state in his case. it's the country ahead of your own thoughts, and it was disappointing to see that when he was on morning joe three days ago, when they said that they were powerful house democrats and senate democrats who were worried about his ability to win. he said he didn't care what they thought. that's when i realized that he had over personalized the situation. in other words, that it was getting to him. and the worst thing also is that the people who are supporting him, the people his inner circle are just making one mistake after the other between whether or not he saw a doctor, whether or not he got an arrest how he had

jet-lagged even though last time he'd been on a plane was 11 days before. and then the worst one of all, he had a bad night i've heard that so much. i don't even know what that means. 150 years ago, general custer had a bad night and that's a bad night. but i just don't think that president biden is really focusing on what the best and would be to this for the country. if he believes that trump is so dangerous, he's got to reconsider what he's doing right now do you think that reconsideration should result in him stepping aside? well, once again, even when he talks about stepping aside, he says only the almighty god could make him step aside i didn't know that he was so much better than the rest of us and these are the kinds of statements that you don't that it demonstrates that the person is not actually in touch with themselves and it makes it harder for them to be the odds with other people. that's why i

really was pleasantly surprised that he was hard when himself in his remarks tonight and answering the questions to the media former governor david paterson. >> thank you so much for joining me this evening and he just going to think a man like president biden, who has said, judge me not by against the almighty, but by the alternative. your take is really, really quite astute. thank you so much. thank you president biden, insisting that he won't exit the race and we've heard this a number of times, and he has said it of reporting tonight, says a group of biden aids have come up with a plan to convince him to drop out. >> can you be persuaded a biden biographer joins me next used car shopping two rows, two dogs are sold. oh woe. let's pause for the facts like nearly half

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go to harrys.com slash shave to claim your $7 trial. >> i'm stephanie elam in los angeles and this is cnn what is motivating president biden to stay in the race besides all the delegates? well, he was asked that very question tonight. wasn't days response have you spent time thinking about what it would mean for your legacy, which you've worked decades to build. if you stay in the race despite the concerns that voters say they have and you lose to someone

who you yourself have argued is unfit to return to the oval office i'm going to do this for my legacy i'm in this to complete the job i started when i want to bring in someone who knows about biden's legacy more than most chris whipple, the author of the biden biography, the fight of his life what oppression statement that is chris these days, let me bring you know you had no idea how oppression that title was going to be, happy birthday. thank you so much. i appreciate that. someone didn't wish me well, but i thought through listen, be ranking democrat on the house intelligence committee was on cnn tonight and you know, he was explaining why he thinks biden should step aside. and one of the reasons he gave was legacy. now he says the biden is now gambling with his by staying in the race. what do you think about that? >> well, look, i think it should be no surprise to anyone

that joe biden wants to run for a second term. i mean, the last time i'm a president walked away from a second term voluntarily was lyndon johnson in 1968 and joe biden has like every other president reserves have ego and ambition and desire to do good things as well but there's one other thing that drives joe biden and that is the thing that's shocking more than anything else as president was the lasting power of trumpism. he thought it would be in the rearview mirror by now. and i think he genuinely believes that he's the guy to beat trump you know, there's some reporting tonight and cnn's reporting that former president obama and congresswoman, former speaker nancy pelosi or huddling about biden's chances at reelection and they're concerned about those chances and that's after political reported. >> the former president obama didn't object to george clooney publishing his op-ed. when we're he calls on biden biden to step down. do you think these two leaders are

souring on biden's campaign? are there assessing the continued reaction? >> well, i think they're probably the latter. i think they're assessing things that, you know, 24 hours ago, laura, i would've said when nancy pelosi said on morning joe, that the president needs to decide what he wants to do. i thought she had opened the door to a possible intervention that would have been maybe a longshot. it would it would have required her and hakeem jeffries and in the biden's inner circle and even some of his family. and by the way, i i've been told that to family members are a little bit wobbly about joe running again and don't want and don't want them to be hurt, which i can't say. >> that cliffhanger, but in any case, i think tonight joe biden close the door on that intervention i think that he was he was in command, he was

fluent on the issues. >> he was coherent he did what he had to do, i think and barring some catastrophic repeat of that debate performance, which obviously could happen he'll be the nominee john love it the pod save america host and former obama staffer, says that there are two bidens, the hero and the fool. >> and he writes, it's hard to deny that in the two weeks since the debate, it's the arrogant and small joe biden we've seen most hanging on bragging defensive, angry weak, who else but him. he wonders aloud, only god could change his mind. he tells us now of course this is somebody who is a staffer and that was a biden excuse me. obama. biden administration? how have you seen this? have you seen this side of biden? does this version that they're describing exist? >> oh, it's absolutely true. joe biden carries a chip on his shoulder. he's always felt that he was the guy from

syracuse law and all the yale and harvard guys looked down on him you know, when he first came to washington, he was summoned to see avril harriman. of all people who was the railroad tycoon and ambassador to the soviet union for fdr and hara man who was a yalee, grilled biden he, he never got over it. he's still talks about he says who that railroad guy that rich guy, he's still, he's still angry about it. so joe biden carries grudges. there's no question about it. and frankly, although he and obama certainly had a bromance, there also very competitive, so it makes this whole oh the reports that barak obama was talking about finding an exit for joe a pretty fraught subject will be interesting. their legacies are intertwined, having served together in the

same administration. and now of course, when the president i'd states, but on that legacy see question. we don't check this out from nbc's chuck todd, listen everything that i've learned, it has made me want to rethink a lot of the biden biography i still can't believe he ran for president in the first place, given that his family was in crisis. >> in 2018, i think the entire narrative on joe biden is going to change and that he was he's always been everything has been about his ambition and his ambition comes first well, two-under certainly changing in right now and you've written the book on biden, what do you make of what todd has said? yeah. no, i think that's harsh. i really do. i think that no question about it that joe is he's spent his whole life wanting to be president. he's thought about you said the run for president or thought about it every four years? but i his family has been all in every step of the way and certainly certainly beau was certainly

hunter was and is and jill biden is. of course, all in on this race as well. so i think that's harsh. >> i think it's intriguing that people are judging and criticizing the ego and ambition of a politician when well, pot meat, kettle, chris whipple. thank you so much. >> my pleasure. >> next the spotlight turns to vice president kamala harris. would she fare better against trump than biden? well, new reporting suggests the biden camp is trying to find out the answer that very question, but first, how to everyday voters feel about biden's news conference? and tonight, it turns out the verdict is mixed i saw you and your friend, react when he said, for example, vice president trump it hadn't okay. he's 81. i think he conveyed more defensiveness versus com and i think we're really craving to

be able to be confident about the candidate that we carry into the november election. you don't think he should drop out? no, he should drop out. keep pushing too late. what do we in july, gary go into august from the swift's new candidate i think it'd be i think it'd be foolish i love milwaukee cnn is live from milwaukee as republicans unite behind their nominee, his vp, and their plans to take that the white house follow cnn for complete coverage. >> the republican national convention starts monday at seven on cnn. >> when your home needs work, where do you go and you angie. angie, gay man with angie, find top rated certified pros in your area plus compare quotes and pricing to help you get all your jobs done well, find top rated certified pros in your area at angie.com 20 seconds a week to lose 20% of your weight in a year with diet and exercise. that's the power of glp-ones through roe, connect

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call 187786 68555 i'm under roger the capitol hill. this is sienna tonight. >> president biden trying to put to bed concerns about his candidacy, including touting the full ticket with vice president kamala harris i thought she was qualified to be president from the very beginning. i made no bones about that she is qualified to

be president while some critics have hinted that biden isn't dropping out because he thinks that harris isn't ready. it's not what he said. of course. as you heard, biden says that that is not the case and tonight, the new york times is reporting the biden campaign is testing harris against donald trump should biden decides to bow out of the race. and that's a big if not, comes on the very same day, a new poll shows harris whole days slight lead over trump in a hypothetical matchup but the state of the race is essentially unchanged and biden insists that polls like that will not change his mind with me now, cnn, national it's all politics reporter eva mckend, who is in greensboro, north carolina. we're harris held a rally today also here, cnn political analyst ron brownstein, thanks to both of you, by the way, he's been digging deeper into harris and her effort to bolster her image and a brand new piece out for it, the atlantic eva let me begin with you, my friend, because you attended harris is rally today and other events

that she has held frankly, since the debate. and at times, the vice president has been criticized for not appearing authentic. how are voters reacting to her now, during this very critical moment for the biden campaign well, laura, she has spent the past week crisscrossing the country, really making the case to keep parts of the democratic coalition. so these by enlarge are audiences that are thrilled to see her the essence festival in new orleans, the alpha kappa alpha convention in dallas. she of course, are self and aka asian american voters in las vegas, nevada. and today at a historic black high school in greensboro, north carolina, they are very receptive what struck me though, is in the conversation with older black voters, there is a real resistance two pushing biden aside in this late hour of the game. they are very supportive of harris, but they don't necessarily think it's the

right strategy to push president biden off of the ticket. younger black voters have more of an appetite to see harris ascend to the top of the ticket. but they also don't necessarily think that biden should be forced out. they think that it's a decision that he should arrive that on his own take a listen to what we're hearing from voters on the campaign trail. >> she supportive of him staying on the ticket, and i trust her judgment so he if he needs to say he needs to stay, i think that people are more are concerned about the aesthetic of what it needs to be president. but kamala harris and joe biden have been working since they got into congress. and i think we need to make sure that the we'll who are in office are the people who are doing the work. i believe it would be a good thing to do. i think that kamala harris is more than ready for that work believe in the power that she has to take this country so

that last woman that you heard from there, she is an entrepreneur and winston salem here in north carolina. and she said that she would be more excited to vote for harris come november. but if biden rides this controversy out and is still well on the ticket in november, she would support him as well. so what you're seeing from black voters is really a pragmatic approach. and a pragmatic look at this contest. they recognize that they're voting for the democratic ticket and are not sort of caught up in this controversy over president biden it's fitness for office. they have an understanding that they are voting for a set of policies, whether they choose biden or harris or another democrat. >> ron let me bring you in here because your new reporting it focuses on efforts to boost the image of harris by a liberal advocacy group called way to win. in this group wrote in the strike did you memo and i'm quoting here, the reality is commonly was tapped by biden as his partner on the ticket and a

new standard bearer for the party and her role as the vp on the current ticket is more critical than ever. so, investing in her is a no brainer. so how do they shape her image? now, we are talking almost four years in and she was a senator that and she was an ag in california before that, how do you do that without igniting concerns about biden's health and ability to remain on the top of the ticket? >> well up the predicate is that harris is going to loom larger in the vote, whether or not biden steps aside, even if he remains at the top of the ticket. there are obviously a lot of voters who are concerned about his ability to do this for four more years in a second term. and the prospect that she would have to step in at some point before 2028 is not theoretical to a lot of voters but i also think there are a, i've talked to a broad range of democratic strategists and donors and local officials over the last week or so and there is growing interest, i think in

replacing him with her. it's not the people are obtuse to the obstacle she would face. you know, i don't have to tell you as a black woman, you know, in american society, it may not be easy to get elected. president xi has roots in san francisco. she has vulnerabilities on the border, but harris offers the opportunity to shuffle the deck her when one democratic consultant said to me, her floor maybe lower than biden's, but her ceiling maybe higher than biden's and i think that there is a sense among many democrats that if you could turn the page you would have a nominee who is younger than trump suddenly he would look like the old guy who is losing a step, who has the potential, at least a deal with the biggest problem? biden has from 20 to 24, the decline in his support among younger non-white voters. that is the biggest change we've seen since his standing in 2020. and you could electric potentially i have a ticket that has harris and

gretchen whitmer that would be historic and potentially electrifying, obviously a gamble, but along that same line of potentially shaking up a race that now seems heading toward a pretty solidly preordained result. >> well, you know, ron on that 0.1 of the common drumbeats that i heard, particularly early in their tenure and the administration i've interviewed her myself several months ago. >> people wanted to see a lot more of vice president kamala harris even before now, they were chanting mvp every time she would come into a room, they wanted to hear more from her. and now the question was, why hadn't they was it a matter of strategy, wasn't a matter of her being set aside. but i want to go back to the new york times reporting that the white house is testing. harris is strength versus trump. i know you talked about a different ticket, but what's that tell you about where things stand right now that despite biden saying he's in this race, unless he's convinced he can't beat trump they're now they're talking about that unless part yeah. >> you look people aren't sure

whether they're doing that because they want to show harris is stronger, because they want to show harris is weak. polling polling today had her doing better than biden. there's other polling this out ahead or doing worse than biden. i don't think any of that polling means very much at this point until you know harris's position would look very different, maybe for better or worse, once she steps into the spotlight as an actual potential successor nominee, you don't multiple democrats i talked to use the phrase to say that she is essentially a cipher to voters at this point. the negative attacks from republicans haven't really stuck in the sense that voters don't have, that isn't the first reaction they have to her name, but there really isn't any positive associated with it either and, you know, when you look at her standing with the public, it very much tracks biden's at this point, which suggest she doesn't have much of an independent identity and regardless of whether she is going to be a stand-in or a potential successor, that reality that there isn't much on the blackboard at this point

is what convinces groups like wait a win that they have to fill in the picture before republicans to, because you certainly going to have the argument next week of the republican convention like the ad that donald trump ran immediately after the debate, vote for joe biden today it kamala harris tomorrow. and regardless, i say regardless of whether she's the top or the number two, democrats have to bolster her to deal with that potential line of attack from republicans even ron. >> thank you both so much. i'll be curious to see what voters think. do they identify her as the vice president and remember her during these past couple of years or identify her as the real firebrand senator who would take control of those senate judiciary hearing meetings ahead to thank you both so much for joining me today. ahead. a complicated question to president biden. that was not related to call for him to step down was it a test or the person who asked it? david sanger joins me next

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president biden tonight peppered with questions about his candidacy. he has asked if he would be willing to take a cognitive test. he was asked what he thinks about democrats calling for him to step down he was asked if he's the most qualified to beat trump and you'd be forgiven if you thought he did not get a single question about policy. but he did. including a couple from cnn, political and national security analyst david sanger. here's one of them i'm actually you answered on whether you would be ready to go deal with putin and xi two or three years from now. >> i'm ready to do with them now three years from now. like i said, i'm dealing with xi right now and direct, contact i have no good reason to talk to putin right now there's not much that he is prepared to do

in terms of accommodating any change in his behavior? and but there isn't any world leader i'm not prepared to deal with david sanger joins me now. >> david, good to have you here. before that exchange, you had asked biden a pretty complex, complicated foreign policy question about russia's relationship with china. and i wondered, and some people did wonder about the motivation compared to some of the other questions that were a little bit more elementary about his campaign. were you trying to test his flow of information? >> yes look, this is the question that i asked which was just before the one that you showed on the on the clip was this that during his presidency, we have seen a remarkable thing happen, which is that china and russia have begun to come together, act together in partnership. and just yesterday pushed by his administration, nato came out and condemn the chinese for

giving the technology to the russians. it's rebuilding their military and enabling them to fight in ukraine. so my question to him was, are you prepared to disrupt the russia, china relationship? i didn't say whether they would disrupted overtly covertly and it's a subject that is debated in the biden white house every single day. it's one he's never talked about. but i knew he knew about it in great length. and i've written a lot on this topic and why i just wanted to see was i figured everybody will have asked by the time he got to me if he got to me. are you leaving the ticket? are you saying and all that? but i wanted to do was just watch him pays through a complex but daily not obscure foreign policy problem involving are two biggest superpower rivals and he wound around a bit, but he did address it and hit all of the major points i had to

sort of step in and say, are you trying to disrupt it? and he said i one point, yes. but i'm not going to tell you how were you satisfied to think that he was responding to you off the cuff with a basis of understanding from the briefings that you were aware that he be receiving yes. >> yeah. i mean, i knew that he was discussing this topic with his aides you know, very frequently it's the biggest foreign policy problem in many ways that they face. the most complex and long-lasting. and i just wanted to see how he dealt with it. the question that you showed law, which was are you prepared three years from now to sit down and see putin the way he did in 2021 is one meeting or with xi jing ping was an effort to get him this did not work as well to address whether he thinks he would be in good enough shape three years from now to go you know, one-to-one with vladimir putin he interpreted it somewhat

differently. and basically said, i'm dealing with xi now, i'll always be ready to go deal with them but i am refusing to talk to putin who was an interesting answer i was just trying to get them away every time you ask him how he's going to be in the future, he tells you what he's done in the past. and i was just trying to see if i could get them to talk about the future. >> frankly, quite indicative of the pivot that many politicians do every single day. but obviously viewed differently these days. but there is a split it's green that's happening while this was going on and while he's been dealing with nato and the summit, you've got the split screen of trump meeting with viktor orban at mar-a-lago. and i'm wondering what does that meeting about and how are you seeing that split-screen? >> so trump has a fascination with orbon trump could be trying to meet in advance with the leaders of germany or france, or or the new leader of britain instead, what he's

doing is meeting with europe's sort of sole remaining strongman, a member of the eu and of nato. but you're sort of wondering here why it is that orban is still in the midst of nato, right the answer is there's no way to expel him but he's the only one who trump really likes because he admires him for his authoritarian tactics david really fascinating to think about how all this unfolding now only through your own mind, but the voters, those of the voters as well, david, thank you so much, great to be with you. >> and thank you all for watching the source is next it looks down at his queen and says our wire matt anymore? i'll be unto, let's work on that french shall we? >> i've learned that it ibm.

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