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come from richmond national battlefield park he's the one guy in the room's got b more bos than i do which is fantastic. most recently co-author a battle of stones river he as a young lad got his start by working for the park service but went to east tennessee state middle tennessee state let me get it right there. there are some tennesseans over here that are going to be mad. he is over here waving his cane at me. chief historian hiding us than she did by the by the way? [applause] have gone to the jefferson davis school of human resources. [laughter] next to her as our book review editor by day he's a chief administrative officer for central virginia battlefields

trust will cure a little bit from them tomorrow. there's lots going on in the chancellor's area for me preservation point of view and a bunch of different fronts we will fill you in on that. were able to address that properly. our former chief historian my great polish brother. chris got his in the national military long, long ago when they still had horses for cavalry which was last week actually. right now he is the director of the museum for the state of wisconsin. so they have more than she's there. he tells a wide story of the involvementth in the armed services that is a fantastic

museum of things he randomly e-mails me. he is off on the adventure of a lifetime. they are very lucky to have him up in wisconsin. last but not least our great friend tim smith who has been gracious enough to sign books and answer questions tonight. [applause] so i actually want to start by framing the discussion here with the great task force which comes from the gettysburg address. i had to memorize it in second grade. i think i remember i had to have the fake felt beer did anyone have to do that with the stove pipe hat out of cardboard or construction paper? at the dedication of the cemetery says any larger sense we cannot dedicate we cannot

consecrate, we cannot hallow this ground. men have consecrated it far above our power to add or detract. the longer member but we say here but it will never forget what we did here. it is for us the living to be dedicatedth here to the unfinisd work which they who fought here thus far so nobly advanced. it is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task before us. from these honored dead we take increased devotion for the cause of which they gave the last full measure of devotion. that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain. this nation under god shall have a new birth of freedom that government of the people, by the

people, for the people shall not perish from here and that is how lincoln framed the great task before us. and so i want to kind of ask our panelists tonight as you think about 1863 and everything that was going on from stones river right up to the end of the year. lincoln frames all of this in terms of this unfinished work. what does the great task before us mean to you? i will wait for the first hole lightbulb i see over someone's head. [laughter] >> the great brother. button at the bottom. >> let's start with why lincoln needs to frame it in the first place. this is something that's a fact

that quite frankly stares us in theot face but the emotional impact is notec fully appreciative. in the seven months between may 1 and november 30, 186300 there are over 140,000 americans on both sides killed, wounded, captured, missing for the three bloodiest battles of the civil war the three audience battles in american history up until that time occur in that, timeframe. gettysburg, one or 40000. the united states does not wade through that much blood in that timeframe at any other time in the 19th century. in fact the next time they wade waited that much blood and afr timeframe and then we wait for that which blood again in that timeframe until 1944 the last six months or seven months in the first seven months of 1945. the tale of human destruction

that is occurring in this country in 1863 that is why he has to go to gettysburg what does this mean? what does this mean? what is this about? he goes to gettysburg to find the conflict. the conclusion that is perfect for t that is if you read the gettysburg address go back and read it now with that in your mind. go back and read it you think about the emotional this is a country that's ripping itself apart now go back and read the gettysburg address and truly the united states. and then standing here at a cemetery there is no guarantee

that gettysburg will remain in that title. in fact gettysburg will hold that. but there is no guarantee. until lincoln goes there explain what this means. and it is very important this sacrifices matters. it matters and we have to stay the course. he seems quite literal in the sense he says our task in the united states with the emancipation for national objectives. he is using as an opportunity. he is defining what this war is about and setting an objective to try to finish the war.

to me that is what this is. you cannot understand the charge he makes without belaboring it makes that even greater in american history. he had that broad context of that. i think about it in similar terms you look around fredericksburg in 1863 and the soldiers getting hate mail from home. and these soldiers are t like ts will all have been for nothing if we give up now. shut your face. and they sent it very angry letters home saying we have to see this through. so on a soldier level we see that and they so eloquently on a national level of 1863.

>> what goes for me is the freedom. a and it comes about through the emancipation proclamation. he had issued the preliminary proclamation in september of 62 but that document is going to change over that 100 days. to serve in the army then of course and may you have the bureau and that's going to put war on a whole new level. we all know a double negative and it's adding manpower to the union effort. >> you think about the new freedom.al and so this new national vision

offers that. >> have been thinking about lincoln at this moment of course. lincoln is many things and another thing he knows is that that isgiving the speech in nova year from now is going to be up for reelection. if he does not achieve reelection and a democrat comes to power and you see the rise of the copperheads and opposition to the political opposition of the w war his great fear at the end of 1863 as he will not be reelected the country will not go on to achieve the military victories necessary part of the task remaining and it sounds sinister to say so is heat knows he knowsif he can get another tf the war is not ended by then.

have a democrat comes to power in all likelihood it lincoln believes that only doing get george mcclellan on the 20-dollar bill or the 5-dollar bill which is terrifying. just imagine opening your wallets. we get probably independent confederacies of two very scary outcomes if you're abraham lincoln he called dibs and i think lincoln has that in mind as well part of the great task remaining is is ensuring he relies on the general's heat trusts18 we have just heard ...a grant of the tools he needs to set up other men for success are going to achieve the victories to return them to the white housege the november after he givesthe gettysburg address. >> since that microphone is moving its way toward youyo anyy i think about stonesor river sealing the deal laid out in the emancipation proclamation. so we start 1863 kind of with

this victory that allows lincoln to finally start moving this vision forward in a very tactical battlefield centered way. how important is that? >> yes it is an unusual occurrence. the majorhe yearr with battle going on 1862 until the first two days of 1863. and so timing is everything with any event. and you had the defeat of fredericksburg a few weeks earlier. you defeated the chickasawaw bau to the other two primary union armies and here's maybe not a pretty one but it is a victory in middle tennessee and that is all you need. and so it is extremely important. lincoln would write famously the

union commander you gave us a hard victory when we really needed one. >> i will lure the microphone back in this direction for tim. sort of in general the idea of the great task before us. >> i think militarily that means that the war's not done yet. we still have more to do. and we have got to win this thing we have a lot more to add to what these folks have. but being a military historian i think more in terms of the military aspect and as i mentioned before lincoln certainly cannot pinpoint a certain time this battle won the war. it was the beginning of the end. he is looking at this and sink there's a whole lot more to do. and we have to put a bow on this yet. that is the great task. >> is there a key moment in the year of 63 where you as a

historian might focus in and sah this is something overlooked as a moment and the consequential year it doesn't have to be like a turning point moment or anything like that but maybe something that is unappreciated and this march towards freedom? anybody else? >> i will go back and my opportunities to prove themselves they had the opportunity to provide their examples of what they could p d. they could provide attack. they could sacrifice their lives to prove they are just as much of a man as anyone else. that's going to have huge repercussions on the road. >> to me it is fascinating

because you talk about how the emancipation proclamation change changes in draft form to final form it gets shorter and yet there's more stuff in the final version. including the idea we are going to bring black troops into the army. but what does that look like? how do we operationalize that 63 is the answer to that question. how do we make this work? what does this look like? it becomes a a pivotable. >> i would throw in and it was alluded to this i think that new york draft riots are hugely important moments not just in terms of the war because they pull a lot of political issues intoto focus for lincoln and the administration but also to understand at this point in the war the initial wave of volunteers are running out of time. the citizen soldier fervor is

now having to be compelled by a military draft in a country that fact we've had to turn to a draft to fill our rank is really,be really difficult for people to swallow pride they view it as andg abridgment of their fundamental rights they should not have to be compelled to serve in the armed forces because that's what the monarchies do. americans should ever have to be compelled to do that is the first real time we have to turn to this. they point as to a really important moment in the war or the volunteer remains at the forefront on having a conversation of how are going to supply the manpower to win this war if we do run out of volunteers. every run out of men willing to march to the battlefield part of the answer to that story is the bloodshed has become unimaginable that war begins in 1861 evan thanks is going to be a big

battle one time or going to picnic and is going to be over at the end of it. they are now starting to realize not only other going to be battles there are going to be campaigns that take weeks and months at a time you are going to be under fire every single day over the course of multiple days and months. that is a different kind of soldiering is something americans are not accustomed to in the citizen soldiers are less eager in 1863 the draft riots point us to some of the tension to the common soldier. whether they are brave enough ti volunteer they have to be compelled and what that's going to lookk like. >> it's really incredible if you look at the makeup of 1864 those are much different armies than they were in 1863 because of the nature of the people in those regiments. and motivation is to get them there in the firstu place. >> will give you one by land one

by c. we have lanterns in the back window? [laughter] the land one is what was alluded to in her remarks. and i know a pretty good book for sale back there if anyone is at all interested. he said it himself do not overlook this victory because it is not written in letters of blood. if you look at the link chain of events necessary to move the federal army from global kentucky through chattanooga to the carolinas the critical bill link. the fact it occurred, timing matters it occurred at the same time's a fall ofal vicksburg on the victory of gettysburg and the union victory at fort hudson. that's the land one, the c1 the

rival of alabama on the southwest pacific in the fall of 1863 were she takes several u.s. merchant ships. that is too important things. one that mobilizes the civil war.ed we should never remember to mobilizes civil war. our friends for the uk roundtable say thank you. >> you are welcome. the second thing it does iss it energizes. we've been sending ships out there since 1853. we went fighting skirmishes and was now the western pacific. but this t energizes. which is in varying degrees. from that perspective and has the pacific power 1863 in 1864

and 1865 energize the u.s. navy to operate more and more and have more and more of a presence. and so that is something else in 1862. a cluster of something else out. the changes coming in 1863 as the union army moves further into the south and occupies more territoryon and we had the emancipation proclamation and affect we have active recruiting of colored troops in the south. they are establishing camps and bases and recruiting stations and territory for southern occupying southern territories.f

virginia, carolina coast. active recruiting of african-american soldiers and using them as part of the effort to destroy confederate infrastructure and dismantleci s society. >> i want to go back to something you talked about about the relationship with porter. teit seems that is a relationshp that is often overlooked but is the key to developing them on strategic thinking and how it's moving. people talk about grant and sherman but how you relate those

with any equals to develop. >> you don't do it in a vacuum. the decision really wasn't. he takes input from others and asks for help from others. therees is no bigger help in the united states navy. i'm not sure he takes vicksburg the way that he does. you're talking about one of the things that is underreported or appreciated, that's the word is the navy. even some of the officers below were significant. if i had to add another to keep

the folks on vicksburg, when john wayne leads that southward into mississippi, it is not offkilter and can be overestimated. >> i read tim's book and -- [laughter] i asked about the relationship between grant and porter. are there relationships that help them in the development?

[inaudible] [laughter] it's not just a john wayne movie. [laughter] the commander of the army so you know there was all the hero worship for mcclellan but after that it seems the luster has worn off and they don't view the commanding officer anymore as the relationship really changed

cotheir. if there were a lot of the letters that come through. whoever else he's quarreling with at the moment there's the further revolution of grant and sherman into the partnership that's going to win the war. it's the partnership that wins vicksburg when you think about the responsible assignments sherman is given in the campaign and grant takes it to the south of the city and then covers his career in jackson. to me you see that evolution and it goes on to quibble with sherman there's no question that

grant is becoming more and more reliant so that evolution of thought partnership sets the stage. i think 1863 is interesting because they have to learn to commandan people differently. richard you will absolutely will not do so robert e lee with of the organization of the army of north virginia with that original kind of phenomenal storm of victory with the absolute peak of its confidence it wondering about the structure versus the two wings if it's going to work. so he has to in the wake of

stonewall's death in 63 so again ifon we are talking about relationships that dissolve, it wasn't his fault. he couldn't be there to continue the relationship. i say that with love in my heart. >> well, rest in pieces. [laughter] he will feeled differently than- he is granted from being a learner in that regard and becoming the micromanager. >> linkedin and grant in 63 emerges as lincoln's problem solver and figures out vicksburg

rethere's a mess over chattanoo. he figures that out and shows that he can clean things up and get things done and he's finally found the person that is going to get results. >> linkedin of course has that cabinet crisis end of 62 that couldn't leave it to the dismissal and lincoln plays it in the most excellent political fashion. he lets lincoln do what lincoln has to do by running a lot of political interference and of course he does fantastic work all the way through.

i saw your hand up first. ask the question if you want to direct it to a specific panelist please mention him by name. >> my question is open ended. we've heard about the relationships between grant and a number of people especially sherman. can you compare and contrast that relationship during that campaign just we've heard about how one seemed to merge and the other seemed to diverge.

>> your eye is before you even ask the question. >> there's a glare in my glasses. [laughter] if we had robert e lee right now he said to did you have a falling out with long straight i think that he would deny. they just needed the space. hand they gone to couples counseling they could have worked through those things without having to send him to knoxville to harass. i think long street, they need a space from one another but i don't think either of them would have said the relationship has dissolved any. he is eager to have him back.

theytu are welcomed onto the fid with reception. so i think william long streets reception meets a hurdle, and i think there was always something that needed to be done to relieve the situation inse tennessee and that is part of why he goes out there and volunteers to do it but he is at that point he says i will let him go but only if you really think he needs to. i don't think there was that much animosity. during the campaign, long street feels he's doing his duty as a soldier. remember they are both west point officers. long street knows as a commander he has the right to question the decisions to make that known in a private meeting but if he orders the attack mustee go ahe, he has to carry that out.

they don't need to open that can of worms. he had every right to make the objections he did and he would continue to debate going forward. that's troubling for people, but i think the relationship it a bump in theth road but i don't think either of them felt the other behaved inappropriately. sometimes the literaturee might give that misconception. i think grant and sherman would astonish and some of us have chatted about this. sherman is able to immediately recognize he doesan not want grant's. job because he is too scared to do it. when i am in command, all i can think about is what the other guy is doing it all grant thinks

about is what he's going to do to the other guy. i think sherman's brilliance is recognizing that he is safe in his hands and he can go to the wall time and time again because he doesn't want grants job and there is no animosity for that. he knows grant can handle it and he has a breakdown in kentucky because he is in ultimate command. i think one element of the relationship to emphasize there was never any competition because each of them felt that they had the right to job, they were doing the right thing and they were suited for each other. i don't know that there was that lack of competition but he resigned himself to follow these and was going to object when he thought it was appropriate to do so. >> instead of these diverging relationships, one thing we forget is he gets grievously

wounded almost as soon asking his back so weke don't see them kiss and makeup. he comes back several months later and he continues to lean on him heavily when he does. but that kind of disrupts the narrative in a way that you're talking about. this may be about sherman and grant, sherman continually underperforms and grant always has his back. he messes things up and -- >> that is the school you should be attending. >> after the fall of vicksburg sherman is sent to the army of relief but he doesn't destroy them. chattanooga, o and green contins to back him up so we created this narrative of them working together. other questions. let's go here to the front.

have you ever looked at any other relationship like between reynolds and mead and for the battle where reynolds who has been made superior says you take command. e have you written much about i? >> whoever the commander at west point would grant when grant was

a cadet and when he starts to move upward inth the army he fis himself in command of the army it takes a certain amount of the lack of ego to do that on smith's part. early in the war in fort donaldson sherman was commanding at paducah and the troops forward when grant is a

brigadier general before he was appointed so the date of ranking. >> and same thing giving of himself for the greater good. >> a question over here. >> for vicksburg what is the plan going forward to repair things given the extensive damage? >> it's larger than just a storm it's an erosion and i'm pretty confident the plan going forward is to do government studies and public opinion and all that kind of stuff so i'm positive it will be years before those things happen. but hopefully the whole north

end of the park is down. the vicksburg national cemetery and part of it is sloughed off so it's a message down there. i am not sure i see it getting fixed anytime soon. >> can somebody please explain to me why there was so much animosity grant had against george thomas? thomas is buried in nearby troy

so that is a great excuse. >> i've thought about this and as somebody that's ponderedd of the career, i think there's a couple of things. the papers were destroyed and there's not much out there. i don't want to disparage the book in any way. i think it's a mixture of clashingng personal styles and personalities and professional jealousy. if you think about the personalities of grant and thomas, they are very different people and today here we are 160 years later trying to dissect the relationships and there were

things that didn't translate well in the page. we get a sense at that particular momentou but it's one thing to read about it. there is some professional jealousy i do agree with that argument. it put thomas in charge therefore they were superseding grant and driving such that he was going tomi resign the commission and he talked him out of it. that is a sore point that it

will continually remind grant of. it's a different philosophy. there is much more, to approach campaigns differently than grant and put all those things together. sometimes it's the intangibles. it's tough without actually watching the two of them in action.. i was going to ask a question about the relationship of wagonern between morgan friedman

and send all washington -- dens washington. [inaudible] but we do know that grant was absolutely paranoid. joe johnston coming to raise the

siege. this turns out there's nothing to worry about. he washed his hands of the whole situation. at the first thing he says i'm too late. he washes his hands of this entirely but he knows his reputation from the old army and the reputation precedes the person and people make judgments on their reputation rather than what they are capable of and i think that is what happens a lot with johnston. i don't think he is quite as fearful but grant is calling the shots with well over a third of his army to take care of the

situation. the memoirs are fascinating. both are highly complementary. johnston in the memoir and my theory the better they make johnston look, the better they look for meeting johnston. so sherman does bend over backward in the memoirs, and they did become great friends based on the idea they were going to settle the war and all thisre but they felt their surrenderr mattered more and thy would come together on this subject. sherman's numbers, he's constantly talking about after the war and why didn't you attacks me here. what about here when he has the perfect opportunity.

he was making him look like a great soldier. the better he looks the more successful we look. >> you've written about the surrender between sherman and johnston. there is a tiny nest to the end of the story where they come together and the dissolution of the army but johnson serves as a pallbearer. it does cover the way we think about it and especially in the post war they have that relationship and has the war ends they have that friendship. i'm also thinking of where

johnston and by no means perfect but he cobbles together the force and defeating a good part of the union army so should get some credit for that. >> that probably called sherman off guard. i know it today. >> did. >> one last question for the audience. >> the question i have is we want to find out your opinion about the political that went into this of us going forward. how much did lincoln depend on

his political generals to unite the country and bring into the fight the democrats that are living ing the north. how much did that affect their ability to win the war? >> that is a complex question to unravel. when you have armies with citizens andey professional soldiers they respond much better to citizen generals they recognize as public figures rather than regular west point trained officers so the general have an important function. we will hear from that tomorrow. the book makes some compelling cases. sort of junior officers and ranking ncos that influence the politics of the men and their ranks and they tend to be young republicans. did you see this transition is becoming more republican even though there's democratic oppositionel but the armies

themselves become a more republican o body. it is as frustrated as 1861 and 62 that every one of the generals is achieving victories and nobody cares because the eastern generals keep moving robert e lee or fail to theolidate so lincoln knows public opinion is so focused on virginia and what's going on with the army that it doesn't matter that grant is were winning everywhere in terms of the politics so one of the big calculations is those bringing grant to washington to take command of the army and then joining to fight against lee is that the key to the political question because politically that matters more than all of the victories and that is why so many of us get frustrated because we love the western

theater and often times it doesn't get as much attention because the battles don't have the social, political, economic ramifications. of the ward is one in the west but all of the attention is focused onn that used. lincoln and 63 politically is still puzzling through the problem and the question of how to get people to appreciate. no one is seems to have noted and to try to turn this into a positive and political advantage. i w want to give you each the opportunity as we listen to tonight's discussion and presentations one final thought would you like to send folks out the door with?

the war is a progression of things as time goes from yearr o year. that's what i've been thinking about. things that happened that coincide with changes happening. the war is evolving and the units penetrating the territory permanentlyy holding it. those things are going to be irreversible. the personalities that we talk about the emergence of sherman and granted to greater and greater positions and the ability to influence things. all of these things are building so that's what i'm thinking

about. my take away is why you spend so much time talking about military issues. what it shows us is what happened is directly correlated to what's happening on the homefront and politically, economically, internationally so paying attention to the way the people responded allows us to chart investment in the war. more now, all of these questions keeping in mind 1863 years the crucible that the campaignsti ae going to deliver outcomes for the w hinge of the war. new issues are introducedd to so we have to pay attention to all of those things i think the whole emancipation thing until we start doing that differently because it takes a long time to

ichurn out especially the union army you have whole officers leaving the army. it takes a long time to see this is a good thing for them if they are going to win the war now that they will see black-and-white as equal but the endd of slavery will help them win sooner and that takes a long time to work out i second all the points made. i want to develop this a little bit further because the piece is the place the united states has strategic supremacy in the war. it doesn't even mean it is the beginning of the end.

for which it never fully recoversrs and so it's important we talk about emancipation and people forget from that point forward they were the armies of liberation. so from that point forward to thousands upon thousands. that 140,000 cited earlier to 1863 approximate u.s. casualties from 2 june 205th.

that is a human cost that affects everybody. every community is affected by that number. it's no accident [inaudible] that illustrates how important and that was an explanation.

[inaudible] this first week in july, you couldn't win a caucus or nomination in iowa or new hampshire or canada in april or may. the first week in july. that is the dog days of august and now a stretch. my big take away, i'm highly impressed and it's a pleasure to be here and be a part of it. keep it up. [applause]

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