the hear deesha dyer tell it, landing at the white house and rising to one of the most senior levels, followed by launching her companies a happy marriage was nearly impossible.

imagine not too long ago she was working multiple jobs, volunteering in the community, struggled with school, and pretty much did a hail mary when she applied for a white internship. she had no financial wealth to or to influence house circles, no political connections, no serious network to her. get the gig, not even a to live. but with all these hurdles, they weren't the biggest one. her biggest hurdle imposter syndrome crept into our consciousness daily. it was our biggest battle and, not for the faint of heart. how she conquered imposter syndrome became becoming only second african-american to be appointed white house social secretary. and by all accounts, nailed it. scandal is the compelling and compelling story laid out in a very vulnerable memoir titled undiplomatic how my how my attitude created the best kind of trouble. so let's give a warm national

press club welcome to deesha dyer. thank you thank taking so i'd like to start sort of at the beginning. i call this part growing up deja in the book you lay out you map your childhood and your adolescence, warts and all. the highs, lows, parents, music, what was the message you wanted to deliver by being so vulnerable, candid, so open? definitely so. first of all, thank you, jeff, for having me here. and thank you all for being here so much. it is an honor be with you here in this space. i think that when i walk past the building i never thought be on stage here. it's so prestigious, nice and so thank you all for being here. and so what i would say is the reason why i was vulnerable, especially of my childhood, is

when we talk about imposter syndrome, we think it's something that happens overnight because we didn't get something, a promotion, a job or whatever. but for and i think for a lot of people, i had to go back and dig up the root of where it started. you know, i went to a boarding school away from my family. my dear friend went to boarding school with me in the front row and you kind of get pulled away from your family and you get put in an environment that's not really set up to to you deal with culturally. melanie people, it is a situation in which, you know, you feel as if you are wrong, you are bad, you're too you know, you have an attitude the time. and so i think that that's when started for me really feeling like it wasn't that i wasn't wanted but everything i did was wrong or i deserve. i was very lucky to. have an environment that was so healthy. like as far as like where from where i came in philly and so is for me to go back because i think that again, people think that imposter syndrome is just i

didn't get a promotion so you know, i'm not worthy. but like where did that come from? you know, we don't get stuff every day. you know, there's some people get things, some people don't. but for that to be a stain, your character that many of us kind digest, i think it's it came from somewhere. so in the book i talk about digging up the root and for me it was the root of leaving family and being put in a boarding school in hershey, pennsylvania. talk about that. yeah, talk about that from north philadelphia. hershey school. yeah, not hershey, as everybody familiar with hershey. if not you're familiar with reese's peanut butter cups. bars. exactly. and so and the smell of chocolate, you know, chocolate and cow manure just loves your life out there. and hershey school was is a school that was originally for orphaned by milton and catherine hershey. eventually, they allowed, you know, people of color in and women in and it's a school for kids from financially disadvantage backgrounds is what i'll say poor kids. and so my parents were divorced.

my mom thought it was best that i go to school there for a study environment. i think she had all the best intentions and there is no blame there that she put there. i was great in fifth grade when i went. i was a great student fifth, eighth grade, ninth grade hit as my dear friend can tell you, you know, just like everybody else, i was a teenager and was a teenager who did not like authority. i you know, times were different back in 1987 and 88, there were no stand up for what you believe in, speak your mind, whatever. none of that existed. it was a child's places, the corner you speak out of turn. you are a bad child. you are punished. and so that's kind of kind of what happened with me kind of getting there, going from an environment with my family to going into this space where, you know, the student population was diverse. of course, we were a bunch of, you know, little misfits over there. but the student population diverse. but there were no black teachers. there were no black house parents. there was no way to tell you about your hair. there was not lotion like i put

lotion, you know, there was all these things that back i didn't i didn't, you know, no, i didn't have the maturity to realize how much it would affect me until later on. how did it how did it impact you? because you you were essentially you started to be a teenager. that book talks about the fact that you acted up and you had to do everybody else's laundry. yeah. and as punishment. yeah. how did that how did affect you? i mean, i think it know when i had to do we had this thing called and 30. and so when you got in trouble you got a certain number of detention. so it was like 30 days of detention and, 30 hours of labor. and so i got 30 and 30 often and i had to clean the kitchen and do laundry, which is not a big deal. you live with 17 other girls and teenage girls at that. and so i think it affected me because i felt as if i was it was like humiliation. you know, like one of the chores was i was dating a wrestler. and after and i say this in the book, after the wrestling meet, they made me clean up the wrestling mats in front of the whole team, you know, and it was

like you need to be humiliate it. and that was because i stood up for something i believed and a teacher got at it and think it was it was a teacher that we all loved. and i was like, i don't this is right. and i'm going to say something about and got i got in trouble. and i think it affected me because i started at standing up for yourself and doing the right thing and i'd be punished and so it wasn't right to do that. and so, you know, it took me a while to understand and now we're obviously at the age of 2024 where it's like, no stand up, say what you want stand, and now it's applauded. but back then it wasn't applauded. it was it was, you know, you're a bad kid and you caused a lot of trouble. so we're going to make an out of you. but this lasting effects. yes, it did talk about it. it did. because it had lasting effects because i thought that my voice wasn't welcomed. i thought that my fight welcome. i thought my voice was too loud. i was too bold. i thought that i just walked in a room. i would walk in a room and be like, here she comes. and all i did was walk in a room, you know? but everybody's like my

reputation. me, you know? she always brings up this stuff. so everywhere i go, i felt that even in environments that it was welcoming, i was still like, how are they looking at me? how they're looking at me like i'm a bad child or looking at me like i'm going to, you know, bring up something. and so i that for a long time, i believe that i was i won't say tarnish, but i believe that i was bad. i was just like, i am so different. everybody else is following this mold of like going to school and they're quiet and they just nice to me where a blazer is and they do all this stuff and i'm over here like like, you know, like i'm like we're in that and i'm getting a nose ring and, you know but i wasn't a bad kid. i was in the community. i had been involved like hiv, aids rates, animal rights, you know, women's rights years. but nobody looked at that, it was like, she's so loud. and i'm like, but i'm helping people. but my my reputation at that point had already preceded me. so yeah. so so you graduated from the hershey school barely a year. and you know, and then and then

you tried college? i tried talk about that. it didn't work so, so funny thing about college, everyone, you have to pay, you have to go to class. and i didn't want to do either of those things. and so and so i went to college. i was 17. i graduated high school at 17. again, barely. and i barely graduated because the i graduated was the oklahoma city bombing. and i had made again, i thought this was a great thing that i did. i had made purple ribbons for the class to wear for a dollar that we'd show our support and solidarity but that's that was not was not welcomed. and the only reason why i got my diploma because our commencement speaker was coretta scott king. and i was crying in the bathroom and coretta scott king came in the bathroom and she's like, are you okay? and i'm like, no. and she's like, oh, going to graduate. and that's actually how i graduated this class got it. but, but, but i, you know, for me, i went to college because i was forced to go. we were we had to apply to school. we didn't have a choice.

i didn't want to go. i don't have any money, you know, i didn't know what i wanted to do. and so i tried. howard. howard said no to me and i was very upset about that. i wanted to be like different world and have my hbcu crew and go to a black for once and once they said no, i applied to university of cincinnati where my mom had lived in cincinnati, got in, had a great time. you in band? i majored. i in psychology first, then i got a d psychology and i was like, maybe i should be people. and so and and so i changed to teaching and i went to go visit a classroom and somebody had i said no. and then the third was i was just like, i'm going to go to get my general classes with. and then i got served and notice that i was on academic probation then financial probation and i left, but i was such a great dancer that kept me on the dance team for four years. and so, you know, so i danced and i didn't even go to school

there. and so i competed and it was great. i mean, like, honestly, i didn't see a problem i mean, how did your peers it because you were officially out of school. yeah, but yet you were still hanging out with your. yeah, but they were like you had a great life. you're going out, you know, you have a job. i mean, like i think when you're in college, you know, a lot of my were like, you know, i'm college, i'm, you know, doing the route but like she's like i was a hip hop star covering hip hop. i was dancing. i was having a great time. so they were all looking at me like, wow, like this. so great. she's doing that. and i was like, yeah, suckers. you know, like, you're it's so and so i think that a lot of them looked at it like she's just around and still my friends i stopped dancing after four years because i was like, that looks a little weird at this point. so i stopped dancing after that. that class graduated, but they were they're still my friends. we're very close. like i went to school with them and then what happened? and then i go, i was writing and i was doing thing had jobs at the mall.

i at a mall in downtown cincinnati called carew tower. i loved it because. i was like, i'm making $5 an hour at three jobs. and i was balling and i got all the credit cards, ran them all up on stuff that i can't even tell you anymore. what i got and, i had my own apartment. it was $150 a month. y'all. i got evicted from that apartment. that was irresponsible. and i moved back philadelphia with my father. and when i did that, i got a job in philly and then led to going back to school. but that wasn't just any move back. no, it wasn't. it was a hard talk about that move with because you weren't really connected with your dad. i'm working that that at that time it was kind of you weren't. you've never really lived together at a long stretch. yeah. how did that work out? well, moved out so my dad. yeah we. had not lived together since my parents divorced when i was five and then, you know, when i the philly i had nowhere to stay. so i was like dad.

i kind of have to move back. and at this point i'm 22. i think 24, 24. and obviously i've on my own, but that didn't work out. so moving back in with your parents for me was hard because i had not live him in so long. i had my own. i had already who i was but i got a job, was at the house lot. so that was kind of great. i was still working with different community groups in philly and you know, my dad, you know, we get along actually one of my best friends as much as, you know, my friends now, but like back then i'd not live with you for 19 years. you know, you were you you were around. but like it was in and out and it was, you know again, back to being, you know, saying, i to figure out a way to get out of this apartment and go live on my own. so yeah, but you're when you're growing up in like if you're in hershey, whatever you were doing is you're you were talking about teachers that you didn't have black teachers and all the things you're trying to find yourself as a young black woman. how was how was that journey?

yeah. you weren't surrounded by supportive peers. yeah, supportive adults. yeah. since i say that i found my community hip hop like i was a i loved hip hop music. i love the hip hop culture. i still do. i try to break still get hurt, but like you, i love the culture and so we were a tight knit community like that was my family. and it's still they still are actually and and so never was lacking for a community. i was always looking for guidance or, kind of like mentors or like parents, but like i had not had my parents like in my life full time like that since i was. so at this point i had already up like had i had a defense, i had my own, i was already independent. so i wasn't looking for that. i wasn't looking for, you know, parental guidance. i was just like, i just need to keep a community, be around me. so i never, you know, i'm most my community was black. they were all, you know, hip hop dancers or rappers or whatever else, you know. and i really started doing community work in hip hop with

hiv, aids, animal rights, stuff like raising at concerts. so i became the girl who like, you know, here she comes for money. i'm like, i'm asking for money. but i think that they were my community, so i never really was lacking for that but as far as like adults, like or mentors to guide me, i stopped looking for that when i was like nine. so i was already like out the door. so you were pretty much in survival mode. oh, yeah, oh yeah. that time all that time. i probably probably up until a couple years ago. but to be honest with you, yeah, i was in survival mode. i mean, that's how i had to operate i had to do what i had to do to get through each day whatever it was, working five jobs or it was, you know cashing fraud checks. so i did point i talk about in the book like i was just like back then you could like you know deposit an actual check in the bank for $200 and get 150 back even if you didn't have it. i did that a lot. like i did what i had do. am i proud of it? i'm not. i also am just like i did what i had to do and i'm not ashamed of it either. but. but i was definitely in survival

mode. let's skip ahead a little bit. you your working at an insurance firm. yeah, real estate. real estate. real estate firm. i'm sorry, real estate firm. you had a really nice boss. yeah. you were still working a couple other jobs. talk about you discovered the white house internship. well, i went back to school when i was 29 years old. 29, 30. and the only school that would accept me, i was i went back to school for social work. i finally found what i wanted to do. i had been in the community for a long time. it was either like vet school or like social work. and i was like, vet school is so expensive i can't. that's not going to work out. and i probably cry every so i was like, i can't do that. so i decided to do social work and who knew? you need to have a degree for that. and so i was like i love people. people love me. what when i got the degree. and so the only school that would accept me was community college of philadelphia. and they actually didn't accept me at first because my math scores were so low. so i was 29.

like, who remembers math when you're 29 from high school? and so i went back to a high school at night to be qualified for community college and then the year after that is when this man named barack obama started to appear everywhere. and was like, who is this random? but we're into like, you know, like he actually, you know is saying all these things. but he was so to me that i was just i'm interested in learning more about this person and i started watching speeches and i started to him and, you know, not only was he black, he had a black wife and had black children, but he knew like a lot of struggles of the he didn't grow up in this like, you know, home with picket fence. and i was just like, i can relate to so many things. he's saying. and i actually understand for the time some politics government that i never understood before, but i didn't know anybody, didn't have no money to donate. i think i donated dollars or every month $10 to the campaign and i would get these letters back that were signed from barack obama and thought he signed them himself.

because i worked there. they were like stamped the thing. i'm like, it's a seal or you know what? you know? and and i to work for him my boss was a republican back then again john we're still friends he got a thank you from john mccain sarah palin for, his donation. and i was like wow, you know, like barack obama. and so i put a picture up of barack obama and my cubicle and said, i'm going to go work for him and leave you. but it was a joke. it was a joke. i had no qualifications. and then the white house in the barack obama won november 4th, 2008, and then a little bit that the year after i got an application in my aol dating me very much so in my aol dotcom it said you work the community, you work with young people. here's a white house application for an intern. can you please pass this on so we can get some, you know, young black people in the white house? and i looked at the application and i was like, what, this? and i was like an internship. and they said unpaid. and i was like, no, i can't do

that. and i said, well, i'm probably not qualified at this point. i'm 31. i've been in community part time for two years, not there was no age requirement. i said, well, i'm only part time in community. i'm sure you got to be a four year school. harvard, you know, upenn, something, duke, whatever. and there was no school qualification. and i was like okay. i said so maybe i can apply for this and so and so i did i never passed it on to the competition that would have been my mentees and i was like ever the hustler. yeah oh yeah. i don't think i've mentees that go to university of pennsylvania like no no know i don't know anything about an internship and so and so i applied for it myself. summer of 2009. yeah. now there's a there's a vivid part of the book where you got the, the call as i call. yes, yes. opens with the call. you were it opens you were. you were you were you were you were spaghetti. i was i was making because we

had air conditioning unit in our apartment and it was a hot philly summer in my soul. philly is hot. it's real hot. and was like, if i make a bunch of spaghetti, we freeze. i don't got to, like, cook no more. the rest of the week. and so i was like a big of spaghetti already had my bonnet on hair wrap pajamas and i got a call from a no number at that point. i was like, it's probably a bill collector, but i'm going pick it up anyway. do they call this at night? and it was i on my, you know, my professional voice of, hello, this is teacher and. and they said, you know, may i speak with deesha dyer? this is the white house. and i was like and i was like, oh, my gosh. and i like, this is deja and it was the white house scheduled advance office calling to schedule an interview me for the white house internship. and what i said to him, the 23 year old that was on the white. one i said to him, lovely patrick said, well, you know, i said, i have time right now and

said, so if you want to do it right now? because my thought was, if you're calling me almost 10 p.m. to schedule interview, this is the white house. what is the chances that you're going to keep this appointment tomorrow at 2 p.m. anything can happen in world. thankfully we did not have zoom. there were no cameras. and so patrick said, if you're okay with that, we'll do it right now. i said, i'm ready. and we interviewed right then and then you sort of now this is not going to happen 100%. i mean, like i was like, first of all, i didn't know i the interview. i was like, i know if that interview with this kid, you know, but but i was like, i don't hear i didn't hear anything for months and months and months i didn't know that's how government worked. then i was there, the government there on top of it. no, not so. i didn't anything for months and weeks and i said i didn't get the internship. the internship right after labor day and we're pushing in august at this point and i was like i just didn't get it. good, good try kid.

you know pat on the back, you wrote a great essay. you put yourself out there. it didn't work until i got a call. another random call from. the people that were looking for my security clearance information at sfo six, which i'm sure all of you are familiar with, you have to give your whole entire life your size, blood type, everything and i had a i had missed the email. an email that was an acceptance email. and they said, rick, wrong about your paperwork. your white house internship starts in a few weeks and we don't have your paperwork and. i was like, excuse me? and i went back them in the black hole of my gmail, an email that said you were accepted to the internship. and so you get to washington by hook or crook. listen, that a journey megabus it was a journey. and you're you know, if you were you were at the time you were you were living somebody. yeah my then boyfriend your then

boyfriend. and so he's like, okay, i'm to washington. i mean, you go to come are you not going to i mean like i was like, this is the opportunity of a lifetime. so i don't know if this is gonna be forever, but is the opportunity of a lifetime. so i was like, i also thought i'd be back in. i mean, i did back. and after three months after the internship was over, i said, i'll be right back. so i wasn't thinking that i would be gone forever. so you did this internship? mm hmm. you did at it. you're like, it's behind you. you're back in philly, you're doing your get back into your routine. get back into the real estate thing. yeah, it was. but then you got another phone call. got another phone call. well, first i quit my job. i quit my. one thing that's really important here to say is, like when i got my the internship said to myself, like as soon as i was done number one during the internship, i older than a lot of the staff because a lot of staff had come off the campaign and gotten jobs while the people that could afford to do campaign

were the right out of college people. and so once barack obama, a lot of them went to the white house. so when i was when i was an intern i was 31 and they were just like, can you help us with this? and i was like, how did you get this job? like, i'm like, what? you know how to do this? but they were so young, so i got a lot of adult that i feel like i kept raising my hand and being like reminder, i'm an intern. like, i don't know i don't know how to do these things. and then i got, you know, the chance to travel with the president and first lady to fort hood for the mass shooting. and i was just like, how am i on air force one as an intern? like, what is happening? and they're just like, you know, you're you're at home, you're community worker. this is what you do. and so, like, we need somebody to go in advance and very familiar go in advance to advance. the president, first lady going to fort hood and be with the families. and i was like. i can do that like that that's when i broke it down to be like it's the white house, but it's

the same basic thing that i do at home of comforting people being with people like making sure they're okay. they asked me to go do that on behalf of the and first lady and was just like, okay. and i flew home on, air force one. and i think that like when that happened, i just didn't i couldn't that that was happening to me. and then i got home and was like, i just did all of i just had this amazing experience i can no longer. and i mean the secretary was fine. there's nothing wrong that. but i can no longer sit at this desk. i was like, i feel like a new person that can do more things. i need to figure out what those things. i just want to back up a little. yeah. because during that advance was the first time you met the president. yes, that was a funny story talks embarrassing. oh y'all like c-span. are you still there? okay. so. so i met the president. so was in shock. i was at first i was very tired and i was like, i'm staying awake. this whole ride, i was like, i can't believe you. i'm trying like, you know, stuff in my purse. toothbrushes and stuff and like

and, and, and the food comes around and i'm like, you know, i'm on a budget, so i'm like, to have to pay. like, i'm like through the payment. it's like, i can't this food, you know? and so then i get my little food and and the president comes around and first of all, i'm just saying hi to people, you know, and he just like looks me like, kind of like think you're the person i really don't recognize. and i was like, hello. and he's and, you know, his aide was like, oh, mr. president, this is deja. you know, she's one of our interns. but and and he said very casually, very nice in his charming ways, like, oh, i didn't know interns were on air force one. and like very casually and i said i said, i said, what? you want me to jump out? you mean leave? and i was like, he looked at me. he was just like, well, that's good. he's a good to have you here. and like i through it. and i was just like and i was more i was so that i knew he probably did try to jump out i was so mortified that i said to the president united states my first encounter that i could

somehow leave that plane when it was in the air and thankfully he doesn't remember that god like you know but but yeah, that was our first that was our first encounter. i crazy i just wanted to she knows it looks like you wrap it before you on the more questions i just want to pause and remind viewers that especially on c-span that you're watching national press club headliner series with deesha dyer on our member and our memoir on diplomatic. so. now's the time we're going to start taking out some of your questions while while i'm going to dig into some more of you returning washington because you said you quit job and then you said, i'm going to do my thing and then you got the second call from the white house. yes. and i got a call, you know, an email, actually, from melissa marshall.

monica, who was director of scheduling in advance. and she said we have a position open at the white house and we'd love to talk to you about. and i just i was like i mean, i was freaking out because i was like, i don't have a college, you know, when you are an intern, it's acceptable to not have a college degree. you're an intern here. that's the time of learning. but as a full time staffer at the white house, i was like, how do tell her that? i would obviously love this position, but i'm still i'm still in community college and i to go part time because i can't afford to go full time and i got to be on a payment plan. and so i was like, what do i do? and so i wrote her back and said, you know, of course i'm interested. and we can talk. and i said, i'm going to tell her, you i'm on the phone. something that could just we can just get this band-aid done, like deja. you're great. thank you. but like, let us when you're finished college, you know? and so and so and so. i did a couple of drafts which are all the book of how i drafted this. i kept everything. i'm i'm a journalist heart and

so i kept everything and and i finally you know, we had a phone call. i told her, i said, melissa, thank you so much. she's like drop jaws. you want it? no problem is no interview process is you know everybody knows they have it's like you're just like you got the job so i got the job and and i said to her on the phone. i said, but i want you to know, i was like, i don't have a college degree. i'm still college. i was like community college and and that close to graduating, i have more time, more like time. go part time. so how was your heart beating at that point? i don't think it was. i think that that honestly, i think i probably died right there. and she said and a list of everybody knows a list. alissa, she's just so casual, so super chill. she now like jelly in woodstock is super cool. and she was like she was like, okay, do you do you so want to go to school? is that like you're trying to figure out how you can do both of them? and i said and i said to her, because it was so important for me going back to school time, i said i would really like to finish school, like i really want to be a social worker and that's my heart. and, you know, and she.

okay, well, we'll figure it out when you start kickstart start june 1st. and i was like yeah. yeah. and she said, well, i'm going to take your resume the wrong and make sure we're good with the chief of staff and was like, oh god, rahm's going to be like, no. and like literally 20 minutes later, she's okay. well, he's good so, you know, we're going to take your paperwork and i was like and i literally took the job without asking how much he got paid. i didn't tell the then boyfriend and told nobody. i was like, start packing like, okay, well, we're going to go like june 1st was like in three weeks. it was like, i didn't have time and and so i had to start on first because the interns were starting and my job was now managing the interns. and so that was my return to washington. i do want to say that i want to skip over the quitting the job because. the reason was that i could quit the job is because my my company that i worked for the real estate company without me knowing you know the internship was unpaid without me knowing the last week that i was leaving to go on leave for three months from my job, they raised $14,000 for me.

and so i did not know that $14,000 was coming in. so i stashed that away to to quit the job once i got home. and so and the reason i to just make this point is because i could have said to myself, i can't this internship, i'm not going to do it. and that is why it's so important for me to tell young people and anybody really that like don't think about the finances at first just apply for something. because i had no idea that $14,000 was i had no idea that $14 on that conversation that was chasing, you know, every cent every moment now it caught. how did how did you know? okay. so how did you navigate that space? yeah, i think i navigated that space by saying i did this amazing thing at this internship that i never thought i could do. and so i got addicted to like the high of what else i could do. i like, wait a minute, i did that. what else can i do? and i was like, i got the job what else can i do. and those survival skills came in because i'll figure it out if

i had to have a job at target at night if, i had to go work at the gym, front desk. there's zero shame about me and when it comes to that. and so i think that for me i was in survival mode. i allowed myself to just be like, yeah, i'm doubting myself, but like, you know, the white house doesn't doubt me. so i'm just going to take that and run. yeah. so get to the white house. you're doing your thing. i am. and start to get promoted pretty quickly. very quickly. that's and you're working in different areas and you jump in. i'm going to leap ahead for the sake of time you were weren't you start to you finally get gig to work in the area that you up being in that's in the social secretary's office and at that point. jeremy right yeah you go to dinner. yes. diplomat we do. d.c. is favorite place and my is

by the way. and and he drops it on you. that is leaving. yeah. oh. so we went to dinner for my birthday and i was like, this is a great time. tell him i quit because no place for me to go in the white house at this like i'm deputy social secretary point. jeremy's never leaving, and i didn't want the job. i was like, that seems a little too frou frou for me. and so i was like, i don't know about that job and i'm not really cut out for that. and before i could get my news out. jeremy says, well, i'm leaving, and i was like, what do we wait? we both can't leave. he's like, you're leaving? i was like, yes, i what? i was like, wait, you're leaving? he's like, well, i brought you to dinner not only for your birthday but also to say, like, you should try for a social secretary. and i was like, are you kidding? are you like, what's wrong with you? like, no. and he was like, i really think he should and i was like, jeremy, i know. and i was like, i don't think i can and i was like, i'm not equipped for that role.

like, i just it's just not my thing and it wasn't and it almost wasn't doubting as much as it was. like, it's just not my thing. like, there are things are yours and those things are not. and i was like, this seems to creme de la creme. i don't own any real i don't do pearls, all that stuff and i don't do fur, i don't do all that stuff that like the ladies walk around. and so i was like, i can't it like i can't fake it. and jeremy was like, i think you should really try. i was like, well, and i'm not right away. but in a couple of days i was like, well, if i don't really put my hat in the ring to try before i quit this job, i'm going to be mad that i didn't try. so then i did. and leaving ahead to your first major event, the pope, talk about what a great event for your event. the pope said it wasn't my first, but not your first. i'm sorry, my first major event. yeah, they. jeremy's like i'm leaving. and i was like, okay with the pope, his body. and i was like, okay, well, okay and so i was like, is this going to be like a little office meeting?

like one on one? that'd be great. they're like, no. so 12,000 people. i'm who people. and so i said, well, who's in charge of that like that? sounds like a lot like they're like, that's. and i was like, i'm not even catholic like i was like so i was just like, oh, man, so. and so, you know, secret service, white house communications protocol, everybody's looking at you to be like the plan. and i'm like, i just got here, like, what do you mean, the plan? and so thankfully, the social secretary crew from like, all, from all the years, we're all close. so call capricia marshall, who's the clinton social secretary. and i was like, capricia i need your help. i was like, do you have the playbook? she was like, i got you. and thankfully, like the resident staff, the white house, they're there all the time. don't just like me. i serve a president they serve all the presidents they had all this all the plans, the last pope visit. and i was like, thank secret service. it's like, we got you. so the team came together and we had a flawless flawless pope

visit the weather god gave us beautiful weather. thank you, god. you know, we had a black catholic choirs sing a black song called, total praise, which was my choice. we didn't have any streakers and we didn't knock. wood yeah, i mean, knock, knock, because pope visit before i had a streaker and i was just everybody was great. we had nobody pass out, you know it was it was this big you pass out. you weren't well that morning. i was not. i was pregnant and in so were swept the whole i you really lay it out there in the book that you were you were i was sick they were very sick. morning sickness on overdrive five and you had to pull off this 12,000 person event. yeah. was, um. i found out i was pregnant right before the pope visit. a couple of days before, and, and that was also the same time at new york times came out with an article that said this is her this rookie she's a rookie and this is her super.

because i had the pope visit followed by a state dinner two days later, followed by out to the united nations general assembly in new york and doing a whole reception with world leaders. and i found out i was pregnant and i was like, well okay, how am i going to do this? because i'm sick. i obviously can't tell anybody because when you have imposter syndrome and, when you do, you know, every little ding, every little. i kept thinking to myself, they're going to be like of course, this girl got pregnant. of course, like this community college, north philly, like that. of course, she would. and so i was like, i have to pull off because if i don't this off and if i get so sick that i that, you know, i'm down there going to be like, we knew couldn't do it. the new york times would be right. so i pushed through it. it was very, very hard, but i pushed through it. we had all three events were flawless, flawless, flawless. and then after i, you know, made my decision to obviously terminate the pregnancy and went back to work a couple of days later and i went back to work still sick, still bleeding.

so very not well. but that's also when you have when confidence is not in check you put everything put my job before my health, which i do anymore. but i used to do that. how was that white hot spotlight? because the social secretary's office is not something that's regularly in the headlines, but because and i say this respectfully, one of your predecessors as mr. rogers, was not did have a good time on her watch thanks to a gate crasher. so that was a major security incident. and she was the first african-american. and in the position you were the second. so you had extra attention that you didn't have coming, didn't want having your way. how did affect you? i think affected a lot. i think, number one, people figured out very quickly that me and desiree, we're just two or two different people. so i think that we people figured out like it's not all social secretaries are like, you know, and i think that it affected me in a sense of i knew that i did not have desiree amazing. she has this decorum she's. beautiful she has these connections. i had none of that. and so, i mean, i think i'm beautiful, but like i didn't

have the connections and everything else. and so i think that it affected me because i felt i had so much to prove. like i had to prove, to prove, prove, prove, prove. and so nothing was stopping me like, on my feet weren't stopping me, you know, a pregnancy wasn't stopping me. so i feel like i had to because this town already like, you know, washington's washington and, we could have a black president, but people don't like them. and so i already also was about the obama reputation of like this, you know, unmarried pregnant woman, social secretary who's messing up these events or whatever. so there was a lot of pressure and i felt like if the world knew that i had this during this time, it was going to be like, you know, didn't even even to terminate the pregnancy had to go far because i was like, i don't want people seeing i don't want people knowing you know? and i said it on this book, not for the fact that like a shock factor, but to say that like we should not put our child before our health. and that's what i did. i went back to work with a diaper because i was like, have to go back i have to go back. i have to like people are going to like if i take an extra day,

people are going to think that i'm qualified, you know, and it painful, painful. no one knew the first lady didn't know. it sounds like she's i don't to tell her i'm just going to keep smiling keep smiling while i'm in pain. and i told that story all because like a lot of us do that because we're of people saying that we're not qualified, we're inadequate, we can't handle the pressure. so push through all this sickness and this and this exhaustion and all it does is end up like, you know, like i have now high blood pressure and type two diabetes, you know what i mean? like it's, not it's not worth it. and so that's the why i tell that story. and the pressure was high, but a lot of pressure i was putting on myself. i never got it from the obamas they were, you know, like i got sick later. i had my high pressure and they forced me to take off for a week and that was torture. they were like not come back to work and. i was like, but i don't want you to think and president was like, it's december 2016. you've with us all this time. would we ever think that you're not that?

no you need to rest? and i was like, i was putting this pressure on myself that goes back, you know, there was a famous scene in in show scandal where her gave her gives her the have to be twice as good to be half as yeah go half as far as speech and it's a brilliant monologue did you have did you have that sense in you that had to be twice as good to be, you know, half justice, you know, halfway? i'll be honest with you, i didn't because with standard. whose standard is that? like twice good as who. and i think that was always my question. i'm at the top of the chain. i mean, i'm the social secretary. so if anything, people are trying to probably be as good as me. and so i never thought that honestly. and i people say that i'm like, i never thought that because i was always just like, i was always and also i was always happy in every job i had at the white house. my favorite job to this day and that was is was the advance i got to travel the world and stay in five class hotels. i'm like, this is the best job

in the world. so being the social secretary was never an essential. it was never, you have to do this. so you had i knew how to do my job very well. i never really thought because my in again. maybe this is part of i don't say it's part of my fault, but i was very much like i like what i do and i do it well and like my curiosity is going to get me somewhere. i am not going to kill myself to be twice as good as anybody. so it was never that. it was always the fight against myself. that's what it always was for me. it wasn't. i had to be good as desmarais or jeremy or capricia or juliana. it was never it was like, i need to be good to this to myself and also to make sure the obamas know they made the right choice. so the fight was always against myself. i'm not i'm pretty good. would not myself to other people so yeah you said the fight was against yourself. you think you think you think you finally won? oh, 100%. i got a great book. we're we're going to we're going to turn to the two to the

writing process in a moment. but you hit on something in this last sequence of question of of dialog about the notion of taking up space. you hear that a lot, especially about african-american wanting to make sure they're respected where they are, who how they're going, how they how they're achieving and making sure that there's that they're not just they're seen not just heard seen and having impact. can you take a moment to talk about that? and then we're going to talk about the writing? yeah, i'm going to say in respect, it's tough because in respect to who i am now, i do not care like if i'm somewhere where i'm not i'm not fighting you. i'm i'm got i'm 46. i don't got time to face you for you to respect me like i'm either going to leave or i'm going to keep doing whatever i'm going to do. and you can throw your microaggressions and stuff at me and we just going to have to fight it out.

i'm not i'm not you know, i think, you know, that's where i am now because i don't have the time i have again type two diabetes i have high blood like i don't got time to be convincing you to like or respect me. i'm going to do my job. i'm going to live my life and you're either going to be there or you're not. that gives me missed opportunities. if it gives me not have invited to a happy hour. good. i don't drink. no. how so? like it doesn't even matter. so i'm a that's how i am. now back. i wanted to make sure that that's how i got my confidence. you're going to respect me. you're going to treat me with decency. now i'm just like. you look sad. and why you're not treat me with i'm going to walk away because i ain't got tell you if you sit here and treat bad because i'm walking over there i feel great, you know what i mean? and i think that that's you know, and in the book i start off in a space where, i'm fighting people and fighting to respect me. and you're going to do this you're going to do that. and i evolved like, you know what? like, you know, i watch my on my

phone and i get in the fight over. i got to be in an environment. it goes like my sugar goes and i'm like, i want to a coma over you. oh, no no, no. let me just walk along a way. you know? i mean, like, it's not worth it to me. but i say that also with privilege, and i want to be very honest about that, that i now own my own business. i the privilege to be able to sometimes away from people or things and respect that a lot of black women don't have the privilege for that their feed and families are doing whatever. so i say that with an immense here with an immense amount of privilege that can say that also if my business belly up, i would go work for my friend, i would go somewhere else. i i'm not standing there no more trying to convince you. i'm listen, i'm not trying to take up space. i don't care. you have the space i'm going over here and i have my own. and you going to look at me from over here and be like, what? now you want to come over here? and i just it's an evolution. and i think that's what the book takes us through. but i want black women to be healthy. i want us to be healthy. and all this fighting and stuff

in the workplace and, dealing with these aggressions like, you know, we just saw dr. bailey, you know, the lived herself in lincoln universe. she, you know, at this respect, amazing black woman because she's been bullied like like, you know, it's life or death at this point for us. and so i don't i don't got the energy. i just got married. i'm trying to have a good time, like don't got it. i don't that it honestly but yeah yeah that's talk about that that sense of happiness you have all these ups and downs little and you found why did peace love lovely and you you launched a business life after the white house you threw some fabulous events legendary parties and you've and you found love. i did talk about that for a moment oh he's a great well i swiped right i mean i know i did i did really? yeah. yes, i did a lot of therapy. i a lot that i had to do for myself. i think that all the things that happened to my child hood, i

brought those to a relationship i think i wanted somebody to be substitute for my parents. i wanted somebody to love me. i wanted somebody to be the front row for my, you know. my parents were not there for front row. my competitions or anything. and i wanted a cheerleader. i was like, i don't want to put that on somebody. let me take some time to heal myself a little bit. and when i did, i said, you know, i can pick, i could start dating now. and and i saw this person that was on a boat and his profile so i thought he was rich and he said he was from he's from connecticut. piped in, found that he said, i'm from connecticut and he's on a boat. and i'm like, finally lord, thank you, rich. and and it turns out it was his friend's and he works a non profit. so i was like, i but yeah so i got duped. and anyway. and he also says he got duke because of my profile picture. i had a fake laugh and he was like, that wasn't even your real laugh. i'm like, whatever. and so and so. yeah, we were on a couple dates and we had a great time and and and now we're married.

but it was, was very much like, you go home. i go home like before it was like, can i move in. can we be best friends? can want to join back accounts like i love you i love you and it was like on a date all, right? well, i have a home, i pay rent and so do you. so see you tomorrow was very much like a mature weird relationship that i didn't even recognize myself. and then cobe, it happened and i was like, well i don't wanna be by myself. you'll be by yourself. so let me just move in for like a week. and then we got married. it's like, how about you haven't one because i'm going to, i'm combining some of these questions. a lot of people want to know about the writing process. you have this this very vulnerable, candid. mm hmm. interesting story, compelling story. how did you get it all on paper? i mean, what a lot of people have their stories, but not everybody has, frankly, the guts to put it out there, like. yeah. and put on paper. talk about your writing process. what else? i've kept a diary since i was young. i have all my diaries since i

was probably 11 years old. every single one of them, it's a stack of them. i kept them at the white house. that's why the chapter being pregnant is so vivid, because after i got my morning sickness like three in the morning. i wrote in my journal. like. like god, like if there's one time that you keep me in place, it's for the pope. like, you don't. i mean, like, come on with me here. and so all of that was very so i kept all the journals, and i think i decided what i decided to write about, you know, in memoirs only a certain part of your life, not your whole life. so obviously, the white house one is people are most interested in. but i think that, you know, i decided to put in my truth and had to, like, not worry about what people think. i had to not worry about. i'm okay walking in my truth. i'm okay with that i tell it all the time. i say it when i speak like there's no i have no shame in anything i've written. like i feel bad i not there's no regrets and i do that because that is the person people recognize. if you are were to say if you didn't have a book and you said to the white house social secretary and you googled me and you saw a picture in vogue or

glamor or whatever else i've been in, you would be like, oh, she's so like she no, she's okay. she, i don't got nothing to do, you know. but now you know that i'm the same girl that got evicted and had stuff on them. you know, and had an unwanted pregnancy and all these things and, and or had imposter syndrome and had these confidence issues. now we have a connection where you're just like, i feel that to. so now we have a human connection that i can then have a conversation with you and build a relationship. and so for me, i wanted to make sure that i appeared and people knew that i didn't start as this person that was in vogue. that's not even even i mean, that was a whole thing that was not of all, but that was a whole thing. and it was fun and it was great. but at the core of, who i am, i'm still from philly and there's more people that are from philly than tisha in vogue. and i wanted to make sure that people were relatable to me. i can't even, you know, my friend heidi will tell you i can't even hold my tongue if you ask me to like i just because to me, i'm just like, this is who i am.

like, yes, i'm scared. i'm very scared. and night before this came out, i'm i'm just bomb and west is like deja like we stop it at this point like you to like calm it down and even obama said like i said to her i'm very ma'am, i'm very nervous. and she said even i was nervous. like you're going to be nervous telling your truth. and i to be okay with the reactions. but now in a space where the reactions of somebody saying she shouldn't share that or whatever else, whatever else, like, i'm okay accepting that and just saying, okay, well that's okay. you think that like going dr. seuss, whatever, like, you know, to me, like, whatever. but i'm okay with did that former first lady obama mrs. obama's book becoming inspire you to do to write this one. it did not i started writing even before i started writing at the white house. i started writing this book, but i didn't know was a book. like, i just it was a diary that a diary. yeah. but i will say i wanted to make sure it very important to me that mrs. obama and the president both had their books out first because i didn't want to tell stories that that's

their stories. and so it was very important for me to tell the stories, my viewpoint and who i am. i was very clear that i'm like, i'm not telling their stories. there's nothing personal in there. there's nothing about malia and sasha. that's not my story. so i had i was i want to make sure i was respectful, like let them tell their story like they are, have the right and have earned to tell their stories. first, i'll come after that. and so, yeah, it's biggie, which is an interesting story about, your interview with the first lady in there, but i'll that for you all the by the book there's a question here about political aspirations it is white house correspondents week and there's a lot of politics happening. do you have any political aspirations? i mean, no, no, no house. no senate, no, none of that. no, i can't i'm not a i'm not a partizan. i'm not arguing with you about my human rights. i'm not i'm not doing all that. i'm not trying to convince you that my life matters.

i'm not so who comes at me with and i'm just admit that people have strengths. i admit that i'm not a person who sit there and argue over a bill about animal rights and human rights. no, i'm just not i don't think i'd be a good politician i'm not i'm not arguing with over that. like we could argue about the particulars but if we have to even come to the point that the first thing we have to do is agree that i'm human or agree that it's not okay to treat somebody or something a certain way, then we have nothing to talk about. so i would not be a good politician. just be honest. i'm just being honest. what is today? we should tell milton hershey show. you know, you tell her that it's going to be all right. you tell her that she's going to grow up to work for the first black president. the first first lady. she's going to write a dynamic book that's going to have words that going to touch people. you tell her that she's going to be loved one day and somebody is good. people are going to sit and watch her and cheer her on. and that's what you tell her. and you know, she won't listen

because she's stubborn, but you tell her anyway, before i ask you, the last question, we have a tradition here. oh. see this lovely little mug? yes there are pictures that you probably saw coming into the room of every newsmaker, every that has come to the press club, be they presidents, astronauts, prime ministers, ballerina dancers, you name it. they're all in the wall. you're going that wall. and they all got this mug. so i want to present this to. thank you so much. thank you. thank thank you. so i thought i was about to drink something was like, what kind of ritual you don't know? so thank you for asking us this. a few. a few calendar announcements. and i realize my friends from c-span, this some of this will be dated in a few weeks.

april 30th. club members invited to participate in membership mixer at pm here you are also on that same there will be a southeast buffet at the reliable source members restaurant and on may 1st our national press journalism institute will hold a practical look at current disinformation tactics and journalists can do to counter them. and this will be followed that same day will be welcoming pulitzer prize winning finalist and wall street journal dana vitale to discuss book the everything we're about amazon and how it made corporate power and on world press freedom day. and may 3rd we will be welcoming the mother of austin tice who in prison in syria and paul beckett, washington bureau chief of the wall street journal, who employs evan garcia -- in moscow. and they will be joining president emily wilkins.

talk about their cases, the state of press freedom and can look at these and other events on our website. this press dot org. so for final question then and i mentioned and i mentioned that is white house correspondents with you and you use and you've you've been a part this event you've done some fabulous events you've had your got your party on but i'm going to pivot a little bit you in the book and your social media people know that you love to dance. i do love to have a great time i do. you've dealt with a lot of high profile musical artists in your career is there one artist that you haven't had a chance to meet that you would like to have dinner with and a dance party with afterwards? oh, you should ask me this before that i haven't met that you have not met.

oh, i got one. they had to be a dancer and they don't have to as it is. and any artist that you have not met you would love to have dinner with and then just go out dancing. i'm going to to janet jackson. mm hmm. in shadow. those are my. i love your ep. that was, like, a better for those that doesn't feel the letter to i would say and i tried to get them both to that the white house for my own selfish reasons that it just didn't work out. but yeah, i would say those would be the two. i would probably just stare at them. nothing like know what to do. but that's what i would say. yeah, yeah. both of them. oh, wow well, thank you, deesha dyer. thank you thank you, everyone. and thank you for. we want to revisit. thanks and thank you. as we traditionally do, we thank our headliners team, our co-chaired by past president donna lyman leisure past

president john judson and, lori russo. we want to thank our board of governors. we want to thank our staff liaisons. scott martin, our our staff executive director didier sawyer and all of the people staff and volunteers here at the national press club that helped bring this to bring this place to life. every single day. and has and they have 417 years. and it's been my privilege to return to the modest, moderator's on president wilkens behalf and giving this talk with you disher with that. thank you. we are adjourned. thank you, everyone. thank