on thursday, the president of northwestern university, rutgers, and ucla testified on pro-palestinian protests and allegations of anti-semitism on their campuses. this comes as israel hamas war continues in gaza. watch the house education and the workforce committee live at 10:15 a.m. eastern. online at c-span's campaign coverage continues live as they choose their party's nominee for president and vice president, beginning friday at 3:30 p.m. eastern. highlights include independent presidential candidate robert f kennedy junior followed by a vice president debate at 8:00 p.m. eastern and then on saturday at 8:00 p.m.

eastern, former president donald trump will speak before the delegates. on sunday, at 9:00 a.m. eastern the party announces its presidential nominee for the november election. the libertarian national convention, live friday at 3:30 p.m. eastern on c-span. and online at c-span.org . our first guest of the morning served as a former secretary of labor and the biden administration, he served the executive director for the national hockey league's player association walsh joining us to talk about other topics this morning. secretary walsh, thank you for giving us your time. >> thank you for having me, my first time. >> the reason we brought you and was to talk about the idea of substance abuse. could you start by telling us your own story? >> the producer in the back to said to me, your career is interesting. ahead of the hockey union, the secretary state representative, all of that was possible. none of that probably would have happened, i may have thought it would have, but my journey of alcoholism when you

are out there acting, it is the good the bad and ugly. when you stop drinking, it turns into not so much fun and then by the end of it it is pretty ugly. i realized that i was fortunate enough to get into treatment and get into treatment for alcoholism went through detox and got sober. when i went through detox i thought my life was basically over. 28 years old, what am i going to do now, my whole life at the bottom, my social life, you didn't realize that when you are in treatment that your life is just beginning. when you get out you are fortunate enough to continue on the road to recovery. i have been blessed. >> when did you know that you had a problem? >> probably at a younger age knowing that i would go out and stay out all night long, blackouts, things like that happening. but you don't want to acknowledge it. you know inside you have an issue.

i worked for the leverage union at one point and pretty much in the office you kind of look at it you kind of look at it, it is a progression, it is a disease of progression. it progresses the challenges and the problems bigger and bigger every time. >> he said he went to treatment, what brought that on, what type of treatment did you undergo? >> i went to alcohol treatment. it is a rehab down the cape. what brought it on was just the series of just that nice, bad days. there, i did not want to g. impacting people around you. i was doing all that. one time, i didn't want to go.

i went because i thought i was going to lose my job. whatever it might be. you know. you go into groups. years before that, i circled one night and i went to the meeting and i got there at five past 7:00. i left at 8:50 or whatever time. i found out later i got late -- there late. i sat in the back. i was listening to the speakers and i thought, wow. their lives are incredible. i left at the break and i

didn't hear the message that night. when i went to treatment my first night there, a group came in. i don't remember with the first speakers said, but the first speaker needed help because he had talked about it. talk about your experience of being an alcoholic. the strength of getting into recovery in the hope it brings. we spoke that night. something happened. i had a different feeling in detox that night. i went to participate in groups i could kill somebody. kill myself. whatever it might be under the influence of alcohol. i learned about the disease, that it's a disease. i learned about a whole bunch of things. even though alcoholics

anonymous is a special program, it is not a god program. i'm a catholic, but it connected me to my higher power. to a relationship with god for me. it's not a spiritual program. i don't want people to be afraid. spiritual -- it's a cult. it's not a cult. a year later, i was running for office. i served 16 years in the house of representatives. i worked on those programs, the funding programs, learning about it, understanding, you know, all of the different challenges. harrowing, i called it. i said it was an epidemic in 97. oxycontin had been running through. heroin had been running through pretty trucks had been running through. i got active in the community, both personally, as an individual, but also, supporting recovery programs

around the greater boston area, but also founding programs. i got active in that. >> our guest until 9:30, and if you want to ask him questions about his experience and the topic of substance recovery, call 202 478 2000 or 202478 6000 . call 202748 8002. text us at 202-748-8003. when he ran for office, or you worried that the pass would come up with you and there would be a stigma attached? >> i didn't think about it. someone said to me at one point -- it is unfortunate about the word on the street. what is it? >> your junk driving arrest. i said, i've never been arrested for drunk driving. it becomes rumors, but when i

went for rep, it wasn't an issue at all. it is a local kind of race in boston when you are running for it. it is parish to parish come street to street. when i ran for mayor of boston, it was different. it is a broader race. it can get nasty. there was a story written about me -- a positive story. i don't know if i wanted it done or not, but a reporter called me up, saying, i want to do a story on your recovery. i was torn on whether to do the story. there is the privacy piece of it and all of that. but she ran the story and it never came out. in the race, no one brought it up. they knew i was in recovery at that point. no one ever brought it up. it never became an issue. i think about my brother who was in the obama administration, when he was going for his job -- running

the office. they went after him in congress. that wouldn't happen today, i don't think. i think people understand it is in every home across america. it's in a lot of homes across america and the world. people look at addiction and substance abuse and alcoholism to a whole different light now. >> when president biden was considering u.s. labor secretary, did this topic come up? >> it didn't come up at all. i was open to people. if someone is going to criticize me or somebody for working on being an alcoholic, shame on them. there's enough stigma around here with mental health and stuff that we don't need more stigma. and the president never brought it up to me. no one in congress brought it up to me. and if they did, i would say, i'm sure your family doesn't have any type of addiction in your family. >> we are talking with marty walsh here. we have calls lined up for you.

we have david in georgia. you are on with secretary walsh. go ahead. >> i have been sober ever since 1994. i wasn't able to go through rehab. i couldn't afford it. i had to white knuckle it, going through aa, and it was a long, hard road to go through. and i pushed family away. i lost friends. it was just a long, hard road. >> david, you certainly know the promises of alcoholics anonymous and recovery now. you have been sober for a long

time. thank you for telling your story. i know a lot of people have to take the path you took. they don't have the ability to get into rehab. they don't have the money to pay for rehab, but they were able to get their lives back together but keep at it, brother. one day at a time. >> from jerry, jerry in new jersey, you are next up. good morning. >> yeah. good morning. listen. i have a question for you. i don't want to get into too much, but you know, with the rehab and all, my concern is, i think people are coming out with almost the same problems they are going in with. and the reality of facing reality, really, is very difficult. how do you get that kind of help? like where do you draw the line with drug addiction and then

the reality of life, and how do you help these people deal with that? >> you know, thank you for the question, jerry. part of it is when you get out of detox or rehab, you need to get connected to something. you can't just simply, and all of a sudden you're cured. it's not like you have a broken arm anybody cast on and six weeks later, the cast comes off and you are not in rehab and eventually you have to go back to the doctor. it is a daily struggle. it is work you work on daily. every day. if you have a loved one watching today and you have a loved one in rehab, you want to make sure that they are connected to a program, alcoholics anonymous, narcotics anonymous, that they are going to meetings and talking to other people in recovery because going into detox is kind of the first step of admitting you are powerless over alcohol and drugs and the second piece of that is working on your life. as the previous caller stated come he lost friends and family and everyone. you have to rebuild those relationships. you don't do that by simply going into detox. there is a process. and i tell people watching, do your research on these rehabs. when you are looking at where to send a loved one, make sure you do your research on the rehabs to make sure that they have a proven record. if you're going to send somebody out of state, make

sure you check with, you know, consumer licensing bureau or somebody in different places to make sure that you feel positive. there are a lot of places out there that do unfortunately take advantage of people. same thing with sober homes, making sure they are licensed and properly equipped to handle loved ones or if you struggle yourself, to handle what you need. >> the substance abuse and mental health services administration tells us that 24.9% of people aged 12 or older used illicit drugs in the past year. and there are other statistics there. when you see those statistics, talk about the role the federal government has in helping with substance abuse. what is the high-level for federal? >> when we think about substance abuse and recovery programs, there are two sides for this. number one, we can't forget what purdue pharma and oxycontin did to america. we can't forget that. they put such a strong foundation for addiction down there that from that point until today, it has compounded,

where you have kids having kids -- people having children who have substance abuse issues and never got clean. their families never got the support they needed. now, it is generational. so i think we have to deal with the past, as well. we have to figure out, how do we create program that can get people on the path to recovery? when i was the secretary of labor at the department of labor, we had the mental health party built. insurance companies will put a cap on how long you can go to detox for a lifetime cap. sometimes you need to go three, four, five times before you get sober. we are looking at that and doing some work on the bread i think the insurance companies have to loosen their rents here a little bit because you are saving lives. we have to make sure we are investing in recovery programs.

we also have to really think the way we do prevention. how do we educate young people? i think the earlier the better. i know some people get concerned if we are talking about drugs and alcohol at a young age, people get concern for a lot of different reasons. some reasons are because they don't want people to think about what is happening about what is happening in their home but it is important for us to lay the foundation at a young age, what drugs does for people. alcohol and drugs -- i think alcohol is still the number one killer in taking people's lives, but drugs -- they alter the brain. they alter the body. they alter the family. so i think the federal government can do a lot more with investing in it. and i think states need to be more consistent, as well. i think we got to make sure we look at a whole bunch of different programs -- how do we move forward? in a positive way. let me give you an example. when i was mayor of boston, we were talking about safe consumption sites -- they are in canada. you know, i was against them when i was the mayor because i just felt that it was -- in my own brain i thought it was kind of promoting drug use. for some crazy reason.

i was at a meeting when i did i heard someone talking about a path into recovery. any path to recovery is a good path to recovery. i went to toronto, montreal, and i visited some of these consumption sites and there were people there using drugs. it wasn't on the street. it wasn't in back alleys. it was in the facility. it was the health center. and when you walk in, you know, you do the drugs, but you also have recovery all around you. i was talking to a guy getting ready to do his trucks and i said to him, did you ever think about going to recovery? he said, i haven't. i said, how come? he said, i haven't thought about it. i haven't thought about it yet. i just haven't gone to it yet. i said what happens if you want to? well, they will help me here.

so you think about -- that is a very controversial issue, but it keeps people alive long enough for them hopefully to get the program. >> do you sense a bipartisan effort? >> for the most part, it is bipartisan. no, certainly in massachusetts, i work with the republicans and democrats together. you know, the former governor of massachusetts, charlie baker, was active in this space. he is republican. in congress, you don't hear a lot of back-and-forth about, you know, progressive and conservative and middle. you don't hear that. i just wish there was more focus and intention on it. i think there is a lot of bipartisan support there. you know, i think every family has some type of -- you are not far removed from knowing somebody that needs help. i would love to see more attention on it. we have a lot going on in the world right now. it is not going to raise to that level, but i would've to see more effort put into recovery, instead of locking down our borders and stopping drugs from coming into the

country, that's impotent, that is the political talking point. drugs coming in from mexico. there are. no question about it, but there's drugs in the united states on the streets. if they can get the trucks from mexico, they would go to another truck and we have to do something about that. >> marty walsh, joining us for this conversation. this is emma from washington, d.c. good morning. >> hey, sir. thank you so much for sharing your experience. it is really inspiring and cool that you are talking about this publicly. i'm also in recovery. i'm in a 12 step program. it's a program called codependents anonymous for people who have relationship issues because i had a lot of mental illness and abuse in my family, and the program has helped me so much, you know. and it has been great, and i was wondering -- do you recommend being open about this kind of thing with employers or potential employers? that is something that i feel nervous about sometimes. >> i don't think you have to be

open with your employer about it, but i think that, you know, talking to people that support you, letting them know dish one thing i found -- obviously, my recovery is pretty public. and in some way -- in every way, it is good because sometimes people will randomly come up to me and talk to me about their issue or they will talk to me about something that -- they will talk about recovery programs and i think that is a good thing. i think with your employer, it depends on the employer. unfortunately, not every employer in america or the world is open and understanding as other people should be, but i think that for you, personally, if it is something you have a burning desire insight and you need to talk to your employer about it, i think you should. but take it one day at a time. >> are they protected under privacy laws? >> i think sometimes, employers will look at somebody who has a substance use and maybe say, okay. what is going on there. what they don't understand is when you have somebody who is going through a 12 step program for whatever it might be, that usually become the best

employee because they have taken all the energy they used for their dependency or whatever it might be or for this conversation, for drugs and alcohol, and they turn it around and now they become workaholics and they focus their attention, whether it is working out or working in the workplace -- there are a lot of positives there. i would like to say employers don't hold it against people, but in some cases, they do. >> joanne is in texas. joanne, your next up. >> good morning, pedro and mr. walsh. i want to say thank you and congratulations on your sobriety. i want to commend you on your bravery. thank you so much for bringing this topic to the forefront. my comment is that i really do believe that america needs to do better when it comes to providing rehabilitation for addicts. my husband and i were empty-nesters for a long time and then, you know, we had to

start all over again, and start raising my granddaughter because , you know, my son had some issues, and of course, we are happy to be there and support him, but i really do think this is more common, where grandparents are having to raise their grandchildren because there's addiction in the family. so thank you so much for bringing this to the forefront, and again, god bless you, and i just want to say to anybody who is facing addiction -- if it is either alcohol or drugs, just stay strong, and just keep fighting. keep fighting for your life. so thank you for taking my call. >> can i ask you a question, colloquy >> absolutely. >> are there support systems for you who has to deal with these issues even though you're dealing with another family member? >> there are.

actually one support group that i'm a part of his grandparents raising grandchildren. here in texas. it is not a very big support group but it it is there for us to talk about and to get resources because, unfortunately, the system is broken for these children for foster families. so, you know, just using that support system is very important for my husband and i at this time. >> joanne, thank you for sharing. >> yeah. joanne said a lot there. i think that some supports is al-anon and alateen. we should fund these programs with an appropriate funding rate. when you think about hospitals or doctors and nurses -- some nurses are underpaid.

some are paid good, but they could always be paid more. these programs -- these people are paid physically minimum wage. you are asking them to help a loved one get through a very difficult period of their life. you are paying them minimum wage, and depending on the state, minimum wage can be pretty low. these are professionals. we need to make sure we pay these folks higher so we can retain the talent there and recruit other talent there. i think a lot of people might want to go to college to become a psychologist and work in the field of mental health or substance use. they are excited to go to college. they pay $40,000 a year, whatever it might be. they get out and all of a sudden, you go to a treatment facility and they want to work there. and they are paid a little over minimum wage. we are not able to do it. if we are going to fund the program, let's fund them as if

it's a program where we are trying to help people. the numbers have gone up. i finished reading a book about someone who passed away in the 90s. in that book, they were talking about 20% of all people tried some substance. it is up to 30%. that number is probably higher. so we are thinking about, with more people trying it, that means the numbers of addiction and substance abuse is going to go higher. we need to combat that. it is a problem in her country. we have an epidemic right now. there are 1 million people that died of overdose in america. those are the ones that we know. a lot of times, people don't want their loved ones registered as an overdose. there are many people. if you take the substance out of their body, that's 1 million strong workers in america that we lost last year and we probably lost the year before. and the pandemic made it a bigger issue, but it was an issue before this. >> what about fentanyl?

>> every new drug brought into the mix is a game changer. obviously, whether it is boxy, heroin, crystal meth, fentanyl, it continues to change the game and make it dangerous for people. >> is there any avenue under the affordable care act that helps people? >> there is coverage under the affordable care act. it goes back to insurance companies not dodging this issue but dealing with this issue. if i'm an insurance company, i'm going to look at the bottom line and say, i'm sending people to rehab for whatever three or four or five times. if you look at the success -- if you took the success of people that went to rehab that never relapsed and you look at their medical records, they are not showing up. they have issues inside their bodies. they don't have liver issues. so you are fixing the individual not just mentally with the addiction, but you're also helping them physically with the way they live.

they're not going to the hospital every weekend. >> let's hear from dave. dave joins us from wisconsin. >> hi, good morning, marty. congratulations on your recovery. i've been sober for 13 years, a little over. and i'm also in recovery. i'm part of a 12 step program. when i first started, i had the impression that if i stopped drinking, you know, that would solve all my problems. and come to find out that, you know, alcohol is just a symptom of a disease. and, you know, as i have gone through, i learned a lot about dealing with life and taking life as it comes and not thinking that just because i'm not drinking everything is going to be fine, because it isn't. and anyway, that's about all i

have to say, but congratulations and it is one day at a time. and if you can get through each day, the next day comes and there you are. thanks for listening. >> thank you. you're absolutely right. it is a constant daily reminder of working on this, and your life does get better, but for me, going and staying active in the program helps me live my life one day at a time and deal with other things. an example of that is when the pandemic happened. you know, we didn't know when the end was. we didn't know what the end was. i was mayor of boston. i was thinking to myself, i can only do a day at a time. i can't worry about tomorrow. this is life. it is people can get this mindset, can't do anything about tomorrow. today is all we have.

worry about tomorrow tomorrow. when the day comes, it is just one day at a time. that is how i have lived my life in a lot of different ways now. i've taken the tools of recovery that it has taught me. the programs that were laid out, and i live my life that way, not just by staying away from drink every day, but all of that. >> is it a struggle every day? >> you know, i've been blessed that i have -- it is just another day. you know what i mean? back when i started recovery, i was like, oh my god, how will i do this the rest of my life? then you realize it is one day at a time. when you get an understanding of it being one day at a time, you don't think about how hard it was or how easy it was. >> if i may ask, also, how did your family react when he started recovering? >> the reaction was positive. we have a lot of recovery in her family. i have lots of cousins and have our family is in recovery. the other half might be in recovery or needs to be in recovery. you know, i think it is a relief for the family in so

many different ways. it is hard when you have someone in your family that you love that constantly cannot see that yet. that can't see that people love him or her. you know, it is sad to watch. and we just pray that the loved ones find their way into recovery at some point. >> let's hear from john. john is in michigan. john, thank you for calling. go ahead. >> good morning. i wanted to introduce something different that oftentimes is overlooked. relating to this idea that there's always something wrong with us, and we need to go to a formal program to fix us. i discovered a book -- i stopped drinking six years ago. i never could really get into the idea that there is something materially wrong, but i knew that there was, but i found a book that was called the easy way to stop drinking by

alan carr, and it would give someone a lot of avenues to explore to stop drinking in a funny way. he starts the book by saying, don't stop drinking until you finish this book. that was a hook for me. i thought i should introduce another consideration. i don't feel there is something wrong with me. i play hockey on fridays and about talking with the guys after everybody is drinking a lot of beer. it doesn't phase me anymore. i have completely eliminated this bad thing from my life. i guess, just share with me your thoughts about how others could consider that kind of thinking. >> first of all, thank you for sharing that. there's a lot of different pathways into recovery. some people go to detox.

some people talk about going to aa. some people talk to somebody in recovery. some people might read a book. i think that it's important -- what are the pathways to recovery -- i think about safe use sites. everyone is a little different. some people don't love going to aa. i particularly liked going to aa. it grabs me and i loved that. i would say just give it a chance because you are surrounded by people in that room that have gone through whatever you are going through at that particular moment. i think that that is important. i think that, you know, when you stop drinking, you play hockey, and you hang out with the guys afterwards.

there are nights when you just take off and they might stay there drinking. we don't put ourselves in harm's way. if you're drinking right now, that doesn't bother me. that doesn't bother me. >> it is coffee. >> but if i'm out and i'm just like all set, i'll just leave. it's that simple. you just don't put yourself in situations like that. >> patrick. patrick is in new hampshire on our line for those expressed with addiction. patrick, thank you for calling. >> hi. i'm 35. i live in new hampshire. i started on purdue pharmaceuticals. the oxycontin there. that was when i was 20. i've been eight years sober from that now. then i started drinking because that was something that was legal at the time, and i was on probation, so i started drinking. my whole family were alcoholics and i have been three and half years sober now from alcohol. and i just wanted to say a couple of things. like the lady who called who said she should talk about it

with the employer -- some people should take caution because it is something that i'm open with. i'm open about my addiction and i have no problem sharing it, and she probably doesn't have a problem sharing it. she seemed like she wanted to share the story it's good for her to talk about it, but a lot of people will talk behind your back and use it negatively, as well. be careful with that. the last thing i wanted to say was, well, i wanted to say, go through and hopefully they will start -- tonight. i have no insurance right now and it cost me $150 to see my doctor, and $212 to pay for the prescription, and so, i know there's a lot of people out there struggling with no insurance, too.

i just wanted to say that you're doing a great job. i'm a republican, but you give me lots of hope, and you are someone i can definitely support in the future. i like the way you talk about your addiction and how you overcame it. thank you, marty. appreciate you. >> i'm not a hero. the people that came before me are the heroes. >> he talked about suboxone and there's an argument about methadone to treat things. >> listen. again. i have come full circle on that when i first got sober and first got elected to the house of representatives. i thought abstinence was the best way. just stop everything. rough it out. if suboxone -- it is used the way it is prescribed, if methadone is used the way it's prescribed and you can work through it in you don't pick up heroin, then it works. and i'm completely full circle on that, as well. you know, i think that people will find the methadone clinic

and take the picture of the person nodding out. meanwhile, they don't take the picture of the 300 other people that weren't in that got the prescription, took it, went to work at law firms, lawyers, doctors, whatever it might be, and offices. no one is showing that picture. they only show the picture of the person that is nodding out. i think those medicines can be used in a good way. i would like to see a recovery program with that. the one thing i get concerned about with some of this is that they are supposed to be a clinical counselor with this stuff. there are so many prescriptions. sometimes, there's not enough clinical psychologists to work with the person taking these medicines. god bless you. >> what you think about the legalization of marijuana? >> i didn't love it. when i was mayor of boston, i fought it. i think it is a slippery slope. when i was state rep, i had the same people that legalized marijuana come into my office.

they wanted to decriminalize marijuana. i asked them to tell me -- show me in people that are in prison for an ounce or less of marijuana. give me one person. that past. and then it was medical marijuana. we are only going with medical marijuana for these really bad cancer patients that need treatments, even though it was already on the books. and now you have marijuana -- and i'm worried. now, you have some places in the country trying to legalize it. i get concerned about that. i get concerned about where we are headed. >> let's hear from amy. amy joins us from new york, clifton park. hello. hello. >> hi. good moaning. it is nice to be able to speak with you. i wanted to share my experience a little bit because i'm actually a therapist, and i worked in substance abuse counseling for around five years, shortly after i got my masters degree, and what i

really saw as being a huge barrier to care for people was health insurance. i mean, i'm a big believer in single-payer healthcare. i believe the u.s. desperately needs that because i saw a lot of people who really did want to get sober and they wanted to do better. and they wanted to do better for themselves. they were having a hard time because they had plans with unaffordable co-pays, or things didn't come in as often as they needed because they couldn't afford the co-pay. for some people, they had a very hard time navigating the insurance system. they weren't sure what to sign up for, whether or not coverage was available. a lot of times, it varied about what they could apply for, and what they could qualify for. and it really was very difficult for people. it is honestly frustrating for me to see, as well, because there wasn't much i could do about it. i worked for insurance companies. but, yeah.

that was the main thing i wanted to say. the other thing that i think would be helpful would be more focus on production, like state facilities. one thing i learned early on is you can't force anyone to be sober. i mean, you can accept consequences for them if they are not sober, but it is up to them, whether or not those consequences matter to them. >> amy in new york, thank you. >> amy said a lot on the insurance side of it. i'm not sure single-payer fixes the problem. i think it's the bigger issue of mandating companies for treatment. i also think -- there are drug courts if done properly. you know, we have a lot of people go to prison because they are alcoholics or addicts. when in fact, they might have a drug problem or alcohol problem. i'm not talking serious crime

but other crime. they create that smaller crime before they create the bigger crime. we need beds. if you have all these programs out there -- if you get a young person -- you are going to go to jail for a year or the treatment. if they go and have a bad experience, they are not getting what they really need. >> this is james. james in florida. you are on with marty walsh. good morning. >> good morning. i have one little thing to bring up. i called the wrong line. i couldn't get the numbers. i have a problem with people saying drugs and alcohol. alcohol is a drug. as far as i'm concerned, you may as well be saying drugs and heroin. i think it just puts a disconnect there for people thinking, i'm not doing drugs. i'm just drinking or something.

it grabbed them. >> when i say drugs and alcohol, you think about recovery programs. at least for the drugs. drugs and alcohol. i hear what you are saying. i think alcohol is a drug. alcohol, as i mentioned earlier, i don't have the number in front of me, but alcohol is higher than actual opioid deaths at this point. >> where are you with the idea of drug manufacturers or alcohol manufacturers, however becomes addicted to these things, only paying up as far as therapy goes? >> we should be part of it. we mentioned this company once already. purdue pharma. i had them in the office before the settlement. it in rage to me and lots of people, what they got away with, knowing what they were doing, and some of this, when you think about advertising for alcohol or marijuana now, when you put an advertisement on a train, and cigarettes, you are

targeting young people. you already have the 25 or older. you don't have to put a fancy thing up there for an ad for alcohol for a 25 year old. but you're targeting young people. we have to be sensitive to all that. i think in some of these cases, these companies who are responsible for the devastation they are causing, should be paying to fix that devastation. >> we will take one more call. this will be cliff in texas. >> hello. hi, mr. mayor. i think we have a common friend, dan ray. >> oh yeah. okay. wbz radio. >> yes sir. i met him through baseball. dan is a good friend. and yes. i have been a mental health advocate for 25 years, and i have led a life of addiction, basically. i won the davis cup twice.

i won the world point championship in tennis. my drug of choice was winning tennis matches, and when i started to decline, i took up alcohol and became basically an alcoholic. i quit that cold turkey. i guess what i'm saying, and i'm asking is, do you think the sides drugs that a life like i had is high and low? i haven't tied eight tennis match it. i won or i lost. do you think that can change your brain chemistry and make you more predisposed to seeking some other kind of relief -- release? and the other thing -- i quit cold turkey, and then i came down with covid four years ago and you probably know it doesn't allow you to sleep.

it gives you insomnia. and i had been on ambien for 25 years and had never abused it, but i started abusing it, and i had to own it. i was in bed 18 hours per day. until one year ago, but i had developed an ambien addiction, and i had to own it. i looked at my sister, and i said, i am an addict. and so i guess what i'm saying is that, with mental health, you can't help people that have mental illness, unless they are willing to own it, and they're willing to seek good help. does your brain reset back to normal if you get into good recovery? >> thank you, cliff. >> i don't know if it resets terminal, but it certainly gets to normal. i don't know if you're ever fully normal. it helps you think about moving forward, but you brought up an interesting point when you talked about being an athlete, whether you are military or athlete, your life is structured up until a certain

point, when your career is over. whether it is the military or you are an athlete or whatever profession you're in, sometimes, there is empty space there, and you're too busy or too regimented, or too.-- disciplined. it can turn into that alcoholism. it might have always been there, but it comes right out. >> let's take one more call if we can. jean in virginia. hello. >> hi. thank you for taking my call. i just want to say that it takes great people like your guest today to talk about this issue and thank you, c-span, for addressing this epidemic that is in our society. and it is a disease. i am a member of mar-anon. from there, i have gone to aca. anyway, i want to emphasize that the 12 step programs don't have any dues or fees.

there are donations if anyone wants to. there is a wonderful program -- a special program. not religious -- and it is a disease that affects all kinds of people from different classes. and gender, and backgrounds. it doesn't matter. and the sickness spreads to the people who are around the addicts. >> this is a great commercial, by the way. 12 step programs -- when you walk into it does whether you are looking for help yourself are looking for help for a loved one, most people don't know you are new. you walk in, get a cup of coffee or whatever is there, and you sit down and listen. and you don't -- there is no money to it. it really is one of those places that you go for help. a lot of people are

intimidated, walking through those doors, and my advice -- and every color that called in today knows this pretty need to cross that threshold. your life will be completely changed. and if you're struggling there today, a lot of people do because they don't know how it will affect loved ones. there are resources out there for you to understand how to live with your loved one, how to deal with your loved one, but also how to encourage that person to get help. one caller did say, it is up to the individual. if the individual is not willing. there will always be a moment in time when that individual might be willing, even for five minutes. >> marty walsh served in the biden admonition is the former secretary of labor. he is the executive director of the national hockey league players association, joining us in washington. thank you so much. >> this has been great. thank you for taking the stop today. it's very important. >> thank you very much. >> c-span is your unfiltered

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