feet ranch sees the opportunity. speaking of ron, the

>> the president founded nyu's furman center for urban policy which has become one of the nation's leading research centers on housing. welcome to the committee, president. >> thank you. our second witness is the president of rutgers university in new brunswick, new jersey. the next witness is the secretary and ceo of this society located in washington dc. the fine witness.

the chancellor of ucla and los angeles, california. we thank you for being here today and look forward to your testimony. we will remind the witnesses that we have read your written statements which will. in full in the hearing record. pursuant to committee rule 8d the committee practice i ask each limit your oral presentation to a five-minute summary of the written statement. i also remind the witnesses to be aware of the responsibility to provide accurate information to the committee. i will first recognize this president for five minutes. >> thank you. and also thank you to the representative for the kind introduction. i agree with the committee that anti-semitism is rising on

college campuses including our own. this committee is also right to be shining a light on the subject for the american people. and that, let me address four issues as they relate to northwestern. anti-semitism on campus are guiding principles of community safety and academic freedom . the encampment and our plans moving forward. our universities are on the front lines of the disturbing spike in anti-semitism that accelerated following hamas's horrific terrorist attacks on october 7. across the country the open harassment and intimidation of jewish people on the streets and social media has also infected our classrooms and campuses. as the descendent of holocaust victims and survivors rising anti-semitism in the world affects and alarms me

personally. i lost relatives in the holocaust, so it is not abstract to me that the world's jewish population has not recovered to where it was before world war ii. the fact that israel is a cherished homeland is not theoretical to me. it is where family members who survived the war found refuge. my family's history is a constant reminder to me of what can happen when anti-semitism is allowed to take root. where there is conduct that threatens the northwestern community we must impose discipline and we have done so. yet i will be the first to admit our existing rules and policies are falling short. we must improve our processes to meet the current challenge. my direction will be working over the summer to update our student conduct code.

the new policies will be in place before students return to campus. we are confident we can continue to promote two principles at the core of our mission. free expression and academic freedom while disciplining harassment and intimidation. i want to take a moment to address the encampment at northwestern and the choices we make. on the morning of april 25 and encampment was erected on an iconic gathering space at the center of our campus. as i watch what was unfolding and the encampment across the country i believe that the danger imposed grew every day. every day brought new reports of intimidation and harassment and then on april 28 the day before the tents came down the threat of confrontation escalated with the addition of outsiders to the university. for the safety of our entire

community i knew i had to act. we have three options to do so. the first option was letting the tents stay up indefinitely. we never seriously consider this option. they were a threat to our community. they came in breaking our rules. there was anti-somatic behavior that was making our jewish students feel unsafe. i knew we had to take down the encampment quickly and permanently. sending in our student affairs officers and the northwestern police department to make arrests was the second option. this option ended up posing too high of a risk to our students, staff, and police officers. there were limited law- enforcement resources available , and it also created escalation

, renewed encampments, and finally talking with the students about leaving voluntarily. this was the path we took, and it came down in just five days. we did not give into any of the protesters demands and the commitments we made are consistent with our values. importantly i rejected the main student demand for divestment and will not ever recommend that northwestern use its resources for political purposes. by engaging students with dialogue instead we model the behavior we want to apply going forward. going forward i want to make everyone of you know i am personally committed to fighting anti-semitism. we are going to reconstitute a task force that will benefit from the information from other task forces and revise our student code and enhance enforcement. we will increase our security and we will do what we do best. teaching our

students about the dangers of anti-semitism. i would like to thank you all for listening and i look forward to your questions. >> thank you. >> thank you for this opportunity. i am the president of rutgers university. to help you understand better i offer you the following. my maternal great-grandfather was an early organizer of the colored ymca in atlanta and served as president of the college in salisbury, north carolina. my grandfather was dean of education at bennett college in greensboro, north carolina before becoming the founding executive director.

my grandfather was dean of education at bennett college in greensboro, north carolina. my father was the first black person to teach it -- i showed this to make clear a commitment to education and providing access is in my dna and though i fully recognize the merit of ways in which my experience and that of our jewish community are different i know something about the awful impact of discrimination. when i served as an intern for the house ethics committee my father brought me to capitol hill on my first day. as we approach the offices he said when i was your age the only way someone who looks like oscar crossed the threshold is if you were pushing a food card. this is a part of the reason

this discussion matter so much to me. record is one of the largest christian populations in america. atari with conviction we condemn anti-semitism in the strongest terms possible be we do so today and did so long before october 7 and will always do so. workers takes pride in being a public university. we conduct life-changing research and clinical care and educate tomorrow's leaders. many of them first-generation college students from low income families. what is more there were and for its jewish community to one of only a few dozen universities in america with the department of jewish studies. building our center for jewish levels public lectures and trains them on holocaust education and host the broker's jewish film festival. it's also home to policing and community resilience which is dedicated to protecting valuable communities that are facing anti-semitism or other forms of intolerance.

both among the largest in higher education sit in the heart of our campus in new brunswick. during my presidency we developed a formal partnership with tel aviv university focused on faculty collaborations as a part of the relationship researchers will have a presence in the health and life sciences center being built in new brunswick. we find ourselves here because of the devastation they hamas terrorist attacks. it is hard breaking to think about the violence and the hostages still held captive 230 days later but the thousands of palestinian children killed in the war about the humanitarian crisis in gaza began force everyday. at rutgers's war has been a tragedy for the jewish and palestinian communities. many communities searching for a way to -- turned to activism and protest. during this period of heightened fear and anxiety and polarization records focused on three essential priorities to ensure the safety of our community and to promote dialogue and education. i would like to emphasize the last point.

disciplining a person for breaking a rule that is easy. it's much harder to build the trust and to understand across differences. the battle against anti- semitism and all of its four must be waged with education. we begin with lectures and films centered around beaching discrimination with the humanity pruitt established an advisory council of anti- semitism in jewish life's work continues to be pivotal the jewish studies of middle eastern studies by the -- not to convince her to change minds but simply to listen to want to each other. we have planned training and discussion and partnered with the anti-defamation league in this surfers be we saw protest take place on our new brunswick campus. when on the third morning some called for a around the to disrupt the exams we moved quickly to shut the encampments down.

we had seen what transpired at other universities and saw a different way. we agreed to talk and to listen. if ever there was a time for dialogue it is now. i have heard your frustration and your desire to make rutgers a stronger community. i want to say thank you. we cannot give in to the easy path. the healing will take time and i am committed to it. thank you

and i look forward to your questions. >> i recognize you for five minutes and ask you in advance to pull the microphone close to you. we have a very an adequate sound system right now. >> thank you. i would like to thank the committee for inviting me today to speak with you. i am here in my personal capacity to share my experience and thoughts as a former law school dean and president and professor of american higher education law. the past academic year has deeply challenged all stakeholders of our college and university communities. images of campus protests and unrest will long stay in our minds. precisely at times like these we must hold fast to the first principles that underlie the mission of american higher

education and the form the bedrock of a flourishing society and vibrant culture. let me first emphasize the safety of students on campus is critical and essential. students cannot learn if they fear for their safety. no one is permitted to threaten another. at a university both entitled to and required to respond to violence or threats of violence. similar these students do not have a right to disrupt the operations of the university. defacing or blocking entry to campus buildings is not protected expression whereas protests outside would be. so what should our universities do in these challenging times? when looking at any issues on campus we always need to keep in mind the fundamental goal of

our colleges is the creation and discovery and sharing of knowledge. intellectual challenges of campus life may come from many sources including protest. that is why colleges it should begin by presuming expression including protest to be protective forms of academic freedom and every inquiry. the limits of this expression are reached when actual threats or undue disruption of university operations are involved. universities must treat all members of the campus community as a part of we and not a day. there is no they where they are concerned. we must encourage listening to each other and learning. schools do best when they see dialogue across political differences between and among the members of the campus community and when they share a commitment to transparent decision-making. this approach is most successful

when it draws on months if not years of conversation and engagement. i not only believe this to be true but have seen it. i have had the opportunity to participate in the application of these principles on campus firsthand including a recent free expression residency as a part of an ongoing campuswide engagement on issues of expression and community and dialogue. during this time i met with jewish and muslim student leaders to discuss their views on the israel palestine conflict and how it affected their lives. i shared personal stories of a former colleague who suffered the tragic loss of his daughter and son-in-law when they were murdered october 7. and a former student born in gaza his family confronts the humanitarian crisis. the ensuing discussion was not easy

but i believe the students both spoke to and listened to each other. campus officials have told me these meetings continue with cooperation and not antagonism with the goal of advancing difficult conversations even where there are strong feelings and disagreements about key fundamentals. colleges and universities exist to examine complex issues and challenges and ideas and to provide a form in which issues and opinions can be explored and debated the freedom of inquiry and expression must include the right to protest. as we see productive paths for what it's worth recognizing this is not just a campus issue. we have seen increased polarization throughout the world so we should not be surprised when this happens as well on our college campuses.

what it does is we have the opportunity to build on the critically important work of role modeling and of teaching how to practice free speech. not just with people who share our views but also those with who we disagree passionately and yet with and we share a community. i think the committee and look forward to your questions.>> thank you. >> good morning. i am the chancellor at ucla. thank you for inviting me here today. let me start by affirming that all forms of discrimination including anti-semitism and islam off of your -- i wish i could see our campus has been immune to the disturbing rise of anti-semitism across our country since october 7. sadly that is not the case.

what i will address today is how we have been confronting and will continue to confront this challenge. last summer the announcement to retire -- while i am saddened by the recent turmoil i am also proud of our legacy as university deeply committed to the peaceful expression of different viewpoints. as a public university that is subject to a dual legal mandate. this balance is often difficult to achieve and has been especially different. i am

fully aware many of our jewish students of high to confirm rhetoric and images on campus that any reasonable person would find repugnant. as a jewish kid living up with relatives who are holocaust survivors and victims the former provost watching news coverage of neo-nazis writing outside of the synagogue where my children were called. as we all know being an american sometimes means being asked to tolerate offensive and even hateful's beach to protect the constitution. there are limits. it usually we draw the line when speech crosses into intimidation and threats and harassment of our community. ucla has a proud history of peaceful protest

before october 7 two we successfully navigated campus protests using strategies recommended by the university of california, but april 25 as a result of the conflict that spread across the university and country a purpose rang up at the center of our campus testing the limits of our approach. we are a part of the university of california system. we follow the university of california policy guidelines that directs its 10 campuses to only use law enforcement to root protest is been absolutely necessary to protect the physical safety of our community. accordingly, the encampment remained. as the encampment grew to over 500 protesters some of them were not even affiliated with ucla disrupted normal access to some classes. on april 28 i decided to remove

the encampment after violence broke out between opposing demonstrators and i asked for a security plan to do so. we gave them written notice the encampment was unlawful april 30 and instructed them to disperse. before the necessary police resources could be assembled assailants attacked that evening. tragically took several hours before law enforcement could stop the violence. on may 1 the support of university of california's president we provided protesters a final opportunity to leave but when more than 200 refused police orders law enforcement removed the encampment that might be with the benefit of hindsight we should have been prepared to immediately remove the encampment if and when the safety of our community was put at risk and we have since taken decisive action. i created a new office of campus safety that reports directly to me. ucla is conducting a thorough examination. university of

california has also engaged independent law enforcement experts to initiate a review of the confrontation including our planning and security protocols. finally, we will hold accountable all of those engaged in violence who violated our policies. no student should be threatened or excluded based on their beliefs or identity. we will always have to strive hard to meet the obligation. we must also maintain our commitment to academic freedom and free speech. the balance is central to ucla's educational mission. it is not always easy to strike a perfect balance, but that must be our goal. thank you again and i am looking forward to answering your questions.

>> i will ask all three of you the same question becoming faculty and staff have you fired or suspended for anti- semitic conduct or conduct related to the pro-terror encampments since april 17? >> if i might just correct the premise of your question. the fact that we didn't and have not yet suspended or expelled students does not mean

that students have not received discipline. there is a wide range of discipline and discipline has been weeded out to many of the students, but we haven't yet suspended or expelled anyone. i do not have the precise number, but we have had staff terminations. >> i do not know that we have suspended any time, but we have ongoing disciplinary proceedings. >> ongoing disciplinary proceedings. >> your deal with the soft proclaimed liberated zone you promised to reestablish an advisor committee on investment responsibility this fall.

students for justice in palestine called this an important step towards our ultimate goal. divestment from israel. will you make here here and now they will categorically reject any divestment or academic boycott of israel? >> i will make here i would never recommend that the board of trustees divestment of anything or any academic boycott of israel. >> why did you agree to create the perception that you would do so which encouraged other universities to cave on this? >> that committee is a committee that preexisted. we had the committee for several years. we had already told the investment committee of the board of trustees that we would be beginning the committee and starting the committee up again in september. i was done months before the

encampment, so we were going to do that anyway. there is no intent. that is not a board committee. that is an advisory committee. it has faculty and two students that are not necessarily from this group . >> thank you. numerous video shows jewish and other ucla students being denied access to central parts of campus by encampment members who had set up unauthorized checkpoints. in some cases they were questioned on whether they were zionists. why did you feel to immediately clear these checkpoints? >> i heard accounts of students being blocked, and we issued instructions to our staff to make sure that all walkways were free and that they could freely pass without obstruction, and i believe i

sent a memo out to the entire community saying that was intolerable and we would not tolerate the blocking of access. >> did is stop as a result of what you said? >> i believe it did. >> thank you. >> thank you to all the witnesses for being here today. this is our fifth hearing on this topic, which is perfectly legitimate and appropriate, but i think it's also important to remember we are in article one branch of government whose job it is to authorize inappropriate the u.s. to permit of education. the civil rights division of the department of education just reported in 2023 the record number of complaints for the department. if you go back to 2009 it has

tripled in terms of the number of complaints and a lot of them involve anti-semitism. the staffing level at the civil rights division at the department of education in 2009 is larger than it is today. as mr. scott pointed out the budget that the majority reported out last year for the appropriations committee for the civil rights division would cut it by 25%, which i would characterize the equivalent of defunding. i think it's our job at some point to focus on the fact that we need to beef up the ranks of that department whose mission it is to investigate and to curtail this type of activity. i would now like to yield the balance of my time. >> thank you.

since october 7 there is no question the anti-somatic has increased at rutgers. we have talked about this. the fact i called you at 6:30 in the morning when i first heard about rutgers. negotiating to end the encampment. we have had the continuing conversation.

i spent my life representing workers and protesting. i know it quite well. i am a firm believer in the first amendment. there are rules in all types of protest is. no matter what the reason is. when i participated over my lifetime and crossed the line i paid the consequences. what i want to get into today is those lines. when were they crossed and how you reacted. specifically the encampment at the new brunswick campus. when did you first find out there was a protest? >> thank you for the question. there was a protest that had been approved in our free speech zone on campus.

it is about a three walk block as you may recall, so i was learning of it as it was happening on that monday. >> were there any communications with the participants as they started the encampment? and in communication? >> no. for any approved protest there is a whole process people go through. they were engaged with those activists from the very beginning in an ongoing way. >> this was the time of year

you look forward to. the finals obviously took some of the most difficult times. >> the participants. it was made clear we would consider the speech act in the first amendment free expression, but that encampment could not disrupt university processes. could not bar people from entering buildings or be disruptive. >> i only have 10 seconds and i will be able to finish the line of questioning. >> your presidents advisory

committee recently disbanded after seven jewish members of the committee including its cochair and a university trust the resigned in protest of your caving to the encampments. you and your administration has cited the creation of this is proof you are working to canter anti-semitism. three faculty members you appointed to object to the very creation in a letter that downplayed anti-semitism and defended the phrase from the river to the sea. at least two of them have supported efforts against israel. why did you believe it was appropriate to appoint faculty members who have defended and made excuses for anti-semitism and oppressed and opposed the committee's purported mission of combating anti-semitism?>> thank you for your question. number one i would like to just address the premise of your question.

the seven members who resigned resigned for two reasons. they were unable to reach a consensus about what anti- semitism was. >> they resigned because they were not consulted with respect to the negotiations. >> will you commit to keeping off those type of members of the committee if you reconstitute this committee as you say you're going to do? >> i will be appointing to the task force that we are going to create faculty, staff, administrators who i believe are committed to fighting anti- semitism and as committed to

fighting anti-semitism as i am. >> we will be watching. one of the members has been a leader of academic boycott efforts against israel. also reverted or referred to as zionist media and condemned white liberal dialogue politics and assigned a petition defending a palestinian terrorist who murdered two israel the college students in a bombing. do you acknowledge her as grossly unfair for a committee commit to combat anti-semitism? >> i do not believe in the bds movement. i am against it at my previous university, and i would not be discussing individual faculty members. >> so you want to that a person like her. let's forget her name. a person with her principles will not be on this commission? >> i will be appointing people

to the committee who are committed to fighting anti- semitism. >> your record is not that way. you also pointed to the advisory committee despite the fact in the days after october 7 the student association released a statement explicitly supporting the terrorist attack saying we resent of the support palestinian resistance to over 75 years of israeli state sanctioned violence and calling the terrorists killed in the attack martyrs. do you agree these comments are shocking and beyond? >> i will not be commenting on any student -- >> i think we are hearing that there is no change that will take place at northwestern university. how could you possibly appoint a student who supported the october 7 terrorist attack to a

committee meant to combat anti- semitism? >> i won't comment on the speech of our students or faculty or staff. what i will say is that committee was a committee that was not just anti-semitism. we tried to do something which actually turned out -- >> let me just finish this. i think we have heard your response. and march the advisory committee hosted the university of michigan professor to speak on his llama phobia and anti- arab and palestinian biases. making numerous antimissile medic statements including claiming that israel was founded on a formal precious premises principle that they must rule be stated in that quote the only thing the palestinians and their sympathizers can do to make them happy is to bend over and allow themselves to be royally

screwed. what kind of committee on anti- semitism invites an anti-semite like this to speak? with that, sadly, i end my questioning. i yield back. >> thank you to the witnesses. i reiterate that we must stand together against anti-semitism and do more. there has been an undeniable rise in hate speech including anti-semitism and his llama phobia on college campuses across the country. although i realize institutions must be held accountable continue to schedule repetitive politicized hearings to attack a college president won't solve anti-semitism. we have to work with experts on anti-semitism and legal scholars with expertise in the area. people knowledgeable in the field who can help us determine what the government response can and should be to the increase of racial hostility on

campuses. thank you for so clearly articulating the value of higher education and why it's important to promote discussion in ways that respect free speech while keeping students safe. the american jewish committee and jewish federations and anti- defamation league and others have expertise we can draw on and because it is also a title vi issue let's focus as ranking member scott and representative courtney set on equipping the office of civil rights with the resources they need rather than cutting their budget. i also want to note as i did recently in the subcommittee my colleagues across the aisle expressed concern about anti- semitism on college campuses but do not see the same concern when anti-semitic comments and tropes come from their side of the aisle. just a few days ago the truth social account of donald trump included in outrageous video with language about a unified right. did any of my colleagues on

this committee call that out and as the candidate that most of them have endorsed for its removal? it baffles me some people are opposed to anti-semitism when it's politically convenient instead of whenever it beers its ugly head. i'm also concerned by any suggestion the first step to address protests should be to call police. it does not work in some cases. as both presidents and chancellor noted oftentimes many of the people protesting are not students. further complicating the issue. northwestern and rutgers reached agreements with student protesters to address campus safety concerns while recognizing free-speech rights. of these involved a shared learning environment to foster the exchange of ideas between schools and school administration. actions that are directly in line with the academic message and mission. in your testimony you discussed

how you identified three options to address the encampment on northwestern's campus. he talked a little bit about why you made the decision you did and that talking with the students was the best option. with the explain how the final agreement you reached with student protesters the escalated activities on campus and how that work? and did it address rights or protections for jewish or israeli students? >> thank you puke we looked at this. what we were experiencing with the encampment was a huge increase in anti-semitic activity. we had things that we had not seen before like complaints of anti-semitism jumping up. there was a sign with a slash on it. there was a picture of me with horns and blotto, as all of you know. that is in anti-semitic trope. we made a decision and it was making our jewish students feel unsafe, so we made a decision they had to come down.

we thought about bringing in the police as an option. that turned out to be not possible to ensure safety. my number one objective and mandate. when parents give me their children or lend me their children i need to keep them safe, and i'm going to do everything i can to keep them safe, and bring in police because of the size of our police force and the resources would have endangered our police and students and would have endangered our student affairs staff. then we made the decision to talk to our students and to model the behavior that we want to be engaged in the dialogue rather than force and had a de- escalation. the tents came down right after the agreement. the entire protest is not in conformity with the university rules. we also did not -- there was

nothing in the agreement that specifically address to the interests of jewish students other than getting rid of that encampment, which was making our jewish students feel unsafe. they could not pass during meadow. they were worried about the outsiders on our campus, and we were worried about the threat that they entailed for our students. >> of the adl released its report card for university's responses to anti-semitism and you are aware northwestern was the only university whose grade was downgraded, correct? >> yes i am aware of that. >> it is true they earned an f:4

-- and called for the resignation. >> i have great respect -- >> i am not asking for your respect. is it a fact you earned a f. >> i am sad that they gave northwestern a f. >> but it is true. let me tell you why. i wanted to discuss what has been referred to as the deer meadows agreement. the unilateral to the pro hamas anti-israel anti-semitic encampment. must talk about what has occurred on this encampment. isn't it true jewish northwestern student was assaulted? >> so i want to question the premise of your questioning. >> i am asking the questions and you are answering. isn't it true that a jewish northwestern student was assaulted? >> there are allegations aced to his -- dressed and was

assaulted. we are investigating those allegations. >> is attributed to a student was verbally harassed and stopped? >> there are allegations of that sort and we are investigating them. >> is a true a jewish student wearing a yarmulke was spat on? >> all of these are allegations being investigated. >> how long are these investigations going to occur? >> the kim and was up just a few weeks ago. we believe that northwestern and due process. we believe in investigations. >> when are they going to be finalized? >> i cannot tell you that they will be finalized when the conduct office and the title vi office, which are well on this issue. >> this is what you have earned an f. isn't it true a jewish student was told to go back to

germany and get cast? >> i have heard that alleged. it is being investigated. we will investigate any claim of discrimination. >> but it's a fact there have been zero suspensions and zero lsions. >> thus far with foster of investigations on their way. >> you said something very important. we did not give in to demands that the commitments we made as a part of the during meadows agreement. use of the word commitments. women talk about those be one of those was funding two visiting palestinian faculty for two years. is that true? >> this is a part of a program we have used with afghanistan and ukraine. >> is it true? the other is you will find the full cost for five palestinian undergrads. >> that is also part of the program sponsored by our institute. it is not a new program. it is this's.

>> it was announced as a part of the during meadows agreement? >> it was a set a goal. >> and who was consulted when he embarked on the during meadows agreement? was the president advisory committee on preventing anti- semitism consulted? >> that was not within the purview. >> so they were not consulted? was northwestern's board of trustees consulted? >> the chair of the board was consulted. they have over 120 members. >> is it a fact they expressed dissatisfaction with your fellow to consult them? >> there have been some members of the board of trustees who have expressed dissatisfaction they were not a part of the decision-making.>> did you consult with the general counsel of northwestern or an outside counsel on the during

meadows agreement before it was agreed to? >> yes. >> are you aware that board members ask you this question and you said you have not consulted. >> the general counsel of the university was a part of my team managing this problem. >> did you consult with two members of the advisory committee that i referenced previously and the kellogg professor? were they consulted? >> i consulted with several members including them, but also including the chair. >> was talk about that. isn't it true that you asked whether it was possible to hire an anti-zionist head? >> i did not. i absolutely did not. i would never hire anyone based upon their views of being a zionist

or anti-zionist. that is not what i do. >> that is not according to the whistle blowers that have come forward to this committee.>> i cannot say who or who has not talked to you. >> i can assure you many people have spoke to this committee. >> thank you for being here today. i will begin with a few questions for the current presidents. if you would please answer with a yes or no if possible. should colleges and universities be places where the right to be free or right to free speech and it's protected -- at the same time to colleges and universities have been a college -- ensure they are able to study and attend class.

>> in your experience as the former president -- what are the hazards of immediately punishing campus protesters rather than opening the dialogue between administrators and students? >> there two main concerns here. we always have to remember that even in these tense moments we are educators, so the goal is to engage with students to the extent possible as a part of the education process of all of the issues involved. we are always looking to try to find ways to de-escalate conflict to the extent possible. understand sometimes that won't be possible and sometimes there

are consequences that have to be pursued on the road, but you do not start that way. you try to de-escalate the conflict, and reaching out to the students and trying to build a dialogue first with the administration and students and then the best way to reduce conflict. >> was the encampment at northwestern dismantled peacefully? >> as it was. >> were there any arrests? >> there were no arrests needed. >> was rutgers encampment to spend peacefully? >> yes sir. >> to the agreement at northwestern -- did the agreement remove any rights or protections for jewish or israeli students? >> no. it actually gave them the ability to feel safe on campus because it was no longer there. >> agreement remove any rights

or protections for the students? >> no sir. >> i will say looking at this agreement i do not see that any rights were abridged or removed for jewish or israeli students either. you silly is an unfortunate contrast to what happened at rutgers and northwestern pretensions exploded. leading to arrests of may be hundred and put students in the hospital. in hindsight could you or your admission have done anything different to prevent things? sometimes it is not possible, but in hindsight my there have been another approach? >> thank you. we are always going to review all of our incidents at to see whether there was another pathway. we tried very hard to find an

offramp for them. it wasn't to be in safety became an issue for the whole community. we had to ask them to leave the encampment. >> can you tell me how much time was actually spent negotiating or dialoguing?>> an attempt was made through faculty and eventually our vice chancellor and provost sat in the encampment and discussed potential solutions and was unsuccessful, so there is a time for it but it wasn't successful. >> thank you. i yield back. >> i would first like to ask each one of you the answer of the day is its under investigation. what are the students doing while they are being investigated? are they still attending

classes and demonstrating or are they still involved in this intolerable behavior on campus? really quickly. are they dismissed until the investigation is completed? tell me what is going on. >> i cannot say for specific students what they are doing, but we are still in session. >> so they are still attending classes? we do not know if they are still involved in protests and everything else. what about your university? >> we had a successful commencement two weeks ago. students who are under disciplinary review are not on our campus. there are no protests at this time. >> what are you doing to the students who are under investigation?

>> during this period of time they are still attending classes. there is no encampment. there have been no demonstrations that are problematic. >> this outlaws wearing a mask to evade identification and committing a public offense. why have you not been the wearing of masks on your campus in accordance with california law?>> the still apparently are allowed to wear them for covid protection, and they continue to wear them.>> those are medical masks. these are not medical masks. you are allowing this behavior? >> we have allowed masks on campus. we have allowed medical masking. >> you said there has been a

wide range of discipline after testifying. he said discipline has been weeded out. how has it been weeded out? >> it has run the gamut. that is the discipline that is already completed. running the gamut from meetings with students affairs and staff at the very lowest level of severity. up to disciplinary probation. university committed to fund raise him above and beyond its current commitment with dearing meadows. >> i do not know who told you that. >> i am reading it from a statement put out by the university. it says, quote, university committed to fund raise this

program beyond the current commitment. i'm reading your words put out by your office. >> that is a program that is not just about the middle east. that is a program that is about war-torn areas all across the world. ukraine, for example. >> isn't it a fact that that was part of the agreement to increase the commitment to that ? >> i don't think the agreement increased the commitment. >> it did. i'm reading it for you. you put this out from your office. the enemy -- university commits to sustain this program beyond the current commitment. is that no longer part of the commitment? >> when i hear beyond this commitment -- >> i'm reading what your office put out. >> are you asking me to interpret that? >> i'm asking you what this means. >> what i read that to mean is beyond this current commitment the rest of the world and over time.

>> it is specifically focused on palestinian faculty members. let me ask you this -- >> we will also include israeli faculty members. >> why didn't you include israeli faculty members when you put out the agreement. >> i never called at that but the dearing meadows agreement was just a framework of an agreement that was reached with students at 4:00 in the morning -- >> at the pro-hamas accountant -- encampment. >> if you would like to see it on the website that would explain to you. >> i am asking you about what the university put out. was no mention of israeli students or faculty. isn't that the case? >> in the agreement that we reached there was not jewish students there. >> because they were not consulted. isn't that the fact? >> jewish and israeli students were not consultant with

respect to the agreement. >> exactly. yield back. representative, with all respect . >> dr. adames you are recognized for five minutes. i'm sorry. mr. norcross, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madame chairwoman. to pick up where we left off and the premise behind this is we were talking about the encampments and protest. what were those lines, when were they crossed and how you reacted? just to bring back context and certainly understanding that since that time you have it and i haven't met with students and instructional staff.

quite frankly the union of the professors. one of the issues that comes up bringing to my attention is when rutgers students and justice for palestine began to issue calls right in the middle of finals for emergency protests at 7:00 him on the second. obviously this is heightened from what you suggested was peaceful protest to something that is going to interfere with the ability of students to either attend their finals, feel threatened. why didn't you order an immediate removal once he learned that the participants were going to try to disrupt the finals? >> thank you for the question. on the day of i woke up probably around 6:15. that is when i discovered the instagram post you are referencing. within minutes i was in touch

with my leadership team and i would say roughly by 6:30 we were talking about the situation. it was at that time i said the encampment had to go down. it was a wild violation across the line to use your language. a wild violation and we decided to take the encampment down. in order to do so in talking with the chief of police at rutgers, he said the process would take a few hours to make sure there were a sufficient number of police for it to be done safely. >> i assume that you were in consultation with the chief of police. did you consult with the board of governors or lawyers that you have on staff or others? >> our general counsel was in the group i was referencing. chief of police was dialed in at all times. we engaged with him directly. the board of governors, i was in touch with the chair and vice chair, not at 6:30 in the

morning but at a reasonable hour to give them a heads up as to what was happening. >> is this when the negotiations started with the protesters? >> i discovered that they had sent in a list, i think on tuesday. this is thursday that i'm talking about. they sent in a list on tuesday and the chancellor, she and my chief of staff talked with four representative students on wednesday. this was the day before finals began. the agreement was made then that we would be happy to talk with you but the encampment cannot be disruptive and cannot block access. it needs to be silent because we have final exams. they agreed to that and the next morning we discovered they

had broken the agreement. >> so the negotiations were taking place while the encampment was still there. >> yes. >> knowing that, and i will call the agreement that was reached with the protesters, why did it take so long to remove the encampment even after the deal was done? >> the students asked for another meeting on thursday morning. that is when they learned that i had already given the order to take the encampment down. they had hoped that we could have some further conversation on different points. i told them if you want to talk you need to agree to have the encampment down. we extended the time linda 4:00 as a matter of public safety. and regular engagement with the attorney general when we sent

out requests for mutual age they needed more time to make sure they have the proper amount of police. we had 125 ready to go by early afternoon. >> i think i heard you say you spoke with the attorney general? >> yes. >> why was he brought into this? >> i did not know it at the time, when police asked for mutual aid in the state of new jersey and they ask for more assistance the request ultimately lands with the attorney general's office. >> what was his reaction or suggestion that you do? take it down immediately? weight? >> since we allowed him to be there he wanted to make sure we would give them proper notice that they were now in trespass and allow time to disperse. >> the attorney general said wait until we tell them? okay. i yield back the balance of my

time. >> i will say to the members, when i start hitting the gavel i want to be respectful to the witnesses answering questions, but if i hit the gavel no more questions. thank you. mr. banks. >> president schiller, have you had any conversations last year about leaving the big ten conference? >> no. no consideration. >> we are proud to be in the big ten conference. we are proud of our football team and we are proud of being a charter member of the big ten. >> you are fully committed to remaining in the conference. >> last year you fired the football coach after allegations of hazing in the locker room. you hired a law firm and spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to do that. the law firm came back with a

recommendation to give a two week suspension of the football coach because there was no credible evidence he was aware at all of the harassment or hazing allegations of the locker room. you issued the two week suspension. correct? >> i feel like this is a matter as you know, he is suing us and you are asking for facts. your premise is inaccurate. >> don't accuse me of that. that's outrageous. let me get to my point because i think your performance here has been very embarrassing to your school. after 72 hours you gave him a two week suspension and then he received a lot of backlash from the left-wing mob including a letter from six professors who attacked you and said that was not good enough. either way, three of those professors were also attacking

you later for creating the committee on anti-semitism and hate. you responded to that left-wing backlash as well. you fired the popular football coach 72 hours later after you originally gave him a two week suspension. here is what is relevant. you said that the decision to originally suspend coach fitzpatrick with mine and mine alone as is the decision to part ways with him. so it was your decision and your decision alone. let me ask you about stephen thrasher who is one of the goons in the photo behind me. he's a professor of journalism at northwestern. he and several of your faculty members locked arms, scuffled with police, blocked police officers on your campus from doing their job. do they continue to teach students at northwestern university after this embarrassing incident. >> i will not comment on individual faculty members.

>> is it your decision and your decision alone to allow those professors to continue to teach on your campus? >> we believe in due process >> except for the decision you made about coach fitzgerald. >> we followed the contract. we had an investigation but i am not going to go on and on about that. >> is it okay for faculty members at northwestern university to scuffle with police officers, to lock arms and present police officers from doing their job. you said in the opening statements that this encampment was responsible for anti- semitic behavior that made jewish students feel unsafe to go to class. is it okay for faculty members? do they get away with that at northwestern university. >> i'm not going to comment on ongoing investigations in faculty personnel matters. there is a role again at the university that that is complement -- confidential. >> thrasher was a professional

prognosticator. he went to columbia university to participate in their encampment and you pay his bills. you are responsible for stephen thrasher's activities which is really crazy. let me ask you this. is hamas a terrorist organization? >> everything i know suggested that hamas is a terrorist organization. >> is it okay for professors or faculty members to praise hamas or the houthis ? hamas is responsible for the attacks on october 7 that killed over 1000 jewish and israeli's on a very terrible and dark day in israel. is it okay for your faculty members to praise hamas and houthis ? >> are you saying okay meaning is it something that i would do

? >> do you allow your professors and faculty members to do that? >> professors and faculty members have all of the rights of free speech. >> i would like to submit these statements of faculty members that have raised hamas and the houthis. is it okay for faculty members and teachers to tell their students to go to the encampments or coerce them and push them toward that type of political behavior to go participate in mock arms and maybe tie their grades to that or make them feel like that is something they should participate with? >> may i answer? >> you may answer. >> thank you. our faculty members, nobody at our school may engage in discriminatory harassing or intimidating behavior. >> i will submit this for the record as well. we should not give you another taxpayer dollar for your university. >> your time has expired.

without objection your material will be submitted for the record. >> free speech and the right to protest are foundational to our democracy. upholding these rights without allowing them to be twisted into weapons of hate is no easy task. nowhere perhaps is it more difficult than on college campuses. places that help students to think, to engage, to broaden their mindsets and express their ideas without violence or intimidation. anti-semitism, islamic phobia, anti-api hate, lgbtq hate and all forms of hatred have no place in our society including on college campuses. the history of protest on college campuses is mirrored in today's history. as college administrators protecting all of your students

and allowing your campuses to remain as communities of free debate is your responsibility. instead of using these hearings for political bullying purposes which is what the majority seems to do. if you want to be embarrassed about something perhaps be embarrassed about the fact that the majority has not been able to govern in this cycle without being saved by democrats. i for one am interested in hearing and learning about what successful negotiation de- escalation looks like in the context of protecting students and free speech. mr. schill i'm a proud graduate from the kellogg school at northwestern. many of my courses were about negotiation and mediation. you have described college presidents as being between a rock and a place. certainly we see that. i agree completely with your eloquent comments on the need to fight the scourge of anti- semitism on campuses and

everywhere. i appreciate your own lived experience and your work to do that. you did not mention other forms of hate that have also risen against palestinian, arab, and muslim students on your campus. do you have the same level of commitment to fight that kind of hate against those students? can you tell me what efforts you are taking to address safety concerns for those communities? >> absolutely. any form of hate, any form of discrimination or harassment based on title vi or other roles at the university, we will investigate any complaints . we have gotten complaints and we will investigate them. we will also protect all of our students whether on campus or off campus. we will connect and communicate. i had a dinner for 45 jewish

kids and i asked them about what they needed. i headed dinner for islamic students and asked them what they needed. we are a university. these are all of our students. everyone is part of our community. i owe an obligation. my number one obligation is public safety and their safety because if you do not feel safe, you cannot learn. that is what northwestern does better than any other university, as you know because you are a alumni. it teaches and does research and creates an environment for learning. >> thank you. you have commented some on this, but i wanted to know if you had more to say about the options and outcomes you considered before choosing negotiation. you are actually successful in ending york college encampment by peacefully negotiating with the protesters.

did you have anything you wanted to add about what you are considering as you decided to take that course of negotiation? >> as i said we had to get the encampment down. we needed, the police solution was not going to be available to us to keep you safe, but also may not be the wise solution as we have seen at some other universities around the country. we found, and we were fortunate to have students who were willing to negotiate and were willing to give up their demands that they came into us for. their number one demand was divestment. we said no. we said absolutely not. we said nothing that singles out israel. we said, let's think about what will make the university stronger. what will be important for your community. then we came to this agreement

over time, hearing what their needs are. i would do that. i would listen to the needs of any community. we have already been in communication with our muslim students. for example, the house for muslim students. that was already in conversation . for a year they have no place to pray or eat or celebrate ramadan. that was something that we accord to jewish students, catholic students, lutheran students. we want to meet the needs of our students where they are and that is what the agreement ended up being. >> i really agree she -- appreciate your focus on negotiation and protecting all students. thank you. i yelled back. >> thank you. mr. owens you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you. thank you very

much. i want to start off by saying that courage and leadership lines itself in the moment. i would say as a nation we are seeing it was not available. i see that in these college campuses. when i think we are looking for was strengths, fairness to all including jewish students, wisdom and the recognition that hatred cannot be negotiated with. i am really curious and trying to understand how you had negotiations, by the way, president, would you have the same patience and strategy if these were white supremacist trying to negotiate that were attacking black people. would you have the same patience for that? >> representative owens, thank you for the question. i'm not going to engage in hypotheticals. >> this is how you deal with hatred. i'm trying to give you an understanding. if it was black students

against the instead of pro- hamas would you deal with them in the same way you dealt with these incidents. >> i'm not going to engage in hypotheticals. >> let's just move on. i will say this is striking that you decide to negotiate a sweetheart deal with pro-hamas students and celebrate it or simply don't care. i look at that is pure evil. how much went money has northwestern university received from qatar sources including connected entities. >> the amount we have received from the cutter foundation to fund our campus in qatar, all of the resources we have gotten >> i'm looking for short answers. i only have about three minutes left. how much. >> i do not have the dollar number. you have the check. every dollar has gone to the

operation of the campus or management of the campus. >> we would like to have a complete and transparent accounting of how much is coming from this. are you aware this is the same qatar government which currently harbors leaders of hamas and has given the terror organization of hamas about $1.8 billion. are you aware of that? >> they are harboring those leaders and the u.s. government supports that. >> are you aware that terrorists have given, that qatar has given the terrez $1.8 billion to hamas? >> this is not my area of expertise. >> are you aware that iranian officials travel in and out to meet with hamas. >> this is not in my area of

expertise. >> if this is true do you think it would be a good idea for the university of northwestern department with a government that harbors terrorists hamas to help fund terrorism. yes or no. >> i'm not engaging in yes or no answers. >> obviously you don't have a problem with that. >> the northwestern school of journalism. >> i am really offended by what you claim my views are. >> the media outlet of al jazeera. did you know that northwestern school of journalism has a former partnership with al jazeera? >> i just found out about that last week. >> let me make you aware of it. al jazeera because of their pro- hamas reporting secretary of state antony blinken asks the qatar prime minister to tone down the anti-israel incitement. also, israel, saudi arabia, jordan and egypt have blocked

al jazeera because of their pro- hamas mouthpiece. my understanding is you have a contract with the qatar foundation that expires at the end of 2027, 2028. now that you know would you be willing to or are you still going to renew that contract. >> the review of that contract is being done by the provost office. may i finish the answer. >> sorry. these are really short questions. knowing that al jazeera is a mouthpiece for hamas, are you willing to end that partnership? >> the decision with respect to the cutter campus is ultimately the board of trustees. i am actually concerned by the agreement you are talking about with al jazeera and we are going to look into it. >> okay. this is an issue that i am

thankful we are pulling because it's not just beginning now. we will make sure that we keep following this. think you and i yelled back. >> your time has expired. misses manning, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chair and thank you to our witnesses today. clearly none of you were prepared for what happened on your campuses after october 7. i have spoken with jewish students, faculty members and alumni who have described countless horrifying and relentless incidents of harassment, intimidation, the use of jewish tropes, the putting up of leaflets and tearing down of hostage posters. the isolation of jewish student groups, of jewish students forcing them to leave official student groups from student government to dance troops. students were unable to get to class, they were afraid to go to the dining rooms. they could not study.

they had classes and exams canceled. what has been described to me has been nothing short of the normalization of anti-semitism on your campuses. but this normalization of anti- semitism did not start on october seven. it predated that by many years and reflects a failure to take anti-semitism seriously. failure to treat anti-semitism the same way you would treat any other kind of discrimination. it has been fostered by years of teaching a one-sided anti- israel view by many of your professors and by a demonization of zionism which is the centuries-old quest by the jewish people to return to their ancestral homeland and control their own destiny. president schill, why hasn't

northwestern taken serious steps to address the normalization of anti-semitism and anti-zionist teachings on your campus long before october 7? >> thank you for the question. i believe we are taking steps. i believe you are absolutely right. none of us were prepared for what we saw after october 7. you have my commitment that we will do what is necessary to combat anti-semitism. we will also do what is necessary to educate our students and the evils of anti- semitism as well as the roots of anti-semitism. >> it is a shame that this disaster, finally brought a recognition that that kind of education is necessary.

i know that you had an anti- semitism task force. they have no experts of anti- semitism on the task force. will you commit to putting together a task force with experts? >> it actually did. we did have a faculty member who was a consultant to the holocaust museum. we did have somebody on the committee there but we will definitely have people who are knowledgeable and are aware of anti-semitism. >> will you commit to training not just students but also faculty members on what anti- semitism is and the dangers it presents not just to jewish students but to the foundations of democracy? >> i believe that is a good idea. >> thank you. chancellor block, same question for you. >> we admit that this is a challenge. >> i have emails dating back to 2014 from dedicated alumni who tried to alert you of the growing problem with anti-

semitism that was growing on your campus. >> we have responded and we've tried to respond with education and obviously enforcement were their complaints about specific events. we developed a training module and bolstered the department on anti-semitism. >> are all of your students required to take anti-semitism training? >> the module is recommended. it is approximately 80% to 90% of our student. >> do you think it needs more? >> i agree. >> does your faculty also need to take anti-semitism training? >> i think faculty can benefit also from understanding the challenges of our students today. i agree. >> okay. >> president holloway. same question to you.

i understand your roots. i have been at college in my district pick >> thank you. i want to say from the beginning we are living in an age of heightened discrimination and anti-semitism . the campuses are no different from the rest of the country. any expression of it i think is absolutely horrible. what i also want to say is we address every instance that is brought to our attention of discriminatory behavior including anti-semitism. >> thank you. my time is expired. i yelled back. >> thank you. you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you. the rutgers new art campus hosts a think tank called the center for security rights. in just the past week csr are, in

just the past week, csrr, a so- called think tank has exposed its anti-semitic agenda in a post on x, csrr called the israeli government genocidal. do you think it is genocidal? >> sir, i do not have an opinion on israel in terms of that phrase. >> you do not have an opinion as to whether or not israel's government is genocidal? >> i think they have a right to exist and protect themselves? >> i think israel has a right to exist and protect themselves. >> you will not say that the government is genocidal? you cannot say that. >> i believe in the governments rights. >> you can't be that surprised by the topic today. another post the biden administration shift on israel

is a game that can and must be built on. meaning the biden administration betrayal of israel. another post said the real threat comes not from students but from maga republicans that are shouting anti-semitism the loudest. do you agree with this? the director has a salary funded by wreckers. do you believe that maga republicans are a threat to american jews? >> the statements are deeply unsettling. >> do you believe that maga americans are a threat to american jews? >> i'm not in a position to answer that. >> what does that mean? do you think anti-israel political advocacy is an appropriate use of taxpayer

dollars by a public university like rutgers? >> i think at a public university we have to abide by the first amendment. >> should rutgers fund anti- israel political advocacy? >> we should not be funding anti-israel advocacy. >> on the 20th anniversary of september 11, csrr sponsored an event featuring a speaker who was convicted in 2006 for material support of a terrorist group, the palestinian islamic jihad. he pled guilty to several charges. the event was designed to so- called challenge the narrative surrounding 9/11 and tell 9/11 supposedly legitimize the war on terror and other imperialist wars and interventions. i should note that 750 people from new jersey were murdered on 9/11. do you think it is acceptable for a new jersey state university to sponsor an event about 9/11.

>> i learned about the person's involvement. i do not support their ideas in the least. i think they are wildly offensive. i also -- i will just stop there. >> you were president at that time. did you do anything about the event taking place on your campus or to prevent future events like this taking place? >> did you ask me if i would prevent that from happening? >> again, do you think it is okay for rockers to sponsor an event about 9/11 with a speech by a convicted terrorist sympathizer. you were president at the time. did you do anything about it? >> we are a community of 100,000 people. there are events happening that i am not aware of. >> as noted before the director of csrr has made numerous anti- semitic statements with her rutgers funded salary. she signed a statement condemning the racial supremacy

of jewish zionist nationalists saying that jews are more privileged than muslims and delegitimizing israel and the u.s. as racist settler colonial states. given that statement and the anti-semitic activities do you think it is appropriate for rutgers to continue to fund this office? is that cool with you? >> there is very little that i find easy about the center. i personally disagree deeply with a lot of their ideas. >> will you close the center or keep funding it? >> i have no plans to close it. >> i am not surprised. thank you i yelled back. >> thank you. you are recognized for five minutes ms. wild. >> thank you. president holloway, just as an incidental matter as a ranking member of the house ethics committee i want to thank you for your

early service to that committee. i hope it was a valuable experience for you. while i understand that free speech is a critical tenet of our democracy, i think we all agree on that. i do worry about whether the campus protests we have seen fear into hate speech. thankfully the protest on the campuses in my district, pennsylvania seven which host a number of wonderful schools like lehigh university, lafayette college and so forth, the protests have been peaceful and respectful. i am deeply appreciative of our students for that. let me also say i commend the restraint shown by some of you in not creating a police state on your campuses. there is a fine line between law and order and oppression of the right to protest. it is a really fine line and i respect a difficult job you

have had this year. as a jewish mother of two young adults i have to say i am deeply saddened and dismayed by the increased evidence of anti- semitism across the country and around the world. as much as i truly believe that college is a place where young people learn to think critically, i also have some concerns about whether students are getting enough guidance on this issue from administrations. , seven members of your advisory committee on preventing anti-semitism and hate, including the cochair, resigned after the university brokered an agreement with encampment organizers. in a follow-up statement the university claimed that the committee charge and its work remain incredibly important to our community. our commitment to protecting jewish students, faculty, and staff is unwavering. my question is, why did

northwestern failed to consult with the committee before yielding to the demands of the protesters? >> that was never in the purview of the committee. the committee was designed to assess the extent of anti- semitism on campus and to propose educational and other ways to deal with it. it was not to deal with an existing encampment. quite honestly, there were 16 or 17 members, most of them did not have expertise in the area. there is a limit to how many people one can consult when one is talking to students. >> i understand there is a limitation on time but it seems to me you had a ready-made committee that could have been asked to weigh in on this and seven other members of the committee felt the same because they stepped down. have you taken steps to replace those faculty and staff members?

>> we are going to constitute a task force. the task force is going to be designed to come up with new strategies to combat anti- semitism. what we are going to do is ask that committee to look at the wisdom of other anti-semitism committees around the country. indeed, this committee wrote a report two weeks ago in which it summarized the harvard anti- semitism committee. i will be asking them to look at the recommendations. >> i hope that you will consult with that task force committee in the future when you've got this kind of situation. i have limited time and i do want to ask, this can be to any of you, hopefully all of you with short answers. as we are looking forward to the fall semester, obviously we have the potential for ongoing

challenges in this regard with respect to campus protests and in kampmann -- encampments and potential violence. what are you planning to do to prepare for the next school year. why don't we start with you, jeff leblanc. >> i will not be there this fall but i would seriously recommend that during the orientation this coming summer we will spend extra time discussing these issues about respectful protest, time, place, and manner and make sure students are prepared with the roles. >> mr. lawrence? >> these are always learning opportunities on our campuses. we should not be surprised in a polarized and challenging time for the nation that we see that exhibited on-campus. i think it is an opportunity to talk about protest, but also about conversation over differences. all of us on campus and through society can play the role of role modeling for students how we have conversations between

and among people with very strong differences of opinion. >> that is exactly my point. i know my time has run out so what i would ask of all of you is that you give very careful consideration to how you will approach this in the upcoming school year and perhaps submit to the committee your ideas which i hope will be some sort of template for other schools. thank you very much. i yelled back. >> thank you, ms. wild. i think you asked a very good question. ms. steele you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you. thank you to the witnesses coming out today. chancellor, you have been talking about that this was a really peaceful protest. under the uc system unless absolutely needed you cannot really use law enforcement, but if you watch the video, that

person physically slapped a jewish student and removed the head covering and pulled out a taser and followed that person. i hope that you found out who that person is and i hope that you found out and dealt with him i hope. that should not happen for the jewish students. your school that had -- i am going to just move on to that. hamas leaning faculty members offered extra credit and better grades for those who took part in chaos and disruption caused by the terrorists. this is really not heard of. what did you do? did you discipline this

professor? or did you really do something? or you are investigating? this should not happen on university campuses such as ucla . it is a prominent university in california. not just in california but in the nation. so what did you do about it? >> i am unaware of the incident of offering extra credit. i am happy to look into it. >> i really cannot hear you. >> that particular incident, i'm not fully aware of the one you are talking about. we know there have been cases where a faculty member has offered extra credit to go to a tutorial on gaza but offered the same credit to go to other

events on campus including jewish studies but the incident you are talking about i am not familiar with. i will be sure to be aware of it and see how it was disposed of. >> i am aware of it and you don't, that is really odd because you are the head of your university. and then, anti-semitism class is not mandatory but i have a little problem with your school syllabus here. on march 27, and activist gave a mandatory lecture to your first-year ucla students. it is part of the mandatory structure of racism and health equity class. during the lecture the medical students the lecture led the students in a free palestine chant and demanded the students kneel down

and keep repeating for mama earth. when you do mandatory, why are medical students required to stand up and chat free palestine in a mandatory lecture and some faculty have called for the course to be suspended and investigated. have you opened an investigation and committed to an investigation? >> we have undertaken fact- finding to find out exactly what happened. i am not familiar with the exact details through the office of compliance. i believe the school of medicine is re-looking at its first-year program for the course content of the first- year program of which this was part of. as a review of this program i understand and we are actually trying to confirm the facts of what has been claimed.

>> how are you going to fix that so it never happens again? >> i think this is one where we need to find the facts out first of exactly what happened and then we will figure out what the remedy should be to make sure appropriate behavior occurs. >> ucla receives a lot of federal funding. impact, over $1 billion per year just for research. is a a good idea to invite speakers that refer to the october 7 massacre as justice? do you condemn the facts that somebody at your university -- they killed hundreds of people. hundreds were kidnapped as justice. >> i am not familiar with exactly the individual you're talking about. i am deeply offended by statements like that.

that is personally offensive, particularly hurtful and i would like to learn more about it. >> chancellor, it seems like i'm not getting any answers from you. i hope these public universities especially getting federal funding, you really need to teach our kids how to think, not just brainwashing these kids. thank you very much. >> i appreciate that. >> dr. adames you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chairman. i want to thank the presidents and chancellors for being here today. thank you for what you do at your institutions. i served 40 years at bennett college in greensboro. i want you to know i did have the opportunity to know dr. trent, your grandfather, and to work with him during my 40 years at the college. let me just say for the record that i am certainly opposed to any unsafe conditions on

campuses, anti-semitism, hatred, katrina, all of those things in my opinion are inappropriate. i was a professor. i work with faculty and student so i certainly understand what you do. because today we are talking about anti-semitism, as i said before i am opposed to that and to any unsafe conditions. any student that comes to campus and spend send money needs to feel safe and have academic enrichment that is appropriate. i do have a couple of questions. i am going between committees so i apologize that i've had to step out, but we are talking about the summer coming. i think most of you probably

had commencement. if not you are having it. so to what extent have you had conversations with students about protests before they left the campus or during the upsets we have seen on campus? you can be really brief in your answers because i have another question. dr. holloway, we will start with you. >> thank you, congressman. i speak with students, faculty, and staff particularly in the jewish community. it's been ongoing. we have talked a lot about different elements on campus and what we will be doing going forward is implementing new training by partnering with anti-defamation league in particular. they have already been a good partner and we will diving deeper to ensure we are doing everything we can to ensure a safe environment for our students. >> anybody else want to speak to that? >> i am happy to jump in. what we are doing, we are

always talking with our students, and trying to help them both jewish students as well as some of the students who are advocates for the current conflict in gaza. the important thing we will be doing over the summer is revising the conduct code. it was just not appropriate for this moment. we will be working on that, both the office of student affairs in conjunction with the board committee. >> so that will apply to all students? >> yes. >> i have a question i really wanted to get this one in. as university presidents, chancellors, how have you

supported the freedom of speech and the right to peacefully protest of your students as well as your faculty, because some of the views or political positions that we know have been expressed may differ from that of your trustees or even your own personal views. how have you insured that the institutional mission of the university remains in tact? each of you can respond very quickly if you want. >> i believe that free speech and free expression and academic freedom are the core values of our university. we will protect them. at the same time, academic freedom and free expression do not allow discrimination, harassment, or intimidation of students, other faculty, or community members. >> let's move on down the line.

>> academic freedom and free speech are at the core of what we do in the work of the common good and protecting democracy. anything that threatens violence harassment or intimidation goes beyond the pale and we work to make sure we hold people accountable. >> as i said in my opening statement, we have to have strong protections of free expression, academic freedom inquiry is the foundation of the open dialogue debate that takes place on university campus. where does that run out, threats of violence and harassment and intimidation. >> i would say the same thing. we encourage free speech. we want to be sure the students understand how to do it within the context of the university environment. >> thank you. i yelled back. >> thank you. mr. connor, you are recognized. >> president holloway, is

blocking students from entering campus based on wraith -- race or ethnicity and expendable offense. >> that is certainly a violation of university standards work >> is it and expendable offense? >> potentially it would be depending on the circumstance of that specific instance. >> president shell, is excluding students and blocking them from entering campus based on the race, religion, or ethnicity and expendable offense? >> i would imagine it is a violation of the conduct code. >> is it and expendable defense? >> there is a range of discipline up to and including being expelled. >> chancellor black, is physically blocking students from entering your campus based on race, religion, or ethnicity and expendable offense?

>> it could be. >> could we please play a video. >> look at this. i am a ucla student. i deserve to go here. we pay tuition. this is our school and they are not letting me walk in. my class is over there and i want to use that entrance. will you let me go in. let me and my friends go in. >> we are not engaging with you. >> will you move? >> will you move? >> we are going. i am going in. i have my hands up i am not hurting them. >> were those students that formed the blockade? >> excuse me? >> were those students that formed the blockade? >> i do not know if they were students were not affiliates. >> have any of them been disciplined? >> have any been disciplined yet ? >> those people on the video that formed the blockade.

>> after we learned about that i sent a message to student affairs to make sure that pathways were open for everyone and they sent the message out to the community. >> i will take that as a no. we have the evidence on video of students being blocked from entering campus based on his jewish identity and there's been no consequence whatsoever? >> i did not say that. i said it is being investigated and we will see what happens. i did not say that. >> resident schill, the dearing meadows agreement if the university does not live up to its end of the bargain do the protesters have a right to reestablish the encampment? >> the protests on dearing meadow, any encampment on dearing meadow is a violation of the university conduct. >> you reached an agreement where you said the encampment will disband and you agreed to certain conditions.

if you don't follow them can they reestablish? >> we are planning on following the conditions. >> if you don't what they be in their rights? >> that the hypothetical issue. if i commit to something i do it. >> you said you have great respect for the anti-defamation league. is that correct? >> i do. >> as i'm sure you're aware they have called for your resignation. they said, president schill embolden those using harassment and violence to achieve their ends. rather than hold them accountable as he pledged to what he gave them a seat at the table and normalized their hatred against jewish students. why is the adl wrong? >> i believe at this moment leaders need to make hard decisions. i believe that we got a good result. we were able to get rid of the major anti-semitic event on the campus with no violence. >> by institutionalizing anti- semitism and agreeing to the demands of anti-semites.

in my view you are the easiest case we have dealt with. you agreed to the demands of those who are trying to change university policy and an anti- semitic way and he reported their tactics and use of force. this is what the adl has said. that's not what i said. >> we agreed to none of the demands that were presented. >> you announced the dearing meadows agreement. you've made preposterous statements like it was not practical to consult with jewish students prior to conceding to those demands. i would associate myself with the comments of the adl. i think if the university does not move to change its leadership it will be endorsing that institutionalization, the normalization of anti-semitism. president holloway, are you currently under consideration to be the president of yale university? >> i am not. >> you are planning to stay at rutgers?

>> yes i am. >> thank you. i yelled back. >> ms. stevens you are recognized for five minutes. >> as some of you might be aware , last term in congress in 2022 when the democrats were in the majority we moved to pass a variety of mental health bills, many that passed, some that languished in the senate. i just wanted to ask you in terms of your purview and the pressures and the stresses on students, what you believe is contributing to the mental health crisis among young people. would you surmise that a gun violence epidemic is the number one killer of young people in america is contributing to rising mental health issues? >> i am not an expert in mental health --

>> do you say it is a yes. >> there is a recent book by a psychologist that's a cell phones are a major aspect because the kids are getting social media all the time and not interacting with each other. there is probably a myriad of reasons why we have a mental health crisis on campus. your assumption is probably one element of that. >> we have a gun violence crisis. we have cuts to higher education. we have unregulated social media and don't know how to take a break. that this committee, as we were playing a role in marking up legislation to address mental health issues on college campuses. had an amendment from the other side of the aisle that was introduced by a congresswoman

from illinois that would strip lgbtq students from receiving mental health resources. and i'm curious if that amendment had not failed because the democratic majority voted it down, would that have violated any equity, code of conduct, violations that we are talking about here today, would you have issues implementing mental health resources that excluded a segment of students on your campuses, mr. holloway? >> i want our mental health resources to be available to everybody. >> yeah. it needs to be available to everybody. so we are here for the third time talking about -- and i know this hearing is important to many stakeholders and many individuals. i come from michigan. we are in the heart of this rising challenge of an ongoing

and brutal and terrible war. but as a democrat on this committee who is focused on increasing and expanding pell, lowering the cost of higher education and trying to build equity, it is deeply frustrating and concerning that this is the third hearing that we have had, cosplaying about protecting students equally when every single one of my colleagues last term in congress voted to exclude a group of students from receiving mental health resources. and i sincerely hope that you would not vote to exclude muslim students from mental health resources. jewish students from mental health resources. students of color, non-binary students, and the like. we have tons of issues before us in this country. and frankly, those who pretend to care about equity, as we have seen time and time again in this committee, is an outrage. it's an absolute outrage. go ahead and cut the civil

rights office. i'm out of the department of education. see you can get yelled at by my colleagues on the other side of the aisle about how you can stand up or not stand up for students, litigating all these matters of free speech. but when we don't put our money where our mouth is, and our policies, we are failing this nation. we are failing muslim students. we are failing jewish students. we are filling christian students. and frankly, we are failing the future of this country. we know what it costs to go to your schools. it's unbelievable how much it costs. that's what we should be focusing on. not this pretend argument about equity when really they are just pretending here. so thank you, madam chair, and i yield back. >> thank you, ms. stevens. mr. bean, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you very much. good morning to you in good morning to committee gentlemen. thank you so much for being here. i know it's a big deal to run

the university. i was making a list of all the things you have to do running a university including recruiting applicants to go to your school. hiring professors and staff, running the plant, raising money, promoting the school. you would think on that list, which is a very long list, you would think at the very, very top is keeping students, staff and faculty safe on your university. while we are questioning where you put that on your list is because we see a lack of consequences. we see the answer is always it's under investigation, or we put that group on double secret probation, which really is not holding anyone accountable. chancellor, on november 15, 2023, a jewish ucla protester -- student and her husband went to a rally wearing pro-israel t- shirts and heard students chant slaughter the jewish and arabic

and heard students say we will find you and take care of you. the next day a student from the rally stocked her husband at his office. two weeks later, more and more hatred and anti-semitism including a garbage topped with a swastika and more left outside the doorstop. all this was reporting to you and other officials including the identity of those doing it. what disciplinary actions did ucla take in response? >> thank you for the question, we immediately alerted the police and the police did an investigation. i don't know if that is ongoing or not but police were involved immediately in the incident. >> was anybody kicked off campus? >> i don't know what the outcome was. police were immediately notified of the issues and interviewed individuals. >> on november 28, protesters cutting down hostage protesters and chasing a jewish student

brandishing knives. they chased him on campus. it was reported to police and ucla officials. can you tell us what disciplinary action including did anyone get ticked off campus or expelled? >> i don't know when that particular case. the police were notified and attempted to identify the individuals holding the knives. >> so you can see, gentlemen, this is why we question this because we see the videos and everything. we meet with students who say that it's -- and we see the video just now. it breaks my heart. can't even go to class. it's hard enough going to one of your schools. but to have to worry about it. president schell, i know that you are rewriting the code of conduct at northwestern. it sounds like you're going to start. probably already starte. is calling for the death of the jewish going to be against her code of conduct? >> it already is. >> it already is. so you cannot yell other words

that we know are hateful to the jewish and calling for the death and destruction. >> anything that calls for the death and destruction of jewish people, whether here or abroad is a code of conduct violation. and the code of conduct will be investigated. there is a variety of disciplinary possibilities that will follow from that. >> very good. it's an open question. here's your chance, presidents, to prove to the committee and to the american people, to congress that your teams back home, that you rank the safety of students and faculty. have you expelled anybody? have you fired people? these hate groups on your campus? i know there is free speech but this is clearly as president schell has already commented on, it's a clear crossing of the line. president holloway, what say you? >> violence, threatening

students, community, harassment is a violation of the code of conduct. >> you've banned groups or students from campus to say this will not be tolerated at rutgers? >> that's correct. >> i know my time is about up, but i was in israel this past few months ago. and eating dinner with a family and we were talking about how scary it is to live in israel. the family says what we're really worried about is our daughter. ironically, our daughter is starting rutgers in the fall. we are really fearful of her safety, coming to america. should she have anything to fear at rutgers? >> am very sorry to hear that the family feels this way. >> well, they're scared. see, they see the video that we see of students, which is what happened at ucla and others across america, and they see very little consequences for breaking the laws and the policy because no one seems to

be held accountable. are you going to hold people accountable, mr. president? >> thank you. yes, sir, absolutely. one thing i want to make clear is that in an instance of the kind of language and behavior you've been talking about, we have responded immediately with whether the student affairs police, sometimes campus police or state police, even the fbi to help us bring that to a conclusion. >> thank you, president. madam chair, i yield back. >> thank you. you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you. i want to thank the panelists for being here. thank you for your life's work. we are all at an age where -- i'm guessing. i'm looking at you or you sort of reflect on where life takes you. welcome to an institution that has an 11% approval rating. chancellor, ucla has a history of supporting jewish students and taking proactive measures against anti-semitism. your school established research on anti-semitism in october 2023.

a october 6, and told, in fact. can you speak to that a bit? >> we have established a number of new programs. we have a study of group 8 to understand better overall any groups group 8. specifically we have a program to look at anti- semitism grid as we do see it is a real challenge throughout the world and on our campuses. that's one of our initiatives. we have a number of initiatives going on to educate our students better about people's history and understanding the dangers of discrimination. one of them that i'm involved in is taking students to washington each year. a group of student leaders. we visit congress. we visit museums. of course, we visit the holocaust museum. for many students it's an eye- opener. the begin to understand something about the history of their fellow jewish students and why it is so important to be sensitive to their needs and make sure you are not discriminatory towards the

students because there are other museums as well. the african-american museum. education is critical here. we are trying to do more and more programs to educate students so that at least we don't see discrimination based on ignorance. it's always going to be, unfortunately, people with bad behavior. we recognize that, but we want to make sure students are well- educated in these areas and that we can minimize the amount of discrimination that goes on campus. >> that's one of the issues i find representing a district surrounding the university of california. the mothership, i'm sorry. we think of you as the younger sibling. these are areas with a lot of diversity. rutgers. so there's some tension there because there is more diversity. our openness in this instance sometimes creates more friction in my view as an urban california representative. do you feel -- i'm not bringing it as a prerogative, but there is a reality to the openness that it sometimes contributes more to the challenges that may

be less diverse parts of the country don't experience. >> that's exactly right. we are very proud. ucla is a very diverse campus. i've worked hard over 17 years to make sure it's representative and make sure students from all backgrounds and the socioeconomic backgrounds, can attend the university. very proud of that. people, different life experiences, with different prejudices. but we work hard to actually bring students together to better understand their common humanity. i think this is something the uc system does well. it brings together students with different backgrounds and we try to form a bond of what we all have in common. that is what our programs are designed to really do. we have very effective organizations like our ll organization which is nationally recognized for jewish students to find a home and other students and other organizations that they can go to. >> and they have been part of this program. they've been very involved.

>> they are a great partner with jewish students. >> how do we keep building on that? that started october 6th. how do we continue to build on that, given the reality of what we are asked dancing right now? this is a teaching moment. maybe more of a learning moment. >> i think we have to build more, as mentioned. faculty programs that could be helpful for faculty to recognize what their students are going through in terms of the challenges of students in this very divided world. but also faculty and new student programs that can really help address issues of discrimination. i think those are really important. >> just a personal note, i became years ago friends with nation chapelle who is now deceased. the 405 named after him. last night i was thinking about what you would think about these hearings. he was a very frank human being. he came here with nothing and ended up being one of the wealthiest people in the united states. mr. lawrence, i was criticized a little bit because i quoted

justice brandeis in the opinion with justice holmes that defined the first amendment. could you talk about that a little bit? it is sort of odd to have people get mad at me for using a quote from justice brandeis and talking about the first amendment. >> i would not think one could get hurt quoting justice brandeis. he is a personal hero of mine and probably many in the room. he famously said that in the absence of insight into imminent lawless activity, the answer to bad speech is not enforced silence. it is more speech. i think he was right then and i think he is right today. >> thank you all. i yield back. >> thank you. mr. smucker, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, chairwoman. i would like to start my comments by addressing comments made during the ranking members opening statements.

there he criticized the majority for holding this hearing, and then talked about the civil rights movement and invoked martin luther king jr. talked about how he was once unpopular, but then moved public opinion. and i would just like to say that his life was defined by peaceful protest. and i think drawing any comparison between him and these un-american anti-semitic protesters is totally inappropriate, totally unacceptable, and i think the purpose of holding this hearing is to ensure that this anti- semitism never becomes accepted by americans. the anti-semitic behavior that we have seen on your college campuses is reprehensible, it's un-american, it's against our own policies. and in many cases, it is criminal. i am deeply concerned by the

fact that president schell and president holloway, you gave into protesters' demands at the expense of the rest of your hidden bodies. mr. holloway, you promised as part of giving in, to explore expanding rutgers relationship with the palestinian university. at least that is alleged. which included considering student exchange and study abroad programs. is that true? >> we already have a relationship with that university. >> they have buildings name to convicted terrorists. they have glorified terrorism and it's in official social media posts. hamas are the majority of the student government. eight students were arrested for planning terror attacks weeks before october 7th. as of 2014, they had an official policy of barring jewish students on campus. is this really an institution that rutgers should be partnering with? >> sir, we partner with institutions all around the world -- >> will you commit to ending the relationship with this university? >> the information you shared with me is new to me, sir and i

will commit to reviewing it. >> thank you. earlier this month, as i said, you gave into the demands of the mob on campus. you agree to eight of their 10 demands in a matter of days. however, you refuse to act on the request of rutgers jewish faculty administration and student group who asked that you provide a full accounting of anti-semitic incidents on campus and organizations that repeatedly violate the code of conduct, private petitions from taking political stances and a meeting campuswide on the jewish experience. why have you chosen to ignore this but appease hamas protesters? >> to your question specifically, the jewish faculty administration and staff organization the request is sent to us is being acted on

posthaste. >> will you commit today to fulfilling all the requests? >> heart of the plan for the summer, we have already drafted out our action plans addresses most of those concerns, sir. most of those concerns. >> will you commit to providing a full accounting of anti- semitic incidents on campus to them? >> we have been scrubbing around information to make sure we can get that information. >> so you will commit to doing that? >> we are doing that. >> will you commit to suspending students and student organizations that repeatedly violate the code of conduct? >> when students violate the code of conduct, they going to a process. the result could look like many different things. >> will you commit to suspending them if that happens? >> of the review committee deems that it merits suspension, yes, they will be suspended. >> will you commit to prohibiting academic

departments from taking political stances? >> this is something that we are reviewing, sir. i recognize that when departments make these kinds of -- i will call them blanket statements, on any topic, it's an assertion of speech, but also there is a chance to make it harder for members of the department -- >> will you commit to convening a standing university wide committee on anti-semitism and the jewish experience? >> we immediately responded to the request, creating a section committee in the new brunswick campus. we have several campuses. the summer, one of the things we are looking at is trying to figure out how to pull representatives from each of our campuses. >> it's taking a long time to respond to that. you have responded to the other immediately. will they need to threaten to disrupt exams for you to listen to them? >> no, sir. that will not be the case. we were acting in a state of emergency in the case of the encampment. with this group, i will absolutely say we could have responded more quickly and more

robustly. we will try to do better, sir. >> thank you, president holloway. >> thank you. you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, chairwoman. thank you all for being here. chancellor block, just for clarification, the video that we just watched, we saw people moving around. was it possible, do you think, for that student to be able to get into campus? was that student actually being blocked from entering campus? >> that was in the middle of campus. they are not being blocked from being on campus. maybe being blocked from the pathway. he should be allowed to pass. any part of campus is open to students. so blocking him was really inappropriate. >> i appreciate that. the recent images from ucla are appalling. what is more appalling is that

there was complete -- it was completely preventable. you could have prevented this by protecting the diverse groups of pro-palestinian students that were peacefully gathered on campus to share meals set in solidarity against the brutal genocide. you could have prevented this by protecting these students' first amendment right to assemble. you could have prevented this when you learned about rats being released into the encampment. you can have prevented this when there was an anonymous group funded and constructed a giant video with loudspeakers to play vile and disturbing footage. you could have prevented this when you saw an angry mob on campus on the night of april 30th, but you did not.

instead, you, the ucla leadership and law enforcement, stood by for hours as the mob of agitators gathered near the encampment with a clear intention to cause violence. and because of your inaction, they acted on the intention and brutally attacked students you are responsible for. this happened in front of your eyes, on your campus, and it was live streamed for the whole world to see. so i would like to know, if you were truly committed to keeping your students safe, how did you fail the students at many critical points where you could have intervened?

>> thank you for the question, but i'm sorry, i reject the premise. the students -- >> how do you reject the premise? are these pictures line? are any of these people in jail? >> and i finished my statement? >> no, are any of these people in jail? are any of these people arrested? >> lapd are working on trying to identify the people who were assailants that evening. we have committed to finding out the people who were involved. >> it's been over a month. i submit for the record an article that cnn has produced. >> without objection. >> why did you not immediately send the police that were standing by, your campus police, law enforcement, to intervene? >> we tried. we notified as soon as we saw the violence. we notified all of our mutual aid partners and tried to get police there as quickly as

possible. going back to my original point, this encampment was against policy. >> chancellor, chancellor, if i may, the footage from that night reveals that some of the most dramatic attacks were carried out by individuals not affiliated with ucla. not the university students, faculty that were arrested. why have the violent agitators, who you know have been identified, not been held accountable for assaulting over 150 of your students? you should be ashamed. in the fact that you failed your students. you should be ashamed for letting a peaceful protest gathering get hijacked by an angry mob. you should be ashamed for allowing such violence to take place on your campus, which will now be weapon honest by republicans in this committee. you played right into the hands

and laying the ground for attacking institutions of public education, stripping students of their rights, and broader repression of movements. i know that my time is up. i would like to submit these images into the record. >> without objection. >> and an open letter to the ucla community from the ucla jewish faculty and staff. >> thank you. mr. williams, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madame chairwoman. a question for each of the university leaders here. when students returned to campus in a few months, will there be new rules, policies, procedures and enforcement mechanisms in place to keep jewish students safe and welcome? >> all of our students, yes. all of our students, yes. >> same answer. >> thank you.

presidential, as in the new rules, policies, procedures and enforcement mechanisms will be informed and guided by the events of the last few months on your campus, is that correct? >> absolutely. >> thank you for that would mean your investigations are complete, is that correct? >> our investigations are ongoing. >> what you did not commit to that earlier, but you just committed to having policies, procedures, et cetera ready in time for the new school year. i assume that is based on your investigations. that makes sense to me. is that true? >> it is based on what we have learned about what has happened over the past year. and it is based on best practices. and it is based, i'm sure, on some investigation. investigations that have already taken place, but it is -- our investigations are an ongoing process. we will be getting violations presumably over time. we are not going to hold up. >> if i may, just to keep this

line of questioning, you know, when jewish students return this fall, will students and faculty, who have been found to have made violent threats to jewish students, will they be barred from campus this fall? this was your commitment to have the policies and procedures in place. can jewish students returning to your campus anticipate that the violators who have been found by your investigations be barred from campus? is that a fair assumption? >> there is a disciplinary process -- >> this is a straightforward question. >> know it isn't, actually. there is a disciplinary process. in the disciplinary process, we grant hearings and due process to the students, and we will give out the appropriate penalty. >> should they be suspended from campus? perhaps while the due process is being undertaken, perhaps to protect the jewish students, the parents sending them to your schools, perhaps then you

would commit that they are barred from campus, that they are suspended until the outcome of these investigations -- >> that's not how due process works. >> how about for you, mr. holloway? >> the same question, sir? >> yes. thank you. >> we are -- we have now graduated our class. so we are now in the process of shifting gears the summer planning. to do the work of exploring or policies and building plans -- >> i am talking about the specific violators that are being investigated for these heinous crimes. will they be at your campus when new students, jewish students, return in the fall, yes or no? you don't know? this is a question for each of you again. would you say that the emergence of encampments on your campus, was this a spontaneous event, or was it orchestrated and planned? president phil, did this

surprise you? >> it surprised me. >> mr. holloway? >> with about an hour's notice, it surprised me, as well. >> mr. block? >> i would say planned or copycat, but certainly a number of encampments went up very quickly. >> if i may, then who is behind these encampments? what are the groups, faculty groups, maybe which departments , student organizations, who is behind these encampments, in your opinion, specifically, groups on campus, mr. shell? >> i don't know. >> mr. holloway? >> have had a public university with a lot of outside organizations involved. i am unable to tell you which organizations. >> mr. block. >> i am uncertain.

>> this is absolutely shocking that you allowed these encampments to persist on your campus that you don't know who is behind them. you don't know what was there, but they are occupying and causing violence and chaos on your campus. that's astonishing admission to me. and probably disingenuous. to each of you acknowledge that giving guidance to campus police to refuse to take police reports of crimes could be a violation of the clay react? president schell, are you aware of that? >> i'm not aware of anyone -- >> are you aware that this is a violation of the clay react? >> i have not learned -- looked at the cleary act recently. >> if that happened at rutgers, that is news to me. >> mr. block, are you aware? >> i'm not a lawyer but i assume it's a violation. >> i yield back. >> thank you, madam chair and ranking member. thank you, witnesses for joining us today. in the past seven months, since anti-semitic incidents have spiked across the country, this committee has held five

hearings. roundtables similar to this, but sadly, sadly, we've not had a single hearing to actually consider the legislation to address this epidemic of hate. and we have bills that we could hear. like congresswoman kathy manning's bipartisan countering anti-semitism act, which i am a proud cosponsor of along with 45 of my colleagues. i will point out that this bill has an equal number of democrat and republican cosponsors. there is a bipartisan effort to actually adopt legislation to cover these issues. unfortunately, anti-semitism as we know is a form of hate also rampant in our politics. for example, the current republican nominee for governor of north carolina has

repeatedly made anti-semitic statements including downplaying the atrocities of the holocaust. madam chair, i would like unanimous consent to enter into the record the article from the times of israel titled trump backs gop candidate for north carolina governor accused of anti-semitic remarks. >> without objection. >> also just last week, the minnesota republican party endorsed a candidate for the u.s. senate who once self identified as an anti-semite. madam chair, i would like unanimous content to enter into the record the times of israel article on the podcast or who railed against jews wins republican nomination in minnesota. >> without objection. >> these are not isolated incidences. they followed the disturbing trend of the far right that embraces anti-semitic and conspiracies like the great replacement theory. just monday afternoon, there was a video posted on former

president donald trump's site that features images of hypothetical newspaper articles celebrating a 2024 victory for him and referring to the creation of a unified right,", under the headline what's next for america? this committee has the authority over something that's really important and key for combating hate across america. and that is education. because we know that education is one of the great methods of bringing people together and having students, americans, all people start to understand. religions, people, viewpoints that are different from their own, to understand the history of anti-semitism that has plagued not only this country, but our world for centuries

upon centuries. to understand the history. to understand that it must be treated with the care and attention that it deserves. unfortunately, i don't think that hearing after hearing for simply addressing sad and disturbing incidents, but not addressing legislation to combat them is what our nation needs at this time. once again, i call on the committee to hold a hearing on the legislation to actually address anti-semitism, like the combating anti-semitism act and with that, i yield back. thank you very much, madam chair. >> thank you. mr. grossman, you are recognized for five minutes. >> first of all, just a bit of a comment on some of these agreements that have been entered into.

when we do these hearings, we are given something called a prehearing memorandum. in the prehearing memorandum, it mentions in one sentence johns hopkins university, harvard university and the university of wisconsin, milwaukee. if you told the university at milwaukee year ago that they would appear in the same sentence as harvard and johns hopkins, they would have been quite elated. i will point out that it was not such a great honor to be put in with those two institutions. in any event, i will talk to mr. holloway. and your agreement with the rutgers encampment, he promised to, quote, implement support for displaced palestinian students to finish their education at rutgers. you acknowledge, or will you admit that setting aside 10 spaces at rutgers for palestinians, have you.

to stop them causing trouble and just being awful would be a violation and a discrimination law? did you consider that? >> supporting refugee students is a violation of antidiscrimination law? >> you set aside 10 spaces -- >> i understand, i understand. we have existing programs to support refugee students and scholars. we would lean on those programs. we absolutely don't believe in quotas, sir. >> do you see a problem here? first of all on this whole gaza situation, the palestinians could not have taken a more outlandish position. secondly, it appears as in response for the trouble that they're having and encouraging, the little ethnic group here is rewarded here with 10 spaces and i'm sure there's all sorts

of foreigners around the world who would be happy to grab those 10 spaces. you think that was a wise thing to do or do you think that something you maybe ought to revoke or rethink? >> are you speaking specifically about the number 10, sir? is that we are asking? >> yeah. it could be 15, it could be 5, whatever. it appears as if you are getting palestinian students support that perhaps you are not giving other students, and it appears like you are doing it as a reward or whatever for participating in this demonstration. in support of hamas. >> i understand your question. i think it is a mischaracterization, but to your specific point about the 10 students we have existing programs already that allow refugee students. getting to the threshold numbers in this case, 10, is a tremendous amount of work. and may not happen, sir. >> you understand there are only so many slots in the university. i don't know what's going on in

new jersey. could not have given the slots to people in new jersey if you wanted to increase the diversity of your program. i'm sure there are many legitimate countries around the world in which students would be happy to come here. i guess the thing that bothers me is first of all, you are violating the federal discrimination law and secondly, you feel compelled to reward the palestinians who were causing a disruption and not to mention appear to be siding with an ideology that is completely offensive, but they get a reward. >> to the various points you put in there, sir, rutgers is one of the most diverse campuses , universities in the country. >> is a good question. i hate to cut you off but i've only got five minutes. you said it's a diverse campus. part of the problem of this whole thing is a lack of diversity in campuses. right now this country is about 50/50 republican, democrat, conservative, liberal or whatever. you think your camp is about 50-

50 or 60/40? is it diverse like that? >> sir. i don't know. we don't have political testimony. >> you have no clue? when i talked to my local professors, they can give me scare stories about the infinitesimal number of conservative students. okay. i will go on here. to the gentleman from northwestern. it appears to me as though you've also entered into some sort of agreement in response to the troublemakers, giving them -- and you're going to support visiting palestinian faculty and students at risk. so in other words, you also have responded to these protests and obviously anti- somatic protests or anti-israel protests by rewarding a subgroup here with special

treatment. do you regret that or do you think that's inappropriate? >> this is an existing program. it is not something new. we have an existing program that has served ukraine, afghanistan, other countries. >> the university will support visiting palestinian faculty. that's what it says here. well, thanks for cutting me off. >> mr. scott. no? mr. burlison, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you. i have a video i want to start with. i have a video. >> you get them right, you win $100. first question, have you chanted from the river to the sea? >> yes. >> wood river, which the? >> the sea of -- >> see you don't know. >> the answer was the

mediterranean in the jordan. what does hamas say the number one goal is according to the charter? >> they want to free palestine. >> it's to murder all jews are in the world. >> you know what that means? but you have chanted it? >> no. >> it's like a global call to murder jews. did you know you said that? >> no. >> would you say it again? >> probably not. >> how much of the donated bikes the answer is over 6 billion. how many gaza refugees have the arab neighboring countries leading in the last few months? >> 35,000. >> the answer is zero. you ask education major, students don't seem to know what they stand for. wouldn't it be great if these colleges actually taught them something? >> after seeing that -- it's honestly comical, but it's not comical, the outcome of that. that ignorance is not comical. i'm concerned for our young people. and it concerns me what they are not learning.

and their willingness to participate in hate. there's an article that came out from fortune. i'd like to submit that to the record. >> without objection. >> that talks about a survey of hr experts. there is definitely a culture of -- within the hiring, within small businesses, who are choosing not to hire from universities that have protests on them, which is unfortunate for students who don't participate in the protests. are you -- you can each answer this. are you concerned about the business communities, the private sector community, the employers that are hiring your students? are you concerned? do you have any communications with those businesses? >> i have not had a communications from businesses who have said they are not going to hire northwestern

students. but i will say and it's not directly on point, you are absolutely right. we need to educate students. the ignorant that you saw in that video that you displayed is part of the problem. and it's something that we, and i'm sure all of us agree we need to be better at. >> thank you. >> the video is shocking and depressing. and i absolutely believe that we all need to do a better job in k-12 education and higher education, making sure we have more, better informed students. frankly better informed citizens. the -- i'm sorry -- as far as -- >> but you can see why employers -- everyone has seen his videos. you can see why employers would say i'm not hiring from that school. >> i do understand that. you asked the question

specifically on that issue. we have a very large career services program, and i know they work diligently to prepare our students to be ready to be hired and not look like the students on the video, sir. >> mr. bloch or chancellor block. >> more education. i was surprised. we need to better educate our students and some of these areas. we do have a task force actually that is looking directly at this issue. >> it was asked earlier and i want to give a second chance to answer this. the question was do you believe that israel is a genocidal state? because that's the propaganda. so i will ask. i will begin with you, mr. shell. you believe that israel is a genocidal state? >> no, i do not. >> mr. holloway? >> i do not. >> chancellor block? >> i do not. >> it's not. okay, thank you. would you acknowledge that from the river and to the sea and

that other phrases are anti- semitic calls for the destruction of israel and the slaughter of jews? mr. shell? >> i believe over time, the statements have become dog whistles for anti-semitism. >> mr. holloway. >> i think anytime that phrasing is used to incite violence and threaten and harass is a violation of conduct and is anti-semitic. >> chancellor block? >> i also think they are anti- semitic. although the survey shows many people do not. >> yes or no. it's not just anti-semitic. it's dangerous? yes or no? >> potentially yes. >> i agree. >> potentially. >> thank you. >> you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chair. this has to be a record for rate

-- racists protest thriving at universities in the post-jim crow america. seriously. a lot of the schools now feel like they're being riled up at george wallace. the target this time not being black americans the jewish americans. before us today are leaders of universities with rampant anti- semitism. madam chair, these witnesses have countless academic accolades. yet, i'm sorry, the ignorance of their actions is on the same level as other schools. do you three think you operate in a vacuum? every jew at home and abroad is raised with stories of the holocaust and how it could happen again. now we are drowning in the same cultural rot which led up to the most horrific genocide in human history. the world knew what was

happening to jews in occupied europe, but why didn't they care? there was a culture of indifference and hatred towards jews. culture drives everything. the world is now being directly influenced by the culture of hatred on american campuses . your campuses. mr. seale, dr. holloway, dr. block, evil does not rear its cowardly head unless given permission. through an unwillingness to successfully and these protests, you have given permission to the evil we are witnessing. according to the anti- defamation league, this past year was the worst year for anti-semitic incidences since adl began recording more than four decades ago. there was a total of 8873 incidents reported across the united states in 2023. an increase of 140% compared to 2022, which was also a record- setting year. this is an average of 24 incidents per day, one per hour. 922 of these incidents took place on college and university

campuses. a 321% increase. through your incompetence, this evil is growing stronger throughout the world. as university students around the world are copying what they see so easily thrives in american campuses. in no uncertain terms, you and counterparts across the nation are directly responsible for the dangers that jews across the world now face. chancellor block, the encampment at ucla included messaging in arabic reading burn tel aviv. peaceful protests are protected by the first amendment and our vital expressions of democracy. this is an explicit glorification and endorsement of a u.s. designated terrorist group which massacred 1200 innocent israeli civilians on october 7th. is this language acceptable at ucla? >> this language is unacceptable. i'm unaware of that and the encampment of course, has been removed. >> what will be the

consequences for racists calling for genocide? >> student disciplinary processes if there are complaints and they can identify the student through a disciplinary process. >> anything less than suspension in my opinion is insufficient. madam chair, i would like to submit adl's report card of ucla into the record. >> without objection. >> ucla received a d. i hope you will review the metrics and carefully do a better job moving forward. president schill, you up for date -- updated the codes of conduct in anticipation of encampments in various campuses and of colleges across the country? yet, you failed to enforce the codes of conduct, providing a false legitimacy to the encampment and its actions. it's also true that you set explicitly on the day the encampment started that any violation of the code of conduct for university policies could lead to disciplinary action such as suspension or expulsion, and possibly

criminal sanctions. the encampment has clearly violated both the code of conduct and policies. what is the point of having rules if they do not matter? let me ask -- and i know you have given dr. fox an answer, but let's run it back. exactly how many citations have northwestern university issued to student and nonstudent participants? >> i don't have the exact figure. >> got it. >> using camron smith is a lot of the the summer but they will likely return. the lessons your students are taking away is that this is an acceptable form of protest even if they are in violation of university policies. that may even lead to concessions by their universities. this is a failure, and yours alone. to everyone that will see this, at -- i ask that you visit the holocaust museum in d.c. kneel down and touch the stones that paved the grounds of auschwitz. peer over the photos of murdered jews and be reminded of the silence of death.

silence of global culture of hatred. i would remind you of who you are. you are leaders of culture. at this present moment, you have abandoned that role. i hope you reclaim it because we will certainly be watching. and with that, madam chair, i yield back. >> the chairwoman's time has expired. mr. scott, you are recognized for five minutes. >> thank you, madam chair. i would like to ask the university residence for the first question that you are asked at the premise was something along the lines of insofar as your campuses are hotbeds of anti-semitism, how many people of you disciplined? and you went on to just answer how many people you disciplined without questioning whether or not your campuses were in fact hotbeds of anti-semitism.

or are your campuses also beds of racism, homophobia, and islamophobia? dr. she'll. >> i would not say we are hotbeds of any of those things. i do believe that we have a problem like all universities. and it's becoming more and more apparent that anti-semitism is a problem on campus, and it's one that we need to deal with. the vast majority -- >> i've got a lot of different questions, so let me just get an answer from president holloway. >> i certainly disagree with the characterization of records being a hotbed of anti- semitism. we do everything we can to promote the security and safety of all of our students and have a community of care. >> i believe the same. i do not believe we are a hotbed of anti-semitism. we have had incidents that are

disturbing that we are trying to address. >> you let the premise go by and did not address it. i did not want that to be the record of the hearing. does your code of conduct -- is your code of student conduct based on whether or not the conduct involves anti-semitism or islamophobia, racism, homophobia or other gender- based hatred? >> we treated of -- each of those equally. >> we are in the same space, sir. >> same here. >> okay. can you develop a campus free of anti-semitism that does not address other forms of hate? >> hate is hate and we need to address all of it. >> president holloway. >> the kind of work you are talking about is the ongoing work of the university, addressing hate in all of its forms. >> chancellor block. >> same here. we have initiatives specifically to look at different types of group 80. >> okay. and i say that because this is indicated in alert remarks and multiple hearings just on anti-

semitism. but under title vi, there are other forms of hate. if you will have a campus free of hate, it seems to me difficult to do that just looking at one form. president shall, the question was raised about qatar. i'm aware of another university i used to represent before redistricting that has a campus in qatar. what is the value of having university located in qatar? >> it provides benefits to faculty and students who want to go back and forth. i believe this was decided 17 years ago. i'm only there for two years. i believe part of the point was to introduce american concepts of journalism, free speech, and to provide journalism and avenues for women to be more successful in those societies.

i think those were the reasons. >> thank you. mr. lawrence. can you remind us how you can balance free speech and protests? >> mr. ranking member, you've begun with a presumption that speech including protest is protected that is the core of the first amendment with respect to public universities but the principles of academic freedom and free expression on private university campuses, as well. were that runs out is where the activity turns into threats of violence, harassment, or undue disruptions of the operations of the university. those are the kinds of decisions that university presidents around the country are making on a daily basis, taking all of the factors into account that they have to deal with. >> thank you. i just have a few seconds left. are there any additional steps that this committee could actually do to help promote enforcement of title vi?

lawrence? >> i think the committee could play a major role in working with and funding the department of education in that regard and in all the ways in which the department of education facilitates the work of universities around the country and all of the issues we have been talking about, and a range of other issues including mental health issues that are major challenges for colleges and universities today. >> thank you. thank you. that was all. >> thank you, mr. scott, for being right on time. >> i try. >> you and i are trying to be good role models. mr. keller, i will recognize you now for a closing statement. >> i would ask unanimous consent to enter the following items into the record. the letter from professor and former attorney general of new jersey stating that he finds accusations of pervasive climate of anti-semitism and records to be both inaccurate

and offensive. a letter from over 500 law school professors condemning the committee's accusations against the rutgers law center for security, race and rights. a letter published in the daily northwestern on may 2nd of faculty members commending the president from northwestern for coming to a peaceful resolution involving the encampment. an article from may 15th chicago times entitled northwestern and it it's encampment without cops or violence. why is congress upset? a letter from northwestern american association of university professors, executive committee letter to representative fox and members of the committee in support of president she'll. and from the l.a. times, entitled after violent night at ucla, classes

canceled, you see president launches investigation into response documenting the organized attack on the ucla encampment the night of april 30th. a joint statement from unions representing educators at rutgers northwestern and ucla. a letter from the national coalition against interest to decrying the may 14th letter from the chair of the oversight committee to the treasury secretary ellen, and an article from boise state university's office of student life, 5.5 things you may not know about martin luther king which includes the fact that the king center, that dr. king went to jail 29 times. but pointed out his protests were nonviolent. but usually against the law. part of the nonviolent strategies that you not only break the law, but you accept

the consequences. unanimous consent for those. >> that's the end of the list. without objection. >> thank you. i want to thank our witnesses for participating. without a doubt, there is more we can do to enter -- combat anti-semitism not only on college campuses but everywhere. no one should be intimidated, harassed or assaulted simply for they are or who they worship. it has been noted that students cannot learn if they feel threatened. today for the fifth time in six months, the majority is holding another hearing just to complain about anti-semitism without providing a meaningful solution to address animus on college campuses or any of the other forms of hatred. so it was great to have an opportunity to hear from our campus leaders about what they are doing to proactively prevent incidences of violence and harassment.. our leaders and students

deserve more. we have the responsibility to criticize, the discrimination, whenever we see it, even if it comes from one's own party. students deserve solutions, thoughtful and deliberate constitute -- questions about the constitutional deliberations before us, which would mean the difference between free speech and violating criminal code title vi and our campus policies. >> thank you, mr. stop -- scott. we do agree that students cannot learn when they feel threatened. we should see that students that do feel threatened are believed that fear. one of congress's

constitutional powers is to conduct investigations. these are an important mechanism for transparency, ringing bad things to light, informing new legislation to address the problems they uncover, and yielding accountability. today's testimony certainly brought things to light beyond the craven deals and shocking inaction we already knew about. president she'll, we've heard accounts of violence and harassment against jewish students on your campus, but you admitted you have not suspended a single student since october 7 for anti- semitic conduct. moreover, i'm appalled by the condescension and contempt you have shown for the committee and towards your own jewish students today. you have refused to answer basic questions on topics. this includes on your decision to appoint anti-semites,

including one who supported the october 7 attack, to your anti- semitism advisory committee and whether you will terminate faculty and staff who fought with police. you have given misleading answers that contradict the words of the agreement that you signed. over a month ago the committee sent you a document, a document request detailing pages of horrifying anti-semitic incidents. that was before the anti- semitic pro-terror encampment. you have only suspended four student since october 7. the center for security, race and rights uses taxpayer dollars to engage in political advocacy, promote terrorism, and delegitimize israel. just this week it was revealed that one of the advisory board members of the center was posting videos of hamas murdering israeli soldiers on

instagram with words of praise. if you are unwilling to close and defund the cecil -- cesspool of hate the state of new jersey should. chancellor block, we saw horrifying footage of encampment members setting up illegal checkpoints denying jewish students access to central parts of campus and accounts of assault, harassment, threats and intimidation. you stood by and let this happen. today's hearing is the beginning , not the end, of the investigation of your institutions. you will be held accountable for your record. congress will not stand by while you violate your obligation to uphold title vi of the civil rights act. you failed to protect jewish students.

cut deals advancing divestment and promote terrorism and radical anti-semitic ideology. there being no further business to come before the committee the committee stands adjourned.

>> get information from members of government right in the palm of your hand when you order your copy of the 2024 congressional directory with bio and contact information for every house and senate member of the 118th congress. important information on committees, cabinet, federal agencies and state governors.

the congressional directory cost $32.95 plus shipping and handling. every purchase help support nonprofit operations. scan the code on the right or go to c-span.org. order your copy today. >> c-span campaign 2024 coverage continues with the three-day libertarian national convention as they choose nominees for president and vice president beginning friday. highlights include independent presidential candidate robert f kennedy junior followed by a vice presidential debate featuring former contender vivek ramaswamy. then former president and republican nominee donald trump is speaking to the delegates. . then the party will announce its nominee for the november election. the libertarian national convention friday at 3:30 on c-

span. >> c-span is your unfiltered view of government. we are funded by these television companies and more. >> we believe that you should have access to fast, reliable internet. we are leading the way taking you to 10 g. >> investigative journalist cheryl atkinson and former correspondent catherine herridge were among witnesses testifying before lawmakers regarding the importance of a free press and what congress

can do