thanks, everyone. have a good afternoon and i will see you on thursday. >> saturdays, american history tv features historic convention speeches, watch notable remarks by presidential nominees and other figures over the last several decades. jesse jackson calls for party unity after losing the 1988 democratic esidential nomination to governor michael dukakis. when we are divided, we cannot win. we find common ground is the basis of survival, development and change and growth. >> watch historic convention speeches saturday at 7:00 p.m. eastern on american history tv. watch c-span's live campaign coverage of the 2020 fourth democratic national convention

august 19th through the 22nd. watch the republican national convention anytime on our website. every saturday, american history tv documents american story, the latest of nonfiction books and authors. these television companies and more including spark life. as e most divisive perhaps one of the most divisive elections in our nation's history was the election hundred president as many of you know, one of the most divisive elections in our nations history was the election of 1800. president john adams ultimately

lost to vice president thomas jefferson. and while the transfer of power was ultimately peaceful, adams did forgo his successor's inauguration. i think that has also happened another time or two, but i won't bring that up. and those two men remained at odds for many, many years. it was only later during their retirement that they actually rekindled their friendship, discussing many different topics in their correspondence, including the topic of death. adams actually wrote to jefferson in 1822 these words. quote, i answer your question is death an evil? it is not an evil. it is a blessing to the

individual, and to the world. yet, we ought not to wish for it until life becomes supportable. he was 86 years old when he wrote this note. perhaps adams had become comfortable with the idea of leaving the world. but it was four years later that both men, adams, and jefferson, passed away on the same exact day. july 4th, 1826. and while he was not present when his father died, john quincy adams later recorded his father's last words. three very portland words. thomas jefferson survives. he had no way of knowing that thomas jefferson had died on the very same day.

as americans gathered across the country to honor the anniversary of the declaration of independence, news of adams and jefferson's passing had spread. and what had begun as a month of celebration was now one of mourning and commemoration. as the citizens began to listen to eulogies, speeches and tributes in churches, government buildings and in public spaces. while jefferson and adams had their own opinions on how they should be remembered, it would be up to those living in 1826 and successive generations, even up to now, to define and shape their memory. presidential sites such as yours are frequently called to discuss the legacies of people who have held the highest office in our country, and one very important way, one iconic

way is we know these men will eventually die. that is how that death is marked and remember that becomes very important. our next panel will provide wonderful and different perspectives on that process. one of the panelists has actually planned a presidential funeral. one is a historian. and another overseas the presidential site defined by tragedy. these three will give greater insight into how these rituals and how these events changed over time, and how we can use moments like this to better understand the relationship between the american people and the president of the united states. as well as how presidential morning at any given time can reflect different elements of american society, politics and culture. our moderator for this session

is john hi bush, executive director of the ronald reagan presidential foundation and institute. before introduce the other panelists, i want to take a moment of personal privilege here and recognize john's 12 years of transformational leadership at the reagan foundation. i have the privilege of working for and with john for several years while planning the reagan centennial. he was a great friend, a great leader and certainly has been extraordinary in transforming the work of the reagan foundation and preserving and continuing to advance the legacy of the 40th president of the united states, so congratulations, john. joining john on stage are my friends jean becker, former chief of staff to president george h.w. bush and first lady barbara

bush. lewis picone, historian and board trustee for the cleveland birthplace memorial association, and author of grant's tomb. the epic death of ulysses s grant in making an american pantheon. and the director of the sixth floor museum at daley plaza. thank you for welcoming so many of our guests the other day to your wonderful museum. please welcome us and our panel as we continue the mornings program. rk. in the past both at >> thank you rso much, stuart. as stuart mentioned, he and i have had the chance to work together in the past, both at the red cross and stuart was absolutely ahead of the reagan centennial in 2011, saved me

from one disaster after another. or at the lake -- reagan library. wonderful to be here with you all this morning. i had little trepidation when stuart told me that what he wanted me to discuss with our panelists is death, destruction and tragedy, and i thought okay. this will be quite a challenge, but when i saw who our panelists were that you'll be hearing from this morning, it's really -- this is -- i think you're going to learn a lot. you will find this to be a real pleasure, even though the subject is a difficult subject for all americans. you will learn more about that in just a moment. i did a little bit of homework. i'm not a good mathematician, but i delved into some of the documents at the white house

association that were pulled together on this very topic of residential funerals and assassinations, morning and the like. and you know, today, we have six living presidents, including our current president in the white house. 32 have died outside of the white house of various natural causes. eight presidents have died while in office. four of those assassinated. as you can imagine, depending on the circumstances, very different situations with respect to america and morning, depending on the particular president. these experts have studied just about every one of them, so when we get to the q&a portion, have your questions ready. think we know today that americans are having quite a lot of difficulty unifying and

coming together on just about anything. when you experience another plan, when you've studied the death of a united states president, we find some of these very rare moments where americans actually come together as a people to mourn. whether it be the incredible shock of an assassination of a president, or the natural passing of a president, the morning is there. i read in one of the papers and talked about how the quote is no greater shock for the country than the passing of a president. and i remember that, you know, for example, probably i am one of the elder statesman here

today. i remember the passing of john f. kennedy. i was just a mere 5 years old. it was the very first memory i have as a young boy here and i remember i was living in arlington, virginia and i heard this thunderous noise outside of our home and i ran out into our backyard. and overhead were the jets that were flying with the missing man formation, moving away across the skyline of washington, d.c. then i ran downstairs to the big black-and- white television set to see those very same jets on television. my very first memory, a memory i will not forget. i thought a lot about it as i was studying up on our panelists. what you will find is that presidential funerals, presidential morning is all

about processions. the lying in state. riderless horses. teams of six white horses. in the modern day, television roadblock coverage across all of the networks. presidential library burials. i would like to start with a show of hands, can everyone who has fully planned and executed and involved a presidential funeral, please raise your hand. >> you're setting me up. >> i am. now everyone who has been to a presidential funeral or has watched one on tv, raise your hand. okay, there's a lot more of the second than the first. so i would like to start off by talking with someone who has done it all.

jean becker. jean, take us behind the scenes of what it's like to plan and involve yourself in a full- blown modern-day presidential funeral. >> it is complete chaos. and what you see on tv, i hope, looked really organized and very together. it is chaos. it's a process that goes on years and years, and i decided the best way to answer your question, i'm not here to promote my book but my editor would want me to show this. the last chapter is called the long journey home. and i'm just going to read something that i put in the book. talking about planning the funeral before president bush died.

one day in maine when i had worked all day on the funeral, i came home to houseguests who are ready to do something fun for the evening. i was exhausted and a little frustrated at some of the problems that i knew i had to solve. all i wanted to do was drink a bottle of wine and collapse. one of my friends was not amused, and with major attitude, she said i don't understand what the big deal is. you've been planning this funeral for years. how is it that you are not done yet? what is the big deal? my answer, i had a lot of attitude, just imagine you are in charge of the event that will take place over six days in three, maybe four, if you had died in maine, it would have been four different cities and involves a cast of thousands including presidents and queens, kings, members of a very large family that love all of the united states need to be moved from where they lived to houston, to washington, back to

houston, to college station and back to their homes. all of which will be carried live on television morning, noon and night for six days. and you have no idea what is going to happen.. when it does happen, you have about 48 hours before it all begins to pull it all together before the show begins live on television for the next six days. you won't sleep, you will not eat. you will not really think. you just do. my friend never asked that question again. so it's just one of the dumbest fights that i ever had was with the man in charge of the super bowl in houston, and we literally had a fight about whose job was harder. i said you know when the super

bowl ends. and he said, and i know you're going to agree with me, he says but i don't know the teams until two weeks out. you know who's going to die. i said, seriously? >> we had a close personal friend, joanne who works at the library. one of the first things she showed to me when i took on this job was a three ring binder. and i think stewart had seen this, about this thick, about 6 inches thick and it was the planning. it was the plans that the staff put together for president reagan's funeral. so i know of what jean talks about, and misses reagan's was just as thick. >> can add quickly that after president reagan died, after ford died, after nancy reagan died, all joanne wrote, long

memos to me, president ford, the man in charge of his funeral, a man named greg willard wrote me a long memo. they became my bible of how to do a funeral. it saved my life. and i did the same for the chief of staff of president bush 43, obama, clinton and carter. i wrote this long memo of what went right and what went wrong and we can talk about later some of those big challenges, but those memos saved my life. >> in a moment, we will talk about the sharing of those memos, but this is one of those. the best laid plans of mice and men. i want to hold up a photo and ask jean to comment. here we go. best laid plans. sometimes there are surprises, big surprises that might occur in unexpected moments in presidential funerals. here is one. >> this was one of the best unexpected moments of president

bush's funeral. many of you will remember th president bush and bob dole were big political rivals. they had a very nasty 1988 republican primary contest. and both said some things that they probably wish they had not said. they became huge friends. and when senator dole, this is when the president was lying in state at the rotunda and he insisted on standing. and saluting the casket. he is in a wheelchair now. and i had an opportunity to ask him why he did this, why he insisted on standing, and i can't tell you the answer without crying. he said i had to stand and salute that great man. this was one of the big pictures of the funeral that went viral. it was such a wonderful moment.

>> why so much spectacle? everyone passes at some time or another. but why in the pomp and circumstance, what is the history behind it? >> it's a good question because it is something that has built up over time. jean is hinting that going into six days of the funeral with the very first presidential funeral in 1979. george washington in his will asked for no funeral arrangement. he did not want any funeral. one of the reason i surmise is washington had a strong sense of republican virtue. and that in america, our leaders were citizens first and we were much different. he had asked for no funeral.

washington was a freemason, so the freemason will ask martha if they can hold a modest general for him and they did. i think there is an image of the funeral. it was just a couple of hundred marchers that were in the funeral. where he died and was interred at mount vernon. the funeral did set some precedents that are still in practice today. the military flourishes, the 21 gun salute. the riderless horse that we still see today. over time with advances in technology and as the country grew, funerals began to become more elaborate. harris being the first president to die in office in washington, d.c., a funeral procession might resemble what

we see today with hundreds of marchers that march from the white house to congressional cemetery. over time, with advances in technology like the train, involving -- the embalming with abraham lincoln where they can be these more elaborated elongated ceremonies before the president was interred. still these modest funerals would be in practice until the 1900s. the first funeral was barely one hour in princeton, new jersey. extremely modest. in 1932, just several hundred

guests attended the funeral in northampton, massachusetts. after that, we see where franklin roosevelt died in office in 1945 and there was this major event. no one expected him to die. that leads us to john f. kennedy, the next president to die. after john f. kennedy also died is when they started to do this preplanning of funerals. that grew over time. the modern-day state general started after kennedy. herbert hoover's was the first one that had the preplanning that had gone into it. >> as we both pointed to the planned element of it, okay, you don't know when it's going

to happen. my gosh, oh john f. kennedy, you really really don't know when it's going to occur. yet the funeral still needs to take place and relatively quickly. so if you could talk about this fabulous museum here in dallas, the sixth floor museum. a great deal of it covers draft's funeral. how are they able to do that? >> the last thing they expected when they made their visit to texas into dallas was to have the four days in november the national funeral uniting the world. the funeral procession with great detail did she plan that and with enormous grace and support from her team. but the museum really chronicles the assassination

and addresses those chaotic days leading up to the assassination of the aftermath and how every nation in the world more and and why there are still questions today. >> i remember at the time because i grew up and i found a book on our shelf at home called the torch is passed. a famous book about the jfk funeral. i remember leafing through it and seeing these iconic images of the funeral. i thought i would pull an up. tell us about this moment. spin one of the strengths of our collection is that we've been given, donated some of wonderful images and films and home movies by innocent bystanders. this was taken by dr. thomas mcconnell, who actually was a doctor at parkland hospital before and after the assassination. she was documenting this

tragic, very sad moment of mrs. kennedy coming out with the children just before little john john raised his hand in salute. we have a lot of materials that we have not been able to put on display. just wanting to express powerful memories. not necessarily thinking their stories are important, but adds texture and dimension to the stories we were able to do through programming. >> i will use the word tourist site. whether we are dealing with ford lincoln assassination, or your own exhibit, tell me how to the museums and exhibits deal with an assassination when you're rubbing up against something so extremely delicate, and how does a community come together and decide it is time for us to

commemorate this, does it take a long while? does it happen instantly? >> it takes a very long time. on the day of the investigation, the grassy knoll became an instant memorial site. the city was overwhelmed with mourners coming to try to understand what had happened. story has been a long journey, one of great struggle over the decades. obviously, the assassination took place in 1963. the six floor museum did not open until 1989. in 1993, it was designated as a national landmark historic district. the museum opened after at least a decade of struggles, trying to figure out what to do with that building. the county saved the building and turned it into administrative offices through the first and fifth floors. the six floor was left vacant, and a wonderful lady who ended

up becoming our fairy godmother was the chair of the dallas county historical commission and she along with the civic leaders lobbied throughout dallas to gain support to create an exhibit, to explain to the world the events that led up to the assassination. we had to find a way to address all of the people that were flooding into daily plaza, trying to find meaning in this piece of tragic history. >> gene, i did not figure this out until i went to reagan, but it's on the tip of your tongue. how do you approach a president to say listen, it's time to start talking about your death. we got to get on with this thing. how soon will a president engage in this vista kid planning effort, in this

delicate moment? >> again, and so many ways, i have the best job in america being george bush's chief of staff. he loved talking about his funeral. first of all, to answer part of your question, i think this is because of the assassination of kennedy. you have your first funeral meeting in the white house when you are president. i was obviously not part of that meeting, but i know that they make sitting presidents at least do some kind of outline of a funeral and casey dies in office. so, when i became chief of staff, i inherited a very small boulder -- folder of plans, and by that time we were done, after he turned may be 80, when sierra said we need to talk about your funeral. and he's like oh, good. and i know it's really odd.

the other thing he did is every presidential funeral, he attended, he changed his mind about something. after president nixon's is when he decided to be buried in his library. he and mrs. bush were going to be buried in maine. after president reagan, he decided he did not want a riderless horse. he thought it was too dramatic. after president ford's, he wanted all the same music. my two favorite phone calls was brent and henry kissinger after president ford's. this is never the 80 or older should be honorary pallbearers because they were exhausted, cold and hungry. i told president bush and you know what we did? his honorary pallbearers were the captains of the u.s. as george h.w. bush. we kicked out all the old people. my other favorite was the 43rd president of the united states

who called me immediately after john mccain's funeral. everyone at the funeral talked to long except for me. no one talks more than 10 minutes, 10 minutes, you got it? i'm like yes, sir. but president bush, is it time to talk about the train? >> we will get to that. >> we will save the train for later. so he enjoyed talking about the funeral. and this story is a little bizarre, but even the national media has to get really organized, because they also had to hit the ground running. the networks divide up who will be the camera for the big events. fox news was the pool camera at the gravesite. they called and wanted permission to advance. we ended up closing it to the media. the burial turned out to be 100% private. for a while, it was going to be a pool camera.

i told president bush as an fyi, you're not going to believe this, but fox news is advancing your gravesite at the library today. he says, i have an idea. he says i'm going to go and when they get out there, i'm going to be laying on top of the grave with my arms crossed like i'm dead. i said no. you're not doing that. >> i told you this would not be all about morning. lewis, how is it that in america, the death of a president drives ever so briefly, and i want to know why so briefly, these moments of national reconciliation? >> well, a president is one person who unites everyone. we all vote for the president. the president represents everyone. so i presidential funeral is traditionally when the nation is divided, is something that

unites us. throughout history, there have been periods of reconciliation, some briefly, some more permanent that have come out of it. where the presidential funeral has been the catalyst. one a brief examples, going back to washington's funeral where the country was becoming divided over the formation of political parties. and george washington's funeral briefly brought together the federalist and the democratic republicans to mourn together, but ultimately, political forces were at play that were bigger than george washington's death. a couple of successful examples of how presidential funerals and presidential deaths have really been catalyst for change, one being after james garfield had died, when he was assassinated, and one of the reasons of the dividing issues

at the time was over civil service reform. and the spoils party. out of that assassination, shortly after the pendleton act was signed and civil service reform against to take shape, perhaps one of the most potent examples of reconciliation being spawned by a presidential death and funeral is ulysses s grant's. because grant had died 20 years after the civil war, so a generation after the civil war, when the country is still greatly divided, north and south. but grant was perhaps the one individual that was beloved north and south of the mason dixon line. and dying a generation after the civil war, the nation was really ready for reconciliation. he was really the perfect man at almost the perfect time to

bring about some of that reconciliation, and during his funeral, there's confederate marchers, merchant predominately with union, but also confederate marchers. there are two former confederate generals and pallbearers at his funeral. his tomb, which comes 12 years later in 1897, really becomes a place where all sections of society come to mourn and pay respects at the same location. there's no and south of the border. white americans, african- americans, men and women, democrats and republicans. he is really the one man, and this becomes perhaps the one place that can really bring about this reunification. we know the history of reunification, that it was

largely also the reunification of the north and south, also built upon african-americans in the south losing their civil rights. unfortunately, that is a very important part of the story, too. grant's funeral was a point that really began to reform the united states of america. that had still been greatly divided in 1885. >> back to assassinations, fortunately, the exhibit at the reagan library portrays what was an attempted assassination. but in jfk's case, and actual assassination, and death of the president. how do you go about determining what artifacts, what objects involving and assassination are

appropriate for public display? i'm sure that must be a difficult situation. >> i will say that john hinckley, who attempted to assassinate president reagan actually lived in dallas. that was another shock for dallas that has really still been reeling from the effects of being the city where the president lost his life. president kennedy's assassination happened at the dawn of television and satellite broadcasting, so the news ricocheted all around the world. and there's been an outpouring of interest all across the world since the assassination in finding out what happened, so people come to dallas trying to seek meaning. the careful crafting of the original exhibit, john f. kennedy and the memory of a nation was designed to reach people who had lived through this traumatic time. the idea was not that this was a museum or a memorial.

this was an exhibit that would help put into context historical context events that happened. 3r , historical context, the events that happened to allow m those people to find their own solace and reflect. they had no idea that 33 years later, that there would be a . sixth floor museum at dealey plaza that is an accredited museum and also holding 90,000 artifacts, the originating exhibit had very few artifacts. it was designed, really, to be sort of a floating chronological event leading up to today's trip to texas. what is the claimant in dallas at the time? the enormous section and the wonderful motorcade and going through dealey plaza which was designed as a wpa project is a gateway into the city and it still works as such. nobody could imagine what had happened. but then the series of

investigations afterward. the responsibility of the original project developers was to address the controversy but walk a very fine line to be factually based, not to tell you what to believe but to leave the visitor through and to come to their own conclusions at the very end. y so over time we have tried to update the exhibit and put in more artifacts as we have been lucky with some donations and there is a gentleman here also who has lent a very important artifact and that is the place setting that would have been at the trademark for the president. we have taken our display of artifacts very carefully. this is not to be a display of curiosities. it is not ripley's believe it or not. most of the evidence in the national archives, probably will not see the life of -- we i will not see it in our lifetimes perhaps on display. the most controversial

artifacts that we have put on display in preparation for the 50th anniversary commemoration was the rifle. it is an exact copy of the one used to assassinate the president. that is carefully displayed, some people don't even notice it. another artifact was the wedding ring that lee harvey oswald left on the dressing room or nightstand the morning of the assassination $187. we display these things to provoke questioning, what was behind the mind of this man that, had he not left his ring and money and the teacup, and had an argued with his knife -- wife the night before, when he have cause these tragedies? >> we have talked about big binders and planning books and

the rest of that but you also touched on how different staff of different presidents, it might be presidents of opposite parties at each other's necks at times, there seems to develop in the modern times, like a camaraderie, almost, as it were, amongst presidential staff reaching out to help each other in these really difficult times. talk about that a little. >> it really is -- we have each other's back. and as i have mentioned earlier , certainly president reagan's chief of staff, he was really president ford's lawyer who planned his funeral. and they give you a heads up of the landmines that are ahead. and without those, they saved my life. and how to organize it before and how to stay sane during. and one of the bigger

challenges that i face, is this a good time to talk about what i learned from both president reagan and president ford? but the state funeral in washington, d.c., all of congress is invited, and their spouse. on the governors are invited in their spouses and the diplomatic corps is invited. they don't all come. and what happens is about 5:00 the night before the funeral, you find out how many tickets come back to you. 5:00 the night before. the reagan and ford people were caught so flat-footed by this for a couple of reasons that they bust in boy scouts. i was ready because they warned me to be ready. i way over invited and for about 12 hours, we had 281 people coming that i did not have a seat for. the funeral team was very nervous. i was a size 6 when president bush died, i am just saying.

but sure enough at 5:00 the night before the funeral, i got 500 seats back. and i was ready, 281 had already been invited. i won't go into detail but there were other -- we filled every seat. there was a list that immediately got invited but one of the pieces of advice they gave me was to identify a group of people who you could invite at the last minute to be your seat filler. someone who meant something to the president. so we chose the cia. he had a very close relationship with the cia. so i asked them if they could use some tickets in the end and they were thrilled. i have 75 seats left. and i give them to the cia and i said i will need names. because the security was very tight as you can imagine. and those were my favorite moments that week. ll the person at the end of the

phone said, don't worry about that. you know you have got to love those guys. but it is just an example of working together. so now all the chiefs of staff now, they know, be ready for the seats to come back to you. >> lewis, you mentioned it and, as did you, jean, the whole concept of trains. i want to put up a photograph for people to see. where did the traditions start? and then stop and then we will go to jean. >> so, the first president's -- presidents remains he was placed on a train, was william henry harrison. but that wasn't part of his funeral, he was temporarily interned at congressional

cemetery, people were being called to ohio. but the first funeral train was 1848 when john quincy adams died. he had died in washington, d.c., he was also temporarily interned but for a shorter-term . at congressional cemetery, before being brought up north to boston to be buried in quincy. and so the train was almost -- it wasn't really meant to be a funeral train, it was just meant to be a form of transportation to take him north. but meanwhile, people would gather at the track and they would -- men would take off their hats, and it really became a place of morning at that funeral track. for people who did not have the means to go to the funeral in d.c. or

did not have the wherewithal to go to quincy for any ceremonies were able to have their brief moment with the former president to pay their respects. abraham lincoln's funeral train in 1865 really is probably the funeral train that is the most famous funeral train of them all. again, i mentioned it earlier, there is the intersection of railroad technology but also involving, which was perfected during the civil war. mary todd wanted her husband buried in springfield which was 1700 miles away from where he was assassinated. so there was a long funeral train that spans two weeks, stopped in multiple cities were abraham lincoln's remains were removed from the train and put out for public viewing in a prominent building but during

the 1700 miles, there were hundreds and hundreds of displays and bonfires and people that would be singing hymns to to pay their respect. so in the end, there was millions and millions of people who either saw one of the many processions over were along those railroad tracks. it was a very personal way that people can pay their respects to the president. and the coffin would be placed on display with windows, so people can actually see the coffin when they pass by. now, over time, again, with technology changing, the funeral train kind of went out of style if you will. dwight eisenhower's funeral in 1869 was the last funeral train before president bush's. and one of the reasons

reportedly was maybe he did not like to fly. so she preferred the train. but it is very important because it really creates a way for just everyday citizens to be able to pay their respects. >> sure. jean, i'm going to give you a hand. >> by the way, president eisenhower's train, i grew up on a farm in missouri and his train went through my hometown at 10:00 at night and we went. you wouldn't have missed it for the world, we definitely went. can you see the pictures we are seeing? can you all see them? you can? >> there we go. >> we go. president bush loved trains, he was in love with trains. he decided he wanted, his second funeral service was in houston, that was the family and friends funeral. he was buried at his library about 90 miles away in college

station, texas and he wanted a train. he loves talking about this train. you are not going to -- please don't judge me, but one day we are talking about the train, he is so excited. he related his funeral as a big event and he said jean will be great. we will be exhausted from others events, we can eat lunch on the train and we can visit and rest and relax before the burial. and i don't know why but i said, sir, your family will. i said, i more or less said to him, that you are not. and he said, jean, i will be on the train. i may not eat lunch but i will be on the train. anyway, this was a union pacific train. union pacific was amazing. they have this engine specially made. they have now donated it to his library in college station. it is under a tarp. it will be unveiled on president bush's 100th birthday, june 12, 2024. ra you are all invited.

this is an -- it was an amazing train. this is one of the more touching moments. the track was packed just like all the historic trends that there was a group of cowboys waiting on their horses and as the train went by, they tipped their cowboy hats. what i did not know until later, there was about 20 cowboys that the engineer decided to toot the horn to greet them and most of the horses ran off. so these were the only five left. but we all cried. it was really special. there have been 20 of them, i don't know what we would have done. but it was a really special part of his funeral. >> great, great story. i have got 100 more questions but i bet a few of you in the audience do as well. we are bringing microphones upfront and i promise if you

are too afraid to ask a question, i am not and i have got a lot more. so if you would, we have got 20 minutes for questions and please feel free to come forward. >> i don't have a question, but i wanted to give you an eyewitness account of being in the capital when they brought the casket in. my father was a united states senator from the state of wyoming. and on the day of the capital event, he put the family in the car and he said, let's go down and let me see if i can get you into the capitol. so we drove downtown and we cannot get anywhere, it was total gridlock. he rained out the window and said to a policeman, i am senator mcgee,

i need to be in the capitol. immediately, he got us a police escort who took us over to constitution avenue, the site that jackie kennedy would be on just a few minutes later. so we drove by all the faces that she would see, and we were taken up behind the capital where are the -- all the dark cars were parked. my dad drove a blue and white chrysler with big fins on the tail, and our car was parked right in there and appeared in all the pictures as this one light car, but we were taken up the steps into the capital, put right behind a rope line where the casket was and that is

right where mrs. kennedy and i think only carolyn came up to the casket. it was just that far away for me. and it was the first time i had ever had -- i had ever experienced death. and i finally couldn't -- i was trying to hold back tears, i did not want to cry in front of my father. but i started to cry and right as i was wiping a tear away, a reporter stopped my picture. i had a copy of the picture, but my parents never told me that it appeared in different places around the country, so it has become a big treasure of mine. and then my father told me however many days later that they put the senate and a bus, on the centers, and drove them out to arlington. he was there, and when he turned around, i remember

seeing this report, president nixon was standing by himself under a tree behind all those people. anyway, i just wanted to relay that story because it is very personal and i don't know if i am the only one in the room that was there, but i was. >> and i ask how old you are at the time? >> i was probably about 16. 11th grade. >> thank you so much for sharing that story. this is still very much living memory and it is important to record all these memories and we would be delighted to do an oral history with you. we have over 2000 growing oral histories, this new material adds so much dimension and stature to our storytelling. we do wonderful public programs and they are all on youtube so that is a shameless promotion for looking at our youtube channel for all the wonderful programs and people like you sharing their memories. thank you.

>> thank you. >> we know how important the histories are to the museum, so i really do hope you get together with her. sir. >> good morning, my name is tracy messer with the calvin coolidge presidential foundation. thank you all for being here this morning. on three occasions, mr. coolidge wore a black armband as a symbol of warning on the death of his predecessor, warren g harding. on the death of his 16-year-old son, calvin junior, and on the death of his father, colonel coolidge. and i was wondering if any of you can comment on the tradition of wearing a black armband as a sign of warning? when did it start and when did it seem to go out of fashion? >> i know that i should be able to comment on this but unfortunately, i don't know the history of that. but it is something that isn't really in style now, you don't really see it now. unfortunately, that is a really good question and i don't have the answer.

>> sir. >> thank you, sir. i had the privilege of marching in president kennedy's inaugural parade, and i had also -- that was my here, at the naval academy, and my first class year, i had the privilege of leading the owner company that marched in his funeral. the marine band -- the national geographic magazine took a picture at the lincoln memorial. it was the marine band, west pointe, the naval academy, the air force academy, and finally the coast guard academy.

honor companies. and that is a memory that i will take to my grave. i was the class of 1964 and of course this was january -- i mean, september, 25th, 1963. and i can remember the people on the streets and in the trees to get a better view of the funeral procession. being in tears and my question for you is, we all remember john john's salutes in front of the catholic church on rhode island avenue. do you know any

background on that salutes? >> i think you might have been prompted to salute. i think that is what the historical record is but i can't verify that. do you know? >> yeah, i think that is the case. jackie had prompted him to salute his father. it was his birthday actually, too. it happened to be john-john's third birthday on that day. >> i also do want to thank you again for sharing your memories. this is just an example, when the exhibit was created in 1989 after a decade, of a lot of controversy and still controversy after it opened, we are not afraid of dealing with controversy, we walk a very fine line but really, what adds power and meaning to our storytelling is the stories that you have shared. it is so important to collect them now and as we reach out to

younger generations, to understand why this is such a significant event of the 20th century and why it is still controversial and yet why president kennedy's legacy still inspires us to become engaged citizens and back to the conversation we have had over the last couple of days about civic engagement, citizenship, leadership, educating our youth. these are all points that i hope that we will take through to the 250th anniversary of this country. >> we corresponded prior to this event and i know one of the topics that you wrote about was, i think just the kind of moments we are seeing here where these exhibits or museums really provide an opportunity for closure. i think that is the case for so many that have participated in these events. >> our event was designed to help provide closure for the remembers, but as there has been a generational shift, beasley, and opening up two more diverse audiences and to be more inclusive, because so

many people were affected by the assassination and one of the difficult challenges that we have here in dallas is getting schoolchildren from the north texas to come, and so there are multiple facets we have for learning opportunities. and we will be reshaping the museum as we have more space to expand and showcase some of the artifacts. i think all of us are talking about relevancy and how do we empower our youth to be curious about the past and find meaning in the present and to take action in shaping the future? >> yes. >> thank you, i do have a question. i have a friend who is a historian at an independent hole in philadelphia. he tells me they get so many phone calls, so and so found so and so in the attic which is a copy of the decoration of independence, i am sure you get calls, so and so has this bit of evidence or so and so saw

this but as far as cold, hard, not so much evidence but do you ever get new photographs of dealey plaza that day? of people that come forward? i know many of them went to the fbi and were under investigation, but do you ever see people that come out and say, these are photographs from that day in dealey plaza, from that day somewhere else, that you are still getting now? >> believe it or not, yes we do. and i am looking at my staff over here that deal with the collections in education. surprisingly we do still receive wonderful things that have never been seen before. a lot of people unfortunately, there is a huge private collection, collecting of kennedy memorabilia so some of the things come up for auction lot, that would belong in a museum but are not in a museum, they are in private hands. we want our artifacts to help guide the interpretation of this very complicated story. so multidimensional.

but as i said the 90,000 things we have in the collections that are original, most of which have never been on display. so how movies, photographs, people don't think that their materials are very consequential. i don't think they're going to be as significant necessarily as this, but anything that can help people understand their peace in a moment that they were there as eyewitnesses is important to us. >> and i see you came in 2005, and being so immersed in what you do every day, do you personally believe that there are other films out there that may show what happened? somebody else was rolling or do you think abraham was the only one rolling? >> first, i have no personal opinions. >> could answer. >> it is possible but unlikely. >> i think of you but is hoping that something will surface but

after all these years, every year goes by and something hasn't surfaced it is going to sort of help us solve the mystery. we have worked very hard over the years because our storytelling was deemed so controversial and polarizing to confront conspiracy a little bit more directly and especially with the warren commission and staffers. everybody thought we were going to be some sort of tawdry, exploitive exhibit. and we worked very hard to stay as far removed from that is possible. >> thank you very much. >> i have read that at least as of 2018, still over 60% of americans believe there is a broader conspiracy at play family harvey oswald, just an interesting stat. >> it is a truly competent story and during the warning period, the shock of jack ruby

shooting lee harvey oswald, the assessment of the president on my television, it was just an absolute crisis, one after the other. i don't think young people understand that chaos and how we came.. >> sir. >> you mentioned that prior to over, most of these processions were unplanned. i was wondering if you could shed some light on how administrations prior to the 25th amendment what balance the expectation of showing mourning for presidency died in office with office of the obligation to continue to provide governance to their people. >> they managed to do both. there is always the transition of power. after lincoln, edwin stanton probably had more power than president johnson for a while. but the funerals were paramount. they were a way -- there was

the surge, especially in the case of presidential assassinations, like garfield and lincoln, there was just this mass public or to say farewell and to see the president one last time where they really managed to do both. the president -- the new president wasn't really largely involved in it. he was going about the business of government. notably, harry truman was thrown into the government after fdr's death and he really had a crash course of what was going on with the government while on the funeral train, partially well on the funeral train. so they managed to uphold the traditions and the expectations of the public for the public funerals. but the work of government went on. lbj did the same thing, where he quickly took over

command of power, even on air force one. while they were still at love field. so, there has always been that balance of retaining the secession of power to make sure that that wasn't disturbed while also giving attention to the public mourning. >> thank you. >> yes, madam. >> thank you. i live here in dallas and this is more of a story and obviously a big honor that i had. lendl and adams, this was toward the end of the 80s, she came to our office, i worked for the dallas business bureau which was now visit dallas and she came and i was the head of the convention services department. we have the great privilege, she was taking us there to the sixth floor before anything was done and this is exactly how it looked when supposedly we harvey oswald shot president kennedy. so we brought our whole department there which was

about seven of us. they said to enter back from the back of the sixth floor to come up the back steps and come there and they would meet us there. so we get to the back steps, we come up to the sixth floor, we stand there. we are ready to open the door and trust me, nothing has been touched, it is -- stood exactly the same way it does. we get to the door and we are going you go first, no, you go first. none of us wanted to go in because it is a part of history that is there. since i was the head of the department, i went in and the boxes were standing there the same way he stood and looked out the window and shot him and everything was, it was one of the best experiences i've had in my life to see exactly a place in time, a place in history. they walked us through where the boxes were and where he ran out the back. so if you did not get the experience to go to this -- the sixth floor, take the time to do that. it is an unbelievable exhibit and how he ran down the back where the bullets were and the shells and where he went down

that way. i just wanted to say how it was. our whole purpose, because i got to work the whole year with her and how to get our -- conventions would come into the city, how to get them there to see a piece of this history and to get the children from the schools. we went around to the schools and how we told the story and how we had all the conventions come into our city. i just wanted to thank you for that. >> thank you for sharing that, you will have to do an oral history with us as well pick some of the artifacts, also the snipers perch which is closed off. we cannot tell our story in another place. we are very much place based and i think there is tremendous power in that site. we are fortunate that the sixth floor was left pretty much in its original state and that is thanks to the preservation architects were involved in the project initially. >> i think we have got time probably for one last question. yes ma'am. >> thank you. jennifer with the presidential site. caroline harrison is one of the

few first ladies who passed away while serving as first lady. this conversation has made me curious, i know more about presidents but first ladies, they also have a plan. do you know if they have those plans in place as well? >> i can answer on behalf of barbara bush. she did have a plan. there funerals are much simpler because it is one service in their home church, typically. she took me with her to betty ford's funeral, mrs. bush did. betty ford actually had two funerals, one in california and one in michigan. but miss bush wanted me to go with her and we talked about betty ford's funeral all the way home. and it was the first really meeting we had about her funeral. she was very hands on with planning her funeral. the you adjust, the music, and

she was like her husband. they thought it was just another event. >> i just might add to that, mrs. reagan's three ring binder was almost as sick at -- as that of president reagan. a sophisticated set of events that we had to execute and as jane knows, joanne drake used to make a practice about once a year for it, and years to approach mrs. reagan, just to update the plan, discuss it, see if there were any changes that she wanted to make. perhaps you might have changed her mind over the years. but i think first ladies give it a tremendous amount of attention. i am going to turn to anita because she is in charge. before i do, because i think we have six seconds left, i wanted to just have jane comments on

one particular photo that i know you are going to recognize. >> that is good, i wanted you to talk about that. >> after mrs. bush died, he was sad and obviously, we came up with the idea, his medical aid arranged for him to have a service dog named solely who became quite famous. this was taken at the funeral home in houston the day after president bush died. he took sully to the funeral home with him to check on everything and he found sully laying in front of the casket, can't make it up. he took a picture and he came to the office and he said do you think we should send this out ? release it to the media?

i said, yes. i do. it will touch the nation's heart. so i have a sully story, this is how famous sully was. this gives me an opportunity, i was telling the story, two members of my funeral team were here, marilyn baker and lindsay reynolds were both great members of my funeral team. i was telling them, we took sully with us to washington, d.c. on air force one because his next assignment was walter reed hospital. and we had a problem with who is going to take care of sully during the funeral and i said let's take him with us. so we got permission from the air force to take him on air force one and i was given the job of knocking him off air force one. for some reason, and so i walked him off air force one and the press person at andrews air force base comes running over to me and said, jane, the press wants to know. for a minute, i just assumed she was going to say they would like to interview you. she said, the press wants to

know if you could not be between sully and the cameras. because you are blocking sully. it is a humbling moment, but sully has an instagram account. he has 5000 followers. i am one. i follow a dog. but, anita, thanks for that. that and bob dole are possibly the two iconic photos that came out of resident bush's funeral. >> jane, lewis, nicola longford, on behalf of this audience i am going to say thank you so much for your time, your expertise . [ applause ] next up for c-span's coverage of the summer's political party conventions, we go to chicago for the

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