>> i wish i could have had the trophy. he had a better car, and he won. i congratulated him. i wasn't happy about losing, but i have plans for next year. a change in design. practice on my driving more. i will enter again next year. maybe i will win. e

anytime at c-span.org/history. let me tell you about our speaker this evening. dr. alan pietro ban is an assistant professor of global affairs at trinity washington university since 2011. he has also served a let me tell you about the speaker this evening. dr. allen pietrobon is an assistant professor of global

affairs at trinity washington university. since 2011 he has also served as assistant director of research at the nuclear studies institute. in his primary research and teaching areas, it is mad in u.s. history and u.s. form policy focusing on nuclear weapons policies and cold war diplomacy. but he also believes in making education more accessible to people outside of universities. he works to get public presentations on wide-ranging topics like the cultural impact of road trips throughout american history, the rise of the american suburbs, the gilded age, the role prohibition played in shaping the 1920s, the history of food and dining in the u.s., or like this one, how the 1939 worlds fair envision the future.

he will also be back with us on january 11 to discuss kennedy, nixon and the debate of the century. we hope you will consider joining us. we are so excited to have him with us this evening. without further ado, join me in welcoming allen pietrobon. >> thank you for that generous introduction, heather. i am a professor of global affairs and modern american history at trinity washington university here in d.c. i want to start tonight by giving you a number. 1939. it is one of those years that stands out in history. for those who know their history, it is a here that he folks a reaction, much like 1776 with the american revolution or, perhaps, 1989 with the fall of the berlin wall, or 9/11. there are just some dates that just sear themselves into the historical memory. 1939 holds special significance because it is the year world war ii began.

hitler's armies roll into poland, sparking a global war that would go on for nearly 6 years and result in upwards of 85 million people killed. that starts september 1, 1939. much less remembered is the fact that that exact same day the united states president, franklin roosevelt, extended a formal agitate stash -- invitation for all european nations to return to the united states in 1940 to continue celebrating the next season of the ongoing new york world's fair. his invitation said " the continuing hope of the nations must be that there will increasingly understand each other, and the new york

world's fair is one of the many channels by which this continuing conception of peace may be no." it all meant -- on that same september day the war broke out, the ongoing new york world's fair saw a record attendance numbers. it had sort of become a de facto gathering ground for those who wished for comfort or solace, or maybe just those who wanted to revisit the world as it existed just the previous day . a world not plunged into a catastrophic war. a world of hope for the future. the following day on september 2, the new york times headline said that europe's turmoil was reflected at the fair. they were "with bombs bursting over poland yesterday, the impact of general war that

seems to threaten europe finally broke with full force at the world's fair , which such a short time ago was dedicated with brief speeches of international peace and goodwill." by 1939 world's fair was supposed to be a celebration of mankind's progress, a glorious vision of the future literally called the world of tomorrow. with that, by means of a teaser, what i want to explore in tonight's presentation is exactly that. how does this fearful of such promise collapse into the fires of world war ii? and what vision of the future to the present? how far off were we?

for about the next hour or so i will explore this fascinating moment in history, and then there will be plenty of time at the end for questions. you can enter that into the question box out or hang on intuit -- to it until the end. i don't want to just look at the world's fair and the vision for the future it presented, but really, the fact that there was an enormous amount riding on this single event. an event that would be marred by the outbreak of war. so let me set the scene and give first a general overview, and then we will come back through and fill in some of the gaps and expand the context a little bit. the story sees us on april 30, 1939. it was a muggy sunday afternoon when the new york world's fair had its grand opening with over 200,000 people in attendance.

it was an especially exciting moment because franklin roosevelt, the president of the united states, was going to be there to officially open the fair. i will show you a new thrill from that moment. >> america's world of tomorrow ready for its full debut. the mighty exhibition, which is a monument to imagination, showmanship and industry, to see the exhibits of 58 nations, clap -- crowds for an half a million strong. for the 40,000 invited guests, the moment has come. president roosevelt and his son behind him on the right speaks. >> i hereby dedicate the world's fair , the new york world's fair, of 1939, and i declare it open to all mankind.

>> i should have mentioned before it started. it is an old video clip, and depending on the speed of your internet connection, the video might be a bit choppy, but the audio should come through fine. but right from that very moment, this fair was already opening a window on the future. the world of tomorrow, because roosevelt's speech was broadcast on a grand -- brand a new invention that was being debuted for the first time at the fair. television. the speech launched the very first scheduled television broadcast tv station in america. nbc, the first broadcast station, breathlessly proclaimed that the president 's address was being beamed from a transmitter at the very top of the empire state building, and the signal, which could read for a whole 25 miles.

now, in reality, only about 1000 people, we think, to them because there were only about 200 tvs in existence in new york at that time, mainly because this is what a television looks like at the time. a five inch screen, smaller than some of your cell phones today it wasn't even technically black and white, it was actually a weird green hue. if you, the regular person, wanted to buy themselves a television, it cost today's equivalent of about $4000. for that wooden box. but this was an incredible thing that we now know in hindsight would really go on to introduce the world of tomorrow. the irony here, and the one that would continuously haunt the entire world's fair was the

fact that, while this may have been the first broadcast in america , it was germany that beat us to it by three years. the first live television broadcast was the opening ceremony of the 1936 olympics in berlin where hitler featured prominently. as an interesting thought experiment and sino, the astrophysicist carl sagan once considered that since this was the first mass tv broadcast sent out on radio waves, that might mean that, perhaps, the first message that aliens encounter, the first transmission from earth, would be a picture of hitler. but back to roosevelt 's each. as exciting at this moment was, there were some storm clouds

gathering. a reporter asked a representative of the fair, wouldn't a european war completely ruined the fair? the respondent, there will be no more. that is all newspaper talk. europe is excited about this fair. in fact, it is all they are talking about. not some more. well, -- war, well, not everyone would agree with that statement. the fair was open to all countries. each country was invited to attend and build a pavilion to exhibit their culture, their products, their industries, and hitler's germany signed a contract to build a pavilion in new york city. there was a lot of consternation at the time in america whether to let germany even attend . two years earlier at an exposition in paris the had also been invited and built a giant and imposing building

with a swastika. this is meant to be a bold display of germany's reimagined role within the global community. what they were projecting was that hitler's totalitarian form of rule was good, and not just good, but it was the way of the future. democracies were old and fading, they were a thing of the past, and national socialism was a new political project to be taken seriously, to be respected, and even to be admired. that was the image they wanted to protect. in fact, the organizers in paris had put the building on the left of this image , and the building for the soviet union on the right directly facing off against each other.

germany leaned into this idea that national socialism was a welcome bulwark against the evils of communism. and so, right away, this illustrates one of the major clashes of 1939, the major fears that overshadowed, not just the fair, but overshadowed that moment in american life. the idea that was real at the time, that maybe we in america were about to be overtaken by these two countries that offered alternative and more modern political systems. to understand the reason why this was a fear, let me go back for a moment to put this fair in the context of its time, which of course, was in the midst of the great depression. by the time the fair opened in

1939, the united states had been through 10 years of economic calamity. a 27% unemployment rate at times. when most families did without. without extra food, which out -- without extra food or shoes, without going to the daunted estate is. it was a time before there was modern medicine or penicillin which meant a child or adult could die of a sore throat or a simple cut that got infected. this was a time when most roads in the nation were made of dirt , not even gravel. literally, dirt that turned completely to mud when it rained. in 1939 fewer than 25% of people living in rigid areas had electricity. that should

astonish you. this is 50 years after electricity was commercialized, and still, only 25% of people in rural areas had it. this is a time when the national emergency council reported that much of the southern united states was, and i am quoting from the report, a belt of sickness, misery and unnecessary death from syphilis, hookworm, malnutrition, typhoid fever, and malaria. the u.s. south was so underdeveloped that it is more akin to what we probably recognize today as a third world country. malaria, malnutrition. and so, there was a growing understanding among the american population that as the great depression dragged on and on and on for a decade, that seems to indicate, that seems to prove that capitalism as an economic system was a failure.

and worse, overlaying that was the democracy as a governing system also had failed. it seemed unable to remedy the problem. democracy was old, slow, subject to the whims of the masses on one hand and, on the other hand, held hostage by bickering politicians all trying to pursue their own political interests. democracy was obsolete. in contrast, a bold, and most importantly, new political system had arisen starting in europe in the 1920s. the system of fascism. it originates in italy, and that it spreads to germany. the fascist ideology argues that liberal democracies are doomed.

they are the past. that only a one-party state led by a strong leader in charge of a martial law government that could tightly control the population, that only that government could respond effectively to economic problems, and forge the positive national unity required to maintain a stable and prosperous and orderly society. the problem was that that approach seems to be working in the 1930s. fascist italy and germany seem to be doing well, driving even. in 1935 the german autobahn was opened, a full 20 years before the was interstate system was even inaugurated. in 1936 the german economy in the midst of the global great depression, germany was at full employment. and so, there were

many in the united states throughout the 1930s, including members of the united states government, who pointed to germany and thought that, perhaps, the way out of the great depression was for america to be more like germany. but it is even worse than that. may be fascism with its strict control of society wasn't quite your cup of tea, but that's okay, because there's yet another new alternative to democracy, communism. in the 1930s the soviet economy was also booming, it was rapidly industrializing so much so that there were russian recruiters working in the united states to recruit out of work americans to move to russia to work. there were more jobs there than people. tens of thousands of americans did move to russia in the 1930s in search of better jobs, a better way of life than what

they thought they had in america, which would america offered at the time was a huge number of shantytowns that have populated the outskirts of almost every major american city. to be clear, the early 1930s, this was largely before we had learned about the atrocities of the soviet union, and to a lesser extent, of germany. these were seen as largely respectable, prosperous european nations. and so, in 1939, american-style capitalism and democracy was under challenge. no one quite knew how things would turn out. maybe the fascists were right that, just like democracy had superseded monarchy, may be fascism and communism were the next logical steps in human political development. that they had solved the problems of politics.

to say that most americans had experienced these years as a constant stream of obstacles and struggles and existential fear would have been about right. tucson, germany was the positive model of the future. but to others, in fact, to most, they were up in arms in america about allowing a repressive freedom restricting german state to participate in this fair, which was focused on freedom and the future. for one, the mayor of new york city, mayor laguardia, never missed an opportunity to heckle hitler, claiming that if germany was allowed to attend, then the fair also had to contain a building that he called the chamber of horrors. he said "containing a figure of that brown shorted fanatic who is now menacing the peace of the world." the nation magazine said no swastikas at the

world's fair. ultimately, despite these clashes, it would come to naught because the germans would withdraw on their own from the fair at the last minute , partly that they claimed it was because of the foreign- exchange problem, they didn't have enough money, but it was really as a protest to what they saw as insults against their nation. many were happy germany withdrew , but perhaps their absence from a peaceful gathering of nations, maybe their absence should have been ominous in and of itself. down the road from where the not the pavilion was meant to have been constructed was the pavilion of the independent nation of poland. except we now know in hindsight

they just five months after the fair opened that the would invade and overtake poland. by the end of the world's fair, the polish pavilion was draped in black because a country, technically, no longer existed. its exhibits were partly sold off by the exiled government to help pay the bills. the soviet union, the other totalitarian state, also a relatively new country at the time, it was only officially recognized by the united states in 1933 just a handful of years earlier. the soviets were granted a prime location at the fair. they built a massive pavilion. the soviets too were using the fair to project a positive image of communism. their official statement read "the soviet union is a country which has ended the exploitation of men by men.

eliminated racial and national animosities, and in which 170 million people of different nationalities are united in an equal freedom." if i had not told you that was the soviet union, you would think that was united states using that language. five months later the soviets would join with the to invade and destroy poland. italy had a major pavilion. italy also a fascist government at the time. in fact, it was italy that essentially invented modern fashion is that -- fascism with mussolini predating hitler by about 10 years. i think you might be getting the theme here. five months later mussolini sides with hitler. japan. the japan pavilion was

modeled to look like a shinto shrine, which was a religious belief in japan that many americans thought encourage an aggressive and militaristic culture. japan had already been at war with china for eight years and had just two years earlier, in 1937, committed an atrocity were japanese soldiers murdered 300,000 civilians. but in new york, their dedication at the fair read "dedicated to eternal peace and friendship between america and japan." except americans should probably already have been suspicious about eternal peace and friendship between their nation and japan because on the grand opening day the u.s. navy fleet was supposed to visit new york city as part of the ceremony, but because of aggressive moves being made by

japan in the south china sea, the fleet visit was canceled, and the u.s. navy was instead deployed to the pacific as a show of force against japan. you get the point. one year later the japanese would launch a massive surprise attack against the united states at pearl harbor. eternal peace and friendship, they said. so my goodness, if the 9039 world's fair was supposed to be this world of tomorrow, this bright vision of the future , yikes, right? we could not have been more dead wrong. world war ii would break out five months into the fair. americans would be dragged into the war just about a year after that in what became the most deadly war humanity had ever

seen. this moment of hope had turned into a moment of crisis, which was truly terrible because the world's fair was supposed to transcend that . that is why april 1939 was so exciting. the world's fair was designed to leave the current doldrums behind and look to an inspiring new future that the decade of the terrible 1930s, the dirty 30s as it were, were about to end. and a better future in the decade of the 1940s would unfold. the idea that the 1940s would be a dawn of a new era of peace and freedom. it is printed right there on the ticket stub. and the designers of this 1939 world's fair truly tried to project a positive view of the future . a few of the future that was so far in the future that the westinghouse company

even buried a time capsule. in fact, as a fun bar trivia, the very word time capsule was coined for this event. in fact, the barry two time capsules because they wanted some redundancy since these capsules were to set to be opened until the year 6939. not to be opened for 5000 years . that is how long americans thought this nation would last. that is how far in the future they were looking, which if you asked me, is a severe case of hubris, because even the roman empire, the most powerful and longest lasting empire in the history of the world, lasted about 1000 years. looking forward, as a side note, the area where this time

capsule was buried is only about seven feet above sea level. so the projection is in the not- too-distant future this will be underwater due to climate change. but they didn't know that back then. this time capsule was meant to preserve a record of life in 1938. so they put in it but they said were 124 commonly used items. items like tooth powder. they had a lightbulb, although today we call these things the old time lights. the have copies of life magazine. they had a mickey mouse watch. they had a gillette safety razor, which was a new technology, not having to use a straight razor and slit your neck. they had a doll. i will admit, i had to look up what a qb doll was it is this

creepy thing. it was a hottest children's toy of the era. they had a dollar and spare change. they had an asbestos shingle, because why not? and of course, they had the coolest thing of all, cigarettes. give your throat a vacation, says this doctor. they also included a letter from the famed scientist albert einstein. he was appointed to be the science advisor for the fair. he was alive at this time. he explained in the letter he put in his time capsule that in the time in which he lived his society had "learned to fly, and we are able to send messages and news without any difficulty over the entire world through electronic waves." what he is talking about is the radio, which was a technology that was relatively new at the time.

in fact, one of the brand new technologies that was debuted at the fair was a facsimile machine that could use radio waves to transmit a newspaper to be printed out right in your home. kind of amazing. except the data transmission would take about 18 minutes per page to print. but back then, you don't need a paper boy on a bicycle anymore. this is like scrolling through phones to read the news right in the comfort of your own home today. but back to einstein. more ominously, his letter also wrote some hard truths where he said "people living in different countries kill each other at irregular intervals. anyone who thinks of the future must live in fear and terror."

not exactly an inspiring message for the future, but einstein would be proven right, and probably sooner than he would have thought, because more than most, he probably felt that fear for the future. einstein had already renounced his original german citizenship in protest of hitler, and he had left germany. effectively becoming a refugee, and eventually landing in the united states. two days before the fair opened hitler would withdraw from the german, polish nonaggression pact. the storm clouds we continue to gather over europe. i want to step back again for a moment to fill in some background here. because what even is a world's fair anymore? well, these things were created

first in the late 1700s in france where it was meant to be held every five years, kind of like the olympics. in fact, the world's fair predates the modern olympics, which only got started around the turn of the 1900s. the world's fair was created in this time were competition in europe was heating up . nations were battling each other for superiority. so the french thought that it would be good to have some sort of exhibition where each country could gather and show off how amazing it was, all of its culture and products and everything in excel that. that this could foster friendly competition instead of war. that world's fair circuit was just as competitive, if not more competitive, then the modern olympics are. the host nation would build huge ornate buildings to host the fair. each country would put on elaborate exhibits. hundreds of thousands,

millions, would attend. these fares will be talked about the world over. they would run for two years at a time, and ultimately in 1939, 44 million people attended. these fair grounds were so huge that i would often take multiple days, in fact, it was recommended that if you attend the new york world's fair, that you spend two weeks to see it all . multiple days. but really, these used to be huge events. they sort of started to fizzle after the 1960s. although i admit to being surprised to find out that there has literally -- is literally a world's fair going on right now in dubai. the last one was in italy in 2015. they are still happening, they are just a shadow of their former glory. back to 1939. it is the u.s.'s turn to host

the fair again. the genesis came back in 1936 when the location was chosen in queens, new york. this was an area that was a garbage dump 15 stories tall. the fact that the fair was constructed on top of a notorious garbage heap with maybe get another unintended irony about what the future would bring. in order for the fair to be profitable, they had to get major european nations to attend in a major way. this started off poorly. both britain and france agreed to construct very small pavilions. and only on the condition that the united states paid for them. but then, a guy named, the president of the world's fair corporation, he decided he was going to play a little dirty. he figured the path to success,

the way to get the big, important western european nations to come was to get in bed with their top rivals. that if he could getgermany or the soviet union to attend in a big way, then britain and france and the other western european nations would really have to step up their game in order to compete. so he promised the ussr a very large and very favorable location to show off the glories of the soviet union. without even haggling over the price, stalin agreed to pay $4 million for the rights to build , which is about $75 million today. and the trick worked. the very next morning he got a call to come to paris to negotiate for a much bigger french presence.

the french were not going to let the soviets take all the glory. cleverly, he decided that before he stopped in paris he was going to make a little detour to italy to sell mussolini on the idea that he could not possibly let those communists outshine the great fascist nation of italy. he arrives in rome and would later write "as i entered the dictator's office, i saw a highly polished floor, at least 200 feet long. off in the distance, mussolini stood with his back to me looking at the sunset through a massive window." it paints a lovely scene, but he continues to use flattery to sell the idea to mussolini,

saying that new york's world of tomorrow, that was just like mussolini 's version for -- vision for italy. mussolini was comfortable, but that sort of sold him. he would claim that his vision for italy, using the government to build the country back up, was no different than roosevelt's new deal. that italy and american democracy is the same thing. when mussolini asked the price after having agreed, big gamble, he raised it from the $4 million he charge the soviets , for the great nation of italy, a low, low price of just $5 million. britain and france quickly increased their participation as well, and ultimately 62 nations would attend. the fact that italy, juiced by -- mainly juiced by the

italians, this allowed the fair to expand and prosper at first. but it wasn't just countries attending the fair, partly the fair was a means to help repair the image of capitalism and corporations, which had, rightfully, gotten a pretty bad rap during the great depression. a lot of people blamed big corporations for the economic doldrums. in fact, there was one proposal that to get the economy juiced and get people back to work again, the government should pay companies to hire people to just build things, toasters, to build toasters, that the government would then take away and barry in the landfill so you have this complete production line of construction, and then garbage. but that would keep people employed, building the stuff that will end up getting thrown

out. it was the government's responsibility to keep production flowing no matter what. all that waste doesn't matter as long as the company is profitable. one public relations firm said "the lack of confidence in capitalist democracy itself must be overcome in the public eye." so major businesses were welcomed to open exhibits as well. in fact, this is one of the first times, again, with whalen being clever about how to make money, he licensed the logo of the world's fair to corporations to print on jackets and whatever they wanted. this is pretty atypical at the time. this corporate branding wasn't really a thing until the world's fair. whalen would brag about how much money was pouring in from these licensing deals the companies wanted to get in on the excitement and sell their

wares. none more so than, number war welcome to open exhibits then general motors. the general. and spent $7 million. today's equivalent of about $132 million to build an incredible pavilion. a temporary one. it was just two years before they tore down. this was an astonishing, sweeping building that rose 10 stories tall. people waited for up to three hours to see the massive futuristic diorama they had built inside they would fly over it in these chairs looking down at the world of 1960. this is what they were depicting the world of tomorrow. a world that might seem rather familiar to us today.

they had skyscrapers. they had 14 lane superhighways they called express motorways. narrators explained that by using these curved ramps, cars can take quarters at 50 miles per hour. that was astonishing. the top speed, the top speed flat-out pedal to the floor of most cars of the era was 45 miles per hour. with this you can go around the corner at 50. you don't need to stop at an intersection to turn. in fact, that car of 1960 would have a radio activated beam projected from the front bumper to keep it following a safe distance behind the car ahead. that is what we've got today with the automated cruise controls. but again, keep in mind that this was a time when most roads

were dirt or gravel. cars tapped out at 35 miles per hour. most of the skyscrapers in that exhibit had landing pads on their roofs for flying cars. that too was a pretty shocking thing since not even helicopters existed yet. the first successful helicopter flight would not come until six months after the fair opened. another similar exhibit inside that round centerpiece of the fair meant to project the future , inside their they had an exhibit called democrocity where it depicted a future where people would live outside the city centers in these rural neighborhoods that they called pleasantville. by using those

new express motorways and private automobiles, it would allow a man quick and easy access to his job in the city, but the ability to live outside the city center in a private, single-family home in quiet and comfort. they are describing an american suburb eight years before the first suburb appears in america. the idea also that it would be normal for people to drive their own private cars to work, this was at a time when only one in five americans actually owned a car. most walked to work or took public transit. across the fair there were displays of state-of-the-art high-speed railway trains. there were modern airplanes. there were new ocean liners. ford motor company had brand

new sedans that fairgoers could drive themselves on the so- called road of tomorrow. you could get in the car and drive it around a test track. again, shocking. the majority of people in 1939 had never driven a car before. at the fair, in addition to cars you could drive and dioramas you could go through, they also had what they called the world's longest electric stairway. it is just an escalator, but people lined up to ride this to the top and then go back down again. i think the most hilarious thing of all was a giant robot they had on display. that was a key feature. it could smoke cigarettes. a robot they called electro.

>> i present to you electro, the westinghouse man. electro, come here. and here he comes, ladies and gentlemen. walking up to greet you under his own power. all right, electro. will you tell your story, please? >> who, me? >> yes, you. >> okay. ladies and gentlemen, i would be very glad to tell my story. i am a smart fellow as i have a very fine brain. >> that is the most remarkable thing i have ever seen.

>> now electro, i know you enjoy these. are going to try to give you a nice on these. here you are. you got that? hold onto it. you may now smoke this cigarette . go on. yes, electro, you do need a lightweight. all right, here you are. and folks, he is only two years old too. just learning. >> that clip is from a promotional film, the westinghouse corporation, which built elektro had put out. the people were mesmerized by the futuristic technologies that were on display here. but even the corporation built

an igloo to show off their brand new technology, air conditioning. the idea that humans, with the touch of a button, could cool themselves down on a hot summer day was astonishing. this was so ahead of its time that it wasn't until the 1970s when residential air- conditioning started to become commonplace in american homes. in fact, in light of all of these new technologies, the narrator at the general motors exhibit said "does it seem strange, fantastic, unbelievable? remember, this is the year of the 1960s." a fantastic future. a world of tomorrow. the at&t corporation, the phone company, had even built and put on display the first device

that could synthesize the sound of the human voice. the first computerized voice, as it were. listen to it here. >> say greetings everybody. >> greetings, everybody. >> now have to repeat that in a high voice. >> greetings, everybody. >> now in. >> greetings, everybody. >> the new yorker magazine described that exhibit probably the best when they called it creepy. which it is. perhaps, depending on how you see it, there was a whole section of the fair devoted to kind of creepy things. because it wasn't just countries or corporations on display, there was also an adult entertainment section. adult in every sense of the

word with shows, and exhibit called "oscar, the obscene octopus" which was a rubber octopus that used its tentacles to slowly strip the bathing suits off of female swimmers. there was also an exhibit called little miracle town featuring the world's greatest little people, 125 resident midgets who lived in this little mini town you could walk through and see. russia, as part of their exhibit, did not do creepy americans, we are the kings of creepier, but russia went grandiose. they sent a replica of a subway station in moscow. why a subway station? because not only was this just built, one of the most modern

metro systems in the world, but it was also meant to highlight that their communist system of government was truly for the people. that instead of letting capitalist profits go to the wealthy or creating frivolous things like a fake human speech generator, in communism, all the excess money, all the prophets, go back to the people in the form of public investments. investments like excellent and beautiful public transit systems. this picture here is a subway station in moscow. it looks like a cathedral. it was meant to. they thought the people in our society should be inspired by public works. if you want to compare, there is new york 's way. built by the government by the

lowest bidder, and it looks like a basement. but soviet communism showed off the fact that their system was better. that this is where society should put it's excess wealth, not so that some rich guy could by himself another sports car or a goldplated back scratch or wall new yorkers, who often have no choice but to take public transit, or in a rat infested, dimly lit, water leaking basement for their subway. so this challenge to western democracy and capitalism was real, and it was on display for everyone to see. and some of the people who saw it were dignitaries from around the world who arrived in new york to participate. this picture is of the procession of the motorcade of england's king george, who sailed over to attend the fair. on that day, when the british

king arrived, 1 million of new york schoolchildren were given the day off to go watch the procession. but ultimately, because we, with the benefit of hindsight know how things turned out, this fair, it's vision for tomorrow, was outdated before it even began. in september 1938, the year before the fair open, british by minister had gone before the world, met with hitler, and said this afterwards. >> this morning i had another talk with the german chancellor , hitler. here is the paper which bears his name upon it, as well as mine. [ cheering and applause ] that

the settlement of the czechoslovakian, which is now been achieved, is, in my view, only the prelude to a larger settlement in which all of europe may find peace. >> it is peace for our time, declares chamberlain. he has talked to hitler, we saved czechoslovakia from aggression by coming to this pack , and we see peace and prosperity for your bad. hitler is a man we can work with. except, before the fair even opened, one month later, i'm sorry, one year later, both czechoslovakia and austria were under control . he violated his agreement. he lied to the british by minister and the world. before the fair at this end,

belgium, denmark, france, the netherlands and others, nearly half the european nations would be added to that list of having been crushed by aggression. after the takeover of czechoslovakia, mayor laguardia raised the charge to raise $600,000 to help finish their pavilion despite the fact that the germans demanded it be shut down because the country was under their control now. ultimately, the outbreak of war was a paul cast over the entire fair. when the 1940 season rolled around, so it runs for the spring, summer and fall of 1939 and shuts down for the winter and reopened for a second year. when the second year came around, 10 european countries would not return. those who

had worked at the polish pavilion, the first country to fall to aggression, did not go back to europe at the end of 1939. why voluntarily returned to a country under occupation? instead, a few of the staff opened up a polish restaurant in new york city. they had nowhere else to go. they had no hope for the future. the most notable nation not to return was the soviet union. they ordered that their massive pavilion be torn down, crated up and shipped back to russia, leaving a gaping hole in the fairgrounds. in its place, the americans opened up a big open space called the american commons, dedicated to the perpetuation of an american ideal. but the american ideal might have been real for americans, but the fear was even more real. in boston the dome of the state

hose, which was this beautiful gold color, when the war broke out, they painted it gray to make it harder for bombers to spot if they were ever to attack the united states. to bravely hold out against the nazis with london being bombed nightly during the blitz. that british pavilion in new york became a crowd favorite packed with people w bravely fold out against the nazis with london being involved in nightly during the blitz , that british pavilion in new york became a crowd favorite, packed with people wanting to show support and learn about britain. in their exhibit, they had displayed an original magna carta from the year 1215. ng the first time it had ever left england. and with the outbreak of war, the government decided it was probably safer to leave the magna carta in the united

states, should england fall to the nazis. and it would stay in the u.s., secured away in fort knox until 1947. which was probably just as well because it was also in the british pavilion or a time bomb was discovered, planted in the back room next to a nazi flag. the police had managed to get this bomb out of the building which was still full of tourists. they carried outside and started to work on before it exploded, killing two officers. case was never solved. the only evidence was this swastika flag planted inside the bomb in the british pavilion. maybe it is for the best that as the fair wound down in 1940, despite the concerns of the

organizers and the idea that they did not really want this to happen to the fair, their glorious vision of the future. instead, the buildings and exhibits were dismantled. it's 40 million tons of steel sent to be melted down and made into tanks. sent to fuel the war effort. this world of tomorrow literally ended up in the war. and that grand vision of the war seemed to collapse into the ash heap that it was originally built on, this garbage dump, but it will itstill remain. as we wrap up here, it will still remain this iconic moment. this iconic year that stands out in world history, even if the memory of the fair itself asked its hope for the future is mostly receded into the background.

for those of you who want to learn more about the 1939 world's fair, this is a great book. twilight at the world of tomorrow. i have drawn a lot of information from it to help build up this talk. i will wrap up my portion here. the floor is open for questions so we can continue the conversation and pull out the things you want expanded upon and more fascinating things about this world of tomorrow or the world of 1939, so thank you for watching. i will throw it back over to heather who will moderate the q&a here. >> thank you. like alan said, please continue questions in the q&a box on your screen. ird have a few. >> let's go for it. >> so i will go back to the beginning and shove your talk. you mentioned there were a lot of americans who went to the soviet union in search of a r

better life. someone is curious, do we know what became of those folks? did they have to come back? did they stay there? do we have any information about what happened to them? >> we do, actually. there were huge numbers that went over the debts of the great depression. the soviets included people whom worked in the automotive industry and the steel industry. these industries they wanted to build up really rapidly. there were many books on the memoirs of people who went over and at first loved it and were astonished, because this was a country on the move. it's building rapidly, it's industrializing. there is work to be done. the soviet people, that first- generation, seemed happy and proud and patriotic that they were producing for the future. and it was good money compared to what they could make in the united states. the living accommodations were great, partly because the

soviets wanted is a propaganda effort to give them great apartments and all these privileges. probably what is most interesting is that there were thousands of african-americans who were recruited to go to the soviet union. the soviets were pitching their idea, not just as a political and economic project, but as a social project in the soviet union, one of the things was toe eliminate inequality. so they welcomed african- americans, these people who were heavily discriminated against back home, welcomes g them into the soviet union partly again for propaganda to show off that they are equal here, we are colorblind, we don't care about the color of your skin. we are not racist like those americans. so what is fascinating is the memoirs from the african- americans, there is a book called black conrad that talks about it. she had a great life in the soviet union at first. there is one story he tells of

among the white americans who a came over and worked in his factory, one day, because they brought the racism with him, they jumped him and beat him up and he fought them off. the police were called and the police came and interviewed him and he was cowering because in america, if you fight a white man, you're going to prison. there is no justice for people of color in america in the 1930s. he was shocked to see the russian police officers, white police officers questioned him with respect interest of the americans who committed this crime and deported them back to america and made this guy a national hero in a way. l at first, life was great and then it wasn't. by the late 1930s, as the soviets get more repressive, specifically with the outbreak of world war ii, there is a lot of suspicion cast on these

people. a lot, by them, had left after the initial rose-colored glasses, mr. to realize that life in a totalitarian dictatorship is not what it looks like on the surface, not all that great. a lot of them are kicked out at the start of world war ii. but there were many others like the author of black on red who stays and meets a russian woman, gets married, has kids and has a wonderful life, as wonderful as you can under stalinist russia. it is quite fascinating. a story we do not often hear about and it shows the pull of communism in the early days before we learned about the atrocities and see that it does not work as a system, it was really alluring to a lot of r americans who were out of work, impoverished and desperate at that time, to start a new life going to russia was a thing. >> great, thank you. okay. you u obviously mentioned the

fair was in queens on a dumpsite. was this the same location they used for them 1964 fair. this former dumpsite which was cleaned up for the 1939 fair, all of these buildings were torn down except for one. they made it into a park between the years and in 1964, when the fair came back to the united states, they held it in the same location. it's plagiarism. same location, same theme. instead of the world of tomorrow it was futurama, depicting the future world of tomorrow. general motors came and did a future exhibit. the big thing from the 1964 fair is that everyone was obsessed with space travel. it was the hot new technology. we have not yet gone to the moon. we had only just gone to space and broken the bounds of the atmosphere. that was a long-winded way of saying yes, it is the same

location for both of those fares. some of you might live in new york today. i don't know what came of it after that. is it a park? i don't actually know. >> we can come back to a couple of things that you touched on in that answer. nm before i move on, someone wants to know if you are able to talk about the federal art project involvement in the site. >> not really in that i cannot speak about their involvement in the site aside from, so, part of the new deal, the federal government is funding not just roads and bridges and setting up social security nets and trying to get people back to work, there is a civilian conservation corps of 100,000 e' people. this and works project. at least on the east coast, one of the big projects, if many of you have been to the blue ridge parkway or shenandoah national

park, there are cabins up there you can rent and they are built by roosevelt. part of that, we saw the infrastructure building as a way to make work for people but to help out of work artists, the government pays artists to go out and do all kinds of things. to do poetry, to set up classes and communities and teach art. to do big murals and paintings around the country. to go out and document stories and musicians. so they paid artists. that is leading up to the fair. there are a bunch of art installations. there is a building dedicated to artistic pursuits. i cannot speak specifically to their involvement piece by piece in the world's fair. that i do not know. >> that is great context, though, thank you.

so a couple of people are curious about the international exhibition of 1939 in san er francisco. do we know if there is any connection between the two of them? >> if there are competing worlds fares that year, in fact in the opening clip of roosevelt declaring his speech, he says i hereby declare the world's fair and he pauses and says the new york world fair. because there are concurrent fares. there are worlds fares that are big events every four to five years and then there are world expos that are on and off. the 1937 paris event was an expo for the 1939 event was a world's fair. for whatever reason, there is no connection in terms of it is not the same organization that runs new york also runs san francisco, but they bid for and got an expo the same year of

the world's fair. so there was a sort of intercoastal competition but from a corporation that runs new york being unconnected to the one that runs san franciscov from what i understand. >> wonderful, thank you. okay, so other than the company exhibit like general electric or any of the others, to the u.s. as a country have an exhibit or not because it was hosting? >> the u.s. sets up their pavilion as the paris fear. a big run building basically in the suburb meant to be the centerpiece of the fair and the u.s. contribution. the u.s. also exhibits a bunch of its technologies in a bunch of different expo buildings like televisions, lightbulbs on display as the u.s. contribution. typically what the countries

bring our cultural displays, feats of science and technology and products that their country excels at making. the soviets for example, there feet of science and technology was they had just recently conquered the arctic. they have been doing expeditions to the arctic circle people going up there. they had put a big arctic display with polar bears and planes in there while display of the arctic as their technological feats. the u.s. does have a number of m different exhibits, but there are centerpieces, like the tower that they put up as sort of a visual grandiose thing. like the olympics, the host country is supposed to show off and build these grandiose things. one other side note, the sphere was supposed to be engineered so it looked like it was floating on this fountain that

was blasting up underneath it which would have been really cool. but they could not make the engineering work. so it just sat there above a pond. >> speaking of, you had mentioned that at that '64, they had rockets and space stuff, so someone is curious ifi there are any aeronautical exhibits or planes at the '39 world's fair. >> yes there were. world travel. showing off modern aircraft nt grade aluminum bodied aircraft, rather than wood and fabric biplanes, which is from the 1920s. the big exhibits, things people were most interested in were trains. they had also about it. the name of it slips my mind, but showing the evolution of relative -- railway travel from

the wild west to modern sleep bullet trains. they even had a high speed steam powered train running between baltimore and new york to bring people up to the fair. so it's these modern trains which are still steam powered, although general motors had on display the newest technology in locomotive, which was a diesel electric train which is what we use today. it looks like a modern train. what you would recognize as a freight train engine. that's what it looks like. trains are really big. but it's the cars, automobiles and highways that people are fascinated with eric little on space travel. little on rockets. rocketry was seen as being amateur child's play through the 1920s. it was not big yet until really after world war ii. and again, hitler overshadows the whole fair when he proves

in the war with their engine sprockets that rocketry can work as an effective weapon. the u.s. devotes enormous funding to developing the atomic bomb is our super weapon. hitler put enormous money into developing rocket engines to launch at london. less about space travel. does not become a thing until the 1950s, which is fascinating. given what we know about space, hg wells and war of the worlds and all of that emma but less subtle than all that. >> some people want to know, who are some of the now famous architects that were commissioned and designed pavilions? is there anyone that stands out or is more of a household name,t i guess? >> no idea. someone is clearly interested

in architecture. that is beyond the realm of what i know. if we are looking at worlds fares in general in the 1800s, i think it was the 1893 chicago world's fair, there was a big amount of hoopla over the fact that a woman had designed one of the buildings in the 1800s. i don't know about architect pa specifically. they did bring in these architect who built these big, grandiose designs. architecturally, one of the problems was how do you build a building like the gm building, 10 stories tall, looks amazing. but build it cheaply, because you're going to tear it down. in the earlier days, there were all kinds of problems of buildings being built really flimsy because again, i'm not going to hardly engineer this thing. it's going to be scrapped in two years. buildings would blow over in the wind and all of that.

the round building and a heavy storm, parts of the facade ripped off of it because they were just sort of stuck on the outside. again, we don't need this to last more than two years. aside from how the buildings are built, i don't know who built them. >> not to worry. i know you mentioned attendance surging up at the uk pavilion. someone was curious, what was the attendance like in general in 1940 versus 1939? did as many people come in the second year or not so much? >> the attendance of these things, like everything like this, the projections were wide. 60 to 80 million people attending the fair and they ended up getting, i don't recall how it broke down in each year. 25,000,001 year and around that the second year. one of the things they tried is

because they had rejected 60 million people, that is kind ofa what they needed to make good on their financial promises. the attendance never hit anywhere near what they thought it would appear right at the end, i think of season one, certainly in season two, they lowered the price, which did bring in some more people, but again, it kind of had fizzled a little bit. the problem with lowering the price was they had presold a bunch of seasons passes at the higher price and people wanted refunds because they think they're getting ripped off. financially and attendance -wise, it became kind of a calamity. they expected near 1 million people on opening day. they got 200,000. i think 44 million overall which is nothing to sneeze at, but it's not the six million that they needed. overall attendance, it was not a flop. 44 million is certainly not a

flop, but they did not reach the level they had hoped. inside the fair, there was competition over his exhibit will be the best. and in season two, the british exhibit became really popular right after the invasion of poland, the polish exhibit became really popular, swarms with people, but overall, the p number one exhibit with the highest attendance was the y general motors exhibit. people would wait three hours to get into it. it averaged about 30,000 people per day. there was a ride through the building to look at this amazing display of what the 1960s would look like. general motors takes the cape as being the best attended exhibit at the fairburn >> someone asked if it was a financial success and from your answer i'm assuming it wasn't. >> it was not. it was not a complete bust, but it's very rare -- like the

olympics, it's very rare that these things make money. the corporation had borrowed a bunch of money with the promise of paying it back on certain ai interest rates and then started trying to convince the people that the corporations who got their seed funding first, when it was clear that they would not be paid back but pennies on the dollar, they tried to use it as a pr thing. like yes, i support the fair because it's a good civic project. but financially it was not profitable. >> and what was the public reaction or opinion to the pl fair? >> that is a good question. it ties into the lack of profitability. one of the public's reactions was that it was too expensive. this is in the midst of the great depression. ticket prices, they thought, were too high, but the biggest complaints were that the food prices inside the fair were way too high. it's always funny today. ri they were complaining that a

hamburger cost a dime. that was too much money. while people were fascinated by this, people cried during the gm exhibit. it was really overwhelming in a way. people were attracted to the technologies in that. it is still in the midst of the great depression and people complained about the price of the food so much that the ticket sales, the price was cut and then the fair had you promised later that year they would have cheaper food options available inside the fair and it would not be such a money grab, so people achieve. that seems to be -- you read the media accounts, there were complaining a lot about the price of the fair. and not to say that it was underwhelming, but partly the reason they never hit the attendance targets they had hoped is that it just did not generate the buzz that people had hoped.

we will never know if that is because the war breaks out and people aren't willing, pulling back on their spending, not willing to have this fun, celebratory thing. it is hard to say. >> is funny. it has not changed much, right? we go to disney world -- >> a $50 beer at the stadium or something. >> we will always complain about the price of food. someone else wanted to know could new york or some other u.s. metropolis make a latter- day world's fair or expo a financial success or has the magic of everyday electronic technologies and permanent exhibitions like disney world's epcot rendered world's fairs and expos passi? >> part of the reason these things fizzled is they are all enormously expensive. they almost never turn a profit. they take all these resources

to build and what it has become is that countries don't need this anymore. we don't really do this. we don't need a huge exposition to show off how great we are and get all of these countries together. partly it has become supplanted by the olympics. which we have the same complaints about. it is too expensive, countries lose a bunch of money on it and we are left with infrastructure we cannot use afterwards work things just get torn down. that's a big part of it now in most major countries. there is just not a huge swath of open land available in the cities anymore, which is where they used to build. ue in philadelphia, they belted in the middle of the city. in new york it was just on long island. but space -- these are huge fairs, huge, unbelievably huge. so i think that is one of the things and i think the person who asked the question is right. maybe we have become jaded or

-- i cannot think of it technology now that excites me the way, from what i have read -- i was not around in the 1960s for the way the space race excited people. the way electronics excited people. robots excited people in that way. now it is like the most exciting thing is virtual reality or the meta-verse, which is entirely lame if you ask me. i'm not going to go on the world's fair and put on goggles and see a fake world around me. that, mainly, the fact we have less time. life is more busy. there is such a plethora of entertainment options but i'm not going to spend two weeks going to a world's fair to walk around for the day to see things that i already see. so that is on one hand. as i am talking this through, even now, it used to be exciting in an era before mass

advertising and commercialization which comes up after the 1950s. it was exciting to go to the fair and go to a corporate exhibit and see general motors cars. their giant advertising platforms, but that was cool to see all the new things offered. we have lost our sense of childlike hope for the future and that way and we just numb ourselves with the endless entertainment available. the personal note here is that i to, when i started researching world's fairs a number of years ago, was kind of surprised to see that they're still going on. one of the things that i study a lot and love researching his food. the 2015 world's fair in italy c was surrounded, revolved around food. as a researcher on this topic i did not know what was going on. i might have gone to it, but i

did not know. right now, there is one going on. it has lost its allure. i'm not sure it will ever come back in a big way that inspires people like it used to. >> speaking of food, we have a question or two surrounding food from the fairs. first of all, how did food displays represent the future of food production, preparation and consumption if at all? >> that is a good question. i do not know off the top of my head that they represented the future of food production or consumption. from what i've come across, there's no futuristic space foods available at the time. especially then when it was essentially most of the countries in their pavilions with cafeterias highlighting their own national dishes. trying to think of an example. i could flip through my notes to flip through an example.

the thing i do know is the problem was often eating in the national cafeterias was more expensive than eating at the fairgrounds outside the pavilion. it's more we are coming to show you what is foreign. if i'm from finland, it's not foreign to me but putting on the national dishes. the fair did make a show of thing that would offer cheaper hotdogs and hamburgers to the masses. i cannot think of any food corporation putting on a new display. it was like giants like general motors and goodyear tires. firestone tires set up an actual factory to show how a tire was made. they called it the tire of tomorrow. but you had a working factory, which i guess is cool. even then, the mechanization of

food really hits in the 1950s s and after. that's another thing. i can't give you specifics on it. >> someone excitedly put into the q&a the belgian waffle. >> one of the technologies they displayed was the electric waffle maker. you can use the iron to make waffles. that might have been exciting. that is a food product on display. >> someone else that you always hear about how the ice bin cone was invented at the chicago world's fair. are there any innovations that were created at the 1939 new york world's fair? something that was not put on display necessarily but came out of it anyway? >> specifically in terms of food, not that i am aware of.

it is often world's fairs that launch new food innovations. the ice cream cone, the hamburger was launched allegedly, one of the many origin stories was that it was launched at the 1904 fair when they took a beef patty and put it between two pieces of bread so you could walk around while munching on it. i can tell you one of the things the organizers wanted to do but didn't. again and marketing making hotdogs and hotdog buns. the tower beside the round building. and to do that as a marketing thing. maybe there would be hotdogs and triangle shapes today if that had taken off. but what comes out of the fair not on the food side, television skyrockets and takes off after the 1950s. the new modern armor -- automobiles, definitely the highway system that they put on

display there takes 20 years, but becomes ubiquitous. it is how we drive around. these interchanges and superhighways. even with radar guided cars with collision avoidance and all that. there are some things that stuck around that came out of the world's fair. >> i think we have time for maybe two more questions. i'm going to ask you one question after that that's not necessarily contemplated but somebody noticed something in the background that they wanted to touch on. you probably know what it is. >> i think i can guess. >> somebody wanted to know how many structures and buildings built for the fair are still standing today? i know you said you were not sure, so if you don't know, let me know. if you people wrote in about

this. >> yeah, one. one building remains and it was constructed with the intention that it would remain after the fair. i think it is a government building today. they kept one, and it goes back to the person who asked about architecture. the infamous robert moses, the highway builder of new york city who had a hand in designing this fair. he wanted after the fair was over to turn it into a big park, much like central park. parts of it were, maybe even to this day. almost all of tthe buildings save for that one central one were torn down and scrapped which was common in the context of the world's fairs. you can keep one centerpiece and the rest gets thrown in the trash. made it into bullets and tanks. some countries dismantle their pavilions. they are made to be easily taken apart and they ship them back home. russia ships there is back home, and they used -- whether

it is the 19 3739, they always tend to at the peak of the tower of the buildings but a huge statue of a man and woman charging into the future in communist glory. that element is now in a park in moscow on fairgrounds in moscow. some countries keep pieces of them. most famously, the eiffel tower in paris was the centerpiece of their 1889 world's fair. it was meant to be torn down after the fair, but they left it up here nothing really iconic that stayed behind in the fair in new york. >> thank you. it looks like we have a couple of new yorkers in the audience who mentioned it now flushing meadow park. if anyone wants to ingo imagine what it might have looked back

then, >> part of it was turned into a park, so there we go. >> final contents question. you showed a bunch of different technologies and you might have alluded to the answer a little bit. out of the technologies that we were shown at the fair, which was the most successful and which was the least accessible now that we have hindsight? >> yeah, the television i think was most successful. it dominates our life today. it was not invented at the fair as much as it debuted at the fair. the nazis beat us to that. our ability to transmit images, news and everything stalls out because of world war ii. for the 1950s, just rocketing. certainly the television. least successful is the notion of

flying cars. something we talked about in the 1930s. they play on the 1950s that the idea is around the corner. we talk about flying cars around the corner and companies working to develop them. starting in 1939, there were talking about building buildings with landing pads. the flying part of the car did not work out the radar, the ability for the car to track the car ahead of it and speed e up and slow down, they have that now, still relatively recent. it took 80 or 90 years to come to fruition. certainly, the highway system, as i mentioned earlier, and the idea of the suburbs, living outside the city and commuting in the private car, that vision worked part of me wished they would have kept some of these exhibits. i wish that the gm put that in

the museum so we could go back and look at it rather than seeing in pictures or reading about it, what they thought the future would be. if you look at the exhibit today, it will look a lot like today, minus the flying cars, of course. >> now the non-content questions. curious if you use the typewriter and the rotary phone behind you. >> the typewriter works. it's a 1926. the rotary phone, no kirkuk works. i have not used it in years. but the phone was my father's. the typewriter, i don't know where that came from. i've got a number of typewriters. the phone, no. the typewriter, yes. like i'm stuck in 1939. i am a constant historian. i use it to write letters to friends and family, so it is functional. >> thank you so much. that is all the time we have

for today. thank you to our audience for joining us and for your great questions. thank you, alan, for another exciting and fascinating presentation. >> the c-span bookshelf podcast feed makes it easier to listen to all podcasts featuring nonfiction books in one place. we are making it convenient for you to listen to multiple episodes with critically acclaimed authors discussing history, biographies, current events and culture, from our signature programs about books, book notes plus and q&a. listen to that bookshelf podcast feed today. find all of our podcasts on the free c-span now mobile video app or wherever you get your podcast. c-span.org /podcasts. th in 1915, a group of women gathered