massachusetts governor, exploring the american story. watch american history tv on saturdays on c-span 2 and find a full schedule on your program guide or watch online any time at c-span.org/history. weekends are an intellectual feast. every saturday, american history tv documents america's story. on sundays, book tv will bring you the latest in non-fiction books and authors. funding for c-span 2 comes from these television companies and more and including more. >> when connection is needed most, they're there to help, bringing affordable internet to families in need. and support to veterans whenever and wherever it matters most. we'll be there.

>> cox supports c-span 2 as a public service. good evening everyone and welcome to the white house historical association. i'm steven mcluren. it is a real privilege to have you here under our roof. we have a full room here and those of you who are joining us by c-span, we have a terrific program that's planned for you this evening. this is the first of four episodes in our white house, history, quarterly series on media and the white house. now it is shorthanded by saying the history with frank sesno, our moderator.

and frank, you have big shoes to fill, at least high shoes to fill because we have ann compton here and four episodes of the white house history. and that was great fun as well. this program is put together by the national center for white house history here at the association, led by dr. colleen, dr. matthew, and all of their colleagues who are here today put in a tremendous amount of work to put on the series as well as our other substantive programs that we would have as a part of the mission here at the association. and anita mcbride who is here and three distinguished former members of our board. martha kumar and who are also on the panel. we have several members of our national council on the white house history who are the real wind in the sales of our work and we are very grateful for their support to help make our

non-profit and non-partisan mission possible. without their financial support, we could not do what we do. we receive no government funding whatsoever, and we do all that we do on behalf of the american people. we are 62 years old founded by mrs. kennedy in 1961 to be the private partner to the white house to maintain the museum standard of those beautiful interiors and to teach and to tell the stories of the white house and its history going back to 1792 when george washington selected that piece of land from where we are tonight. well our moderator this evening is frank sesno. he is -- they don't like this. our moderator is frank who is the emmy award winning journalist who has held just about every position of leadership held in television

to anchor to television host who has interviewed five american presidents and the leaders in every sector around the globe. he gave leadership as the director of the george washington university school of media and public affairs. he's currently the head of strategic initiatives for the school. and also teaches, which i think is probably the highest calling of all of those to engage in media and how to become the next generation of the american journalist. and the other project is plan it forward and i encourage you to explore that and learn more about that current endeavor where you are in for a treat with the panel this evening. and my part of the program is over and with that, i'll turn it over to you. >> and thank you very much.

before i go any farther, i want to thank you for what you do because to bring these stories to life and bring these places to life to learn from the past is one of the most important things that anyone could do. so thanks to you and the association. [ applause ] >> well, i'm really look forward to this conversation this evening. welcome to those who are joining us from afar. what happens now is everybody's business and cameras, 24/7 will bring in pretty much whatever is happening there to the rest of us. so our panel this evening, it is the best. kelly o'donnell is nbc senior white house correspondent. she's covering the white house for quite some time. interviewed multiple presidents and into any number of news conferences, crisis, places abroad. she's going to be able to tell us what it is actually like today and how that camera and

that image beams around the country and the world. and i talk about him as the most remarkable press secretary that i ever worked with because mike got it and mike came over from the state department, where he was a press secretary, where it wasn't just spin all the time with a lot of substance. and somehow he would try to blend the two for bill clinton. and there were high points and the low points in that tenure. we will talk about some of those and maybe even see one or two. and he's a former cochair of the commission on presidential debates. the other place where the camera has been so important and so influential. and martha kumar is a walking encyclopedia of the white house and brings such an incredible insight to what she talks about. her scholarly focus has been at the white house and can hang out there and bring you not just trivia, but the big

picture stuff too and has written important books that will give a perspective on all of this and how george w. bush and barack obama managed the transfer of power. and managing the president's message and the white house communications efforts, just two of the things that you have looked at that will give some focus here. and i would like to frame this conversation a little bit with a couple of clips and the pictures that will kind of get us started. television is a powerful medium. i was the cnn white house correspondent in the day when cnn was revolutionizing the news and the power of the camera and because suddenly it wasn't just walter cronkite or at 6:30 at night. it was any time that the camera could be on. and the president could speak in a long stage or event, and we might take it live and that brought it to living rooms around the country and around the world in real time. and it wasn't always that way. so let's see if i could make

this work. there we go. john f. kennedy is often said and known as the person who brought the presidency to television and vice versa. this was his first news conference. and in 1962. as mike mccurry points out, it's at the state department, correct? let's just listen to this. these negotiations that you know will schedule to begin everything in february. and we will need more time here in that decision. >> so there he was, standing in front of the group, two microphones. reading from prepared notes. very stiff, very formal. it changed over time. not just the news conference,

but the sit down interview. and it changed over time and it became a crowded briefing room. and that place is jammed as we have been there too. it changed over time with barack obama announcing the death of osama bin laden with a very solemn ceremony and that camera in that foreground is taking the words around the world. what has changed is not just the technology, of course, the speed, but the audience and the expectations. mike, as a press secretary when you think about this change and how this has sort of swept over us and it is now about speed, what is the biggest component in terms of actually communicating from the white house that you see? >> well, i think too often is speed that you need to stay on top of the story and try to stay in front of the story.

that will create a little bit of a dilemma because we don't pause enough to consider what are the most important elements of that because they move and the story moves and they will jump ahead to whatever the next crisis or subject is. so i think one of the consequences of having that televised presidency is that it is all immediate all the time. and you know, sometimes that's not the way the government will work where they work slowly. policymaking will take time. making that sausage is sometimes not an easy thing to put on television. and that is the consequential business of the the presidency and sometimes i'm not sure if they would capture that throughout the coverage they would have. >> and he was young and dynamic and that it was new and not too many people would have it in their homes, growing things.

but bringing together of the picture, that thing on the information here that they are talking about it and talks pretty serious stuff. is that equation of information verses picture changing over time? how do you balance that? and ultimately they are tested as that process will go through, so they know it's a part of their job. that's one of the things that especially happens when there is breaking news is we would look to a president to address depending on the type of breaking news. is there an opportunity to seize the moment to bring calm and answers and to send a message internationally to our partners, allies, or foes? is it a way to bring the nation together? is it a way to control the moment? there are a lot of different

uses that a president can seize the power of the collective experience and that is one of the things that i find very fascinating about working in television is that it is a place where everything that is important in the world is intersecting there. and some of them will bubble up and demand attention and some will take a long time in terms of policy and plans to develop. when something bubbles up, that's a chance to harness that power. we are there every day. the lights are fixed and they could take steps to come to the briefing room or set things up where sometimes you are competing with the sound of the marine one helicopter and so forth. but it is something that they could use or not use. >> and who work closely with president reagan had a great

line that said my job is to light the president. it was his way of saying that they will predominate. how do you balance today? that's 30, 40 years ago now. the picture is hijacking the information that you're trying to convey? >> and the staff has a difficult job of managing the imagery. if they're on the road or traveling and how they would stage that event becomes critical. for example, if they stage an event and you're at a location where there are a lot of choices to be made about where they stand and that lighting they would bring in and different things like that and that camera position, the obligation of the tv pool, which is your constant shot of the president and that will be framed very tight, of just the president. and so they have to contemplate how will that moment look?

and they will have that sweeping picture. trump often said oh, they're never showing the crowd and there is an obligated camera that must always stay on and that image sometimes is particularly attractive one and may not be as attractive as the experience of being there in person. sometimes there is an advanced person challenge and where they are competing with the sound of the rain pouring as he is trying to communicate something important and competing with the chopper as i describe. so there are challenges, but that also adds a reality to the experience. >> and play historian for us here in just a minute because i put up that video clip walking into the press conference where the longest time, it was in some ways, that dominant television image and message delivery system of the president of the united states. and i know you kept track of

this and i remember doing conferences for the white house and remember. prime time was a big deal and america watched. every news room would watch and every headline reflected what happened. what happened to the prime time? >> and the last two presidents, biden and trump had none. >> zero? >> zero. and obama had four, but all in the first six months. reagan, by this time. it's funny that you asked me that question. >> and he had seven nighttime, 15 at the white house and seven were nighttime. when you look at his diary, you'll see he prepared for several days for them. >> it was a big deal for the white house too?

>> it was because this was an opportunity, not only to project him and his personality, but what his interest were and what his knowledge was. so they would prepare some times in one set that i looked at. and he had his economic advisers come in to talk to him with foreign policy, national security, and domestic policy. and so when the president will come out in that press conference, he's pulled together from throughout the bureaucracy information on what was going on. and then he took time on two of those days to practice in the white house theater. >> the point that i would make about that is preparing for that press conference as an action forcing an event where

we would sit around and get ready for the press conference. my job is to be that nasty reporter asking that mean question, which got me in trouble sometimes. but we would give him what that prepared talking point was and that it is just mush. they would say well, do you want to do something about it? and he would call the secretary of labor or call someone else in government saying we need a better question. so they will move them forward and require better decision making, i think. so it is one of the important aspects. >> and that is an interesting thing to ask about and how they focused those in power to think about not just with a they were saying, but what the policy was. >> and the questions too because we are now in a situation where i'm boiling

down to bumper sticker level as few words as possible. can the president hear me? will he know what i'm trying to ask him? and a presidential press conference in prime time that you would have the microphone and the attention. that you could ask a nuance, thoughtful question. and that it is a moment to contemplate it and a thoughtful answer where we are competing with all the other things in the room, trying to get their attention and it will become a haiku. and i hope he hears me. i hope he understands, and i hope he'll answer where it is a different kind of quality of questioning. >> and as we think about the cameras in the white house, that it is one place in venue and that we could see a number of different places in ways in which the camera has played a role. so let's take a few of them now and discuss them with a big

major news event. this is one of the earlier times when the cameras were invited in and they announce that he's going to run for a second term it. president ronald reagan and his top advisers would gather around what? the televisions and watching the coverage of the challenger disaster when america's spacecraft blew up, taking several lives with it. this is a wonderful video clip that i want to share with you and bringing them in to the oval office. to sign the guestbook. and then sit in that, in these chairs. and cameras were live. and an.

and you and tells gorbachev there will be five waves of cameras and reporters coming in from all over the world for i was there for this. okay. and for those of you who are around during and are you going to tell us? there will be five waves of cameras and reporters coming in from all over the world where i was there for this and this is a moment of the incredible high drama. in the oval office. the united states, it's interesting to describe this and what it is all about. mike, what about capturing the mood of the place of a moment like this? >> and bro, you can see here that it is absolutely essential

that the stage managing be carefully done. the moment that it is created reflects the president's priority that it will become an image of something that is much larger and important. the evil of an important change in this world, the end of the cold war and how they've communicated to the people, becomes one of the challenges of being on the white house staff that you would need to spend a lot of time thinking about what are these moments going to look like? and you're conscious of that all the time when you're looking at the white house. >> are there moments like this that are remotely unscripted, where they point out, bringing

people inside, both opportunity and danger? >> yes. when they went on television, his staff had recognized his press secretary. they recognized that you needed to create the shop in the white house. so they said about doing that and they brought in robert montgomery who was a producer, the actor who did staging. you've had them create the press office that existed from 1927. he would formalize the communication operations, that would do the future planning,

doing the state setting. and that was done at the beginning of the nixon administration where they realized it right at 1969 that it is something that they should do and every administration has had such a shock. now will will you get the public's attention because there are so many different ways in which you could do it. >> have you seen the change on how you'll get their attention? there's big changes that have taken place. we were talking a while ago when there was a press conference, were they talking to the country? that's a hard thing to

duplicate today. so how about that threshold that she was talking about? >> i love seeing the clips, all the things that i will take into the white house tomorrow because it is so important to be reminded that we are not just covering today's news event. we're building the historical record. everything you see will tell you who was standing near the president with the body language and who was in that room in a place that will give you some insight about the influences on the presence. for example, biden welcomed in the new democratic leadership. that was in the roosevelt room. and ron who is the current, but outgoing, we believe based on the reporting. the chief of staff was there in the table.

40 years from that, that will tell the story about what was happening, covering it, having a chance to let that moment breathe, it's critically important. >> how important is it and how do you now do it to get a president out there on a big news story? the demand is get there now. >> the structure of the white house staff is important to understand that there are two different offices, a communication office and a press office. and that is the one that will do the planning, orchestrates the events, you know, figures out who will stand with the background and what the message will be. and that is the product development side of the house. the press office is the retail sales department and the operations because you need to go out to sell this stuff. sometimes you win and sometimes you don't and sometimes they

buy and sometimes they walk away. that's the position there that i think is necessary for a successful communication. you've got to have both the planning that will go in to orchestrating the event and understanding what the message and the picture will be. but then you need to have a reliable way to talk about it and answer questions about it and to face criticism, that will face skeptical reporters who are going to ask those tough questions. >> what's the biggest crisis, the biggest news story that we shall not talk about, but we will in the major policy department? >> and it is interesting because we will drift into monica lewinsky, i'm sure. >> let the record show that you uttered that first. >> the harder things, they were the questions and policies that were complicated. >> you had to work hard at it

as i remember at one point, clinton announced that we were going to regulate tobacco. and the theory of the case was that you may not know this, the cigarette is a medical delivery device. that was the theory because it will deliver a dose of nicotine to the human body. on that basis with the rurals and the fda was involved, so i would have the secretary of health and human services there and david who was the head of the fda as they went up and said you guys, you're the experts on this. you need to answer the questions. they got so wrapped up in this regulation that i can tell looking at the reporters, i said, you know, one of them, what's going on? and so those of you who know these two individuals, booted them out of the way and took over the podium because i had stayed up to study this thing and read it. it is hard work. i answered the question and

kept looking at them saying am i getting this right? and that at end of the day, you need to explain things that will be accessible that they will give you that opportunity and that whole country watching at once that you'll get the opportunity to lay the case out and to have people understand what it is that you're trying to accomplish. >> so martha, there's big news of bin laden. a major policy announcement. and there is also crisis in controversy, this is a news conference briefing appearance in the middle of covid crisis. and we would have policy, but we also had controversy. from your point of study, looking at cameras and the impact of television, does crisis in controversy overwhelm

the information? and we get distracted by that? >> well, if you look at that and you see somewhat chaotic scene. and i think that would say a lot about the white house. i think in the administrations, they do handle things differently like bringing in people who are experts, for example, the challenger blew up, the reagan white house brought in people from nassau. and they stayed at white house for a couple of weeks to answer questions about it. when the obama administration, they wanted to talk about the iran deal, they brought this in as an example of success. they brought in the energy

department who was very clear and was able to speak, but to have an understanding of what the reporters knew. so in a crisis, people are going to tune in and the bin laden statement was way at night and around 11:00 and the president, they had to ask for air time. there were concerns around the country that there was something unfolding. so they had to let it out that it was going to be bin laden killing. they had one of the largest audiences ever. >> these huge moments are certainly attracting the audience? >> but they are difficult to come by. >> and let's go down memory

lane for a moment here. and i have, you know, cameras in the white house. these are famous words. >> i want you to listen and i'm going to say this again. i did not have sexual relations. i want to say one thing once to the american people. i did not have -- >> a couple pieces of video running at the same time. okay. so mike, was that double time? [ laughter ] but cameras in the white house and a crisis, okay? i mean they remember well. i do too. and the cameras were everywhere. you would get a controversy and they don't quit. so how do you manage television and this constant focus when

you're in the middle of white hot crisis, controversy? >> i mean the most critical thing is to make sure you have facts and they are reliable. that you can actually put the information together in order to tell the truth. now i got in trouble one time, something i got asked about how she came up before. can you ever lie when you're the press secretary? i said no, but sometimes you have to tell the truth slowly. and what i meant with that, i got in trouble for that. and that sometimes you don't have the complete story or sometimes someone's definition might be different than what hers was or is and so you have to stick to what you know is

verifiable. and that's the only person that is a press secretary to two presidents that said that is the ultimate responsibility of being in that job to verify the information that you're getting. and if you're not completely sure that it is reliable, then you have to back off. and i am thankful that during the whole episode, i never went beyond anything that i was given to me by the president's lawyers. and his legal team. and i had to go after the question after question and one of my briefings that i went on for more than an hour. 47 different questions about what they mean with that and that definition of that and just based on the clip that you just saw. and i stuck to the script that i had been given by the lawyers and that they would say look, i'm double parked in the no comment zone now and that there is nothing else i could see. >> and that i will just jump on this whoever wants to go on it. that's one of the concerns that

were expressed by the public. that television will feed off this stuff and that if there is a problem or a controversy and real news, whatever that might be and however you might define that will get shoved to the back. is that a fair criticism? or is any media, long before there was television that there were headlines on the baby and all kinds of stuff out there. is that a fair criticism of television, kelly? >> i think that there is a great burden on the consumers of news. to be able to work through all that is out there. if you want serious review of policy, there are places to get that. if you want the immediateness of what events are happening now, television is a great place for that. if you want quick headlines, scroll through your phone. i think there are a lot of things that people don't understand about how we do our

jobs, and i understand that and there are plenty of short comings in my understanding of how people do their jobs. but right now, we are in a situation where we have been peppering the current press secretary who is limited in what she has been given permission to talk about with respect to bind's document and the circumstance, referring us to a great deal of the white house council's office. it has been a challenge for the reporters, and i'm sure a challenge for the press secretary as we are trying to find different ways to illicit something new. to cover the ground. to move the ball. and if you are a viewer who is watching that and you may not understand what we're trying to illicit, it can look repetitive, it can look, you know, like we're bullying. there are a lot of things that might not be ideal. that's the sausage making. >> martha, one of the things that's changed, of course, is that we could call it, we can cry about it and also call it the democracy. the presidents have tried to keep up with the technology,

right? so now it is not just television, the nbc camera that's there. but it's a tiktok camera. it is not really a camera, but it will go back out on tiktok. so how have you seen whether it is the crisis or otherwise this technology changing the way that the imagery of the white house is projected to the american people in the world? >> yeah. and that's one of the areas that i could see it is the interviews that president biden has chosen to do. and he's chosen to aim to particular audiences at certain times. and so he's wanted to get to young people, for example, so he had an interview with the east room of the white house that the white house didn't promote except to that particular group and there r with six young people and each one of them an issue, abortion, student loans, things that they individually were interested in. >> and this leaked through

social media? >> it was on instagram, facebook, and it was on tiktok. and even though the federal government doesn't want people using tiktok, the president is using tiktok for his interviews. and so i see it there when he was president and he did interviews. and those that were once our board chairman here. and they would do weekly interviews with the president, all of the news magazines because that's where people were getting their information. >> i want to talk about one other thing too with the television and the white house and the thing that's really interesting and important. that's the camera that's outside the white house. that when the president will go on the road, the camera will go with him. television goes with him. you know, president nixon, pat nixon at the great wall. 1972. and this is a picture of george

walker bush in new york. the famous blow horn speech that we will roll in just a second. the power of the camera that will go with the president on the road to capture a moment and a message. can you roll that clip? [ inaudible ] >> i hear you and soon everyone that brought these buildings down will hear you. [ inaudible ] you.

mike. this is that's great. thank you very much. this is an increase, terrible example of the of the power of the message and the >> i mcan hear you. >> that's great. thank you very much. this is an incredible example of the power of the message and on the road at the time of crisis. >> and one thing that is powerful about that is for all that we have talked about, it is not scripted and genuine and authentic where you really saw

a glimpse of something. and that is the most interesting moment of the presidency when it is not scripted and you see you'll get a glimpse of the character of the person. that's one of the things that you mentioned involved in the presidential debates. that those are some of the most interesting moments in the presidential debates that you would recall that are things when there's a flash of temper or whether there is something that is really revealing about the person and that is something you'll get from television that you would not get otherwise. >> you don't get many of those spontaneous moments, do you? >> there is a potential for it where it will show sandy hook and that is an enduring image with flashes of anger from the president or when they go to

comfort people and that will come through with humanity that television is uniquely able to transmit and people feel it. >> remember, president obama is singing amazing grace in charleston. and not something that any white house aid has said hey, you know, this is what you need to do. >> let's turn the page just a bit and say it is not just presidents who will take advantage. and this is a very famous tour of the white house as you may know. cbs, wandered around with her in a completely different way. and here is barbara bush, laura bush, sorry, sitting down. yeah, they're related.

but don't mistake them. sorry about that. sitting down for an interview as the role first lady will take shape. michelle obama, using the south lawn and the garden and the kids to convey a very different message. martha again as our historians here. how have you seen the first lady's relationship to the camera and bringing that camera in affect the place? >> it is very important. jackie kennedy, the tour of the white house. truman, they had one and it was not quite the same in black and white. and hers, she had an audience that was around 80 to 88 million people. and that was something of a national moment and that what often happens is the first

lady is seen by the senior staff of the white house as a source of maybe she's going to cause trouble. but all of a sudden her poll numbers are higher than his and they start using the first lady where they become important in giving the human element and that view of what the president value like. >> so there is imagery around the first lady? >> and so it is very important. and that we would see that with michelle obama and they seem to be pretty cool where she was very warm and so you would see her there with kids and hugging kids. >> that's one of the things that i think is so important in my coverage across four presidents, but what i think is important for the white house

press corp. to do, to have a chance to talk about the families. things that go beyond politics and beyond the tribal partisan experience that could happen in our country and first lady has helped to do that and the artistic guest and entertainers they would bring to the white house can do that. and i have a side hustle now that's called the first pets and i love to report on the dogs and the cats and because of people, they relate to it. >> and do you have a camera? >> and if they send me pictures of willow, seen in that wild on the grounds there because they will connect people to what will matter about the white house that is not politics where these are real families who would live in that white house and they're a part of our cultural story. >> this is a great piece of video where we saw president reagan bringing them in and

that is mrs. reagan. so it is not just, you know, atmospheric and christmas trees that they are using this to convey the real interest. >> and certainly that it is about afghanistan. and the literacy issues. and they would work for the president in many cases and because of exactly this that we don't have, i have been binge watching the crown, you know, we don't have royalty. but we do have a family and that will convey a part of that story and the narrative of what they are all about. >> eleanor roosevelt was the president's eyes and ears. and so she went out and there

is a wonderful new yorker cartoon where they were e reminders down in the mine and they would say that business roosevelt is coming. she then would report back and she would have her own column. >> let me show you a couple of images here as we'll talk about that with the couple of other great things to open up for questions. so i like to call this elevating the icons. using the white house and the pictures that you could pull out of it. i mean you don't need any words around that. it is maybe one of the weird or pictures of the white house. talk about the unlikely pair. and this also is president obama and the medal of freedom awards in 2016. >> today we celebrate

extraordinary americans that have lifted our spirits, strengthened our union, pushed us. and i always love doing this event. but this is a particularly impressive class. we've got innovators in arts. public servants, rebel rousers, athletes, character actors. the guy from space jam. we pay tribute to those distinguished individuals with the nation's highest civilian honor of the presidential medal of freedom. >> and so here this is an

incredible crowd. ellen degeneres, karim abdul. and to bring in the other dimensions of america. do you put this image on television? >> oh yes. this is one of the events that's often carried live and always included in our nightly newscast. it's one of those things that will jump out into a cultural touch moment. and i also think when the championship teams come to the white house, that is another one that people will relate to and look forward to and certainly medal of honor is another one. when it comes to people who are notable like this, i think it just touches every part of american life. and it is it not about the president. it's about american talent and ingenuity, art, and the president is simply the person

conveying that honor. and it is one of the great american traditions. and they truly enjoy those moments. >> and for more than seven years. and the big story was the white house easter egg roll. people want to see this stuff. and so you are the image meis, it er here. what is the picture and the television that will connect with people? >> well, i mean it's a great example here. it's when you connect to the walks of life that americans will experience and when you touch them about something that is relevant to who they are and what they think the country is about. those are the great moments. and we would talk a lot about television and how they are going to elevate and amplify the moments like this. and they are celebrating something exceptional about the country. but the television also needs

to do the job of giving us the nitty-gritty of the hard work that will go into it. and i wish we had television business of the mark up sessions where people are actually doing that work. >> people were rivetted we the c-span coverage of the process electing or not speaker of the house. >> and right, so my point is there has to be this balance between the glamour and then the gritty. what is the real worker? >> let me ask you one quick question. >> and can i just put something in here on the glamour? last week the golden state warriors came to the white house. steph curry came to the briefing room with steve kerr. and the briefing room was just the block. and that there were so many

reporters reflecting the interest in seeing curry. and then after he left, gradually fewer, fewer, fewer people where they seem to just vanish when it came down to the nitty-gritty of the news. >> and i want you to try to put it in that sound bite and we will see how you do. then we will be just a few minutes. and we have seen the sense of what television and cameras have meant from the earliest days, crisis, controversy, trying to bring them to the people and the public. it comes a time it's a much more competitive, much more rapid fire media that has also

become about social media. whe better? are we being well-served, the public being well-served by this? well, that is mission every day. and it's one that i'm proud to do we understand our white house better? are we being well served? is the public being well served by this? >> that is my mission every day, one that i am proud to do, along with all of my colleagues, to try to take messages of the white house and the issues of the white house, and i happen to work in television, but for all of us various media outlets, to try to tell the people story and the president's story. it's incumbent on those who consume news to do their homework, to scan seek out quality and recognize that news needs to not just be curated, but needs to be edited and needs to have professional structure around it. there is work to be done for

consumers of news. >> is in one of your biggest mistakes was turning the camera on during the briefing. is there too much imagery? >> there is very often too much noise. but i think if i were thinking of the numbers, incredible is the word i would use. that reporters have to be seen as being credible with the reports that they are given to the american people. and the white house's need to tell the truth. and being respected as people who are willing to confront hard truths sometimes and deal with things going wrong, mistakes that happen and that's not an easy thing to do. maintaining credibility would be the gold standard. >> i think that television is

and continues to be important in giving us a sense of who the president is. and it gives a the president an opportunity to get his message out and find out whether the public likes it or not. i remember george w. bush going to the border and doing many interviews and talking about immigration legislation that he wanted, and the public just didn't want it. the retirement accounts also that he first. the message got out there, and a lot of different ways, but he found out that they didn't want what he was trying to sell. but i think if you look at his presidency, you look at him as a person, you knew who he was.

you had a good sense of that. and i think we have gotten that with all of our presidents. and so, i think television has been a positive, but i also think kelly is right. we, as citizens, have an obligation in the democratic government. it is important to maintain that government, and one of the ways of doing it is really finding out what's going on, and reading a variety of news sources, not just following one that may fit in with one's opinion. >> as i like to say, every news consumer is now his or her own executive producer. you choose and you are responsible for the information we consume. a few minutes of questions for the audience if anyone would like to go first. front row, i'm sorry, we will come back to you next. >> you had talked in the

beginning about the primetime press conference. why have we lost it? >> because we have lost the audience. >> there have been occasions where the networks have refused to give the president time for a primetime press conference and i think that's partly because the obvious, the audience has so many other places they can go consume things, 57 channels that would be on. what is the utility and value of running your own entertainment program versus something from the white house, given that they think the president is using this to push a message or sell a story. >> and and i were at the white house for the very first story. they asked the networks for prime time coverage and said no. one of the reasons they gave was this was political or

whatever, so the threshold changed when they were not the principal carriers of this message anymore. they can say, you know, this is not sufficiently newsworthy or we have other money we want to make elsewhere. he didn't say that, but -- >> there is a considerable cost to give up programming, for three networks to do that, so they try to do the balance of what they think public interest is versus giving up that time. >> thank you all for speaking tonight. my question is, provided various comments about it is the public's responsibility to do their homework in regards to the information that is served to us, i have a problem with that. when i first started college, a wannabe journalist, i just wanted to produce the facts. that's what i expect to hear.

i think most people in the room might expect to hear that because we all worked various jobs and may not have time. why would that statement be made? why do we need to do our homework? i get that we need to do our homework but we should just hear the facts from journalists is my opinion. yes? >> what i mean when i am saying that is that we now know there are a variety of news outlets that have an ideological opinion, that may have a niche in the way that they are focused on material, and so what i am saying is to be well informed about a variety of topics, be aware of that so you know what it is you are getting and be mindful of what you are consuming. that's what i'm suggesting. i'm not suggesting that you have to spend all your free time reading lots of news. i am a traditional news

journalist. i do work that is not ideologically driven. and i have worked very hard at that for a very long time. there are lots of different outlets and i think it is actually challenging sometimes for news consumers to know what it is they are getting, so that is the harder part, the reading material. if you are reading things on the internet, you may not know the ideological point of view, whether there is an editor involved. anything i did for nbc, there were multiple editors who review what i do lawyers involved before i put things on television. it is not just me out there on my own. there are standards involved with training and 30 years of experience doing this. there is care put into that. that does not mean i want make mistakes sometimes. we are all human, but there is a variety of ways especially as fractured universe, things will look like news because people can self publish and we can all

put things out there. that is all i meant area be a smart consumer is what i'm saying. >> and i don't mean to let anyone in the media or anywhere off the hook. you are responsible for getting it right, pursuing the truth, revealing sources, being transparent with where the information comes from. you are responsible if you get it wrong. >> all i am saying, to kelly's point, there is so much stuff out there. you need to be an informed consumer. there are really good mattresses and really bad mattresses, right? we have time for a couple more. >> i want to ask you about something called watergate. >> that's a hotel. >> yeah, that's what it is. but you just said about being an informed consumer and i happened to have a baby around the time that -- how long was

that on? for at least days. a long time. and i really want to know how if you all, if any of you know how that impacted society to have the president of the united dates be accused of what he was accused of. and when that was over, when i watched for a few days, i'm telling you, guys, they should replay that. it was clear to me it was a set up deal. the whole thing was a set up deal and nixon took the fall. and i would like your opinion on that. >> there is a lot of history and another series that we could have on that. does anyone want to comment on the impact of the televised hearings of the presidents? >> in those hearings, i think that the public, the whole issue, the coverage by the washington post and the new york times, of all of the things that became part of

watergate, i think the news organization certainly gave respect from the public and for the truth of what they had projected. it certainly has changed as far as public attitude towards government and towards the press , as well. >> we have time for a couple more questions. sure. >> my question might have some similarities to the last one. we've learned through history that years later, the press was covering up for roosevelt with his polio, kennedy with extramarital affairs or his health in general. what changed. was it television or watergate? what was the change that made the press suddenly not want to

play ball with the white house? >> so much changed my right? the media change, society changed. >> i was working in vietnam and it was the realization that the cozy nature of the white house, the reporter, the relationships were just not going to cut it, when you had doubt that you are being told the truth by the president and the people around the president, so i think the culture of that reporter and the relationship changed dramatically. >> television with her, too. it showed people pictures. it showed people with the reality looked like on the ground. people want more information. you see the evidence like the freedom of information act and

the 1960s. that people want to know more. so watergate i think fed into that growing realization that there is a lot more information out there then the public wants it. so i think those efforts have expanded over the years and what we want to know. >> one last question, have you got it or is that it? one last question. she has a microphone. can we do that? bro. >> hi, i am a student at tw. and i was wondering in terms of television, it might die out. do you think it will die out because of social media? >> that is a great last question of the night. what is the future? is kelly going to be unemployed

anytime soon? >> i had a sinking feeling. i think a visual medium is not going to die. what we call it, how you receive it, how you pay for it, how you want it might change. but i think the desire to be connected in a live way, in a way where materials played back. the jetsons model, or something i can't even think of, i think it will continue. you probably don't pay for cable at home, do you? okay, okay. i am impressed by that. most young people do not pay for cable. i will be the last cord cutter on the final day. i have given my professional life to working in tv news. i am bullish on tv. i think people want the opportunity to see things in real time. and i think that will be an

enduring desire. and i think the chance to experience things collectively, which we do not often get to do, to experience something at the same time together, whether we are doing it, watching tv or in some other way connected will endure. political leaders will want to harness that and the white house will always want to be at the forefront of that, whatever we call it. >> i cannot add much to that other than to say that i agree, but we want to be connected to our leaders. somehow or other, visually, we will always have the opportunity i think well into the future to experience some of what our leaders experienced, because we need that. we need to have confidence in them and we need to know who they are. presenting that will change as technology changes. we have seen that already.

i did not have to deal with twitter, facebook and social media in my time. my daughter says dad, that was in the last century, you know. there will be different ways in which we get the story. before the leaders themselves, when they wanted information on what's going on in the world, they look at television. look at the way in which trump was a consumer of news and television. president johnson had his three television screens in the oval office. so the leaders themselves are informed. it is not just the public. >> the technology has changed. the audience has changed. the expectations have changed. to your question, what we hope has not changed is the

commitment to the priority to get real information to the public. making this the kind of democracy it should be. making journalism what it should be all about. what a great conversation. thank you very much. >> thank you. back to you. >> thank you very much to frank cessna, martha, mike and kelly for this very insightful programming this evening. one thing i love about my job is i get to learn something new every day. clearly from the expertise and insights and experience of those here, we all learned something this evening. i'm reminded about how fortunate and blessed we are to have the freedom of the press that we have. people like kelly doing her job every day to bring that

information to us. people like mike foster and accessibility to our leaders. and messages to historians and scholars to have context and retrospective scenarios that we live through everyday on television and in other forms of media. this is the first of four programs that we have on the media and the white house called white house history with frank says no, the next episode will be here in this space on march 30th. the topic will be women in media and the white house. you will all want to be here. we hope c-span will join us for that occasion, as well. to close this evening, i invite you all to join us in the historic progressive hitter house. and so march the 30th, thank you for supporting the white house historical association.

>> weakens on c-span 2 are an intellectual feast. every saturday, american history tv documents america has a story end on sunday, book tv rings you the latest nonfiction books and authors. funding comes from these television companies and more including comcast. >> you think this is just a community center? james wagner f at the kennedy library since 1993, working primarily with the museum staff as exhibit specialist. but his work has had a particular focus the life and times of jacqueline kennedy and her accomplishment as first lady. among the jens wagner has been on staff at the kennedy library since 1993. his work has had a