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host: this is a washington journal for march 23, 2024. plenty of news events this week in washington. the senate passed the 1.2 trillion dollar appropriations package this morning. internationally, the secretary of state urgent israel to hold off on its plans to invade rafah and get a cease-fire in place. in the united states, former president trump to have his properties seized. this may be the top stories of the 4■aeek, or maybe you have others. tell us what you think was the top story of the week you can call on the lines to do so. democrats, 202-748-8000, republicans, 202-748-8001, and independents, 202-748-8002. you could also text at 202748 8003,upr and also reach us in social media. when it comes to some of the things you may want to talk

about, here are some things, you could choose this list or euros to the mix as well. it is congress avoiding the government shutdown in the early morning today, passing in the senate that one printer to the end of the package that is to head to the president's desk for his signature that will keep the government funded for months. secretary blinken head into isro, calling cease fire. the u.n., the cease fire resolution falling. and a question of the prime minister will address congress, speaker johnson plans to convert contractors congress about his plans for rafah and gaza. this week's out there was the second budget impeachment inquiry hearing featuring the former business partner for hunter biden. and then for the president facing a possible seizure of some of his properties because

of his. failure to pay a bond, you can euros to the mix. 202-748-8000 for democrats. republicans, 202-748-8001. independents, 202-748-8002. you can text us us 202-748-8003. that vote that took place in the morning on the senate side, the ap reported this morning that they managed to pass the one printer to the package, and long-overdue action six months into the budget year. that will push any threats of a government shutdown into the fall. the bill now goes to president biden to be signed into law. that was before the vote took place on friday. senate majority leader chuck schumer reference the bill and the importance of its passage. >> it has been a very long and

difficult day, but we just reached an agreement to complete the job of funding the government. it is good for the country that we have reached this bipartisan deal. it wasn't easy, but tonight our persistence has been worth it. i want to thank the great leadership of chair murray and vice chair collins for making this agreement possible. again, it is good for the american people that we have reached a bipartisan agreement to complete the job of funding the government tonight. >> one of the stories that stemmed from the passage of the package, particularly in the house which passed its on friday, was marjorie taylor greene introducing a motion to vacate the chair, threatening a future vote to oust him. a story from axios adding green is not yet forcing the vote to remove johnson as speaker, but the move lays the groundwork for another historic showdown on the house floor.

you may remember speaker mccarthy became the first house speaker to be ousted after republicans triggered a motion to oust him. she spoke to reporters about what she intended to do in the message she intended to send with that filing on the steps of capitol hill yesterday. [video clip] >> today i filed a motion to vacate after speaker johnson has betrayed our conference and broken our rules. we were promised regular order, that is what our conference had started out as, with rules and promises to the american people that we would bring regular order back to congress. speaker johnson betrayed that by passing through resolutions and then forcing us to vote on a two-part omnibus, the second one being today. he also only gave us -- we had pages, breaking the 72 --hour rule.

this is a betrayal of the american people, a betrayal of the american voters, and the bill we were forced to vote on, forced republicans to choose between funding to pay our soldiers, and in doing so, funding late-term abortion. this bill was basically a dream and a wish list for democrats and for the white house. it was completely led by chuck schumer. not all republican speaker of the house, not our coereren't et amendments to the floor to have a chance to make changes to the bill. i filed a motion to vacate today, but it is more of a morning. i respect our conference. i have paid all my dues to my conference. i am a member in goodg. don't wish to inflict pain on our conference and through the house in chaos. this is basically a warning and it is time for us to go through the process, take our time and find a new speaker of the house that will stand with republicans and our republican majority,

stead of standing with the democrats. [reporters shouting questions] >> if it is a warning, doesn't mean you're actually not going to go through and force the vote? rep. green: no, i will. reporter: nothing can convince you to back off? >> there is no timing on this. i don't want to force the house into chaos. i don't want to put our members in a difficult we will continue our committee work and our investigations. there is a lot of good investigations going that have to be able to proceed and the american people deserv that. but i am not saying it will not happen in two weeks or in one month or who knows when, but i am saying that the clock has started and it is time for the conference to choose. host: just some of the stories that spun out from the passage of the one printer to then packu may consider that the top story of the week or add yours to the mix as well.

again, democrats, 202-748-8000. republicans, 202-748-8001. independents, 202-748-8002. make your thoughts known on text or also posted on social media sites there as well. john in florida, in orlando, starts us off on the independent-minded's week. . john, good morning. caller: i want to start by saying thank you for what you do. i think it is so important that we have forums to us to have civil conversations about matters that are very important. i think the top story of the days of the dynamics around the budget because it shows both our priorities as well as what is broken. what i mean by broken is for the through these battles and fights with continuing resolutions we never built the budget in a ctural way. it should reflect the parties of the nation and the major issues like you hear people debating about the border, what we're doing with our economy, and what

we do from a foreign affairs perspective. i think the budget activity shows the priorities and i think it shows, frankly, what is broken on both sides of the. i find it disconcerting that compromise is penalized. it is so true. we used to see compromise pass multi-year, multi-issue budgets and not allow people to devolve into these battles where, frankly, the american people get caught in the crossfire. . the example on the border, the border has to be addressed in a don't see that as a democrat, l independent. both sides have missed the mark. you see republicans fueled by trump. you see democrats led by the president. they have missed the mark by not addressing it in a structural way because we can't have an open border, but we know from the demographic and macroeconomic perspective, we need immigration. it keeps our economy going.

why that cannot be dealt with in the long-term, structural way, shows the difficulties. frankly when you think about it debate on the budget and other issues that transcend that, you think about our current presidential election, i think it also shows it is broken because, the trip i like to say is we don't need a rematch, we need a reset. a reset with candidates that will unite the country and get us focused on the long-term structural issues. host: that was john in florida. let's hear from tim in alabama democrats line. your top story of the week, good morning. caller: good morning. my top story of the week is the atrocities and the genocide that is occurring in gaza. you have the world introduction of condemned the killing of men, women and children in gaza.

you have the united states which is not supported of those -- supportive of those killings, then you have the u.s. which recently said they should have a cease fire, except for china and russia. now you have speaker mike johnson who has invaded man, netanyahu, to come before this country and talk about his war crimes that he has committed against humanity over there. that is my top story, thank you. host: speaker johnson earlier he intends to invite the israeli prime minister to congress to address congress. senator chuck schumer, senate majority leader, saying that if that invite does take place, he would be open to that end a joint session of congress there. again, you can add your story to the mix, especially since the

events in the u.n. the new york times reported on the resolution that was pushed by the united states yesterday. this is the headline, u.s. resolution for gaza truce member runs aground again. it reflected the breaded administration's growing frustration both with the humanitarian crisis in gaza and israel's conduct in the world that has killed 30000, and reduced the enclave to ruins . its refusal to call for a permanent cease-fire doomed the resolution. 11 members voted in favor of the resolution, but russia and china, permanent members, voted against it as did algeria. guyana abstained. it adds the secretary of state, expressed disappointment at the resolution that failed. you can add that to the mix, especially with the visit of the secretary of state to israeli leaders, order you and vote. susan in pennsylvania -- or the

u.n. vote. susan in pennsylvania. caller: i am concerned about most of these people are just young teenagers, they are young people and they want to just shoot people. people are trying to escape to the dominican republic. it is very upsetting to watch it. host: what do you think the u.s. should be doing about it, if anyt?caller: i don't know in the situation because it seems every time we get involved in something like that, it backfires. i really don't have an answer to that, it is just very traveling to see that. host: the atlanta journal-constitution saying there are gangs rampaging through haiti's capital 33,000 people have fled in 13 days, according to u.n. officials. have fled in the span of two weeks as girls continue to pillage homes and attack state institutions. pictures there from haiti, from

this morning. this is from john, in jacksonville, florida, democrats line. hi. caller: my top story of the week is the 10 employees and their attempts to replace --. this to me, is nothing more than treason, but it just goes to show you who is running the government. it is corporations. they are paying off politicians and our congressmen. it's just policy. they are replacing these 11,000 workers and primarily both of them are african-americans. certainly, opening up the borders is basically an attack not only on americans, but to specifically african-americans because these jobs that they claim nobody so called wants to have, it's a lie.

americans work. that's plain and simple. it's nothing more than a lie. thank you. host: that was john in florida. the new york post picking up in the story he referenced, published on the 20th of march, saying tyson foods was slapped with a "refuse to buy" branding after refusing to hire workers. a conservative investment fund group is pulling its holdings of tyson foods over the meat and poultry giant's hiring of migrant workers seeing the practice will repel customers. the american conservative values etf, an exchange traded fund, divested from the company and slapped a "refuse to buy" rating on his stocks. "we believe tyson's management blundered into a political minefield and should have known better constance saysridgeline . james harkin from facebook, when it comes to the top story thi se

trump party speaker of the house of representatives said he plans to invite benjamin netanyahu to speak before congress. this comes in the wake of democrat leader chuck schumer's groundbreaking "enough is enough" speech last week where he urged his removal." david in north carolina adding that regarding the kate middleton, story, when you don't show up for work, you owe your boss, the british people who fund you, and information if you don't wish to be fired." joseph in north carolina saying, how many times do we need to see people like jim jordan and marjorie taylor greene paraded on television to realize they only went to the top news story of the week?" those are some of the top stories you can add. as far as calling us too, democrats, 202-748-8000. republicans, 202-748-8001. independents, 202-748-8002. michael, on this idea of top story of the week, he is in ohio on the republican line.

caller: hello. i just think that it is kind of crazy that people don't really care about what is going on in the u.s., they care lot more abouwh on -- like our border, all the fentanyl allowing this, it is like he is the leader of the mexican cartel. he needs to do something about this. host: what gives you the sense that people don't care about it? guest: i mean, the democrats don't care. they don't care about the border. they let people come over here and then all of our taxpayer money is going towards them and they are getting all kinds of free health insurance. we have to pay our way through life, and then they get all everything. they come over here the other

day -- i am a dumb truck driver, my car got hit on70 by a dumb truck. he hit the done truck and they just give the guy a ticket. you didn't even have a -- he didn't know how to speak english or nothing. they just give him a ticket and let him go, and he's is not even registered, you know. that is crazy. host: with his top story. this is jesse in california on the republican line. go ahead. caller: yes, my thing is, president biden, that guy, you voting for harris. he will not take a cognitive test. when he does a press conference, he always has a cute card. so it's not really biden running the show. when you see him without the cue cards, or a set of writings, he

can't even finish his sentence, that is number two, it is under the biden'sna that keeps these borders open. using to yourself, why is he letting the people in? because the democrats want to use the power of the vote. that only reason they are letting these people in. today and how it was when trump was running -- gas prices were not high. the economy was not as bad. interest rates were not high. the democrats will do anything to keep that power. who has to charge billions of dollars for biden messing with that lady? people get day -- excuse my french -- but they put them in jail. but i never heard that it is preposterous! host: ok, let's hear from doc,

in louisiana on the independent line, top story of the week. caller: i guess the illegal migrants storming our border the other day. i was in the military for four years. that could be ended. when they cross that border with the texas national guard, injuring a bunch of guardsmeg■ n and so forth, one jeep with a mounted 50 caliber machine gun would end that. he wouldn't have any more people crossing the border. but you know what, the communists are here, betty. -- buddy. they are in government, in entertainment, and in media. the communists are here. it's time to get rid of these communists.

host: david in missouri, republican line, go ahead. caller: i just wanted to come on and say that i have regained some faith in the democratic speaker that was speaking earlier on the tyson situation.u that i have lost faith in the republican party and our republican leaders because of their rino actions. i just wanted to say that, we all know the major topics, we know the situation. we need to approach this as the people of the united states in a bipartisan way and come to terms with the people who are supposedly leading us that are in the that is now in control of our country. host: what constitutes a rino action, in your opinion? caller: these republicans in name only that are voting with

democrats to help drive our economy in the ground and blinged this country on purpose. caller: you mean from the budget appropriio yesterday, is that what you are talking about? caller: absolutely. and previously -- same thing. host: as far as what they should have what they did, what do you think -- what would you have liked to see? caller: the unified force to stop this, to stop the reproductive act, slow down the lies going forth. they sugarcoat all these issues and callnt name. to push them through and found them. a“a“ -- to push them through and fund them. host: david in missouri criticizing the actions of the republicans.

criticism also coming on the house side from the minority leader. you will remember the house took its vote on the appropriations package on friday. it was before that passage that hakeem jeffries, minority leader, spoke about natalie the package itself, but republican opposition to it. > we said in the very beginning of this congress that we would find bipartisan common ground our colleagues and issue, whenever and wherever possible, as long as it will make life that is exactly what house democrats continue to do. at the same time, we have said we will push back against extremism whenever necessary. we will always defend a woman's freedom to make her own reproductive health care decisions. we will always mosaic of the amn people and push against unnecessary attacks against diversity, equity, and inclusion. these are american values. we will always fight to protect

and strengthen social security and medicare. and we will always put people over politics. and we hope that that will continue, not just on the democratic side, but together. to solve problems for the american people. as soon as we complete this work , let's turn to our national security priorities and make sure we don't abandon the people of ukraine. in their hour of greatest need as they fight for principles like democracy and freedom and truth and pushback against autocracy, tyranny and propaganda. america should always stand on the side of these principles, like democracy and freedom and truth, and that means standing with the people of ukraine.i the appropriators for their

leadership in concluding this process. i urge everybody to support this legislation, and i hope that as we move forward, and our promise to you but, more importantly, to the american people who expect that in this congress we should have more commonsense and less chaos, we should have more decency and less dysfunction, and more exceptionalism and less extremism, our promise to you is that we will do our best to put the people over politics. and we hope you will do the same. vote "yes" on this bill. i yield back the balance of my time. host: house minority leader hakeem jeffries yesterday for the house passage of that appropriations package also passing in the senate and heading to the president's desk for signature today. . you can chart that as a top story of the week. as well as a traditional affairs

involving israel, with the secretary of state traveling, and the cease-fire resolution failing at the u.n.. the invitation reportedly of the israeli prime minister bennett address congress. that second biden impeachment inquiry hearing that took place this week, we will show you that in a little while. and then also president trump facing that bond payment and a possible seizure of his properties. that is just a suggestion of topics that you can add to the mix. erin from texas adds, "earlier this week, the white house releasing tailpipe emissions guidance. saying that the white house want ssions is forcing us into electric vehicles. we are losing our freedom." you can add that into the mix as our top story. kim in columbus, ohio, democrats line, hello. caller: hello. i want to say first of all, that latinos working in the meat factory, i haven't heard the black people saying they want to work in the meat factory.

they are not going to get us into it with the latinos. i frankly have nothing against them. furthermore, fentanyl was coming in and we all know how it is coming here. it's not coming with any mexicans with it around their thigh. if they had fentanyl around their thigh, they would be dead befo they got to our border. so that is a bunch of hog-mog. they are bringing the stuff here in them trucks. it's not enough where somebody could have been around their thighs and bring it here. it supports a whole country that makes no sense. the last thing i want people coming over the border war, whenever troops were here. how did we miss that? ? they were putting them in military bases, but they were coming. so quit acting like donald trump started. and fentanyl was coming to in fact they were buying more with them checks. host: kim in ohio. let's hear from ken in d.c. of

the ohio line. caller: when i found out this week, clearly, one donald j. trump doesn't have the money he claims to have. last time i checked, his lawyer said a while back that he had plenty of money. he could pay. now she is saying he can't pay, or he doesn't want to pay it. but that's okec he is going to go from moving our up with the jeffersons, to the guterres family with james evans. he is going to the bottom, where he belongs. you know that. pedro. we must have drank the same coffee this morning. host: host: that is ken in■: d.. several stories about the former president today including a possible financial info from. the washington post saying that shareholders voted friday to ■ítake former president trump's media company public, a move that would open the owner of

truth social to stock market investors and grant tramp a stake of billions of dollars that he could use to pay down legal debts. the story adding that he will own 60% of the company, which at the current share price would be worth about $2.9 billion. trading on the stock market will open the company to more public scrutiny and a drop of share prices would affect his stake. and adding that a merger agreement would prevent mister trump and other major investors from selling their shares for six months unless granted a waiver by the board. the new york times also taking a look at the president's influence at the republican national committee. prioritizing his legal fund. rating this morning that in order for entities to receive funds from big donors, there is an invitation to a big dinner next month where top tenners rt-2 contribute $814,600 to

attend. the invitation shows the first $6,000 donated will go to mr. trump campaign, the next $5,000 will go to aipac which paid more than $50 million in legal bills for mister trump in 2023. that 5000? is the maximum the federal rules say can be contributed to the oacp by ana individual. after thatc, the money goes to dozens of state parties. more if you want to read it on the new york times. the new york times also picking up a story from the former head of the rnc, ronna mcdaniel, and a new job for her, saying that she will be hired by nbc news as a consultant. saying that she adds■q conservative voice to the federalists. she is expected to provide commentary on msnbc, at a network that former president trump and his allies often accused of being an arm of the democratic party. quote, "it couldn't be more important to have a voice like

hers on the team." the personal oversees nbc's political coverage rooted memo saying that she will provide an insider's perspective on national politics and the republican party." our next color is on the republican line, on their top good morning. caller: the top story here in california is about crypto tweeting -- crypto trading. i will suggest six. will get the resource person to talk about crypto trading anomalies. host: when you say cryptocurrency trading anomalies, what is happening in california? caller: like they offer crypto trading, either bitcoin or

whatever cryptocurrency, they -- these fraudsters deprive you of your profits, like myself, i have been deprived $35,000. and i am pretty sure it's not only me. i hope c-span will devote at least one or two hours on this business. thanks. us his thoughts. let's hear from linda, in staten island, new york on her top story of the week. good morning, on o independent line. caller: yes, good morning. my top story this week --[indiscernible] 5(so far, i haven't heard that e stopped anyone's addiction or

the issue of falsifying documents or anything like that. but in the housing court, its apartheid. that is exactly what is going on. they don't have a right to turn off our heat and water. even our vulnerable senior citizens. in many cases, two people have died from the wicked court's action. they are forcing birthright citizens into exile again. this is my first eviction from the court. so i will put the word out and ask my government in new york, the new york governor, where is the government to stop these wicked hate crimes? someone needs to step in and put a stop to this. thank you, mr. pedro. host: do you think governor hochul understands the situation or at least is doing something about it? caller: no.

there are moratoriums. but no one is following the law. host: ok, linda in new york talking about what is happening locally there. you can do that, too on, the top story of the week if something is of interest to you and you would like to share it with our audience, feel free to do so on the lines. you could also text us and post on the socials, as well. maybe inichigan, independent nine. caller: i used to be a democrat. even wanted bernie sanders for president. certainly not hillary clinton. so, i started voting for republicans because i understood , even though they were the former good old boy of business only, started to understand that it is about our country and not internationalism. and if you want to protect our country now, folks, you have to

get to work. it doesn't matter which party you are, you have got to turn over congress again here because we only have, what was it, 173, that nationally voe republican side, not the democrat side. they are so out of touch. they are not watching. if you wanted to take over our co you do it? you would bring in immigration. we would make everybody sick with covid. i mean, if you were a compromised politician, he would be selling us out. and that's exactly what is going on and you should watch them. you should watch them and you should do something. then there is the threat of of course, 87,000 irs agents have been added to the force, the federal force that is pressing us for all of these things, and the international acts of war

that are really to just loot us even more. we need to wake up, folks, and throw them all out. host: ok. new york state, margaret, democrats nine. hi. caller: i am talking about they passed the budget last night, and very happy that, and it was the democrats who saved the day. at republicans, they want to take everything away, social security,, they want to put in as the king of all kings. it is a shame what is going on in this country. i don't care what the other woman said before that. we have to be the strong ones in the country, in the world. that is all i've got to say. host: brenda is on the line for republicans in louisiana go ahead. caller: yes, i also am a

former democrat who is now republican. the story of the week, i went to the democrat who just spoke about the budget that wdemocrat. and i am very concerned. i have overheard -- i haven't overheard, i heard marjorie taylor greene wants to vacate speaker johnson is wrong. i am sure that speaker johnson has perfectly good reasons for going along with the democrats on this but i was also concerned to learn that the house members had only 24 hours to go through the budget which was over 1000 pages long.

that concerns me terribly. nobody, except maybe my son, would read 1000 pages in 24 hours. and i was very concerned about that and a word on speaker johnson represents my area of louisiana, he dated town hall here in opelousas, louisiana about a year ago and i couldn't go because i am 100% disabled, vietnam era veteran, confined at home. and i had sent a note via a nephew of mine to speaker johnson to invite him to come to my humble abode to speak with me on the front about what he was g to do with my district in louisiana. and no and behold -- lo and behold, the speaker took the time out of his very busy agenda drop by my humble abode and talk

with me about issues. and my nephew who actually conveyed the notes to him, who is a democrat, said he was so impressed by speaker johnson at the town hall and here on my front porch, that he would vote for him if he ran for president. anyway. host: ok, that is brenda giving us her top story of the week when it comes to speaker johnson the possible vacate motion by marjorie taylor greene. the hill reported yesterday that the house freedom caucus chair was noncommittal friday when asked if you would vote to oust speaker johnson familiar introduction of that motion to vacate. serves the pleasure of 2018 members. i can't make a difference for him as speaker." to be removed from the leadership role. the story saying that bob good provided some criticism, being

unhappy with that spen spending package which was passed on friday, but he acknowledged that the speaker was put in a difficult position within narrow gop majority. quote, "mike johnson admittedly has been dealt a difficult hand and has the most narrow majority in the history of the country, that said, i can't defend his performance." that majority by the way, down a further one with theannouncemene representative gallagher from wisconsin saying he would leave early, narrowing further that majority. the democrats line in ohio, arbor, hi. caller: this is a first time caller. the congress meeting with netanyahu. i remember the act, which i would appreciate if you would find and read, it's not congress's job to meet with the prime minister, the prime minister needs to go to the president, and then to congress. but it has been a while.

and i don't have a perfect memory. if you can read the logan act, i would appreciate it. host: as far as the invitation itself being extended, you have an issue with that? caller: yes, because if he doesn't meet with the president, i understand the logan act, if i remember it correctly, he must go first through the president and then through congress. host: yes, but as far as if the invitation was extended to speak to congress, we do have a problem with that? caller: no one is above the law. host: that is barbara in ohio. john in florida, independent night, hello -- independent night, hello. caller: hello. i think the story of the week is the fact that an ivy league school named view the -- beat a

southeast conference school named auburn in the basketball tournament and all the other stuff that everybody else is talking about is just noise. host: what is significant about the basketball game as compared to everything else? caller: that is what the country is watching and teright now, nos political garbage, that is what they are paying attention to if you look at the statistics. host: host: thank you, john, for the comment, but you are watching us so i assume you are interested in politics as well, at some level. caller: oh, yes. [laughter] fair enough, march madness is your top story of the week. john in florida, tnk. west virginia, james comer republicans line, hi. caller: i think marjorie taylor greene is doing a pretty good job. and the house speaker is doing a good job, too and he needs to stay in there.

the public. there are so many bills that they have to make up their minds on. these congress people, they get paid every day of the year. why haven't they provided us in the poor sections and take four of those things they want to pass at a time and they will not have to pass all of these bundles that nobody knows what is in them because there arsohoe changes as to how appropriations get past general, and if you change that, maybe it will prevent things from happening like we have seen in the last few weeks? caller: yes, they don't need to be on tv doing all this stuff so people can see them they need to do it four times a year a set of doing it all at once and nobody wants to pass it because there's too many things in them. look at the money for all these immigrants coming across the

border, we are given of all of this money and taking care of them. and we are not even taking care of ourselves. the border has got to be closed. host: that is james in west virginia giving us his thoughts. you can do the same. democrats, 202-748-8000. republicans, 202-748-8001. independents, 202-748-8002. we told you about that vote at the u.n. yesterday at the security council about the resolution calling for an immediate cease-fire in gaza. it didn't pass. it was vetoed by russia and china and other countries, but one of the comments coming about that is former u.s. ambassador, linda greenfield thomas, urging council to support the vote and pass the cease fire resolution. [video clip] >> by adopting the resolution before us, we can put pressure on hamas to accept the deal on the table. colleagues, you don't need me to tell you that everyday without a

deal, meaning everyday without a cease-fire, leads to more needless suffering. for more than 100 hostages, including a one-year-old child being held in captivity by hamas and other groups. for innocent palestinians in gaza who have been displaced, who are starving, who desperately need peace. for israelis who have continued to face missile attacks from hamas, a terrorist group that set this conflict into motion on october 7. everyday without ideal means more needless suffering. this resolution will move us closer to securing that deal and help us alleviate that suffering, and i urge all councilmembers to vote yes. to vote for a resolution that at long last condemns hamas further terrific terrorist attacks and sexual violence that makes clear ■dthat all civilians, palestinis

and israelis, should be able to live without fear of violence. that demands the proten gaza as that a major ground offensive in rafah poses a grave threat to civilians, even as we still work toward eliminating hamas from all parts of gaza. that calls on israel to eliminate all various restrictions to humanitarian aid especially as the threat of farming lose large in gaza. that condemns calls to resettle gaza and makes clear thathe palestinian authority should have ultimate authority over gaza and that reiterates this council's support for a two-state solution. this is a strong resolution. it is the byproduct of the exhaustive, inclusive negotiations.

it reflects the consensus of this council and it does more than just call for cease fire, it helps to make a cease fire possible. it will be a historic mistake for the council to not adopt this text. and i again urge all councilmembers to vote yes. thank you. host: that vote did not happen, that resolution not passed. you can see the vote and the various members of the international community commenting on it on c-span.org. . if you have the app, you can also view it at c-span now. from canada, if you are saying that their top story is the impending withdrawal of american support for israel. when they withdraw the navy from the mediterranean and stop funding the iron dome, israel is done. that is mark from canada. cornell from facebook saying -- chuck schumer speaking up for over 30,000 palestinians, a little limited children being killed and they can't call him

antisemitic. history is going to frown on famine and basically a land grab. those are events internationally that are going on, you may remember senator schumer recently making a speech calling for changing elections in israel and that got a lot of pushback on the capitol. you can see that on the website and the app astime in florida, t line, your top story of the week. hello. caller: i have to say, before i get tonight -- the guy that called in about basketball i mean, way to lighten up my morning. that was a funny call. [laughter] but my big issue of the week, with the money that we are willing to send to other countries, the acp program is coming to an end. i may not have internet and they may not have, even the ability to what your program anymore.

because i am no-income. i just don't -- because i am low-income. i don't know why congress is not moving on extending the program. host: just so viewers at home no, at is from the feral communications commission, the affordable connectivity program, as it is called. time, if i recall correctly, congress is yet to vote on funding for, that how much longer do you have assistance from that program. caller: two weeks. host: so if congress doesn't act on it, that stops as far as accessibility to you? caller: yes, and my bill for internet and cable is going to go up about 40 something dollars. and i know that doesn't sound like a lot of money, but in my particular situation right now, $40 is a l around with $200, three hundred

dollars cash in my pocket, i have owned a couple of . but things have changed for me. $40 is $40. that's a lot. it makes a difference. host: tom talking about other matters when it comes to top stories. like i said, you can add that to the mix, especially how it affects you at home. rhode island on the democrats line, matt, hello. caller: hello. hi, pedro, how is it going, this morning? host: it goes well. caller: i think right now the top story for this week and every week until it is over is going to be gaza. i have such empathy right now for the israelis and the likud party and for the people in gaza being killed. and i have so much empathy for you, pedro. and i wanted to say, you know, i

listen to you take these calls being, day out of just absolutely brainwashed vitriol. i have to answer a question which has been asked, which is why has a two-state solution field so many times, right? you have had this question a couple of times and nobody seems to be able to answer it. i will tell you right now, it is because you can't have a peaceful two-state solution with one of those states is a fascist ethno-state that suppresses its population, brainwashed them into hating a minority in that area and their neighbors. you can't toss having this -- and they say oh, it's the only democracy in the region, right, but it is not. it's a fascist, apartheid state.

on october 10, somebody said really well, that if you want to be part of the first world, right, if you want to be a "western state," you can't have these ethnic-nationalist ideas. the ultimate thing here is we have to put the onus on these people, these people owe an entire population of 2 million their lives back, their proxy back. and it is not just the idf and the likud party, it is the united states. host: ok, matt in rhode island giving us his thoughts. john from facebook saying top story of the week -- former president trump's legal problems, that he has scrambled to raise an enormous another money. how he will raise it is another mystery that we will see revealed. the other big story is that horrible attack that isis is claiming responsibility for carrying out. the death toll is at 90 as of

this morning. this took place at russia. reuters saying that u.s. intelligence confirms that the islamic state has claimed responsibility for that deadly shooting attack at a concert near moscow on friday, saying it was the islamic state in khorasan, named after an old term for the region that includes part of iran, turkmenistan and afghanistan. . it emerged in eastern afghanistan in the 2014 and quickly established a reputation for extremeaffiliates of the ise militant group. isis-k has seen its membership decline since peaking around, 20 the taliban and u.s. forces inflicting heavy losses again, that story from russia, from reuters, if you want to catch it and read it there. let's hear from rob in new york on the independent line. caller: good morning. it's a twofold thing. number one is our borders are still open, illegals are still invading the country.

but the most important thing i saw this week was the impeachment inquiry of joe biden. other proof was put out that anybody would need to get this president out of office. he sold us out to the highest bidder for cash and be in prison. that should be everyone's top story. we are at war. we are on the verge of world war iii with russia. and why is that? because joe biden and his family took bribes from ukraine and russia and china to bring our country down. that should be the most important story and no one has talked about basketball. come on, get real. you really think that is the most important story, sports? get a life. host: that second bite and impeachment hearing with hunter biden's business partner, you can see the full hearing on c-span.org. but here is part of his opening statement. v [video clip] >> should i allow hunter to give his opening statement first? >> it doesn't appear mister

biden should have for his public hearing, so we will recognize you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you for this opportunity to speak with you and present my truthful testimony to the people. i sit under oath member for one reason and one reason only, the american people deserve to hear the truth. although the truth involving the deep corruption of the biden family including the malfeasance of the sitting president of the united states, might be raw and unpleasant, the american people much. you are presented with two narratives in this investigation, a false one being pushed by joe biden, a serial liar and fabulist not under this impeachment investigation for corruption, his brother jim biden, is 75-year-old man who can keep his lies straight, including under oath member, and son hunter biden, a chronic drug addict facing indictments of 12 counts. you also have the truth confirmed by multiple business partners of the biden family for many years, and backed up by

irrefutable evidence including text messages, emails, documents recordings. t only biden family business partner with an impeccable military record. i am grateful this country has ve the freedom to be successful. i worked hard to be independently wealthy, i have taken several businesses public, sold multiple businesses to private equity firms, in fact, my business success is why they sat me out. however, what they have done is use i am a patriot and a truth teller. host: again, if you want to see that hearing, the testimony and the questions yo that at c-span. rhonda is in new jersey, democrats line. hi. caller: good morning, pedro and good morning to my fellow americans. my top story is the fact that donald trump owes $500 million

to new york. and the fact that this man has all of these properties and n't have half $1 billion, and the fact that he had all of our classified information ok, at mar-a-lago, indicted person v said he transferred the documents to bedminster where the fbi was at the door. ok? jared kushner made $675 million in his tenure, got $2.5 billion two months after leaving the white house. come on guys, we are in big trouble. i want merrick garland to do his job. i want the supreme court to give us an answer on immunity.

they have no problem putting trump on the■h ballot in colora. they know he doesn't have blanket immunity. give us an answer. we have a right to know if donald trump is guilty of treason. host: ok, rhonda in new jersey. mark is in the neighboring state of new york, republicans line, schenectady. caller: good morning. how are you doing? host: fine, thank you. caller: i was just calling about how they want the cease-fire in israel. i never hear them talk why they don't like a ceasefire over in russia and ukraine and how they want to keep on giving them money with no situation that's going to be solved over there. i think we should stay out of the russian, palestinian problem, the situation. re of their own. we have a lot of problems going on here in the united states,

which is joe biden. i heard the other day that ck obama visits joe biden lick two or three times. i guess he is worried about the race, about the campaign. my opinion, this is bad. a lot of people, the black people, the hispanic people are worried and concerned about what joe biden has done to this country, the wars, the border, the gas prices. china is threatening our country with buying propertand staff. that is all i have to say. host: one more call from ron in michigan, independent line. caller: thanks for taking my call, i really appreciate it. my goodness, deliver to start here. people, we are in trouble. as the caller from new york

said, we are at war. we are, man. number one in my opinion is the border. what are we going to do? what can we do? we are at war? in war, we put out minefields to stop the enemy, we put out armed guards, which apparently our national guard was not even armed the other day when illegals came in and a rampage to -- unbelievable. anyway. also, term man, we have to get these old guys out. they really mess things up. things up in my opinion. looking at the biden family corruption, we are in trouble. we are at war and in trouble. host: ron in michigan finishing off your our of top stories. thank you to all of you who have participated. we will turn to the attention of efforts on the state and federal level to legalize cannabis and

joining us for the conversation is beau kilmer of rand corporation to tell us what is going on in the federal government on that front. later on we will hear from former trump office of management and budget official vance again -- ginn we will talk about his podcast "let people pr and economic news of the day. both of those coming up on washington journal. ♪ >> since 1979, in partnership with the cable industry, c-span has provided complete coverage of the halls of congress on the house and senate■w floors to congressional hearings, party briefings and committee meetings. c-span gives you a front row seat on how issues are debated and decided with no commentary, no interruptions and completely unfiltered. c-span, your unfiltered view of government.

>> american history tv exploring the people and events that tell the american story. on the civil war, edda fields -black talk about harriet tubman's role in a secret military mission against confederates in south carolina that rescued more than 700 former slaves. we will take a tour of the congressional investigations exhibit with christine blackerby looking at the investigations through the years to the sinking of the titanic to watergate. she will explain the investigation process and artifacts included. and this weekend, american history tv gives its new series congress investigates looking at its historic investigations that led to changes in policy and law. we will look back on the group -- on the joint how senate in 1871 that investigated conditions in southern states

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line dived into the water and dragged her to safety. [applause] >> c-span, powered by cable. >> washington journal continues. >> joining us from california is beau kilmer of rand corporation, the codirector of the drug policy research center to talk about the efforts on the state and federal level for the legalization of cannabis. good morning. guest: good morning. host: a little bit about the rand corporation overall but particularly in the the work of the drug policy center, what is the goal? guest: we have been around for 75 years, we are nonpartisan, nonprofit research organization that focuses on trying to improve policy and decision-making through research and analysis. we have 1000 researchers working on critical issues but at the intersection of the work that we

do on health and criminal justice we have the center whicn around for 35 years and we work on all aspects of substance use and interventions with a goal of trying to inform policy discussions in the united states and abroad. host: when it comes to the effort of legalization of cannabis can you give us an overview of where states are on that front? guest: i want to make it clear, we do not have an official position, we are just doing the research. at this point, 24 states have passed laws which allow for commercial sales and production of cannabis. they are not open and all of the states, but this covers more than 50% of the u.s. population. i suspect that other states will go down this pathway as well. host: why do you think so many states have signed are those dr? guest: on one hand it is reducing arrest which is one of

the arguments made in terms of drug arrests, cannabis was always at the top. also, some states are looking at this as a way of generating revenue, but you have to be very careful in how you set up taxes. and in general, public opinion on cnabis has changed quite a bit over the past 25 years. so, in the general gallup polls most people support legalizing it. the one thing to keep in mind is that if you are moving from pope -- prohibition to allowing a legal supply in the united states we decided to focus on this kind of for profit regime. we need to realize that outside of the united states there is what -- much more interest in middle ground options which allow some form of supply but they do not allow commercialization. host: how does that work? guest: it depends. for example in luxembourg and

malta, they recently passed where you can produce it at home , but you are not going to be able to buy it in stores. what malta is also doing is allowing for cannabis social clubs, nonprofit collectives that people can join. and you know they would go in and cover the cost of the product that they are going to be using, they will pay or work at t cso you see this model in w different places in europe. in fact, germany just■ past legalization earlier this week and there will be two components to that. as of april 1 adults will be able to grow up to three plans at home and in july they will start opening up cannabis social clubs. it is a way of making supply available where u do not have the for-profit companies and all of the promotion. host: back in the united states

states are signing on to sell this recreationally and the drug is still federally classified as a scheduled one drug. how do those exist at the same time? guest:hat is a great question. in fact in welding 12 when -- 2012 when colorado and washington past the ballot initiatives to legalized cannabis no one was sure what the federal government was going to do. it was not until august 2013 that the hartman of justice put out a guidance memo saying this is illegal under federal l but as long as you follow these guidelines we are not going to make it into a priority to target you or the industry. and so that was before -- referred to as the cole memo. and then once president trump got into office with a.g. sessions, he rescinded the memo but for all intents and purposes nothing changed. so the federal government has

largely just sat on the sidelines and watch today's commercial industry develop in more than 20 states. host: how would you characterize the biden administration's approach to this? guest: so, it was october, 2022 that president biden made a statement about cannabis policy and made it clear that he thought that marijuana prohibition was disproportionately affecting people of color and also said that the u.s. had a failed approach to cannabi and we need to right the wrongs and then set i have three ideas. the first thing he was going to do is to pardon the individuals had been arrested for simple marijuana possession at the federal level or within washington, d.c. but realize that will not affect a lot of people because most of the peoe they get arrested for cannabis possession happens at the state and local level. this could affect thousands of people and not millions.

so he made that announcement in october 2022. the second thing he said is that he would encourage states to do something similar. so we have seen various states before and after his announcement having conversations and implementing approaches to ceiling or expunging the offenses that eventual might have -- individuals might have for low-level cannabis violations. the third thing he wasoistration to review how cannabis is scheduled or classified under federal law. that is underway. host: we continue on with the guest, if you want to ask him questions on the state or federal level, 202-748-8000 for those of you in the eastern and central time zones. 202-748-8001 if you are in the mountain and pacific time zones. and you can also send us a text at 202-748-8003. to pick up on that, it is health and human services ultimately

making that recommendation. what did they decide upon? guest: it is not just health and human services. if you want to reclassify how a drug is scheduled under the controlled substances act that can happen two ways. congress can pass a law that says we should move schedule or deschedule ag or you can do this through executive action. initially what he did and how he started the process was he asked attorney general to do an assessment. it was in august of 2023 that health and human services said we believe that cannabis should be rescheduled from being a scheduled one drug to a schedule three drug. now the decision is with the dea. the dea is doing its own review and they do not have to follow the recommendation of dhhs -- of hhs. it is unclear when they will make an announcement. host: on that front, the dea has a five-part test when

considering this kind of situation which includes taking a look at the chemistry if it is known and reproducible and if there are adequate safety or controlled studies proving efficacy. if the drug is accepted by experts and scienif that is thet are the hurdles as far as federal legalization? guest:we talked about this contd substances act and within that all controlled substances were classified into five different scheduled -- schedules. in general schedule one is much more restrictive than schedule five. we have these five categories but it is best to think about it as two buckets. if there is a substance that does not have a federally recognized medical value it automatically goes into schedule one. and then if the federal government does recognize the metro -- the magical value --

medical value it is scheduled to through five. since the federal government does not recognize t medical value and the use of cannabis as a treatment. that means that it is our -- automatically put into schedule one with■s heroin and put their with lsd and so some people say why are we acquainting them? it is not the case. if it does not have a recognized medical value it goes into schedule one. if the dea were to agree with hhs and move it from scheduled one -- schedule one to schedule three, that could have a number of implications. it will reduce barriers of research. you can do research on the schedule one drug but there are a lot of hurdles to jump through. it would provide tax relief to cannabis businesses. right now cannabis businesses cannot the doctor their business expenses federally because it is

a schedule one drug. if it was moved to schedule three they could deduct those expenses so it could be revenue for these companies or more promotional advertising because now they can write that out. if you move from schedule one to schedule three it will reduce the penalties associated with cannabis. it is not going to change all of them because there are some specific to the schedule you are in and then there are some sanctions that are specific to cannabis. but then it would also send a signal that the biden administration is taking action on cannabis. that said, if it#ñ gets moved to schedule three, that will not resolve any conflicts or make it legal. you will still have those issues. also, it is unclear how much of a difference it will make. if it is schedule three that means it can be prescribed.

but for a drug to be prescribed it has to be approved by the fda. the fda has not approved cannabis as a drug that can be prescribed. so, i have to say if it moves to schedule three there is a lot of uncertainty. i should say the congressional research service in january produced a useful document on this. but if it does move from schedule one to schedule three the question will be will more money be put into the fda as they deal with this complex issue. host: know that itea and if it passes muster and they say it is ok to make that move, and -- is it automatic and who makes the decision? guest: it is with the dea so it will be an administrative rule. but as i mentioned before, this administrative process is only one way. the other way is that congress could pass a law saying we will move it from schedule one to schedule three or schedule five or just%8 deschedule it.

it would no longer be under the auspices of the controlled substances act. when we think about cohol and tobacco, those two are not part of the controlled substances act. host: beau kilmer of rand corporation joining us with this conversation, the codirector of the drug policy research center. pat in oklahoma starting us off. go ahead. caller: thank you for taking my call. i live in oklahoma. they just legalized medical marijuana. people do not understand when it comes into your area how destructive it is to you. that allows the farmers that are growing this stuff to come in, right next door to you to do their growing, they do their processing, we smell like a herd of skunks all the time.

we have people laying around on the street they are so hooked now. of course they are learning some things that i understand that they did not want everybody to know at the time they legalized it. and of course, this gentleman is possibly pushing for it to be legalized recreationally. i pray to god that that does not happen. i myself have had to call the natural gas people, like i said the odor is horrendous. and then guess what? say me as an individual does not have any say in what comes right into my yard next door. host: in oklahoma. that is her assessment. how do you respond? guest:

oklahoma in a while but that is my assessment as well. oklahoma gave out a lot of licenses for cannabis businesses. and so, you often hear about them being thousands of stores throughout the state. and this gets to an important decision we are talking about medical legalization or legalization for nonmedical purposes. it is not a yes or no decision. if are going down this pathway considering alternatives the prohibition there are a lot of choices you have to make that will ultimately influence what it means for public health, safety, and social equity. some of those basic decisions are are you going to wen yu are giving out the licenses, limit the number so you do not have overproduction? are you going to limit the number of stores that can sell it? so oklahoma is an example of a place that essentially made it very easy for those -- for people to get into this business and they did not necessarily

have a lot of regulations. you compare that to washington, where washington state has a limit on the number of retail stores that can sell cannabis for recreational or nonmedical purposes. the devil is in the details. and so, oklahoma took this approach. oregon is another state that just gave out a lot of licenses. you have to be thoughtful about this because you give out a lot of production licenses and you are not putting caps on production you are likely to eventually have an oversupply and what that means is that that will push prices down and make it harder for these businesses to compete. these decisions about the number of licenses to give out either for production or sales, those are important policy choices and those require some thought if you care about public health and safety outcomes. host: steve in massachusetts. good morning. guest: hello, i just wanted to make that comment that i have

been a lifelong marijuana smoker so i know some about it. but my children during our entire lives never knew that i got high. now, i would rather see marrow donna -- marijuana be de criminalize before legalized. you say the government makes money off of it and that is the only reason they are involved at all is because the money that they are making off of it and i think they should not be growing it or selling it. they should be decriminalized. you get caught with announce it is a $10 fine and a pound■ñ is $100 but it should not be that they are making money off of marijuana. secondly, i want to ask is why is there no warning on any of the labels for marijuana that you buy from the state, no negative effects to marijuana whatsoever, secondhand smoke or

any kind of effects at all but there is nothing on there. if you buy any other kind of drug there is a list a lot -- a mile long. drowsiness, do not carry -- do not drive a truck, and on. that is my question is. -- that is my question. guest: you raise a couple of good points. the first one is helping people understand the distinction between de criminalization and legalization. when people are talking about legalization will talk about . when we talk about de criminalization means that reduce the penalties for possessing small amounts where it is no longer a criminal offense. it will not be a felony or misdemeanor, maybe it is a $10 or a fine or civil offense. it does not -- the possession is not legal it will not be a criminal offense if you get caught. that is very different from when we talk about legalization.

when we talk about legalization, that is when you are essentially allowing some form of supply, either people can grow it at home or in germany that will have these social clubs. in the united states we have a lot of for-profit companies getting involved. there is an important distinction. once you change the policy with respect to supply that will have many different effects compared to decriminalization. i am glad you highlighted that because there is a lot of confusion. when we are engaging in conversations you want to make sure you are on the same page. if you are using the word de criminalization and you are talking about legalization that will not lead to a productive conversation. host: the vice president was part of a forum on marijuana reform. here is part of her comments. [video clip] >> i cannot emphasize enough to it as quickly as possible and we need to have a

resolution based on their find athis issue is stark when e considers the fact that on the schedule currently marijuana is considered as dangerous as heroin, as dangerous as heroin. and more dangerous than fentanyl , which is absurd, not to mention patently unfair. so, i'm sure that da is working as quickly as possible and will continue to do so. we look forward to the product of their work. [end video clip] host: what you think about the comparison she made? guest: before i want to get to what the vice president said and i want to get to steve's second point. he raised another point about warning labels. and that he does not see them on the products that he is consuming and once again this is back to some of the choices that

you have. you do not just legalize, there if you go to canada or other places, they are taking the warning labels pretty seriously. i know that some states are as well. but once again because this is happening at the state level you have just patchwork not only of laws but of regulations. and so, hopefully that will change because people need to know that there are risks associated with cannabis. back to what the vice president said. you know, she was speaking about scheduling. and as we mentioned earlier, schedule one drugs, if a drug has no federally recognized medical value it automatically goes into schedule one. that is why canavan is -- cannabis is in there with heroin. there are a couple of different choices. you could re-schedule or it can

go from schedule one to schedule three. you can be de schedule it. and then people said maybe create a new schedule for substance is where we still have a lot to learn about them but they might not be as harmful as other controlled substances. there are a lot of options and this could happen through the administrative process or congress can pass a law. host: timothy, alaska. the morning and you are up. caller: i appreciate the conversation. i personally from two standpoints have an issue with all of this. first, we do have legalized marijuana. and i do not really think it has been beneficial to the populace. ?$i think that as the other pern had mentioned i would prefer to see this decriminalized. we are willing to get the people

out of the prisons who have been incarcerated for this. i think that that needs to be put on. the other thing that i wanted to mention is that i noticed that there is not a lot of african-american owners of franchises for marijuana and i think that is unfair because a lot of them have records and a lot of the state governments or the governments will not allow people who have records to own franchises. of course the reason they were in prison a lot of time where because of marijuana or other reasons as well. i certainly think that should be the case. so i -- because i have had problems myself with substance abuse, i do not like to see that we are moving more into it. i concerning methyl crestone -- methoprestone with abortion and i wonder if that will fall into this category where we are

moving this off of schedule or recriminalizing marijuana. host: timothy, thank you. guest: timothy, you raise a good point about social and racial equity. in the conversations that people are having now about legalization, social equity tends to be a front burner issue. it was not always that way. i have been a part of these conversations are 10 to 15 years. early on social was not really part of the conversation. people talked about reducing arrests and reducing racial disparits.it was not until overt state starting thinking more broadly about this. so, the later adopters for legalization, some of them might be easier to seal or expunge■# previous cannabis offenses because i can be useful. you have a criminal record there

are a number of barriers it creates. if you have a conviction for a drug arrest including cannabis that adds additional collateral consequences. early on you saw some states making allowances for expungement or ceiling but they still put the onus on the individual so you would have to petition the court and hire a lawyer and depending on the resources that you have that can determine whether or not you could do it. states began to realize that was an issue so there was this evolution towards putting the onus on the state. if you're going to expunge or seal offenses have the state do it and do not put that responsibility on individuals. you move from reducing arrests to expungement and ceiling and then people said what will you use the tax revenue four. some places tax revenues for various social programs. in illinois, they are using their cannabis tax revenues to help with slavery reparations, so there is a lot of variation on how this is used across the

country. there is also some states and that have been thinking about social equity in terms of giving licensing preferences to individuals. and i have to say, there have been a number of these efforts in terms of license preferences and it is taking time. it is already pretty expensive to get into the cannabis industry depending on what state you are in in terms of amount of capital needed. also, especially in your more mature markets, it is already hard for smaller businesses to compete. even though we have the federal prohibition you have bigger players that are pushing down the price is and here is the thing to keep in mind when you are thinking about![ these varis not only social equity programs but also with tax revenues is what you have federal prohibition right■[ now and the prices began to plummet, especially in oregon in 2017 you

could maybe get a gram of let's say 20% thc for over $10. today it is less than four. we see these declines in a number of places. however if you were to legalize at the federal level that could dramatically change the economic landscape which would have implications of a separate tax revenue, the size of the illegal market -- the legal market. you talk to people who are in this -- are in the industry a lot of people complain about the federal prohibition because it makes it harder too and they are tax implications and what a lot of those folks do not tell you but they are actually able to stay in business because of the federal prohibition. federal legalization could look ke a lot of different things, that if you were to legalize federally and it was no longer prohibited from moving cannabis across state lines could see the industry concentrate very quickly. so with some my colleagues we

estimated that you could produce all of the delta nine thc on a few dozen industrial sized farms and that is it. also, if you were to allow -- if they were legalized at the federal level, and that is when the big companies get involved, the alcohol and tobacco you could get amazon delivering. that would put a downward pressure on price making it harder for smaller businesses to compete. another question is if you legalize at the federal level are you going to allow imports because it might be cheaper to produce the cannabis offshore, extract out the thc and everything else and send that back to the u.s.. so, timothy you raised this really important point about social and racial equity and we need to be thoughtful about the different policy level or -- layers. as i mentioned earlier, we have seen a number of states making

easier to expunge or seal offenses and that makes a lot of sense. host: this is beau kilmer codirector of the drug policy research center. ed in- georgia. go ahead. caller: thank you for taking my call. i am a snowbird so i am down in georgia for the winter time. and my summers i traveled north and i have a cottage in michigan where recreational marijuana is legal. and it is unbelievable what it has done to the state. i am a user. i have been using it since the mid-70's when i was in college. was 25 or $30 an ounce. and when i get back to georgia in the wintertime, i asked my friends who are users how much do you pay and they pay upwards

of 170 five dollars and more an ounce because it is not legal down here for recreational use. in michigan, i pay for it and i like to help friends out, you cannot give it away because everybody has it. there is no black market. you know, i can understand -- i understand that there is ■xnot a lot of research still done on that and i think that is because of the way it was scheduled. i think once it is scheduled properly, research will be done. and even when you legalize it, you are not going to increase the smokers because the smokers are there right now and doing it whether or not it is legal or not legal. host: ok. that is ed in georgia.

there is a profile in the "new york times" about new york state. 81 legal shops and 2000 illegal ones. i think you've seen trends as well. guest: not like this. as a jurisdiction and as you are thinking about moving on this pathway towards legalization and pass it. even after it goes into effect there tends to be a couple of years where you have to system,e producers and stores. and so new york had been going through that for a while. was making these decisions about licensing, you started to see a number of illegal stores popping up, even in bodegas they were selling this and it got out of control. so, this has a couple of implications. you have all of these places that are illegal and not paying

the taxes on it. so, a lot of consumers are choosing them. getting back to social equity, new york was smart about this. what they said early on is we are only going to give the retail licenses either those we deemts who come from communities disproportionately affected from prohibition and nonprofits. there int■sention was to give support to the smaller entrepreneurs early on. but realize because they did not enforce the law against illegal shops, you now have all of that happening and lower prices and social equity licensees and your nonprofits that are just getting started and trying to compete at their product costs a lot more than what you are seeing. this gets to a larger issue that if you are thinking about

legalization, you might end up spending more money on enforcement in the■o early days. what new york's audit that should have done is nipped in the bud. and then they did and the situation is out of control and now they are working hard to reduce the number of stores. i suspect that over time they will be successful. in the meantime that puts the social equity applicant licensees and nonprofits at a disadvantage. that is somethinthat the you have to be -- that you have to be thoughtful about. you have to realize that if you do that you need to allocate resources to prevent what happened or what is happening in new york. and i just want to follow on one other thing that ed said which is a good point and he was talking about how in michigan he does not think that there is much of an illegal market. and this gets back to what your priorities are. in terms of debating cannabis legalization you have to --

people come out -- come out this with different values, risks and goals. for example if your main goal for legalization was to reduce the size of the illegal market as quickly as possible you could do what michigan did which as you give out a lot of licenses and just tried to drive the prices down to make it harder for those in the illegal market to compete. when you do decrease those prices you are going to see an increase in consumption and the evidence does suggest we are seeing an increase in the use of cannabis for adults after lebut other people, their goal might be more focused on public health. they might be more willing to have more regulations and production even if that means that it is going to take longer to reduce the size of the legal market. they will be happy with that because they are putting things in place to try and prevent the

market from getting out of control. so that is something to keep in mind. not everyone's goal is to reduce the size of illegal market. so being open about what you value can really lead to more productive conversations on the issue. host: we have a viewer who texted us from illinois asking to explain the differences between delta 8 cbd and it is different from thc. and the potency level of today's cannabis versus the one who called in using it in the 70's. guest: that is a great question. so going back five years ago, typically when we would talk about thc we were talking about delta 9. there are a lot of cannabanoids

in the plant. we have noticed that over time the amount of delta 9 has gone up quite a bit. so if we look at even almost 25e look at the cannabis seized by law enforcement the average levels really did not exceed 5% thc. now when you walk into any of the stores and throughout most of the country where cna legal for either medical or nonmedical purposes, you are seeing flower product that is 20 to 25% and even 30% thc. those products have gotten a lot stronger. also you've seen a proliferation of non-flour products, the wax is or the shattered so some of those can be 80 to 85% thc. so and that is just with delta 9. that is what you had happening.

you have seen this increase happening not only in the united states and other countries as well. that is for delta 9 thc. what happened is in 2018, you had all of this activity happening with the states and the federal government was being hands-off about what was happening. but, then in 2018 the farm bill was passed and legalized industrial hemp, it is cannabis but there is a limit on the amount of thc in the plant. it has to be less than .3% thc, so compare that to the flour products being 25% or 30%. but what this farm bill did is that while there was restrictions on delta nine, you could produce as much cbd as you wanted. what they figured out is that you could take the cbd that you

get from industrial hemp and convert that into delta 8 thc. delta8, if you consume enough of that you are going to get intoxicated like you would with delta 9, that is not a lot of research but that is why you see delta8 and a number of states. and some places it is not being regulated like delta 9. that see delta 8 products sold with cap -- sold in gas stations with no age limits. there has been a concern about this. we do not have a lot of data on delta 8, but there are real conc about kids walking into a gas station and buying a delta 8 vape pen. earlier this week 21 state attorneys general signed a letter saying that they hope that when the farm bill is supposed to renewed every five years so they are now having

conversations about it. they hope when they have those conversations this summer that they will try to address this loophole. there are a lot th delta eight s the one that gets a lot of attention. i should also say that we have had a number of state also prohibit delta eight. so, someone who does research on cannabis policy and has been for some time, it is hard to keep up with what is happening. host: let me ask you frank quick follow-up. itas "the journal of the american heart association" that looked at cannabis use and increased heart and stroke risk. "despite common use littl is known about the risks of cannabis use and, in particular, the cardiovascar disease risks. the perception of harmful smoking cannabis are decreasing.

previous research suggests that cannabis could be associated with cardiovascular disease." i suppose that there is research about the long-term effects and where are we and guest: that is a good point because of until recently most of the research that we have on the health consequences whether it be the risks or medical benefits, a lot of that were based on people smoking lower potency cannabis. a lot of the health research being done is not about the products actually sold in stores. as i said they have gotten stronger over time and there has been a proliferation. so we still have a tremendous amount to learn about this. ome emerging research suggesting we need to be careful about these higher potency products. there was one study trying to compare those using higher potency versus lower potency products and they found those

using higher potency products were more likely to be at risk for a cannabis use disorder and more likely to be at risk for pshosis. here is the thing, and the authors were honest about it. they said this is what it is suggesting but none of these studies meet our requirements as being a good quality study. and so policymakers now even though we do not have a lot of research are being forced to make decision. so canada legalized in 2018, and as part of their bill they built and that they would do a five-year legislative review of what happened and what is happening. that five-year report came out this week. it is full of a lot of great information and they talked to a lot of people. one of the issues that they raised in this large report is that there are concerns about higher potency products so we need to be thinking about how we

can incentivize people to maybe use the lower potency stuff. one of the ideas is that they throughout there is changing how cannabis is taxed. you can set it up in a way where you tax as a function of thc content that can be progressive meaning that for the products that have more thc they will have a higher tax rate meaning that that might nudge some people towards lower potency products. we will see what happens. you know, the decision-makers are confronting a lot of choices and they do not have a lot of data. host: kurt in florida for our guest, beau kilmer. we are running short on time so jump on in. caller: two quick points. keeping it illegal on a federal level to me shows the unresponsiveness of the government to the people. the people wanted legalized and the gara -- the government is

one of the biggest reasons for this is that law enforcement across the board is against legalization of marijuana simply because it is one of their major tools for making arrests and keeping the for-profit prisons full of people who were drug offenders. thank you. host: kurt in florida. guest: i would just add to his comment is like we mentioned before there is a lot of public support for not only legalizing for medical purposes also nonmedical purposes in the united states. also the united states has to be thoughtful about the federal level about policy changesith respect to international conventions and treaties that we are party to. for decades the united states was really pushing these international treaties which would countries to prohibit various drugs. and right now the federal government says that they are in compliance because it is illegal

under federal law and the states might be legalizing but they are compliant. if the federal government, if we were to have federal legalization we would no longer be in compliance with international conventions which could open up a lot of different questions and that is a dynamic to this conversation that does not get a lot of attention, but it is important. host: beau kilmer with the rand corporation and you can find his research at rand.org. he serves as the drug research -- drug policy research center codirector. i hope you come back on the program. guest: will do. host: about half an hour from now in our spotlight on podcast segment we will hear from the former trump office of management and budget offi abou, "let people prosper." and talk about economic news of the day. you talk about that as well an

open forum. 202-748-8000 for democrats. 202-748-8001 four republicans. independents, 202-748-8002. we will take those calls when washington journal continues. ♪ >> do you solemnly swear that in the testimony you are about to give will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me god. >> saturdays watch american history tv's 10 part series congress investigates as we -- as we explore major investigations. each week authors and historians will tell these stories and we will see historic footage and we impact and the legacy of key congressional hearings. this week the 1871 investigation during the reconstruction period

, looking into violence toward free black slaves from the ku klux klan. watch saturdays at 7:00 p.m. eastern on c-span2. sunday on q and a, the bullets are prize-winning book critic carlos lozada author of "the washington book" talks about the insights he gleaned from reading political cap biographies and reports written by politicians and washing -- and officials in washington, d.c.. >> when the latest special counsel report, the hurt report looking into biden's handling of classified documen about how hed come across to a jury as a well-meaning elderly man with a poor memory. one big thing in that book -- in that report was how he had supposedly not remembered the precise year that his son died.

and in the acknowledgments there is something that speaks to that. the first paragraph of the acknowledgments section in joe biden's "promise me dad" said that this was a very hard year or a hard time period for me to look back upon and as such me of my memories of this period are foggy. >> carlos lozada with his book " washington book" sunday night at 8:00 p.m. eastern. you can listen to all of our podcasts on the free c-span now app. c-span has been unfiltered congressional coverage for 45 years. here is a highlight from a key moment. >> just two weeks ago in the midst of a terrible tragedy on the potomac we saw the spirit of american heroism at its finest. there heroism of dedicated rescue workers saving victims

and we saw the heroism of one of our young government employees. lenny skutnik, when he saw a woman loses her grip on the helicopter line dove into the water and dragged her to safety. [applause] >> c-span. powered by cable. >> washington journal continues. host: again the numbers for open forum. 202-748-8000 for democrats. 202-748-8001 four republicans. 202-748-8002 for independents. several papers publishing the story that the princess of wales is being treated for cancer which is a story from "the wall street journal" which garnered a response from the white house press secretary. >> i just wanted to start off at

the top that we just heard obviously, all of us the terrible news. our thoughts are with the duchess of cambridge and her family, members and friends during this difficult time. recovery. i think it is important that we respect their privacy at this time so i will not go further than that. i will do one more thing before that. i know folks are going to ask if the president has spoken to her or the family, i can just say right now that we do not have anything to share at this time. obviously, we wish the duchess of cambridge a full recovery. we are incredibly sad to hear of the news. >> are you going to send her a note? >> i do not have anything to share the news just broke. we are taking this and as all of

you are. and so we do not have anything to share. we want to make sure that we certainly respect their privacy at this incredibly difficult time not just for her but her family. so i will just leave it there. >> did the palace give white house any kinds of a heads up. >> we learn just like all of you and we want to be respectful to their privacy. [end video clip] host: that from the white house yesterday and you can see the full press conference. s'george's up first in maryland. republican line. caller: i just wanted to bring up that the american people need to do something about taxes because the average person when they are working, that person is making $70,000. and then by the time they bring home their money it is $40,000. all of that is out on deductions and al have someone who

works three months out of the year that makes 35,000 and they get all of the■k■v assistance ad that equals the person making $70,000. what i am saying is that the government needs to come out with something that the average worker that works more than 40 hours week, anything over 40 hours should be tax-free. if they have to work a second job it should be tax-free because they are trying to keep their head above water. things have gotten so expensive that the worker is working 50 to 55 hours a week if they are working and they get penalized for it. we need to get somebody in office toe disappearing. host: george in american. let us hear from jenny in michigan on the democrats line. caller: i am calling regarding the marijuana business. our michigan regulation act is distributing its 2023 proceeds and our county will receive

$295,000. the city of holton will receive $177,000 and they can use it however they please. also, $101.6 million was sent to the school aid fund for k to 12 education and another 100 points -- 101.6 million was sent to the transportation fund. there is a lot of money to be made and a lot of happy users in the state of michigan. and i just think if people knew some of this stuff, people are always crying about high taxes. i mean, they are talking $101.6 million for k-12 education. i thought i would just call and report that. host: indiana is next. republican line. randy. caller: yes. this is randy, i just want to let you know, hold on a minute. caller: are you at a horse race

or something, that is what it sounds like? caller: in five minutes, i am at a navy base. in five minutes the national anthem will start. host: got you. caller: i am sorry you heard■o that. host: it is ok. caller: the border needs to be closed. it was basically■. shut down whn trump came in. when biden came in he did away with anything that trump tried burning the flag and having these protests of palestinians in the united states of america, they can go back to the country they want to protest too. when 9/11 hit the people in gaza were cheering because america got bombed when the planes head. and we need to be and it is the

way i feel. i am a vietnam veteran and 77. host: let us hear from kevin in washington, d.c., democrats line. caller: good morning. i called a month ago and i gave you the wrong information about an investigative reporter studying the origins of covid. and she was on "breaking points" not "field rising" her name is emily aokpp, and she has been giving thousands of documents to the freedom of information act. and one showed thatvid came froy 2020. and when people say that we are never going to find out where covid came from drives me crazy. they need to have an intelligence briefing on covid

the same way they had one on tiktok tell congressman and senators where covid came from. it came from this guy ralph at the university of north carolina. and i was at the center for american progress on january 24, 2020 where they had a meeting with john podesta and ron quinn, and lisa monaco and jerry brown from california. and ron caught a plane to norway where a research center is where it is like the vaccine headquarters. the week after that they came up with a consensus that they could not have made covid in a lab. host: gotcha. he brought up tiktok. there is a story in "the washington post" about reaction

to lawmakers in the effort to have the holding company sell it off. saying that "the u.s. capitol police are investigating an uptick in a rise in concerning threats and as a jazz according to a law enforcement as an -- law enforcement official. the exact abundance is unclear but one senate aide says that their office has began receiving threat since tiktok began urging users to send -- to contact members of the chamber. a number of people have suggested that they will commit self-harm if congress passes the app. since the bill's introduction tiktok has repeatedly nudge users to register their opposition to the effort. a tactic has inundated offices with calls from users, some making violent

>> kathleen from ohio, democcalh time as the previous guy. i -- in the recent ohio primary, i am aiehard, but very disillusioned democrat. so in the primary, i voted for dean phillips. i did not vote baden. dash for biden -- i didn't vote for biden. i am very disillusioned with the way he has been handling the situation in gaza. for decades, joe biden as a senator, as vice president, now as a president, has ignored that conflict and essentially given israel unbridled support for whatever work crimes they are committing. now, of course, hamas committed war crimes on october 7 and they shld be held accountable, but not like killing tens of thousands of innocent

palestinians. i mean, this is unbelievably horrific. i have questions about whether i will vote for joe biden in the fall, i am ripped up about it. sherrod brown, i didn't vote for him and i work for two of his senate campaigns. the reason i have questions about him in dayton ohio, a group of two people called the clergy community coalition tried to get together with him for the last five years, a face-to-face meeting in regard to a 93 year old hospital, good samaritan in northwest dayton, being torn down and the loss of jobs and health care in that area. he has never met with a group of us face-to-face to hear the people who have been negatively affected by the closing of this hospital and hs us. if you are in a union, he will meet with you, but not with just the everyday kind of folk in ohio. host: ok, kathleen in dayton,

ohio giving us her thoughts especially as the primary cycle events are happening on the way to november. wendy in ohio as well, independent line. caller: good morning. this is wendy, thanks for taking my call. two points i wanted to make. one was on the bill they just tried to get past, the $1.2 trillion. i don't know if you can pull this up or whatever, but i have been saying, they call it the pork that's in there. one is like elizabeth warren in the bill has $850,000 for a gay senior living center. $15 million to favorite egyptians to go to college. um, $400,000 for chest binders and tuckers for teens.

harris has $1 million for some oyster farm in new york. i mean, they don't care about sending need to ukraine -- sending aid to ukraine. if they were so concerned, why is this money being spent on senseless staff that should be in the if you can pull it up, but this week, tyson foods, i think, in iowa laid off 1200 because they are moving their plant -- and they have already said to have the application for the immigrants to come. i think it is time to boycott python. host: wendy in ohio calling us her thoughts of particularly what was in the bill, her reaction to it. the same came from texas republican chip roy on the house of the floor yesterday before the house passed its version of the bill before sending it to the senate. here is chip roy from yesterday. [video clip] >> the democratic leader talks

about the mosaic. i assume by "the mosaic" that everyone who votes for this bill today will be supporting, that we are talking about money for ■;the organization described as champions of lgbtqia equity, provides training in cultural competency and axis to health care for lgbtq youth. for $2 million for an organ clinic that provides hormone therapy for kids. or money for a gay senior housing in massachusetts. $400,000 for the briar patch youth services in wisconsin that has an agenda affirming clothing program for kids 13-18. or $400,000 for the state quality education fund which helps minors transition genders, promote biological boys playing girls up at three sports and to the same restrooms. i could go on and on. how about $1 million for the inner-city muslim network, which called for the destruction of israel? that is what we are funding?

that is precisely what we are funding in this when the democratic leader talks about a mosaic, that is what he is talking about. in my republican opponents who campaigned against it all year, they are voting to fund it today. to be clear, my republican colleagues are voting to fund that so-called "mosaic" today unless they choose to vote against it. my friend from california when he talked about the horrors that would happen if we have a this is this lamp. have government funding expire on a friday before a two-week recess heading intoe pressure so that the american people are left holding the bag so that, members of congress, can go off to our codels, to go travel, can go do your fundraisers. the ones left holding the bag are the american people. we talk about this, the game was given up.

when we talk about defense, everything happening here is being done in the name of defense. everything that you see. talking about our national security will be undermined -- well, tell me about national security in texas when you have the national guard getting rolled over in el paso. when he have texans dying from fentanyl poisoning. when you have gangs and cartels operating in texas, talk to me about national security then. host: the debate on the house and senate side is still available on the passage of the 1.22 lindor appropriations package -- 1.22 lindor appropriations package. our next caller is james on the democrat line. james in missouri, hello. caller: shout out to v.a. i am 52 years old. i have -- fibrosis. require a transplant. they authorized me to have it, even though the cutoff is 65

years old. and i am a pot smoker for 55 years. the caller you had on earlier, still talk to woody harrelson. [inaudible] host: stan in alabama, republican mine. you are next ucaller: good morn. s,■b about the marijuana issue for a minute, i started growing and selling marijuana four years ago. i was persecuted for it. now the state of alabama has legalized it, and, of course, corporations have taken that over. my senators, tommy tuberville -- they can't even get them all. he needs to get back in the kitchen. tommy tuberville need to go back to florida and keep his mouth shut.

host: as a republican, you didn't support them as far as electing them? caller: i wasn't against. host: why is that? caller: both of them are nothing but just trump supporters and i don't support trump. i am those who don't support trump, the 13% who don't support trump in alabama. the state of alabama republican party just got took over by trump's people. we used to have conservatives. now it is just all trump stuff. one of my friends, he went trump on me a while back, too, i don't know why. trump is a traitor. he is a russian. poutine supporter, that is all they are. host: ok. in georgia, republicans line, you are next. caller: i am truly a republican from georgia. and i like to talk about some of the disinformation that is put

out by some of your guests that is not called out by you moderators. yesterday you had a representative miller from indiana who stated that it is donald trump's plan to reduce or get rid of social security and medicare. donald trump has stated numerous times that he will never touch social security and medicare, and your moderator yesterday allowed representative miller to state exactly the opposite. which is very unfair to donald trump. and your last, is no republican. these kinds of things have to stop. you don't allow when democrats, but you allow this kind of disinformation to come on when it is republicans. allowing disinformation has caused us here in this country to have a never debacle measles again -- to have an epidemic of

measles again. and children will die because of the disinformation that you put ardern covid, and now nobody trusts -- that you put out on corvid. annow host: well, at times recod democrats, at times we correct republicans i think. we admitted that it is the consumer that is the best resource when it comes to checking out statements made by various guests we have on this program, so i would invite you to do that. this is from basil, in ohio, independent line. hi. caller: i am 93 years old and my l of these iphones. i see many people walking down looking at their hands. when are these people going to go up to be adults and think on own? we live in a beautiful planet and i do think we appreciate the gift of life we have on this wonderful planet with trees and parks and water and other things we have.

we have to become more aware of the reality of the world we live in and we e not. way cap, young people. wake up to the reality. wake up, you older people and help these young people become aware. we -- we live in a beautiful world and it is time to appreciate the gift of life we haveyour time. host: next up, on the republicans line, rose, heather. caller: yes, freedom of speech is my number one concern. without free speech we don't have a republic or a democracy. the supreme court has been deliberating whether or not people have a right to question the authorized narrative, questioning whether that government has the authority to override the first amendment, so the viewers of the cdc, the w.h.o., the nih they could rule supreme.■g looks like they think freedom of speech can be put on the back burner when it suits them. we have scholars like mr. perlstein who came in c-span on

january from george mason university, saying there is too much free speech. he wants us to just allow politicians to have their way. why? have they been trustworthy in the past. broken the logan act of consultance? i don't know about you, but trust in politicians is at an all-time low, we have twitter flagging anybody who mentions sex cia, even though there was a whistleblower from the cia. they censor any posts from veterans today. on the kazarian mafia. humidity have to pass a challenge ma do. to add insult to injury, he will be given a period in which you cannot post. your followers will also suddenly disappear and be bottomed out to zero without explanation. any links discussing china's humanoid robots, they will be

replacing human workers, they are blocked. that is not what i call a free-speech platform. host: ok, rose, we have to move on and let others have their chance to express their thoughts. down in mexico and the independent line. caller: thank you for your time. i just want to bring awareness of the opportunities in power of our cell phones. i have been able to pay my taxes, buy and sell houses using my cell phone. i have moved thousands of dollars that have received high-level credential excluding certificates. but i can't vote fm my phone or other electronic means that, is a technology we should be able to embrace. thank you. host: let's hear from janon in illinois on the independent line. caller: i would like to see this station put on people from the democrat party. it's an insult to democrats in

this country and it should be understood that the democratic party was officially made the democratic party in 1828 and then again confirmed in 1844. i think it is deliberately done to insult democrats. , go ahead, janet. caller: i think it is about time somebody comes down hard on the catholic church as it attempts to keep women from having their rights two their own bodies. apparently, stations like this and others are too scared of the catholic church to criticize it outright. host: charles on our line for democrats in north carolina, hi. caller: lesson, i just wanted to encourage anyone who is concerned about election fraud, just go and talk to your county board of elections. they are going to tell you that they have aa?t

the county and whether you are a walking voter or a mailing voter, if you are not on that list, you may get a provisional ballot, but beyond that, you cannot vote without being on that list. thank you. host: one more call on this open forum, from detroit michigan, roland on the independent line. caller: grant writing to you. technology is off the hook. it needs to be put in the box. be done. it is destroying human disability, human nerve feelings . a friend of mine told me, he wrote into his nephew's room, his nephew is eight years old, he was laying on the floor asleep and he had three cell phones plugged into the wall and the cell phones were right at his head.

this world is going to be destroyed by technology, and the people who run it, they don't care about humanity. maybe they will take a natural force to it, but, like the color before said, we are ignoring our natural resources, water, land, air, for devices that are literally replacing people and nature. that is my comment. have a great day. host: ok, roland finishing off this round of open forum. . thanks to all who participated. coming up, it's over weekly spotlight on podcasts. vance ginn will talk about his ■cpodcast "let people prosper." also economic needs of the day. but first, we want to show you an event that took place this week, three surviving members of a top-secret world war ii unit that huge creative deception to

fool the enemy were honored earlier on ca=p!pitol hill this week with the congressional gold model. here is a portion of that ceremony from thursday. [applause] [video clip] >> ■)then there are the veteran, bernie bluestein john chrisman, seymour naz inbound who are here with us today. the veterans who are watching from home today. thank you. and then there are are all those who are no longer with us. when the ghost army soldiers were landing at omaha beach, when they were setting up inflatables in the rain near the front line. when they were freezing in the snow's drawing fire, they would have been shocked by the a deer that 80 years later, a grateful nation would honor themth soldio served in this unit considered himself a hero. i have talked to many veterans

of the ghost army and each told me that the real heroes were at the infantrymen and the tankards who bore the brunt of the fighting. but it has always struck me that the ghost army's deception mission demanded a special kind of courage to protect -- to project strengthening have none, to purposely draw enemy fire to keep it from falling on others. a dangerous business. not for the faint of heart. i note the presence in the audience today off the u.s. army officers from the rank of sergeant of the way up to the army chief of staff general randy george, particularly well represented, they should also mention the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff is here, general brown. particularly well-revisited the u.s. army's psyops forces. what the ghost army accomplished is not trapped in the past, it remains an important inspiration to the army today.

in january 1944, private harold dall of the 60 third camouflage engineer wrote home from tennessee after learning for the first time about the deception mission they would be carrying out. i can't tell you who else is without support what we will do when we start to do it on monday, but it promises to be very interesting. [laughter] and frankly, it looks like we are at last going to play a real part in the war effort. the tenant gil seltzer described morse's increase, "we all came to the conclusion that this was going to be a suicide outfit." but they had a job to do. so they put themselves in hm's way, wielding imagination, bravado and creativity in order that other soldiers might be able to fight and live. four men died carrying out these missions, but most of them came home and then kept quiet about it for decades. don't you think that's

remarkable? [applause] in july 1945, after taking part in the operation you heard about, the deception carried out for the crossing of the rhine river, harold dahl was now a seasoned veteran and had been there a year already. he wrote home again, "general simpson gave us a commendation giving us major credit for the success of the crossing. we understand he also recommended us for a presidentialn. we are mighty proud of that little deal." the presidential unit citation never happened, likely because of secrecy. but today, the 1300 men of the ghost army are finally getting their due. on behalf of the veterans, bernard bluestein, seymour nussenbaum, and john christman who are here today, on behalf of private harold dahl and

lieutenant gil seltzer, whose families are here today, on behalf of other families working fellow soldiers, their children and grandchildren, on behalf of the men whose lives they saved and their children and their grandchildren, i thanked congress and the president and everyone who helped make this happen for recognizing and honoring the laudable wartime service of the ghost army. "washington journal continues. host: welcome back. joining us now from austin, texas for our spotlight on podcast segment is vance ginn, economist and host of "let people prosper." welcome to the program. guest: thank you, it's a pleasure to be with you today. host: thanks for joining us. start by tellings about your podcast, when and why you started it. guest: "let people

prosper", i started year and a half ago, something i believe strongly in is that we should be letting people prosper. is something i have been doing for a long-term now in my work in public policy, government and even in academia, is looking for the best ways to let people prosper. in a lot of ways that is for limited government and making sure the government is setting the rules of the game, but otherwise getting out of the way and letting us have as much opportunity to do what we can. i bring on a lot of guests on the program, experts, economists, and some politicians, to have a good discussion about what is going on, in the economy, what works well and whaet people prosper. i also have "this week's economy: as part of the program every friday where we talk about what is going on in the economy. it's a good discussion and i hope everyone will go and check out the podcast where you can have insights and a lot more every week.

host:. host: there is a lot to do with the economy, a lot of issues out there. how do you narrow down what it is that you're going to talk about, and then pick those guests that you're going to talk those issues about? guest: i have four big topics i like to look at, one of those is sustaibl the federal level, state-level or local government, how do they budget sustainably over time? the big focus of that is on limiting government spending and having the least burdensome tax system possible to allow that to happen. i also look at inflation, what are the causes of inflation from the fed from too much spending, and also barriers to work. you think about occupational licensing, things of that nature that are getting in people's way of them being able to do what they do in their business and their work efforts. the last thing i look at his school choice. i think school choice is very important when thinking about meeting the needs of every kid and empowering parents.

those are the big four items i talk about about, and i find guests can talk about each one of those. there are a lot of people out th issues. i hope to provide more of a dialogue and discussion among different point of views on the program, that is really where i am focused on, on the "let people prosper" show. host: when you started the podcast what kind of audience, who do you want to listen to your show? guest: well, first and foremost, have my family and my friends. then i started branching out more to leadership positions whether they be legislators and country,t also looking at whether it be think tanks, grassroots leaders, so many. i think anyone can find insights and find it enjoyable to watch on the program. they will get insights that they can understand, that is at one thing i try to do is break things down. yes, i have a phd in economics,

but i tried not to talk like an academic that you can understand. that way people have something in the back of your mind when looking at the news or talking to friends and family, insights about the best ways to let people prosper. host: vance ginn, economist and host of the podcast "let people prosper." we want to invite our audience to become involved with the conversation. you can go ahead and start calling in. democrats, your line is 202-748-8000. republicans, 202-748-8001. independents, 202-748-8002. this week, speaking about the economy, just last night, very, very recently, congress managed to get the 2024 budget passed. it is on its way to president biden to b signed.

but there were a lot of house republicans who were not happy with speaker johnson and the budget deal itself, more than 100 of them voted against it. your thoughts on the budget, and should republicans have supported it more? guest: it takes a lot for them to pass a budget they have not passed a complete agent in decades something i think we should go to is actually passing for budgets instead of passing continuing resolutions that kick the ball down the road. that is unfortune not only for the certainty of how much funding will come from the federal government to states and other issues, but also for the economy as a whole. for businesses and their actions that are taking place, they can know what interest rates will you and things of that nature and what the budget is going to be over time. so i understand the concerns by many republicans who are looking at how this process is going. they continue to just kick the can down the road, if you will,

with a $1.2 trillion amount for the rest of this fiscal year we are in which runs out at the end of september. so there isn't even that much time left. we have waited so long to pass this budget. whenever you are kicking the can down the road when we already have 34 plus trillion dollars of national debt, paying interest on that debt of nearly $1 trillion a-q year now and it will continue to go, in interest rates being 5.25%, a lot of the debt is maturing or rolling over and that means we will be paying highhat debt there a lot of issues that need to be looked at when talking about the budget and unfortunately that is not what is happening now with in this budget. we need spending restraint. until we get spending restraint we will not get enough control over the deficit, the deficits alone are $2 trillion a year. that is where this concern is about increasing the budget more it is coming out of our pocketbooks, out of our wallets.

when he think about how much inflation there is. higher interest rates. all of this is a direct resultoh the budget. we do need to be looking at spending less and not running a future. with naugh the republicans were rightly concerned of what is going on within this budget, but at the end of the day we need to pass the budget, keep things going but at and cautious about the future because that is what the budget deficits and debt will really have an influence on. host: talking about the future, biden released the 2025 budget more than even the 2024 budget. in a recent washington times piece, you wrote that the budget doubles down on bad policies. which biden administration policy are having the biggest impact on the economy right now? guest: you are right, tammy,

$7.3 trillion.e budget it's a massive budget. it is one that increases taxes over the next decade by about $5 ]trillion. so you're talking about a huge increase. the $7.3 trillion is just for one year, the $5 trillion is over the next decade. that even with the increased taxes there is even more spending compared to what, the revenue that is coming in. and what you see is that over the next decade sock there could be nearly $17 trillion added more to the national debt due to this budget. it is a problem of excess spending. there is not a revenue problem, there is a spending problem and until we have control over that problem we will not have control over the debt and the higher interest rates in the economy so we have to do something about this. some of that specific policy initiatis this budget are continuing to ratchet out more

money not only to businesses, through something like the inflation reduction act and the investment act that they passed and biden has really pushed in the process, but it is all part of considered the build back bettera comes up with an energy -- a green energy scheme trying to push us into unreliable sources of energy. it is also trying to give handouts to big businesses which is not a good idea when you have industrial policy across the economy. it is also raising taxes on people and businesses which, ultimately, we pay for those higher taxes on businesses with higher prices, lower wages and fewer jobs. so it all comes down to people. this is why i am so focused on "let people prosper." 's to get government out of the way. we don't need more government in our lives, we need less. so this budget is bad policy for the future and it should be that can be more

pro-growth policy so we have more economic activity and more prosperity across the economy. host: let's go ahead and bring in our audience into the discussion. we will go to dalian in rural maryland -- damien on the republicans line. caller: good morning. i live in maryland and last year, me and my wife made about 260 grand. but it is hard to generate wealth because i can't hold onto it because the maryland legislature and the leaders are all democratic, and they are trying to tax the heck out of us. our property rates are going up. they are talking about adding more fees and everything. i mean, it is just hard to accumulate wealth. even though i am not poor, but i am not wealthy, because the government is always leaning on my type of people for more taxes . if you are really poor, you get

a handout. if you are a great, you have good lawyers to figure it out, but the people in the middle are getting hammered. hey, i will listen to your podcast. thank you. bye. host: vance? caller: thank you. great points. guest: thank you for listening to the podcast. one thing we can look at is why they are texting so much, whether it be maryland or texas where i am, we have to look at the budget and what they are spending money on. local governments ntinue to ratchet up spending. they have received a lot of fund from the federal government in the last two years, covert forms, the american rescue plan act. they have spent this money and now that the money is going away, they have to figure out how do we keep the funding going, in there where they do that is by continuing to raise taxes -- sales taxes, income taxes, property taxes or other fines and fees. they will find a way to get the money from you. something we have to focus on is on limiting government spending at the federal, state and local

levels. if we do than wean tax less in the process. i definitely feel your concern. another thing hurting ople and their wallets is inflation. since january of 2021 when biden took office, the real average weekly earnings, so you take average weekly earnings across the united states and adjust that for inflation, they are down 4.2%. 4.2%. that means you can't buy as much as you could just three years ago. . it's a big concern that is not only coming out of your pockets from taxes and everything else, but also it is, with higher prices. this is not agreed inflation -- this is not greed-flation, it's a result of the bad policies coming out of d.c. so we have to do that, get that under control. host: president biden's 2025 budget included a tax on unrealized income.

what is that, and who would be affected if attacks like that were to be put in place? guest: thank you for a question like that. i had a piece out at the american institute for economic research talking about biden's proposal to tax unrealized capital gains. the way this would work is, say you have stocks or another asset that appreciates and goes from $100 to $110, a 10% appreciation, normally y don't pay any taxes on that today unless you sell that asset and you get that income and pay your taxes on the capital gains. what president bids to do, and a lot of progresses are as well, is create a new tax so that way whenever you have the $110 tax, year are taxed on the 10% appreciation that you have not even realized. so it is an unrealized capital gain. while that can be considered a source of income, it should not

be taxed have not actually got the income in order to even pay the taxidea but it is a progressive sort of idea that once to tax wealth and income -- that wants to tax wealth and income and redistribute wealth and income around. it wilhas large effects on savings, investments and other things that will reduce economic growth over time. -- one thing i would say here is some would say they need to pay their fair share, the top income earners. the top 1% of income earners. over 40% of all federal income taxes to the government. the top 10% pay over 70% of all income taxes pay 97% of all income taxes. so how much is a fair share? how much should they really be paying? the more you redistribute income, the less productive activity will have, the less economic growth, fewer jobs and, ultimately, higher prices if we will run deficits and everything

else. so i don't think it's a good idea, taxing unrealized gains. . i hope congress rejects it, because it will put us in a bad path. host: terry from georgia on the republicans line go ahead. caller: yes. i work a 40 hour week. all the employers down here now, construction, their overdose to work overtime. i suggest they not tax anything over 40 hours, or at least reduce the tax. for anybody -- it's really penalized when you work longer hours, is my opinion. guest: i think that's a great point. whenever you tax those overtime hours, over 40 hours a week, often times you get taxed at a higher rate and it also may put you into a different tax bracket which if you are a progressive, a marginal tax income system also makes you pay taxes at a higher rate. that is a concern.

ultimately, which many states have been doing this and maybe the federal government i think should have a flat income tax rate, not a progressive marginal tax, whereas your income goes up, you are taxed at higher rate. there should be one flat rate. it's not only fair, it is more efficient. we could have leuss complicatios and complexity within the federal income tax system if there was just one flat tax rate at the federal level and state and local governments. weave seen this flat tax revolution happening at the state level, many states in the last three years have been moving to flat taxes and cutting income taxes. that is a great approach for not only pro-growth but, ultimately, more money in families' pockets like yours so you can do what is in your best interest to meet your unique needs. instead of the government to try to figure out how to do that for you. so i am with you, we need flat income taxes. that way we can reduce the tax

burden of people across the country. host: john in wisconsin: on the independent line. john? caller: thanks for taking my call. i live in the small city of lake geneva. like you brought up with your taxes, it is also an issue for state and local people. our scoreboard system here currently has two referendums on the ballot two weeks from now, april 2, for $3 million each, to exceed their state-mandated budgeting. every year. forever. in perpetuity. that would be $6 million out of our taxpayers' pockets. two years ago they passed a $1.5 million per yr eternity. in the last three years, my school is attempting to pick the pockets of seniors and retired peopleik incomes in order to fud

their school system, which i understand how school systems work and they need proper funding, but my district here that i am in is very well known for being in the top tier of schools as far as sports go, football team just won the state championship. so but i am aghast taxes like that, especially in perpetuity, forever. i am against that. i just want to know what youtha. guest: great point. congrats on winning the state championship. being in texas, there is a lot of football going on here as well. [laughs] you are right, one thing the local government will do is continue to ratchet up their spending and even debt, right, they will issue new debt to pay for sports stadiums or other things that may not be needed. and voters can vote on that. but just remember, if they are spending more, you are going to pay higher taxes, which is your

point. so you have to start looking at their budgets. ok at the school board budget. good to some of the meetings being held by the school board, that we have insight about ter you need to and say, "you know what we are spending too much on this, what are the outcomes, what is the return on the spending i process?" this would give you a better way to counter any increases in spending that they may be proposing. because often times what we're finding is that there is not a high correlation, or high correlation on spending and in improvements in0h■r outcomes. instead, we need to be thinking about how to get more encies? a lot of what we are seeing in school districts across the country is a large increase in administration, to deal with testing or other things. not as much increase in teachers compared to students. where does a lot of that money go? instead of paying

teachers more, we are paying superintendents more. things of that nature. that is not going to the classroom. which is having a direct effect on the education of those students. that is where the money should be going. so i tnk start focusing on setting priorities, and spending efficiently taxpayer money, we are going to be in a much better situation of not having as higher taxes and more of a burden on the committee. that way at family like yours can do what they want to do best and let people prosper, if you will, in the process. host: herbert from michigan on the independent line, go ahead. caller: your guest there, he is using a bit of fuzzy math when it comes to the amount corporations are paying for taxes. this goes all the way back -- let's take your caller from marilyn who says it is the democrats that are raising taxes. well, in michigan we had a guy named rick snyder. since then, taxes in the state went through the roof.

someone has to pay for streets, libraries, police, fire. when you don't get money from corporations, when thedoe, thatn the little guy, the homeowner. this is exactly what is happening. it goes all the way back to ronald reagan. he is the first guy that did this. it didn't work for him and it don't work now. corporations have to pay their share. wealthy people need to pay their share. and it is not 40%. trust me. your guest is dreaming. thank you. guest:hanks, herbert, for that point. i always like to ask, what is a fair share, right, it is in the eyes of the beholder. what is fair to another person may not be -- and corporations, you know,, ultimately, they submit taxes like businesses do, but remember the final tax incidence in economics is really important.

who actually bears the burden of that tax? is it the business themselves? evidence of this is pretty clear that it is not. . they will share a bit of that by reducing -- raising their costs, reducing their profitability, but, ultimately, they are in the business to profit or they are not going to business long. they will pass along this higher taxes to their workers through the form of fewer jobs and lower wages or climate work. -- last time at work. or they will raise prices for consumers, or reduce their shareholder benefits and dividends that go out which also hurts people company. so today corporations, at least from the federal level, a paying a 21% corporate tax rate, which is about average for the developed world, a little bit higher than that. remember, before the tax cuts and jobs act, it was 35%, the highest in the developed world. now it is 21%. i think that makes us more

competitive. a lot of people have been concerned about jobs going overseas or businesses going elsewhere. when you have a high tax rate, remember, we are in a global economic environment, they are likely to go somewhere else. so it not only comes from estate taxes or local state taxes but at the federal level as well, we need to focus spendd make sure we are spending efficiently in the process and if you do that, you will not need to have higher taxes with it is on corporations or individuals and, therefore, you can pay those budgets and release the burden on americans in each state across the country. host: earlier this year, the house budget committee passed a bill that would create a fiscal commission. according to the associated press, the bill would ask the commission to recommend ways to balance the budget at the earliest reasonable date and to approve the long-term solvency of medicare, social security and other programs paid for through the trust.

do you think a commission like that is needed? guest: yeah. i am glad they are talking about these things because we do have major problems. not only the $34 trillion in national debt that congress is racking up, but we also have to look aties of social security and medicare. you add those to it, which just means the net present value of how much revenue we are likely to receive from taxpayers over time through the payroll tax and how much, is going out to seniors and others for those programs. . we are looking at more than $100 trillion in unfunded liabilities and debt. it's a massive problem that needs to be addressed. so this fiscal commission idea i think could be a good one. but i also share concerns with some of my friends at the americans for tax reform where we don't want to be raising taxes to dos where i think we sw some people in this fiscal commission, wanting to put tax hikes on the table.

i don't have a problem looking at those and see what is in there but, ultimately, the evidence is from both economic theory, but also evidence of what has happened across the globe, will you raise taxes, useful economic growth. if you have less economic growth, you will not bring in the same revenue over time because of the incentive effects that will create. . and so tax hikes should be off the table. ultimately this is a spending problem. there could be good reasons for tax reforms like i said earlier about flattening the income tax, having a low flat rate with the broadest b possible end and more simplified system. i would love to see it on a postcard where we can mail in a postcard with our income tax returns, that would be great. there has to be a way to simplify the tax code, allow for more growth in at the same time, focusing on it raining ivernmen. that means there is a need to do something with these mandatory spending programs also known as

"entitlements," of social security and medicare. within the next decade, both of them will be insolvent. what does that mean? it means that the social security trust fund will go closer to zero, meaning there is not as much money coming in as going out. the baby boomers are retiring and things of that nature. we have to do something about that because if we don't, those who are getting social security today could see a 23% cut in their benefits that they are receiving monthly. that would be a huge hit for many cities across the country. so i think there are w this pro, you know, influencing those who are on social security today, may be above a certain age, maybit older. and then those who are younger -- pick the age, but younger individuals like myself, make it to where they are on a different path to where they understand that social security or may not there in the future and they should be taking care of

themselves, allowing for them to have the opportunity to save and do what is best for themselves. for medicare, there are other good ideas like expanding health savings accounts, allowing people to put money in there. that way they have incentives for when they want to go to the doctor or not and still be covered fully. especially those on disabilities who can really care for themselves with their income, we should be taking care of them through these programs instead of so many on these programs today. by doing so, we can be in a better fiscal situation in the future without higher taxes. if we don't cut benefits by 20%, you will see a 30% increase in taxes. so there is a huge cost if we don't do something about this at social security, medicare, medicaid, which should be block- granted to the states and other areas of the budget. at the end of the day, a fiscal commission could work. but let's not have tax hikes on the table. let's have spending reforms and

tax reforms on the table, that is the way we can set a budget on this sustainable path forward. host: joel, arkansas on the republicans line, go ahead. caller: yeah i would like to give you all some great news today, ok? the federal government, t are $34 trillion in the hole and it is growing everyday. but i want to start with some good news for you folks out there. arkansas gives us military retirees a tax break on our military retirement, and they don't tax us on our social security. arkansas is the best kept secret. we have a great governor here since he took office. i hope i used the right pronoun -- she, you can look her name up, i will not tell you. we don't pay on military retirement or state tax. she is also looking into giving

the first -- the police and firemen, the same tax break. she is looking at the closely now because they do protect our country, too. i lost my train of thought, but i would just like to say, arkansas, you need to look into moving here. get out of the blue states where everything is taxed. we have good schools here and crime is low and i can't say enough about arkansas. oh, i moved here seven years ago. i would just like to say, i bought a 2500 square-foot house and it was only $145,000. today, the value is up to $215,000. my friends that are listening, they know who i am, because i tell them all the time. we are in the ozarks, about 60 miles from branson. this is a beautiful state, beautiful hunting. people come from oklahoma, they

come from tennessee, they come from everywhere, kentucky. i am a trout fisherman. this is a great state. i don't work from the state, i am retired, i am 82 years old. but we need to get that spending with the federal government -- we can't fund the world and we can pay for all of these -- can't keep paying for all these unnecessary benefits like for people that don'tork, people that are killing their babies, erdogan to get on that subject. that under control buddy. i will tell you right now. arkansas will not -- caller: thank you, joel. guest: you are right, arkansas is a beautiful place and there is a lot of good things happening in arkansas. governor sarah huckabee sanders put a lot of goocontinue to cuts there, cutting other taxes. ultimately what you want to do is make sure the taxes are broad

as possible so you can have the lowest rate for everyone. that is just huge. also what is happening good in arkansas and also happening in about 10 other states across the country is, universal school choice. i think that is huge. to empower parents, students and teachers. it empowers parents to where they can find the unique -- meet the unique needs of their kids, whatever type of schooling that should be. that i that is where i live. we haven't had school choice were a live but hopefully it will change. school choice is important because it empowers teachers because teachers have more opportunities to go and find jobs not just at government schools in the monopoly government school system. but at private schools, home schools, co-ops, tutoring, there is more opportunities. savings accounts. that is also a huge part of making sure people can prosper, by giving them a sound education. so arkansas is on the right track in so many ways.

so i appreciate those points. caller: philip in oklahoma on the independent line. go ahead. caller: i have two comments. it kind of got me off track with that one, you made aware logo. you think we should have a flat tax. ok, let me ask you this, someone making $100,000 a year, would they pay the same as somebody making $20,000 a year? i don't think so. if flat tax is not going to work. let the richer people pay their part. the second thing, you said something about social security and putting it. how are you going to pay these people that are on $800,000 or $100,000 a month if you cut 20% off of that? try living on it. they don't work. social security, we pay in. it's not a given, it is not given to us. we earned it.

do not cut social security. you are great to starve these old people to death. the government gave me, on the s.n.a.p. program. they gave me, from what i get from social security, they gave me $23 a month. a little bit over $.60 a day. do you really think that peop■@e making $100 to $200 to $1 million a year should pay what someone makg year -- do you think that is equal? i don't think so. get a grip. thank you. guest: thank you for your comments. when you are looking at a flat tax, say this keeps something simple, a flat tax rate of 10% on income -- someone that makes $100 would paymeone who makes $d

pay $2000. so the upper income person at $100,000 a year would still be paying substantially more than the taxes that were paid to the lower income individuals. so we can discuss about what their fair amount is and everything else, but even with a flat tax rate, the upper income people will pay more taxes than lower income people will, it is just a matter of how the system would work. we see that it other states, where if you have a flat income tax, upper income people pay more in taxes. we could talk about economic efficiencies and those things, that i think that's a better system than having progressive marginal income rate where if your income goes up, you pay higher tax rates. that reduces your incentive to work and invest and takes money out of the private sector and complicates the system. that is why a flat income tax does not create the same disincentives. . there is still at a cost to it,

don't get me wrong, any tax has cost to the economy. your problem about social security, i was not saying we should cut social security by 23%, that is just at the fact of the current situation. if we don't try to reform it or improve it in some capacity, there will be at 23% cut to beneficiaries within the next decade. . that's just what the congressional budget office has said and others who have put reports out on this, that's just the fact of the matter. . that is why we need to see a situation where it is held up for those getting close to retirement or in retirement today. then we find other paths for others who may become upped in or out of it, up into that system if they like -- opt into that system if they like. social security was created in 1935 during f's presidency and during that great depression, to

be supplemental income, not what people lived on, but supplemental. whenever they put in place, the average life expectancy was below the age you are actually going to receive social security over time. now, you can get early benefits for social security at 63, full benefits at 67. years old and now the life expectancy is much longer than when you can start receiving social security so people are getting a lot more benefits than what they paid in even. it is creating a tough situation. that pay-as-you-go system means that what people are paying today, they are paying for those who are in retirement and getting social security. there is no account that says vance ginn, and social security, or your name. the current workers are paying for retirees within the system. that is one reason why we have these major problems along with something we need tog and

get control over. i hope we can get flat taxes, spending reforms and a more sustainable path for our budget, because it will help us prosper more. host: we have time for one more call, let's go to gaylord in california, calling on the democratic line. caller: back in the eisenhower era, tax rates for corporations and the rich were 81%. ronnie reagan cut the taxes and then he rubbed social security -- then heo -- not him, but bush robbed social security for going to war. you need to quit messing with it, because taxes pay for frastructure, police station, fire departments, what have you. ever since the republicans got in, they have been robbing it.

flat taxes are ridiculous. make corporations pay their taxes. trump gave huge tax breaks to corporations, and the economy now, you know, is doing better since we got a democrat back in. thanks. guest: thanks for those comments. i think during the eisenhower time, a tax rate -- the top tax rate being so high was not a good thing for the economy. it created a lot of economic distortions over time. you actually had jfk who pushed the first tax cuts at that time and then what you saw it as we went down from 97% to 70%. before that you had calvin coolidge in the 1920's and president harden, both of them also cut taxes during the 1920's and cut government spending. i think that is the best way to pay for any tax cuts. i am not saying tax cuts pay for

themselves but you do get an incentive effect where you have more economic growth over time, you reigning bama government spending, you had to also don't have -- and if you rein inovernment spending, you have less deficits. we saw that one george bush cut taxes because there was less spending by congress. what you have to do it in tandem, when cutting taxes or reforming taxes, also cut spending good i am a big fan of spending limit, fiscal rules that grow spending by less than uyghur the economy so it is taking less of our livelihood. population growth plus inflation is a good measure to use that a lot of states are already looking at using. so that federal government should do that a we also need a monetary rule, may be the money growth rate over time. because the federal reserve, when they buy a lot of our debt and print money, it increases inflation throughout the

economy. so we need a fiscal rule, make sure we have restraints on politicians because they will keep wanting to spend more and more of our money. across the political spectrum, i want us to let people prosper and make sure we have opportunities to do so. that is done with a limited government. a constitutional republic. and a more productive private sector. s done by less government spending, lower taxes and deregulation. if the next president doeshat, if biden does that, we will have a more prosperous future. host: vance ginn, economist and host of the podcast "let people prosper." thank you for being with us. guest: thank you so much, tammy, have a great day. host: that is it for today's "washington journal." we will be back tomorrow at 7:00 a.m.. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2024] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy, visit ncicap.org] ♪

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