host: good morning. it is wednesday. a hearing on the abortion pill.

a rule made obtaining the pillow easier. asking this morning about your on abortion access in general. i think it should be extended an -- do you think it shoul■ud be expanded? if you think it should be restricted, call (202) 748-8001. if you think it should stay the same, call (202) 748-8002. you can send us a text at (202) 748-8003. be sure to include your name, city and state. you can also contact us on social media. welcome to washington journal. before we get into the question of abortion access, talking about the bridge collapsed in

baltimore. here is the washington posth the headline, the whole bridge fell down. a huge cargo ship plowed into the bridge. rs are presumed dead and others were rescued from the water. the collapse deals a blow to the economy. also on the front page is the abortion question and pill. skeptical justices question the . doctors that brought the case have the right to sue. and regarding that question, here is an exchange with justice brown and justice gorsuch. both expressing skepticism in the argument presented by the attorney for the plaintiff. >> assuming that we have a world

in which they can actually large the objections that you say they have, my question is, isn't that enough to remedy their issue? to be also have to entertain your argument that no one else in the world can have this drug or no one else in america should have this drug, in order to protect your client? ■ç/>> it is not possible given e emergency nature. >>t. i think justice jackson is saying, with respect to your clients, normally an article remedies, we issue and say over and over again, provide a remedy sufficient to address and go no further. we have before us a handful of individuals who have asserted a conscious objection. normally, we would allow

equitable relief to address them . recently, i think what justice jackson is alluding to, we have had a rash of universal injunctions like a prime examplf turning what could be a small lawsuit into a assembly on an fa rule or other federal action. thoughts? >> i have to say that i think it is impractical to raise an objection, but even spotting that, the district court remedy was perfectly appropriate under section 705. it granted reviewing courts the authority to issue all necessary and appropriate relief. the government acknowledged with the1m parties before the court e nonregulated parties, the only

avenue that they can possibly get relief -- that was a portion of the arguments on restriction on the abor■we are taking your calls ts morning in general on abortion access, if you think02) 748-8000. if you think it should be restricted, it is (202) 748-8001 . if you think they should stay the same, call (202) 748-8002. we are also taking your facebook and posts. this is on facebook from dustin who says get government out of health care completely. susan on facebook says restricted to 12 weeks unless the mother's life is at risk or rape. here is the front page of the

washington times on the issue that says this legal inqui query has doctors in to limit access. theyg back access as they weighed arguments over whether pro-life doctors can challenge the fda's recent moves to increase access to the drugs. nearly two hours of oral arguments. they suggested that the pro-life doctors lacked sufficient legal inquiry to challenge the changes of the pill, which is used to terminate a pregnancy. a lower court sided with the doctors and issued an injunction, restricting the use of the pill. the supreme court put the injunction on hold while it granted an appeal. justice kagan and a lawyer representing the doctors about

their complaints suggested they speculative. she said she did not see how any of the doctors had been injured. some polling for you to take a look at. this is from july of last amerin abortion? here is simply the question on legality. you think abortions should be legal under any circumstances, legal only under certain or illegal under all circumstances? from may 2023. last year. 34% say legal under any circumstances51 percent say legr certain circumstances and 13%,

legal --llegal in all circumstances. here is a little bit more detail results. do you think abortion should be legal under dutch under any circumstances, only under certain circumstances or illegal you think they should be illegal in most circumstances or only in a few circumstances? how that came out. 34% under any circumstances. 13% said legalsaid legal only i. so we are going to be taking your calls this hour and getting your views onwe will take a looe thomas, questioning the lawyer from the manufacturer about the act. a 19th-century law that can be

used to restrict abortions or the abortion pill. >> the government, the solicitor general points out would not be susceptible to a comstock act problem. in your case, you would be. so, how do you respond to an argument that mailing your product and advertising it would violate the comstock act? ? agree that the charge is limited to looking atapprovals and modi. the fda approves --

i think this court should think long about the mischief it would invite if it allowed agencies to start taking action based on statutory responsibilities that congress hasencies. this issue was not ruled on below and i would point out that 2021, the decision allows use of brick-and-mortar pharmacies in addition. host: for your information, here is the washington post with an article from last march. what does a 19th-century law have to do with abortion? we have a little bit more information about that. n 1873. it made it illegal to send =kthe mail, including the bannig of anything that could be used for an abortion.

it got its namesake from an anti-rights crusader. it was unenforceable under roe v. wade constitutional protections for abortion.severak ruling was overturned in june, republican politicians and conservative lawyers have cited the law in several high-profile instances of efforts to restrict abortion. this includes the texas lawsuit seeking the suspension or removal of medication, sparking renewed debate. and we wonder what you think about that. dave says it is a state issue. there should be no national law banning it, nor should there be a national law that supports it. way to make it the law of the land is bypassing a constitutional amendment.

madison, illinois. good morning. caller:■x■ç let's just make it legal and be done with it. ■xthey should have never overturned it to start with. host: why? caller: why? this thing is a big mess. you are messing with the women. that is all you are doing.one o. i think donald trump bought himself some more bibles. all you republicans out there -- host: let's not get off topic. good morning. justice, you there? caller: yes,good morning.

i am against abortion, but if the democrats want to mur■uder , i'm all for it. the more the merrier. they murder their babies in the na of reproductive rights. the more the merrier. host:ocial media. it says, i have one question. i have nothing against drug and concerned not being available by mail would be putting the woman at risk of physical harm. it is not like taking aspirin for a in fact, it does -- the fda has recently approved -- recently approved it for telemedicine visit. a woman does not have to go in

they can fill the prescription by mail, but it is still a prescription. in georgia, how do you pronounce your first name? good morning. caller: good morning. i listened to a supreme court argument yesterday and i think it misses the point. i feel sorry for the doctors who have to perform emergency taking an abortion pill that comes through the mail. this morning i heard abby 2ujohnson, who was the planned parenthood abortionist turned pro-life women. she described young lying about their age when they apply for it and get it through the mail.

the bleeding, the problems come the sepsis that occurs when all of the baby is not extracted. they follow-up. women are very ignorant and most hostages,■ and pharma in these situations. why trust what they safe for their own profit? i would never be that stupid. thank you. st: regarding the persona -- this drug, here is e to get information about that. when did the fda approved it for termination of pregnancy?

the fda approved the version bun on their website. you can visit fda.gov for more information. good morning. caller: i am john from cincinnati. thank you for allowing my call. i am for restrtions on this. some states have absolute no abortion and some have conditions. the conditions are usually rape, incest and the life of the mother. rape and incest are crimes. if a girl decides she wants to have relations with her brother or something and then later find

way, i think she should have reported that as a crime and then maybe it would be eligibl medication. the same with rape. thank you for taking my call. host: next in knoxville, tennessee. caller: am for the abortion pill. there is no way. they overturned roe v. wade. ok. women have rhts. all these men are calling saying, we need to get rid of abortion they have no idea what we are talking about. ■dthis is a woman's body. i have not had one. i have three kids, but i know if one of my ki raped or -- she should be entitled to an abortion.

this is just ridiculous stuff, fighting over women's rights. it is plain as day. host: your thoughts on mifeistone ■k? caller: i think it is a good thing. thisthe fda approved it. all these medicines were taken approved, but what is wrong with this one? i do not understand. host: jared, wilmington, delaware. how are you? caller: i wanted to say i am for any type of abortion access because it is women's bodies and women's lives. then have no control over it. it has not been deemed to be harmful but --

i wanted to disprove some of the things you republican caller said. saying that murdering more the merrier -- also, that mifepristonetypicalln to 10 weeks. the republican nominee trump said now you can do a 15 week there and or limit. it does not make sense that the republicans -- even the rape and incest thing, that is usually it is a woman thing. if women are having issues medically■ baby will cause

an issue with their life, then it is necessary. it is not optional. women are living and paying taxes, taking care homes. leave women alone, leave their bodies alone and let them have their way. host: let's take a look at justice alito and sotomayor questioning about safety issues when it comes to mifepristone. >> the studies that the fda relied on for the 2021 amendment say that mail order mifepristone suggests more emergency trips to the emergency room. this is what i see as the response to that. even though the literature suggests there may be more frequent emergency room care

when dispensed by mail from the clinic, there are no apparent increas a related to the drug. does that count as a reasonable venetian to the suggestion that the data says there will be more emergency room visit? the increase emergency room it does not even merit a comment? >> it was reasonable. although it is knowledged at some of the studies reported emergency room visits, and did not equate to additional serious adverse events. half the women went to the emergency room and did not get any treatment at all. many might go because they are experiencing hea b and need to know if they are having a complication, but in that case, they are not having a serious event.

at the end of the day, fda carefully parsed study and made determinations about the results to beed. i think it follows well under capricious review. >> on that last question -- that doesn't trouble me, but the reality is, even if there is increase emergency room visit, the question of when that rises to sufficient safety risk is up to the fda, correct? >> that is right. the fda acknowledges that. i also want to emphasize that the studies were far from the evidence that was consulted. it had a real world experience during the 19 pandemic, a period of time when the person dispensing requirement was not enforced. they started looking at the two

periods of time and saw that there was no relevantbetween the frames. >> the problem is that there are complications with virtually all drugs. at what level it tells you to stop prescribing something is a diicult question, is not it? >> that is interested fda. host: talking of the abortion pill. we are taking your calls about abortion access in thedo you the expanded? do you think it should be restricted? and stay the same? on our line for expanding is mark. good good morning and thank

you for c-span. i think that abortion rights should be expanded. abortion is a human right and it is also health care. i do not understand why six justices with law degrees are going to decide what women can do when they have medical issues . it is just ridiculous. qj about the act from the9 ury? great. this is what makes make america great again is all about. let's have women have no rights. f diseases that we have vaccinations from. it is unbelievable. the fact is, the conservative justices are fascists. they want to take away the rights of half the population and what theyires like donald tp

to have full rights. host: also in new york is kyle from buffalo. you are saying the same? caller: they expand as well. arguments, you see these commercials that have all these different drugs and the side effects that they have, because this or that -- my theory is in my personal philoshy is ke calle health issues and we live in america, so i do not understand when it is a political time, there is a side that wants to push abortion and then they are the same people that talkbout limited government intervention. i think we really need to go back. soseemed like we were fighting n

the 90's and early to thousands or even before the supreme work handed over to the state. seemed like we were doing fine. but again, for young mothers getting raped or so many issues that go behind why it is up to the person to twn health care choices. in this day and age, we have so much technology to open doors and allow access so that we do not have a society of unwanted, handicapped or whatever -- you know. there are a lot of issues when one side wants to force the mom to hav■÷e a baby. they tend to not want to fund them when they are in early intervention years and school years. but just need to give

medical choices. thank you host:. -- thank you. host: lisa says lead the states make the decision. c says, simply expand it. pam says it should be access for every woman to make their own choices in every state. giving states indiduhas been che the lives and reproductive health of all girls and women. health care decisions care providers and not involved the political views of leaders in individual states, who should not be involved in diinth care. here is a map for you on the u.s. red is, that

is where abortion is banned. legal with gestational limit and the green is legal. see you can take a look there at the different states. you can see where your state lies. west virginiain morning. caller: i have one question to ask you. i'm not worried about a heartbeat or when it is time to have a pregnancy. i want to know when angets its . host: i'm not sure aboutha line on abortion? caller: yes. i want to know when it gets its dna.

no other person as your dna. i would like to know when an embryo or fetushost: all right. richard in fort myers, florida. caller: my main thing about abortion is that we need a middle ground, not left up to the states. either but a middle ground. california is so extreme and texas in another way. we need a middle ground, desperately because we cannot have abortion going up to eight limited to five weeks, like in texas. we need a middle ground and i think it was better done in the late 1990's and through the 2000's. this is not working for either party. i was blowingow and -- i was bon

in 1984 and they have been blaming this -- they abortion en thing. they play with this as a football, the abortion thing. it needs to come to an end. host: what do you think of the laws in your state, in florida? caller: it was better before he got pressured into different bands. it better at the 12 to 15 weeks. i think we are almost with texas right now. host:shelby in left city, tenne. good morning. caller: good morning. i think roe v. wade should never have been reversed. it has put somebody women's lives in jeopardy. r

congress -- government should never be playing god. god gives people choices. they have to make hard choices, is.matter what we are the ones who live with this the rest of our lives, not the men. why are they not looking at the men pushed yes responsibilities? take away some of their right. it is horrible to think we are living thank you. host: g good morning. i have a question here. let'y available and a lady is three months pregnant. so she gets the pill and takes the pill.

what happens to her body then? does she need to be hospitalized? is this something she can take at home or what? host: at threev months, you cannot take this pill. it is only up to 10 weeks. caller: up to that point, she decided she wants to take the pill, so she takes the pill. what happens inside her body then? host: i donest, but you do have to get a prescription. it is not an over-the-counter kind of thing. call but still, she takes the pill. what happens to her body? ■isomething has to happen to tht pregnancy. host: but a pregnancy -- the pregnancy would be terminated. caller: ok.

thank you. host: north dakota, good morning. caller: the morning. how are you doing? host: i'm ok. caller: i think it was bill clinton who said abortion should be legal but rare. i might be wrong. i would like to know why it is not more rare. i just, we talk about roe v. wade -- not roe v. wade but the roe of products. options that women have. it used to be just the condom or the pill. there are some the options andg. of course, mate and incest are a small minority of it, but thai s

might get in between the legs of the goalie -- sorryyears ago, m, we had visions of hollywood cartoons and the versions of the sort. the store coming to your home. fertility and now it is like a vulture swooping down to land on your front door. i wonder -- women -- we should be -- we were a healthy and robust country shouldencouragine babies all the time. politicians are the ones that came up with the . they tell us that we do not have population. so we will not encourage our fertility forward. we will bring in a whole new

population of the culture. host: i wanted to go back to your original sin about the number of abortions. i had this to show you from research. says this is a graphic of the changing number of changing abortions since the 1970's. there is the caveat that it is hard to pinpoint number exactly. there are numbers and the cdc, u can see visually from 1973 when roe v. wade was initially enact to 2021. in is not recent da, but it the. eva is in columbia, mississippi.

caller: why are men speakinfor women? i'm looking and listening. i look at the■6ñ)÷ tv and they e viagra that they can in the mail. what the man have to do with this? they never carry a baby. i'm listening to the questions they are asking and they really do not know. they need to let women do women help. they do not carry babies. host: all right. let's talk to ellennext in st. louis, missouri. caller: hello? host: go right ahead. caller: i like what yvette had to say. men need to stay out of women's bodies. men keep acting like abortion is birthit is not always birth con.

sometimes it is health care. men did not know what it is like to carry a baby that is not viable. host: kurt. good morning. caller: a man calling in about abortion. thank you foru3■u not designatig the phone lines democrat or republican of all the things that i can talk about. my variance isel■c there have been a lot of abortions because of me that i am not proud i changed my tune. some may call it being born again i see my children now and i see my grand childrenand i cannot rt

i can be proudi and honor my future, and pitiful children. -- beautiful children. i will take response to the firm i cap -- responsibility for my past. host: how many kids do you have? caller: i have two childrennd two grandchildren, which are the most beautiful, unblemished -- and anything -- the only thing that can mess up the kids is us. but i just --t hard. the only way iman can have a child is through a woman and that is why a man might want to call in. i cannot argue either side. but it

i mean, there are so many ramifications. god bless the child within. thank you for bringing attention to the truth. mifepristone works. this is an article. it says 63 percent of abortions last year were medication abortions. taking one dose of -- it causes cramping and empties the uterus. they have found the combination of the pills is safe and effective for abortions whether prescribed in a clinic or ro telemedicine. tobias is calling on the land -- line for expanding access from ka caller: i am calling from missouri.

we have gotten rid of our accese people earlier who were uusuggesting that it should be limited based on whether you can prove in the case of rape or incest. i want is that are brought ford , less than half of those are ever see and given any sort of conviction. you have to imagine it will be a fraction of thosees and you have to bring in the fact that in the case of it being someone in your family, that is even fewer cases and even fewer people who will report those because you have to realize that they are taking into account that th

those families are troubled as you are honestly out of your mind if you think that will be the case. to the person asking when is he relevant? -- host: back to social media. saying, codify roe v. wade. carol said, it is a state-by-state decision. there is no way to set aside morally qualified health care. paul says, there is no legal reason to restrict care of their body. they are guided under a false sense of superiority. they are willing to force women and children to carry any fetus to term d

emotional harm it would cause. caller: hello. they can eliminate all of that if they do something about these men. make them all have aectomy. let them get a vasectomy and do them reverse it until it is time to make a baby. put some of the pressure on them. would not need abortion if the men's dead but they are supposed to do. protect the women. that is what they need to do. put laws on these men. everything falls on women. men need to take some of the responsibility. host:et's go to inglewood, california. caller: good morning.

i bel should have a choice. it is her body. do not say, have the baby and put it in foster care, somebod i was a foster parent. black and brown children are not adopted and then they end up asn the street, drugs and in prison. let everyone have a choice of it is her body. these men need to mind their own business and get out of our business, the women's business. thank you. host: beaumont, california. good morning. caller: thank you for this forum. i cannot understand why this issue was debated on and on. the liberals make it an issue about a woman's health, but what

about the baby's health and life? once a life has been can leave, it should have the cost -- unless the mother's life is in danger, i cannot support any sort of abortion. in the case of rape and incest, i can understand, but they should go directly to the and there is medication before the baby is actually conceived. once the life is started, it is murder. i cannot understand. if they do not want the baby, put it up for adoption. we do not get -- take care of babies. i do not understand it. host: let's take a look.

president biden and vice president harris made a rare appearance in north carolina to talk about health care. making the case that restricting access is creating a health-care crisis. >> president biden and i are fighting to expand access to health care. there are extremistscoverage or make it more expensive. extremists who want to take awag social security and medicare. they want to take away coverage by trying to gut medicaid and they w away coverage from those with pre-existing conditions by continuously trying to repeal the affordable care act. across our nation, extremists

attack. proposed laws that punish women. laws that threaten doctors and nurses with prison time, even for life, simply for providing reproductive care. no exceptions for rape or incest. the result is a health-care crisis with real harm. host: that was the vice gabriel is calling from north carolina. caller: good morning. what is really important is to take a step back. there are many who do not understand what this does in particular and how it works. the key thing to understand is this medat has gone through

the gauntlet of trials that was so essential from that phase trial safe in certain populations and whether it served a job in a medicinal role , so it is not always the elective case. quite oftent other cases, but the key thing i want to highlight is that mryoie judges who have no training whatsoever. i promise you it is arduous. i will tell you that lawyers do not understand on any basic level what the vast majority of these medications do and what

they do in terms the process at work in the body. now you he s a judge with no understanding of that taking away to be able to rule on whether they have it and i think it is absurd. where does it stop? i'm concerned about what this pandora's box opens up for those who have no medical training can step in and say going through the process to unveil what these medicines do can be overturned by someone who does not understand it at all. i think that should have a chilling effect on the country. i think it is also important.

people have to recognize the interest there to a certain point. ■d but when you listen to the oral arguments, when you talk about there is an interest that is inherent to the woman and it is important to understand. the outcome of her life and what happens as a result of that. there is athat has been obliter. it is absolutely not state-by-state. it goeac lines. people would be impacted

differently in different ss. it is a federal question at that particular junction. it is not right to say -- we see that now that they are host: on the line for staying thecaller: good morning. tear point. ■@i am not talkingut -- there are instances where womenn trafficking. what i want to know is why don't

people vote for a contraception mandate? host: is that what you are in favor of? a contraception mandate? ■would you vote for? caller: i would vote for it, yes. the idea is that contraception it would keep a lot of people from having to make life altering decisions some people do not take the time to prepare for that lifelong commitment.

given the well disparity in our economy, people could not afford raising children. host: next, lying for restricting. caller: i think they should be restricted to 3.5 months. this started a couple years ago when a couple women from an abortion clinic were having lunch and being interviewed. between bites of food they were saying how much money they were making by selling baby parts. i think the supreme court did not want anything to do with that. it's not be(w state-by-state.

as a young woman, i had an abortion. i had an underground abortion. it scarred both of my ovaries. if people go back to those ways, it would not be a good thing. host: was this before 1973? caller: yes. another thing, the stage not have a dr jail if he performs an -- an abortion. anything else you want to know? host: no, that is it. so you are in favor of restricting it to 15 weeks? would you make that a national ban? caller: you showed a graph and it showed 51% of people agree with that because a woman knows if she has a sporadic ministration. it gives her enough time to make a decision.

this is hearsay, but they say the government once -- is promoting single mothers. it is unfair that husbands are missing in action. host: to new york, new york on the line for expanded. caller: thank you, this topic. i watched the supreme court yesterday -- supreme court case yesterday. i truly believe that a woman has the right to choose what to do with her body. if they want to ban these me all medications. they should band viagra, condoms , anything that prevents if they want to go that route. also, i heard the lady talking about be sterilized

until they are ready to have a baby. maybe they should. why are only doctors anwo jail g abortion? why are men not going to jail? ■=i heard so much about the doctors and women, but when it someone, you do not hearaped by anything about punishment for them. i have yet to hear them talk that. people need to stop saying that democrats want women to have women -- want women toyb have abortions up until birth. host: bonnie in pennsylvania. good morning. caller: i agree with the brother

who just called. we should have our freedom. i think men need to step out of this thing. want to be involved, get a dna test and make it mandatory for court ordered child support for any of these children who are misconceived. host: take a look at this article. ■n kansas legislators passed a bill to require providers to ask patient why they want artican legislators nd final approval for a bill that would require providers to ask the patient whether -- why they

want to terminate the pregnancy and report the answers to the state. the state senate approved it after the house approved it ortion rights supporter who is expected to veto the bill. e majority needed to override that veto. good morning. caller: i'm going to take a different tact on this. i think we are missing the point with regd to the abortion issue. the greatest thing that any human being can do in the world -- this is a message directly out there for anybody, any woman at risk of abortion. the greatest thing any human

society, for your own life is to create your own family. it is the opportunity, the most empowering thing a person can do. so i thinkive of this, i think people need to consider that the democrat philosophy is to destroy the new yearily, debase their own future family, their own future generations with promoting abortion and things like this. i think that missing part of the conversation is thatdevoted a ln this. the vast majority of abortions are carried out by minority women who are unmarried in poverty, who also already have children.

majority are an economic choice, and they pretend it is a medical i so they can work around the legal system. the vast majority are making financial decisions. what i would say is that we need to stop thinking about abortion and start thinking about life. the greatest thing a person can ■ -- host: we got that. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i do not hear too many people with the same viewpoint. i believe the supreme court made the right decision. i do not believe the government should have anything to do. it is already in the constitution that there is a right to life. i wish peop we be as active trying to address rape and

incest as they are trying to kill an innocent person, the baby. those same people would never kill the rapist. they would never kill the person who committed incest. i heardne woman call in and saying, people do not want to adopt black and brown children. i believe that is a bthe 1960's. that is encouraging the sex trafficking trade. look at all thehappening with this wide open border. those are the people being forced to have an abortion. they are killing an innocent person instead of putting and ending to the sex trade and sex trafficking. i think it is already in the constitution that the by has a right to life.

host: call for this segment. coming up next, former transportation department inspectors discusses airline safety, federal oversight of the aviation industry and multiple safety issues of incidents at boeing. later, johns hopkins school of public health discusses efforts to limit lead and harmful forever chemicals in the drinking water. we will be right back. ♪ >> book tv every sunday on

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>> "washington journal" continues.. host: welcome back. we are joined to talk about aviation safety by the former inspector general at the transportation department, curranwelcome to the program. guest: thank you, it's good to be with you. host: before we get into aviation safety, the bridge collapsed in baltimore is top of mind if you'd like to make a comment about that. >> sure, obviously, the national transportation safy board has an awful lot of work ahead of them. the coast guard also has jurisdiction to investigate. i am old enough to remember the sunshine skyway collapse in florida and the comparisons, the similarities are quite be read. when you see the pictures, they look similar and the differences there but the rebuild

bridge at the sunshine skyway cement support structures that act as buffers or islandsthat's one of the most things that's missing from the accident in baltimore. a few miles up the road, there is a bridge refreshment program going on on another bridge where they are putting those offenders or dolphins around the bridge to protect the structure. i think that will have -- will come into play a lot in this. of course, the reason for th power outa ship that caused it to be on steerable in the first place, it could be many things. they are at the fuel contamination. they have the data recorder now. ■pthat probably will give us the answer right there is to why

there was a power outage on the ship which made it unsuitable. i think they will have the y solved rather quickly. then what to do about all this. it could take five years or more to build a newin charleston, so, we had a bridge that was also hit in the late 40's and ea 50's by a ship and several of the spans dropped into the harbor and they replace them. just about 15 years ago, we got a gorgeous new suspension bridge with lots of fenders meaning wee bridge. the goal is to make it impossible that a ship could hit it. ne will be in play when they replace the bridge. that's a very long process, five , 5-7 years and $10 billion. host: there are many issues that

boeing has been facing regarding aviation safety. lawyer and do you have links to those legal cases involving boeing? >> guest: i am involved in the litigation in the federal court concerning the boeing 737 max8 in ethiopia. those cases are ongoing. boeing has admitted liability after about 2.5 years of litigation. boeing has admitted liability so those cases are being resolved and may be set for trial later in the year. that's dhost: as a refresher, y on alaska airlines flight, a door plug in a 737 max nine aircraft blew out midair over portland, oregon. investigators from the ntsb had said the evidence showed bolts

that held the door in place were missing at the time of the blowout. who is at full for that? that is a question that's being resolved. now we have learned that the department of justice and the federal bureau ofgations have opened a criminal investigation because the ntsb which is ratr unusual, they were irritated the records concerning that particular door plug repair before it left the factory were not available to it or were missing. maybe they didn't exist. air of the ntsb expressed some frustration or anger that th exist and soon thereafter, was the announcement that came in a strange way with letters to the persons on the plane, there is a

federal act that requires in a criminal investigator to take into consideration the victims. all the people on the plane got a letter saying now there is a criminal investigation. that's at least two investigations that are out there against boeing. they concern boeing but to open a criminalplained the records are not available and weren't available and no one at least one last there was a public statement, no one knew where the bolt actually went. that prompted criminal investigation. host:ashes of the max8 boeing aircraft, was there any reap -- anything related to those wcrashes or are they different issues? guest: i think there is something related and that's the continuing issue of alcontrol ag excellence.

to have that situation occur with not one but two aircraft that were six months of part with just when the planes went down, the first response is not d it's not just the max8 accident. the first response is blame the pilot. investigations and air crashes, and about 75% of the cases, the ntsb and theb, fed the pilot. i've been involved in several cases where we are able to prove that thee pilots full was an er. one case that the engines has something called core lock in another case the trim system was moved backwards and the instruction from the factory had the reading system backward so in many cases, they blame the pilot and a terms out it was mechanical. in the case of the 737 max8

cases, there was so much there so much that came out in the investseveral congressional heas and disclosing -- we among other lawyers litigated that casd diso years before boeing admitted liability in that case. i can't discuss the discovery 's a court protective order but the amount of information that came out about so many that were not what you would expect with manufacturing of the aircraft. boeing admittedha hso many proby it was six months before the ethiopia crash which is the one that i'm involved in litigation f court, that should have been the warning bell right

there. i thinkond one wouldn't have happened had they cleaned up the quality control process and manufacturing problems and oversight problems. i don't think the second one would have happen and i don't think we would've had the door blowout. i think it's a it's an oversight problem, not so much an engineering problem but it is an outsourcing problem. they change the wayanes over tht 30 years with a lot of outsourcing. before, boeing probably had more control over all processes going into their parts and assembly. things have changed over the last 30 years in aerospace manufacturing. host: i will open the phone lines to anybody that wants to call in and m6■e or a question about airline safety. our lines are regional this time

so if you are in the eastern or central time zone, call us on (2, if you're in the mountain or pacific time zones, you can call us on (202) 748-8001. you can also send us a. we are also on social media so facebook.com/c-span and on @c-span w j. i want to ask you some specific starting with january 5 when the 737 max9 door plug failure happened. on january 8, three days later, parts while a lawsuit alleges excessive amounts of defects at a key boeing supplier. can you tell us about that and who the suli is and how those issues were found and addressed? guest: the supplier was an

offshoot manufacturer in kansas. they provide the parts tthe pros they were investigating the door blowout. this particular part is shipped to boeinged and ready to be installed in the plane in the final assembly, they take the door assembly and put it into the and that firmly affects all the passengers, etc. at first, there was a question of where was the problem? was it a problem from this assembly or a problem on the line? is the information came out, you could dig down and it got pretty specific on this particular plane.

they learned there had been a problem on the right-hand side and they fixed that problem , boeing, nothing supplier, and while looking at the rúig■p-hand side door plug, they thought we better check the left-hand side door plug and they found some problems there and it was the left-hand side doorg that the ntsb later found they didn't have the records for that. no one is really sure where the bolts are. there were some whistleblowers or commentators, people who said they are probably in the trash but that certainly has not been verified during the investigation. those are just people commenting at the plant. that's how that came to be. now it looks like the problem really was at going on the assembly and not the supplier. the market place in the discussion that going is now in the market to repurchase and■u y

that supplier back and put it into the boeing fold. host: about that factory, this is from x -- j guest: or under supervised and without proper oversight. the faa and over the years, i've criticized the faa a lot and they did■l come to the situatioa little late but the faa did go out inspected the boeing processes and they looked at the fire. just the supplier. in many cases, they were not in compliance with their own procedures, with their own asty control. when you build an aircraft, you don't just have to have the

qualified and approved materials, you also have to have qualified and approved manufacturing processes. the plane cannot be certified unless you follow the processes in addition to having the qualified certified parts. they found that the faa flunked boeing at of inspections nets does this year. boeing got a lot more problem we oversight, the quality control and requiring all of the workers processes and all the management to meet the standards that were already there. it's doing what you're supposed to do when yo're%yupposed to do it. the faa calls that quality control and i call it doing what you are supposed to do when you do it. host: on march 8, sorry, march 9, a boeing whistleblower was found dead.

this is from x -- guest: i know charleston can be a fairly small tim. i know his attorneys and they are good and i've known them for years. ve heard some things about that case. what i will say is that is under invest a -- before the justice of -- department of transportation, i was a prosecutor at the department of justice and how you process a potential crime scene is very important. whilescender instigation, what i would want to know if i was going to be a prosecutor and investigator on that case that

any kind of a gunshot incident, you supposed to look at the ok at this whole scene. you have to do all that and none of that has come out because it is a case under investigation. it falls within the jurisdiction of one police department, in south carolina, you can call in state law enforcement and you can get all the help you want. hopefully, they are doing everything by the book. even here locally, there been ae out about that investigation. host: let's talk to callersom b, virginia, good morning. caller: good morning. you know as well as i do that the problem isei hiring practices. they are not hiring people

because of qualifications. they want to hire them because they are lgbtq. that's the bottom line. : mary i'm glad you brought up the faa. regardless of who it is and what they do and where they come from or their color or sexual line, and it's already coming out with the faa audits is you have towhe certification and regulation say that you are supposed to do. e faa go all the way back and i worked on this, back to the certification of the triple seven. that was way back in 1995/1996 in congress and treated my

office to go out and look at the certificatiopr the 777 aircraft. it's a good airplane but we found that boeing, i can't member the exact percentage, but boeing self certified about 95% ofha and we reported that in congress. the faa said basically, boeing has rocket scientists and the faa doesn't. i said wait a minute, you have a job to do so regardless of who is doing the job, if youa don't lay down the law at the top of the organization, it was almost inevitable that at happened with the 737 max8 without oversight without people being made to do exactly what they are supposed to do and i think people want to do that. it's the system that lags and

that'sthe training and speakingt the 787 dreamnecharleston, litee state went to bed to get them off the training the local es the training and develop the training courses for boeing. everybody tried but it's -- if it's not the will at the top to do it■6 right, it doesn't matter who you put in the role, everybody's done that. if the tone doesn't start the top. host: let's talk to leah in sandy, utah, good morning. caller: i wanted to that for years, there's been a problem with planes shaking so violently that the bolts would fall out, the tail would come off and there would be a crash. there is a similar example in the movie hidden figures.

wh t bad, the shutters came off and burned e person insideket to death. there was another problem with boeing. at one point, several parts came from several countries. sabotage could be a big problem. host: what you think? guest: she makes a great point because aerospace has changed. in years past, boeing and other manufacturers been bankruptcies over the years of various aerospace manufacturers and aviati manufacturers and buyouts and we've come down to just a few manufacturers. she is right, over years what has happened is instead of most of the parts, maintenance and assembly in the united

states, it happens all over the world. you could have suppliers on any boeing aircraft of parts of that plane coming from 50 or 100 different countries. on the maintenance and, we used to be number one on maintenan outsourced, the planes get fixed all over the world. unless we have a very very robust, very proactive inspectiond follow, we lose control. in many cases, woodblock control . -- we block control. we can't go on -- we can't know what goes on many foreign countries but we trust the parts in the maintenance. host: following up on that ■fcomment --

guest: for the past several decades, used to be airlines did had a maintenance base like a facility in the united states nearby. over the past 30 years, so much been outsourced. it's legal and the faa allows it. a lot of that has to do with cost.that's a whole another isse that a lot of people are looking at boeing and others about overrule the engineers and the quality control experts. that has been a trend for about 30 years where everything is being outsourced and in many cases outsourced outside the country. owadays. i can give an example from a case i worked with, the was doy

highly qualified individuals in the united states made the difference in the case. we were breaking a criminal case unfocused aircraft parts that weoming nited states from all over the world. it was very savvy mechanic who c with united airlines for decades. he picked up the part and he said this isn't right. i've worked on these engines for maybe 26 years. i work on these engines in this part is not right. he got the part and he got the box and he helped his break the case in his criminal enterprise, and international criminal enterprise that gave bogus parts in those kind of highly qualified industry and that maintenance is left the country. it'saat make all the differencen the world. it's really great working with folks like that. host: bloomberg says that boeing

affect goes back to traveler+s. fares are expected to rise especially domestic and regional trips. joe in maine, good morning. caller: my goodness. wow, young lady if i can call you that. you look very pretty this morning with my -- with nice clothes and everything. what you make for a salary? you're a prosecutor to do whatever you did and you are sitting here defending boeing. i guess son question is boeing killed people. they paid lawyers to get them off and get them to pay the cheapest they absolutely can. that's what goes on.

krupt. they must've lost so much money last year. but they didn't, did they? t: no and actually i'm on the others. what i do isxd sue boeing for the families of people who have died in their planes. i agree with you, boeing did kill those ppli do think thatyoe insurance companies and their insurers often take over the litigation when something happens and you are right, they try to pay the least amount possible. it works its way through the courts, usually federal court but sometimes state courts. the other part of all of this is that a tragedy happens and it takes years. the average aviation in any

case concerning boeing is not average for the average case takes about five years to litigate. the ethiopia case for example has gone on for five years and it is a long, hard litigation. course, the flipside is that that's what we as a country have given litigants. we give them the opportunity on both sides to people who are harmed or killed and boeing, both sides get to fight and argue and present their cases and that's what our laws allow. there are people like me on both sides. by the way, i left the justice department to go to the labor department and then i went to the transportation department. i had several federal agencies in their over 16 years, i can remember how long. it was a long time.

guest: wear and tear on the aircraft and expense. so it was not a safety issue? guest: for the concorde, it was a safety issue because what en a while but i worked on that one. there was something called free planes on the runway which punctured a tire which punctured the fuel tank on the concorde. like every airplane crash, there had been some concern about the c■íissue that the concorde's ful tanks were not adequately shielded on the runway.

some operators, some planes had had reinforcement and some hadn't. when the terrible crash of the concorde happened in france, it was too much to wrestle. they were old planes by that time, 20 years old. was just too expensive given what would have to be done to make those planes safe tit was e safety issue but fixing the safety issue was too expensive. host: let's talk to richard next ine. caller: hi. thank you for this program. it's my interest is in flying. i love to flyvei'm 72 now. i enjoy flying in smaller

aircraft. i'm not very much interested in commercial airline traffic anymore. as far as boeing#y goes, i workd as an engineer for 45 years. not in the airline's tree but environmental industry. projects that were insuredrk o construction projects. i had an opinion about flying and boeing situation here. building complex things like aircraft is very different.

involves a lot of specific scientific and engineering asctwhen you get into manufactug of an aircraft like a 737, it's a very difficult thing to design, very difficult, it's complicated in the manufacture. the parts come from all over the place. you have subcontractors on those subcontractors make tears of the manufacturer. host: let's get a response and mary, following that, we got a text --

guest: the colors absolute right. an aircraft is a marvel of millions of parts and that's why these processes in all these regulatory oversights have to have beat set with precision. safety of lying has come about because of all these various steps in a complicated often wonder what warble and willed her with -- and willed her with thick about it today. -- whatlbur would think about it today -- what orville and wilbur would think about this today.

about small planes, on the other question about accountability, i agree■ that there have been several books that have come out and i'm not plugging my book but there was a book that came out i think it was from a new york tis reporter and it was called the man who broke capitalism. i read the book because it's aoe book, there is all this stuff about boeing. it was extremely interesting because the take of that book and many others are that we have wonderful engineering companies and ahe united states and great minds with great engineers who built great aircraft. all of a sudden, not just boeing but many companies being led by finance accountants or the green eye shade people.

all companies, you haveto addre. you have to address your employees, you have to address your customers and ys. perhaps in some companies, there is too much emphasis on just one of those aspects of the three legged stool. even the leadership of boeing says they kind of lost their way which is why they are having the shakeup now. host: speaking of that, that was on monday, the ceo dave calhoun well high-ranking executives have announced they are stepping down . is that going? what does that do to boeing as a company? guest: we know it's not going to take care of the issue is yet an

stepping down or stepping away. now the big debate, you pick up anfi journal or any aviation newspaper in the issue seems to be boiled down to whether they get an gineer or a finance accountant type. if that's what the decision comes down to, it won't solve the pthe problem has been definy the faa, after all these accidents, the problem of getting backo quality manufacturing, getting back to following the rules, getting back to doing everything they are supposed to just constantly focusing on the prophets. i think they shouldn't be looking at whether to get an engineer or an accountan■6 i ■qthink #ha somebody with quality control and safety at the top of his or her mind. and integrity.when boeing is thf

jokes on saturday night live and tiktok, when people, if it's not up boeing, i ain't going and now it is a boeing, i'm not going. they become the but of jokes, it's time to find somebody who has integrity and can produce a quality product. the test versus an account will not solve the problem. host: let's talk to gregory in silver spring, maryl there is ae fish go from the headfirst. i want to kno prosecuted at the? if you don't prosecute the ceo of the company, the chairman of the board, how can you bring change in a company? ultimately, the shareholders bear the burden. we are normal people, i have boeing stock. i suffer.

where is the prosecutionceo then of the board? why are they not in prison? guest: i actually know the answer to that. after e 737 max8 crashes, the department of justice entered into withg something called a deferred prosecution agreement. the dpa, they had a peri of time where they were supposed to commito no further wrongdoings or violationsd and if they thatd essentially not be prosecuted. that time ended in january this year. united states department of justice now evaluate whether boeing complied with the terms of that deferred prosecution agreement. finds that they did, then you are

correct, no one gets prosecuted that's with the united states department of justice did with boeing after the 737 max8 crashes. hopefully they are doing a robustie months and i have to add a couple of more people, you said the shareholders suffered, so did the customers, said of the people on the planes and so did the employees. it always comes back to the three legs of the three legged stool. a lot of people and all you have to do is look at the ftc filing to find it if there is any suffering at the top. all of this has to be reported. host: earlier this month, the ntsb chair was talking about investigation into the alaska airlines flight in january. i will show you a.áp: she is asked by committee ranking member senator ted cruz

about the degree of cooperation between national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [video clip] madam chair, how cooperative have you gotten timely access to the documents, the information in the way this is unique? >> there are a numbeofes to the investigation. some parties have been very cooperative. the federal aviation example. boeing has not provided us with the documents and information we have requested numerous times over the past few months, specifically with respect to áóopening, closing and removal f the door and the team that does that work at the facility. >> wow. you ll us that even two months later, you still do not know who actually opened the door plug? >> know and it's not for lack of trying.

it's not unusual that we don't get information immediately in an investigation. can point to numerous investigations where this occurs and it takes months and months to get information. for this one, it's two months later. we know for a fact there is a team that deals with the doors, there is an entire team of 25 people and manager has been outn medical leave. we've not been able to interview that individual. we've/f a names of the other 25 people and have not received the names. we've asked for the records with respect to what occurred. we've asked for whichhip tic -- wished shifted occurred on. we know it only because of our investigators worked looking at pictures and emails to try to getowe don't have the records, e don't have the names of the 25 people that are in charge of doing that work in thait's absus

later, we don't have that. our investigators right now are at the renten facility in their conducting interviews. those started on sunday and they will continue for the rest of the week. host: before you comment on that, i want to show the boeing that hearing was march 6 and on march 20, npr reports he said this early in the 737 max investigation. u think of that? what about the cooperation between boeing and the federal oversight committee? guest: the ntsb rarely talks

about problems and investigation public oin fact, the in years pn investigations if they've spoken about the investigation while is going on area from that, i conclude they were very frustrated with they termed the lack of cooperation and what they termed a lack of transparency or access at boeing. because the ntsb investigation, they are on a party system and sometimes, parties wheer manufar or you name it and whoever is part of the investigation, they are used to providing■] tjáir se of the story, their information. they have a lot of control in the investigation. it must have been pretty had tok out as it did and what boeingr

the dish or they will find out they have the power to get the records in interview anyone they want. they should've just done that. th mige fbi now has a criminal investigation ongoing. host: caller: i think there is one thing missing here that people aren't figuring out including your guest. people today who are working, the people you can hire, they do not care about doing a good job. they only care about their paycheck. you go in the grocery store and the checkout people are talking to each other about some social event, they totally ignore whether they are bringing things up right. it goes all the way back to our school system. if a student points out that a , that student will get disciplined and what happens is

everything is open k, we are glad youdno, if you go back 40 e job was can i do a great job i can ro thank you. guest: well, i wish that everybody had p■óride in their workmanship. what came to mind when she was saying that was the pictures of rosie the riveter from world war ii. lots of people say the american workforce is changed and people don't take pride in their work. i think i take pride in my work and i know lots of people who do. i hope that isn't but the solution for that in addition to lots of things that companies can dos oversight in r regulatory enforcement.

i will use the door as an example. you have to sign off. in aviation, if you literally touch the plane, there is a sign off line in the records on the aircraft i'm simplifying it. an inspector has to sign off on the work. ep of that regulatory certification process exactly how it's supposed t djust this year, thel times said on various things that we were lucky. our aviation safety record doesn't rely on lock, it relies on oversight, it relies on quality control. an the system were everything you do to that aircraft is inspected and signed off on or almost everything. that's the problem we hav,çthate very lax. host: just to end with this

question -- host: do you have any issues with getting on a boeing max 737 ? guest:ly all the time and it's part of my job. a monoplane every week somewhere several times a week■have a sma. i'm a very rusty pilot but i do have concerns. ■bthe first time i was on a max eight after the crash, i was concerned. i had to go with my family >y■'somewhere. we weren't expecting a max eight and there we were. i actually thought about how we could divide it up and i could send my kidsn a different one or whatever was possible. the bottom line is that you don't often have a choice.

that's robust and the fact that the faa is just now years later flunking boeing on1/3 of their audits, he should have been out there all the way along because millions of americans and millions of people around the world aho fly depend on you. yes, i have to say it still gives me a little bit of pause because of what i do for a living. it still gives me pause but yes, i fly every week somewhere. the former inspector general at the ntsb. coming up later, natalie exum of the bloomberg school of health discovers efforts to limit lead and harmful forever chemicals and drinking water but first

it's open for them, you can call in now and the numbers are on your screen. ♪ celebrating >> celebrating the 20■th anniversary of our documentary competition. middle and high school students, look forward while considering the past. highlighting the milestone of the anniversary, they were given the opportunity to look 20 years into the furing documentaries from students across 42 state, through in-depth research and interviews with experts, they tackled topics such as social media. eliminating entire fields of work. >> challenges in climate. >> we can no longer sustain. discussions about criminal justice. >> race, bias and the criminal justice system. >> we will share the winners in the middle school division, from isaac brown middle school in mountain view, california. we wr shaking but this unit states

dish for the united states will not have to enter into so many negotiations. >> congratulations to all the winners. >> we extend our gratitude to everyone who supported each of these young filmmakers on their creative journey. congratulations to all of our winners. do not miss out. they will be broca starting april 1. you can catch them online at any time on studentcam.org. join us in celebrating these young lives as they share their opinions on issues that are important to them and impact our rl >> c-span now is a mobile app showing you what is happening in washington live and on-demand. keep up with floor proceedings and hearings from the u.s. congress, white house events, the courts, campaigns, and more

from the world of politics, all at your fingertips. you can also stay current with the latest episodes of washington journal and find scheduling information for c-span's tv networks and c-span radio, plus a variety of compelling podcasts. c-span now is available at tapp. download it for free today. c-span now, your front row seat to washington anytime, anywhere. ♪ >> "washington journal" continues. host: interested to hear your thoughts and anything public affairs or politics related in open forum. ga the bridge collapsed in baltimore, here is the front page of the new york times. ■:axios reports this -- here is a portion of what he said at the white house yesterday. [video clip] >>■n my transportation secretary is there now. i'm directing my team team -- to

mo to clean up the port and rebuild the bridge as soon as possible. we will work hand-in-hand with the support of maryland to support maryland for whatev they ask for. we will work with their partners in congress to make sure the state gets the supported needs. it's my intention that the federal gnment of reconstructing that bridge. i expect congress to support my effort. this will take some time. the them at every step of the way till the port is reopened and the bridges rebuilt. host: that was the president yesterday about the bridge collapse in baltimore. we are in open form and we are taking your take your calls come i want to make sure you are aware of this news -- we have a portion of that

announcement from[video clip] >> i wanted an advocate who has who shares my indignation about the way it allows regulated industries to commoditize o■u food, or wildlife and their children. i wanted someone who would honor immigrants.ons but who also understands that to be a nation, we need secure borders. [applause] >> i wanted a partner ws fted ao possesses the gift of curiosity, and open inquiring mind and the confidence to change even her strongest opinions. in the face of contrary evidence.

i wanted dimension and compassion and idealism and above all a deep love for the united states of america. [alae]>> i found all of those qualities in a woman who grew up right here in oakland [applause] >>aughter of immigrants who overcame every daunting obstacle and went on the highest levels of the american dream. that is why i am so proud to introduce to you the next vice president the united states, my fellow lawyer, brilliant scientist, technologist, a fierce warriorñ5 mom, nicole shanahan. [applause] host: that was rfk junior announcing his vice presidential

pick yesterday. going to the phones now, sandy and rockville, maryland, line for democrats. caller: wonderful show as always. did you happen to mention that mr. trump is going into a new business now selling bibles, $60 a clip? he talks about how inflation is awful and people can afford this that and the other and he stills from people all the time. mr. trump, president? no, convicted rapist, liar, convicted everyinno more complat inflation or anything else. maybe you can go on one of his travels. ■y a go to travel thing that went under, six bankruptcies, what a great guy he is. here is the ap article about that. trump is selling god blessas a e

faces mounting legal bills. there is the picture with mr. trump holding the bible. andy is going from ingleside, texas, republican. caller: good morning. i have some thoughts about wrece bridge yesterday. i am 97 years old andcareer in . i never remember getting underway at 1:00 in the morning. also, i don't understand why there wasn't a tugboat alongside the ship that could sit there through this ship channel near the bridge. also, the drug testing of the pilot and the captain and the helmsman, i wonder if that happened. i just don't understand why that

not near the center of the ship channel. it was completely out of the ship channel. also, you don't need power to drop the anchor of a ship. ■■■calso, ships that i sailed od a crew of sailors in the active steering and could steer the ship manually if the power went off. so many things that i don't understand about that accident. host: we appreciate that. i guess more we will keep you updated if we find out about those questions. david in new bedford, ■massachusetts, ien line. caller: good morning, todd -- i'm calling to talk about the airlines. i wanted to8entie

first caller talked about the trump bible. i feel like you are allowing your outrage to do the marketing for trump himself and you're giving more exposure to this new product. i feel like a lot of the liberal argument against trump is sort of unfounded when your candidate is supporting and aiding and abetting a genocide. i get the arguments against trump but when you put joe biden up there and 's some beacon of morality, it could be further from the truth. going back to the airline rather, there was a whistleblower and he had himselt of people in his family said he would never do that. i wanted to say that people havt killed him or a corporation. there is really no difference at this point, the government is

funded and lobbied by these corporations. you go back to the book war is a racket any talks about capitalism and that's what our military has been come. you look at haiti and was going on. they had aristide in there. he raise the minimum wage two times and was before and you had bush overthrow him and look at th the coury has become. whether it's the government that is doing these actions or corporation is really no difference. that's all i really want to say. host: that's all i really wanted to say. caller: tkpwo*rpbg. great show today -- good morning. ea so i thought i'd throw my opinions out in th ether. the first caller was fully correct. first it was n.f.t.'s and then it was $19 gold-painted sneakers that he was selling for $400 and now it's a bible that has the

constitution in it, i believe, and the bill of rights is in his little bible. but anyway. on the bridge, i wanted to call, it's a tragedy. also, the fact that people like marjorie taylor greene and other politicians are right conspiracy, that it's some type of invasion or attack. same thing alex jones did with sandy hook. to, like, calm down, hear the news, let the investigation come with an opinion before they go right off into some tangent of conspiracy theories. that's all i wanted to say. have a good day. host: julie, south carolina, independent. good morning. caller: good morning. how are you? : caller: i have to tell you, your hair looks beautiful today. i called in because i have tondn

the second guy, the last guy who just -- god, he agreed with her. ok. he's selling bible, sells tube ? he's generating money, right? whether he's good or bad, he's trying to generate money. he's not asking anybody for money o his product. and then here you go with biden and everybody's so angry. and then you've got the other guy talking■h■w about the bridg, biden. he's saying we're going to fix. it like he's spending his money. it's our money. so it's like, do you want people to try to make money oncts and service? or do you want, you know, the government to just come in and take care of everything for us? which ist? pissed off, it's frustrating. it's so frustrating the way people act. and then they agree with each other. everybody's so pissed off. kennedy. because it's not left or right, it's just everybody's so distracted and angry.oking at tg

picture. host: what do you think of his vice presidential pick? caller: honestly, i don't know her. bui'e about learning so i will learn about her and see. but i know enough about him to know there has to be another choice. there has to be -- whatever -- the two options that -- the main two options people thinkhae arat option in my opinion for thing, you want the same baloney that's been going on for years, pick one of them, go ahead. but if you want something different. if you have chicken and steak for five years, try something else. what we have going on is not wo let's go to john in pennsylvania. republican line. good morning. caller: good morning. jr. but the whole kennedy family is supporting biden. they even took a picture with biden. and the other thing is too, this lady that was killed, laken

riley, was killed by an immigrt. but they failed to mention that almost all the mass murders and mass killings in schools and synagogues were done by angry white guys, red land and a copye second amendment in the other. so, you know, maybe you get someone on from the poverty -- the southern poverty law center, a representative, to discuss the hate groups in this country and the white supremacy. 1600 hate groups in the united states. there's about 28 of them in pennsylvania. so anyway. i'd likejust make that suggestion. that's my call for today. thank you. host: st. paul, minnesota, republican. caller: good morning. host: good morning. caller: i'm calling in to -- for the -- i have like 90 million votershae $1.2 trillion bill.

it's all pork. and i think that we should have all those senators bringú boxesy should all be fired. and the next speaker of the house should be chip roy. right. talk to bruce in lagrange, illinois. also a republican. caller: yes, ma'am. i just listened to all the and g trump a convicted liar. and i just wish that people would look up the definition of traitor and apply it to trump who is taking money from our foreign adversaries with absolutely supplying nothing. and also, when they talk about two-tiered justice, look at the $25 million that has flowed into without any tax consequences. and he professes to say, you know, the rich should be paying their fair share. well, that's all baloney.

that's all i have to say. thank you. host: all right. also there's this news from the "washington nbc news planning to fire rona mcdaniel, according to a report. it says that it is preparing to droppublican national committee chairwoman mcdaniel less than a week after hiring her as a paid contributor. plang mcdaniels but has yet to work out the details. she's seeking legal counsel. it's apparently caused at the outlet. her hiring, that is. with several on-air decrying the former r.n.c. leader being brought on as a paid analyst.

host: david is calling from westfield, new york. independent. caller: hello. can you hear me? host: yes, we can. caller: ok. i have a couple of things to say. the first set. the boat set. the desk that you are at the a share and do a great job. and it's sort of a metaphorical boat bause it heads into sometimes uncharted waters, but also into oceans of opinions an# winds of wonder and over eddies of i had yosy into -- idiocy into tsunamis of stupidity. host: did you write that or just come up with it? caller: actually, i've been mein■át --

host: ok. i appreciate the -- caller: i didn't have the courage. caller: well, the other thing is after world war ii, which came after wo was decided by those in charge to have the united nations, the purpose thereof to end war. however, the people in charge of it, the united states, china, even britain, seemed to go the other direction. this is well stated in martin luther king's vietnam speech. what we could have done. but nonetheless,■ as eisenhower warned about the industrial complex, it'sthat the cold war e

reason to it. but the industrial complex, militaryial complex, they are diplomats. they are the people who are foreign policy and i believe it's based on a profitable war machine. and you can sigh the results of this -- see the results of this. i believe thatae for some time a part of the military industrial complex. ree pentagon a month ago allowed that the iron dome was an example of this cooperation. so people have to understand that there is so much pressdente executive branch from the industrial complex and from the

financial situation, financial people, who are also involved in this. so let me cut to the chase here. humanity cannot end war, we will not be able to stop global warming. host: all right. and david did mention the in gaza. we do have a programming note for you on that because today at noon there will be a discussion on the israel-hamas war. after nearly six months of fighting and the prospects of a ceasefire, it's hosted by the simpson center, you can watch thatspan at noon. also it's on c-span now, which is our free mobile video app. and online at c-span. mike's calling from north carolina. republican. caller: good morning. i got a couple points if youlow. you know, you're talking about

that mcdaniel thing on msnbc. well, msnbc doesn't want nobody in there that's got an inkling that they like trump or a republican. they ought to change their name to mscpp because they all toe the same line and it looked like a death funeral when that appeals court reduced trump's bond from a half a billion $175 million. yeah, that's a lot of money and it's ridiculous. but it was like watching funeral on there. but the main thing that's lost in the news cycle is illegal immigration. watch other channels, the type, msnbc, even cnn showed the mob of migrants in el paso pushed over the national guard and rushed the fence. and there's reports that biden in his administration are going to give amnesty to the people

that's been here at least 10 years. and people don't understand, every one of these people that come across, the american taxpayers pay for them. they're lying twhre when they sg into social security and then they're taking medicare and they are taking medicaid. i know you got a lot of e old pd but not that old, on social security. they're all worried about that. but all that social security, medicare, medicaid, going to all of these illegals. what do you think they're putting all these people at? they're putting them in affordable housing that are booting out veterans, they're booting out poor americans, black people, white people, actual americans, hispanics that are over here. and the american taxpayers are paying it. a study from the immigration study, with the money that's a half a trillion dollars in 2023

and with all, what, eight, nine million people across, these people are not self-sustaining, they're coming over here and on the government -- look at in new york, they're going to $53 million cars up there for food, and rental assistance and all that. americans deserve this money. i don't agree with democrats most of the time, i only agree with a lot of independents, but the americans are entitled to this money. not these illegal immigrants. and the mexican■3 president, hes bought and owned by the cartels down there. he could stop this and his little border down there, hgo w, 1700 miles? he could stop this but the cartels own him and he knows it and he knows that administration is not going to do nothing, it's going to --

it's just the democrat party nowadays is basically the erike. let's talk to zach, leyland, mississippi, independent. go ahead. caller: tpra*eul first of all, i -- first o say i'm an army vet. i love my country. but we're no different from the rest of the world. if we taving people for hundredf years and torture them and make profit off of them for hundreds of years and think that and make them ignorant, denying them education for hundreds of years and then say you're free and i don't give you anything, i don't give you any land, i give millions of acres to immigrants, to european immigrants. no, two billion acres. and i don't give black people an inch. i'm starting to believe that this whole system is designed to keep black people at a certain level.

a foundational family on which this country was built on, not to that you're just going to max out. it scares me listening to,f reparation and share any of the pie, and they won't let us get free education, that's because you like this uneven playing field. because you can be born a damn genius but if your zip code says you're from this neighborhood,hu got. you understand me? and this is partly from slavery. you can't run the military without black people. you can't run the drug game without black people. not because we're running it, not because we're running it, because it's all set up to be a pawn -- you can't run the criminal justice system without black people. and you know what, because it's all designed to make money off of us. i love my served my country. i would do it again. but i should have an option.

my option was, i got to join the military before i get killed in chicago. host: let's go to steve in blacksburg, virginia. line for democrats. home of virginia tech. caller: good morning. welcome to a chilly spring. at least it's sg. these people claim that they're christian nationalists, because i don't think they would recognize jesus if he came walking in off the ocean. back e he's an illegal alien. i like to call them crinos. that's a new word for this year. republican party does every time joe biden tries to do anything for the working class citizens. they cry no. yeah. that's all i you. host: that's our last call for open forum. up nextxum from johns hopkins bloomberg school

of public health. we'll talk about harmful lead and drinking water. we'll be right back. >> american history tv, saturdays op c-span2. exploring the people and events that tell the american story. wf long street, talked about confederate general james embraced reconstruction after the civil war and became an outcast in the south. at 7:00 p.m. eastern, american history tv series, congress investigates, looks at congressional investigations that led to changes in policy and law. this weekend, the special 1912 na■. investigation into the sinking of the titanic, the 82 witnesses' testimony about ice warnings that were ignored, the inadequate number of lifeboats and treatment different classes of passengers.

and how ancestors exerted political influence during their presidencies. hear from descendants of william jimmy carter.harry exploring the american story. watch american history tv saturdays on c-span2 and find am guide or watch online any time at c-span.org/history.■$■t ♪ >> c-span has been delivering unfiltered congressional coverage for years. >> the space program has been a marvelous to expand. its knowledge, its horizons. and w so in the future.

as long as man has the thirst for knowledge, we will continue to press outward. and in the process, there is risk. r is taken by each one of us every day and that risk is understood by all the mem crew d spaceship. >> c-span, powered by cable. announcer: "washington journal" continues. host: welcome back to "washington journal." we're. jen: ed now by natalie exum -- we're joined exum, assistant scientist at johns hopkins bloomberg school of public health. natalie, welcome.ving me. host: how bad of a problem is lead exposure in the united states? guest: yeah. this is, you know, a big probled say that as a society we've done a lot to get lead out of our

population. we took it out of gasoline, we took it out ofaint e of the things that we have not dealt with yet is taking lead out of drinking water. because it actually means digging up a lot of old pipes. host: because it's too expensive? guest: it's too expensive, it's underground, we don't know where they are. we're living with a legacy of lead pipes under our host: so how -- what are the actual dangers of having lead in your drinking water? guest: yeah. well, if you think about it just as a low-doseic exposure over time. that in general is not good. but we're concerned about -- it's a neuro toxin so we're■ipmf our children, we're also concerned about our older populations and how we're seeing lead maybe be linked to dementia and such. we're concerned now. not a probe population but we're concerned about the vulnerable populations, meaning kids living in urban cities, right, where a lot of these lead ne in the ear. host: speaking of children, this is an article from "the

washington post" about the flint water crisis. it says how the flint water cr sets schoolchildren back. now, that was 10 years ago. so remind us about what happened and what do we know now that the actual impacts? guest: yeah. so this hits home because i had a baby right at that same time and so this is about 10 years ago.aw that lead levels in kids were spiking. and then we saw also that there was elevated lead in the drinking water so we brought those two together to say that a large number of children in flint were exposed. so a lot has been done since then but now those kids areob in elementally school and what we're seeing in flint is that maybe a doubling of the children that need special education, right? so this is linked to adhd, behavioral issues, and so kids, not being able to sit in their chairs and learn and needing special programs that schools need to be very order to take c. host: we'll take your calls

about lead in the drinking water as well as f our guest, natalie exum, you can call us. our lines are regional. so it is (202) 748-8000 here in the eastern or central te zone. mountain or pacific, (202) 748-8001. last year the biden administration announced the proposal to replace all lead water service lines in the u.s. within 10 years. we srtion by you telling us we're not sure where they are, it's extremely expensive. they're underground. how possible is this to get them all switched out in 10 years? guest: so, money needs to be allocated to be able to do this as well. the guest: the bipartisan infrastructure law put $15 billion in for lead pipe finding and replacing. so that is a st but by no means is it going to be able to fund all of the lead pipe replacements for the 9.2

million pipes that the e.p.a. is es underground. host: when you said earlier, we're not quite sure where they are, so how do we know thatkingr isn't coming out of lead pipes? guest: right. what viewers can do after this show is go and look for their lead service lines. it's most likely com from your -- in your basement. and you can do what's called a scratch test where you scratch the pipe and look to see if it's lead or copper or galvanized or p.v.c. host: if it is not lead, then you're good? guest: then we're good. there are other soues that could be in your home, but the lead service line is contributing the most lead into your drinking water. host: what do we do if we find out it is lead? first, don't pac because there are ways you can reduce your risk. one thing i always do in the morning when i wake up is i always flush my pipes. i live in an old home. because whatever water sits overnight inere's even lead inned soar use until 19 -- in sodder use until 1986.

host: how? guest: turn on the cold water and let it run for a couple of minutes. i know it's wasteful but you can water your plants with the water. you can also use filters that can be -- that say that they are -- will treat lead. so even something that you can go to the store and buy.■6er geg into -- lead getting into the drinking water, how does that actually happen? is it an old pipe? new lead pip? or is it -- you mentioned cold water. is it hot water that will increase the amount guest: yeah, you're onto it. so, it's hot water. it's the chemistry of the water. so the p.h. and the corrosivity of the water. if the water is flowing -- it flushing through your pipes, also just stagnant water and ■wasi especially in that overnighttime is when we're most concerned about it getting into the water and that hot water will kind of

induce the lead to be more likely to come o that's why coo, preparing baby formula, always use cold w billion was already allocated. it's in the bipartisan infrastructure law. how easily can that be reversedw administration? could all that work stop? guest: so, those moneys have gone down to local levelsnow. the federal money goes to the state revolving funds which goes -- the state decides which water utilities get those funds. those funds have been allocated so as far as i know, taken backa change of administration. host: so jim has a question for you on x. we've had lead pipes since the turn of the 20th century, how are we all alive? and capable of somewhat rational thought? guest: thais but, you know, we know that zero -- that no amount of lead in our blood is good for us.

the c.c.n moving the limit down and down further. the new limit is now at 3.5. when i was growing up the average population lead level was 15. a population, we've gotten lead out of our blood progressively. it really is related to i.q.'s, right? sohildren are sphrarter than us -- smarter than us for a reason, because they've been exposed to less lead than we were when we were children. host: is there a blood test, if you're conce tested? guest: yeah. so i have a 1-year-old. i just brought her in for her blood lead test. c.c. recommends 2 we test our children for lead. that's our most vulnerable population. when lead in our blood can get into our brains no reason for ao get their blood lead -- you're not going to be -- there's no reason to do that but i would say if you're concerned, go talk to your doctor about it. host: we're going to take calls but before i do, i want to ask

you about pfas. there was another action by the e.p.a. that proposed that nine pfas, these are call forever chemical, bed hazardous substances. first, start by explaining what they are, why they're called forever. guest: so they're called forever chemicals because these " compnd bonds, they're the strongest bonds in chemistry. we have used them for decades in te teflon, gortex, anything that's stain repellent,■o repellent, has these chemicals in them. we've used them for a long time. they're now in our drinking water systems, our ground water, our surface water. theyeô everywhere. the e.p.a. now by making them hazardous chemicals is now essentially asking the polluters to pay because we as a society right now are tr■v tt them out of our environment, by asking our utilities to do their work. our water utilities. there are new regulations going

in place that's going to re chen our drinking water. that's extremely expensive to do. and the tpayer should for all os contamination. host: we've got a question for you about that from robert on x who says, water is supposed to be free for everyone. such a vital thing should not come with a price tag. treatment and purification are responsibilitieshabe paid for. somebody's got to pay for it. guest: somebody has to pay. we're talkg especially right now, somebody has to pay for this. it is not going to be cheap. and the e.p.a.'s action gives them a little more leverage to be able to say, these leaching t of this plant or that a certain company put in the grod when they were doing their processing, that the responsibility could now be put on the company or the industry

rather than on the taxpayer. host: even though if you charge the companies, you could say that that does trickle down to the consumer. guest: true. though not every company has done this, right? so if -- a lot of process has my using these chemicals. host: judeish in virginia -- judith in virginia. caller: thanks for taking my call. i'm a retired senior chemist for d.p.u., department of public utilities for the city of richmond. we started a lead and copper project back in the 1980's. and then the 1990's. we are coordinating with the state of virginia and also the e.p.a. on our tests and our analysis. i started off as a water quality technician where i went into homes and tested for lead and copper. became a senior

chemist, we are still doing the same process. we check and we analyze. we we analyze. and we've been doing this for a number of years and we are still doing contacted my boss and he indicated to me that we are still with thatro so we have been in the front mind with this. welines with this. we are also coorditithe individg in the city underground. they have replaced pipes. ve a process to contact people if it came up positive that they had lead and copper in their lead pipes. so we have been in this process for a very long time. gov. gianforte: - guest: you

are a public health hero for all the work you've been doing for decades. i think what was done in the 80's and 90's and what's continuing today set the stage for the program we are trying to supercharge in other cities that may not have had those programs in place. mhost: larry in chicago sendinga text saying i been wearing contacts for years. this goes way beyond drinking water. guest: absolutely right. in our environment, food can be another source of how they get into our bodies so there are many courses for these chemicals. 97% of americans we have this in our blood. as a population we are -- it's hard to which sources the

most dangerous source but right now we are just kind of getting a handle on how to reduce these levels across the sources. host: its in makeup, dental floss, is there something the normal member of the public and do to reduce exposure or to know which have been in it or don't, or is it a losing battle? >> you can be smart abit. eating a lot of take-out food means there's a lot of packaging and a lot of packaging has it because they are grease resistance. but i think you can begin and si do not want to use as much

take-out. host:linois, good morning. caller: thank you for having me. i've been studying what's■z been going on around the country with fracking like for instance the public harold recently had a piece i turned blue, workers share horrifying experience of treating fracking wastewater. i understand the fracking wastewater is going into our water supplies■- and it's also going into public lands and i was wondering if you had anything to say about fracking wastewater? thank you. guest: that is a great point. one of the ways the epary with w hazardous chemicals is through injection wells. a lot of what you're talking

about with fracking wastewater is the water is injected deep down into the ground and it often gets into groundwater. that's a concern because the only way that will be taken out is through being treated, so having these be classified as hazardous chemicals would then allow those who put those chemicals in the ground to have to clean it up. host: sean is asking you more details about flint michigan, what happened, have the peif sod how much has been spent? guest: as of today as i was reading there were about 30,000 lead service lines that were replaced. there's only about 30 left. there was recent court ruling that a lot of repairs and sidewalks have not been repaired.

done at it's meaningful to say almost all of them have been replaced at this point. how much money hast very clear t was a lot. it's hundreds of millions of dollars that have gone into just replacing that. >> can ago we knew these forever chemicals were detrimental to health. who found out about it, why this has not been an issue earlier on. guest: in the 40's the chemical industry develop these compounds and saw what miracles they were and how they were able to prevent your couch from wine stains on them. these chemicals have been used for many ways and evolved over time. so we have known for a long time and the chemical industry new that they were causing problems. host: how did they know?

guest: through smaller studies done on animals and even you rs are getting sick over time when they're exposed to high levels of these chemicals. so you know there is extreme danger but what was said over time in the 80's and 90's is it's not getting released, this is not going to affect the population. it's doing all these things for humanity this making lives more convenient. it's not to get out to the environment. over time thosehes, of promises get broken and those chemicals get released. host: have the chemical companies the new these were a problem released him into the air, have they been held accountable, will they be held accountable? host: many -- guest: many utilities are bringing legislation to these companies because of the huge price tag they will need to be paying at the treatment plant level.

they are trying but again this is not a one and done thing like it is. we will need continual erational and maintenance of the huge treatment operation because you have to redo your filters, it is very expensive to do. host: let's talk to philip in michigan. are you there? caller: can you hear me ok? host: yes, go ahead. caller: our milk cartons er chemical? our government needs to put a deposit on and fruit, all the polyethylene jugs it's really easy to clean them if they put the label on the top rather than on the side of the carton it would be 100% recyclable. thank you. dguest: this is a great point.

we talk about how we've become a plastic society and we need to begin to reduce our use of plastic, plastics are closely linked to contamination. host: tim in raleigh, north carolina, good morning. caller: thank you for a wonderful show and a wonderful guest. i am an architect and i just finished renovating an elementary school in n had to us filter under the new water bottle drinking fountain fillers and my question is isn't water quality the problem like baltimore bridges and with the other caller was mentioning.

where we have a system that does not value basic human needs like clean water. do when we have this capitalist system that requires cheap labor and cheap investments for shareholders while our commonwealth of health suffers. what can we do to change that? guest: one that i say as a public health person, one of the equalizing forces in society is we can turn on our tap and all of us can be assured from our safe drinking water act we are taking a clean sip of water. continuing to invest in those public systems is one of the most important things we can do because it is showing value that we value everyone's life and we are not going to abandon the public systemause it's for everyone. >> related to that, steve says

these are forever chemicals for poor areas of this politicians e about them or their well-being. is it a bigger problem important areas? guest: are criminal justice communicating -- are located to areas producing these materials so there is runoff or impact around the communities at these plants. this is not just because of th's gotten into our drinking water and often times you are more at risk if you buy a new carp■. ree often these chemicals are in carpets or it's one of these issues that is kind of affecting all levels of the population. host: is there a safe chemical

that can be added to drinking water that would bind with lead? guest: are getting into chemistry. this is a very good question but the way utilities manage lead in the drinking water is by adding anti-corrosion agents. you can add certain chemicals into the drinking water to but until that leadpipe is actually replaced, the risk of it getting it is always there. came out of the pipes in flint because of the corrosive plant river water that was switchedcost-saving measure. caller: good morning. >> go right ahead. j% i have a comment about lead. i'm 88 yi was raised in the ally

mountains of west virginia. i was a young kid and my father 90% of ourgame but my father sha shotgun. with deer and squirrels and fed us. they were lead bullets we were using. i blame led -- i had a lot of ability -- inability and a lot of problems and i was younger. i blame that on the lead in our meat that we ate. i don't know what we can do about that today but that was one of the problems. a lot of meat shot by ledi than.

guest: this is a great point becath can do today if you are a hunter and use -- you can use copper plated bullets. venison is a very good source of meat and a very sustainable source and many people in the united states eat it. i appreciate the caller's commentsis one of those ways we are still vulnerable to lead getting into our bodies and we have to think about every single source of thank you for that comment. host: louis in new jersey, good morning. caller: i think our water is bad and i will give you the reasons why. all the animals died of cancer here, we have had just on my block that have cancer, the young lady nextis ge next few months.

that's all it got to say. guest: if you have concerns about your community's water system you should be reaching out to your councilmembers and representatives, to people who are there who are voted in to be taken care of their population. that's what i would give to that caller. >> a question that says i've been using water filters since the 1980's. t family and friends thought i was a new age not. what type of filtersguest: i nee recommendations because if you don't have and you're sure you tested your water and there is no lead or issues you can turn on the tap. some places are not affected by it.

you could actually call your water utility and ask if they have tested for perform eight chemicals and they may say we have very low levels and there is no concern here. get to assure you that you don't necessarily need a filter. host:■sarticle, 70 million amers drink water from systems reporting to the epa. it has an interactive map on that that you can take a look at. brian is in pennsylvania. >> i was interested in the flint case and i went online and looked up washington dc had a much b problem, probably five or six years

before flint, does the guest how was the water in d.c.. >> in the late 90's into was about 15 years before flint, the same issue happened where the corrosion of the drinking water had led out of the pipes levels were higher than in flint michigan. it just did not get the news that flint michigan dock. what that meant is washington dc really got on top of its leadpipe's. washington, d.c. and mar #5■v the lead lines is very well documented and its many years ahead of other cities in knowing where the lead service lines are and getting them replaced. that's what we are trying to bring every city up to to say let's find them and replace them. doug is next in laramie,

wyoming. caller: goo morning, i've been drinking distilled water exclusively for 55 years, what can be said for against usi.y distilled or otherwise purified or filtered at home and what about buying bottled from the supermarket? guest: sure. so distilled water is highly purified butr that are good for us so you don't want to necessarily you don't want to water because some of those are good. bottled water to me is a good not able to turn on your tap for certain reasons. ultimately bottled■oater is not regulated the same way public drinking water is regulated. as a public health scientist i

prefer tap water because i know it's being checked all the timet contaminants wears bottled water you are depending on the company's who either purified it and we did a study at johns hopkins university that showed certain bottled water companies have higher levels than others. host: you also have the plastic for bottles of water. guest: we want to move away from plastics. host: here is a text from connie. make replacement less expensive,, identify where they hooked a water supply, trench a new pipe and abandon the lead pipe■o they do not have to look for it? guest:of digging involved in that solution as well and what we are trying to do is avoid doing that digging at all. the problem is records. utilities to first make

may try to look for the files, those records only go back so long and these lead lines were late in the 20's. what's the best way to feverybor basement to look to see if they have them. they may have the 80's and they didn't know about that. you may still have led. >> are now installing plastic pipes for our water use in the new home. is there any danger of the plastic leaking particles in the drinking water? guest: there is. we do not know a lot about of this so it's hard whether to say it's more or less safe at this point. host: gordon in kansas, good morning. guest: i'm trying to figure out

what's wrong with these democrats. could the lood turn to lead? host: kim in virginia, good morning. caller: i would like to let you guys know when i was a i lived in ohio and we had the dupont chemical company was right up theiver probably at 11 years old and i had pet mice and they both grew large tumors onem down and theyd walk in circles, perfectly healthy mice that had good foodr gave them massive tumors. i want to share that with you guys at the water in that area, you know the scandal the forever chemicals were dumped in the river.

it's really horficrimes againstt it is. so thank you. guest: i think the caller is correct. we have unfortunately learned from those massive pollution events how troublesome these chemicals are for the entire population. catherine in minnesota, good morning. host: -- caller: there is a large state that for years was challenged about may be accidentally something chemicals in the sources and then knowing about it and not doing much about it. ately got convicted of doing this and had to clean it up and they said you clean it up. d basically told the state they weren't going to pay for most of it. that they weren't going to do

the efforts that were demanded of them. disappointing that they continue as a company and everything. it's just disappointing that it's hard to hope that these large groups -- hold these large groups accountable, they did not do what they could have and i still don't think the water in thosethe cancer rate when they d into one of those areas i think a lot more people have in those areas. it's just disappointing when places no they have done something wrong for once and they cover it up, they don' even when we know efforts need to be taken they shove that responsibility onto someoneelse. i think there's a lot of people that are struggling with this right now. neighbors being told not to drink their water that it's not safe. i don't know if those people go out and buy a bottled water.

i'm really shocked that there not efforts locally to try and clean up those systems and make sure the water is safe for everyone. thank you. guest: the finger-pointingen a s necessary, it creates a standstill. what wes chemicals now gives regulatory teeth to the environmental protection agency to do what it shoulde g the pube chemicals. host: jerry is in waterford, new york. caller: hey, how are you. public fountains, like school fountains or like at fast food stores where they have the sodas and the option for water. would they absolutely have to have no lead in that have to

serve to the public? guest: the lead and copper rule do address increasing testing for lead in our public water supply. the utility should be testing for lead at certain points in the distribution system and so as i said, we are very fortunate we in the united states can be rest assured people are testing for lead. i would say you are safe to drink t host: mary is in silver city, new mexico. caller: thank youd offering this information, not just today but every day. i have heard some time ago were bottled water exposed to sunlight plus turn chemicals into dioxins?

i'm just wondering if you have heard anything about that. guest: they are very powerful chemicals. they are not used in the pltics in our bottled water but exposed to sunlight and heat that can release other chemicals so you do want to keep those out of your cars and not -- you do not want to heat up your plastics. >> we have a question about our waterlines commonly found in private wells treated with lead like the city water line. guest: private wells are separate issues then city water lines. they are there's no one really regulating them and those can have use of lead from whenever they were built. we do find sometimes private wells have more lead than public. public water systems are looking for lead lines in the main

public side of the distributi system pretty actively. where we are trying to get to now is where that public line crosses over to the public line and that something residents need to take care of. >> gerald you are on the air. >> water is just as healthy as tapwater and that there is no real big . it looks like something out of watergate or something. >> bottled water is kind of gallon per gallon far more expensive than what you pay if you asing your public water. just from a cost perspective, bottled water is not as

affordable for families and of hear from lower income families they are often making the choice between food for their families or bottled water. provide clean and safe drinking water from much more affordable source. let's talk to bob in new york, new york. >> a couple callsk a woman talks rights over epa rights talking ■ not there's any control over their own regulations on polluting. that's up to the supreme and the point being the supreme court is leaning towards the states have dumping into the rivers going from one state to another that

another state cannot sue another state because pollution with smoke pipes coming up in one state going to another state. another state can sue the other state on regulations. so my queson this, what devastation will occur from regulatory rights of the environment if the epa cannot dictate what the standard is in the united peril will we be in if this happens. this is the same thing with bowing situation we heard where the republican party doesn't want regulations on commerce and that's what those are for. guest: drinking water contamination does vary state to state.

so the state level, state apartment of environment do a good job of protecting the population so that kind of federal to state relationship is important on some levels especially when it comes to drinking water. >> a quick call in. >> i was wondering how do we compare as a nation some of the european nations as far as the quality of our drinking >> this is an important point. a lot of european countries have the precautionaryrint■■ -- principal where it cannot be used until it's proven to be safe and we have taken the opposite approach here in the united states. where we have allowed these chemicals to be produced and used and now we are just

beginning to catch up with are these chemicals hazardous to health, those studies often get done after the chemicals are produced and used so i wou say european countries are in a better position because they have this cautionary approach. >> assistant scientist at theer. thank you for joining us. that is it for today's journal, thanks everybody who joined us and thank you for watching. we will be back again tomorrow morning, have a great day. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2024] >> today at noon, a discussion

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