the sign it reset in the i seen on the as americans argue amongst themselves about continued aid for ukraine. russia is pressing ahead with it's offensive. now, while it's made some tactical gains and the don boss region that has come at the cost of many lives. and now some russian women have been protesting the deployment of their sons and husbands. but ahead of russia's presidential elections next month, waterproofed and has been drumming up support for the war and ukraine using an old soviet slogan. everything for victory. but how far is putting willing to go? welcome to this week's edition of to the points the

a very warm welcome. i'm so glad to introduce our fantastic panel this week. we have christoph front, marshall, a diplomatic correspondent for the german daily tigris. should be the sarah progress program program director for international affairs at big for about foundation and dw used former mosque, our correspondent for almost 5 years. emily, sherwin a very warm welcome to you all. thanks so much for taking the time. a lot to unpack here today, and i want to start with that speech that we heard from fulton into language is making references to this old soviet slogan. he's saying, every thing for the front, everything for victory. and emily, i'm wondering for you, what does that tell you about the way that person is thinking about the next stages in the war and ukraine? well, i think, you know, from the beginning thing in this, for,

there's been this reference that's being made or this connection being made to the 2nd world war, which is a very emotional topic for russians in russia. it's known as the great patriotic war. almost every family will have some relative who was killed during that war because over 20000000 soviet citizens were killed. so, you know, a huge loss for other russians and that connection is very emotional. and it's one that puts and has been using since the beginning kind of infusing this almost heroic narrative into the current war. and there's this narrative as well now that russia is fighting against ukrainians who the russians have said are nazis but also against the entire west. so i think it's interesting that there's now this reinforcement of that narrative. and it's also interesting to see that by the way of putting this kind of touching his election, why going to that narrative to that very emotional narrative and also to the war? because we've heard that, you know, potentially the kremlin was actually saying he should. you should talk more about

social issues, but he's very firmly connecting himself and his political future to this war. yeah, that is fascinating. that, that he's really, as you say, hitching his bargain to this. um, even when it wasn't necessarily what advisors are saying, christoph, um, as emily says, this is really emotional issue, hearkening back to the soviet union's role in the defeat of the nazis in world war 2. and put in, in that speech was also calling for a social and economic mobilization of russians. and i'm curious of how you think practically, he might be able to do that. well, he certainly has more young men who could solve a sole address. he certainly has enough money to post use this war, but to put it into perspective, i mean it's, it's surprising how difficult it's for russia with so many more people. so it must be guy, economies and ukraine, that they always, they are. and that's not much farther off as the beginning of the war. so they move forward very quickly is the and cycle keeps. now they are back into the eastern,

in this house, as the ukrainian offensive, as they struggled as well as they couldn't gain much territory in, in, in the last year. but now putting maybe sees an opening in this election. yeah. which selection you're all over the world for 14. as we heard, he is connecting success as war with his re election. but we have also elections in the united states and we see it that's a west struggling to get fuel cream. is a financial enter the military 8. they need to just keep the front as it is. and so we see, yeah, for a put in election. if something go all in and it was a west, is a question whether we can sustain or support for ukraine or is it politically difficult? so really an x, a central question or questions we should say, sarah, i'm curious about your thoughts on this rhetoric that we've had it from pretending that speech and toola i'm. so there's a suggest to you that mrs. hymn,

looking also at a new phase in the war when you hear him say things like everything for the front. everything for victory. so i think the sins maybe somewhere autumn, 2022 pollutants game will rush has game was to basically wait out the west and to support for ukraine and in the west. crumbles due to elections due to domestic questions about supporting you crane. and i think that he assumes, at this point, has finally come when we look at the base that we now have in germany, but also in other european countries. and especially in the us on, i think for him this year a p appears very decisive as really hopes that they support the point of the crumble and with all the social economic, political and mobilization that he stages within the country. and, and, you know, from schools to, um, to rallies to, to companies and to different cultural events. you really hopes that he can you like find really when in ukraine and really defeats the west. it's an excellent

point and we are going to come back to that again later in the show 1st. so i think it would be helpful if we can take a look at the situation on the battlefield. i mean rushes, incremental gains there have come at a really high human cost. and a rare show of public the sense we've even seen some russian women protesting for the return of their loved ones from war. they are determined to get their husbands back. these russian wives are link flowers on the grave of the unknown soldier. it's a protest, not a ritual or use. this is a war. people are being killed, ordinary civilians, men were drafted in the personal mobilization. we can't pretend that they're not dying over there, so i need some new this kind of demonstration puts them at risk for harsh punishments, including imprisonment rushes prisons are increasingly filled with more dissenting

activists who chose to take a stand against pollutants. we're seeing these pictures paint a different portrait, young russians from the young army movement standing side by side with their president of see what was using you viewed in a short period of time, nearly 5000000 people have already joined the movement to menu on the radio with the this is a massive army, a lot of the russia will hold elections in march. but even though the result is a foregone conclusion, the question remains how much support does really have among the people the? that is the question, and i'd like to put it directly to you, sarah, how much support does put we have among the restroom population? i think quite a lot, even though and i think we have to admit that that what we do have poles and brush, of course, was due to the refreshments and the autocratic system. we have to handle them fully,

however, um i would assess that we have roughly about maybe 20 percent who are strongly supporting war 20 percent, who are really opposing it at the big mass in the middle east. and that's also, i think, something that reflects maybe know how people actually support put, put in so how the system has been working over the last, maybe 10 to 15 years is actually not by politically mobilizing people for pollutants cause or for any political cause. but rather about, you know, like the pals full of sizing them so that they're, you know, like not interested in politics that may take a step back saying, you know, that's not for me. i'm not really interested also because they're partially afraid of for oppression. so i think that is how you know the support for the regime and the support for the government is structured. however, if we got to look at polls, even though we have to have them carefully put in, is still the most popular politician,

which is awesome to you to know that he's all the time on to be doing nice things and helping people. and then of course, you know, reflects in the attitude that people hold to what say yeah, here's a great platform there. of course, you know, if you put it as high as ation is the goal, emily, i'm curious what you think when you look at something like this movement of wives protesting a one thing, their husbands to come back from the front. i mean, i mean, what does this tell us? what are they risking by demonstrating like this, and how much influence do you think they actually have in society in russia? i think that the position that sarah was talking about is exactly why this movement is interesting because these wives, sometimes mothers of, of the soldiers fighting at the front they're, they're the traditional support base for letting me to put in, you know, their, what would be considered his loyal core and these are the people who are suddenly saying, actually, you know, this, we're not okay with this and we're going to take to the streets. so that's one reason why it could be worried, i think,

for the kremlin. and the other reason is that russia has, you know, a long history of women's movements protest movements during the war in chechnya. there were also mothers process um for political prisoners when i was uh, covering events in moscow. and it provides a, it's a, it's a real problem for the kremlin in terms of optics, because what are they going to do? they're going to be down these, these women on the street that the head is not a good look. and yeah, so i think there, there has been some moves to silence these women. they've been talking about the police visiting them about their rallies being banned about their husbands on the front. even getting visits from the f. s be having pressure put on them. but they're continuing, and in a way they're coming up against this impressive system that perhaps they hadn't known about before. so this could be something that radicalize is them,

and radicalized as others. but it's still of course, minority. and the russian state is very experienced at, at repressing various a protesting defense. yeah. so if there's something of a thorn and put inside a kristof, maybe we can look at the, the other end of that spectrum. we also saw there in that report, the young army movement of, of these patriarch youth. how big are they, how influential are they? are they really supportive of food? and of course we don't have an ex like picture about i would say is that as mainly propaganda, it's overblown. i don't think of that. most young russian think it's a pop throughout texting to fight and you're creating, i'm willing to die for fund boss. and so yeah, for let's look for the reference points. i mean, in these 2 years of war, when ever a protein tries to get more soldiers to the front, a young people were doing the pulling with their feet. say we're trying to get out of the country. and as long as the sounds of the middle classes in the big cities

are concerned, it is a political risk football team on scripting at c a for he has sold us, you know, from prisons, from ethnic minorities, from provincial towns. so it has not this impact on the national picture, and that is the same with the most of soldiers and the reference point. when we hit sea of contest on war of that $78.00 and the eighty's that times the movement of the mothers of soldiers contributed. that's as of yet. so did union have to enter war. we are not, not see our yet because put in control to pictures of the protest in the demonstration. so most of the russians will not at all that they have. so similar movement today. it is fascinating that there's that history there as well. of course, all these political questions are really on the table right now because we are looking ahead to presidential elections in march. and sarah, just, just for our international audience. i mean, when you think about elections in russia, can you paint a picture for us to what degree these are actually free and fair elections and

whether there's any kind of real opposition to a lot of our approach. and they're not praying for at all. and there is no room for real a position in any like presidential or also federal elections. which doesn't mean that these kind of electrons doesn't serve a purpose inside russia. it's, but the purpose not to, you know, change the government. or maybe, you know, the fact in the end, for example, the president gets less rhodes and maybe learns about, you know, how he should alter his politics. for example. it's rather about, you know, demonstrating the ability of the system to produce a high level to turn out a high support for poetry. and so it's actually creating legitimacy for the whole system and for the person to put it, which is very important for this double ization of the whole system. so if we look at the electrons, we and i certainly know how it's going to turn out in the end. so put in will, but will, the, will, the regions,

will the federal agencies all the different parts of the states be able to produce these high water turned out as plus result. but it's at least as high as the, you know, boats about putting gates in 2018. and i think these are the things that we should look to. and this illusion of the way you put it on allusion of legitimacy, i think, is really fascinating. emily of for a while there was, there was an anti war candidate running in these presidential elections for us in a den dish. and it didn't. we now know which is 5 weeks to go into the presidential elections. he is out to read off the ballot. can you tell us exactly what happened there and what this says about as far as point. so he's the 2nd anti war candidate that tried to qualify for these selections and is now also off the ballot. so i think it's interesting because while we're seeing these mothers protesting, there are also surveys, sara pointed out that surveys during war time or are difficult, but we're seeing some surveys saying that basically the people,

the amount of people that would support a piece deal at the moment within russia are now and, you know, that's a larger percentage than the people who want to keep fighting. so that's interesting. and that's something that the kremlin definitely knows, you know, they, they carry out their own surveys and put into popularity on all kinds of issues behind the scenes that we never see. so it was interesting that the potential of, of an anti war candidate in bodies and that there's been, was even on the cards, there was some, seemed to be some during over whether he should be, whether he should qualify or not. now, due to some procedural things to do with signatures that he collected, he's out. but i think there was some consideration within the kremlin of whether they need that kind of vowels pressure. vowels to release some of this anti worth sentiment. and i guess they decided it would be too much of a risk to have him on the ballot. because what if he actually did get a, you know,

a few percent of percentage points unexpectedly. yeah. christoph, is that, is that our impression to why he's not going to be on the ballot this year? do you think that they found him to be too much of a threat to be, i think so, again, i would say the war is not popular. at least it's not popular to go to war and say, a set us up in a center in the russian population which is empty, the war and not willing to sacrifice of children. and when that would come into the open, how big percentage is even if they have pressure and threats, if you go and vote for him, the risk was to big. i would agree. so this has been a really fascinating insight into russian society as far as we can see from here in berlin. i do want to take a look at the situation currently in ukraine on the battlefield case, of course, saying that it is lacking ammunition. and that the west hasn't delivered all the a, but it has promised. and it is also at the same time hoping that new aid packages

from the you and potentially the united states could help bridge that gap. let's take a look with a shortage of weapons and emission and soldiers. president zalinski is using slogans of perseverance to motivate troops on the front lines and wash the flu shot . you have such a difficult task in a clear mission. with them to beat back the enemy and win this war to do so, you pray not only needs more weapons, but a lot more money to replenish it's empty state coffers. after a lot of wrangling, brussels has finally given the green light of the installer drunk. since we've got 27 heads of state governments to reach an agreement that will allow an additional 50000000000 euros, an aid for ukraine to return. but the real question is, what can you create expect from the usa?

the senate has introduced a package worth billions that combines a to ukraine with us border security. but house republicans have already declared their opposition to it if it passes, will it be enough to insure ukrainian survival? so crystal 5 is this picking up on something you were touching on earlier? if it passes, will this a to be enough to ensure you crane survival? i'm afraid that this you can change of the course of the war because it's not enough to support from the west. and now we have to make a distinction between financial aid and military aid, as the european union approved that 50000000000 euro packets in the end. so that is enough to keep the government running for the next month. but the more important it's come from the united states military 8. we see, since this is an election in the united states, we shouldn't expect of that. congress can make up the choice whether they want to

support the queen military 8, say what to house. in fact, they fax, those white house decides how much military 8 is they sent to ukraine and that is much more than europe can do. europe is not even able to produce a 1000000 autoline suits with which we need and promised to produce and deliver. and even the military packets might come not to an total end of might be reduced strongly if the notes from when c election at the ends of the year. so if we have not enough financial support, and we have to prospective that the military 8 of the united states might be reduced, come next year on the trump presidency. then i think you create and will be in deep, deep trouble. and it is a real risk that that might change the course of the war. and sarah, you know, if we do see trump elected in the united states, or even a further draft toward this nationalist america from south america,

1st policy among republicans in congress. how x a central do you think this is for ukraine? what, what the consequences be? i think it's quite, it's essential not only because the military is 8 in support of the us for ukraine is really crucial. so if we look at the numbers now the european union states are, you know, supporting ukraine military are roughly a bit more than us. but in total, altogether this just, you know, gives you an idea of the, of the size. what do you actually does? and what i hear is about in case the u. s. reduces its support for ukraine. will also have a kind of development in europe. you know, where's different starts stuff, say ok without the us. we kind of really enjoy that. as you know, it doesn't really make sense supporting ukraine without the ask because we kind of supply enough. so maybe like lesson for piece talk while that's, that's for us to crate into a position where they have to, you know, get into

a position that is really on favorable for them. so i think we're really also have to, you know, make sure that the, your pin consensus to support. you can stay strong no matter what actually in the last happens. christ off. do you agree? i where the us goes of the you follows in terms of support for ukraine. yes, that was the situation. what was the last 2? yes. a tons of sites always waited for us. decision was up to deliver better tanks or whatever. it was always, he looked what is president find doing, and then i'm trying to, to move the drum and a behavior behind him. and when it's now comes to the next year, and what europe could do was out says leadership of the united states. and that is also an important point. it's not just the financial aid. it's not just military who holds this coalition, pro ukrainian callers and together. that's one guy. so by then, because he has the tory tlc, the united states, as a superpower, can we imagine here any person in europe who could get in these shoes? if the trumpet selected, chancellor thoughts, no monument, my call was

a lot for me to lie. no body has this. oh sorry t. and that would be also a huge loss. so my personal hope, but i'm not sure whether you're able to do that, but my personal hope is said you're up finally says, you know, this is a region of war in europe. we should be able to wins is more what we should be able to enable if you could in the winds as well. it was also for europe in the union has economic resources 7 times bigger than russia. so it's a question of organizing our resources and defining said, we want your cri, you know, to lose. we want to give them what they need not to lose. and we take pride in being able to do this without the united states. not we have pushed into such a situation which we don't like and would like to avoid. we still take pride in finally having this moment that you're upset, step so we'll give it how far away we are from that currently, emily, you know,

do you think, how do you think pretend is viewing all of this when he looks at this in fighting within the united states and also even within the republican party there also, you know, the, the inability of european leaders to, to do what kristof is suggesting. does this play in his favor? absolutely. all of this will be music to his ears. i think, you know, i think initially presumably the kremlin was or funding there put you in was surprised at the strength of that coalition that kristof was talking about. and i know a lot of people have been saying he's just playing a waiting game at the moment. you know, with this war of attrition, basically waiting for the money to run out of when it comes to the west. and now we have this election year in the us, where trump, you know, is the potential republican candidate. he's been talking about not supporting, you know, or this america 1st policy anyway and, and also not continuing support for ukraine. and also the world has been looking much more to the middle east with the conflict there. so i think that distraction

is, is something that the kremlin has been waiting for and also, yeah, the money, the money running out. and it's interesting because actually right now there's been a big discussion about tucker carlson, who's your boss of the house. yeah, it is this, this fox presenter who's gone rogue and has his own show the super conservative. he's going to moscow to interview, letting me or put in. so it does seem like even letting me, unfortunately, right away into the, the debate going on in the us and kind of back up that or top republican narrative that the, that ukraine can't win any way that, that the financial support won't matter. so they're really using that to their favor, i think. and sarah, just your final thoughts here is, but emily says ringing true, it's any. does it seem like food and can out weight the west? i mean at the moment that seems like, uh it will have to be like a legit strategy because if we look at the device that we have in the us. but also the, the base that we have in, within the you and within germany, you know,

support is crumbling, people are thinking about, okay, what should we invest to, or should we invest into security and should we invest in to ukraine or should route rather invest them to i don't know digitalization or modernization of infrastructure for example. plus, you know, we do see that we have a link between domestic and foreign policy where a lot of political actors in use this of support for ukraine as a leverage. do you know, achieve different things domestically and internally, and i see that this is very, you know, dangerous development that really and dangerous support and consensus for supporting a client. well, i can talk to you all about this all day, but i'm afraid that's all we have time for. i thank you to our fantastic panel christoph, emily and sarah. i appreciate your insights today and everybody watching at home. thank you for watching and let us know what you thought in the comments. if you're watching on youtube and please join us next time. thanks so much the,

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. this is dw is line from salad ukraine's. ministry gets a major shakeup. president savanski replaces, he's talking to other tre, combine that has led to the countries war efforts since russia invited the dismissal of general. but there is a versioning suggest the major v. think of kings approach to the complex also on the program talk. this time comes the votes after millions take past in on the election, boxed by deputy 5. despite the obligations of the vote trigger, they shut down of the mobile phone system and at least it doesn't test the government. assess the pope for successful pressures. electro commission bonds on people con confident that punishment just a.