your brains largest children's hospital on monday, russia launch the wave of missiles against ukrainian cities killing at least 37 people. a mixed close up takes a look at how countries and african agent view nato today. and terry martin, thanks for watching. the name is the calls back. saved loud. thank you so much for joining in. welcome to don't hold bad. a lot of people do that. it's all about saying it aloud. you guys would have being nosy, bay, like get everyone talking to me. you're healthy award winning called called the called back the nature coast itself,

the strongest defense alliance in the world and the community of value multiple conflict, but to prevent the confusion. but this view is not sure if i actually want you don't have a protein rights to be in charge. in many countries, it's enough for kind of asia. the military alliance is regarded with skepticism and distrust. we often call and help, but you're a little bit suspicious that we are being set up for the future. causal. there is a 2nd level of thought proceed. the war and ukraine. his father divided the world and reveals a deep disconnect between nato countries and the global song. we don't even take inside the west also needs to recalibrate them approach. so what does this mean for need to in the future of the alliance? we can't expect every country to see the world the same way we do, you know, nato should expand on a global basis. the,

the booking alfonso in west africa, in september of 2022 youtube as soldiers detained the president and ceased power accusing the government of failing to fight and as long as the insurgency, it was the 2nd coup within a year. supporters of the crew took to the street waving russian slang. the movie one day, a piece about the loop, if you don't know, can't find the end, says, says read, never give up the fight because we are here to support the military in order to testify our country, which has suffered so much from territories and jumped out of duties, the embassy of former colonial ruler friends came on to attack,

dissatisfied with french influence and the west in general, the orchestra to it's of the crew to him, to rush out for military assistance. demanded a firm we are asking from to get out to lead to these awesome being peace because they are taking us centuries back to most co instigate the pricing. it's not clear but this, the whole region has been in the cross hairs of russian. this information campaigns for years, the cooling book, you know, fast, so was just one in a serious of military take over. it's in west africa since 2020, that have toppled governments in new jail, molly and guinea, and were a military home test or the western troops to leave inviting russian mercenaries in . instead, the russian wants to show that the west is failing. so of course, when there is a legal,

the geo political vacuum russian, russian moves is everybody's in the game with just one of the play is now, you know, and that's what we have to, i think i understand and integrate into us thinking people are looking after their own interest and making, making a choice based on what they see and what they need. the kremlin has aggressively expanded its footprint in africa, offering military cooperation and seeking support, or at least neutrality over its invasion of ukraine, government and some parts of the world. russian president vladimir putin is no longer welcome, but here he is seen by some as a friend. and all of this, despite the with efforts to build a global coalition to condemn and isolate the regime in moscow. rational tries, in a way to, to do, of course is in the spread of their false narrative. and of course the i believe in, in, in, in, through. so i, i believe that the best answer to this information is,

is, is the truth. and of course, nato is always ready to be part of the open public debate about about dissertation in europe, in africa, on the and we will continue to appeal to everyone that believes in the law that we should know that our country instructional tool has been to force to get there will we are at nato headquarters in brussels, of to decades in the office, installed them back is about to step down. and secretary general, she has navigated the organizations through difficult times the since the start of rushes invasion. and she has been trying to keep the alliance together, rel, link elyse behind you cream. she has also intensified need to it's outreach to global partners. our security is not a regional. our security is a global. what happens in ukraine matters for

a shot and the more successful to to induce in ukraine. the more likely to is that you're going to see something single happen in the salt sign on the seat on april 4th, need to celebrate to that spread state. and the strong found fortune between europe and the u, as in the off to months of world war 2. but there was no real party moved. investors, in spite of speeches full of strong commotions. today we celebrate the senate 50 spend the rest of the strongest. most and during, on the most successful alliance in history for some of the to members like hungry and germany used to have very close ties with russia before the war. other especially those in eastern europe have always been wary of the kremlin with visiting military trail in western poland to

a need to hi readiness troops from different countries are exercising. how to fight side by side should the need arise, like other countries that share at border with ukraine or russia, and it's used to live under the some of the soviet union. the poles no fear. they are at risk of being attacked too. if you claim falls, they have been warning of russia true intentions for years. it's little bits for us the we were aware of the situation and we were awarding the others who are showing the, the experience, our experience for many, many use of cooperation with russia. they didn't believe close, they wanted to make a business as usual. now they can see we're right. we're right. we can make the business, but we have to be ready for and the threats from english, because russia, it's russia, they haven't changed for centuries. helping you crane fight against rush office so

far united states or countries even though key, if it's not a member of the alliance, you installed back in fellow need to leaders believe they are. cause is it right? just one of the rushes more and ukraine is a blatant violation of international law. these are the 2 competing narrative which has been central to russia's longstanding dispute with me till most co says that the alliance has been encroaching on russia's folders for years. nato says it's the other way around. central and eastern european countries were afraid of russia and wanted to join the organization the claims that the russians and some others make about what they called nato's expansion to the east after the end of the cold war. uh, are really badly uh, misplaced and don't at all describe what happened. i was in the george h w bush administration. i remember that countries like hungry came to us

as the berlin wall was falling and, and were knocking on nato's door. because they had been through world war 2, they had been through the post world war to basically soviet occupation. and they wanted defense. they wanted to be in an alliance that would protect their sovereignty, the way the west caesar. every country should have the right to choose its own allies and not to go to great powers seeking to maintain your self interest. but this narrative doesn't seem to convince the global self. what he can't understand is why do you want to expand it? why would you, 1222222, by and large in large, the footprint of nato in the world where we should be decelerating the synthesis of conflict, especially with one of i see globalization and the will be increasingly integrated

from nato's perspective, military support from its members is badly needed for ukraine to survive as a suffering nation. but the allies are also struggling economically and have problems producing enough ammunition and weapons for both ukraine's and their own protection. rochelle meanwhile, has so far the flight wisdom sanctions and completed the transition to a full board economy. so the supporters, so few clean, understand they need to the international community to help them contain russia. and they want countries in the global cells to also believe this is for their own goods. if you validate the principle that unprovoked aggression goes on answered, it's going to be the small defenseless countries who are going to face the risk. united states doesn't face the risk of, of unprovoked attack, as long as we remain strong in this afternoon for the india. and we have to open up

to dialogue to other perspectives. and we have to make it clear to the country in the global side and see which in know to the same. everyone has the interest that we are interested in dialogue. we are interested in the strategic partnership, which is going to by protecting the real estate and international, the behavior above you at the end. and that's a lot of our them for fits but is this the kind of partnership the countries and the global self are looking for? we travel to south africa to find out the country has as much as one of the driving forces on the continent. south africa does not see the war in ukraine in the same light as the west. the government in victoria has refused to join the western coalition against the kremlin. instead, south africa conducted terry trails with russia and up stains on every resolution adopted by the you and general assembly. we joined

a rallying shoshanna group in new york vittoria, one of the most notorious townships in the area. supporters of the governing african national congress have come together here to protest, scan violence, crime, unemployment corruption. these are the issues south africa is currently grappling with. but in spite of all that, they are proud of their country and they'll stay are successful, struggles for freedom and independence. we want to be treated as equals, because we're living in the clinton and quote, africa doesn't make us different. and from people who are living in mural for people living in the americas, we put our own destiny. we want to go to that destiny using our own way of doing things. we cannot be told because the very same people want to tell us what to do. they get resources from this theme of food that they want to undermine to deep. we support a blue one who is a victim of a meal,

kind of losing. who is the victim of imperialism? we have one to support them without even flinching. the rest of historical legacy that might possibly explain south africa's political choices of to all, it was the united states and other western countries that supported the apartheid regime for decades. while the soviet union provided money and weapons for the fight against white dominance in the region, the weapons us to them displayed symbols of old alliances and partnerships when nato or the west goes to countries like india. china now of course, but also in africa, latin america, to come and join them and sanctions against russia, or in condemnation of russia. they forget that these countries have historical relations with russia. but some of them have been health by rush in the liberation struggles, and they forget that these countries are also deciding on the basis of the national interest of the community sent in the cafeteria. monro panama,

my go by is the b. i. p visitor here today, the politician has served in different positions in the government, including as a foreign policy adviser to president serial rama posts the center has been financed by cutoff just one example of the many partnerships south africa has thoughts since its independence. here, nato is viewed with this trust that things weren't happening right here in, in, in, you know, old continental, no one is talking about what's happening in west inside. no one is talking about even what's happening in the middle east. there's many, many places, way we believe that intervention as we have not only in gaza and we believe that they have really been some kind of discrimination against that basis as it relates to conflicts that are happening. and it's only important if it is happening in the setting geographic area and fits into these that's what vs fee,

the. and that is how people seem to perceive nato here in south africa. and also in other parts of the world as a western club characterized by dapple standards. when we see they don't often call and help, but be a little bit suspicious that we are being set up for a future cold war. based on this label, based on historical commission, do not provide, the nato has never been aggressive. no one in the global sites has to worry about that tonight. and it will stay that way because the members days of an a to room western democracies which feel clearly and good in the values that are a state which also have clear moral principles. they don't have whenever natal went to build the, you know, a do the lock and i've gone this on, on. if you, if you talk about countries that are going to the global solid or countries that are not western, i think for them it's about too many movie to rich. perhaps 6 percent does change, which is that every time they did was google. it doesn't the dock and i've gotten

those funds to mutual splendors and you all kind of got us on something by which all we have a perception and i think it's a correct to that it was option because of business. while we under the sun, the do can justify one need or didn't it all kind of gone to funds need to elyse went into i've gotten this done up to the 911 terrorist attacks on the u. s. to ensure they said that the country, which never again become at safe haven for terrorists. the invasion of iraq was launched in 2003 under what's turned out to be a full street tex. it was conducted by a you asked, let call ition of countries which included some other nato members the conduct of the west and both operations undermined its claims that it wants to protect a rules based global order. the suffering of the civilian populations in iraq and afghanistan, and eventually the humiliating retreat from of kindest on weekends, the reputation of the west leading power. the us,

one thing we should to do as nato is told to throw less us from of kind of stuff. if you saw, because it was hot breaking to see a while, a need to uh, troops are leaving as the tenant and the disorderly. the behavior on the part of a kinase for city is the united states as been the well, it's well the best they can us into one adventure of to the other and the full has full for to the rightful modeling. leading new emerging powers like india, are eager to step in to feel defined. we are in new delhi, india, capital, the country of 1400000000 people has aspirations to become a top global power. faithful to the corner stone of its foreign policy,

multi alignment. india has refused to sacrifice its twice with rush over the war and ukraine. instead, it has taken advantage of west and sanctions on russia by purchasing cheap oil and bulk. need to seems to be seen here as the party mainly responsible for the war and ukraine. 2 factors. one is. 2 you know, going on please stream. there's no supervisors that does the west and rescue, but more specifically to the not to we status and that kind of publication that's not to has done regularly on the east. and, you know, border of a shelf maple is probably the purpose of nato's to head for us at arms. it's media, chris, by the us to find the market towards weapons. nothing more. the 1st thing i particularly don't feel that of that is affordable or any such type of what is happening. that natural is needed, the prime minister in their rent remedies refusal to break

with russia seems to surprise many european for a few that india being a democratic country which side with other democracies. does this mean? india is indifference to the violence in ukraine. also a question should be what really hasn't done. so india takes a lot of pride in saying that he has to be on euclid. but at the same time, we do not support the water in any way. all we all have also sent 15 consignments of age to create a v r one. so perhaps, so one of the most bulky supporters, all for mediation and be splendid. you know, india has a particular relationship with russia and it has a particular relationship in your up and these are both constructive partnerships that have, you know, different elements there. the relationship with russia still remains important for a number of reasons, defense, energy, security, food security, and for strategic relations and duration of rational has long been india

as largest arm supplier. but the warning ukraine has hastening new daily inputs has to diversify its weapon. space mode is government has turned its focus to domestic production with western technology. this guided messiah destroyer locally made by india, is a recent example of that. the military drill into himalayas. the injustice disputed border with china india and, and american troops training together. here it's both countries tried to manage rising tensions with badging exercises like this one, reflect the bonding defense ties between india and the u. s. but the mistrust of nato appears to be deeply rooted. i think nato and his member states and other european institutions do suffer from a charges of double standards,

hypocrisy when it comes to a universalizing their mission. and the feeling in many parts of the global south is that uh, the standards only apply when your insecurity or need to interest started stake. but our convenient fee set us side when other country share similar concerns about things happening in their regions and their countries. so countries like india and south africa are aspiring to take on a bigger role on the world stage. their platform is brakes. an informal collab initiated by restaurant 2009 to counterbalance the g 7. it has recently welcomed new members. the group now represents 45 percent of the world's population excellency product excellencies from india food. he supports the expansion of the brakes membership. hardy's back bricks, members have differing interest. there is competition. there are disputes among

them. but what unites them is the urge to challenge a world order dominated by the west. the view of a rigs is larger that just of it. uh so you would get it already recognize the rely, jay that the bricks country is dope, solves countries on a rise. we don't need to be that we will stay in the brakes and strengthen the brakes and let the voice of the african nations to actually be had brooks is definitely a good for me to actually do that because it is taking away the power of the west we look at the brakes and when we are devin brakes, i think we want to retain the non western on nature and the flavor of bricks because of we are not there then actually becomes and to western breaks it's about geo politics and economy corporation. it's not a military alliance. nato countries collectively spent much more on defense. but the brakes nations are catching up. especially china. it already has the 2nd

biggest economy in the world, and the numbers, the biggest army and navy in the world. for the last few years, china has been asserting its power and its neighborhood in particular towards taiwan, which is considered a renegade province, but also towards japan. and increasingly, in the south china sea, a region of sweet tease, you can port this when nato countries, as well as one 3rd of global trade is shipped through the area. this is a very volatile region. we know that, but there are no horse. i mean, there are no hot tours at the moment, and most of the countries that i speak to whether it's indonesia, on malaysia, or even the indians who look like pro west and at the moment. don't want this foreign power. this foreign st. king power to come to, to the region and perhaps make things worse. so far it is mainly due as that is boosting smaller countries in their efforts to contest beijing

claims in the region. but kids need to play a role there to of to own. and it's new strategic concept. the alliance describes china emissions as a challenge to add security. well, my own personal view is that nato should expand on a global basis, not for a offensive purposes or just out of now you've idealism, but because the world has entered, i think, a new period of foreign policy. i think it was, you could take 2023 is the year that happened with the visible formation of the china, russia axis. and if you ask countries along, china is periphery, japan, south korea and india. they will say they're very worried about what the implications of this are, and i'll be a globe. i don't have my diet. so by whether we need to become more global and it matters whether a conflict is 3 hours away. for the 2 hours away from you, we have to deal with it differently. and i don't think that the future,

but that doesn't realize nato becoming large of that and can. but the future of nato will also depend on its most powerful member of the united states. we are in washington dc. what those voices don't think the value of the trans atlantic bond has been growing load and louder, and the recent years. money could be spent elsewhere to do like better infrastructure or likes better politics in america the 1st and yeah, i think mondays can be sent to other resources. i mean, we do have the largest portion of the contribution scenario. we've been asking them for years. our country partners to contribute more contribute more or we're gonna, you know, kind of loosen up our ties. but we have the responsibility. i think it's uh, ensures that others feel safe in the world. and i think without it, you know, you have outside actors like russia in china, they're going to feel the buildings. she has been fueling and time nato sentiments . when donald trump was president of the united states, he described to you

a penny union as a folk. and threatens to make your opinions, pay for you as protection. now on the contain trail, he is doing it again. one of the presidents of a big country stood up said, well sir, if we don't pay and were attacked by russia, will you protect us? i said, no, i would not protect you. in fact, i would encourage them to do whatever the hell they want. you gotta say, so crude, a 2nd, trump presidency, mean the end of nato. i do think that it's a highly likely trump will withdraw from nato. if he's elected and i think that would be a catastrophic decision for the united states, it would have negative consequences all over the world because the countries of asia would say, look, if the united states is leaving the most successful military alliance in history. what, why do we think they would defend us? we need to look at the factual elements and also to

visit recent development. that sentence has inactive that deals to prohibits in the future us, pres, then to withdraw the united states from native. this is a good safe guys to measure. i think in may 2024 need to complete it. it's largest exercise since the cold war involving thousands of troops from europe and north america, regardless of who wins to raise to the white house. many as you expect that you asked support for need to will decline any way. and the viewer of will have to do more for its own defense. some see, it is a chance for the continents to emancipate itself from the u. s. and we calibrate it's approach to the global self. i believe very much that europe has an important experience to share with the world. countries coming together offer a war coming together, setting up structures. this is an inspirational,

really and inspirational story and inspires me as a european. but i can tell you, it inspires many people in asia, africa, and latin america. so i think instead of talking at each, although i'm always so, so to, for exemplifying all the diversions and the problems, i mean, tablets and those other interview with. but i think we should be talking to each other much more and the geopolitical moment is perhaps right for it. and as well, we need to get all far high horse finally meet on an equal footing and accepts that there are no longer any blogs in the world. that's the decisive factor coalition of all those who support the rules based international order. because in the end, it protects everyone from indian fits. so now europe is occupied with the war raging on his doorstep. but it's this war that has shown you a p instead little can be a cheap alone in an emerging, multi polar won't change in perspectives. may be an important step towards

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