rudenko, verdict program, let's watch together. good evening, we are from ukraine. glory to ukraine, this is the verdict program. my name is serhiy rudenko, i greet everyone and wish everyone good health. for the next two hours , we will talk about ukraine, the world, the war, and ours. victory today in the change program in the ukrainian army, how does recruiting differ from mobilization and can it become an alternative? gaining muscle from the kremlin's tricks, can russia really increase its army to 1.5 million people? border hostages: when the us congress finally will help ukraine. we talk about this and other things. during the next hour, with our

guests colonel of the security service of ukraine, people's deputy of ukraine roman kostenko, military expert valentin badrak, and former head of the security service of ukraine, people's deputy of ukraine, valentin nalyvaichenko. in the second part of our program, political experts andriy smoliy, vitaliy kulyk and kyiv city council member viktoriya ptashnyk. however, before starting our big conversation, i suggest you take a look. video of how the magyar birds hunted the russian one t-80 in the krynok area. heavy armored vehicles were spotted by aerial scouts near the forest on the left bank of the kherson region, where the destruction took place. let's watch the video.

friends, for those who are currently watching us on youtube, please like this video, subscribe to our youtube page, and also vote in our poll, today we ask you if peace with russia is possible, yes, no , everything is quite simple on youtube, two options, yes, no, or write your comment under this video. if you're watching

us on tv right now, get your hands on it phone and vote if you think peace with russia is possible, 0800 211 381, no, 0800-211382, all calls to these numbers are free, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote. we have our first guest on call, people's deputy of ukraine, colonel of the security service of ukraine, roman kostenko. mr. colonel, i congratulate you and thank you for being with us today. good evening, each other. mr. colonel, let's start with the main topic, which will probably be in 2024, because at yesterday's press conference , volodymyr zelenskyi said about a possible mobilization of 500,000 people, well, at least that's what he said, that military people are convinced that exactly this, such a number of people is necessary with... the armed forces of ukraine.

let's listen to what zelensky said, then continue. the questions are very sensitive, i think. they addressed, regarding the defense of our state and potential counteroffensive actions, regarding the deficit, and their view was on the rate that they proposed to mobilize. additional 450-500 thousand people, this is a very serious number, i said i need more arguments in order to support this direction, because this is a question first of all of people, the second is a question of justice, it is a question of defense capability and a question of finances, mr. colonel, what does mobilization mean... 500

thousand people in 2024, that is, zelensky said about 500 billion hryvnias and that a lot of resources are needed in order to ... dream about this large mobilization, what this mobilization will give and whether it is necessary to carry out this large mobilization in the 24th year in such a quantity, well, it all depends on those plans, which must be agreed among themselves from the very beginning and from the current situation that exists on the fronts and regarding the security of our units, staffing of the warehouse. er, i will say this, in principle, i know perfectly well the situation that er, there is regarding mobilization, i will say this way that we have a very bad situation in mobilization now, and er, when the president

talks about such figures, it is me i think the plus or minus average numbers, which, well, i think will allow us to keep the situation as it is, i think it's... a question of some counterattacks there, a question of some actives there actions, this is a matter of stabilizing the situation, maybe demobilizing someone , maybe someone there, let's say to have the possibility of rotation, so you need plus or minus such an amount of news, here you can tell a lot of things more specifically, but unfortunately not it is possible, because all this information, in general, is a question of mobilization, it is... secret, and in general, when the president says such numbers, it means that these numbers, they are a state secret, and therefore we must understand that going from these numbers, the enemy also hears how many we are going to call up there, what problematic issues we have there, and

of course he can also respond to that, so the specific issues, they cannot be specified, but the fact that we need to mobilize clearly, the fact that... problems with mobilization, this is a fact, i can confirm them, that now we have something to work on. mr. colonel, before zelenskyi’s press conference, just a few days later, the commander-in-chief of the armed forces of ukraine, valery zaluzhny, said that he was dissatisfied with the release of regional military personnel, because it is still too early to evaluate the new recruitment project for the armed forces of ukraine , and the mobilization in ukraine in the 20th... of the third year should return to the framework in which it worked before, let's hear what general zaluzhnyi said, it is still a little early to evaluate the recruitment, it's a little early, and as for

mobilization issues, well, it's not that it needs to be strengthened, but to return those boundaries, those frameworks, as they worked before, because now it's, let's say, the problem of those guys. who are fighting on the front line, someone has to replace them, someone has to help them, and they are now, well , over time, they are left on their own, this is completely wrong, it is simply necessary to return to the framework in which the wine, in which the wine worked, the dismissal of the regional ones greatly affected the efficiency, these were professionals, they knew how to do it, mr. colonel, i know that now the verkhovna rada of ukraine is considering several draft laws that concern both mobilization and demobilization. is there any final version of the projects that will be included in any we do not consider, sir a series, none, that is, there are no draft laws yet, as such, there is work to be done,

work to be done, well, i understand now, the groups of the ministry of defense that came to us recently presented these draft laws, they are debatable there, and there are many norms that still need to be finalized, there are no ready-made studies, what the president said there, that he already has some studies, they even, let’s say, there are studies, but there are no ready-made norms, i don’t know when they will be, there yesterday, literally we at the committee considered one of bills, and there there was a question, including the registration of women, and practically none of the people's deputies of the committee supported it, well, i think you can say 90%. did not support this, we have already discussed this issue, there are some other norms , of course, they will also discuss demobilization, the question, in particular , was discussed, what will be the period of 36 months or 24 months, what are the norms in this case or 36 months for everyone to do , for example, is 36

months common for all, and for those who participated in hostilities there for at least six months to make it possible mobilization after 24 months, my biggest supporter... of such norms that those who directly participated in the battles were in combat orders, they to have the right to early demobilization, so all these norms, they are, and now a mini group the ministry of defense is working on... they presented it to us, we gave our comments there and they went to edit it, so i think it is right that it will be submitted to the ministry of defense through the cabinet of ministers, because no matter what, they say about the deputies that they should do it in us there are several people, so that everyone understands, in the country who are responsible for mobilization and demobilization, this is the supreme commander, this is the government and this is the commander-in-chief. and first of all, the commander-in-chief and the government should go

to work, of course, with the agreement of the commander-in-chief, what you want, because the deputies do not know the plans, the deputies do not know how much someone has to mobilize for the next year, our task is give funds, expel and make the right laws so that the army can work properly so that it can regulate their own, let's say, internal relations. so that it can write off property that the president has not yet signed into law, the military, frankly, still cannot do this, write off property, and this is the task of the verkhovna rada, to ensure livelihoods with laws, namely the budget, namely mobilization, precisely norms, how it will look, this is the question of volodymyr and zelenskyi, this is the question of glavkom zaluzhny and this is the question of the minister of defense, or shmyhal,

so they should submit it and then divide it, they will say, we see that people have to demobilize how much, the draft must be such and such, the conscripts must be released or not released, or re-enlisted and then divide it, which, for example, if i need to reduce my age, then who should do it, the president, because the law has been with him for more than six months and... for some reason he does not sign it, well, i don't know why, probably because it is possible to lose some political dividends, it is bad that we are still we think about it, he did not sign it. the next, uh, let's say, moment, it's for example, what we talked about with you, various accounts, issues of disabled people, issues there , crossing borders, whether you are there or something else, care, these are legislative issues, some issues, issues are for the government, and then comprehensively, when there is a solution, you need hand out these tasks and we will... accept them, but that’s not what they said: you will work hard, and the verkhovna rada again, you will see, there will be such

a test, do it now, neither the government , nor the president’s office will do anything, and the verkhovna rada will adopt this law, they will vote, they will test society, as this bill in society will accept if they sign it well, if not, it will go where it lies for 25 years, where the bill on the write-off of property lies, and there it will be... therefore, but the time has come to make popular and unpopular decisions, because if this does not happen, we will not win, but mr. colonel, if the president does not sign the bill and does not return this bill to the verkhovna rada within the specified time with his comments or references, it means that he violates the constitution of ukraine, because there is a clear regulation, according to which law, which are received for... the president's signature must be signed and or returned to the verkhovna rada within the specified period, that is, i understand that

the question of whether those who are 25 years old will be mobilized to the armed forces, starting from the age of 25, has not been resolved, the question how to write off property in the armed forces according to a simplified procedure, the draft law that you were the author of has also not been signed, that is, all these questions hang in the balance if... we are talking about mobilization, but at the same time, mr. serhiy, pay attention, please , yesterday even at the conference, how the tactics are being conducted now office, i try to be tolerant, but when the supreme commander of a democratic country during a war directly attacks the legislative body of our country, as it happened yesterday at the conference, there are people's deputies, there is an institution, if there is a question, everyone needs to ask, every deputy separately. to ask questions, he discredits the institution that symbolizes democracy in our

country, and if someone does not think, does not like, he must be re-elected, he bears political responsibility, he is a representative of the people, as well as the president, this is not the government that we elect, each deputy and he has voters whom he represents, to whom he is responsible, and the office of the president is now working on discrediting clearly not by signing laws, that is, we dug up. i am citing a bill signed by 42 people, 42 people's deputies who are representatives of the people, they, we voted it in one reading, immediately as a whole, then... because all the deputies understand that military bills, they are important, and we immediately we make it a law, the speaker signs it, we send it to the president, more than two months zero, i know they talked about it in their meeting, when the office agreed that it was possible, and the president said that i would sign it, but he did not sign it because of the request of the department of

defense there, because of some other, he didn't sign it, and as a result, what we have, we're here saying let's give our guys at war, on the one hand, and on the other hand, we're saying, we're not signing something that's going to make their lives easier, and that , who will come new, who will understand that they do not want to go to the bureaucracy, and for this we will later push everything to the verkhovna rada, discrediting the legislative body, as was the case with salaries, when the government removed 30,000, and they fired, let's say, they said that all this was done by deputies, deputies do not collect salaries, we allocated the budget , in which this money was deposited. but the government and led by the supreme commander-in-chief made a decision to take away these 30,000 and many such issues, and this is very wrong, we are fighting for, first of all , for the territory and for democracy, and we and we must protect this democracy as an institution , i repeat once again, i am not for individuals, i am for the institution, if there is no one to protect it, i will protect it myself, because now these

institutions and the people have entrusted me to be here, and we can see the president that does what i don't like about this game. you can play together, mr. colonel, one more issue is quite relevant, which was commented on by zelenskyy yesterday, but it does not remove this issue of the relationship between the supreme commander-in-chief of the armed forces of ukraine and the commander-in-chief of the armed forces of ukraine. zelenskyi said about the relationship with valery zaluzhny, literally. let's listen. i have a good working relationship. he has from to report the result for the result on the battlefield as a commander together with the general staff, there are many questions, there is also the commander of tavria, who was engaged in operational command, look, this is a difficult issue of the offensive, something happened, something did not happen, something happened, something is missing, and maybe he won't be, well, that is, it's

a complicated, very complicated story, i think we can afford it. live in ukraine with daily result, that's what i think, if we're ready to bring that result, each of us , and it's, you know, it's not a sacrifice, that's what i 'd like to say, i think it's an honor to be the head, well, right away the journalist asked about how he met. has the position of mariana bezugla, who has been trying to iron out zaluzhnyi on facebook for literally the second month, and the journalist asked if this is the position of the representative of the presidential party and if it reflects the position of volodymyr zelenskyi, let's listen to what zelenskyi said, mr. zaluzhnyi is also mine

representative, as well as... all those whom i appointed, or who came with me, someone, someone, i am very grateful, and for someone, i am ashamed, and as for any uh-uh comments on facebook, i'm sorry, i don't do that , i don't have time, i don't have time for daily, daily... and oh daily these unnecessary dialogues, fruitless, and as for maryana, valera, and they have a few more people there, it's very difficult, they all love very much commenting, liking, on facebook, they communicate there very often, they have dialogues, they have been from the first

days, then they go to the front together, then they quarrel, these are difficult questions, to be honest. for me, that's why i told you, it seems to me that we all need to give results to the state every day, and we'll have time for a selfie. mr. colonel , this is the third time i am listening to this valer maryan, and to be honest, this is just a monologue, well , it's really annoying, i don't know how you, as a military man, perceive me at all, is it at all appropriate during to put wars on the level of headmaster and... some kind of marina? yes, to answer correctly, well, yes, it looks terrible, i think the president should not conduct dialogues like this. there during the war, even if he thinks that he has achieved something there, directly, he is me, i am a representative, this is all mine, no, this is the ukrainian people, and everything they have now, including what

positions they have president in the world and in the country , it's all thanks to the ukrainian people, it's thanks to the chairman, it's thanks to his deputies, thanks to every soldier and every person who, let's say, does something, joins in order for our country to be and for the president to have the opportunity to give ... press conferences, and i believe that whatever the relationship with the commander-in-chief, respect for the fact that this person protected the country, this person , well, even if we are just talking about generals, not even during the war, a person who wasted his life, he first graduated from a military military institute, i graduated from it myself , it’s not just like that, it’s not an ordinary institute, when you live in a barracks for four years, then from a platoon commander and... from a soldier to a general, he passed all these questions, he reached the rank of chief, from the 14th year on

at the front and now he is fighting, then he is a respectable person all over the world, and it's so disrespectful to talk there valera, marianna, well, it's very not nice, believe me, i talked with many people today, including my colleagues and my colleagues there. relatives, then everyone appreciated it as such a disrespect, and after that to say that everything is fine with us, it is quite wrong, so i think, no matter what, that the president is here, i don't know why i emphasized that relations between glavkom and him are not the best. thank you, colonel, for the conversation, it was roman kostenko, colonel security services of ukraine, people's deputy of ukraine. friends, we work live on the espresso tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms. those who are watching us now, please like this video so that it

can be trended on youtube and facebook. and also take part in our survey. today we ask you about this, is peace with russia possible? perhaps this is too rhetorical a question, but it is still obvious that all wars end in peace, and we ask you whether this peace is possible at all. even from russia theoretically now, so yes, no, please vote on youtube, everything is quite simple there , write your comments if you have your own version of the answers to this question, and those who watch us on tv can vote by phone lines, because for those who support possible peace or peace with russia (0800-211-381), no, 0800-211-382. all calls to these numbers are free. next , we have valentyn badrak, a military expert, director of the army research center of conversion and disarmament. mr. valentine, i

i congratulate you and thank you for joining our broadcast today. mr. serhiy, thank you for the invitation, as always. so , mr. valentine, the congress of the united states of america has postponed the decision to provide financial assistance to ukraine in the amount of 60.1 billion dollars, and this issue will already be resolved in the 24th year, before that, the pentagon said that the funds for military assistance kyiv will run out by december 30, if lawmakers cannot come to an agreement. how the lack of this money, or how the lack of a political decision to provide this money will affect in russian-ukraine. front, and in particular, how, in your opinion, will this whole story be used by putin and the occupying army? well, first of all, i

will not say clearly now how long this situation can be delayed, yes, there are some insider sources that generally indicate that it is not higher than 30% of the possibility of receiving such a thing at all. aid of 61.4 billion dollars, which has been pledged for ukraine, and biden's political advisers advise him to give up support for ukraine, in favor of, strictly speaking, his political interests, because there is a very powerful political struggle, as far as it really is... so to speak, the final decision, i'm not going to judge, but the challenge, it's really the number one challenge for the 24th year, but come on...

there's already a shortage of ammunition, which he pointed out two days ago, general tarnavskyi, talking about the direction, southern and eastern, and first of all he spoke about the redistribution of ammunition and , first of all, the insufficiency of ammunition of post-soviet calibers, i.e. 122-152 mm, these are those that... ukroboronprom previously said that it began to produce in 22 year, but i think that i exaggerated a little with the statements, and now it is also very difficult with this, for the 24th year, i will recall another interview of general gavrylyuk, deputy minister of defense of the bbc, who noted that in the 24th year we will try

to do. so to speak, to produce enough ukrainian ammunition to cover the deficit or the difference between the ammunition that the western world can provide us, and we expect 2 million a year, a million ammunition from the united states and a million from european nato countries, but well, from the european union, rather so but the fact that... only 480,000 were broken down into the state, by the autumn state, by the beginning of winter, is evidence that there may be major delays with this issue, and therefore, actually, the ukrainian leadership, the ukrainian government , well, she began to react positively to this situation, and positively, in principle, general gavrylyuk also announced

that... it is necessary to use fpv drones, and actually speaking, during his press conference, president zelenskyi said that he would a million fpv drones were produced, and then it was supplemented by the minister of strategic affairs of industries oleksandr komyshyn, who noted that this is until the million drones with a range of 1,000 km will be produced. and 10,000 strike, medium-range strike drones, apparently medium-range he meant between the range of the battlefield and the operational range, that is, up to somewhere 400-500, 500 km, how realistic is all this, well, let's hope that, well, first of all, a step this is, in principle, the movement of the ukrainian authorities. absolutely

true, because a year of very big challenges is coming, and you have to rely on yourself as much as possible, and i define the issue of my own production as the third challenge out of five that i and my center have determined for the 24th year. mr. valentin, we, we will take a short break in our conversation, the alarms have started in ukraine, we have to... go down to the shelter, where we have a spare studio, from there we will go on the air and continue our conversation, i apologize, viewers, please do not switch, stay with us, hello, this is svoboda ranok, an informational

project of radio svoboda. every day, this is the shipping district of kherson, including live. we we are somewhere in the vicinity of bakhmut. we tell the main thing. on weekdays at 9:00. my name is andriy, i am 33 years old, i come from kherson. in september of this year, i went to the military office, and immediately said if there was one. possibility, if there is a shipment somewhere, then i am ready to go. immediately before mobilization, he was a computer tomography regenologist, and even before that , an infectious disease doctor, and even earlier, an ambulance paramedic. when completing the documents here at the kmb, i was asked the question of who i want to be and a list of military specialties. and besides everything else was.