chop down, corruption will disappear? no, of course, well , in china, in saudi arabia they cut down, there is corruption, in china, a favorite example with oleksiy, punishment in itself means nothing, but you understand, if it is guaranteed that 90%, not even 100, of people who take bribes receive one year of imprisonment, there is no need even for life, 10, one, no one wants, believe me, and 15 days of administrative arrest to serve their own punishment, if there is such a possibility, they will stop, they will be afraid, in any case. therefore the question in the inevitability of the punishment, not in the punishment as such, in the inevitability , especially since again we are somewhat to a certain extent forced into a situation, in principle it is good where we are not, that somewhere there everything is so wonderful, and here everything is so bad, in fact, everything is relative, because if we look at the discussion in the united states, why trumpists come out and speak, they have three questions for ukraine: the first is democracy, why not hold elections, well, if, why don't we hold elections, because of the war, that's why we do not conduct, the second question - this is... the most corrupt country in

the world, says trump. the third question is that churches are forbidden in our country, specifically with regard to corruption , why do the trumpists have such a logic, because actually he tried to return the case of burism, which took place in ukraine, as part of the election campaign against mr. biden, and today he is going to do the same , if, accordingly, the son of the current president and trump's competitor had affairs in ukraine, and ukraine is a corrupt state, this means, well , just enter the logic, it's just that... what is this the move is purely political, purely rhetorical and purely pre-election, but we all have to perceive it as such, because if we look at the states, in them there are two or three senators currently under investigation, also under bail, by the way, they have the question of the supreme court justices, who only got a code of ethics this year, there has not been a supreme court in the united states for 250 years, the code of ethics was approved today, and some judges are directly accused of having their oligarch friends buy houses for their mothers and ride them on yachts. all this is also there, here

the question is how effective the struggle is and how effective the state can cope with it. today, if we talk about these new trends , an atmosphere is really created to a certain extent, when taking bribes is simply difficult and psychologically, if you take a bribe and can't spend it, the question arises, why should you take the risk, well, what's the point , if your way of life is constantly monitored, if you can't put it in a bank account, if you can't issue it on... a lover, a wife, whatever and so on, property, in our country, as they did, they thought that it was issued for the grandmother, and everything is fine, i drive a mercedes myself, she belongs to the grandmother, and no one has any questions for me it will be, for today no, for today there is a mechanism of civil confiscation, such property is actually confiscated as state income, that is , we tighten these nuts, the only thing is that it is not necessary to consider any official in advance and, accordingly, a criminal, because in our state service, they have to be at least some of the best people in charge to everyone... mechanisms, if we create, we will create

conditions when it is impossible to be in the civil service, when you sit all day filling out all kinds of declarations, you don't have time to work, no one will go there, and today this problem exists, so it is necessary to a certain extent harmonize our unstoppable desire to fight corruption with common sense, so that we simply do not collapse the entire state in the rush of this struggle, i absolutely agree with you, mr. igor, we announced here at the beginning of this broadcast hour that we will talk more and about corruption... we also saw a number of high-profile scandals in the picking centers, but in general, in this industry, yes, to what extent are we moving in the right direction, well, let's not even rephrase the question, how realistic is this problem in the picking centers overcome, because we understand that there is a very big corruption risk, because many, well, by and large , many people go to the picking centers, and not there of their own free will, for example, so we are...

grateful, of course, and occasionally thank the forces of defense, to the people who went to defend our country, but judging by the way some soldiers tie people up in the streets, we see that there is a large number of people who go there against their will, and here yes, how much thanks to despite such a corruption risk, is it really possible to overcome this problem? well, i will immediately make a small remark to the previous question, simply regarding the fact that it is good where we are not there, here we are going to the european union, and i will draw your attention literally... recently the eurobarometer also published sociology, which showed that 70% of the citizens of the european union believe that there is huge corruption in the eu, 70%, so it's just a matter of that, right up to the level of perception, and with regard to tsc, it is clear that the biggest problem here is actually in the system itself, in the archaic nature of the procurement centers, we remember , which a few years ago, of course, we changed due to changes to the law.

the name was from military leaders then, but the essence really did not change then, unfortunately, and now we remember, recently defense minister umirov. published a concept regarding personnel policy, and the question is precisely about recruiting, regarding the maximum digitization, finally we have to start using the register of conscripts, it is already 90% ready, it is called a charm, and in principle we are already 5 minutes before this process and a number of other such nuances, but of course we have to respond absolutely rigidly to any violation of legislation, what we see today in social networks, we have to get a reaction today from law enforcement agencies, and of course, then from the judicial branch of government, this is what is necessary, and in principle, of course, here we already see a change in approaches , and i'm here i agree with mr. gennady that it is not necessary,

he really spoke about officials there, so that it is not necessary to immediately consider all officials as corrupt, the same situation with... employees of the picking centers, there are really patriotic people who work and perform their duties with absolute dignity obligations , so i think that actually this evolution, it is ultimately for, well, i don't know how until the 28th year, as this concept is written, but in general, we are now gaining the right direction and the main thing is that we do not stop in this direction, thank you for your analysis, ihor chalenko, chairman of the analysis and strategy center, thank you for being with... mr. gennady, if we talk about the tcc and the processes that have been launched, and obviously they will not stop, obviously they will be possibly less, less intensive, we hope, but they will continue until now there is a war going on. how would you describe this process?

the state central committee is a part of the state mechanism, there plus or minus the same people, well, ukrainians work there, just like in the social security departments in fact, and the question is... you know, there are simple recipes again, let's go let's take people from the front, let's put them in positions and everything will be different , well, it doesn't work like that in reality, well, people everywhere, even if they are at the front, even if they are in the rear, they are structurally plus or minus the same, so if a person really has more moral rights and priority should be given front-line soldiers , but this is not a recipe from the point of view that among them there will be those who will take bribes, with all due respect to our servicemen, because the people around are alone, and so are those in the rear... no necessarily all corrupt officials, that is , it does not work like that here, an effective mechanism is needed here, first of all, the most effective measures we had were those, when it comes to digitalization , first of all, when it comes to certain independent checks by each other, including blind checks, we have the heads of the military chiefs there, they

are not or tsk, they are directly they don't take the funds into their hands, there mostly all these difficult moments happen at the level of military medical commissions, and they draw various diagnoses and so on. the work is conducted from the point of view that sometimes in some places they were so arrogant that they simply painted the same picture, accordingly, x-rays or other studies were conventionally put into 100 cases, for which white flowers were issued, so-called, all this needs to be detected, attracted, well , in this way, we will gradually approach something more like this, well, of course, the problem is that we are in a state war, and in our country , we have to stomp on one fire with one hand , and the other with the other, but again from... trends, for example, what, let's do, remove the possibility of exemption from military service altogether, well, the wrong approach, because there are really people, who have complex illnesses diseases that are not suitable for military service, and today very often it is precisely this struggle, this atmosphere, when the doctor

is afraid to sign the unfitness, because for each sheet of this unfitness he will be brought, will try to bring him to justice, whether there are grounds or not , so here again it is a balance, it is always necessary for all of us... society to understand that there are no correspondingly simple solutions to big problems, there are none. we often have, you know, why the level of corruption is perceived as very high. we have such a thesis about the fact that ukraine is a very, very rich country, and everyone individually lives in poverty, because someone, accordingly, sits in the state and steals everything that should reach him. this is not quite true, we also have a lot to do with the economy, because to reach the level of norway, we need somewhere as much as they have oil and gas. to find, in order to live like south koreans, it is necessary to build those enterprises for three generations, there is lg, samsung, there are shipbuilding enterprises that feed south korea today, and so on, that is , it is necessary to perceive it more clearly, it is necessary understand, and not just think that the bad ones should be imprisoned, the good ones put in prison, everything will

be fine, it will never work like that, according to which model of the state can we move , according to the model of ukraine, according to the model of the ukrainian model, which, based on the principles of reasonableness, if we manage to build it, then... it does not comply with the law, we condemn, well, we condemn in the sense of giving a negative assessment, but this is the principle, if we work accordingly, then we will have a question, for us to like legal solutions, we need a little the law may change somewhere, and then we will have a substantive discussion, not that we don't like the court's decision, but why, but because the case was read, no, not read, well, but i feel, i have an intuitive feeling, that in this, as i did not read this joke, but i condemn it. so here we are, which, by the way , was born, for our viewers to know, was born in response to boris

pasternak's publication of dr. zhivago, and at that time devastating articles appeared in soviet, soviet newspapers, but in reality the authors of these articles did not read this work, well for many of our leaders of public opinion, certainly not all of them, but i haven't read many of them, but i condemn it, it's just a life credo, we condemn them in turn. for him, for this cream. tell me, what is the recipe, for each country i understand that in the fight against corruption there must be an individual one, what is it based on, well, what do we rely on, when, for example, we analyze some successful cases, we can take some countries there, so what there is such a concept as mentality, for example, it definitely exists in the context, i mean in in the context of corruption, there is such a thing, i'm sure, that among people, as they like to say, well, we're used to it, well, it's like that in our country. they say that it is a national trait that you can improve your conditions, for this, through a familiar godfather, matchmaker, brother, there, i don’t know,

to solve some issues, the same is true, well, first of all, that it is really possible to overcome it, absolutely realistically, well, it's difficult, it's long, again, but if we stop living by the principle of corruption - it's something where we don't personally participate, then we're different, that is, the law should become self-worth, even if the whole world does not like the decision that is in accordance with the law. it must be respected , it must be followed, and our decisions are divided by law into those we like, those we don't like, and it doesn't matter, that is, you have to throw it away, even if you don't like it very much, but it's the law, and accordingly, in this regard, the court must feel that it has authority, it has issued a decision against the state, for example, the state came to do business there, give me the building, i wrongly sold it to you myself 20 years ago, i did not return the money, but give it back, and the court thinks, yes, if i rule in favor of a private person, they would tell me that some activist will come out again and say that i took the money, then, and if i rule in favor of

the state, then i did good to the state , and what if one small business were to be destroyed, well, it’s okay, but no one will say anything to me, and that’s it, and that’s how it actually works, if you go out to play against the state in a court, a state court, i've done it so many times, it's as if you went to the barcelona field, and the score is already there 5:0, if it wasn't in your favor , the starting whistle hadn't been blown yet, well, i'm telling you seriously, it just happens like that, there you need, or fight... you just need to make an effort, a superhuman effort to win the state, and then, when you won, they will definitely come to you and tell you that you brought in the money, but when you know that you didn't, when it just wasn't pulled on your head, it was great, and unfortunately, this is what happens in the state, because respect is not cultivated , because well, i don't know, well, let me mention it even personally, mr. shabunin says, here are the corrupt people there sentenced to 3 years, but here is an unfortunate person somewhere in lviv who stole a stick of sausage in a store, were there actually shampoos there... 5 years of imprisonment and he himself puts the link and there is such a discussion on facebook with 250

comments, what ah -yay-yay, the court is corrupt here, here it is non-corrupt , it seems that no one has opened these links, you open the sentence of this person who committed theft, and it turns out that she already had three conditional sentences, this was the fourth the episode of the corresponding theft, and what about him, what should the court give in such a situation, when a person has committed the seventh crime in a row and does not want to be given a conditional sentence, he does not correct it. we will threaten that the most important thing is not the punishment itself , but also the number of years of imprisonment, with which we , who will think of taking a bribe, and not the reluctance , so i really liked your thesis about the punishment, he also said. a famous criminologist, that's it, thank you gennady, gennady dubov thank you for your honesty, you could sign up

today joined us in the studio, and actually there is one last topic that i would like to discuss with you, friends, on the soon-to-be new year holidays, we will talk about them on the last broadcasts, when we sum up the results of this year, but despite all this , we understand that there are currently our defenders who cannot be near their families, and in these holidays, and we are thankful for the fact that... now we have the opportunity to conduct this broadcast, and it is precisely about this, let's say, about this discussion, whether there is a place for a holiday during a war, yes, let's talk about it let's talk further. so, to be or not to be new year's trees in the cities, this question is now being asked in everyone to the community, one of the first about the decision to organize a festive location was announced in the capital, in kyiv the main christmas tree will be, but not at the expense of the budget, but at the expense of patrons and businessmen, about how to answer the question for yourself, whether it is time for a holiday during war, now let's talk with the psychologist

and psychotherapist olga golubytska, ms. olya, we congratulate you. so, have you personally made a final decision to celebrate or not to celebrate? yes, of course, to celebrate, because it is a form of struggle psychologically, not to give russia to seize our mental health and take away our ability to create the future. or maybe this is, let's say, an individual story, i think that there are people among our viewers, people who can't. they can just psychologically allow themselves to relax , celebrate there, because they have relatives who are fighting in the defense forces, they probably already feel this, this sense of guilt appears in advance, they haven't celebrated yet, but they already understand that if will, then they will feel guilty, what could be advised to such people, and do you think you, that in order to take care

of your psychological health directly, you need to distract yourself from time to time. probably even a family celebration, what do you say? and i will say that i very much understand this feeling of guilt, because in principle, at the beginning of the invasion, we have a so-called survivor's guilt, that these ukrainians, who are in more tolerant, let's say, conditions, feel guilty for not sharing everyone's fate, and for the fact that other people. and suffer so that we can implement and do something, but we also have to to understand that this guilt, it is very much used by russia for all kinds of informational and psychological special operations, it is a whole front, they are beaten specifically because of the feeling of guilt, a lot of

it is done in the kidis, in the army, in order to cause us some kind of revulsion. before the celebration, for example , these are such messages, why do ukrainians have a christmas tree, why spend so much money, this is created in order to start a conflict in society, people began to feel even greater depression, frustration, due to the impossibility of building something, and speaking about the integrity of the psyche, and for a person it is extremely important to be able to generate an image of the future, this is what allows healing. from a traumatic experience, what all the psychologists of the world are talking about, so in fact we need to even find some ways to celebrate, of course it should be regulated with the mention of those who protect us, but it should not be a complete rejection , due to the fact that other people are dying, then

it is also necessary to mentally die, not to move and not to develop, because then there will be no help for society, perhaps in this way... put a question for yourself, mrs. olya, and if you are going to celebrate, re-convince, be able to convince yourself that it is really worth it, then how to celebrate, what can be offered to those who doubt, and to offer, to make such a topic, or to offer, as , for example , this is a celebration, to send the same collection of donations there, yes, to make it some kind of... event that is both psychologically useful and socially useful, yes, to establish some, for example, timings, that it is now that i spend money on your mental health, share, yes, now that i'm not just throwing money away, but i'm spending money on my mental health, so that later i have a way to support the same soldiers who then

return home, for example, and civilians are always pitied, they say, how difficult it is for them, how indescribable it is for them, because the civilians themselves do not have the resources to cope with this , so if such restrictions are set, then i allocate so much money, and they are directed to understand the logic of what exactly you are doing on this holiday, why is it necessary, because it is russia that takes away from us the possibility of these traditions, they are aimed at that, to take away our culture, take away our traditions, take away our joy and the opportunity to create a future... and a healthy society, so if you focus on exactly this meaning, it will help to overcome the feeling of guilt, and also the feeling that i do not need to allocate funds for it. or if you do it as a social action, yes, it can also give a different color to this holiday, but of course it shouldn't be, you know,

the kind of holidays that outrage the military, it's when people overeat there, get drunk on rubbish, and well, if they showed some kind of detachment from the social context of the public, what gifts can be, and also... saturated with context, so that the emphasis is not on the price, on what the meaning is, it will be especially cool to do them together, or choose them together, or create a whole event to what this particular gift can mean, what meaning, it can be a charm, it can be something that supports, it can even be a trinket, i to my friends in the military gave such small bags of lavender, which you can put with you in... and there it will create this completely different smell, something that can remind you of another life, that is, it does not necessarily have to be something so

huge or expensive, but even this little thing, it can be this light, and very difficult topics is the world. thank you, thank you, mrs. ola, thank you, and for these warm advices as well, because they are extremely important to us in such a difficult time. olga golubytska, psychologist, psychotherapist, was. with us, we talked about the fact that it is still worth celebrating the new year's holidays even under wartime, because it saves you personally, saves your mental health, and you can also give warmth to those around you. well, we congratulate you on the upcoming new year 's holidays, thank you for being with us, all this long way, and especially the last hour, and you were with oleksiy homan, kateryna derkach, see you, friends, thank you,

chevorons, who bring victory closer. this year , more than ever, we felt the great power of help. we have proven that by supporting our military... we are bringing victory closer, that there are no large or small donations, any of our help is important and necessary, because it is by uniting that ukrainians become a force capable of overcoming anything. but we must not stop, we must do even more for our soldiers. let's become guardian angels for them in the coming year. and let's make it our duty to protect their lives, the way they fight for ours. each of us must have someone at the front, whom we need to

support and take care of. and even if there are no military personnel among your loved ones, find a brigade or soldier that you will help. be a guardian to everyone who is in hot spots, on the protection of cities and villages and on the recovery of waste. let's give them love. faith and daily support, a kind word or deed, a donation or a treat, to one fighter or unit is a gift to yourself, because it is a step to victory, the main thing is to do it, help the military, the best new year's gift. thanks to them, minefields become offensive routes. bridges and crossings appear on the rivers. reliable

barricades are growing at the battle positions. thanks to them, we can attack and defend effectively. they destroy enemy equipment and save the lives of infantry. they go ahead of the first, to make their way to ours. victory, glory to the engineering troops of the armed forces of ukraine. we all dream of a future, better, happy, free and independent, without war, under a peaceful

sky, we dream. everyone individually for himself and we all dream together for our country. and they took this dream and made it common, began to realize it, began to make this world a better society, country and environment. the mriya charitable foundation took under its care hundreds of families of our dead and prisoners defender heroes. first of all, so that the children, from whom the war took away the most precious ones, do not lose faith in the future and in themselves, so that they know. there are those who love them to feel supported. my today's guest, tetyana komlyk, is in charge of educational support programs at the dream foundation, and most of our viewers may know her as tatusya bo, a well-known blogger, writer and volunteer. i congratulate you, ladies, tatyana, dad, dad, and whatever is convenient for you, actually , good day, yes, this is your nickname, and this is how we know you, i say, because those who

i read your fairy tales. children, in particular for sinaika , i got to know you through one of your books, thank you very much for that, by the way, i am writing to you now, under such conditions, i am writing now, i am writing now, because i have two children, and the youngest is four years, and he really likes me to make up different stories for him before going to sleep, then in my opinion, some stories turn out so cool that they are worth me writing them down, and yes, in addition to this, i write, sometimes i write poems , in which i talk about my personal experience of a wife who waiting for a loved one from the war, a volunteer who takes care of the military, a person who listens to the stories of families who are going through the most difficult times, this is my way of self-therapy and reflection, the families you work with,

a charitable foundation, how many families are you taking care of right now? currently, we have under our care almost 400 families and, if i am not mistaken, almost 5,000 children, in all regions of ukraine. an incredible number, of course, people, it is a big job to help everyone, and what does this help consist of? we have several directions. the first is humanitarian, of course, because that when the family is in grief and trouble. the main thing is to remove the question of what to feed yourself, what to feed the children, and what to dress the children in. next, we already work a little deeper, we work on the fact that whoever is the eldest in this family, mom or dad, they can feel the ground under their feet, that is, help them feel like a person, important, a person, so that they feel supported, so that they felt faith

in themselves, that's why we organize various activities with the help of psychologists, lawyers, with the help of even artists who help these people to reflect their emotions, in fact, regarding children, then yes, we also have several such different directions, this is also extracurricular development, we organize excursions, some trips, interesting meetings, and now our children are learning an additional english language thanks to our partners and programming, and we also have a course of preparation for nmt and zno, children from the ninth to the 11th grade study there, they study on these courses, and actually we do, we try to do everything so that the children despite... those difficult times,

that their family lives in so they can to choose a cool profession so that they can learn, so that they can get a good quality education, so you know, i am 43 now, in 10 years i will be 53, in 10 years those who now went to elementary school, they will become students, and more 15 years from now, these people... these children, who now need our attention, our care, our support, they will determine our future with you, in fact, and i would like to invest in this future, as it sounds a little selfish, but at the same time it will be true, i want these children grew up to be those who understand state processes, huh.