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the pogrom of the ukrainian intelligentsia, as they said then, and now we say ukrainian intellectuals, in 1972 , 19... people were arrested in kyiv and lviv, and actually these arrests, this next wave of attacks on the ukrainian intelligentsia, is called the arrested carol. today we will talk about a cultural phenomenon, an underground publication that was published in lviv in the early 1970s and was printed in the west. this cultural phenomenon was called the ukrainian herald, and its creator, publisher and author was vyacheslav black today there are only three persons, witnesses and participants of this edition, this is valentina chornovil, sister of vyacheslav chornovol, this is mykhailo kosiv, a publicist who lives in lviv, and this is a public figure,

a people's deputy of the first convocations, yaroslav kendzor, who today is my guest, mr. yaroslav, i greet you, good evening, christ is born. mine and glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes, today we will talk with you not just about samvedav, but as i said about a cultural phenomenon, the ukrainian herald, it was a real printed underground publication, we then let's talk about how dangerous it was for people, for you, yes for everyone who issued it, let's start with why it's so important, why it's printed. the ukrainian herald of those times, why was it so important, you know, the phenomenon of underground writings in various forms, whether written, transcribed, reproduced copies or somewhere on

a typewriter, because then there were not so many such means for reproduction, this is today the appropriate technique and this... it can be done quickly, but at that time in the forbidden non-censored literature that was circulating and printed something, informed about what was not allowed and what was feared by the soviet authorities at that time, just starting with 65%. year, when the first were the pogroms of kagibi, arrests, all over ukraine, in the end such a border, when it began to roll in such a wave, it was after the presentation of the film

parajano, shadows of forgotten ancestors, there is a lot of reporting, well, in particular, we will talk about. .. then vyacheslav chornovila, as a politician, in my opinion, he begins from this moment, when he, together with ivan dzyuba, others by his comrades, then he stood up and protested, they informed very briefly with one slogan that there was a wave of repression in ukraine and so on, and who... what is the significance of this ukrainian conclusion,

why is it not a postcard, yes, why is it not some kind of self-publishing , and this was a real edition, so printed, what was its significance back then in the 70s, 72s? i just want to prove that what you are doing is a phenomenon, it was there even before that, but so that it acquired such a content and form, that it became a clear, terrible danger for the totalitarian of the state, it began with, here i managed to catch a disaster from my mind, i understand this disaster. this is a book that was in front of the ukrainian herald, even before the ukrainian herald, it is about the events of the arrests in 1965, it is the book of vyacheslav chornovol, for which he received the first term of imprisonment, correct? three years, plus a second book before that was justice or

relapses of terror, and for these two editions, which were published in the west, he received, as vyacheslav himself says, different systems, different evaluations in... in britain , great, he received an international journalistic award, and in his native country the soviet union received 3 years and prison terms. camp and served time, he served less than three years, because there was some kind of communist jubilee there and an amnesty was announced, and vyacheslav was arrested for this book and imprisoned in august, and somewhere in october a trial was held and he was sentenced to three years in 1967 year , we say 67th year like this, and in... in february, at the beginning of march, i don't remember the exact date,

in 69th year, he stayed for one and a half years, and there he was born, he was thinking, there was time, probably, there is a lot to do, after all to move, so to speak, this machination, this union, which here created deeds, miracles, black, bloody, but convincing. the west, through its mass media, convinces the whole world that democracy is flourishing here, how people live happily here and so on, and that’s it, and these handwritten self-publishing cheat sheets that went around, well, i remember i copied vasyl symonenko , mykola vengranovsky, back there, but it did not have this effect, because, well, tens of people at most, it was about... they read and everything, and he just thought about how to make the world

heard that millions of people heard what was being done in order to break through this iron curtain built by the then soviet union, its leadership, and fool the whole world, what a happy life there is, that is, he plans to actually create not just a self-published book, but a printed one. . we will then tell you how it went on, where, where it is written about what, where it is written about the truth that exists here, in particular in ukraine, arrests, political prisoners, the state, everything, everything, and people's lives, economic life, and so on, and so on, everything he lives by, that is, he, the logic of his plan was such that it should work out. a full-fledged e-e magazine, where there will be columns

of information, publicists, works, e-e , shot, writers of the shot revival of this period, works that families, family members, prisoners who went to e-date with their relatives in mordovia succeeded , it was sometimes possible to deliver a report. they transmitted and these works got into the ukrainian gazette, that is, it is a full-fledged magazine of 150, sometimes 200 pages. let's listen, we have a direct speech, a memory of vyacheslav chornovol, which, these are archival footage, actually, which yaroslav kendzuar, it was you who took your shots, 1991, vyacheslav chornovil talks about how he was in prison in vinnytsia. he got an idea, a ripe idea to publish a ukrainian gazette, please, in vinnychyna we lured

in the constabulary, i will return already there i had a matured intention to publish some periodical that would destroy the national democratic forces, because a kind of decline began , as if from the same rise that was already in the first half of the 60s, and upon my return, i realized these intentions by publishing a magazine, starting the publication of the magazine ukrainian soldier. 2 years gives out there is such a magazine in the underground, when already after the first issue, it immediately got abroad, it was also a secret how it got there, when after the first issue searches began, the whole kgb was raised to its feet to catch who was doing it, because it went abroad and from there it was broadcast on the radio and passed around here, in fact, as soon as this magazine began to be published, i understand that fedorchuk himself, the head of the kgb of ukraine, began to occupy, fedorchuk is a terrible person, i also heard about it, but you now tell me about it, what people risked, who, who, first of all, himself

vyacheslav chornovil, and secondly, all of you who were involved in this, in the publication, in the printing of this magazine, you understand, now it is difficult for people, perhaps, to comprehend the fact that one thing, this print is written, some piece of paper, and there is some sharp poem that criticizes the soviet government, and this is when uh... this reprint from the film was published by the smoloskip publishing house in baltimore, we will now, we will now talk about balatnimo, let's go. let's start with how you did it in ukraine, before it got to baltimore to osip zinkevich, and we will tell you about it later. to tell the audience that vyacheslav's idea was that not tens, not

hundreds, not thousands, but millions of people in the whole world would hear the truth about what is happening in ukraine, because when er... when the ukrainian herald was still warm, it was immediately sent to the editorial office of radio liberty, and then it was reprinted in english, italian, german, and spanish translations , and indeed millions and millions of people heard the truth about a happy life in the soviet union ukraine, as we did it, when vyacheslav returned from... the first imprisonment, he went to kyiv, talked with his friends there and told about his, his intention, about this idea, he was dissuaded, he was also in svetlychni, talked with ivan, and with other colleagues they told him that vyacheslav, this will not help, they will tie everyone up after the first number, the kagibists know how to do it and that's all,

how many of our people are already in prisons, this.. ... you have to wait for this time and then do something. vyacheslav was very bitter, he returns to lviv, we meet with vyacheslav, and he relays this idea to me, says: slavko, and you are suitable for the company, i say, well, what is it about, slavko, of course, what should i do? in the early days, find a place where you can type, this magazine, i say type, that is, yes, type. i have a house in solonka, 5 km from lviv , the second house from the highway that goes there to transcarpathia, he says, well, how about that, it’s right next to

the international highway, i say, that’s right, very good, nice, well, someone , well, all kagibists know. if we do something illegal with from their point of view, then we are hiding somewhere in some nook and cranny and that's all, no one will look here, the house is there and that's all, well, if you think so and that's all, and there was also involved, we still forgot to say who was involved, there was lyuda sheremettieva, this... she studied at the faculty of journalism in kyiv, in 1965 she was expelled from the university for anti-soviet activities, lyuda moved to lviv, and she was an excellent professional typist, i don't know how vyacheslav is, i know then she married yaroslav dashkevich, a historian, yes a historian, known and so on, and lyuda did it

selflessly, the first ones, i brought lyudmila. in solonka, again, very discreetly, one night we met there with a friend who had his own car, he took us to the village, and she sat in my house for a week and printed out the first two issues, vyacheslav prepared and she printed it all out, and then in line with this technology in this procedure , it was necessary to rephotograph it on microfilm, this is to transfer it to the west, to transfer it, then the film, because you also won't have a folder with then to transfer, that is, excuse me, let's first type it on cigarette paper, it was 12 copies, the first copy with the font cut was thrown away,

burned, and the last one was very pale, it was difficult, and... and the second one was the best, it went for taking pictures, and here vyacheslav got such a small not-minolt camera somewhere, some kind of small camera for microfilm, if i'm not mistaken, 16 or 8 mm, i won't say, because it's been many years, years, i don't remember, it was the slowest work because i was doing photography, and at the faculty of journalism. at the school where i studied, there was a photo lab there, so i had enough, but here at home in the village, well, there was none. there is no appropriate equipment , and all this is all on the most primitive, i rephotographed it several times, and every page was needed, every page was 150

pages in the first issue of the gazette, that’s 150 photos need to be taken, uh, and when i developed the film, i saw that there was too much overexposed here light black everything nothing. if you read it in another way, i redid it, so it's too light there to read it the same way, that is the torment was terrible, but yaroslav, your mother lived there as well, she knew what you do, what you do, what lyudmila sheremeteva does, what you do, did she know and did she ask anything, mommy, a wise woman, she survived these terrible years, she was born in the 23rd year, two brothers of the nkvd. so to speak, they were tortured, and she knew very well , so to speak, what the soviet government was able to do, and she always worried about everything for me too, oh,

baby, oh, don't go there, oh, but i know that these bolsheviks can, here we have her testimony, let's listen to her, she says, it is difficult to watch these footage, ms. hanna kenzyur, this is also a recording of 1991, that’s right, in 1991, she talks about how this process actually took place and what she actually witnessed, the process of printing the ukrainian gazette and in fact, please, i blocked the windows and was so afraid and even tolerated it, because they took it out and did everything, you know, they planted it in the churms, so you knew what was being done here in the house, i knew, slavik told you, but he didn't tell me, because he was afraid, he knew that i was a teacup i bear everything, but i myself guessed what it was, and there was such fear, there was fear, yes, we

searched so much, my god, the smallest corner, we looked for images, through the cups, the whole credenza was turned upside down, there, where, falling asleep, so in such crafts, they looked everywhere, every smallest nook and cranny was turned upside down, so that... the fear was such, you know that even now, as i remind myself, i cannot do it, god forbid , it did not return, so ms. hanna kentsyu tells about, in particular, what happened the coup that the kgb was doing precisely in these days of the arrested carol, in which, as we are talking about, there was also a coup in solonka, please tell me the most interesting thing that at this time... another participant of the actual production of the carol was passed on to the ukrainian herald by pashko handed over such a folder of texts to mr. yaroslav, and just

before this search by the kgb, this folder with texts was in the house in solonka, please tell me about this moment, because it is a wonderful story, such a moment that was imprinted on me, because it was somewhere on the border. i had to receive such a guarantee for at least 10 years mordovian camps, just on january 11 , on the eve of those mass arrests that took place after the christmas party, after the christmas holidays on january 12, 1972, and mrs. atena, vyacheslav's wife, came to me and said that... in the room it is very difficult to hide those folders somewhere, because there are very few hiding places in the apartment, everything is possible there, and he says, in your village, you can

hide them in a barn, or in a storeroom, or in hay or in straw, so that no kagabis will not find anything, and she handed me this folder, i came from lviv in the evening when i arrived the village, i had already gone to bed, everyone had already gone to sleep, in the middle of our little room , there was a cot in which the straw was sleeping, who was three years and a couple of months old, the child had already, the straw had already fallen asleep, and i pulled out the folder from under the pillow, and started looking through some materials, and just like that i fell asleep, and i stuffed myself back under the pillow, and already i began to doze off, i supposedly... had a dream that the security guards were breaking into the house, banging on the windows and doors, i instantly woke up , woke up, i haven't slept yet, but here i am with the model... i situation,

and what will happen if tomorrow, where there is a guarantee that they will not be there, and that's all, and i got up, took out the folder and thought, well, where should i run somewhere outside to the storeroom, cut hair and so on, and next to it is a bed, and i i stuffed this folder under the mattress of a straw cot, and such a providence of god that i was pushed to that, somewhere around 5 o'clock. in the morning, banging on the windows and doors , six chekists burst into the house, led by my boss from 1965, this is shumeiko oleksandr oleksandrovich, the head of the fifth department for the fight against dissidents, nationalists and so on, they are all already there, what my mother is saying, they are turning the house upside down, he is standing in my room, where i am , my bed is already there... he himself looked at that

bed all the time and leaned on the railing of that bed and looked at the child, i endured, i think how i have to give in, i think, let me say this, oleksandr oleksandrovich, well , what are you waiting for, wake up the child, maybe she wrote something, published it herself, and has it somewhere in her rompers, hid it or something. i say, what is wrong with you, wake up the child, put him on this bed and so on, that is, i say with such indignation, he began to lose his temper, well no, well, we’re not human at all or something , i left the bed, that’s all, the straw is sleeping, i remember after that, even to this day, when i see sovmiya, i say my savior, you saved me from the minimum 10 years, mordovian camps, and so,

there were a lot of such cases that were etched in memory, there was one more very interesting case, but it was in the year 65 in a few months, i must say this, because he never said anything anywhere, on the eve of the arrests in 1965, mykhailo goren gave me a book, somewhere he does not know, someone handed to him, in memory of the figures of ukrainian culture for... faculty of journalism, says: slavka, if you can rephotograph this book, if necessary, and i am my friend, the only one in the group, for 25 students, the smallest faculty, vasyl gushta, unfortunately, he is not there, and he and i sat in the photo laboratory, next to the dean's office, all day,

taking pictures of this... book, and i, when already , that is, for the second time, for the second time, when i already printed from this film , well, there the technique is appropriate and so on, and i leave, i leave lviv university, under my boss, shumeiko oleksandr oleksandrov, is waiting for me at the main entrance. when you say boss , what do you mean, that is, well, that is, the person who supervises you, conducted these conversations with us , preventive interrogations, and so on and so forth, and he is already waiting for you, he is waiting for everything for me, and i go out, but those photos are still wet, the developed photos, you see, i stuffed them in a cellophane bag and stuffed them, well, i'm overweight, my chest is high. hungry, then

i could fit a few kilograms here, so to speak, on my stomach, he belted this one, and i sat for three hours in his office in the lviv kgb office with that cargo with this bomb that i had, so to speak , hiding on it, that's what it means, that's what the words of vyacheslav chornovol mean to walk on the edge of a knife, i'm sorry , before we continue about... continue, i will quote to you that when a criminal case was actually opened against the ukrainian herald, according to the kgb employees, the magazine posed a threat to the friendship of the soviet peoples, the national policy of the ussr, the state social order, because it could raise doubts about the possibility of construction communism, to weaken the authority of the soviet country in the international arena. now we come to something very interesting.