repel these attacks, then what, then think about how to attack, because we need to understand , to formulate first what victory should look like, so that we understand how much we need to attack, so actually speaking, goals are formed for this, you see, logic very simple, and she understood, she is honest , the commander-in-chief voiced her, general zaluzhnyi came out, he said, i need people and weapons, and this is already a question for the government, for economists, think about where to get the money, how, because i have the task: to fight, and i have to repel attacks, and then also conduct offensive actions, because there is a task from the state leadership, and this is supported by society, if you look at sociology, it is correct, well, accordingly, and here of course, i think, for many there was such a cold shower that it turned out that well when they started to talk about the issue of mobilization, renewal of personnel, people, people, people, yes, it turned out that stop, so what, and those who supported, cheered. somewhere else

i said it was necessary, so it turned out that it was necessary to make some kind of contribution, and these discussions began, you see what gathered, yes, it turns out that the war is dragging on, so what are we going to do, and this is also a question, this is also a challenge that they are facing, accordingly now what, accordingly now i would just like to clarify, however, returning to what mr. andrii said , and about the fact that the issue is also the effectiveness of using the army reform, it must change, look, look, it must change madly. and approaches must change, i support all this, but we have two tasks, the first task is operationally what must be solved urgently at the front, and you don't have time there, but there are of course, yes, but there are of course questions that need to be asked, and by the way, bahmud and klischievka, you see, we have also moved away now, and normal society understands in the sense that somewhere we may have moved away from maryenka, everything is somewhere, well, there is no tragedy, the sky did not fall to the ground, you understand that ours are not standing on stones here. left

behind these stones of ruins, these are also realities, and now we are approaching the question of what and how it should look like next, and it seems to me that our strategy is now being restructured somewhat, because they want to present a success story and rightly so, i support it, look, the president of ukraine mentioned crimea in an interview with the economist publication, he says yes 24 in 2000, and why, because it is right, we need to move away from the success story. and we have it, and we have to say about it that look at what our defenders are doing, look at the old planes, it’s not an f-16 or why, these are these planes for you, that’s what is being done now, and this by the way, we have a problem with information communication, now the negative has covered all the positive that we have, we have all the negative mobilization, closed anything that could happen positively, and here i am talking about the fact that we did not communicate and in particular everyone.

communicators from the ministry of defense , i mean there, the army, itv and so on, because we will show, we have received a flurry of messages about how negative, look, where are our examples of how fighters study abroad, master specialties, gunners , others , where are our others? an unfortunate one appears, sorry for the joke and the country , this is a week we will discuss it... anyway , in terms of communication, we asked a lot and many issues that should have been discussed, we did not discuss them, and now we have just come to the point, you are asking about 5 years, i can't give a forecast for 5 years, judging how the situation is developing now and the fighting, i can tell you that it can be two scenarios for this year, i'm not about the forecast, i'm about the strategy, how should it be right, i'm not i understand, we also understand that it will obviously not be 100% correct, but what a direction there must be movement.

we've gotten to the point where we have every military commander now afraid to send people to attack, we've gotten to the point, you know what we're going to get to, and we're going to... we're going to get to the point where we're not, we're not going to go into an offensive strategy , we will not go into it, because everyone will understand that tomorrow a publication will appear in some western media or somewhere else, and these commanders will be told, look, what are you doing, you sent people, and they died, and then there is question: excuse me, but how do you want to free the territories, knock them out the enemy, if we have no casualties, and the topic is unpopular, i say that not everyone will like the answers on the other side, is there even one commander who took responsibility for

a poorly planned operation, and i will answer you, i will answer you on this is a question, the limit of responsibility, and here we can come to the point that here i will answer you, because my colleagues and i were developing amendments about combatity, ugh, combat immunity for commanders, what does it consist of, you see, ukrainian legislation provided that the commander must know in advance all the risks and their calculate how you calculate all the risks in a war, relatively speaking, you can have the best intelligence that the scouts brought you, the best pictures from satellites, the enemy will come out somewhere, set up an ambush, or strike with some kind of weapon. a korean ballistic missile or a ballistic missile at all, having superiority in the air, you understand, then how to conduct, how this commander should sit down and say, there are various cases, i agree with you, there are excesses, for this we need military justice, which on sorry no fully formed to control it, but you understand that this issue

is difficult from this point of view, that now we have a lot of comparisons, the first world war, the second world war, nothing will be like that, because then, because. .. or then, i’m sorry, but let’s face it, the value of human life was much lower, i’m not calling for it to be the 10th year now, it’s true, we ’ve been fighting for more than two years, and we’re doing very well, just as maxim and i mentioned before by air, such a precedent is very well known, when general nazarov was tried in a civil court, and how it ended, let's remind our viewers, it was a story when paratroopers were sent to the luhansk airport and the plane was shot down, 49 people died then, the sentence of the civil court was 7 years. he was appealed, and the military, they say, cannot be the subject of a conviction in a civil court, now nazarenko is an adviser headed by the supreme court, well, that’s right, yes, that is, you see, we are already going to talk about strategy, no, yes it's important you know, it's an important issue because these are

people, it's key, and why i'm talking about unpopular things, you know, because we can we come to an honest dialogue, honest with society, people, how ready are you... there is a strategic goal, you answer yourself, how ready are you, do you see yourself in the army, i don't mean what is clear there , it's a constitutional duty, but you see, we can talk now, it's your constitutional duty, then people first ask what we're going to fight with, what weapons we'll have in 3 years, what weapons we should have, because we don't, rightfully so, because we understand that in theory, even in theory, the same nato and countries nato, it is written that the attack aircraft does not run to the enemy's trench, but long-range fire works there. artillery, then it works, first attack aircraft work, long-range missiles, then artillery and then people enter the cleared or destroyed area, we have an opportunity, we are waiting for these f16, not f-35, yes, not thunderbolt, we are waiting for f16, they will appear, what we should

build in the next 2-3 years and what we can build so that ukraine repeats, we are talking about positive examples, repeated the black sea factor, well, the black sea factor is very important. moreover, i think that this theater of war, by the way, here are two successful theaters, i don't want to offend anyone, the black sea and special operations on the territory of the enemy, it's super cool, that is, it's really what impresses and what you can see , again, without diminishing the merits of those who are now and in the battles, in other directions, it is very important as well, so look at it, from a military strategy, i will tell you, what i see and what is planned and that , that i know, there is an understanding that we are now... a resource to be on the defensive, he there is, that is, i want it to be clear, because i saw quite a lot of such, you know, panicky moods that everything, the front has been shaved, there are no people in the army, people have run out, wait, well, this is also not true, that there are no weapons

, well, yes, there are not enough, well, there weren’t enough a year ago , that is, next year too, i’m afraid that there won’t be enough, it will be constant, but what do they come to, which i like in the understanding that we really need to develop innovative technological solutions for advantage, only in these solutions is important you see, two days ago the news that lancets will fly through the neural network, we don’t know if they will fly or not, it could be a propaganda campaign, it could be this pso of russia, but prepare and then i ask, we have been working since 2022 with the network, i know the developers, why don't they fly with us yet, well, if they can, then our western technologists'. with support, we have to provide it, explain to our viewers how we can do it network is when there is a swarm of drones, it is when not one fpv or another type is flying, but maybe 20-30 are flying, controlled one, which in the center gives out a target guidance signal, and they are either on one target, or fly to different targets, they make

maneuvers in the air, dodging, the anti-aircraft system cannot hit everything, this is real, and this is a technological advantage, further a technological advantage - these are robotic systems. ok, the first story, robotic systems that can, that can replace a person, fiction must be brought closer to reality, well, they are talking about this very actively, and our general staff is talking about it. what can replace a person, a robotic system, a drone not only air , ground, surface, underwater, waiting for boston dynamic here, no, yes, why, look, we have, listen, we have, we have, look, we have developments, we have , which already drive on the ground and perform tasks, you want, they can carry a machine gun, you want to be an evacuation vehicle, you want to bring the bull into position, and you don’t have to drive there through the swamp at the risk of the arrival of... the same drone the enemy will destroy, that is, this is also a decision that we saw and showed in this marathon

chariots, somewhere it is like that, but they are different, that is, there is, this is also a question, which, we have excellent experience in communication, cooperation, the company palantear technologies, which developed a control system for us, management, how to use the army, where, this is also something that works and helps the commander, it is artificial intelligence, it is somewhat better, i think, than nettles and delta, well, i don’t, that is... by the way, the russians stole nettles from us, called them turnips, yes, well that's right, it's just that in the order of this, yes, well yes, they developed their, yes they, it's absolutely stolen a ukrainian idea, well, that’s it, i’m just talking about the fact that these solutions based on artificial intelligence are already being implemented, i ’ll give you another practical example, very down-to-earth without fiction, for example, there are companies that work in the development artificial intelligence, french, they are perfect. caesar projectiles, ugh, caesar will be better aimed, caesar will be more effective, caesar

will work better in counter-battery combat, the range increases, accordingly, look at what is currently holding the bridgehead in krynk on the left bank of the kherson region, our artillery is suitable, it has worked , the range of damage makes it possible, and such solutions, and such solutions are being developed , and by the way, this is the element that should not be treated as some kind of future fiction, because i want to... . to remind that all of us who have read fiction since childhood now see many things implemented in life, and it works and it serves, so i think that this is also the way we should set the task at the state level, that robotic systems, finding solutions that will replace people or help people, i also want people not to go, so that the military does not go to minefields and storm trenches, i also do not support large losses, that is, it is not, it is necessary so... nobody, i think from us, then for this we need to find a solution, and what are the solutions? it's a better weapon

, it's a more technological weapon, it's more innovative, and it's the effective use, the control of that weapon, that's a very important aspect, because the weapon itself, it's not enough if you don't know how to control it, and here, by the way, i don't support idea, you know, when we very often have, here our defenders are the best, ours warriors, they learn what someone learns in two years, in two weeks. well , sorry, if you need to study for six months, then you need to study, well, because yes, yes, i understand the war, but then this machine, or equipment will come into real conditions, and we will not be able to use it effectively, and this equipment will be destroyed, you you understand, that's why you're speaking with some experience, from the experience of this counter-attack of ours , somewhere we didn't learn something, and i won't say that we didn't learn, i'll say that certain managerial decisions. could be implemented better in terms of implementation, everything, but it is normal, and it is now being studied

, and the military is talking about it, that they are analyzing it, it is revealed that there were some miscalculations, now it is analyzed and conclusions are drawn, i, well, first of all, this is war strategizing, in particular, the development of the latest military technologies, when it is necessary to think today about what will happen tomorrow, the day after tomorrow, and someone has to deal with this, it is already necessary to create the appropriate ones. structures and state, maybe not state, or jointly, that's how it was at the beginning of the war, when business together with state structures created headquarters and solved the problem of fuel and fuel there, and so on, yes, yes, with regard to human resources, i think now it is a fundamental issue, we started talking about mobilization, we will not use this term, no-no-no, i agree , yes, it is perceived, well, let's say so, cynically, somehow yes, too, well, let's say so, inhumanistically, yes, sorry, sorry. friends, so what are we going to do with perception, maybe we ourselves need to learn and grow up, there is

a term human resource, it is people are capital, it's true , i just understand, you just formulated it correctly , human capital sounds quite, yes, but here, as we call it, that's how it will be used, just when people hear about the resource, i agree with you , you immediately know that it can be spent, well, the resource will be absorbed and the capital. yes, yes, yes, here we have, we have to protect people, that's what needs to be understood, i heard about this from some people's deputies, and from the military as well, that in in principle , we are in such a situation where russia has a huge advantage, well at least three times in the mobilization potential, yes, and we cannot compete with them in this dimension, and therefore we need to look for asymmetric methods of waging war, and this is also a question of strategy and tactics, and at the same time, the preservation of our people

- this is an element of our strategy, there is still humility in russia, yes, not only yes, we know for putin, they are frankly even them... and military, political experts say that it does not matter to us how many people will be used for war, yes, there are higher goals, state goals, we cannot have such, and we are alone of the strategic goals is preservation, and this is what i am approaching, when we talk about the goals of the war, yes, the main goal of the war for us, and this is recognized at the political and military level, is the liberation of all occupied territories, well, some goes on, destroys. russia and so on, but here is the official one, the exit to the border in the 21st year, by the way, our western partners never officially say anywhere about such goals of the war, there is not even a consensus there, to support us so that we do not lose the war, but they never say, and what is the purpose, that it is not will finish what is meant by victory, so, for us, i think,

the minimum task, the minimum, is the preservation of the state, nations. society, and by the way, biden said about this that our victory is already in the fact that ukraine has endured, yes, as a state, as a society, as a nation, and we must always understand that we cannot fight endlessly in order to lose what what are we fighting for, yes, and that's why the combination of the minimum task and the maximum task, i think it's important precisely in the strategic dimension, in the understanding of the strategist, now all that's left is, i think so i understand, the easiest, yes... the first moment is demographic, you know what our biggest problem is, not even the fertility rate, not the birth rate, but the premature mortality of men, these are simply terrible indicators, compared to european countries, and this should be the key

national demographic, not related to the war, even, not related to the war, health. and sometimes stupidity, sometimes lifestyle, different circumstances, this is the first, so we, we can change this in the near future, second, there are 60 million ukrainians in the world, 60, not 31 million, as we currently count in ukraine, twice as much , even more, i would say, ukraine will definitely lack human resources, human resources for the growth of the economy, we will need to import labor resources, and... maybe it is time for us to import the military as well, it is us too we are afraid to raise this topic, but there is also a great potential there, $300 we now pay to our heroes, $300 for many countries, this is a lot of money, russia pays seven, russia, well , to those whom it imports, to those whom, and then tell me a second, about

the salary at zero, 23, plus 100, so combative, about these, russia has already declared that those who will fight for them will immediately receive citizenship. they give out, yes, we are working, they are nepal , they are nepalese, you see, nepal has already banned leaving, yes, yes, further, but further, by the way, we had many ready, and even f-16 pilots who wanted to go to ukraine by volunteers, there are many questions, many questions, which, after all, we ourselves filled up without finding some way, further, economically, ukraine is the most underestimated country in europe, at least. possible for a huge part of the world, a financial resource ready to enter ukraine, these are tens of billions from south korea, from japan, from the european union, we are counting hundreds of billions, of course, the resource that could enter, why didn't he enter qatar, the entire asian region, of course, why the fear, military risks , it's all random, no projects,

no understanding where to invest, no insurance that we can definitely solve, like questions, procedures, help, all that. it is possible to saturate ukraine with money right now without delay, and this money will be taken away we are patriots who will protect these factories that will be built here, without delaying it, we ourselves are afraid for some reason to declare ambitious goals, now we need to develop export- oriented industries, furniture, whatever, we can do it, and in the end, the security forces as a dominant, dominant force in our ukrainian political system, the state is a force. which dominate the economy, not giving the opportunity to realize economic freedoms, in the legal system, the courts, which again are subordinates and so on, all this we have now. the security forces have to decide engage in war, the economy should definitely not be handled by security forces, when we finally solve this issue, why are we afraid to constantly

talk about it, remove security forces from the economy, from business, you know what has happened in recent days, even those enterprises that were what we agreed with the president at the meeting, let 's eliminate the security forces, let's come , show what examples you have that the security forces dominate the business, business came to the president's office, at these closed meetings, showed cases. now what we see is us we see that for those who came to the president's office then, the security forces came, that is, the pressure increased. what does this say? he is talking about the fact that the security forces sneezed on the president, sneezed on democracy, on economic freedoms, within the country, now, in these times, the security forces, not under the supervision of the president's office? you see what is happening, respectively, the president's office surrendered to the security forces, or whether the security forces seized power in the president's office, well, this is a question to whom, to the president himself, because, because

we told the president a long time ago, he will decide, who is your team, if, if civil society and business, which reaches out and says: come on, we are ready to join, act together, create public policies together, produce weapons, whatever, but, but for some reason... still, the president on at the press conference, he says that he has a team of five people, you can now, like mr. oleksandr, name a few industries, two or three, on which we need to focus, which will become transports, locomotives of the economy , which should become, because we understand that we do not produce weapons because we want to, or i'm techno, because we have to, and let's also grow up here, no one, except business itself, should determine any priorities, uh, all industries will be drivers, all, economic freedoms are the key that will enable no... no no the fact that the state will determine priorities, we have a certain understanding and misunderstanding here with our european partners, even with the government, the key is, well, tell me which industry will not be

the driver, i already mentioned the furniture industry, the poles export 15 billion euros furniture, that we can't do it, we can, well, what the pharmaceutical industry cannot be, perhaps , a weapon of specificity, you understand, if the german government had not poured 6.5 billion rainmetal, they would not have done anything. everything must develop, only balanced development makes it possible to strengthen the economy, and if we define priority industries, then corruption appears here, because there are priorities... then some kind of subsidies go, in the end, suddenly everyone becomes farmers or pharmacists, there is no need for this get rid of these benefits and ideas, some preferences in

the state, then we will make a breakthrough. mr. andrew, when you say that demography is the biggest challenge for ukraine, i want to go back to that study on fair mobilization that you talked about, and it seemed to me that you support the thesis that people who pay high taxes should be... reserved , i think that most of those people will be 30 plus or 40 plus, because with age only people reach the opportunity to earn a lot of money, doesn't this mean that we will put the 20 plus generation under even greater pressure, who will not have time to give birth to their children, especially when we start add metaphors like, they didn't have time to give birth to children, i remind you that men can be 60 years old. to have a child, i'm 51 years old and i still hope to have children, sorry, so ageism is the first thing we need to eradicate in

our country, not only politicians, ageism, although i usually blame everyone, well, if we are serious about it, first of all, we should consider it not as rich and poor, it should not be, there is no such segregation. there must be discrimination on this basis, it must be fair from the point of view of the effect for of the state, it is not that this person , who has the ability to donate more or pay taxes, should not serve, it is his choice in fact, he can serve, but let us as a society decide what we should do with this person , how to use it for the public good, i understand, we talked. yes, this is a question of efficiency, the efficiency of using the limited human resource that we have, turning it into capital, into capital, but

this is provided that we have it. will be, we will give these funds and we will have robots, drones and so on, where and where we will give it, then money yes, and this, you see, is a very global issue, because it is not only about what was discussed, that it can cause social tension, although i think that maybe there are such risks, we also have to understand and realize it in the end, because people, well, this idea, you know, a war for the poor, these are slogan stamps, they get used very quickly, and it is very difficult to deal with it. then it is rational to knock it out, whatever arguments you find, and then see what situation arises in this sense in general, in in this sense, if we talk about people, everything, it is very important, but it must be integrated into the military sphere, you understand, it must be changed, because while we have the concept of a platoon, a company, a battalion, a brigade, and if a brigade loses combat capability, because why does the brigade

lose? combat capacity, for example, may lose, god forbid, she must be taken out for rehabilitation, not only because something happened to her, there is no money to provide, but because she has sanitary losses, and therefore she needs to, and what to do with sanitary losses, any commander will say, i need people, and this is also a question, and this is a question of serious reforms in the military sphere as well, agree, i say that this is also a topic that has not been discussed now, 9 minutes , three for each, so go to the conclusion of the main , no, that 's it, look at it, that's the conclusion because today we're talking about balance, it's very important, i support here that it needs to be found, and we have to come to some kind of decisions with the military, you you see that we come to some kind of understanding from the point of view of what and how it is necessary to act, that everyone says that we really cannot allow high losses, everything and we have to come to the conclusion that, firstly , resource provision, people, weapons, funds, secondly, these are the goals that you set.

based on our needs, you understand that we will still, i'm sorry, we will still come to the question of the resource, what it is, whether it is enough for us to realize the best goals, because we all support the exit to the borders of 91 year, and i definitely, but when we focus on the question of what we need for this, the first, second, third, fourth , fifth, yes, and here it becomes so, of course , a serious dialogue with society, and this is the second moment, and the third moment, we must... not be afraid to discuss reforms, not only the economy , everything, but also in the military sphere, this should become an open topic, without closed, of course, those things where you don’t need to climb, they should remain, yes, but we have to come to that, and then we will build a certain system, then it will this is the connection, because this is what mr. andrii is talking about now, believe me while listening him, someone will share this point of view, someone will listen to the battalion commander or

the brigade commander and he will not... completely understand, but what is it about here, and in what way? i 'm just giving specific examples, without integrating the military here into this and that's how to make this bridge, well, it's just difficult to create conclusions, sir, my conclusion is this: first, develop any documents, strategies of the national income strategies or demographic strategies, without having an overall strategy of understanding how we... but where the state is going, not what it's ridiculous, it's just ineffective , we need to have a national strategy, and finally we have to realize that there is no place to postpone further, it's not us who should adapt to the situation , we finally have to seize the initiative, this is the first thought, the second thought, we need to finish the dialogue, the dialogue should be based on two things, the first is trust, and the second

is the objectification of trust, that what we have to finally understand is that it is not necessary to feed the patronalism that we have in society, it is not necessary to treat to nations as fools, i am addressing all of us, and those who comment on facebook, and those who give press conferences, finally what needs to be done, there is a question of justice, let's... talk about it, let's listen to philosophers , people who are the moral authorities of the nation, there are people we listen to, gudzak, pekar, hlibovytskyi, epiphany, let's listen to them and define what justice is, whether it is public good or individual good. second, objectification, everything can be counted, everything, how to use the resource more efficiently. let's turn to

economists, to... mathematicians, let's calculate all these models and see: