discussed these norms of the draft law, you know, they are listening now, but conditionally, this listening is oral, we have a written version of the text, which is unconstitutional, which violates rights, which has corruption risks, and this text needs to be worked with, and that is why i am talking about the presence political will in the cabinet and the need to sometimes admit mistakes in order not to disturb society, in order not to create chaos, in order not to... create mobilization issues that are vital for our state, because we we are in a large-scale war , in an issue that scares us, as the president said, we are a nation of heroes, so now we are being molded from a nation of heroes into a nation of dodgers , due to the fact that there is no clear communication, clear argumentation, and most importantly, legal norms regarding changes in issues of mobilization. i thank you for joining and thank you for informing the community because... the topic is really important.

iryna friz, people's deputy from the european solidarity party and member of the parliamentary committee on national security, defense and intelligence, and we talked about government bill on changes to mobilization. meanwhile, the chief scientific expert on the management of the verkhovna rada apparatus declares that the bill on mobilization submitted by the government on december 25 contradicts the constitution and other laws. in the conclusion, the experts note, in particular, that many questions are raised by the proposal to introduce evasions into a single one. register of debtors by decision of the head of the atc. the scientific and expert administration notes that the single register of debtors was created with a completely different purpose. not specifically, in my opinion experts are spelled out in the draft law, and which transactions with movable and immovable property can be restricted for evaders, and the proposal to limit evaders in the rights to use and dispose of funds and other valuables and in general directly contradicts the articles of the civil code, which states that similar prohibitions can be imposed. court. later in

our broadcast, we will talk about human rights in this draft law. agtem chaygos, the first deputy chairman of the human rights committee joined our broadcast. akhtem aha, congratulations you. glory to ukraine. glory to heroes. thank you for joining. can you say, in your opinion and in the opinion of your colleagues from the committee, what are the main reservations about this government bill on changes to mobilization? a lot is being said about it these days, even from the first. on the day when our ovbutsman made a remark regarding the violation of the constitution of human rights, and we supported it, and i personally gave comments that it is impossible to turn mobilization into some punitive methods, yes, war does not justify the violation of freedoms and human rights, it's wrong, not just wrong.

i am talking about the fact that the government cannot now find such a balance that would make it possible to demobilize, to make it an act like the beginning of a war, that is, a person is responsible for the state by virtue of his citizenship, and in order for him to implement it, it is necessary to... . the government, the state demonstrated such consistency in matters of war, and not like we have all these two almost two years, i am not talking about those three, there is practically such a leveling, yes responsibility, and lately, when society is outraged by these corruption schemes that were.

yes, and for which now, i hope, i am sure , there will be responsibility, and when you, well, watch the broadcasts of this marathon, well, then what will be the responsibility of a citizen who walks around the city of kyiv, yes, where does he see what is happening here , that is, human rights are primarily the responsibility of the state. and for it to have, for a person to have, let's say, the motivation to use, here are his duties, yes, in part to the state, to the nation, this must be brought up, constantly brought up, and not like this, on the one hand, these are just images in appearance eh there are some uh... quarters and on the other side

a person, she we all live, we live here mr. artem, artem, i know, there are still different opinions here, because... you understand, for almost two years now full-scale invasion, and many ukrainians have already faced this war, someone is at the front and does not know when he will be demobilized, and this is also an important issue, and someone is a relative of someone who is fighting or someone who died and understands that his contribution to this war they have already done it for victory, on the other hand there are people who, well, should be drafted, but are not they want this and avoid it, and there is such a conflict here, how to defeat this bill or introduce these norms of changes to the laws in such a way that it is fair for everyone and that there is someone to replace those people who are already fighting , for example, what risks do you already see there in the proposal to include evaders in the unified register of debtors by

the decision of the head of the tsc, because the fact that evaders already exist and will obviously be there is a fact, so what to do with them is, in a word, corruption , we see how today... these tsks and what scandals there were with some of them military committees, and how decisions were made and are made by the authorities, that is, i say once again that yes, i clearly know, yes, and with whom i communicate, i always say, the war, it touched, touched everyone, and it will rather be that we all we will take with weapons in hand to stand on those fronts where we will be able, regardless of the year, yes, how old are you, but i return once again, we will always

envy some states there, where the responsibility of the citizen, yes from ours, from from our point of view, ours is very high, but we don't... yet we have the responsibility of ours citizens in such times of, let's say, very great danger for the state, has always been withdrawn from the whole world, you understand, that's why you have to look for motivation in the actions of the government itself , which proposes this draft law, how can you, how can you even consider that you are karate. .. and what do you propose, what do your colleagues from the committee that deals with human rights propose, because here there are issues of both the rights and duties of citizens, how to combine it all,

i will tell you my separate opinion, yes i communicate a lot with the military, it is necessary not to politicize this issue, in this the draft law should leave purely such technical things that relate to the mobilization itself , everything else, it can be introduced through separate laws, yes, for example, today the authorities have nothing to prevent them from taking and doing it through resolutions, decrees and what we see on the card, yes, but on the other hand , we see and every day... we hear every day how this corruption allows high-profile people, i am not talking about such individual, individual ordinary citizens, high-profile cases when people, well, they are traitors, go abroad, i.e. here

again i return, first of all the responsibility of the authorities, the law itself should , in my opinion, be purely technical, i.e. it... invite the military and those with military experience to sit down and write down point by point what will make it possible to understand more of such a transparent and clear concept of how the rotation will take place , what do we mean by the front in general, but we all say the front, the front... the front, and what is it? and when you talk to specialists, you clearly see, and there are other concepts such as securing, yes, this front, there is such a concept as fortification structures, but infections in fairness, i would like to clarify that in the specialized

committee, which is currently considering the government draft law on changes to mobilization, there was a meeting with mr. umyerov, the head of the ministry of defense, with mr. zaluzhny, that is , there were such discussions. and can you tell whether certain complaints are currently being received by your human rights committee, perhaps about the restriction of certain rights for men of conscription age, they already exist without changes to certain laws. what is happening now with this story and what changes specifically from the committee are there, what proposals from your committee is it possible to ask your fellow parliamentarians and government officials to take them into account in the adoption of such important changes to various ukrainian laws regarding mobilization? and first of all, yes, they were, they themselves initiated these meetings and er... with the leaders of the faction and on the committees, and they are more responsible

for the military, i mean, the minister of defense, according to the father practically, the technical aspects of this mobilization , everything else is a hoot, i would say from the cabinet of ministers and who else was involved in this, so let's also be clear for ourselves let's understand, yes, the military will never offer any punitive methods. in relation to the crossing of the border or the seizure of property or bank cards, so we need to understand this clearly, as far as complaints are concerned, well, many, many, well, but they, as far as i understand myself, m, as the first deputy, they are individual character go directly, but many people contact me and the fact that now there is such a hotline eh... i opened it for the defense and where we can reach everyone, yes, and this

helps a lot, as far as i know, there i meet with advisers, and unfortunately, today they are forced to interfere in such cases, but it helps these families, yes, these very soldiers, because we have seen before... repressions by the troops, when someone appealed, do you remember these scandals with tourniquets or with other medical equipment, and immediately there were repressions there in the cities, now , i will not say that there is no such thing, but there is such a quick reaction, yes, that is the military has the opportunity to address you as well, including the deputies to the hotline to talk about these problems, this is the main one. i will say, the aspect of trust is to start like this, and i think that

when the ombudsman addressed this issue, of course we work directly, and we are doing very well, he himself headed our committee, and we have such constant and cooperation with him, dmytro lubinets. it should be noted right away, it was at the end of december when this draft law appeared, it was noted that some norms that violate human rights are controversial, so attention to this is also from this point of view chained artem, thank you for joining, sagol, artem chigos, the first deputy chairman of the human rights committee, was a guest of svoboda ranok. then we go to international news, here in ecuador, that in south america, a state of emergency has been declared due to the violence that has occurred in the last few days. yes, the previous ones. armed men in black clothes and masks on their faces broke into the live broadcast of the tv channel tc in

the city of goyaquil, and they forced the tv presenters to lie on the floor and even threatened them with weapons and said that they had bombs. it was on the footage hear shots and screams of people. we were live on air with my partner vanessa milela, talking about the news after the news program. when we heard about 2:10 in the afternoon, we thought we were out. there was a fight in the corridors of the studio , but it wasn't like that, through our headphones, the producers told us, be careful, they're trying to get in, they're stealing, they're robbing us , the studio doors are very thick, the studio doors are very thick, almost when not breakable, and they 're trying to get in because they want access to the studio so we can say whatever they want us to talk. one of our operators, they shot through the leg, another broke his arm, they shot bullets, use. there were weapons inside, the police were alerted and arrived within minutes, surrounded the tv channel.

on the same day, the ecuadorian police fired the employees of the tv channel and detained 13 people on the spot. this case will be investigated as a terrorist act, the national police of the country reported. and the president of ecuador , danielel nobo, announced the state of internal armed conflict in ukraine. power recognized as military targets 22 gangs that had previously been declared terrorist organizations. the country's president introduced a state of emergency in ecuador for a period of 60 days. it happened on monday. a night curfew was declared in the country and military patrols were allowed, including in prisons. all these measures were introduced by the country's authorities due to the escape of one prisoner, the leader of the criminal group los chinoros, jose adolfo macias, and his nickname is so fito. he served his sentence in prison, and at the same time continued to lead the gang. and fito is too a suspect in the murder of a candidate for the presidency of ecuador, a former journalist and

fighter against the mafia in august of last year. fito's absence from... prison was noticed on sunday, his escape caused a series of explosions in several cities in ecuador, as well as the disappearance of policemen, according to reuters, as of january 9, at least seven law enforcement officers have been kidnapped. and now international news, but which is very, very related to ukraine, here ukraine and its allies from the j7 and several countries of the global south have held secret peace talks agreements between ukraine and russia. this was reported by the american publication bloomberg with reference to... according to the publication, the secret meeting took place in saudi arabia on december 16, and it was not announced, among other things, in order to make the participants feel more comfortable. however, it was not possible to achieve progress in the matter, the journalists write. for example, ukraine and its allies from the g7 continue to oppose the countries of the global south, because they, in

turn, insist on ukraine's direct interaction with russia. according to the results of the meeting, he writes bloomberg, kyiv and its allies under attack. stated that a just peace involves respect for the territorial integrity and sovereignty of ukraine and that support for ukraine will continue, and the european union and the united states are confident that aid packages will be agreed upon. the white house refused to comment on this secret meeting, and the governments of ukraine and saudi arabia did not respond to bloomberg reporters' requests for comments prior to the publication of this text. in russia , such meetings without their participation are publicly condemned, but the interlocutor is not named publication bloomberg, close to the kremlin , said that at the end of last year there could be some contacts that tested interest in the ceasefire agreement. i would like to note that this secret meeting took place 10 days after the visit of russian president putin to the united arab emirates and saudi arabia. the trip was significant amid his limited visits to other countries during the full-scale invasion of ukraine.

it is also known that saudi arabia mediates between ukraine and russia in matters of exchange of prisoners. in january , the first exchange took place after an almost six-month pause in this process. well, before the start of the economic forum in davos, which will take place next week, a meeting has already been planned in the format of discussing the peace formula. it will take place in switzerland, and more than 100 countries have been invited to participate, writes bloomberg. zelenskyi's participation has already been confirmed by the president of the world economic forum. vitaly portnikov, publicist, columnist of radio svoboda, joins our broadcast. mr. vitaly, i welcome you to our broadcast. congratulations. on your opinion how important and decisive in the matter of peace is this secret meeting in saudi arabia? we perfectly understand what the goals of those who organize meetings to achieve peace in ukraine without russia may be. this may be a desire to somehow reduce, first of all, the economic

relations between the countries of the global south and the russian federation, because the contacts that exist today are... reciprocal, they help the russian federation, first of all, to circumvent western sanctions, not to pay attention to their effect, keep selling yours energy carriers and thus have the opportunity to further militarize their own economy and hope that the war of attrition that russia is waging against ukraine will continue as long as russia needs to put an end to the... ukrainian issue, to force ukraine to surrender , and of course, if the countries of the global south agreed with this logic, it would be much easier to at least talk about ending this war, at least see some light at the end of the tunnel, but now we can state that and the tunnel itself is not there for the simple reason that ukraine and western countries have one

position, and the countries of the global south have another position, and they talk about a simple thing all the time. ukraine and russia should agree on a cease-fire, and ukraine should not put forward any conditions to the russian federation in this regard, but simply look for ways so that the war, which has now become a serious test for ukraine, ends on this demarcation line, where today the russian and ukrainian troops, but many countries of the global south do not they notice a simple thing that this line of demarcation passes easily. the whole of ukraine is not covered by its state borders, and since the vast majority of the population of ukraine is sure that our country must fight until the exit to the borders in 1991, and the russian federation, in turn, is sure that the war must end, at least with the exit of the russian federation to the administrative borders of those regions that russia wrote in

its constitution, no real object, which in principle would say that the war would end with some negotiations between there is no russia and ukraine. for now, we can clearly say that the continuation of the war is ahead. and many diplomatic meetings can be held. ah... yes, i agree with the logic of those who say that meetings about peace without representatives of russia in conditions when representatives of countries ready to help the russian economy come to them are exclusively presentational in nature, let's say so, and the presentational nature is not something that would help to see, at least tentatively , the end of hostilities. mr. vitaly, the bloomberg agency points out that did not show up for the meeting. representatives of china , brazil and the uae, the secrecy was partly aimed at making the participating countries feel more comfortable, and why does it happen that someone did not appear, someone avoids publicity in this matter, what

they are afraid of, maybe, on the one hand can be afraid, on the other hand, they can consider it simply pointless, what china can be afraid of, it has nothing to be afraid of, it's just that the representatives of the people's republic of china can see the absolute lack of prospects for a meeting where... there is no real the possibility to talk about peace, if china has its own position on the ceasefire, then it can adhere to such a position and consider that the ceasefire should be discussed with moscow, and not with it. the united arab emirates may not participate in the meetings, as you said, because they are important mediators today. on the one hand, they provide the russian federation with enormous financial comfort, including representatives of the russian nomenclature, including russian oligarchs, and on the other hand have the opportunity to mediate there in the exchange of prisoners between russia and ukraine, and thus, with this, i would say, mediating mission, to justify the strengthening

of its economic relations with russia and gladly receive the president of the russian federation, vladimir putin, in the emirates. why then should the representatives of the emirates come to eriad and thus question their friendly, good relations with the russian federation. so everything is absolutely here. obviously, there are countries that believe that participation in such meetings is not will interfere with their good relations with moscow, there are countries that believe that this can become a problem, and there are countries that believe that ukraine should conduct peace talks with russia, because it is at war with russia, not with the united arab the emirates or brazil, and from this logic they believe that it is necessary not to put pressure on russia, but to negotiate with russia, and this is the eternal problem of our misunderstanding of how the attitude to war in the global south differs from... say, there attitude to war in europe and the west. europe and the west after 1945 year finally came to an understanding of the importance

of international law, internationally recognized borders, it was connected with this, let's say, the decision of the meeting in helsinki in 1975 was known , and therefore for us these borders, they are a value, international law is a value, and on the global south still has a huge number. the number of territorial issues that arise at any moment, conflicts and political armed conflicts between countries, literally right now the president of argentina, javier millay, to present at whose inauguration volodymyr visited zelensky said that he is ready to fight there for the return of the falkland islands, which are called the malvinas in argentina, from great britain, to which they now belong to argentina. argentina, as you know, tried to wage war with... great britain over these islands, i would not be surprised that even now under president stepan miley there will be some serious conflict of the same type, but this is the norm for the global south, if

my idea of ​​the border is anything to go by , i will defend it even by force, and therefore, when ukrainians say, the country of the global south, you know, we will fight there for another 5 or 10 years, but we will go to our borders, of course , a huge number of politicians and diplomats of the countries of the global south are looking at us... with wide open cordo eyes, what do you need, borders or a peaceful life, that is it more important for you, the territory, or that your people will die and live under shelling and the inability to develop their country, different worlds, different perceptions, mr. vitaly, i want to have time to ask you about such an interesting moment, bloomberg writes that beijing is being considered by many countries, participants of this meeting, as the key to influencing moscow, and whether you, or is it really so, can xi influence putin and most importantly, or? does china need it? well , first of all, i think that the influence of the people's republic of china on the russian federation from a political point of view, to put it mildly , has been exaggerated, they can consult,

but simpin. i definitely cannot tell vladimir putin to stop the war. secondly, for sidzinfin there is absolutely no need to say this, you are absolutely right here. the russian federation with its war in ukraine weakens the west, creates serious watershed lines in the very west. we can see this now and from what is happening in the united states, when republicans and democrats are debating among themselves about what aid to ukraine should look like, how long it should be, in what amount, and european disputes on this matter. and the fact that economic opportunities are eventually exhausted, and the fact that the west fell into an economic crisis in connection with the fact that it was forced to switch from russian energy carriers to energy carriers of other countries, and the chinese the people's republic needs to have its hands freed in the future confrontation with the western countries. china sees the world as bipolar, but the bipolarity of a world in which the people's republic of china can do as it pleases and ignore the united states is not only about

building capacity. of the new chinese people's republic, it has, it is also connected with the weakening of the potential of the united states of america and the european union. the russian federation with its struggle in ukraine, especially this struggle, like us we know, takes place exclusively on the territory of our country and the russian federation itself, it does not seriously threaten, it weakens the west, and this weakening of the west is a serious contribution of the president of the russian federation, vladimir putin, to the russian-chinese understanding. mr. vitali, two minutes, but i want to ask you whether there is any sense in these delegations. recently it became known there that zelenskyy formed a delegation to participate in negotiations with other states on security guarantees, it will be headed by the head of the presidential office andriy yermak, these are all the delegations of the meeting of 100 countries invite 50 countries, do they play a role in resolving the issue, in ending the war in ukraine? in any case, diplomacy is an auxiliary tool for us to hope for the end of the war, because the end of the war is a process, and i repeat, for such a conflict as the russian-ukrainian one, this process can stretch for years and

it is necessary to convince other countries. and to look for some guarantees that will allow after the end of the war, even if it ends in years, to create such a mechanism that would not allow the russian federation to attack ukraine again, this is all necessary, but we must understand that the war between russia and ukraine, even if it ends there with some kind of truce before our eyes, it can break out into any new moment, if ukraine does not receive real security guarantees and does not become a member of nato. thus, we need to look not only for tools to end this war. no matter when it ends and no matter how many years it would take for us to wait for the end of this war, but also for that a few years after its end, the restored russian federation with new weapons, with new soldiers, with new popular support, does not go to a new war in ukraine, hoping to capture not the regions that we just liberated from its occupation, but other regions that will be considered a target for the russian state from the point of view of war with ukraine, or try

to destroy the entire russian statehood. that ukraine should turn into a fortress, and its citizens should realize themselves as residents of this fortress for many years, and the fortress must be defended not only by military means, but also by diplomatic efforts. i thank you for participating and remind our viewers that dialogues with vitaly portnikov can be watched on the youtube channel of radio liberty ukraine, these are very interesting conversations about the global. vitaly portnikov, publicist and columnist of radio svoboda, was a guest of svoboda ranok. i thank everyone. to our viewers for being with us, for writing your questions, writing comments on these broadcasts, it is very important, do not forget that radio liberty, our journalists make a lot of content, including on youtube, radio liberty pages, we are on all social networks, be informed and let's understand together what is happening in ukraine and beyond, my name is kateryna nykrecha, i and the whole team freedom of the morning, we wish you a restful day, see you tomorrow.

greetings, it's news time on espresso, kateryna shiropoyas works in the studio. the russians hit kharkiv with two s-300 missiles this night, targeting a children's health center. destroyed on impact medical building and canteen building. this was reported by the head of the region oleg synygubov. fortunately, there were no people in the room, so no one was injured.