the heads, let's say so, of the russian establishment, well, the vast majority of countries in the world, i will say that almost all of them, except for those five or seven who support russia, i will not list them, so they are known to everyone, all the others are not perceive, will never agree to this, and therefore the question arises of what and with whom to talk at such negotiations, if russia is invited there, so until... the russian leadership does not change this position, i think that it will be able to change this position only after certain turning points moments on the front, that is, now , as i have already said many times, including on your broadcasts, the main negotiator from the ukrainian side is the armed forces of ukraine, when will we have certain successes, when the russian leadership will finally understand what. ..

this war leads to a complete deadlock and impasse, and none of the goals that russia has set for itself will be achieved, since then it will be possible to talk about something with them, and i am not sure that it will still be possible to talk about something with these people, but let's wait, we'll see, the situation is possible changes and we will have other people from the russian federation with whom we can at least talk about something... not just talk, but with the understanding that we can reach an agreement, which will then be implemented by this country or its future leadership, because today all the agreements that were reached with the russian federation until today, including ukraine, i mean the agreement of 1997, and the violation of the un charter, and the principles of the osce, and many other things. all this remained

only on paper, russia never complies the obligations it undertakes, and this applies not only to ukraine, but also to many, many other issues. mr. volodymyr, the former president of the united states of america, donald trump, after winning the republican primary, promised to resolve the situation with the war in ukraine very quickly. let's hear what trump said. i know president putin very well. "i know zelensky very well, i can involve him, we will solve it very quickly, this war should never have happened, putin and i get along very well, we get along very well, that's good, but not bad, if fake news became real and honest news, 90% of our problems in this country would be solved, the situation in ukraine is so terrible and we are going to solve it, we are going to solve it very quickly. mr.

vladimir, well, considering that trump can become the next president of the united states of america, and what he says that we will decide very quickly, i know putin very well, and we get along very well, in what way trump, in your opinion, can resolve the issue of the future of ukraine and the issue of ending russia's war against ukraine, we can't hear you, unfortunately, we are here. lost sound and now yes yes yes well this remains a huge, mystery, mystery to me because i'll tell you honestly, i can't understand, understand what mr. trump means, uh, and i don't think , that what he is saying now is, well, some kind of reality, and not his complete detachment from the reality that he will face if he is elected president of the united states of america, because one thing is

his rhetoric under during the election campaign, he says what he wants to hear the electorate, that's another thing, that's what he 's going to have to deal with if and when he becomes president of the united states of america, again, and this is where i think his rhetoric is going to change, we 've heard similar statements from president trump when he was president in the past, i heard these statements when i was working in washington, uh... but the thing is, when these issues were discussed at a serious level, you know, in such an informal way, even, i would say, uh, the tone was very different from of what we heard from him during such emotional statements, he loves it, he is an unsystematic politician, this is exactly what he works on, and on this, let's say, he bases...

his success, because, you know, people hear such unexpected things from him, which nobody expected, nobody expected, they think that... there is some truth in this, there is some reality in this, but actually the reality is very different from what we hear today from mr. trump as a candidate, well not yet a candidate, but possibly a future candidate for the presidency of the united states, so i repeat, that one should pay attention not to his rhetoric today, but to the actions he will take in reality if he becomes the next president. of the united states of america, i think it will be, well, a completely different person, and we will see completely different steps from him than, than what we hear from him today. mr. volodymyr, germany, the baltic states and poland are already publicly and openly

talking about a possible war with russia in 3-5 years, in your opinion, is the development of such a scenario possible, i understand that... russia is probably very difficult to predict and understand, what putin wants, but still, can putin go to raise rates and encroach on the baltic states or show strength in the kaliningrad region, especially since there are russian military bases there, and obviously putin will probably have such a temptation. you know, after all that we have seen in the last two years in ukraine, after the beginning of russia's large-scale aggression, i no longer exclude anything, although in fact i think that everything is not so simple, everything is not so clear-cut, one thing is

tweet like mr. medvedev does, or to make statements there about nuclear weapons, well, about the use of nuclear weapons in case of any... for the security of the russian federation, but apart from such statements, we have not yet seen any practical, let's say, steps that confirmed that behind these statements there is a well, some serious intention, but on the other hand, i will repeat once again that i do not rule out any steps on the part of the leadership of the russian federation, since the further they will, well, let's say, get involved in this conflict, in this war with ukraine, the more they will feel hopeless, and the more it is possible that they will be tempted to take some such steps that, in their opinion , will somehow allow them to get out of this

impasse, so i do not rule out certain aggressive actions against other countries, these are poland, these are the baltic countries, as you said, today russia basically uses any unrest in any part of the world, we see it today in the gas sector, in the same yemen, in the red sea, the situation around taiwan, i mean north korea, and russia's support for it and so on, we see that russia will continue to use any opportunity to divert attention, on the one hand, from the war that they have unleashed against ukraine, and on the other hand, to... distract western countries , primarily the united states of america, from the assistance that today these countries give our state, well, that is, putin's task not to lose to ukraine, and if to lose, then

to the north atlantic alliance, just like that, well, there can be no other, no other option, well , judging by the events that are happening and from putin's articulated position. that he keeps saying that we are at war with the entire north atlantic bloc, with the entire west, with nato, the united states of america, and of course, he needs some victories or, well, defeats, beautiful defeats, he can end the so-called special military operation at any moment. very briefly, how likely is it that putin will curl up and say that the goals of the special military operation have been met, and we 'll be locked in. on what is now, and we will not do anything else, that's all ours. well, you know, i'm having a hard time today imagine, although, on the other hand, taking into account the impasse in which putin and the russian army have already fallen on the territory of ukraine, and i do not

see, well, any prospects for their advancement, well , at least on the territory of ukraine, if it will be a protracted war, and that's all will continue in the future. va, then of course it will be necessary to look for some way out, and then he can resort to saying that that's it, let 's put an end here, but what we talked about will follow. a little earlier, that is, those realities on the ground, about which he constantly says that let's stop now, and ukraine has to deal with the fact that there is no longer 20% of the ukrainian territory, that this territory is in the russian federation, and we will move on from this, and ukraine and ukrainian society will never agree to this, thank you mr. volodymyr, it was volodymyr yelchenko, diplomat, former representative of ukraine under the organization of the united nations. friends, during our broadcast, we conducted a survey, we asked you about this and... are you ready to put an end to putin? 33% - yes, 67% - no, these are

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the judicial control program with tetyana shostrova on thursday, january 18 at 5:45 p.m. on the espresso tv channel. verdict with serhii rudenko. from now on in a new two-hour format. even more analytics, even more important topics, even more top guests: foreign experts, inclusion from abroad, about ukraine, the world, the front, society, and feedback. you can express your opinion on the evil of the day with the help of a phone survey, turn on and turn on the verdict with serhiy rudenko, every weekday from 8 to 10 pm on espresso. congratulations, friends, live on the tv channel. program verdict, my name is serhiy rudenko, i congratulate everyone and wish everyone good health. we

work live on the tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms. for those who are currently watching us live on these platforms, please like this video and vote in our poll. today we ask you this question, is the world ready to do away with putin? yes, no, please, everything is quite simple in youtube, two options, or write your comment. below this video, if you are voting on tv, pick up your phone, look at tv broadcasts, pick up your phone or smartphone and vote if you think the world is ready to end putin. 0800-211-381, no, 0800-211-382, all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote. i would like to introduce the guests of today's program, they are people 's deputies of ukraine, vadym galaychuk, the first deputy chairman of the verkhovna rada committee on ukraine's integration with the european

union, a member of the servant of the people faction. mr. vadim, i congratulate you, thank you for being with me today by us thank you for the invitation. rostyslav pavlenko, people's deputy of ukraine, member of the verkhovna rada committee on education, science and innovation, member of the european solidarity faction. mr. rostislav, good evening. thank you for being with us today. good evening. yaroslav yurchyshyn, people's deputy of ukraine, chairman of the verkhovna rada committee on freedom of speech, member of the "voice" parliamentary faction. mr. yaroslav, i congratulate you and thank you for finding time for our broadcast. good evening. let's start with bliss poll, gentlemen, as we ask ours viewers about what they think about whether the world is ready to end putin, and unfortunately we have two options for the poll, yes, no, obviously you have more options, and more thoughts, and more words you can to say whether the world is ready to put an end to putin, because today

volodymyr zelenskyi in davos spoke about putin as a predator, as a person from whom it is impossible to get rid of. there is nothing to agree on, and the only way out is simply to finish, as he said earlier, with putin. mr. vadim, what do you say about whether the world is ready to do away with putin, considering the crimes that the whole world, and ukrainians in particular, are witnesses to? my answer is yes, first of all really, because the whole world saw the crime. the image of the regime created by putin, and the crimes that are well documented today, there are legal decisions, including the criminal prosecution of him, but here i would also like to draw attention to the fact that with my own, well, very conditional partners too, as we

learn more and more from various sources of information, putin will act... not quite frankly, so even those who are his conditional allies today are also, again, according to the information that is beginning to come in more and more, these are his conditional allies today, today, dissatisfied with what actually happened, like the svo, russian. left, what were the intentions and what came out of it, and as a result, what damage putin caused not only, first of all, of course, to us, the country, international relations, international law, his own country, i am sure, but also to his conditional ally , that's why the world is like that today

the day has come, it seems to me, is coming to an understanding, and there are definitely those who believe that... that it is time to put an end to putin. thank you, mr. vadim. mr. yaroslav, what do you think, is it already obvious to everyone that the future of the world, er, can only be without putin at the head of russia, or after all with putin's russia, part of the world is ready to put up, some way to use, to trade, find a certain compromise, and... take into account the fact that putin has his own interests, he defends them? no matter how much we regret it, but unfortunately, the world is not unipolar and not only the western part of the world sets general rules, there are arab countries that quite often help us, and

here we should note the good work of our internationals who involved in the exchange of prisoners, in particular the last exchange of more than 200 people, representatives of arab countries, but on the other hand, they actively trade with russia, take advantage of the fact that they can raise oil prices, i'm not talking about china, and i 'm not talking about those countries that systematically support putin's russia itself. well, even in europe they sound quite often, so be it marginal, but there are statements by orban, fitso and the like that putin should be tried to listen, which they also have. interests, so that, but, i agree with vadim that the situation changed radically thanks to the heroic defense of the armed forces of ukraine,

the entire ukrainian people in the 22nd year, and a large part of the countries that used to use russian gas there, realizing that it's not economics, but closing my eyes that it 's actually bribing them with energy resources, and now i've categorically changed my mind, i recently mentioned the situation, about the so-called stanmeyer formula, and the position of the whole world has changed so much, and of the west, in particular, that they are now ready to recognize putin as a criminal, but ukraine still has a huge amount of work to do in order to prove legally within the framework of international law that that it is impossible to negotiate with putin. russia is doing everything there by investing frantic efforts in disinformation, in propaganda, in the banal buying-up

of european politicians and officials, hiring european lobbyists, and very often through proxies in ukraine, such as, for example, the campaign against the fight against the fsb, np, the so-called ukraine. the orthodox church, the ukrainian orthodox church of the de facto moscow patriarchate and pays us lobbyists there and all over the world novinsky yes, that is, a sanctioned person in ukraine, a russian nominal in ukraine, is now hiding abroad, so here it is important to understand that a lot has been done, but we shouldn't really be reassured that we have already achieved it, we need a lot, a lot more, in order for us to not be able to talk with putin to the civilized or the rest of the world to do, and this is not a unipolar,

not a bilateral confrontation, we are fighting putin there, and we understand that putin is comfortable with totalitarian regimes, of which there are few, but there are enough in the world, in fact, what atrocities he commits are genocidal things he is currently conducting in ukraine, for them, well , this is a test, as far as the world can do it, thank you swallow, so the work is still very big, but a good start has really already been made, and very often actually great sacrifices of our defenders. thank you, mr. yaroslav, mr. rostislav, mr. yaroslav said that the world changes very quickly and changes its position regarding what is happening in ukraine, using the example of the strain formula. mayor , but we see how germany's position has changed over the course of two years, how they quickly and dynamically started working with ukraine, we see what support we have in great britain, we

see how much support there is in the united states of america, but that's all the answers there is no one thing that is clear that the victory of ukraine is necessarily the defeat of putin, that is, that there should be no putin regime, everyone is saying that we will make ukraine... support there and ukraine must win, or, let's say, russia must be defeated, but this thesis that putin's regime is misanthropic, that it kills people, that it threatens the whole world, for some reason this thesis, well , no, it is not articulated and it is not constantly said , maybe putin would introduce himself in a completely different way, to say, listen, we want... to be, but without putin, because this, this is impossible at all, he is a murderer, he a man to be condemned? well, sometimes it

feels like the world would like to see a situation where there are no putin's crimes, where there is no russian aggression, but i would like it to happen without any drastic changes, here. it seems very likely that several factors are at work at once : the first factor is the fear factor, because it is still believed that russia is a great power, everyone cites about the two million army that russia can field, everyone talks about its economic power , everyone is talking about the fact that it was underestimated, although in fact it looks like it was overestimated and in no way... it did not happen to kyiv in three days, and no economic a miracle did not happen to russia, but the sheer size of russia itself gives many people in the world, and

according to... the fact that, first of all, in the non-western world, the desire to think about the fact that, of course, it is possible to correct russia's behavior, because it crossed the line in many questions, but what will the world be like without russia, will it not plunge into chaos, and by the way, here is the second part of this fear factor, because the world is very worried about what will happen, whether there will be a nuclear conflict between conditional... by the moscow directorate and the siberian federation for some useful deposits minerals, and here ukraine still needs to make great efforts to show what the way can be after the defeat of russia, and that this way will be better for the world and safer for the world than maintaining the situation as it is, and that for ukraine, for example , the first and indisputable step towards this safer world would be

joining nato. which would actually put an end to russian aggression and would guarantee that this aggression will be impossible in the future, and for this everything must be done, taking into account the fact that the washington nato summit is approaching, already there is less than six months left before it, and this will be a very important test for ukrainian diplomacy and for the ukrainian government as a whole, how to organize this preparation in such a way that both the government and the opposition... and civil society experts and in general all the forces of ukraine could work for this purpose. thank you important, yes, yes, yes. thank you, mr. rostislav. now, of course, we are waiting for the decision of the congress of the united states of america, meaning the ukrainian side, minister of foreign affairs of ukraine dmytro kuleba warned in an interview with abc news that time congress to approve military aid. with

the united states of america, ukraine, emerges. let's listen to what kuleba said. whatever the cost of supporting ukraine now, the cost of fixing the mess in the world if ukraine loses will be much, much higher. if the west cannot stop russia in ukraine, who can it stop in other parts of the world? even if we run out of weapons, we will fight with shovels, because the existence of this nation is at stake for ukraine. mr. vadim, of course, a reply about what we will do to fight with shovels, if there are no weapons , it probably sounds somewhat controversial for the western audience, or somehow not unexpectedly so, but for ukrainians such a statement indicates

that... we are preparing for the fact that we will fight no matter what -what if they don't give us weapons, although it is clear that the russian federation, which has great power as a military machine, needs to be fought with high-precision weapons, and here again an absolutely logical question arises, why the west is delaying the provision of these weapons, which , which is enough in the world for in order to provide ukraine, and ukraine could the russian occupiers from the territory of the ukrainian state, what is the world afraid of a nuclear war, that the ukrainians will not be able to cope with it, or are they afraid that the rules of the game, which are already broken, that they will still allow to keep the world from some kind of catastrophe, which which is constantly hinted at by the kremlin and vladimir putin, serhiy, you yourself

have absolutely correctly guessed. that there are certain messages for a certain audience, and first of all , i would not draw attention to these specific words of our minister of foreign affairs regarding the fact that we are ready to fight at least with shovels, although in fact it is really so, we understand what exactly such messages are used for, but with regard to your question specifically, unfortunately, really... until now, we see this relationship in countries of our allies, not only among the political elite, but also among the general population, well , this is very cautious about