tsarska okhota or soborna street, it does not give an idea, can you describe the situation that is currently developing in avdiivka, and to what extent it can develop from the side of the russian federation towards the ukrainian defense forces? in fact, in general, it will be quite difficult for a civilian to realize and understand what events are happening at the front, and this is obvious, because, well, no one except those who are directly there. can understand and grasp everything that is actually happening now not only in the avdeivka area, the situation is difficult in i won't say that the situation in bakhmut can be repeated, because the tactical situation is also different , the opportunities and the terrain are different now, that is, there are a lot of points, if you make a direct generalization, then of course you can somehow compare it somewhere. but i don't think it's

catastrophic, critical for today. we must understand that the war today looks like the enemy has accumulated forces, has accumulated forces, he has used them, i can tell you for sure that the enemy has most of them with those he was preparing he had already destroyed in his attempted attacks before... achieving the success he hoped for, but our problem is that, unfortunately, the russians still have enough internal potential to again to accumulate, recruit , equip units, equip them with equipment and send them in order to continue offensive actions, that is why the situation is difficult, it can change both in one direction and in the other, it is very important. just

to understand that, well, our realities are like this, we live during a war, and in this war we are sometimes you will have to retreat, and sometimes you will have to save up, accumulate strength in order to move forward, easy battles and or there for victories tomorrow after lunch, well, it will not happen, you have to stop believing and realize that it is difficult both in the avdiiv direction and in... it is difficult in the kupyansk region, and it is difficult in liman, and there are also battles in the south, so everyone should realize and prepare for the fact that we still need a lot of our own forces to fight, because the enemy still has these forces yes, on its own strength, mr. major, the government is currently finalizing the bill on mobilization, the first version of the law or draft law... was rejected in the verkhovna

rada of ukraine, meanwhile, zelenskyi said in an interview with a british tv channel that he does not see the need to mobilize 500 thousand ukrainians, let's listen to what the supreme commander of the armed forces of ukraine said . personally, i do not see the need to mobilize half a million people for now. i'll tell you yes, yes, i think so, not because i want to somehow answer now and please someone, it's just that these are people who, it's not only life, life number one, but life number two the story is that there are appropriate actions, there are appropriate operations, and that's why today i haven't seen enough... clear details

to say that half a million has to be mobilized, that's the second, the third, i'd just like to tell you that it's more money, huh, and no matter how one puts it, all these finances, they definitely do not come from partners, mr. major, you can explain why the figure of 500,000 mobilized people is constantly being used, although it is a hard-working head... of the armed forces of ukraine said that it's not a one-time thing, it's over the course of a year or so over a longer period, it is necessary to attract more conscripts to the armed forces of ukraine , it is necessary to change those who are at the front, eh, you, being at the front and on the front line, you, you, you understand the logic of what is happening now with mobilization, which is not enough to simply tell people: there will be mobilization,

otherwise there will be mobilization into the army of the russian federation, if the russian federation goes further into ukraine. of the main problems of mobilization is that of this absolutely ordinary, absolutely logical of the process, they create a show, ah, this show is quite effective, by the way , the russian federation also takes part, which likes it very much, while we here discuss, quarrel, sort out and everything else, the issue of mobilization is mandatory, there is no from... and there is absolutely nothing extraordinary in this process, the mobilization process must take place constantly, we just need to leave this hysteria, leave all these informational

show programs around this issue, because well, we have to put everyone on record, at least everyone men, understand how much in there are us, in which they and then call up to the army exactly those who are needed in the army today, and not recruit those who were caught or who remained, the question of mobilization is quite complex, and it lies not only in the problem in the tsk or in statements , the question of mobilization, it is necessary to change the systemic approach to this in general, and it includes it. and training of personnel, informing the population, and working with the population in terms of preparing it for those new conditions and realities of life in which we we are today, a lot of attention

is paid to this question of unnecessary things, although in fact there is nothing unusual or strange about this process, we are at war. and it is absolutely clear that we need to carry out mobilization in order to replenish the army, in order to really give someone a rest, but someone is taking advantage of it by simply manipulating the number, which is still unclear, where they got it from, and on this they are simply creating hysteria in society , although there are no reasons for this, as a year ago there was a mobilization in country, so it is happening now. and will continue to happen as long as we are at war. mr. major, russia articulates its position and says that there is no ukraine, there are no ukrainians, it is all russia, bears, if he

were not treated ironically in ukraine, but he says what putin has in mind about , that we will go to the end, and no matter how many 10 or. for 10 years we will fight and destroy ukraine and ukrainians. what do you think should change now in ukraine with approaches to war so that this war is not only a war for those who are at the front or those who are in the armed forces of ukraine, because this awareness should be universal, and this is the plan of how to confront russia and not only a year, and 10, 20 or 50 years in order for ukraine to get used to living in war and to understand that there is an obnoxious neighbor next to us who at any moment can invade our territory and start doing what they

started doing in 14 22 years old. first of all, all ukrainians should stop living dreams, hopes and memories, as it was before. as it was before, it will no longer be, the world has changed a lot and it has changed, first of all , right here today, so there is no point in waiting when it will be as it was before, there is no point in dreaming about how we would like or how possible it could be, it is, it is, there is a reality in which we all find ourselves, and therefore the only correct way out today is the first, that is... to prepare for the conditions and realities in which we find ourselves today, and the second - is to join the joint work on victory, only in this case the nation will unite, it will become monolithic again, because at the moment i do not think that we

have preserved this monolith, which was at the very beginning, we again began to be distracted by the absolute delusion that today nothing is worth it, therefore... unification, awareness of reality, acceptance of this reality, preparation for it and mobilization of everyone for these processes. mobilization does not mean the army, but mobilization. your internal, absolutely everyone, in whatever places they are, if you work, you work for victory, if you serve in the army, then you serve and fight for victory, and so every ukrainian must determine his place, where he is approaching victory. thank you, mr. major, for the conversation, this was maksym zhorin, deputy commander of the third separate assault brigade of the armed forces of ukraine, major of the armed forces of ukraine. friends, we are working. live on the channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms, for those who watch us on youtube

and facebook, please like this video and take part in our vote, today we are asking you about whether you support multiple citizenship in ukraine, yes no, vote on youtube, vote on tv, if you watch us on tv, you can pick up your smartphone and vote if you support multiple citizenship in ukraine (0800-2011): 381 no 0800 211 382. all calls to these numbers are free. pavlo klimkin, politician, diplomat, minister of foreign affairs of ukraine in 2014-19, joins our program. mr. pavle, i congratulate you, thank you for being with me today by us greetings, mr. segiu, greetings to all, friends, i am also glad to be with you. mr. pavle, today the prime minister of poland, donald tusk , visited kyiv and... spoke about the fact that poland joins the

g7 joint declaration of support for ukraine, and also promised to facilitate ukraine's entry into the european union as soon as possible. let's listen to what donald tusk said while in kyiv. we came to an understanding with mr. president.

which was announced at the summit in vilnius and which all our western partners are now talking about, does this not mean that on at the washington summit, ukraine, well, except... this declaration that was in vilnius , nothing more awaits, well, that does not mean that we should stop, say, even tusk joined the declaration, and if so, even poland will not do anything more plans, first of all, we are in reality, and in general the reality of this year, when there will be a lot of unpredictable things. and completely surprising things that will fall on our heads when we

have cleaner elections there than once a week in different countries, secondly, the fact that the poles started the logic of security obligations, this is an important story, we need to talk with them, we need to talk about the supply of weapons, about logistics, since without them... in fact, no way and about many different things, but, as they say in odessa, it's the same two big differences, security obligations are one thing, security guarantees are completely different. by the way, i am also somewhat skeptical of what may happen at the washington summit, and i say this reading the mood somewhat. in the states and in many european countries, and reading the mood that is about to end

war, what is the end, is of course a separate issue, it is unlikely that our partners are ready to talk about the fact that we are actually becoming allies, but one does not cancel and in no way negates the other, what will happen in the process of such a transformative transition to nato it is critically important for us, but it does not cancel or negate the need to work on security. guarantees, and here i see only two options: or bilateral guarantees, as such a temporary transition, it can be american guarantees, by the way, it can be european guarantees or their a combination, now there is a lot of talk about it, or nato directly without the stage of bilateral or

multilateral guarantees, but i emphasize that these are two different stories, security for... knitting, which donald tusk talks about, in the context of joining the seven declaration, and security itself guarantees, and there and there it's about security, but a completely different quality of security , so the washington summit, what i 'm hearing, i'm very skeptical, unfortunately, but as you know, i'm a real fan of our membership in nato, and i do not see no... their options, which could actually replace this membership as of today, i participate in many discussions and so far i have not heard a single conscious proposal that would actually even, even indirectly, reach the level of our participation in nato, let

alone more, not that it is not unheard of for nato, but very actively against it. listen to fitz, now robert fitz, the prime minister of slovakia, he spoke out against ukraine joining nato, he said that the only way to end the war is to give part of the ukrainian territories to the russians. let's hear what he is said ukraine is not a sovereign and independent country. ukraine is under the full influence of the united states of america. there has to be some compromise. what do they expect the russians to leave crimea, donbas? luhansk, this is unreal. frankly speaking, i cannot understand either the prime minister of slovakia or the prime minister of hungary. the countries that at one time suffered from the soviet military boot from the soviet army constantly talk about the fact that we are under someone's influence, that we are there,

we have no chance in this war and in general, there is some logical explanation. the behavior of both robert fitz and viktor orban, what does this position have to do with it? and i can understand, i do not see, unfortunately, in this position anything unusual or unexpected, and i would actually share the position of orbán, who plays a strategic game, who knows what he is doing, who started the fight not... for money , and for his positions, for the positions in brussels, and most importantly for, as he believes, the leader of the conservative european movement, some new right-wing parties, which he believes will definitely appear and now strengthen, which partners

republicans, or read trump, who were ready and could talk with... but also with putin, that is, orbán is playing a strategic game, he has been preparing for it for a long time, or fitz is playing a strategic game, i don't see it yet, from fitz its own difficult internal politics , slovakia, again, unfortunately , the most pro-russian country in central europe, it has always been like that, but now it is showing, and the fact that... they voted for fitz, it is not a surprise, it unfortunately, the state of today's slovakia in domestic politics, and hungary, and the slovaks, as you know, is parts of the european union and nato, so who depends on whom, we still have to see and

talk separately, the whole logic is about leaving us again in the gray zone, it will definitely explode, but it is better for fitz, somehow about slipping between the droplets, the edge of the rain, as we sometimes say, i like it even more, since it is no longer about the droplets, and to maintain some kind of relationship with everyone, to maintain one's position in domestic politics, so he... plays absolutely a clear, comprehensible story, but it is not orban's history, the fact that they have a situational coalition today does not mean that... they will play a strategic joint game as of today. i think it's a tactical coalition. nevertheless, fitz, when

he says that he is against aid, he does not say that we cannot buy weapons from slovakia, and especially take something from today's slovakia, well , it is difficult to say here in principle, because in the initial stages of the war there are a lot of us. took slovakia and for that we are very, very grateful to her and to all slovaks and we have to talk about it, so we have orban and fiza is not the last problem in the european union and in nato, we have to reckon with the fact that they will have other situational coalitions, let's see how the elections to the european parliament will turn out, but we also have to... understand that our, our logic, since we are ukrainians, and for us ukraine is above all, a completely different logic than the same, the same fitz, and counting

on the fact that they are fans of ukraine, and unfortunately, even in europe, everyone is a fan ukraine is to be, well, i won't say naive, but nevertheless to be in some kind of positive tuber'. unfortunately, there are those in the european union with whom we will have to have a very long and difficult conversation both at the stage of joining the european union and at the stage of joining nato. that is, this road, it will not be some super positive, pink, er , painted in the best colors, it will be very, very difficult, and we will try to put sticks in... wheels and work according to the opinion of the same putin or other countries , who would very much like to destroy our european integration, euro-atlantic integration, as

putin wants to show that ukraine is not a state yet took place, this is how he wants to show european integration, which did not take place, and thus show us to show the west, actually we are already informally part of the west, so... think that there is fundamental support and solidarity in the west, and not a willingness to help us in everything the way we want and when we need it, we see it from the help with which the discussions are not easy now, and in the same united states, so the struggle continues, and we should not conduct it with rose-colored glasses, that is this is such a story. which is sometimes perceived by us with pain, well such emotional pain, agree, but nevertheless, the world must be understood as it is,

and i believe that today's west and today's europe, it has fundamentally changed in the sense of the position of ordinary people in favor of ukraine, i am like that in europe, in germany , france, italy, well, well, i haven’t seen all of these... and i’ve been involved in foreign policy there plus or minus there for 30 years, even more, and as for me, the politicians of these countries now, i certainly don’t want a stone in them throw some, they are less pro-ukrainian than people, yes that, but as they say, in the family, remember , our well-known ukrainian proverb, not without the one who actually interferes, interferes with living, but also with such people it is necessary to... live, since we have to live with them and in the future of the eu, and in the future of nato. mr. pavle, a global

peace summit is planned to be held in switzerland, last week zelenskyi met with swiss president amgert, and in principle they agreed there that this summit would take place, the principle is yes from switzerland, but then a message appeared that the president of switzerland is looking for opportunities to invite. to this global summit, because without russia, they say, there will be no peace and no talk of peace in general, what do you think this position of switzerland is connected with? and in fact , you need to understand what they want to delay, i actually did not see the president's statements or statements, i saw the foreign minister's statements. switzerland about this , who said that it will be difficult to move forward without russia, i am the one, i looked at the phrase he said, maybe it was not an ideal project.

i didn't hear it in the original, i'm always a fan of the originals, as you know, so one thing is the movement within the site, where the west and the non-west meet, and here we need to understand, of course, and what will be the result of future meetings, especially meetings high level, as to declare commitment to the fundamental principles of the un. this is certainly a good story, but nevertheless it is not enough, since we declared it, you hear what putin also says all the time, here i seem to respect the principles of the un, although russia, as a member of the security council, violated, in my opinion, if not half, yes, if i once counted, well, it turns out that there are almost half of all the articles in the statute, that is, she

destroyed this... here, so we really need to have at least a way out of any measures , the political will was formed, and how do we carry out and return the un, return the world to the fundamental uon principles, and as for what the minister of foreign affairs of switzerland, ignatius, says, it seems to me that he means a completely different format. when he wants to somehow talk with russia, and here the question arises, and why do we need it? it's one thing when we talk about humanitarian issues, and geneva itself is such a cradle of international humanitarian law, that is, we have to talk about the exchange of prisoners, we have, once they talked about the grain turner, a complex story, complex,

but critical... important for ukrainian business, that is, it is one side, but i do not see an opportunity in today's reality, and i did not see it in any sense , emotional, moral, political, whatever, from some side, from which dimension to start some conversations with today's russian regime about the status and so on and so on, for me it is a total mystery. the swiss have in mind, well let's hope they explain it soon, so it seems to me that there are two or even three different stories that the swiss have in mind, they really want to mediate again, will they be better mediators than ardan? i will put three dots and a smiley here, well, a smiley in our sense, well, you understood me perfectly, thank you, sir

pavlo to you for... the conversation, it was pavlo klimkin, minister of foreign affairs of ukraine in 2014-19. friends, we work live on the tv channel, as well as on our youtube and facebook platforms, and during the program we conduct a survey, we ask you whether you support multiple citizenship in ukraine. now we will look at the intermediate, the results of our vote in the tv audience 33% yes, 67% - no, we continue to vote in 15 minutes after that we will continue, there will be a second studio, ahead of the bbc news, after of bbc news, political experts maksym rozumny, ihor reiterovych and viktor boberenko will be on our air, stay with us, we will be back on the air soon, it will be interesting with us.

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