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today, from beginning to end, we are talking about the downing of the il-76 plane in the belgorod region of russia, on board of which ukrainian prisoners of war could be on board only with the approval of the ukrainian side. a military transport il-76 fell today in the korochan district of the belgorod region on board the plane, as announced by the ministry of defense of russia, there were allegedly 65 captured servicemen of the armed forces of ukraine, who... to the belgorod region for exchange, and also there were allegedly six crew members and three accompanying persons according to the russian official side, all these people died. russia blames ukraine for the downing of the plane, there is currently no independent, even russian, evidence that ukrainian prisoners were on the downed plane. the ukrainian side refrains from commenting, at least the ukrainian authorities. a comment appeared just recently. the main

intelligence agency, and the adviser to the head of the office of the president of ukraine mykhailo podolyak told reuters that it takes time for clarification of all data. in this broadcast, we will try to analyze everything that is currently known about the downfall of il-76. look right at us. this is the footage that shows the plane flying down and then exploding on the ground, started to be published on russian telegram channels around 11 o'clock in the afternoon. the network talked about the fall of the il-76 military plane in the korochan district of the belgorod region. later, the ministry of defense of russia confirmed this, reports the state russian agency tas. the russian ministry of defense also added that there were people on board the plane.

prisoners of war who were allegedly transported to the belohorod region for exchange. in addition to them , there were crew members and escorts on board. meanwhile, the state duma of russia said that there were two planes in the airspace, another one that followed the il-76 was also allegedly transporting prisoners of war. according to the chairman of the state duma committee on defense andriy kartapolov, they managed to turn it around. the state duma of russia blames the ukrainian side and western partners who provide the accident itself. weapons to ukraine. kartapolov also stated that the plane could have been shot down by missiles the american anti-aircraft missile system patriot or the german iriste. they supported their assumptions in the state duma with a statement about appealing to the us congress and the german bundestag in order to find out which missiles could have caused the il-76 crash. at first, ukraine did not comment on this incident. the ministry of defense reported that they could not confirm that the plane was hit by ukrainian defense forces. he tells about it. later, in a comment to radio

liberty, andriy yusov, a representative of the main intelligence agency, said that on january 24 there was really supposed to be an exchange of prisoners between russia and ukraine. at present, i quote: it can be stated that the planned exchange is currently not taking place. yusaf also added that the russian side announced information that prisoners of war could be in the il-76 plane that crashed in the belgorod region. currently under review. russian. shot points out that the exchange of prisoners was supposed to take place on the border of the belgorod region, however, the il-76 was allegedly flying in the opposite direction, ukrainian osin analyst skrynka pandora notes. according to his assumption, the russian military could use this plane to transport weapons from eastern countries. here he writes that the plane took off from belgorod and kept the route towards the central part of russia, i.e. from ukraine, and not the other way around. before that, analysts report, he flew through saudi

arabia, the red sea and iran. in addition, the ukrainian news agency rbc ukraine , citing a source in the defense forces of ukraine, said that the plane was probably carrying missiles. zazrk-300. well, literally in the main intelligence office once again commented on the fall of the il-76, there it was finally stated that the exchange did not take place today, and that the data on the prisoners is being checked. in particular, gur noted that they currently do not have reliable and comprehensive information about who exactly was on board the plane and how many there were. listen to the quote. according to the agreements , the russian side had to ensure the safety of our defenders. at the same time, the ukrainian side was not informed about the need to ensure the safety of the airspace in the area of ​​the city of belgorod in the specified period of time, as has been done repeatedly in

the past. ukraine was not informed about the number of vehicles, routes and forms of delivery of prisoners. it is known that the delivery of prisoners takes place by air, rail and road transport, this may indicate deliberate actions of russia aimed at creating a threat to the life and safety of prisoners. well, oleksandr musienko, head of the center for military legal research, has already joined our broadcast. good evening. good evening. oleksandr, how previous are you can you draw conclusions about the downing of the plane, who, with what weapon, why, and most importantly, do you see any signs that there really could be ukrainian prisoners there? ah... i will say that i think it was shot down, by what complex, by what missile and from where , it's hard to say right now, but most likely it was really shot down, and as a result it fell, it's a military transport plane, which is used for various purposes, it

is used by russia, very often il-76 transports attack aircraft for reinforcement their military and assault groups at the front and rebuke. for the transportation of weapons from time to time, this is something that can also be stated, and about which i am ready to say now and what i know in principle from various sources. the next moment, i admit that it could have been the actions of our defense forces, which acted, in fact, and the goal was to destroy the military target, well , based on the statement of the general staff that appeared, it is stated that the general staff of .. as necessary and will continue to work in order to carry out enemy complexes, missiles, which are shelling kharkiv, kharkiv oblast, in the kharkiv-bilhorod region, and including means of logistics, i.e. what delivers, i.e. a hint about military transport aircraft that can

transport such missiles, this has been done, so i would not rule out that the targets such could be targeted, of course, ukraine has the strength and means. in order to destroy it. the second point, which concerns prisoners of war, is actively spread by the russian version. first of all, i am alarmed that this version was immediately prepared, as if it was expected. that is, it was immediately thrown into the information space, from the russian side, as if there was no alternative. we, unfortunately, this round of information struggle, ukraine, i mean, lost, it can already be stated, that is, the only russian version was picked up, a lot of western media was enough, since there was no official position of ukraine on this issue for several hours, well and now , let's say, it seems to exist, but it does not state, that is, we can, based on the statement of the general staff or the statement of the general staff, let's say,

suspect or make some interpretations or version, but we cannot draw these conclusions based on these statements, but only build certain constructions and assumptions, and this is what it really is. used by russia, it reminds me of how they immediately accused ukraine of shelling in the case of olenivka, i remember their statements very well when the azov prisoners of war who died there were actually fired upon and killed by russia, directly committing a war crime, which was established by the relevant conclusions of the specialized un commission, and now they immediately made such statements, that is, there may be a whole a number of versions that... the enemy acted deliberately to try to somehow set up and , let's say, conduct a special operation in order to provoke a corresponding reaction, when they could deliver missiles, and someone could be on board, or could not be on board, they

could deliberately actually confuse the situation if the exchange was to take place today, in fact, they may have actually been preparing the delivery. some of our prisoners on board some plane, no one informed the ukrainian side about this, as gur claims, although they, although oleksandr, i am here for you, first of all, i will say for our audience that we are for... we are now showing the footage, it is pro-kremlin russian and we see, well at least we see, there is a redovka telegram channel, but this is the only video , which, as of now, has appeared from the belgorod region, the place of the plane crash, the bodies of independent journalists, as you understand, in russia, in the belgorod region, so it is very difficult, very difficult to say anything exactly now, and of course the ukrainian the party , from its side , there are no representatives of ukraine there to confirm this. but you said about us, you started talking about prisoners, but isn't this a process that is prepared for a very

long time, it took a long time, as a rule , both sides are notified, and well, in theory, i guess the military could have known that there would be a plane with prisoners, is n't it necessary , just technical , i want to understand the technical side, i think, no, i think that it is not absolutely necessary, but the first point, secondly, listen, and i think that if the military ... knew, no one would, if it from our side, the missile, and our air defense system, no one would use it, what is the motivation, you understand, when it comes to the russian version, i immediately ask a question, and the motive, well, if we accept the russian version, what is it for ukraine, what does ukraine get from it, and nothing, that is, you understand, well, we are nothing informationally, media-wise, and in no case do we get anything here... from this situation, and russia gets a lot, russia gets from this news, the first thing is that they

tried to intercept the initiative, to blame ukraine. the second is that in this way they can appeal to the west and raise the question of what ukraine could do to use anti-aircraft, anti-aircraft, patriot or other means for strikes on the territory of russia, for example, to raise and appeal to the fact that planes with their own citizens are shot down, do not let them strike, and let's do something. to actually stop these strikes. russia is very afraid, they are very wary of our opportunities and capabilities, which are growing. third, they could do it absolutely deliberately for discrediting, for a certain, let's say, deterioration of the social and political situation in ukraine. they have a lot of motives for all this, and i do not see ukrainian motives at all. and they don't want to explain, their task was to throw in this news and that's it. i will only add here that, for example, a russian. politicians, in particular the speaker of the state duma, has already stated that he instructed to prepare an appeal to the united states and

germany in connection with the disaster, and i understand that in this way they will now try to influence western countries so that they stop supplying weapons to ukraine , maybe the same patriots, do you think it could work? i hope not, it is it's funny, actually, because you understand what the situation is, it's very cynical and... as always , manipulative from the russian side, because they shoot at civilians, shell our cities, like, for example, the day before kharkiv, and kyiv, and others near the front lines of zaporizhzhia, kherson, dnipro, they are shelling heavily, hitting civilian infrastructure, houses, and at the same time they absolutely do not feel any obligations regarding whether there are any moral reprimands due to the fact that they take kn-23 missiles from the same northern korea and so on, and i want... to remind you that in general patriot and similar systems are defense weapons, that is, they are

weapons for defense, and they are never qualified as offensive weapons, and the united states can always find a reason and say that ukraine took an obligation not to use offensive weapons on the territory of russia, but no one talked about any defense systems. by the way, this is true. we also have, i think we can hear the testimony now. eyewitnesses, as i understand it, are local residents, whom journalists managed to record, who arrived at the scene, it was released to a foreign agency, this is a video , let's watch and listen to what they said, we just saw some red, long flying object, then we heard an explosion, saw a red flash and that's it, i only heard two explosions, first a dull thump, and then an explosion and a big fire and that's it, two explosions with an interval of less than a minute, the second one was louder, we ran out to see if

help was needed, but he fell far behind the village, fell, looked at the sky, can't see nothing, i looked at the sky, nothing was visible then i looked in that direction, the plane was already flying over the street, there, there was a fire in front of the plane, and then it exploded somewhere behind the forest, there was black smoke and then it exploded somewhere behind the forest, black smoke. oleksandr, what about the version, because this one may have already sounded, or will sound again, that russia shot down its own plane, well, you mentioned olenivka, when really. dozens of ukrainian prisoners of war died, if it is the same now, if it is true that there really were ukrainian prisoners of war on board, could russia have done it? you know, i'm talking about russia i can believe any version, because knowing how they operate and seeing examples of what they do, i would not rule out such

a version, in fact, i would not rule out a similar scenario, so that, you know, the motive is absolutely... but obvious, it is to try to discredit ukraine, as they think, and to say that ukraine is doing this with western weapons, although in reality there is another question, you see, what is missing in this, if everything was really as it says russia, on those videos that they are trying to show now, probably, well at least they would show the bodies, or forgive me, well, i'll tell you how it is. the remains of the bodies that could have been after the disaster, this is not yet visible, that is, even this is not available today, well, plus, i think that it seems to me that soon this information, it will be active in any case, well no something that is active, and it will gradually seep into the media and into the western media, in particular, western intelligence may give

some insights, and we will learn, i think, the real state of affairs that happened. and i also have a question, i want to make one more statement the ministry of defense of russia, they said , they claimed that it was allegedly this sil, well, the attack on it was carried out, carried out from the area of ​​the settlement of liptsi, kharkiv region , and an anti-aircraft missile system was used, i apologize, how much, how much does this information and this version look like to you plausible, if we start from the point of view of the one from the version. that it was ukraine, it was a ukrainian anti-aircraft missile complex, that is, our ukrainian armed forces, it is clear that the launch was most likely carried out from the territory of the kharkiv region, so it is true it could be so, and maybe they were preparing for this, i will tell you that i know, i have

insider information that our forces know and were known from where in the territory of... belgorod, from the city of kharkov shelling was carried out this once and in the past , it is carried out directly from belgorod from the city, and they tried and hunted for missiles, means of delivery, that is, absolutely everything is normal, well, this was confirmed by the general staff in the end, it’s just that in this case we do not have, let’s say so, final evidence that it was precisely the sam a patriot from the ukrainian side, that is , what i can say... and confirm what i said at the beginning, according to all the signs that i see and the information that is available, yes, most likely he was hit by a missile, which one and from which side, there is still a question here? during our conversation, they said the thesis that ukraine lost the round of information struggle, and you can explain to what consequences this

may eventually lead to, and do you have an explanation why ukraine lost this round, i understand... it is what you understand , in today's world, you are wonderful and you obviously know better than me that information spreads quite quickly, and of course that this information needs to be prepared in a different way, well, at least, let's say, well, at least not to spread outright fakes about what exactly russia is accurately spreads that ukraine shot down a plane with prisoners, well, at least say that, listen, it doesn't answer. reality and so on, there we are currently conducting our own investigation, even if it is quick, let's say so, clearly and deny it, secondly, we must immediately have versions about what could happen, well , let's not confirm that it is ukrainian forces, maybe not, we also don't have 100% confirmation right now, we only guess, maybe not, but we have to

provide versions of events, in this case we , i'm saying what the experts provided, that's right, we provide, and i mean... the state, because there are relevant state bodies that should do this and especially to the western media, because when i open the pages now many leading western media, there is a russian version of events, and they all write at once, they write, they write, whether you want it or not, a person reads it, of course, if he even hates, hates russia, supports ukraine, and there are many of them, it is still postponed on some level, but i believe that it is worth it to us... avoid, there are mechanisms to work, there are many professional people in ukraine who are ready to do it. thank you very much for your comment. oleksandr mysienko, head of the center for military and legal research, we are talking about... the downing of the il-76 plane in the belgorod region. thank you very much. well, i will remind you that the band did confirm that

an exchange of prisoners between russia and ukraine was being prepared today, and in the end it did not take place. andriy yusov, a representative of the main directorate of intelligence, told about this in a comment to radio liberty. well, literally just in the evening, it was already officially announced from the page of the main official pages. intelligence, well, they also add that information is currently being checked on whether there were actually ukrainian prisoners of war on board the il-76, so far this information, i remind you once again, comes only from russian sources, and at the same time that there are no independent sources among these sources. maksym kolesnikov, veteran of the armed forces, former prisoner of war, joins our broadcast. good evening. good evening. maxim, i am simple for our audience. i will clarify and remind you that you were taken prisoner back in march of the 22nd year, that is , literally a few weeks after the beginning of the invasion, and you returned in february

of that year, well, a year passed like that, and this photo with an apple then flew all over the network , i think we 'll mention it now too, but yeah, but here we go you were called today to help us recreate as much as possible, of course, the path taken by a prisoner, prisoners before returning home, well, for example, the russian side says that there were prisoners of war on board, tell us how, in principle, prisoners of war are delivered, this by bus, whether by train , or always by plane, well, of course, i can’t talk about always , because i don’t know all the situations, the scenario that i went through, that went through many of my acquaintances who were exchanged, it’s quite typical, first with car accidents, which they have small groups from tyure. from the colonies, from the camps , they are taken to the military airfields, well, there were five of us from our prison, and we were taken

in this auto-rickshaw to the airfield in bryansk, in bryansk we were put on the same mud, ugh, and there with a large number of guards, that for me, today was an indicator that the version does not agree with the russians, but with a large number of security guards, we first... flew to kursk, where some people were removed, maybe it was some kind of internal transfer, some people sat down again this plane already from there we were taken by this plane to belgorod , and there in several minibuses, again with a large number of the same security , we were transported to a special customs town, where we were kept until the day of the exchange. the fact is that the russians are keeping ukrainian prisoners of war. the way they keep criminals in private, that is, it is very strict restrictions, very strict detention, which includes that always when these

people leave the cells, they are accompanied by a large number of people, for example, when a person someone is taken somewhere for questioning, she is always escorted by at least three people, plus it is usually a service dog, that is, one of the three is a dog handler, when our cell... was inspected, we were also taken out in the corridor, when we had 14 people, there were seven or eight of them with dog handlers. it is impossible to imagine the situation, what they write that there are three attendants on the plane, where there are 65 prisoners, because you are flying a huge plane, there are a lot of people sitting, their hands are so tied, but their legs are free, imagine that you for all three people can follow them, it is impossible to use firearms. weapons , in which case it is impossible in the plane, it can fall, everyone will die, so just as they flew with us, maybe 20 people, maybe, well, there were many of them, but we had five, and

we had two security guards, and then they gathered, and then all these people get into minibuses with you, they are the russian military police or representatives of some of their military structures, so they are constantly watching, there are many of them on the plane, the russians write that there were only three of them, this is there can be no way, so this is the official position. of the russian ministry of defense, the russian ministry of defense that there were 65 prisoners on the plane, that there were six crew members and that there were three escorts, and i understand that you think that this is not true, because as a rule, the security is many times more , this simply cannot be, well, imagine how three people can control 65 people seated in an airplane, and how suddenly something they can do with them, i will emphasize once again. that our prisoners of war are not held according to the protocols of some geneva convention, no, these are ordinary prison protocols of a special

regime, personal there. a person where for criminals who commit some serious crimes in the russian federation, this is the constant presence of armed people, these are people with machine guns, with batons, and here they say that there are only three of them, well, how, but do you know, do you have a more accurate idea , how is the approval process going, well, there are lists, does the ukrainian side know for sure who should arrive, because today the employees, i will say this, the employees of the pro-kremlin me distributed the lists, supposedly these are the people on board, then both the ukrainian media and the international media analyzed these lists and it turned out that there are many of those people who have already disappeared or have already returned from captivity, that is , also in the ukrainian structures with whom we spoke to the security forces today, they also speak , that it is not always known for sure who will return in the end, and the ukrainian side does not always know about it until the last

moment, what can you say to that? do the parties always know who they are trading or is that a surprise too? i am not an employee of the coordination headquarters, i trust their opinions very much, i haven't seen their comments that they don't know who they're trading, as far as i know, the lists are very hard to reconcile, it's always a matter of trade, and what's on the list now that they kind of showed that there were those people on the plane are traded, again, this is the second bell for me, which shows that this is a fake, which... fought on the go, because obviously after a long pause there were no exchanges, the last exchange, the people who analyzed it, see that russia wanted to take away from the russian side mostly ex-convicts, criminals, who after the exchange will calmly go to their own home the will i don't think that the russian military, especially personnel, especially officers who have relatives in the column, were not outraged by this, they need to be somehow shown that... well, it's impossible, because

you see how ukraine is behaving, that it's really very- very bad, that's why the russians , i think, my personal opinion, i don't know these nuances, of course, now it seems to me the most that - after the downing of the plane , the russians just grabbed and start to mold some version, and that's why it is so contradictory, well, with these three attendants, they had to write something security guards were killed, write that they died 20... employees, well, somehow this is wrong , let's write three, this is such a fantasy, let's give a list of some random ukrainians, well, come on, they don't explain the task to everyone, some major or captain gave some list of people who have already been exchanged, because he does not know the task, it is all done on the knees, this is my impression, i hope that ours were not injured in this incident, well , so far it seems to me, thank you very much, maksym kolesnikov, veteran of the armed forces forces

of ukraine and a former military... prisoners, it is nice to see you free and in ukraine. thank you very much for joining. well, the general staff of the armed forces of ukraine neither confirmed nor denied that it was the ukrainian forces that struck the il-76, but after the accident of the military transport plane in the belgorod region, the general staff published a statement. the accident itself is not mentioned in this statement, but it is about the increase in shelling of kharkiv oblast, which, according to the general staff, is directly related to the increase. the number of military aircraft in the area of ​​the belgorod airfield. listen to this statement. fixed the intensity of shelling is directly related to the increase in the number of military transport planes that have recently been heading to the belgorod airfield. taking this into account, the armed forces of ukraine will continue to take measures to destroy means of delivery, control the airspace to destroy the terrorist threat, including

in the direction of bielgorod khacoma. well , valery romanenko, aviation expert, leading researcher of the state aviation museum, joined our broadcast of ukraine. good evening. yes, i congratulate you. is it possible to draw unambiguous conclusions about the reasons for the plane's crash, based on the information that is publicly available on the internet, photos and videos. what can you state, as of now? well, for now it can be stated that the plane fell and disintegrated. everything, nothing more, was it an anti-aircraft missile for debris, well, too small debris and too small a resolution of these pictures for it to be possible to look for any traces of striking elements of an anti-aircraft missile, but i i know that this plane is quite dangerous, and in general, every tenth of the released planes crashed, but...